smittyoneeach's Journal: Interesting

Jay Carney: I Never Told A Lie
I am seriously interested, as an intellectual matter, just what the man's definition of 'lie' is.
There are national security matters that are off the table--got it.
Then there is carrying out orders--understood.
I guess the only way I can buy Carney's line is if the scope of the statement pertains solely to any matters of personal opinion into which he ventured while on the job.

Liar Liar

[tepples]

I misread it as Jim Carrey. His character in one of his movies [wikipedia.org] had to go 24 hours without telling a single lie.

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[smittyoneeach]

Didn't ever see that flick.

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[mwlewis]

It has one of my all time favorite lines.

[Jim Carrey's lawyer character, on phone with criminal defendant client]: STOP BREAKING THE LAW ASSHOLE!

I believe it

[Bill Dog]

He probably defines a lie as voluntarily explicitly saying something that you know is 100% untrue. And he probably never did that.

It's like journalists. They never lie, but they constantly, daily, hourly, deceive. And if you can, via the black arts of trickery, make people believe you said something without actually having said it, hey, then it's not all on you, it's partly their fault. So it's not as bad to do it that way. (A poster here from way back when I first started journaling here said essentia

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[smittyoneeach]

Again, if communicate with you in a way that permits you to be misinformed (as apposed to amused) then I call that lying. Because the truth is that important.

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[Bill Dog]

Oh I'm with you, and take it even further, to "lies of omission". Like RG's example of Sarah Palin having been accused of whatever whatever number of times. I call speech that leaves the wrong impression, even if what is spoken is incontrovertably true, to be a "lie".

But then how do we compete against those for whom truth is just a nice-to-have, or a luxury that is not affordable these days while there's various inequities and injustices that have been going on for ages and need to be remedied?

Wouldn't yo

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[smittyoneeach]

We're saying the same thing. "Permits you to be misinformed" is lies of omission. It also covers having someone else lie on your behalf and failing to correct the record.

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[Bill Dog]

Well, okay, "misinformed" (knows things that aren't true) is close to "uniformed" (does not know things that are true). And all such gradations of deception can loosely be called "lies", which was your beef with the former WH Press Sec.

I was just thinking, put yourself in Lefties' shoes for a minute, as it's an interesting (and disturbing) but enlightening exercise. Some "lying" is more direct than others. For example our culture has distinctions like "only" fibbing. Or "little white lies".

I look at them

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[smittyoneeach]

You have the issue in a national security setting where you cannot disclose certain matters of What or How on certain topics. Hence the spectacle of DNI Clapper looking a fool on telly over specific events.
So they say nothing, or speak at uselessly high levels of abstraction.

For example the need for nationalized health care was so severely great, it totally justified even the most bald-faced lying. It was for the greater good.

And that is the Devil's logic.

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[Bill Dog]

You have the issue in a national security setting where you cannot disclose certain matters [...]

I'm finding it harder and harder for me to shake off the feeling that this is mostly incompatible with a free society. And I choose an insecure, free society.

And that is the Devil's logic.

Thank you! And who do you think is driving the godless in all their godless pursuits? Nothing? It's just coincidence that it's what the Devil would want?

Human beings aren't evil, but we're prone to tremendous foolishness. I didn't get to the point of filtering out Lefties here because I think they're evil, they're just thoroughly compromised, and

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[smittyoneeach]

I hear you. Yet, spying and skullduggery are things that governments do. It's just useless to deny it.