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Notebook with Huge 20 Inch Screen Reviewed

ScuttleMonkey posted more than 7 years ago | from the desktop-replacement-not-laptop dept.

307

An anonymous reader writes "Trusted reviews has a look at the Acer Aspire 9800. This massive machine has a 20.1" screen, two 120GB hard drives in a RAID 0 array, super-multi DVD burner, analogue and digital TV tuners and an Intel Core Duo dual core CPU. And at over 17lb you can even use it for weight training!"

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307 comments

Not only that, (5, Funny)

fredistheking (464407) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489784)

It almost gets to the windows loading screen before the battery dies.

Re:Not only that, (2, Insightful)

Whiney Mac Fanboy (963289) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489871)

It almost gets to the windows loading screen before the battery dies.
hehehhe - so true, but everyone I know who has one of the Acer (or Asus) monster laptops falls into that (quite large) 'other' category of laptop users - those who occasionally lug a laptop between work & home & rarely (if ever) have a need to use a laptop away from AC (that outweighs the need for a cheap laptop with big hdd & screen).

For those users, I guess this laptop will be good, but I bet it will still suffer from the 'goddamn thats one noisy ~0@#\/|3r' problem of having waaaaaaaaay to many fans....

Only 1680 x 1050 resolution (5, Insightful)

peterdaly (123554) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489785)

It may have a 20.1" screen, but it's a little light on the pixel density side of things.

"So let's start with that huge screen. With a widescreen aspect ratio, you're getting a native resolution of 1,680 x 1,050, which to be honest is pretty low considering the physical size. Considering that many 17in notebook screens have a resolution of 1,920 x 1,200, I can't help but find the resolution on this 20.1in display somewhat disappointing. Closer inspection gives some clue as to why the resolution is limited - quite simply, Acer has bolted one of its desktop monitors onto a notebook. Whereas most notebook screens and consequently lids are getting slimmer and slimmer, the lid on the Aspire 9800 is 30mm thick - it's therefore a safe bet that it's exactly the same panel that Acer sells in it's 20.1in desktop monitors."

Personally I have an older Dell C800 (I or something like that) with a 15" 1600x1200 screen. I value pixels more than size, so for me it's great.

1680x1050 is horrible resolution for 20" of screen space, but I guess if you value size more than pixels, then this is the laptop for you. I would guess that for some users, particularly gamers, raw pixel resolution may not be your highest priority. There's also the "mine's bigger than yours" aspect.

Frankly, I'm surprised it took this long for a company to bolt a 20" desktop screen onto a laptop base.

Oh yeah...don't forget the Holy 17 Pounds Batman! I'd be willing to bet that doesn't count the power brick. Does it come with wheels and a pull handle?

Anyway, if I had the cash burning a hole in my pocket, I'd pass this one by.

Re:Only 1680 x 1050 resolution (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489815)

You are an idiot. 1680x1050 is the widescreen equivalent of 1600x1200. It is not a waste of space, just a monitor with a different aspect ratio.

Re:Only 1680 x 1050 resolution (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489870)

No, 1920x1200 is the wide screen pixel count. See how that height in pixels is the same there? even my 17" dell widescreen is 1920x1200, along with my 24" dell , mmmmmmmmmm.

Re:Only 1680 x 1050 resolution (1)

Kemanorel (127835) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489917)

Wow, what a truly insightful and enlightening comment. If I had mod points, I'd mod you to oblivion.

TFA stated that 17" monitors tend to come in at 1,920 x 1,200. How can 1,680 x 1,050 be "just a monitor with a different aspect ratio?" That is fugging light on the pixel count for that much real estate, no matter what ratio it's in.

*/troll fed/*

Re:Only 1680 x 1050 resolution (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489882)

> Anyway, if I had the cash burning a hole in my pocket, I'd pass this one by.

And soon after the cash did, the laptop would as well.

Re:Only 1680 x 1050 resolution (5, Funny)

VorpalRodent (964940) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489907)

Frankly, I'm surprised it took this long for a company to bolt a 20" desktop screen onto a laptop base.

I did that long ago. The problem was that the CRT made the laptop a bit top heavy.

Re:Only 1680 x 1050 resolution (1)

cpsc2005 (629087) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489927)

Anyway, if I had the cash burning a hole in my pocket, I'd pass this one by.

A wise decision. It's not even endorsed by a superhero [slashdot.org].

Re:Only 1680 x 1050 resolution (2, Funny)

Jherek Carnelian (831679) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489930)

1680x1050 is horrible resolution for 20" of screen space, but I guess if you value size more than pixels, then this is the laptop for you. I would guess that for some users, particularly gamers, raw pixel resolution may not be your highest priority.

Indeed. It isn't size that matters - its what you do with it that counts.

17 lbs is heavy? (2, Funny)

milgr (726027) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489962)

My first computer was one of the original Compaq "portable computers". If I remember correctly, it weighed about 34 lbs. That was before the day of laptops. I probably moved it more than my current laptops. I lugged it between college and home - a trip that included commuter rail, subway, shuttle bus, airplane, express bus, another commuter train, and several long walks -- along with a clothing bag and numerous books.

Hmm.... Maybe I was nuts.

Excellent Large-Screen Portable Television (0, Redundant)

reporter (666905) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490108)

peterdaly (123554) wrote, " 1680x1050 is horrible resolution for 20" of screen space, but I guess if you value size more than pixels, then this is the laptop for you. "

Due to the horrible resolution, if you viewed DVD movies close-up on this laptop, then you would see the square-ish outline of each pixel. However, this laptop would make a great portable, large-screen television. Just place it about 15 feet away from your sofa in the living room and crank up the brightness of the LCD panel. At 15 feet, your eyes would blur the outline of each pixel and would form a smooth contour of each object in the scene.

Incidentally, this portable television would be excellent for viewing pornography when your wife has taken the kids to soccer practice on Saturday. About 5 minutes before she returns, you quickly delete the porn mpeg file, close the lid of the laptop, and shove it into the closet. No one would be the wiser.

Re:Only 1680 x 1050 resolution (2, Informative)

mlinksva (1755) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490141)

15.4" laptop screens that support 1920x1200 have been around for awhile too. I'm satisfied [gondwanaland.com] with mine.

lb? (4, Informative)

Whiney Mac Fanboy (963289) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489787)

And at over 17lb you can even use it for weight training

Thats 7.7kgs for those of us not still using British imperial measurements ;-)

Re:lb? (2, Informative)

BrianTung (914386) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489846)

I think the units used in the U.S. are actually an amalgam of various pre-Imperial systems. The U.S. gallon, for instance, is not equal to the Imperial gallon; it's a pre-Imperial gallon (back before the Sith took over).

Re:lb? (5, Funny)

Coryoth (254751) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489928)

Given that, as pointed out, the units used in the US are not actually Imperial units, the question must be asked as to what exactly to call that particular unit system. Some suggestions: "Archaic", "Irregular" "Primitive", "Obsolete", or "Wrong".

Jedidiah.

Re:lb? (3, Insightful)

BrianTung (914386) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489984)

I'm sure you're not entirely serious, but "archaic" and "obsolete" are obviously incorrect, since they are in current usage in the U.S. The U.S. system cannot be wrong (except from a technical elegance point of view), and it's not primitive in any meaningful sense. That leaves "irregular," which it certainly is.

Sorry. If it were up to me, we'd have standardized on metric a long time ago, but we're too busy legislating morality. So we'll have to get back to you on that.

Re:lb? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489863)

Nah, it's pretty light in britian. Only 1.1 stone....

Re:lb? (5, Informative)

nizo (81281) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489865)

I just wondered, why are pounds written as "lbs"? I found the answer here [worldwidewords.org]



[Q] From Andrea: "Why are pounds, when used as a weight, abbreviated lbs?"

[A] The origin is in the Latin word libra, which could mean both balance scales (hence the symbol for the astrological sign Libra, which was named after a constellation that was thought to resemble scales) and also a pound weight, for which the full expression was libra pondo, the second word being the origin of our pound.


Who says Slashdot isn't educational???

Re:lb? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489969)

Who says Slashdot isn't educational???
That's assuming you aren't the only one who didn't already know the origin of lbs.

Perhaps the only thing we learned is that you learned.

One small nugget added to nizo's wisdom bag, right on. Hopefully that positive boost helps you navigate through the day's negative distortion fields.

Cheers.

Re:lb? (1)

dedazo (737510) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490053)

If you speak or understand any of the Romance languages evolved from vulgar latin (such as Spanish or Italian) you already know this. Because in those languages the word for "pound" is also "libra", so it doesn't take much to relate the "lb" contraction to it.

So I'd guess about 1/4th of the planet's population already knew this.

But OK, we'll say Slashdot is "educational". Just this once!

Re:lb? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489868)

unsubscribe

Re:lb? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489920)

fuck yourself and die.

Re:lb? (1)

kfg (145172) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489968)

The weight in pounds given in the blurb is a conversion from the weight in kilograms given in the FA.

KFG

Re:lb? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15490058)

or 1.467 stone or well over half a tod. By the old definition that kind of weight was reserved for portables not laptops. By any weight standard it's like having a small child on your lap.

Force != Mass (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15490065)

Aren't you assuming a 1 g gravitaitonal field? How very Sol III centric of you.

For a limited time with our 17lb units (5, Funny)

nizo (81281) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489788)

Included with the purchase of a new unit: one year of free adustments by the chiropractor of your choice.

Re:For a limited time with our 17lb units (1)

CRCulver (715279) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489803)

Indeed. Didn't the Mac Portable tank because its weight was up around that much?

Battery capac... (5, Funny)

network23 (802733) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489793)

This massive machine has a 20.1" screen, two 120GB hard drives in a RA...

And a battery capacity to power the unit for 4.5 seco...

- - -

Oh Lord, won't you buy me a Color MacBook?

Re:Battery capac... (1)

CrazyJim1 (809850) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489823)

[blockquote]And a battery capacity to power the unit for 4.5 seco... [/blockquote] Oh come on, you couldn't have been typing that in under 4.5 seconds on that machine because Slashdot won't let you post something under like 30 seconds. Nice try buddy, but you're not fooling anyone.

Re:Battery capac... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489971)

Use the damn preview button. It's there for a reason.

Re:Battery capac... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489836)


"Oh Lord, won't you buy me a Color MacBook?"

Because I don't reward faggotry.
- God

Re:Battery capac... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489936)

We get more tail from both genders every [atspace.com] week [atspace.com] than you'll get in your entire life, PC user.

Any commercials about it that use migdets? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489807)

Cause those are really funny.

Battery power (5, Funny)

dotpavan (829804) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489808)

FTA:

"but still has enough battery life to give you a full days work on the move."

What does it come with? a power plant attached?

Re:Battery power (1)

crazyjeremy (857410) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489822)

The author wasn't talking about this computer when he made that comment... he was talking about latops in general.

Re:Battery power (1)

Overzeetop (214511) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489842)

What they mean is a full day's productivity, which, for your slashdot addict is somewhere around 1.5 hours. No, they really don't count the 6.5 hours we spend on the web as "productive". Go figure.

Re:Battery power (0)

ChrisGilliard (913445) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489872)

What does it come with? a power plant attached?

It uses cold fusion. :)

Cold Fusion? (1)

steveo777 (183629) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489964)

Yeah, that must be using the frosty power plant keep the CPU and all those HDDs cool at the same time. er... yeah...

Re:Battery power - 1234567890 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15490032)

I'm waiting for the realization of cool fusion [imdb.com].

Half-assed effort (4, Insightful)

word munger (550251) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489826)

This is such a slapdash attempt at a laptop it's pointless. There's a one-inch margin around the edge of the keyboard, yet the keyboard itself doesn't even have full-sized cursor keys. You've got a full-sized monitor, why not a full-sized keyboard? Obviously it's meant to be lugged around as a gaming machine for LAN parties and the like, but if you're going all-out, why not actually make the thing useable?

Re:Half-assed effort (1)

Rob T Firefly (844560) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489919)

I'm a bit confused by the lack of bulky NiCad batteries and a highly dirt-susceptible rollerball pointing device, to complete the fifteen-years-ago form factor they were obviously struggling for.

market segments (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489848)

In europe this will be marketed as a workstation replacement and in USA it'll be marketed as compact PDA (just the size of your back pocket).

The SUV of notebooks... (1)

GillBates0 (664202) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489862)

New meme: People who buy SUVs and Aspire9800s are just trying to compensate for their little winkies.

Re:The SUV of notebooks... (5, Funny)

heson (915298) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489884)

Acer Canyonero!

Re:The SUV of notebooks... (5, Funny)

ettlz (639203) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490028)

Can you name the 'top with two hard-drives
A built in webcam and a screen that's wide?
Ninety-eight double-zero-oooooh,
9800.

Well it goes real fast with dual-core brain,
It's the super-size 'book too big for a plane,
Ninety-eight double-zero-oooooh,
9800.

380 mills deep, 490 mills wide,
7.8 kilos of Taiwanese pride,
Ninety-eight double-zero-oooooh,
9800.

Top of the line in weightlifting sports,
Knackered elbows are a matter for the courts,
Ninety-eight double-zero-oooooh,
9800.

She stuns everybody with a CrystalBrite screen,
She's a 20-inch dual-core computing machine,
Ninety-eight double-zero-oooooh,
9800.

Re:The SUV of notebooks... (1)

generic-man (33649) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489938)

*ahem*

The "SUV of notebooks" is the HUMMER(R) Laptop [hummerlaptops.com]. "Just as tough, reliable, and go-anywhere as a HUMMER vehicle, this laptop is the perfect addition to your active lifestyle! Featuring the latest in mobile technology, it's ergonomically styled, and tough enough to survive the wear and tear of every day use whether at home, in the car, or on the go!"

Re:The SUV of notebooks... (1)

Carnildo (712617) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490082)

If it can't survive falling down a 50-foot cliff into a mountain stream, I'm not interested.

Re:The SUV of notebooks... (1)

HermanAB (661181) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490006)

Need to power this baby with a fuel cell: "My laptop gets 20 hours to the hogs-head and that's the way I like it..."

RAID 0? (1)

caluml (551744) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489864)

Personally, I'd find RAID 1 a better choice. Whack it through the dm-crypt layer, plonk XFS on top, and it'd be good to go.

This is an Eierlegende Wollmilchsau (2, Insightful)

Zweideutig (900045) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489874)

This is what is referred to in German as Eierlegende Wollmilchsau. This essentially means "egg laying sow." The reason I say this is because it is a laptop trying to be a workstation. This would be better in Apple II C form. I personally don't like anything larger than my 12" iBook (which runs Linux well). I wouldn't want anything larger than my 14" Compaq Evo laptop. There are two types of people that will buy this from Acer: (1) those that like high tech lifting weights (2) those who won't remove their laptop from their desk.

Re:This is an Eierlegende Wollmilchsau (1)

heson (915298) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489914)

I love my Fujitsu lifebook (B142), even if its obsolete.

Add one more type of user to your list... (3, Interesting)

raygundan (16760) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489915)

3. Those who work at a desk at client sites, but are required by company policy to take their machines home at night.

I'd LOVE a monitor that size-- but I'm stuck with a puny laptop screen as long as I'm working outside our main office.

Having taken up all that desk space (2, Funny)

ettlz (639203) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489875)

I'd at the very least expect some recesses on the top of the lid for a plate, cup and come cutlery. Disconnect the fans, it could even keep my dinner warm!

It even comes with a free chiropractor! (1)

Cixel Sid (977171) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489887)

I got a chassis of HP BL25ps in the basement... heck, why not put a flat-panel on it and lug it around. Weighs the same and has 10x the power. This product will likely miss the market...

Quality (3, Insightful)

phorm (591458) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489893)

What I've found with Acer in general is that they throw a lot of quantity (in terms fancy features) with not a lot of quality. Fragile frames, dying screens, and various other problems have been a plague to Acer machines for years. Moreover, I've seen the same type of power issues occur in their notebooks from my old 233MMX (T310 I think) notebook all the way to the last Acer machines we bought (about a year ago).

Having a notebook with features is great, but not when you can't use the thing or have to keep sending it in for repair due to poor design. I'm not sure that this laptop would be any more or less reliable than previous models, but I'd be careful that all those great "features" don't cause one to overlook the issues of reliability.

In other news: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15489899)

Acer engineers have decided to expand on the idea of portable performance: It will now offer a desktop case with holds to attach your monitor, keyboard, and a small UPS for carrying ease.

Big Muscles! (5, Funny)

parasonic (699907) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489909)

And at over 17lb you can even use it for weight training!**

** Applies only to those reading this Slashdot article

Re:Big Muscles! (1)

CDarklock (869868) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490103)

My thoughts exactly. You'd have to be pretty weak to consider 17 pounds a weight worth lifting. Anything less than 50 isn't even worth *counting*, is it?

Commercial (1)

blackdragon7777 (720994) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489933)

For some reason after reading the blurb on here I am reminded of the dish tv commercial with the guy standing next to the huge speakers and of course the old lady eating the 5 pound steak with the song in the background singing "Big and huge and huge and big!"

Flex (1)

Sazarac (621648) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489940)

From TFA:
There's a significant amount of flex when typing and the break is a little spongey too.
And you'll be glad too, when your rowmate on the plane attempts to repeatedly slam your head in it because you whipped out such a big friggin' laptop. God help you if you buy one of these and want me to give up my portion of the armrest so you can play Spider in relative comfort...

One good thing might come of this (1)

nonlnear (893672) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489941)

Designers of 17" laptops might look at that beast and finally realise that there has been room for a numeric keypad all along...

stop dissing it. (4, Insightful)

nblender (741424) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489946)

You're all dissing this thing because it won't fit in your front pocket or run for a week without going to a power outlet. It is what it is. It's a desktop computer that can easily be pitched in your vehicle, driven to a destination, unpacked and used within seconds. Sometimes when you're working, and need to concentrate on a particularly nasty problem or are architecting a really nasty piece of code, you just want to take your computer and go _somewhere_else_. I don't want to pack up all my monitors, keyboard, mouse, cpu, cables, etc. I want to flip the lid down and go to the library or the cabin or wherever.

My employer bought a Dell D810 for me to use. This thing is so far from being portable it's not even funny. It's huge, heavy, a little flimsy, etc. But it's fast, has a big screen, lots of pixels, and does everything I need (except run OS X). However, when I travel, I still bring my 12" PBG4.

Mobility (4, Insightful)

Umbral Blot (737704) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489957)

Most people own laptops because they can go places with them, which for the most part means fitting them in a backpack or other bag. (weight is less of an issue, students carry loads of textbooks arround all the time on their backs, so what is a few more pounds?) However with a 20 inch screen I have problems imagining the kind of bag it would fit.

Re:Mobility - in N. America (1)

johnty (558523) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490040)

In north america, its considered mobile if it is smaller than the largest storage space of an SUV.

I dont think it will be usefull (1)

skyfi (978768) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489975)

It is so big so in that way it is no more notebook.)))
It is not useful. I cant understarnd why customer will be needing RAID controler!, and 240 gigabytes space for data.

Numeric Keypad (1)

RealGrouchy (943109) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489982)

When I first saw the picture, I thought to myself, "Wow! There's enough extra space to put in a numeric keypad!"

Then I realized there already was one!

- RG>

Re:Numeric Keypad (1)

nonlnear (893672) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490031)

That was my reaction too.

My beef with the industry is that there has been room for a numeric keypad on the 17" laptops all along. On some widescreen 15.4" ones also if they really wanted to. I really hate pushing the "special" key to use the fake crooked number pad. It's one of my pet peeves.

"super-multi DVD burner" (2, Funny)

Frightening (976489) | more than 7 years ago | (#15489994)

Is that like better than the uber-max DVD burner? Now I know why the post was anonymous.

ALso, what is it with R&D these days? It's like they make em work straight for a month or so, then they have an office party where they get the managers drunk:

Employee A: Lets make a 20 inch Laptop with RAID 0. And lasers.

Manager: Yeah dude that would be amaaaazing. Can I lick your balls?

Time to Apply the Term.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15490001)

.. luggable. Remember the Osborne? [wikipedia.org]

Man with Huge 20 Inch Penis Reviewed (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15490019)

go to macslash and ask Trollaxor about Ben's 2 in peppis!

TEH NUE JESUSGEEKS -> http://macslash.org/ [macslash.org]

Close, but no cigar. (1)

Octopus (19153) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490070)

I ALMOST like this laptop (even though it's an Acer). ALMOST. And just because I want a bigger laptop.

But I agree with others - THERE'S PLENTY OF SPACE FOR A FULL-SIZE KEYBOARD ON THERE, YOU NICKELBAGS. Go flush to the edge and get rid of the damn touch-pad. The nerds that would really use a good powerful laptop like that HATE TOUCH PADS - can't count how many times I've seen developers making a scrunched up face jamming their thumb on the pad just trying to minimize a damn window, let alone done it myself. (Spare me a lecture about hotkeys please.) So much usable space there, wasted to make room for the touch pad.

Christ on a crutch, it pisses me off. I could easily pack a mouse or even a slim Wacom tablet with the thing and be very happy with the 20" screen.

Size (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15490074)

It's not the size that matters! It's the battery life..

Short battery life.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15490078)

slashdotted already!

law suits (1)

objwiz (166131) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490083)

so how long will it before there are lawsuits against laptop manufactors because someone hurts their back lifting a laptop?

That's it? (2, Funny)

brian0918 (638904) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490092)

With something that big, you'd think it would come with a handle, and maybe some headlights and deer whistles. The sidewalks and campuses of the world are no longer safe.

Imagine! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 7 years ago | (#15490097)

Imagine watching porn on that while on the move!

Thats the only logical reason to use one of those.

Quoting from the article:
Size does matter

subwoofer (1)

tedpearson (910434) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490115)

It's so big, they even put a SUBWOOFER in it! Better be careful with this on your lap (if your lap can support its weight), not only might it cause infertility due to heat, but it will be booming and bouncing all over your lap as well.

Not 'nuff redundancy for me. (1)

suv4x4 (956391) | more than 7 years ago | (#15490129)

Intel Core Duo dual core CPU

You forgot to mention it's from Intel. Again.
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