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The Near Future of Intel

Zonk posted more than 8 years ago | from the very-specific-crystal-ball dept.

136

wh0pper wrote to mention a Design Technica story about the near-term future of Intel. They've been getting beaten in the press pretty soundly by AMD of late, and at the Intel Developer's Forum they did their best to convince attendees they were on the comeback trail. From the article: "It wouldn't be IDF if there wasn't a solid performance message. This time, Intel clearly had AMD in their sights. By a series of their products' massive performance improvements, Intel hit the ball back into AMD's court. With Microsoft's Vista operating system coming out at the same time, Intel showed how they have the higher performing solution. Clearly, we won't know until final systems ship. But Intel presented their case strongly, suggesting they can match AMD, if not beat them."

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Gets you thinking... (5, Funny)

0110011001110101 (881374) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890363)

FTFA - Think of being able to set up a secure network in 3-1/2 minutes after you have plugged in the hardware.

Think of putting that network up for a hacking challenge on the web and having it totally violated in even less time than it took you to setup... Phew!! Good thing Intel isnt inside an Apple... ohhh shit. [ducks]

/ssharcasm

Re:Gets you thinking... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890474)

offtopic? This is gold, I wish I had mod points. ssharcasm (chuckle), gold I tell you.

Re:Gets you thinking... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14891367)

Wow. Most subtle "frist post!!!!!" ever

Vista to run in SMP mode only on new Intel procs (1)

absinthminded64 (883630) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891783)

"Intel showed how they have the higher performing solution. "

An attempt at humor. I'm sure they'd never stoop to this level.

"Leap ahead" just was not enough.... (-1, Redundant)

blankoboy (719577) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890383)

...when someone else is leaps beyond! http://www.leapsbeyond.com/ [leapsbeyond.com]

/fanboy much.

Intel has been catching up lately... (3, Insightful)

PFI_Optix (936301) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890401)

...and I, for one, am quite glad. The closer the two competitors are, the better products each releases. This will keep AMD from coasting the way Intel did in the nineties.

Re:Intel has been catching up lately... (5, Interesting)

WhiteWolf666 (145211) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890420)

I'm a big AMD fan, but this is true.

Lately AMD's development rate has slowed. Initially, I suspected they did this to hold better product back until Intel became competitive again, but after a year or so I believe they started to sit on their laurels.

The new intel designs will push AMD to work harder, which is a good thing. AMD's developers are very, very talented. It's sad to see the business side of the operation (even though its very practical for them) to tell the developers to slow down a little bit.

Expect AMD to start going full-tilt again.

You really think it works that way? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890506)

I'm pretty sure processor development isn't just a matter of how determined the people involved are. Some parts of it depend on the building of new fab equipment. Some depend on the discovery of new ways to design things. Some depend on serious advances in physics.

The reason chip companies sometimes hold back on new product is because they can't always be certain of the exact time at which breakthroughs in these other areas will be made. Their companies depend on having a solid, reliable revenue stream, so they have to use release schedules to smooth out the apparent advances in chip speed. If they didn't do this, we'd all be sitting around, hoping against hope that this month would be the month the new chips come out, and worried about buying in case they come out tomorrow.

Which is more or less how Apple worked for a long time, because IBM wasn't able to smooth out its development curve. It wasn't pleasant.

Anyway. Overall chip development does not just scale depending on the moods of the employees at chip companies. Intel went off-track by being overconfident at one point, sure, but that was a five year thing involving a bad choice of roadmap. The idea that AMB is sitting on their laurels after a year is ridiculous.

Re:You really think it works that way? (1, Troll)

jank1887 (815982) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890867)

"Some depend on serious advances in physics." last i checked, physics hasn't changed too much... I'll let you know if the apple falls up next time.

Re:You really think it works that way? (4, Funny)

4e617474 (945414) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890918)

last i checked, physics hasn't changed too much

Maybe you need to check more often then every 350 years. Fortunately, the Journal of Applied Physics has some RSS feeds [aip.org] .

Re:You really think it works that way? (0)

jank1887 (815982) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890965)

oh... sorry, forgot that sarcasm is usually lost on the slashdot reader. Now, had he said changes to our understanding of physics...

Re:You really think it works that way? (2, Insightful)

Deliveranc3 (629997) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890939)

But in todays world where consumers either don't research or have access to good research the idea of having a huge performance diffrence being any diffrent from a small one?

Intel and Amd have fallen into a game of releasing microscopic advancements to pass each other. It's easier and it offers the long term potential of selling chips.

There aren't many doublings in power left before people just don't need anymore power.

For the average user who doesn't need to compile code there is already way too much power for basic apps.

Check the source its Rob Enderle (1)

anandsr (148302) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890492)

I wouldn't place any faith in his prediction.

Re:Check the source its Rob Enderle (4, Informative)

porkThreeWays (895269) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890662)

Oh geez, this clown. For those of you who don't know, Rob Enderle is the troll of trolls. He will go on various forums and make outrageous statements seemingly to do nothing more than pick fights. I can't tell you how many times I've seen him make personal attacks on people. Then, once he's done trolling, will write articles on how vapid the open source community is. The sad part is he's supposed to be a "professional" with a consulting company. I wouldn't believe a single word that comes out of that mans mouth, whether true or not. Get a different source for your facts...

Re:Check the source its Rob Enderle (2, Interesting)

samkass (174571) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891058)

Agreed. The Mac community often calls this guy "Rob 'Microsoft wrote the original MacOS' Enderle" because that's one of the claims he stands by to this day.

Re:Intel has been catching up lately... (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890731)

Intel are increasingly developing technology that work *against* the customer rather than *for* them... and this is their future direction.

Everything done by Intel in the last 5-8 years has been driven completely by Digital Rights Management, and ensuring that the PC platform is completely locked down -- even if they so desperately want to avoid talking about it publicly. Remember the fuss over the "Fritz chip" -- it was a bill intended to force all electronic manufacturers to include a security chip to guard "digital rights" within a year to two or the government would impose one -- Intel was one of the companies that stopped that bill... because they, behind the scenes, made it quite clear that they were working on their own solution in conjunction with the rest of the technology industry. Any imposed solution would be half-assed at best.

Part of that solution is Le Grande (their trusted computing chipset), but also a raft of other technologies including stuff like EFI and HDCP, and rengineering software protocols to include DRM measures... all initiatives either created or primariliy driven by Intel... all guided by the principle of security used against the owner of the computer... and all intended for DRM. Intel isn't looking at selling to PC makers in future, they are looking to getting their chipsets into TV, DVD players. Not to mention such future tactics as their deal with Skype to cripple it unless running on Intel -- such future deals will be watertight once you cannot patch binary code and still have it work the same way.

It's a shame really. Intel, for all its faults, used to be in the business of making computers more and more capable. Now they are just in the business of building hardware that is deliberately crippled.

Price war (3, Interesting)

Ginger Unicorn (952287) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890410)

hopefully this means AMD will revert to trying to compete on price and so i can afford to get a modern setup ;)

Re:Price war (5, Informative)

Zephiris (788562) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890585)

If I could get an Athlon 64 3500+ (Venice Core :D) with 1.5GB of DDR400 RAM, 200GB ATA100 HD, DVD+RW 16X, an insane number of USB ports, etc, for less than $600, and add two serial ports and a good hardware modem for about $14, reuse a Soundblaster Live! or Aureal Vortex 2 (yes, really), into the end of last year, after not being able to have any computer upgrades since 1999 (Yay for Pentium 3), I don't think anyone else would have any excuse for AMD's price point. The only lower-end point is the ATi IGP graphics (which don't have a hardware T&L unit), but that can be upgraded at some point once PCI-E cards are cheap, and it can play most newer games still pretty smoothly, including Half Life 2.

Ironically, it is slower in Freespace 2 (the new open source engine with fancy effects anyway) and SWAT 4, mostly for the lack of hardware T&L. Especially with relatively basic lighting effects in newer games, you can "feel" it slowing down as the CPU has to handle it. But a system amazingly over the top for modern gaming and heavy programming and other usage, that's quite a lot cheaper than how much you could get even a slightly usable system in 2002. I wish they made an AGP to PCI-E or even AGP to PCI adapter so I could use my Geforce 4 Ti4200-8X, which has absurdly reliable performance.

Plus there's the fact that it uses so little power, and runs about 32C stable, while under heavy gaming/compiling prolonged usage, with about 30C when not having to do much, amazingly quiet as well.

Re:Price war (1)

prurientknave (820507) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891527)

I love the freespace2 SCP although i wish they could've supported linux too. freespace2 had one of the most brilliant story lines and game engines i've ever seen. The babylon project, is admittedly pretty awesome but since you're a fan I figured you'd also be interested in the new battle star galactica mod that's due out soon =) http://www.game-warden.com/bsg/ [game-warden.com]

Can't wait! check out their video.

Re:Price war (0)

Saven Marek (739395) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890626)

hopefully this means AMD will revert to trying to compete on price and so i can afford to get a modern setup ;)

Well AMD already do compete on price. What you see we have is the situation where AMD are the chipmaker with next gen chips that thrash intel's current gen chips but they are sometimes a little more expensive.

But intel's current gen chips only match AMD's last gen chips, and they are cheaper though. But so are the AMD last gen chips. So AMD are already competing with intel equally for price, but AMD have one generation ahead.

Lately Intel have released examples of their new next gen chip, designed to compete with AMD, but if you look closer at their tests they had to overclock the AMD in order to beat it, and that's not an accurate test but rather cheating. Also, by the time Intel have their next gen chip released it'll be more expensive than AMD's new one which I'm sure will be out by the same time.

Re:Price war (1)

ShibaInu (694434) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890990)

You know, I don't care. I have both AMD and Intel chips in my PCs at home and they both work fine. I'm glad Intel is making improvements in their chips, rather than just bumping the clock speed every few months. AMD had to make better chips to stay in business and now Intel has to do the same. We, the nerdly consumers who care about pipelines and memory access times, benefit.

umm... how is that cheating? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14891041)

if you look closer at their tests they had to overclock the AMD in order to beat it, and that's not an accurate test but rather cheating.

So let me get this straight... Intel could have left the AMD chip at the factory clock settings and thrashed it by a mile or it could have OVERCLOCKED it to give it an advantage against Intel's upcoming chip. This leads me to believe that you are just another retard who doesn't know what OVERCLOCK means. OVERCLOCKING from Wikipedia:

  • Overclocking is usually practiced by PC enthusiasts in order to increase the performance of their computers. Some hardware enthusiasts purchase low-end computer components which they then overclock, thereby attaining performance of a high-end system, while others will overclock high-end components, attaining levels of performance that surpass the peformance of the newest generation of computer hardware.


The 2.8 ghz AMD processor speed level is where AMD will be at when Intel's latest gen Core processor comes out. Even then, that would be AMD's highest end part compared to Intel's middle-high end. A true test would have been to pit a 3.0ghz or higher Intel processor and overclocked AMD or not, the Intel processor would have wiped the floor.

Your comment is the reason why the moderation system sucks here. You are clueless and yet you get modded up.

mods on crack (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890411)

offtopic? this is most definately a topic in the article.

Mods, you are not immune from RTFA as well...

Slashdot to be banned (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890419)

Hello, I am the CIO at a medium sized consulting firm in Miami, and while reviewing logs I've found as of late, a huge increase of traffic to this site, especially to this thread. I am new-in-position and trying to get some smart practices in place. As of tonight I'll be removing all of Slashdot's DNS entries from my servers, and be re-directing and visitors to Human Resources, it will be a final warning if anyone so much as tries to access this webpage.

Also, I've seen an increase of attempted Tor usage; I have a list of Tor IP addresses and block them, along with monitoring anyone who tries to use it. Although attempted Tor usage isn't directed at HR...yet, the people who try and use it are watched very closely. It gives people a false sense of Security most don't know there real IP's can be traced from it.

Now, for some personal comments. I've seen a LOT of anti-DRM stuff on this site, and it boggles my mind how self professed "nerds" are anti-DRM, it is the wave of the future, and I don't see how something the assures the artists gets paid for his or her work can be continually bashed on this site. I don't get the Anti-Microsoft stuff either; I mandate Windows in my workplace because multiple tests have shown it cheaper to run then Linux. Plus I've made thousands off MS stock in the past few months. Your whole privacy rants are horrid as well, the only people who argue for privacy are pedophiles, if your not doing anything wrong then what do you care who glances at your stuff? Also, what's up with the 7-Bit ASCII? What Is this? The 90's?

Re:Slashdot to be banned (0, Offtopic)

Aussie (10167) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890564)

You should get a username AC, may I suggest "PatheticTroll" or perhaps "BadTrollGuy".

Re:Slashdot to be banned (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890772)

Plus I've made thousands off MS stock in the past few months.

Good to hear people who invest in real, honest companies instead of Make-Larry-Page-Rich-scam GOOG.

Your whole privacy rants are horrid as well, the only people who argue for privacy are pedophiles

There is a obvious correllation between pedophiles and FOSS-posterboys; see the state Wisconsin vs. Linux "Sugar Daddy" Torvland (2002).

You will also wnat to block digg.com, since it is somewhat more dangerous that Slashdot in that it sometimes has actually interesting topics.

Yay go Intel! (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890429)

Intel intel, he's our man
if he cant do it, I BET AMD CAN!

How is this news? Intel's BRAND NEW processor can outperform a 1+ year old AMD X2?

Hey did you know that I can slap a buncha logic chips together and create a faster processor than ENIAC? DEAR GOD SOMEONE GIVE ME A MEDAL!

Re:Yay go Intel! (2, Interesting)

mapmaker (140036) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890635)

Intel's BRAND NEW processor can outperform a 1+ year old AMD X2?

It's even worse than that. This isn't a brand new processor, it's a future processor that they hope to have out in 6 months.

Re:Yay go Intel! (2, Interesting)

Courageous (228506) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890680)

This isn't a brand new processor, it's a future processor that they hope to have out in 6 months.

Indeed. This is a new situation for Intel. What they have done is given out copies of early silicon to reviewers, to publish reviews of a product that they don't plan to have out of their fabs at any significant production level for quite some time. Quite embarrassing that Intel has been reduced to this, really. We're getting reviews of a product that no comsumer can buy, and won't be buyable for quite some time.

Nonetheless, I'm happy to see them moving forward with decent x86 plans. The additional issue width, the microop bundling, the power enhancements-- all neato. Now they just need to address their goddamn bus topology.

C//

Re:Yay go Intel! (1)

fitten (521191) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890724)

It's even worse than that. This isn't a brand new processor, it's a future processor that they hope to have out in 6 months.

Were you talking about Conroe or the upcoming FX-62? (both due at about the same time).

Re:Yay go Intel! (1)

Saven Marek (739395) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890768)

Were you talking about Conroe or the upcoming FX-62? (both due at about the same time).

Conroe of course, coming out in six months.

Watch for it to be thrashed by the FX62 :). And intel, continue there never ending spiral downwards. If only Apple went AMD...

Re:Yay go Intel! (1)

fitten (521191) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891759)

Watch for it to be thrashed by the FX62 :).

Heh... the AMD machine was what the FX-62 is going to be...

Re:Yay go Intel! (2, Interesting)

Surt (22457) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891042)

Well, they've shown they can beat an overclocked X2 running at the clock speed that AMD predicts they'll have in their own roadmap in 6 months by more than 20%, running at the low end of their (intel's) expected clock range, using 6 month early hardware. This suggests that they'll be delivering a significant performance advantage over amd in 6 months, barring amd delivering a new architecture, which is not on the amd roadmap right now. AMD will deliver DDR2 at that time, which may have some small performance advantage, but they've said nothing to suggest that DDR2 will deliver more than a 5% performance advantage, if any (it may even be a slight performance disadvantage early on, but will cost less).

Re:Yay go Intel! (1)

RightSaidFred99 (874576) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891048)

Yeah, this one is Funny, if by Funny you mean ridiculous. The Intel chip beat AMD's fastest processor out _now_ (it's not an X2, asshole), including overclocking. Should they have sent a time macihne into the future to bring back AMD's chip from 4 months (not 6 months) in the future? AM2 will not perform better than the current s939 boards. The best AMD will do in the next 4 months is release a clock speed bump and minor enhancements, you're looking at a 10% improvement at _best_. The Intel chip runs 200MHz less speed, uses less power, and will still be considerably faster. But hang on to your excuses, if they comfort you.

Fluff? (3, Interesting)

Zebadias (861722) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890441)

I actually read the link and found it dull and lacking in any real excitment.

So if you have not RTFA then don't worry your not missing anything!

Re:Fluff? (1)

jzeejunk (878194) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890477)

Can mods reconfirm please? i'm on an intel box, it'll take forever to load the article.

Re:Fluff? (1)

aurb (674003) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890485)

Thank you! Now I'm not feeling guilty for not reading TFA. :-)

Re:Fluff? (2, Funny)

Not_Wiggins (686627) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890881)

So if you have not RTFA then don't worry your[sic] not missing anything!

You're advising the /. crowd that they don't have to RTFA? You must be new here! 8D

Clearly, we won't know until final systems ship. (4, Insightful)

digitaldc (879047) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890454)

Clearly, we won't know until final systems ship.

Need we discuss this any further?

You must be new here (4, Funny)

hoborocks (775911) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890470)

Arbitrary thoughts and unfounded speculation is how we roll :-)

Re:You must be new here (0, Offtopic)

perbert (241785) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890634)

Huh. I always thought it was arbitrary moderation and unfounded flame wars.

TFA is weak, Here is Anand's updated benchmarks (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890461)

I RTFA and it is severly lacking on substance.
Here is Anand's updated benchmarks.
http://anandtech.com/tradeshows/showdoc.aspx?i=271 6 [anandtech.com]

Re:TFA is weak, Here is Anand's updated benchmarks (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890557)

KUDOS to Anand from quickly addressing the issues raised here on slashdot over the intial Conroe vs. AMD benchmarks.

Anand says:
"But the one thing I 've come to understand and appreciate is that the AnandTech reader will always keep us honest; many of you came to us with questions and we spent all evening answering them"

No conspiracies here, Looks like Intel is back in the saddle again.

Re:TFA is weak, Here is Anand's updated benchmarks (3, Interesting)

Billosaur (927319) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890631)

From AnandTech: The performance picture with regards to Conroe hasn't really changed all that much - on average we're still seeing a bit over a 20% increase in performance over an overclocked Athlon 64 FX-60. While it's worth noting that these results should be taken with a grain of salt, we really were not able to determine any cause for suspicion based on Intel's setups. The machines were as clean as they could get, with the BIOS oversight having no tangible impact on most performance.

So Intel is finally catching up to and beating AMD in some regards. Mind you this is only one set of tests, but it may be indicative of a tightening of the processor battle.

Re:TFA is weak, Here is Anand's updated benchmarks (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14891228)

So Intel is finally catching up to and beating AMD in some regards. Mind you this is only one set of tests, but it may be indicative of a tightening of the processor battle.

Looking at both companies press releases can't really tell you that. I have knowledge (NDA protected, of course) of development at Intel that goes WAY beyond anything ever presented to the public. We're talking stuff 5, 10 years out. Stuff that's WORKING, although in prototype phase. I'm sure AMD has their own suite of super-secret shit.

The long term battle between AMD and Intel is being fought years ahead of what you actually see coming from these companies. It's totally impossible to say who is catching up to whom based on their current and near-term product offerings.

Intel is doing shit that would make your eyes pop out of your head. AMD is probably doing the same.

Re:TFA is weak, Here is Anand's updated benchmarks (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890644)

I agree with many here who have already said: Don't waste your time RTFA.
Read the AnandTech IDF benchmarks updated instead.
http://anandtech.com/tradeshows/showdoc.aspx?i=271 6 [anandtech.com]

"On the Intel front, there is a lot of time for performance optimization with regards to Conroe and its platforms. It's also worth noting that the 2.66GHz E6700 we previewed here is simply a high end mainstream part, it is not an Extreme Edition flavor of Conroe. At 2.8 or 3.0GHz, a Conroe EE would offer even stronger performance than what we've seen here. "

"The performance picture with regards to Conroe hasn't really changed all that much - on average we're still seeing a bit over a 20% increase in performance over an overclocked Athlon 64 FX-60. While it's worth noting that these results should be taken with a grain of salt, we really were not able to determine any cause for suspicion based on Intel's setups. The machines were as clean as they could get, with the BIOS oversight having no tangible impact on most performance"

Re:TFA is weak, Here is Anand's updated benchmarks (1)

fitten (521191) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890763)

And the Conroe EE part is expected to be a 3.33GHz part.

Re:TFA is weak, Here is Anand's updated benchmarks (1)

P3NIS_CLEAVER (860022) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891169)

I will tell you what I find suspicious, is that you see across the board performance superiority. In the past you will see with independant benchmarks that a chip will be better in some things and not in others. Either the benchmarks are cherry picked or the OS's have been messed with to slow down the AMD system. These numbers look like crap.

Re:TFA is weak, Here is Anand's updated benchmarks (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14891619)

Excellent job by Anand covering concerns after his first round of benchmarks.

Looks like Intel's comeback is the real deal. AMD probably knew this was coming; why else file lawsuits claiming "unfair" when you are kicking Intel's ass with Server/Retail market share gains?

Remember all the trash talking AMD was doing a few months back? "We challeged Intel to a dual core competition and Intel wimped out" AND "Top ten reasons Intel sucks in performance and power". AMD only has a few more months left before the can of ass-wup arrives.

Here is how I see it playing out...

2006Q2
Area Advantage
Mobile INTEL
Desktop AMD
Server AMD
Manufacture INTEL
Marketing INTEL

2006Q3
Area Advantage
Mobile INTEL
Desktop INTEL
Server AMD
Manufacture INTEL
Marketing INTEL

2007Q1
Area Advantage
Mobile INTEL
Desktop INTEL
Server INTEL
Manufacture INTEL
Marketing INTEL

getCPUId() (2, Funny)

OzPhIsH (560038) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890463)

I can't help but wonder if Vista won't be making any mysterious and unnecessary getCPUid() calls....

Re:getCPUId() (1)

TheDauthi (219285) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891122)

No. Microsoft is fair: it will work equally poorly on all CPUs.

Thanks Steve! (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890475)

After the recent embarrassingly sleazy Intel Conroe marketing push, getting dumped by IBM looks like it allowed Steve Jobs to find a soulmate in bogus benchmarks in Intel.

Great for Steve, a fucking nightmare for Apple users.

An overpriced Intel exclusive x86 OEM. Just what the computing world is waiting for!

But, hey!, gotta love those REALLY BIG SPEC SCORES(tm)!

Article is drivel. (4, Insightful)

tpgp (48001) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890490)

Do not waste time reading the article - it is stream-of-conciousness drivel. You will not get that 5 minutes of your life back.

Typical quote:
One of the technologies they showcased was the use of flash memory to increase system performance. By using flash, they can cut application load times dramatically; this has a huge impact on games (which load much more quickly from memory than from drives.) For us gamers, the game will load more quickly, we will be able to move between zones more quickly, and scenes pop more quickly.

This could keep you alive longer and overcome the problem of teams breaking apart before all team members can get to the same zone. The biggest improvement would be with laptop computers; for those of us who play games on our laptops, this is a good thing.
What? What are you talking about? Are you suggesting manufacturers will ship games on flash chips? And what the hell do laptops have to do with anything?

Nothing I've heard about intel's plans to use flash technology would improve any system performace other then boot time.

Welcome to slideware (2, Interesting)

ookaze (227977) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890563)

Heh, I guess this is another example of slideware, vaporware through slides, presentations, articles...

To be more specific it's Enderle drivel (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890573)

When I went to the webpage and saw Enderle name on the article I rolled my eyes. I read the damn article anyways and came to the same conclusion. Enderle like Dvorak gets paid good money to spout rubbish and drivel. Its a shame most people actually read these tabloid hacks. Save yourself 5 minutes of your life indeed.

Re:Article is drivel. (1)

93 Escort Wagon (326346) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890594)

"Do not waste time reading the article - it is stream-of-conciousness drivel. You will not get that 5 minutes of your life back."

I feel exactly that way after most of the times I've spent reading Slashdot...

Re:Article is drivel. (1)

Ginger Unicorn (952287) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891583)

if i could mod you insightful i would :)

why do i drain my life reading this junk.....?

Re:Article is drivel. (1)

NSIM (953498) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890600)

> Nothing I've heard about intel's plans to use flash technology would improve any system performace > other then boot time. This really more a feature of Vista which lets you use flash memory (typically on USB2 I/F) as an intelligent, non-volatile cache. Apparently Vista will put frequently used applications and data onto the flash device to speed up application start times etc.

Re:Article is drivel. (1)

SteveX (5640) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890637)

What he's talking about is a feature of Vista, called SuperFetch.

The idea is that the OS predicts what pages of what files you're going to need based on it's analysis of your usage of your computer, and caches those on any faster-than-disk-but-not-RAM storage you may have, like a flash drive.

So if a game occasionaly needed to load something up and the prediction algorithm figured this out, then it'd be cached on the flash drive where it can be read faster than going to disk to get it.

It's a great idea, but it doesn't have anything to do with Intel.

Re:Article is drivel. (2, Interesting)

tpgp (48001) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890848)

What he's talking about is a feature of Vista, called SuperFetch.

The idea is that the OS predicts what pages of what files you're going to need based on it's analysis of your usage of your computer, and caches those on any faster-than-disk-but-not-RAM storage you may have, like a flash drive.


Yes, I figured out he was talking about SuperFetch, but it's still drivel. SuperFetch is unproven and overhyped
Wow! Thanks Jim, 500MB of extra memory by plugging in a usb stick.

In addition, it's not likely to be any good for games. I can imagine loading system libraries, etc onto flash at boot... but games? It doesn't really work. Flash write time is still waaay to slow, and games manufacturer's are still going to want everything loaded off CD to attempt to prevent copying.

Re:Article is drivel. (2, Informative)

Glock27 (446276) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890987)

Flash write time is still waaay to slow,

Games read data WAAAAY more than they write data.

and games manufacturer's are still going to want everything loaded off CD to attempt to prevent copying.

Darned near every game I have loads all the big data onto the hard drive for speed. A few games require the original CD be in the CD drive during gameplay. That type of scheme is generally unecessary for online games, where you're authenticated by other means, so the situation is generally improving.

The idea of caching frequently used stuff to a flash drive is good - I hope Apple and other OS vendors pick it up.

Re:Article is drivel. (1)

Surt (22457) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891306)

They are talking about using flash to cache hard drives. A large flash cache can load game data faster and with less latency than the hard drive. For laptop users this has an additional advantage of using much less energy, and so extending battery life.

Good (4, Funny)

JRGhaddar (448765) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890498)

Competition => Innovation

Innovation => Faster/Better Chips

Faster/Better Chips => Faster/Better Comps

Faster/Better Comps => Giant Robots

And I for one want a giant robot.

Re:Good (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890519)

Do you really want a giant robot that can potentially kick your ass?

http://www.robotuprising.com/ [robotuprising.com]

Re:Good (1)

0110011001110101 (881374) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890537)

I am a Giant Robot you insensitive clod. What's this nonsense about "potentially"???

Re:Good (1)

JRGhaddar (448765) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890566)

I'm not scared I'm an official Ninja [realultimatepower.net]

Now a Giant Ninja Robot...that's something I'd be scared of.

pshaw! (4, Funny)

Thud457 (234763) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891112)

Independent lab testing proves Pirate Monkeys will beat Robot Ninjas 97.6 % of the time.

Re:Good (1)

senior.wrangler (828191) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890555)

I, for one, welcome our giant robot overlords.

Re:Good (1)

rcamera (517595) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890854)

innovation => faster/smaller/better chips

which leads to small [com.com] robots.

Irony! (3, Interesting)

SolitaryMan (538416) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890539)

The page showed me an AMD ad with this article. Was enough for me to know "near term future of intel" :)

It is just not enough... (1, Troll)

kurt_ram (906111) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890545)

It is just not enough to match AMD on performance. They need to match their price too. And I dont think this is ever going to happen. AMD is the clear winner.

Re:It is just not enough... (1)

fitten (521191) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890750)

Have you not seen any price lists in the last few days? The Conroe part as previewed is expected to be at/around $500USD. The FX-60 from AMD is over $1000USD, not that you can't get an Athlon64 X2 4800+ for just over $600USD [newegg.com] , prices will surely drop by then but Conroe does look to be a bit faster.

Re:It is just not enough... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890864)

AMD is the clear winner? Do you even know what the rumored prices are for Conroe? Here: http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=29504 [theinquirer.net] $529 for the 2.67 GHz chip. Even if the FX-60 price drops by half (right now it's just over $1000), Intel will still have them beat in performance/price. AMD is the clear winner? More like, you're clearly a fucking idiot AMD fanboy.

Performance improvements (3, Funny)

jrumney (197329) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890570)

By a series of their products' massive performance improvements

Let me guess - they demonstrated how Intel's top end chips can handle 10 way conference calls with Skype, while AMD's only handle 5?

AMD - Time to wakeup (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890577)

While AMD has clearly have a better processor now, it looks very complacent now. Especially when they should be looking at being more menacing by aggressive Research.

Alas nothing of that sort is happening. Still resting on the glory of the on-die memory controller, the core is now 7 years old!

Every other chip company is doing interesting things.
1. Sun Niagra T1 is amazing
2. IBM Cell rocks!
3. Intel Itanic may have failed, but was no doubt interesting.

Well ... AMD please move on. We acknowledge you have won. But the next battle is starting this week.

Re:AMD - Time to wakeup (4, Insightful)

hxnwix (652290) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890920)

What the hell are you talking about? Quad core, DDR2 - this year. Same core for seven years? What? The last core was 32 bit with no integrated northbridge. Hammer was a complete revamp/redesign.

Whatever criteria you are using to judge amd64 as the same core as k7 would also label merom a 686 core. And that is an old ass core.

Will Apple make something better/cooler... (1)

drrck (959788) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890581)

TFA was more a speculation on will apple utilize the Intel "toolbox" more stylishly than other WinTel companies. I'd better consult the Magic 8 Ball to answer this one.

Turning off PC and going home for weekend (1)

ndg123 (801212) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890599)

In the near future, most Intel corp employees will be logging off and shutting down before having a relaxing weekend following a hard week's productive work. A variety of leisure activities may be pursued, but a spokesman refused to confirm rumours of beer drinking.
Ah...may be not that near future.

Re:Turning off PC and going home for weekend (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890834)

Intel employees never "log off" and "shut down" and have a relaxing weekend. Trust me.

interesting quote (5, Insightful)

spiderworm (830684) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890606)

But Intel presented their case strongly, suggesting they can match AMD, if not beat them.


My, how times have changed.

Improvements? (4, Interesting)

Kilz (741999) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890638)

But Intel presented their case strongly, suggesting they can match AMD, if not beat them. Im waiting to see an independent head to head comparison. That Intel can beat AMD using 2 computers they set up is not a shock. Its possible to do all sorts of low underhanded tricks to make one computer run better than another.

Re:Improvements? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14891104)

I really doubt Intel rigged this test. They would have to be embarrassed later if that was the case. It is easy to compare to other tests (Quake 4) and see that the new chips are _very_ good even without comparison to the AMD system.

AMD (3, Insightful)

mac123 (25118) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890655)

Boy, sure is a good thing AMD has decided to stand still and not come up with any further technology advances on their side.

Oh...they haven't?

AMD? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890712)

I'd say AMD got trounced in the press by Intel yesterday. Is AMD going to compete on Microsoft's and Intel's Origami/UMPC platform?

Not optimistic so far (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14890803)

Language such as "Intel presented their case strongly, suggesting they can match AMD, if not beat them" is the language of someone who's accepted a position of defeat. You couldn't have come up with a more hopeless phrase if you were a Democrat.

Some important things (AKA garbage article) (4, Insightful)

augustz (18082) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890902)

There seems to be agreement this article is a bit weak. Some very important things to note.

"By a series of their products' massive performance improvements, Intel hit the ball back into AMD's court."

These are products that are not out yet. Benchmarks look good, but you are comparing a product on the shelves (that's been there a while) with one that is not OK.

And by the time they come out, AMD will likely have moved on to. This is a fast paced space, so 6 month time gaps matter when doing comparisons. Product matchups in the actual market are what matter.

AMD's M2 platform looks good. The performance / watt issue matters a lot, and it will be interesting to see how that develops. Both companies are clearly chasing the power/watt area, so should be a lot of fun. The notebook space especially which is currently dominated by intel will be fun.

"Intel showed how they have the higher performing solution." This should read intel MAY have a higher performing solution sometime in the future.

I'm tired of the big announcements of victory on non-shipping parts. ATI with crossfire (lunched twice). The hype around the P4 "netburst" architecture. The itanium hype of course. PS2 movie like visuals (still a nice platform, but please).

Fun to watch, great it's a great race.

Re:Some important things (AKA garbage article) (1)

Chainsaw Karate (869210) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890999)

As far as I know, the only thing AMD is adding with AM2 is DDR2 800 support. The A64 isn't bandwith starved anyway. It would be awesome if AMD could bring out some secret weapon to keep Intel from grabbing the performance crown (hell, I'd buy that over a Conroe if it happened), but that is extremely unlikely. Keep in mind that, in the benchmarks, the FX-60 was overclocked to rumored FX-62 speeds, which is likely the fastest chip AMD will have at that time. There is no chance in hell they will be able to come out with a chip 20% faster than that in time for Conroe.

Re:Some important things (AKA garbage article) (1)

augustz (18082) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891520)

Fair point. It'll be interesting to see how the power envelopes develop (both are chasing that) and how the cost is going (the FX series is one generation behind process wise, which if they've got it really ramped up might help keep costs lower).

That said, good points. Given that AMD is not bandwidth starved, I can see them going the multi-core route, and so far I like the multi-core solutions a bit better then Intels. Next step would obviously be a quad core. Be interesting to see when their next process move is scheduled.

Intel too expensive (0, Offtopic)

bemenaker (852000) | more than 8 years ago | (#14890919)

I can't ever go back to Intel. Too expensive. I'm done with them.

Re:Intel too expensive (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14891793)

RTFA

The Conroe part as expected to debut at around $500USD. The FX-60 from AMD is over $1000USD.

The last time AMD coasted... (2, Interesting)

NivenMK1 (755271) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891119)

If memory serves correctly, the last time AMD was fairly absent in the processor market and "resting on it's laurels", they rocked the world with the XP-class processor

Anyone who has been keeping tabs on AMD knows they are in the process of expanding their manufacturing capability/capacity.

I think AMD is playing the part of "lion in the weeds"...... ....again.

Feeling like... (1)

gerwen (960269) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891160)

Rip Van Winkel here. I haven't paid any attention to the processor wars lately, but what the heck happened to make AMD and Intel swap positions? I thought only in Bizarro world would people be wondering if AMD would rest on its laurels while Intel was trying to come up with a plan to unseat them from their throne.

Just a note for AMD fanbois (3, Insightful)

Aadain2001 (684036) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891274)

Just wanted to let all the AMD fanbois out there who always trash Intel whenever they show the slightest move in the right direction (for their company and consumers) that if Intel disappeared tomorrow, the world of computing as you know it would crash to the ground like a bowling ball.

AMD may have had the upper hand on processor designs for the last few years, and even Intel is practically admitting that by switching their mainline core architecture to the Pentium M derivative (which is a PIII derivative). But Intel has had them beat in one area and probably will for a very long time: production capacity. Intel's fabs can crank out processors in a day that matches AMD's production in a year (exaggeration, but run with it). There is NO way that AMD could meet the demands of the business world in sheer scale of orders. If Intel closed up shop, computer CPUs would triple or quadrupal in price overnight due to scarcity. Fabs take YEARS to build, and can take even more years to full ramp up to full production while shaking out the process bugs. Intel has a LOT of experience with this due to the shear number of fabs that they own and operate.

Competition is good, for everyone. Give props where they are due though. Intel is turning around after making a very bad roadmap choice many years ago, and I think it will only benifit consumers in the long run. AMD had very good designs and will probably have some more good ones in the future. But don't pick on or the other exclusively and wish for the other to disappear. That would lead to a VERY bad situation for everyone, even you.

Re:Just a note for AMD fanbois (3, Insightful)

jareth-0205 (525594) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891441)

What sort of argument is that? If Intel disappeared then AMD would not be able to cope with the gap? Well duh... things don't change that quickly, AMD are always going to have time to ramp up their production as market share shifts. For that matter, if AMD disappeared then I'd bet even the great and bountiful Intel would have a hard time filling that 20% or so.

Plus if Intel closed up shop, suddenly there'd be lots of fabs and extra supplies up for sale...

Nobody claims that Intel should not exist, but their squeezing over the last few years has been good for everybody. (well, except Intel maybe)

Re:Just a note for AMD fanbois (1)

Lxy (80823) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891489)

Maybe a bigger obstacle is branding. Intel is such a widely recognized name that higher ups who don't know any better keep buying Intel. AMD may be cheaper and faster, but Intel owns the mindshare. As long as Intel keeps billing themselves as they have been for the last 10 years, there will be a market for Intel.

excellent competition (3, Informative)

slackaddict (950042) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891322)

I love this competition between AMD and Intel. They have been slugging it out producing excellent processors and actually being fairly responsive to consumer demands. Here's a brief description of the wars between the 2 companies over the last 10 years:

1) Floating point performance wars - Before AMD came out with the K6 processor, Intel had the floating point crown and neither AMD nor Cyrix could compete. Although AMD and Cyrix had inexpensive intel-compatible processors, most people used their cpu's for low-end desktops.

2) That all changed when AMD released the K6 processor with an excellent floating point unit. Then the war became a Mhz slugfest between AMD and Intel in which Cyrix was marginalized. Intel reached the 1000Mhz mark first with the P3 but AMD wasn't far behind with the Athlon.

3) AMD changed their approach with the Athlon focusing on P3 crushing performance regardless of the actual clock speed. Intel kept the Mhz focus with the P4.

4) AMD released the hugely successful 64-bit Athlon that dominated the P4 even though the 64-bit Athlon operated at a much slower clock speed. Intel lost much market share in the desktop and server market to the new 64-bit Athlon and the new 64-bit Opteron processors.

5) Intel finally realized that the educated consumer didn't care about raw Mhz anymore, they switched to their own performance number rating scheme.

6) The latest oil crisis hits the world and consumers become more energy conscious. Many computer enthusiast websites point out how much energy Intel processors demand and how little AMD processors demand in comparison. Intel and AMD respond by making their processors more energy efficient and cooler running.

7) Dual-core processors are released from both companies trying to squeeze more performance out of their aging cores. The Intel processors can't scale as well with multiple cores due to the already high energy and cooling demands of their processor cores. AMD gains further ground in this area.

And that's where we are today. AMD has seriously damaged Intel's marketshare with some excellent products. Intel is feverishly working on new products to get that marketshare back. The benefit is that we will see very good products from the 2 companies over the next 12 to 24 months.

Re:excellent competition (3, Informative)

Visaris (553352) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891509)

2) That all changed when AMD released the K6 processor with an excellent floating point unit. Then the war became a Mhz slugfest between AMD and Intel in which Cyrix was marginalized. Intel reached the 1000Mhz mark first with the P3 but AMD wasn't far behind with the Athlon.

That is not true at all. AMD reached 1GHz first by a couple of days. I hate the way these things get turned around. Next you'll try to tell me that Intel was first to dual core because they paper launched it two days before AMD, even though AMD was the first to have actual shipping parts...

AMD is waiting (profiting) (2, Interesting)

shummer_mc (903125) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891480)

It's expensive to continually upgrade fab facilities, marketing material, etc. Sitting on a successful product with inflated prices is a serious profit maker. AMD is simply reaping the rewards for kicking the hell out of the P4. Congrats to them. I don't blame them a bit. They've been skating on razor thin margins for quite awhile. I hope that AMD has addressed the majority of their production issues in the last year (they're gonna need it).

OTOH, Intel has been fattening (and has expanded into MANY other markets) and until recently hasn't had to really work to keep a nice lead on AMD in the processor market. So, now they will have to turn around processors faster than AMD (which is likely why they just switched to 65nm processing before moving into Merom processors). That's just business.

It shapes up as a nice fight (finally). I can't wait. I want a dual core CPU for around $100. Maybe then I'll get off of my 3000+XP processor. Yes, the consumer wins in a competitive market (FWIW, I've never built an Intel system... but I've built a LOT of AMD ones (and one Cyrix)). I only hope that AMD has enough designs stable and in reserve to keep ahead of Intel for another 5 years. AMD is still the serious underdog here.

Intels near future (1)

crizpiz (960300) | more than 8 years ago | (#14891484)

Hmmn, this has me all excited at the prospect of having a 2 major processor vendors. Look at all the good the Ati and nVidia rivalry has caused. I can only hope the same applies here. On that note the last decent workstation processor Intel has made was the Pentium 3.
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