Venezuelan Interest In U.S. Voting Software 337
A number of readers wrote in about a U.S. federal investigation into the Venezulean ownership of Sequoia Voting Systems, which makes voting machines used in 17 states and the District of Columbia. The Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States wonders whether the anti-U.S. government of Hugo Chávez could be trying to influence the U.S. midterm elections. From the article: "Government officials familiar with the Smartmatic inquiry said they doubted that even if the Chávez government was some kind of secret partner in the company, it would try to influence elections in the United States. But some of them speculated that the purchase of Sequoia could help Smartmatic sell its products in Latin America and other developing countries, where safeguards against fraud are weaker."
Ridiculous (Score:5, Funny)
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Unfortunately, Diebold disagrees with you. They prefer the run this election to the tune of "may the best cracker win". I mean, the US government has such an world-reaching influence that it makes sense to have a global election process, right? That's probably why they tabulate election results on unsecured Windows PCs and why the sell voting machines with less integrity and security than an XBox.
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Personally, I find it hilarious and ironic. The USA played a part [guardian.co.uk] in the attempted Venezulean coup in 2002. The documentary The Revolution Will Not Be Televised [imdb.com] covers it rather well and is well worth a viewing.
Then we have regime change in Iraq! Frankly, I find the paranoid fear that another country is attempting influence US elections quite worrysome. It's almost like the US has developed some sort of collective paranoid psychosis.
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Hey the US was just celebrating the ten year anniversary of the Coup held by "friend of democracy" Hugo Chavez.
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Oh fucking please (Score:4, Insightful)
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Let's investigate the only E-Vote vendor who is NOT under control of our own thugs.
Re:Oh fucking please (Score:5, Interesting)
I also think that al-Qaida would vote G.W.Bush: Never ever have the recruiting possibilities have be better, never ever have the arguments of al-Qaida being existant better. Never ever have the means and possibilities of getting money from the Arab world being better due to high income on oil and an general feeling of being waged an undeclared war against from the U.S..
Never ever have allies of the U.S. being more alienated from the U.S., making "divide et impera" the most easiest ever. Never ever was the danger of the own population being in favor of U.S. so minimal. The U.S. was actually managing to get the same people of Iran, who were burning candles on the streets in condolence to the victims of 9/11 and thus expressing their sympathy for the U.S., now being nearly unified against the same U.S..
If I was the U.S. administration, I would recommend to hush up any possible ties between Sequoia voting machines and Venezuela.
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You've ignored the possibility that Chavez actually despises the actions of the Bush regime and genuinely would like to see a better US foreign policy.
Not everyone is solely interested in power.
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Actually, he wants to "bury the US". I saw him say this in a live speech. What was really surprising was that he neglected to bang on the podium with his shoe while saying it.
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Could you please point me to a source for this?
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Not everyone is solely interested in power. Yes, I would ignore that possibility.
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Not everyone is solely interested in power.
A ridiculous statement made even more ridiculous when applied to Hugo Chavez. Read up a little on the guy. He likes his power.Re: (Score:2)
You're right, people not soley interested in power get jobs. The ones interested in power become politicians.
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The US policies have always benefited the rich while disadvantaging the poor, and that's IMHO the number one reason why he's opposing them.
endorsements (Score:2)
If memory serves GWB was endorsed by both Osama Bin Laden and Vladimir Putin in the days before the 2004 election.
Which has to be a first.
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Yeah, all populists have secret police to round up dissidents.
Even anti-Bush politicians like Nancy Pelosi agree that Chavez is a "thug."
Like most 3rd
Re:Oh fucking please (Score:5, Insightful)
Wow... and all of those accusations have occured in the local Venezuelan press? That's pretty cool, considering we've got US pundits trying to claim that Chavez is censoring the press [washingtonpost.com].
I don't know much about it myself, but one of those silly leftist writers, Tariq Ali [democracynow.org], is going around saying things like this about Chavez:
What? (Score:2, Funny)
Do they run open source software or something?
Hmm (Score:4, Insightful)
Is that supposed to be a joke?
Safeguards against fraud in Latin America (Score:2, Interesting)
For the 2000 elections I was a representative for a small party and was an observer at the vote counting (there was an observer at each polling station for every party in most urban areas, plus independant observers). It was of course voluntary work (non-paid).
Let me know if such measures are implemented in the US - last I heard, they aren't. I was proud to be a watchman
Only in America (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: Only in America (Score:3, Informative)
Our country has a long history of the FBI keeping an eye on people for no reason other than liberal views, while jumping in bed with the most extreme sort of right-wingers in South America.
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My first thought was exactly this - investigate machines made by that leftist radical country Venezuela, but don't even think about critizing those made by Diebold.
My second thought was way more cynical - could this be a pre-election manoeuvre designed to set the stage for investigating/recount/tossing out votes on suspect machines? Being sure, of course, to focus on those machines that voted Democrat. (OK, so the machines don't themselves vote. Or do they? Since we often can't see the the code or eve
Re:Only in America (Score:4, Informative)
http://www.motherjones.com/commentary/columns/20 04/03/03_200.html
Many, many more details at that link.
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If we were to further research the matter I think we would quickly discover that the top of most corporate hierarchy's ar
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Does it really matter what Diebold's politics happen to be at the moment? The point is that we shouldn't have to be having this discussion. Our electoral system should be set up in such a way that its integrity shouldn't depend on the honesty of any one company or individual. If things were done correctly, then the voting machine companies could be owned/run by Lucifer himself and we'd still
BFD (Score:2)
Chavez isn't a saint, but Bush sure is the devil.. (Score:5, Informative)
Knowledge is the main weapon in this day and age!
Please... (Score:2)
Bush is not the Devil, even if the Devil were to exist other than as an idea.
Bush is just a stupid politician who pa
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TLF
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Churchgoing people (if by churchgoing, you mean Christian) by definition cannot logically believe that they are the Messiah. If they do, by definition, they are not Christians.
As far as telling you "how to fix all the problems you didn't know you had," what exactly are you talking about? If they're trying to tell you about Christian beliefs--like salvation--tha
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Forgive my hyperbole. I did not mean the "Messiah" part literally. The non-Christianity of such a claim is part of my point. Jesus was supposed to have unlimited power and yet he chose to live in poverty and not establish a Christian regime. To claim more authority for oneself is on some level like claiming to be a greater Messiah. At the same time, I do not wish to limit my comment exclusively to Christians. You are correct that many religions deserve the same criticism.
I don't mean to hold anything agai
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What dots? Seriously, I'm not sure what you mean.
but you're suggesting what he's saying hardly happens at all, which is where you and he disagree, seemingly.
If you mean that I'm suggesting that what "hardly happens at all" is Christians giving people with different world-views the sin beat-down, you've got the wrong guy. I think that it happens all too frequently. What happens too *infrequently* is Christians respectfully & non-j
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Chavez gets to call Bush anything he wants when addressing the UN general assembly. Its a small price you have to pay for sponsoring a coup against a democratic government. Many feel that Bush should be punished properly.
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Chavez, as a dictator, has nothing to do with "democratic government". There's certainly nothing like democracy in Venezuela under Chavez, where it is now an explicit crime [washingtonpost.com] criticize the dictator.
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One of the main reasons I do not like it when people call Bush the Devil is that is does not convey any description of the negativity within the statement. It is a blanket statement without any depth. I prefer more qualitative statements involving reasonable criticisms or complaints than pie-in-the-sky religious labels that get nobody an
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There is the matter of lying to the World in his efforts to start the war in the first place. Even if one is magnanimous enough to say it was a genuine mistake to invade, rather than pointing at the huge ulterior motives for it, the action of deceit can hardly be called one. It was deliberate and unconscienable.
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That is all.
Thank you.
TLF
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It was a reference to Chavez's latest UN speech in NY.
Breaking news, buddy! There's a world outside the US. I happen to belong to it and am really glad about that.
MOD up, thats a great DOC (Score:2)
Well... that is so long he can stand the sulpur smell I guess. tee-hee...
Seriously though, Chavez is just your average guy who grew up in the slums and rising to power fighting for the little guy/gal.
Clearly Bush&Cheney would like nothing better than to introduce the harmless little fella to some friendly water boarding.
Re:Chavez isn't a saint, but Bush sure is the devi (Score:3, Informative)
Bush isn't a saint, but Chavez sure is the devil.. (Score:2)
I watched this video. It certainly did not make me favor the dictator. It was sort of heartbreaking that the coup almost set Venezuela on a road to decency, but the dictator won out in the end. Now with rigged elections and the laws Chavez passed (including one that requires a long jail term for criticizing the dictator), Latin America is sure to enjoy a few decades of bloodshed, war, and oppression from Venezuela's expansionist "President f
Re:Bush isn't a saint, but Chavez sure is the devi (Score:2)
How can he be considered a dictator? He got it to power democratically after huge support from the countries poor. This same support played a part in the counter-revolution to stop the undemocratic assention of a military government. What's your angle here? Have you actually seen the documentary? I honestly don't know how anyone could come to your conclusions after watching it. And yes, I have read of this coup before seeing the movie a
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Yes, Stalin said the same thing in the 1930s as he did what he did. Hard to imagine someone believing either of these similar guys (who are both rich, corrupt types).
Re:Chavez isn't a saint, but Bush sure is the devi (Score:2)
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What was ACTUALLY going on remains a mistery to this date. I watched your piece and there's too much reliance on gimmicks and cheap shots in it for me to consider it seriously. Heck, the stated mission of "X-ray of a lie" was to discredit "the revolution will not be televised". Th
Torrent link to Chavez: The Revolution ... (Score:2, Informative)
Download this movie now! (Score:2)
The film-maker said we were all free to download it. He'd covered his costs thanks to RTE and the BBC and just wanted people to see it now.
Great movie. And what happened was truly frightening. Not least because (as mentioned in the discussion afterwards) most of the Western press largely ignored it.
The movie vaguely hints that Washington may have been involved. It shows the plotters going to the White House the month before the coup
film Link (Score:2)
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Number of countries invaded by Chavez: 1 (attempted) -- when he tried to overthrow the elected government of Venezuela in 1992.
Number of countries invaded by Bush: zero. All military interventions under the Bush administration have occurred with the support of the United States Congress.
And besides, this thread was about the quality of domestic life under Bush and Chavez, respectively, not about their foreign policies.
Fight fire with fire (Score:2)
"Better" meaning practical and effective, not necessarily morally right.
Hold on a second (Score:5, Insightful)
Though a move to open systems would help with either.
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Hell, if it takes Chavez to get the US back to pen-and-paper ballots, then all the better.
Is there some way we can get Kim Jong-Il to invest in Diebold?
- RG>
What about investigating Diebold? (Score:3, Insightful)
Poster child of FUD (Score:5, Interesting)
A GOP risking to lose an election, a less popular than ever PotUS, a largely announced electoral defeat: so let's try to blame the machines, and while we're at it Chávez too. It only surprises me they did not mention the company's CEO is an alias used by Osama Bin Laden or some other scarecrow.
The article also mentions (in the second page) the controversy about Chávez' re-election's, but fail to mention that election's result was UN-certified (unlike someone else's) and the guy in charge of UN controls was Jimmy Carter, not Fidel Castro.
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To put it into perspective, since 9/11, about 30x as many people died because of drunk drivers than died in the attacks. Don't get me wrong, the attacks were brutal and I'm sure the guys who were piloting the planes didn't reach the heaven they thought they were reaching, but as a nation we are overreacting.....
Not overreacting, just reacting wrong (Score:2)
Even the right wing chickenhawks stated the war was going to be very long and expensive before we started it. By not making t
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This same Jimmy Carter?
http://www.mnstories.com/archives/2005/11/ethiopia ns_prot.html [mnstories.com]
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Chavez will probably have died of old age.
Election fixing (Score:2)
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[url:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sequoia_Voting_S ystems]
I suspect that he realizes that George has done the same here,
and is basically doing the same to get George out, because he
believes George to be the Devil, or at least a reasonable facimile.
These machines have the same problems as Diebold, and a few of their own.
DRE, just like the Accuvote machines, small difficult to read typeface, and so on.
[url:www.votersunite.org/info/CorrectingSequoi
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first link,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sequoia_Voting_Syste
second link,
http://www.votersunite.org/info/CorrectingSequoia
Flame Bait (Score:4, Funny)
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I think Nelson phrased it best.. (Score:2)
"Hah-hah!"
I am of course referring to Nelson off of The Simpsons, not the the admiral, or the guy from South Africa..
Turn-About is Fair Play (Score:2)
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Some sample differences: Bush hasn't nationalized his country's only real industry (in Chavez's case, oil) and started using it as a subsidized way to prop up leftist politicians in other countries. Bush hasn't issued edicts about what percentage of music broadcast in Venezuela has to be of a certain type or origin. He doesn't shut down journalists for speaking out against him, or imprison opposing political candidates. He doesn't issue statements saying that his "
Oh, of course. (Score:2)
Personally, I'd rather have them doing it than
Fucking xenophobic, racist bastards.
the real issue (Score:2)
Why should it matter? (Score:2)
If that is the case, why does it matter who is doing the actual manufacturing?
Reminds me of a Black-Hat Briefing conference I attended some years back, where a chain of encrypted anonymous email servers was introduced. A member of the audience asked whet
Funny it wasn't "stuff that matters" months ago.. (Score:2)
Feh.
In Other News... (Score:2)
Yawn, how predictable... (Score:2)
Every screaming liberal here on Slashdot treats random allegations about Diebold to be indubitably true, unquestionably the reason for their 2004 disappointment.
But here's an allegation that a devout socialist and an avowed enemy of the United States might have an ownership interest in a compnay that makes electronic voting machines, and not only do some folks dispute the allegation off the bat, but many or most of the same screaming liberals actually cheer for the idea of stolen elections as long as the "
Maybe a bit predictable - but don't dismiss it! (Score:2, Informative)
http://weazlsrevenge.blogspot.com/2006/10/sign-of
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Hi there. I'm a liberal, occasionally screaming, and I don't think that. I do think, however, that the fact that it's impossible for anyone to demonstrate otherwise is a disgrace. How can any election ever be trusted if we can't verify that the results weren't tampered with? If you don't think it's a problem, I imagine the issue will be made clea
Test eVoting scientifically (Score:2)
Or maybe the current system (notice I say system, not just the current administration) doesn't like the idea of doing things scientifically?
Bullshit Anti-Chavez Story (Score:2)
The US hasn't had a fair election in six years and won't have one next week either - even assuming Bush doesn't try bombing the vote fraud off the front page with an attack on Iran.
Finally!!! (Score:2)
At least SOMEONE is interested in the potential misuse of software in U.S. voting!
Partially true (Score:2)
This is partially true. Originally, the goverment was part-owner of Smarmatic. No wonder they got chosen to supply the hardware for elections here.
As soon as the public found out, they sold their percentage of ownership.
The hardware smartmatic sells is a model that was intended to be used in Lottery calculations (source: http://buscador.eluniversal.com/2004/06/14/pol_art _pol1.shtml/ [eluniversal.com] )
This shouldn't matter (Score:2)
We should be demanding enough transparency in voting machines that it wouldn't make a difference if they were being programmed by Karl Rove or by Boss Tweed. Either they're clean or they're not, and it's wrong that we have to guess which based on who owns the manufacturer.
The truth is out there ... (Score:2)
The Revolution Will Not Be Televised [google.com]
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We need some really obvious fraud by anti-American foreigners to wake people up. Sadly, all we're going to get is both sides of Americans accusing each other of fraud, w
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