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Macs Gaining a Bigger Role In Enterprise

kdawson posted more than 6 years ago | from the i-want-my-os-x dept.

Businesses 383

rev_media tips a short article up at InfoWorld giving some numbers on the increasing Mac presence in businesses. "We're seeing more requests outside of creative services to switch to Macs from PCs," notes the operations manager for a global advertising conglomerate. They "now [support] 2,500 Macs across the US — nearly a quarter of all... US PCs." Another straw in the wind: "Security firm Kapersky Labs has already created a Mac version of its anti-virus software for release should Mac growth continue (and the Mac thus [find] itself prey to more hackers)."

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Macs Gaining a Bigger Role in the Enterprise (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211498)

Well that's only because you can run LCARS in vmware now...

Re:Macs Gaining a Bigger Role in the Enterprise (4, Funny)

Kamokazi (1080091) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211976)

Really? Can it emulate the bio-neural circuitry found on the NCC-1701-E, or am I stuck with old-school isolinear circuitry emulation? (or god forbid, duotronics?)

Just goes to show ... (-1, Flamebait)

tomhudson (43916) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211506)

We're seeing more requests outside of creative services to switch to Macs from PCs

Get ready for all the right-wingers crying about how gays are infiltrating corporate culture ... as opposed to the perma-brain-damaged.

Re:Just goes to show ... (-1, Flamebait)

timmarhy (659436) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211554)

well even retards can manage to stick it in the correct hole, so who's more retarded? don't get me wrong i don't hate faggots or anything, i just think their inferior.

Re:Just goes to show ... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211626)

"even retards can manage to stick in the correct hole."

So you don't like getting blowjobs, because that's the 'wrong' hole?

Oh, right, slashdot. Nevermind.

Re:Just goes to show ... (1)

timmarhy (659436) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211688)

rofl. seriously i don't have anything against gays. I was responding in kind to the moron OP, he seems think anything who doesn't use a mac is rightwing? seriously wtf.

Re:Just goes to show ... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211794)

Sure you don't. Lord knows when I want to make a point, I spew hatred, too. You were probably just misunderstood. Like always.

Re:Just goes to show ... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211914)

don't get me wrong i don't hate faggots or anything, i just think their inferior.

I'm beginning to recognize the idiots here and you now provide evidence that you are indeed one. Please complete the proof of your idiocy by attempting a logical rationale for your statement. My guess is you won't because you know its better to STFU than prove you are an idiot. Also, you are most likely lying about "hating". You're a homophobe and you can't even admit it. They need a word for you, maybe something like homophobe++.

Re:Just goes to show ... (3, Informative)

dorzak (142233) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211886)

Not likely since Rush Limbaugh is a Mac user.

Macs on the Enterprise (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211516)

Well, thats only because you can run LCARS in vmware now.

Re:Macs on the Enterprise (3, Funny)

calebt3 (1098475) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211542)

Brought to you by the Department of Redundancy Department.

Low starting point (3, Interesting)

timmarhy (659436) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211518)

Well when you've got such a low starting point it's not hard to improve is it? i think this deserves a dilbert comic, something like marketing showing a 100% increase when they only sold 1 extra unit.

Re:Low starting point (5, Funny)

flyingsquid (813711) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212082)

You know, when they said that Macs were gaining a "bigger role in the Enterprise" I had a picture of a bunch of Macs installed on the bridge of a Federation starship. And this dialogue:

"Fire photon torpedoes!"

"I can't!"

"What's wrong, number one?"

"There's just a single mouse button! I can't right-click on the Klingon ship!"

"Dammit! Do a command-click!"

More IT Jobs require Mac skills (0)

New_Age_Reform_Act (1256010) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211534)

Re:More IT Jobs require Mac skills (4, Interesting)

ColdWetDog (752185) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211588)

Nah, according TFA, you don't need Mac tech skills:

After all, as Publicis' Plavin notes, Macs -- which cost the same as equivalently configured business-class PCs -- are cheaper to support because they are easier to support.

To which I might add, "Citation Needed".

I'm a recent Mac switcher with years of Windows experience. It's not all that easy to get OS X to work and play well with Active Directory and Windows networking (or maybe it's the other way around). IT lets me play with the Mac because I'm pretty self sufficient. Most enterprise OS X users aren't going to be particularly savvy - they'll need lots of help (like always).

And finally, the cynic in me wonders how many of those Macs are really running XP / Vista under boot camp while at work... Not that there is anything wrong with that. You'll look cool and all, even if you're running the same dorky programs as everyone else.

Re:More IT Jobs require Mac skills (2, Insightful)

symbolset (646467) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212402)

I'm a recent Mac switcher with years of Windows experience. It's not all that easy to get OS X to work and play well with Active Directory and Windows networking (or maybe it's the other way around). IT lets me play with the Mac because I'm pretty self sufficient. Most enterprise OS X users aren't going to be particularly savvy - they'll need lots of help (like always).

I'm pretty new to the Mac too, after a 20+ year hiatus from the Apple world. You know what? Figuring this out took me all of a day. Figuring out how to do broadcast imaging using Apple's tools took most of three days. In short, people aren't as dumb as Microsoft needs them to be.

I honestly donâ(TM)t want more market share.. (2, Insightful)

Rod76 (705840) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211548)

If Macs ever get to be the predominant platform or to common, Im switching to Linux. Call me a troll or whatever (Im a Mac user and have been for over a decade, so you other zealots feel free to mode down one of your own), but I dont want the Mac to grow anymore than it already has. Id much rather see OSS software take over the market and let the others be a paid choice.

Re:I honestly donâ(TM)t want more market shar (5, Insightful)

timmarhy (659436) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211580)

thats right you can't be an elitist snob if everyone had one.

Re:I honestly donâ(TM)t want more market shar (2, Insightful)

HeroreV (869368) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211806)

Hence the hate for Ubuntu, for allowing normal users to be comfortable with Linux.

Re:I honestly donâ(TM)t want more market shar (1)

nawcom (941663) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211652)

If Macs ever get to be the predominant platform or to common, Im switching to Linux. Call me a troll or whatever (Im a Mac user and have been for over a decade, so you other zealots feel free to mode down one of your own), but I dont want the Mac to grow anymore than it already has. Id much rather see OSS software take over the market and let the others be a paid choice.
heh, i dunno. you sound like the type of person who only listens to underground music, and as soon as it becomes the hip thing, you switch your music to another underground genre. I'm not saying it's a bad thing at all, I'm a mac and linux programmer myself; i just found your statements interesting.

Hmmmm (0, Offtopic)

ModernGeek (601932) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211556)

Don't we hear this about once every two years or so? Maybe even more often than that. It is always same thing, "Macs will end up like Windows with viruses if it gets mainstream" Tagged with slownewsday

Re:Hmmmm (0, Flamebait)

NoobixCube (1133473) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211584)

Linux will never get like that though (-1 flamebait, -1 troll, -1 offtopic). Unless the worst viruses in the world are interested in your music collection, stored in your home folder. Correct me if I'm wrong, but for a virus to run on a Linux machine, the user would have to either knowingly execute it, or run a program that executes it. And even then, unless the user does it as root, the virus is almost totally harmless to the system.

Re:Hmmmm (2, Insightful)

calebt3 (1098475) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211606)

People are pretty trusting of the repos most of the time.

You asked to be corrected... (4, Informative)

thestuckmud (955767) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211854)

Don't kid yourself. Linux is potentially as vulnerable as other operating systems. Reports [slashdot.org] say that rootkitted linux machines serve as botnet controllers. Keeping linux machines patched for security is necessary, too.

Fed up with MS (5, Insightful)

stoolpigeon (454276) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211572)

I think a lot of us really hoped that eventually people would really get what a mess Microsoft's products are and then OSS would really take off. Instead what I think is happening is that Apple may really see some growth.
 
I don't know if this means much but my department of 80-90 has gone from zero to about 20% mac in the last year. I don't see that adoption rate slowing down either. Now in the server room it is a mix - Windows, AIX and Linux. With Linux growing the fastest. But on the desktop I don't think anyone is full time Linux only. Even the Linux users all have a windows or apple machine.

Re:Fed up with MS (1, Interesting)

ColdWetDog (752185) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211658)

Even the Linux users all have a windows or apple machine.

Well, that's obviously because this isn't (yet) the year of Linux on the desktop. That's next year.

But seriously, I think it's because, on a Mac, you can run OS X, Linux and / or Windows of whatever flavor. The latter OS being the most important. Once it becomes more common for enterprise level apps to be written for *nix or just as web apps (shudder), you can then easily migrate the worker-drone clients to a cheap Linux box. Or convert your cheap Dell box into a cheap Linux box.

I see that as happening in the next couple of years - then OS X will be marginalized in the enterprise unless the mythical cheap Mac mini tower (i.e. the brushed aluminum beige box with an Apple logo) actually gets by his Steveness. Mobile users will still have Mac Book Pros, artiste-types will have their cheese graters, but the cubicle critters aren't going to get anything that fancy.

Re:Fed up with MS (0, Troll)

flyingfsck (986395) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211856)

Do you realize that Asus alone, sells more Linux laptops than Apple sells Macs?

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

node 3 (115640) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212354)

Do you realize that Asus alone, sells more Linux laptops than Apple sells Macs?
Citation?

In 2007, ASUS sold about 300 *thousand* Eee PCs, only 1/3 of which run Linux. In 2008, they plan to sell 5 million Eee PCs, which amounts to 1.666 Linux Eee PCs. Apple sold 2.3 million Macs last quarter.

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

daBass (56811) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212400)

Can you please quote your sources? Apple sold well over 8M Macs in the last year, that's a whole lot of sales to beat.

I'd also like to see how many of those "Linux Laptops" actually end up running Linux. I have seen more than a few Eee PCs running Windows...

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

arminw (717974) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211882)

....That's next year...

That's right, the year of Linux is ALWAYS next year in the same way the fusion power plants are always twenty years in the future.

Re:Fed up with MS (0)

Telvin_3d (855514) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211670)

Why would anyone go Linux only? OSX has a perfectly functional *NIX back-end to it so it's not like you lose out on any of the advantages of Linux by going with it. And you get to save on the hardware compatibility hassles that do still exist. Especially for laptops which I see more and more office workers getting.

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

stoolpigeon (454276) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211726)

Me - I'd like to at some point because I really like working with and on open software.
 
I think cost comes into it for some as well.

Re:Fed up with MS (2, Insightful)

howlingmadhowie (943150) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211798)

losing out on the advantages of linux? by using OSX you lose out on the most important advantage of gnu/linux and free software: you actually own the software, you don't just license it.

the philosophical difference between software released under a free license and proprietary software is massive. as for the technical difference, well that is something you can of course never know, seeing as you can only know what free software technically is.

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

Telvin_3d (855514) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211884)

Well yes. But I'd love to be a fly on the wall when the IT guy tells the boss that from now on purchasing decisions for the office will be based on their philosophical merits. After all, working WiFi is a practical concern and what place does that have when weighed against your computing soul?

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212136)

whens the last time you used linux? Ive been using it for the last 2/3 years and WiFi just works. No you offer the boss the financial benifits ( e.g 0 installation cost, 0 additional hardware costs, dedicated support that will fix the software for you under the support fees)

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

oatworm (969674) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212316)

0 installation costs only work if your time is worthless as far as the company is concerned - hence why machines have OSes pre-installed these days. 0 additional hardware costs only work if you assume the hardware will never die, which isn't even remotely accurate. Dedicated support? Uh... isn't that your job? Also, don't forget that WiFi "just works" if you have just the right chipset (i.e. avoid Broadcom and Realtek unless you want to play with Ndiswrapper or have your OS do it for you).

Look, I'm typing this from a laptop running Linux - it works great. I'm happy with it. However, if you try to sell it as some sort of pie-in-the-sky utopian vision of "no cost", nobody's going to, pardon the expression, buy it. It just sounds (and, much of the time, is) too good to be true. That's not to say Linux won't eventually make some serious traction against Microsoft on the desktop - there's something to be said for running the ultimate definition of a "commodity" OS on commodity hardware - but it's going to take a long, long while to get there, and, by Linux's very nature, it's going to have to trickle down from the server room.

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

arminw (717974) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211910)

...you actually own the software, you don't just license it...

What difference does that make since every computer comes with an OS anyway, either OSX or Windows. If you have a Mac, also get some other very useable software and you can also run many free UNIX flavor programs. If you want you can any flavor of Window, or Linux all running in a VM under OSX.

Re:Fed up with MS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211994)

If you want you can any flavor of Window, or Linux all running in a VM under OSX.
Or I could just not run OS X at all... OS X doesn't provide me with anything I want so there's absolutely no reason to use it. If I'm going to be using Linux in a VM all the time why the fuck would I bother with OS X? I buy supported hardware and use Linux and it does everything I need. In my case, using OS X would be a step backwards.

P.S. I can also run Windows and OS X in a VM under Linux.

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212104)

If you want you can any flavor of Window, or Linux all running in a VM under Any OS.
Fixed that for you, if your going to be using free UNIX programs why pay loads for hardware?

Software mostly equals digital office supplies (-1, Troll)

NDPTAL85 (260093) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211998)

About that philosophical difference..... seeing as how a lot of computer software is the equivalent of digital office supplies how good does it feel to be giving away your labor (if you actually are a programmer that is) to enable others to freeload off of the electronic versions of Staples / Office Max's products?

Don't get the analogy?

Word processing software - Typewriters/mechanical word processors
Email,IM,IRC - Pens, Paper, Envelopes, Stamps
Database software - Filing cabinets
Spreadsheet software - Calculators and ledgers

There are exceptions of course, video games aren't office productivity tools. They're the equivalent of board games.

But still with so much software resembling something you could buy from Staples 20 years ago, it kinda takes the "righteousness" out of the whole free software movement. Shoplift something from Staples or Office Max and see if you still have the feeling you are a part of an important "movement".

Re:Software mostly equals digital office supplies (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23212058)

That's the dumbest fucking analogy ever. Just blatant idiocy...

Re:Software mostly equals digital office supplies (1)

Jerry Smith (806480) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212150)

But still with so much software resembling something you could buy from Staples 20 years ago, it kinda takes the "righteousness" out of the whole free software movement. Shoplift something from Staples or Office Max and see if you still have the feeling you are a part of an important "movement".

I'm stunned, really. Do you really not understand the difference between 'shoplifting' and 'receiving a gift'?

Re:Software mostly equals digital office supplies (2, Insightful)

MBGMorden (803437) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212172)

But still with so much software resembling something you could buy from Staples 20 years ago, it kinda takes the "righteousness" out of the whole free software movement. Shoplift something from Staples or Office Max and see if you still have the feeling you are a part of an important "movement".
I think you win the Stupidest Analogy of 2008 Award. How can you compare using free software with shoplifting (stealing)? In one case the "owners" are giving you permission to take what you want, in the other you're taking it against their will (and breaking the law).

Personally, as a programmer, I write stuff in my own time because a) it keeps me in practice in languages and application "genres" that I don't get to really work with in my professional career, b) the projects look good as professional samples of my work, and c) most importantly, because I like to do it. It's a special type of weasel that instantly seeks compensation the instant that they believe they've enhanced the life of another person in any way.

Re:Fed up with MS (4, Insightful)

node 3 (115640) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212406)

Free is just a feature. When I choose a computer or operating system, I weigh all the features, in proportion to their importance to me.

Free is nice, but I'd rather have a system that works well, and is compatible with the hardware and software I most care about.

as for the technical difference, well that is something you can of course never know, seeing as you can only know what free software technically is.
Aside from specific technical requirements for such assurance, what does it matter, in practice? Should I worry that I can't prove that Photoshop isn't setting the blur radius to 2.1 when I request 2.0? Is it important that I can't prove that iTunes isn't shuffling the songs randomly?

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

orlanz (882574) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211876)

Personally, I didn't like the Unix in OSX. I liked both individually, but programming on it for me was no different than having 2 separate machines.

The OSX and Unix sides don't play as well as say Gnome, KDE, daemons/services, and Unix (you know what I mean) do in Linux and the BSDs. Not to mention I am programming/interacting with a specific proprietary system instead of a more generic, open, flexible one.

It's just my style of programming. I try not to be implementation specific where I can and rather be generic interface based.

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212158)

But for the cost of a mac, you could get a higher spec Dell which is guaranteed to be compatible with you SuSe And when you phone up Novell with a bug, your phoning people that will fix the bug and send you a patch, not some generic mac help desk.

Re:Fed up with MS (1)

howlingmadhowie (943150) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211822)

But on the desktop I don't think anyone is full time Linux only. Even the Linux users all have a windows or apple machine.
do you really want to go with this? as it happens i do own an imac, which of course has a gnu/linux distribution on it. installing gnu/linux was actually the first thing i did when i got it, i never even booted osx once. my company laptop got the same fate.

I call bullshit (2, Interesting)

zappepcs (820751) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211578)

That was a very inflated summary... fuck

FTFA

"We're seeing more requests outside of creative services to switch to Macs from PCs," notes David Plavin, operations manager for Mac systems engineering at the U.S. IT division of Publicis Groupe, a global advertising conglomerate. There are so many requests that Plavin now supports 2,500 Macs across the U.S. -- nearly a quarter of all Publicis' U.S. PCs.
There that sorts it out, 2500 is no where near 1/4 of all US pc's... damn

Besides, uhmmmm, ok, so Mac is gaining ground. How much is that about the Mac vs. about Microsoft being shit for the last three years? Vista did more than an 'own goal' they are giving points away to EVERYONE else. Of course Mac will get some of them. It doesn't hurt that the iWHATEVER has been so popular. It's called the halo effect http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halo_effect [wikipedia.org] and so Mac gets more customers right now. Lets see how long they keep them? The halo effect has been shown to be quite a peak-then-die thing unless the product has real staying power.

Don't get me wrong, Mac has some serious positive qualities and I'm not going to bash it (other than being proprietary and expensive) but this story is not taking into account the halo effect nor the gains made from MS defectors. Defectors? Why don't we just describe them as passengers on the titanic looking for a life raft without having to resort to building their own?

I have a couple of friends (who have obvious desires for Mac due to musical or creative arts reasons) who have opted for a flashy balls out Mac because, and I quote "I just want something that works and I don't have to fuck with it, no matter what the cost is."

Mac will get those votes. With the looming recession I don't think there will end up being all that many of those votes, especially when GNU/Linux is making so much headway. I'm not declaring a winner or anything, just saying that the optimistic view of this FA is .. well, overly optimistic given the other facts of life.

Re:I call bullshit (2, Funny)

ColdWetDog (752185) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211702)

Oh come now, Mr. and Ms. Moderator. Just because zappecs isn't in a very good mood, there's no need to Trollerize him. Besides having a reasonably cogent point (the article is pretty lame and stupid), he's posting on Slashdot on a Saturday night. He's obviously a lonely guy stuck in some (perhaps figurative) basement.

Where's the love?

Re:I call bullshit (1)

zappepcs (820751) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211790)

I nearly spit beer on the screen laughing at that. I've been imprisoned by the ring... wedding, not precious.

So posting on a Saturday night (after mowing the yard, organizing the garage, picking up brake parts to put on the car tomorrow, and fixing a bathroom faucet) is just a bit of relaxation before bed.

I was only trying to put a big-picture-business-analyst slant on the story. I'm not angry at all. I just don't think the business values, market trends, and predicted market conditions will sustain this growth so it's not much to clamor about. Same would be true of previous fanatical posts about Linux on the Desktop so to speak. I think we all want to see the results we desire and see them in anything that even remotely looks like it. For the same reasons that Linux won't replace the majority of PCs in the workplace soon, the Mac won't either. There is a LOT to be said for investment in technology. Once you're in the boat and headed down the rapids it's terribly hard to turn around for most people.

Re:I call bullshit (1)

NDPTAL85 (260093) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212012)

Did you see Apple's latest financials this week? Apple's sales are growing while the rest of the PC industry is shrinking. This recession isn't affecting the company in terms of Macs at all so far. There's no indication it will either. As people's PCs break and get old they're buying Macs.

Re:I call bullshit (2, Insightful)

CODiNE (27417) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211782)

"We're seeing more requests outside of creative services to switch to Macs from PCs," notes David Plavin, operations manager for Mac systems engineering at the U.S. IT division of Publicis Groupe, a global advertising conglomerate. There are so many requests that Plavin now supports 2,500 Macs across the U.S. -- nearly a quarter of all Publicis' U.S. PCs.
There that sorts it out, 2500 is no where near 1/4 of all US pc's... damn

You're just reading too fast and getting offended at what you perceive as Mac fanboism... they are stating that 2,500 Macs are 1/4 of Publicis' US computer systems. So it's an anecdotal report of one particular companies growing Mac trend. Read what you want from it, but it's not talking about Macs being 25% of the US PC sales or anything like that. Slow down and as a Technocarpenter might say "Read twice, reply once."

Re:I call bullshit (1)

zappepcs (820751) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211824)

Actually, it's Saturday night, I'm not going out, so I'll point out that it was not mac fanboism that I thought of. If you read the summary you 'd see that it was 'edited' to say 1/4 of US pc's, and there are way more than 10,000 pc's in the US business world. The math did not add up. I had to read TFA to figure out what the hell they were talking about. The summary was written very poorly, my friend. I said nothing about Mac fanbois... nada, zip, nil, null, nothing. In fact I did mention that Mac has seriously positive points. My gripe was with the summary and the overt optimism of TFA.

Re:I call bullshit (1)

fat_mike (71855) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212074)

You can't argue with them, they'll find some retarded thing that they believe supports their argument.

I work in a company of 2200 people, not a Mac to be seen except for the 6100 with the DOS card that I keep.

Apple lovers, they're good for what they do, Windows XP is good for what it does, Linux is good for what it does.

Stop complaining and find the goddamn middle.

Re:I call bullshit (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23212300)

they are stating that 2,500 Macs are 1/4 of Publicis' US computer systems.

But even then it's an advertising agency. It's not a big shock that 1/4 of machines in a creative agency (regardless of whether they are for creatives or not) are macs. If anything the trend should be higher. The summary is poor, as is the article itself. Indeed it talks about maybes; an outsourcer saying they are "eyeing the possibility of extending its services to cover the Mac", one anti-virus manufacturer (who lets face it sell snake oil a lot of the time) and a hotspot reseller (who really aim at the traveller market, personal or business) do not a trend make.

The article attempts to say that "trends are making it easier for tech departments to say yes to the Mac by facilitating IT's ability to provide enterprise-grade Mac management and support." without offering any real evidence for the things that an enterprise really needs, centralised roll out, control, administration. Whilst it admits that the move to web based apps could drive a trend towards the mac, equally that could drive a trend towards anything on the desktop, as long as it supports Java; that is not specific Mac support. It talks about apple's remote desktop, "$500 per copy", something both MS and Linux offer for free. It talks about how it can link to AD policies, without highlighting that's only applicable to file shares, nothing more, no app rollout, no patching, no security settings for the desktop; you want that then you need to buy an Apple server and kiss your investment in AD goodbye.

It's a poor article; it talks about alternatives which really aren't. But hey, it's marketing right?

Crests and troughs (2, Insightful)

Hojima (1228978) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211598)

This isn't surprising. We've seen this behavior many times and it's called the oscillations of business. Just wait until they are the dominant force in the market and it'll all go downhill from there. Just like Microsoft. They've already made the mistake of not allowing open source software on the iPhone (one of the many reasons I don't get one). That's the one that's pissed me off the most, but it certainly isn't their only mistake. I'll never be a mac fan since I'm so used to tactile response anyways.

You're kidding, right? (3, Interesting)

Santana (103744) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211764)

They've already made the mistake of not allowing open source software on the iPhone (one of the many reasons I don't get one)

Are you being sarcastic? Nowadays it's difficult to say. I have just finished to watch Steve Jobs' keynote [apple.com] about the brand new iPhone SDK, which is a heck of a platform for development, either proprietary or open source, and the App Store that will let you distribute your application to every iPhone on Earth.

I'm not sure what's wrong with those Mac bashers around. You know, just stating to not want to be a "Mac fan" because you like tactile response is stupid for itself. Intel based Macs running UNIX plus open source software and a great set of development tools is anything a geek that respects him/herself wants to get his/her hands on.

And before anybody mods me down, I'm not a Mac fanboy. I've been programming for Windows, Unix and Unix-likes (Linux, OpenBSD) on Intel and SPARC for years and never owned a Mac until recently (two weeks ago aprox.) and I'm amazed. I'm currently writing this message from Safari while whatching my terminals (cloning repositories, building software, the usual stuff.)

Re:You're kidding, right? (1)

HeroreV (869368) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211832)

Pleas read The iPhone SDK and free software: not a match [linux.com]

Considering how defensive you were, despite your ignorance, I would definitely consider you to be an Apple fanboy.

"free software" (1, Interesting)

Santana (103744) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211900)

You seem to assume that I believe on the "Free software" religion and its prophet RMS. I'm sorry to break it to you, but not every Slashdot reader is a free software loon.

But maybe you got something right, after two weeks with a Mac, I think I've started to love this thing.

Re:"free software" (2, Interesting)

Telvin_3d (855514) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211920)

Just wait until something breaks. Something minor like a fan. And taking to the nearest Mac approved retailer, handing to the actual tech who will fix it and picking it up the next day. No phone calls to automated systems. No shipping.

Happened to my MacBook. Was completely my turning point from 'this is kind of nice' to 'from my cold, dead hands'.

Re:"free software" (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212040)

actually if youd read the link (i know its hard because your too busy looking at the grovey safari fonts man), its incompatible with GPL2 & GPL3 and may only be usable if you use a BSD shim of unreleased source code. But the truth is apple wont stop free software, its just a bad choice of development kit rules.

Richard Stallman need not apply here. (4, Insightful)

NDPTAL85 (260093) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212042)

I know this is dangerous to say on Slashdot and all but here goes.

You are VASTLY overstating the importance of open source on a mobile platform such as the iPhone. Its a friggin $500 phone. You think the masses who are buying it are going to care if they can use open source software on it or not? The big draw of the device is its interface and ease of use. You can release zero cost programs via the AppStore if you want and to the user thats really all that matters. The vast majority of the computing using public can't program to begin with so whether its open source or proprietary is wholly irrelevant.

Re:Richard Stallman need not apply here. (1)

wootest (694923) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212422)

The masses don't care one whit about the technology or licensing behind their apps, but the big deal with iPhone development is that to be able to test anything on a real phone "legitimately", you have to pay $99 for a developer license that's hitherto only available for US developers. For a "friggin $500 phone" (even if the 8 GB model is nowadays $399, so $400), this is *not* a big deal if you're planning on selling software, but a big deal if you're planning on releasing free software.

On no other mobile platform that I know of do you have to pay just to be able to try it out on a real device or just to be able to release freeware, and with the iPhone we're talking, in terms of user interface, the most technically advanced mobile platform. No wonder people are a bit upset that they can't use it. There's no accelerometer and no location awareness in the Simulator.

The "US only developers" thing is obviously to limit the test group to a manageable size until the SDK is really ready. We don't yet know what of the other restrictions are here to stay (I'm betting code signing and the App Store-only distribution are the most ingrained), but I really hope that it's a ruse and that most of the real brain farts will have been removed by WWDC, when the final SDK drops.

It's not Vista; it's W7 and beyond (4, Insightful)

StreetStealth (980200) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211612)

Perhaps it's just IT people looking down the road and seeing the same thing some end users saw with XP:

Like many others, I didn't like where it seemed Microsoft was headed with Product Activation and DRM and decided that long-term, I would attempt to migrate away from Windows. I might not have as quickly if I hadn't gone into "creative services," but that was my thinking at the time.

I can imagine IT departments are now experiencing a similar sensation: Even if Vista (like XP) isn't a terrible thing in itself, it points toward a rather unpalatable future for the platform.

There is a slow but undeniable exodus underway. To Ubuntu and Fedora go the more technically focused, to MacOS go the more user-focused. Windows' arbitrary relevance becomes ever slightly moreso every day.

Re:It's not Vista; it's W7 and beyond (1)

humphrm (18130) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211634)

More likely it's IT people looking at aged, about-to-die NeXT-on-Intel hardware running critical apps and trying to find a way to mitigate risk. That's how it is in my company.

Yes, you heard me, I said NeXT.

Re:It's not Vista; it's W7 and beyond (4, Insightful)

wass (72082) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211690)

There is a slow but undeniable exodus underway. To Ubuntu and Fedora go the more technically focused, to MacOS go the more user-focused.

Not necessarily. I left Windows for Linux a decade ago, but switched from Linux to OS X a few years ago. I am not alone, I know many scientists and even whole science departments switching from Linux (or SunOS) to OS X. It has nothing to do with the presence or lack of technical skills, but IMHO it's just a better OS to get shit done on. And obviously many other technically-skilled scientists agree.

Re:It's not Vista; it's W7 and beyond (2, Informative)

UttBuggly (871776) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211896)

Absolutely agree with what you say, most especially "...a better OS to get shit done on."

I've used everything; Apple II and III's, every Mac model there is, the Lisa, and NeXT machines from the Steve. I think at every strata of the evolution of Apple, there was a focus on getting shit done. And making the user interface better.

I'm not a fan of Apple or a Microsoft hater. I am most certainly a fan of things that work and work well.

That's why I've started switching the family to Macs. After the first MacBook, for the son in college, I had no takers for Vista, even though they would HAVE to get a new machine to run it. Everyone will replace their current laptop and/or desktop with a Mac as budget permits.

At work, not so rosy, by a long shot. I think it's more a function of overcautious upper IT management than the Mac isn't a viable alternative to Vista. We have about 40,000 PCs and laptops to support, so this does require some serious thought. Do we replace the estimated 25,000 machines that flat will not run Vista and upgrade a fair amount of the remaining 15,000, plus the cost of Vista itself? How much will ancillary impacts from upgrading other services like Remote Management, AV, Windows Update, and so on cost? User training costs? Will it break anything like internally developed applications?

The light at the end of the tunnel is that the numbers ARE scary, so we're doing studies with various Linux distributions and there's some serious thought to bringing Macs in. Linux looks good from the hardware standpoint as virtually all the current PCs in service can run Linux. The Mac looks good from a support overhead standpoint, which is not insignificant with the number of users we have.

I'd be happy with either at work myself. I have an old ThinkPad T-23 (a Celeron CPU) with SLED 10 on it now. It's good.

Still, I have 4 machines at work and I wouldn't mind trading them ALL in for Mac replacements!

Re:It's not Vista; it's W7 and beyond (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211990)

The Mac looks good from a support overhead standpoint, which is not insignificant with the number of users we have.
what sort of support are you talking, If the system is locked down, its just as easy to support linux. I suppose you have a point if you let everybody set-up their own stuff tho

Re:It's not Vista; it's W7 and beyond (1)

gwk (1004182) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211988)

I agree completely, I have been very critical of Macs in the past but I recently switched from OpenBSD on my desktop (switched from linux to that in 2003) and don't know why I didn't switch when OS X came out. I see it at work as well, I work at a CS department and Macs are *very* popular, and some of the other science departments are completely dominated by Macs.

The ghost of Vista (4, Informative)

Santana (103744) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211838)

I was thinking of buying a laptop some weeks ago but I was reluctant to use Vista. That was the initial thought that led me to buy a MacBook.

I use Windows XP at home and OpenBSD at work as desktop OS. I can't stand Linux as a desktop OS. Mac OS X seems like a perfect merge of a great GUI and the power of UNIX, running on solid, proven Intel hardware. With a Mac I have the best of both worlds.

Re:It's not Vista; it's W7 and beyond (1)

R15I23D05D14Y (1127061) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212270)

Phase 1) All users on Dell, HP, etc computers, running Windows.
Phase 2) Many as above, many running Apple computers with OSX
Phase 3) Dell, HP, et al, discover linux and use it to compete, as they can do more with it than windows once the MS monopoly dies.

People will buy linux if it is sold. It isn't being sold, really. Dell does a little, without much advertising (and we have seen a fairly sizable pickup since they started) - but if Apple starts gaining enough traction that Windows isn't a de facto choice, the retailers will start to use linux. I think Dell is positioning themselves to do this./p

OSX in 2008 (5, Funny)

Artuir (1226648) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211630)

This is the year of OSX on the desktop!!!!11

*cough*

Re:OSX in 2008 (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212088)

Could the year of desktop linux be the year of OSX + 1, there have been three problems with getting linux adopted
format lock in (e,g everybody runs word), with people switching to OS X are people starting to use OO,or are they using word4mac anyway ?
vendor lock in, but this seams broken now with dell offering linux
User unawarnes, (monkey see windows, monkey do windows), but now as theres diversity, perhaps users will start realising windows may not be the best OS for them.

Is the dream of a 30/30/30 market, just a dream or could the end of MS (Dominance) be near?

I've been programming on a mac for years (3, Interesting)

vrillusions (794844) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211636)

My "introduction" to macs--aside from school--was at my current job. I am a web developer/it manager. I first thought it was odd everyone used macs but after I got used to it I'm glad. The amount of questions asking about their computer locking up or not being able to print or something is practically nil. When something doesn't work it's usually something more significant than just the windows "shut down and reboot" mantra.

EVERY employee uses a mac. From graphics designers (of course) to the IT department to accounts receivable and billing. From an IT standpoint being able to have a native terminal to ssh to remote servers is very handy. Yes I know of cygwin but terminal on mac is just there. We literally only have two windows machines only because of some software that only works on windows.

Re:I've been programming on a mac for years (1)

AHuxley (892839) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211870)

In Capitalist West you used a Mac in the past, use a Mac now or are thinking about switching.
In Soviet Russia going to gulag, in gulag or returned from gulag is life story of you.

Re:I've been programming on a mac for years (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211890)

With Parallels, you can eliminate those last dedicated Windows machines. Set up the VM, install Windows, install pesky apps.

Theres a deal going on where you can get Parallels and a couple of random Mac apps for $65, cheaper than Parallels alone at $80. Too bad I already bought it at the higher price. ;_;

http://mupromo.com/

Re:I've been programming on a mac for years (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211966)

Die Ad-Cow!

Re:I've been programming on a mac for years (0, Troll)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212010)

Why would you want to run windows in parrallels?
current situation, you have a dedicated working windows box for some reason cost = 0
your solution get a mac $$$
get parallels $$$
move programs across to the VM

so instead of 1 thing that can fail youve just spent a shitload of money to add 2 points of failure to your system. Smoooth!

I don't remember macs in the enterprise (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211664)

Kirk used those cell phone communicator things.
Ohura had that blue tooth device in here ear.

They did have devices that were touch screen, but they were bigger than an iphone.

Can anyone name one instance of a Mac in the Enterprise?

The PC market is smaller than I expected (1)

ill stew dottied ewe (962486) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211674)

A troll already pointed this out, but the quote has been mangled: [they] "now [support] 2,500 Macs across the US -- nearly a quarter of all... US PCs." The article says that this is a quarter of all _the company's_ US PCs.

what's Kapersky labs working on now? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211694)

oh yeah - mac viruses!

It's about time... (1)

TheNucleon (865817) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211714)

They have needed Macs on-board Enterprise for a long time. First there was that blue screen of death when they were head to head with a Romulan vessel. Then there was the malware that kept putting male enhancement spam on the viewscreen. Picard says "Make it so" and they're stuck waiting for Geordi's new "Vista" thing to boot up...

Wait, did that say Macs gaining a bigger role "on" the Enterprise, or "in" the enterprise...

Oh well, never mind.

Macs (0, Offtopic)

AHuxley (892839) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211778)

they melt in your lap, not in your rack.
What would Tech Support do all day?
Read macsurfer for a heads up on anything new in
the wild *for real*?

Mac support in the Enterprise? (5, Interesting)

moofrank (734766) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211792)

The article asserts in a couple of places some very amusing things: 1. Apple SAYS that it integrates cleanly in Active Directory environments. (In our experience, it doesnn't). 2. "That Apple Enterprise support doesn't exist is a popular myth." (We actually paid for Apple Enterprise support and work in a major metropolitan area. We and our VAR could actually never manage to locate Apple Enterprise support. I'm calling myth.) Admittedly, I'm writing this on my Macbook Pro with an Iphone in my pocket. Supporting a handful of macs is easy. Supporting hundreds is a major pain.

Re:Mac support in the Enterprise? (2, Informative)

bartron (772079) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211970)

AD works but is is no-where clean. It doesn't support DFS (not the way we set it up anyway). The only thing that comes close is Thursby's AdmitMAC product which does the job but likes to own the computer in the process. To me that's just an invitation for instability and we'd be back where we started.

I love my macs but they are indeed a pain to get working properly in a mixed environment.

Does this worry anyone else? (1)

at.drinian (1180281) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211888)

"Security firm Kapersky Labs has already created a Mac version of its anti-virus software for release should Mac growth continue (and the Mac thus [find] itself prey to more hackers)."

Last I checked, all Windows anti-virus programs did was slow your computer to a crawl while consistently breaking their host machines over time. They're a completely backwards answer to the problem of security. Please don't tell me that enterprise Macs will have to run anti-virus too; isn't there anyone in corporate IT that understands this? It's especially silly considering that OS X tends to have much better privilege separation than (pre-Vista) Windows.

I can't wait for on-access scanning to become standard on Macs, causing everyone to complain about how slow Apples are.

Here too... (2, Interesting)

adnonsense (826530) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211902)

Small company, newly formed IT/development department. Turned out all four of us preferred OS X as our desktop environment, and it didn't take long for the boss guy to convince himself he needed one to (and very happy with it he is). Just found out one of the sales people has come over to the dark^H^H^H^H Jobs side, and the external consultant guy has a MacBook Air (which is a subject of constant ridicule as we are Ethernet-only for reasons of paranoia).

(Personally I need a laptop which runs an internationalized UNIXy environment and plays well with the hardware without me having to spend time fiddling about with the OS , and OS X has saved me a great deal of time in this respect).

Take this! (0, Redundant)

Thyrteen (1084963) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211906)

I first read that as "Maces gaining bigger role in the enterprise". How much better would that have been? I'll leave the remaining humorous remarks to the pirates...

Strong Rumour - Salesforce Switching to Mac (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23211942)

If this is true then 4000 users at Salesforce are about to switch to Macs.

http://www.alexcurylo.com/blog/2008/04/23/switcher-salesforcecom/

Re:Strong Rumour - Salesforce Switching to Mac (1)

Achromatic1978 (916097) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212284)

Thanks, Alex, but you didn't need to post that anonymously.

Apple, make a freaking laptop dock already. (2, Interesting)

bartron (772079) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211950)

I'd love to roll out more Mac laptops but the main thing holding it back is complete lack of a first party dock connector for the portables. Not everywhere is the same of course but where I work it's an OH&S problem with loose cables hanging about the place.

I know about bookendz and they might be ok but it's hardly an elegant solution and the aesthetic is so non-Apple. I would jsut like a single connector on the bottom of the Mac that connects to a dock that has all my shit permantly plugged in to it...is that so hard?

Re:Apple, make a freaking laptop dock already. (1)

SoupIsGoodFood_42 (521389) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212146)

Yeah, it probably is. That connector would mean more wiring/PCB space and other stuff. Perhaps not much, but avoiding these things is the way Apple keeps their hardware simple and elegant and avoids making feature bloated products like many others do. I guess there just aren't enough others like you -- people who want a functional and aesthetic dock -- to make it worthwhile.

you know... (2, Funny)

luigi517 (1169353) | more than 6 years ago | (#23211964)

they only work better for the same reason that its hard to drown in the kiddie pool...

No way! (1)

networkzombie (921324) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212004)

When they sell an OSX for any x86 architecture system I'll try it. With the OS tied to the hardware the flexibility is reduced. Giving one vendor too much control in a corporate environment will eventually give them leverage. If Microsoft tried this they would only have 3% of market share and we would all be using Linux.

It's happening where I work too (1)

HairyCanary (688865) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212098)

First it was us on the Unix Sysadmin team. Then the network guys had a look at what we were doing, and started buying themselves Macs as well. Now management is starting to get into them. With VMware Fusion we can use Outlook, everything else we don't need Windows to do.

Vista has prompted many people to make a decision about what they want from their operating system of choice. With Windows the OS is everything, with OSX it's just the means by which applications are run. The measure of an OS that I find most compelling is how effectively it keeps me from noticing it.

Don't Be Pleased (1)

JamesRose (1062530) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212140)

Firstly, it's nothing to do with "Oh my God how amazing is my mac" it's more like, "Oh my God just how badly can microsoft constantly screw up". And in my opinion this is a very very very bad trend, we're going from a heavily locked down operating system run by a monopoly, to what is a more (in some ways) locked down system which will become a monopoly, AND this is from the guys who make the ipod, YOU MUST USE OUR ITUNES FOR YOUR IPOD, YOU MUST USE OUR ITUNES FOR OUR SONGS, and the lesser known lying to customers about their internet browser. So they've proved they can't be trsuted to handle the majority of market share. So does no one else worry that, having seen microsoft badly screw up, people are moving to the most locked down untrustworthy alternative they could find?

Re:Don't Be Pleased (1)

theurge14 (820596) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212308)

Could you please provide some examples of this 'locked down' characteristic you describe?

As a Mac user I would like to know.

Preposterous! (1)

DigitAl56K (805623) | more than 6 years ago | (#23212186)

I've seen nearly every episode of Star Trek and I've yet to spot a single Mac as anything other than an extra!

Is this just a win for "marketing"... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23212416)

or an actual move driven by informed/skilled users?
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