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id Software Announces Doom 4

timothy posted more than 6 years ago | from the this-time-it's-yours dept.

First Person Shooters (Games) 425

spoco2 writes "The id Software site has announced that work has begun on the next sequel to their most famous game, Doom. Will they be able to resurrect the series after what many considered to be a serious misstep with Doom 3? Oh... and they're hiring for the team, so maybe you can steer them in the right direction?"

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Misstep? (5, Insightful)

MankyD (567984) | more than 6 years ago | (#23335980)

Doom 3 certainly wasn't perfect, but I enjoyed it. And I certainly don't see how they veered too far from the original concept of Doom either. Am I alone in this opinion?

Re:Misstep? (5, Informative)

spookymonster (238226) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336036)

I think he's referring to 2 things:
- The massive (at the time) system requirements
- The repetitive gameplay (turn corner; monster jumps out of hiding; rinse & repeat)

Re:Misstep? (5, Insightful)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336158)

The repetitive gameplay (turn corner; monster jumps out of hiding; rinse & repeat)
<sarcasm type="heavy"> Yeah, because Doom and Doom 2 were nothing like that.</sarcasm>

Re:Misstep? (3, Informative)

Trent Hawkins (1093109) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336424)

what massive system requirement? Just about anything could play that game, the beauty of it was that the game could run very fast even on systems that didn't support pixel shaders or normal maps. In fact it ran faster on systems that didn't support those options.

Re:Misstep? (4, Informative)

Yvan256 (722131) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336680)

Just because you had high-end hardware at the time doesn't mean everyone also had it.

Even with all options turned off/at their lowest settings, my Radeon 9600XT was barely able to manage acceptable framerates in 1024x768 (no FAA either).

And I don't mean 120FPS either, the game was crawling under 10FPS in lots of areas. And yes I had enough system RAM too, if that's what you're wondering.

Re:Misstep? (2, Interesting)

EricR86 (1144023) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336588)

- The repetitive gameplay (turn corner; monster jumps out of hiding; rinse & repeat)

Which is great as long as it's fun.

Re:Misstep? (2, Interesting)

Schmodus (875649) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336638)

I hope they add more encounters with lots of (cannon-fodder) monsters. I think I missed that the most from the earlier installments. With the new tech out today... it should be more possible?

Re:Misstep? (5, Funny)

bhima (46039) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336062)

Iâ(TM)m not a serious gamer at all but without that duct tape mod I found the game virtually unplayable.

Re:Misstep? (5, Insightful)

Pazy (1169639) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336092)

The flash light thing was a bit wierd but I the experience it created was awesome. Seeing the light at the end of a corridor, or not wanting to leave an area because it had light was a great experience or perhaps the lone light source being a fireball hurling towords you? If you accept it in I think most people will enjoy it (in the same way you can enjoy horror films). Unfortunately most of my friends gave up easy being used to bright lights and jungle textures and things.

Re:Misstep? (5, Insightful)

MankyD (567984) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336128)

I just want to second you on this, Pazy. Yes it was dark - and that was awesome. It's one of the few games where I genuinely felt scared and startled at times. Sure it became a bit predictable at times, but so are horror movies and people still love those. Again, I don't think the game was perfect, but it was one of the better FPS productions I've seen I'd seen in awhile.

Re:Misstep? (4, Insightful)

CheShACat (999169) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336252)

I just want to second you on this, Pazy. Yes it was dark - and that was awesome. It's one of the few games where I genuinely felt scared and startled at times. Sure it became a bit predictable at times, but so are horror movies and people still love those. Again, I don't think the game was perfect, but it was one of the better FPS productions I've seen I'd seen in awhile.
Thirded. The dynamic lighting was used really well and anyone playing with duct tape mod or whatever completely missed the point and basically pissed all over a lot of careful level design. Only right towards the very end when the attack waves really cranked up the pace did it start to get noticeably repetitive and that kind of fits in with the zombie hoardes vibe. The closest to viable criticism I have heard was that it was too easy: Well there's the case for always playing games on the hardest difficulty level - you get the most play time out of them that way anyway. I played on max difficulty and it scared the crap out of me, creeping through the darkness waiting for the next closet to open.

Re:Misstep? (4, Insightful)

nuzak (959558) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336714)

> anyone playing with duct tape mod or whatever completely missed the point and basically pissed all over a lot of careful level design

Careful level design that kept going back to the same well for the same tired mechanic: "It is dark. You are likely to be eaten by a grue^H^H^H^Hdemon". A mechanic that was hard to believe in the first place. I could have bought it if the protaganist wasn't a freakin MARINE.

That and monster closets.

Id makes a nice engine, but they haven't had a coherent story since Quake II. I hope they have better luck licensing the engine this time: only major Doom3 licensee I can remember was Prey.

Re:Misstep? (1)

fatcop (976413) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336164)

Have to agree with you there buddy. The game was a fantastic experience. The number of times I jumped out of my pants was tops. It was just so immersive (with the excellent sound and visual effects) I couldn't play with all the lights off or I think I would have had a coronary. So how it can be suggested it was a mistep is beyond me.

Re:Misstep? (5, Informative)

Bombula (670389) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336170)

I thought Doom 3 was boring and unimaginative. It looked good, of course, but looks alone don't make a game great. There were no interesting puzzles to solve, no original encounters and action scenarios, just more of the same dark hallways and slobbering monsters slowly thudding toward you ready to absorb a hundred hits from the rocket launcher.

HL2, by comparison, was quite a bit better just for the diversity of gamepla, with vehicles and interesting new weapons (grav gun was innovative). This made up for the heavily scripted, linear gameplay.

Now that there's competition from other amazing game engines too, I think Doom 4 is going to have to raise the bar on its gameplay if it wants to compete with new titles like Crysis. Not only did Crysis look astonishingly good, but the gameplay was hugely varied, with the sandbox option of playing missions a dozen different ways each time.

Re:Misstep? (3, Interesting)

sm62704 (957197) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336560)

There were no interesting puzzles to solve

I absolutely hate getting puzzles in an FPS. When I play an FPS I want action, adrenaline, and mindless carnage. I want to vent, to get rid of my frustrations.

Back when Wolfenstien was new there was a german shepherd in the yard next door that would bark all night. I'd take great pleasure in firing up wolfenstien just to shoot the dogs.

If traffic had me pissed on the way home I'd fire up Screamer. If jaywalkers and those damned idiotic runners had me pissed I'd play Road Rash.

Puzzles? No thinks, I'll buy a newspaper for 75 cents and save my $60. Or have those damned games gone up even higher? Seems everything except my paycheck has.

-mcgrew

Re:Misstep? (1)

MBGMorden (803437) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336664)

I'm totally with you. I used to think way back when: "You know, Resident Evil would be such an awesome game if they just got rid of these INSANE puzzles.". (and put in more bullets - I didn't have enough ammo to kill a certain boss in Code Veronica and couldn't find any more). Most of the time when I hit them in a game I'll spend at most 10 minutes fretting over it, then I just reference the online walkthrough and skip through it. I certainly don't want chores to do in my video games.

It was good, but nothing stood out (1)

phorm (591458) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336204)

This is just IMHO of course, but. Doom 3 was actually quite good, it just wasn't anything really new or exciting (except for the flashy graphics, of course). The original doom - though similar to previous sprite-based FPS's - was quite an innovation in many ways, especially from the perspective of multi-player fun.

Doom3 was fairly repetitive, but - if you go back - so were the originals... people just weren't worn out from the deluge of a gazillion other FPS games. The storyline wasn't actually bad either. If you actually followed all the little videos and stuff, it was quite interesting, and would have made a heck of a better movie than the POS the came out with "The Rock."

Now at the same time as Doom3, Half Life 2 was out and about. Despite being overused a bit, the physics engine made *that* particular game a bit of something new, and the missions themselves: though also tedious at parts, are also fairly interactive. And the gravity gun... well, the BFG was a fun innovation back in the doom days, the gravity gun was a more modern innovation in gameplay from a weapons perspective.

HL2 was also fairly nice on older hardware. Doom3 could be run on an older PC, but tuned down quite a bit in terms of graphics, etc.

So was it a bad game, no? Did it do as well as the competition, no quite. Is there hope for the future, hell, why not?

Re:It was good, but nothing stood out (1)

Fozzyuw (950608) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336340)

Yes, Doom3 was a game I only first played a year ago, because I never had a PC I could play it on until then.

It was Doom. You crawling through maze-like corridors slowly turning into Hell and filled with Hell-like creatures.

The graphics where awesome. The level design was awesome (it really felt like a Mars research station). The story... was there one?

Those who where disappointed didn't know what Doom is about. Is it Half-Life? No, Half-Life is a sophisticated Sci-Fi thinker/action film, Doom is a special effects blood and guts action blockbuster.

Do I want to play Doom4? Eh, maybe if it's on sale or if they finally add "real" multi-player story archs. I want to find other people in the hell infested research base who'll blast baddies with me. Not just the pimp scientist locking themselves into a room or talking to me over the intercom.

Re:Misstep? (1)

erroneus (253617) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336222)

I have to agree. I enjoyed the game and RoE as well. I actually paid for these games... okay, I paid like $10 each through the likes of Amazon.com or Walmart.com, but still... I didn't just copy the game. It kept me busy for maybe two or three months off and on... a few hours at a time... played it through twice... the second time at nightmare level.

If Doom4 is as good, I'll buy it too...for like $10... ;)

Re:Misstep? (1)

fyrie (604735) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336294)

I feel that the only major variations Doom 3 took were the pacing and the storyline. Doom 1 + 2 were all about running around very quickly while taking out monsters. Additionally there was very little plot. Doom 3 on the other hand, had a real story and it was more about slow tension building.

Hype Hype Hype....show us the game (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336378)

Doom 3 was poor.

Both from a game pov and from a "id are a tech company" pov.

The game was very poor. The game engine was barely used by anyone else because the tools were so bad and the quality quickly surpassed by others.

Prey showed how good the game could have been [and also how good artists could use Carmacks tech and make it work too]

ET:quake wars showed that Valve [with TF2] are light years ahead.

Unreal showed Id that a lack of tools and an arrogance that they matter just because they are Id is false.

Clearly plenty of other games companies that originally followed in ID's FPS wake have overtaken them.

Valve have created better games, a just-as-good engine, and developed steam. Carmack's response to steam "they didn't want to be publishers" is like someone in their 50s living in poverty saying there's more to life than money...if he'd said it before steam was a huge success it might be believable, but after, well, it's just stupid to say you wouldn't want to have created steam...and he isn't stupid...so it's worse, it's trying to save face. It's even more laughable given that, before ID games appeared on steam, ID had an FTP server on their site that most home users could have done better.

Id haven't produced a decent engine that loads of developers want to use, a decent game nor do you want to publish games...So, what exactly do you want to do then Carmack? Porting Doomto a mobile phone is probably your only recent success, but just about any bunch of half-literate open source buffoons have ported old versions of ID software games to different platforms...it's hardly world leading activity.

Carmack, more or less, acknowledged the tools for D3 were crap and no one [except the usual suspects like splash damage, raven and nerve] used the doom 3 engine and instead the Unreal engine was the tour de force when he introduced id tech 5.

As he introduced the brand new tech 5...he also claimed they were writing a "new IP", albeit without much evidence.

But the biggest problem with Doom 3 [and HL2 to some extent] were the years of hype and hyperbole with nothing to show. The games, no matter how good, could never live up to those expectations.

HL2 lived up to more though, even Ids hastily "it's supposed to be dark" to counter the tech appearing before hardware could really do enough lights and the stolen and kludged gravity gun for the sequel [saying "we always had one" didn't fool anyone...plenty have acknowledged ID as inspiration, it's a sign of their arrogance that ID don't acknowledge their sources]

Sadly it seems that Rage and ID Tech 5 are going the same way...lots of hype and are probably so far off as to be meaningless. Now, to add to the hype, Doom 4.

C'mon Carmack, implement something new...write the code, chuck out the dead wood and write some game play and instead of just saying "when it's done" STFU about it until it is and then, and only then, shout about it.

Re:Misstep? (1)

fdiaz5583 (531839) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336398)

Yeah he's way off course with that one. Doom 3 was REALLY good. Personally I'd like to see a Quake 5 come out that's more closely related to Quake 2. I still play that and Quake 1 all the time (my personal favs)

Re:Misstep? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336416)

I thought the gameplay was boring and the Doom 3 engine just looks BAD.

Even if they fix the gameplay, if they still insist on using the same lighting model which results in characters and environments that look like they're made of plastic, which they appear to be doing with that racing/adventure game they're working on, then Doom 4 will inevitably be a miss as well.

Unless Duke Nukem Forever comes out between now and then, and changes my mind about what the Doom 3 engine is capable of, I'll probably skip Doom 4 as well.

great experience, bad game (1)

Scudsucker (17617) | more than 6 years ago | (#23335984)

...I think was how one of the gaming sites put it. The atmosphere was spooky and demonic, and the art was sometimes fantastic, but the game just didn't feel like it was tied together very well. Maybe they should have had Valve do it. :)

I'll apply! (3, Funny)

techpawn (969834) | more than 6 years ago | (#23335992)

I'd love to make a game of complete darkness that's nearly impossible to play without cheat codes and and over clocked super cooled box...

No I'm not bitter at ALL! It's a speech impediment...

Re:I'll apply! (1)

Borgschulze (842056) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336186)

I played through Doom 3 on the highest difficulty, it's been too long for me to remember what it was called, but you definitely don't need cheat codes to beat it.

Re:I'll apply! (1)

techpawn (969834) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336210)

Only one code really: Duct Tape...

Re:I'll apply! (1)

EdipisReks (770738) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336344)

Only one code really: Duct Tape...
ah yes, the great Doom 3 ruiner.

Re:I'll apply! (5, Funny)

jellomizer (103300) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336192)

Hold on Let Me Make a Web Based version of this...

<html>
  <head>
      <title>DOOM 5</title>
  </head>
  <body bgcolor="#000000">
  </body>
<html>
Enjoy

What's the betting... (5, Funny)

L4t3r4lu5 (1216702) | more than 6 years ago | (#23335996)

... we see Doom 5 before we see Duke Nukem Forever?

Re:What's the betting... (1)

AgentSmith (69695) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336054)

Damn! You beat me to it.

I was going to say. "id software is just hiring and they'll still beat Duke Nukem' Forever!"

There I said it. Yes, I did just go there.

Re:What's the betting... (3, Funny)

sm62704 (957197) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336682)

I was hanging around with Duke when he was a aqueaky little side scroller. I saw him yesterday, the poor old guy isn't doing too well.

"Duke!" I said. "Hey, dude, it's mcgrew, haven't seen you in a while! Where you been?"

"In the hospital mostly." He was bald, wrinkled, walked with a stoop and carried a cane. No doubt the cane had a sword in it. Or even more likely, a chain saw.

"What happened?"

"Well, after Mr. Broussard and the guys retired me I started drinking pretty heavy. I wound up homeless and depressed, and tried to kill myself. They said I had PTSD and put me on Paxil. Boy, mix that stuff with alcohol...

"Then I got a bad case of gout. I have arthritis all over now."

It was sad, seeing my old hero like this.

"Who's your doctor?" I asked.

"I'm indigent, so I have to go to the VA hospital and take whoever they give me. The new doctor's name is 'Proton'. They tell me he's pretty good."

-mcgrew

let's do yesterday again (1)

bmcage (785177) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336004)

been there, done that.

Can't they spend the 'brightest' minds on new content instead?

Re:let's do yesterday again (1)

Pazy (1169639) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336058)

Not a chance DOOM is a legend in gaming, and the way its set up you can tweak it to make it still fun but still feel 'classic'. In fact most of the modern games arent that diffrent from Doom, there may be a million billion polygons and shaders and stuff like that, there may be 'iron sights' and 'Squad based multiplayer' but at there hearts FPS's havent changed since the early days. Im all for more DOOM, though more varied enviroments would be nice.

Re:let's do yesterday again (2, Insightful)

somersault (912633) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336154)

In fact most of the modern games arent that diffrent from Doom, there may be a million billion polygons and shaders and stuff like that, there may be 'iron sights' and 'Squad based multiplayer' but at there hearts FPS's havent changed since the early days
There's also being able to aim up/down, I'd say that was pretty major. The elements that haven't changed are that you can run around in a 3D world shooting stuff, and choose weapons using the top row of number keys.. not much else has stayed the same. Oh, and Wolfenstein was first ;) Though Doom was presumably first with multiplayer, and deathmatch is something that's still good fun. I personally prefer team based games these days as I don't then feel like everyone is out to get me - I play games to get AWAY from real life! :p

Re:let's do yesterday again (1)

Pazy (1169639) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336240)

Or maybe Maze War or Star Raiders? But im not being picky about what was first though :P (with multiplayer being Maze War or MIDI Maze cant remember which). So up and down was a major update with the premise of the game and everything you do is the same. Though the same can be said for a lot of genre's which have minor updates over time but still often end up feeling the same. Then again maybe im a jaded gamer since ive been playing since before I can remember :D

Re:let's do yesterday again (1)

L4t3r4lu5 (1216702) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336386)

Jumping and swimming were pretty huge, too.

What would Quake 2 DM have been without the Rocket Jump?

Re:let's do yesterday again (1)

somersault (912633) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336622)

I never really played Quake 2, but you could do rocket jumps in Quake as well

Re:let's do yesterday again (1)

ShadowsHawk (916454) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336656)

I always felt that Rise of the Triad (RotT) was a far better game. It was released about 14 after doom, but it had built in lan gameplay as well as a full sense of three dimensional movement.

What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (4, Insightful)

Shivetya (243324) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336012)

I liked it. It was a great change of pace. Yeah it was scripted and it was in their trademark brown for the most part but the story and presentation was great! I play Half Life 2 for similar reason, great story and proper visuals. If I wanted to rip Doom 3 for overly scripted encounters that seemed to repeat a lot I could seriously pummel Half Life for the same. Hell I would love to punish the HL team for their over use of their damn physics engine... yeah I know you have one but some things get annoying after a while.

I guess we can hope for a flash light taped to the gun this time. Still the Doom 3 is one of the few games that actually made me jump. Great sound and visuals.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (1)

gEvil (beta) (945888) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336078)

I guess we can hope for a flash light taped to the gun this time.

Something tells me this will be one of the little jokes in Doom4--somewhere near the beginning, you'll find a flashlight. Then a little while later, you'll find some ducttape and the character will go "Aha!" and put them together.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336676)

Nah Doom4 will be something more like, you find a flashligh on the 1st level, but there are no batteries to recharge it once you run out.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (1)

Yvan256 (722131) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336742)

Well, if they didn't think of it, I do hope they'll read your post.

That would be at least as funny as Blizzard adding the secret cow level in Diablo 2.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (4, Insightful)

OzRoy (602691) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336108)

To me it felt the same as Doom 1 with better graphics.

The story that they hyped up claiming to be written by a professional writer etc was kind of shallow and stupid.

Even the AI was crap. I found the tactics for the first game worked equally well in Doom 3. Imps for example could move across the ceiling, but they never took advantage of that ability. They would crawl across a wall, then jump down and start slowly shuffling towards you throwing fireballs. The easiest way to dispatch enemies was the get their attention with a pistol, then sit on the other side of a closed door with a shotgun waiting for them to open it so you could unload both barrels into their face at point blank.

I could go on, but that was the worst of it for me. In summary, it was generic and kind of boring.

Half Life however had pretty good AI. An interesting plot and varied enemy encounters moving you through different environments, not allowing it to become just the same old crap.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336320)

If you try to outsmart an FPS game, you're not going to enjoy it. Next time when you play a shooter, don't conserve ammo, don't use fail-safe tricks to kill enemies, don't tip-toe around the game. Go for it. Rush in and fight your way out. It's a game, you're not going to die for real. "Sit on the other side of a closed door ... waiting" Sheesh!

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (4, Interesting)

OzRoy (602691) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336446)

If you try to outsmart an FPS game, you're not going to enjoy it. Next time when you play a shooter, don't conserve ammo, don't use fail-safe tricks to kill enemies, don't tip-toe around the game.
Why shouldn't I do that? Why should I dumb muyself down to make the game fun? A game is supposed to be challenging for the player. It isn't my fault Doom 3 was easy to fool. It's not like waiting and hiding is an unusual tactic.

I tried to use the same trick in FEAR (a game that I thought really was scary). I shot one of the bad guys hid on the other side of the door and waited. And waited some more. And nothing happened. Just as I was about to give up and walk through the door myself I got shot in the back of the head by a sneaky bastard who had flanked behind me.

That game had decent challenging AI. In reality it still used a lot of tricks to keep things simple for the developers, but it gave the appearance of being intelligent and made the game fun and interesting.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (5, Insightful)

Scutter (18425) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336230)

Still the Doom 3 is one of the few games that actually made me jump.

Personally, I'm getting sick to death of game designers (and movie makers, for that matter) who confuse "startling" me with "scaring" me. Any hack can startle someone. All you have to do is have a cat jump out from behind a curtain or something. It's not scary, it's just annoying. It takes a real talent to actually scare somebody with a movie, and especially with a game.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (2, Insightful)

khendron (225184) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336434)

And Doom 3 achieved this. It not only made me jump, it is one of the few games that gave me the creeps and made my skin crawl.

But it went on too long, and got boring. If Doom 3 were about 2/3 the length it was, then it would have been much better.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (1)

BigBlueOx (1201587) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336606)

If I had mod points they would be yours. Right on. Damn straight. Effin A. Doom3 absolutely rocked for about an hour or two and then ... "get on with it!!". I have a nagging feeling that Doom4 won't exactly be Bioshock.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (1)

MrJynxx (902913) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336436)

Yea I definitley agree, startled is not the same as scared!

But this reminds me of a game back in the late 90's, Alien Vs. Predator for the PC. Now THAT game was scary. Wandering around as a marine hearing the motion sensor blip, then beep when something was around and you not having any idea where the hell the thing was. That was the only game that actually made me afraid of what it was going to do next, and when the encounter did happen it usually started with a scream, shooting wildly into the dark, and then a "Did I actually just scream? WTF"

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (2, Insightful)

cb95amc (99589) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336530)

I think System Shock (1&2) is a the best example of how to scare someone without having to resort to lots of dark areas with things jumping out at you...

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (1)

TomorrowPlusX (571956) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336576)

And that is why Alone in the Dark and Silent Hill are actually scary. I never played Doom 3, but I blew a fair amount of junior high playing Doom 1 and 2, and loved them. Not because they were scary, but because of the frantic adrenaline rushes. It was fun.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (1)

sjwest (948274) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336250)

Never played it, but doom3 goes for $ 20 secondhand. I bought Doom2 online and it zipped to four 1.4mb floppy disks. Doubt you could do that with Doom 3. Doom three is something i might buy, but knowing what version to buy put me off as there is 2nd life add on pack or something.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336380)

Doom three is something i might buy, but knowing what version to buy put me off as there is 2nd life add on pack or something.
There's "Resurrection of Evil" which is a short extension where you get a gravity-gun and a few more tricks with your soul cube. You can get both from Steam for $30 [steampowered.com] (assuming you're not a Steam-hater) or $20 for just the original game. Or $40 for all Dooms so far, or $70 for everything id's released so far.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336414)

Doom3 was all about walking in dark corridors with the usual guns shooting at monsters that spawn annoyingly behind you _every time_ you pick up some items. Whereas HL2 is one of the greatest games ever made - remember driving the hooverboat and the car? The Gravity Gun? Controlling those "sand-creatures"? Also, the game was made in 2004 and the graphics and physics look and feel still up to date while running smoothly on onboard graphics.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (2, Insightful)

EricR86 (1144023) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336500)

Have you gone back and played the original Doom(s) recently? IMHO the problem is Doom and Doom 2 were way more fun than Doom 3. Doom 3 was just a much slower Doom and Doom 2. Doom 3 also wasn't that scary, but admittedly it had a few moments.

And yes, games can be reasonably faster paced and scary! Undying [wikipedia.org] was a really neat game, a good storyline, and it was pretty creepy sometimes. Didn't people also find Quake to be kinda creepy for it's time (and more so than Doom 3 now)?

And with Doom 3? You're basically left with a game that's slow, not that fun, and not even that scary. So what exactly were you left with? A really shiny, graphically immersive and beautiful, but mediocre game.

Re:What the hell was wrong with DOOM3? (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336648)

Hell I would love to punish the HL team for their over use of their damn physics engine... yeah I know you have one but some things get annoying after a while.
Well said, I felt that they were trying to show off half the time, they did the same with the AI, even tho the friendly AI were pretty dumb. I hope Doom does improve, but i also hope that they dont show of their improvements. Better AI shouldn't even stand out, you should just realise after a few levels, "hey, those AI are better" not "Wow, if i throw a can at his face he hits me with a stick, that's soo smart". same with physics and even level design.

A Mistep? (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336032)

Since when was Doom 3 a "serious mistep"? It sold well and generally got great reviews.

Re:A Mistep? (1)

ThirdPrize (938147) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336228)

It was the original Doom with a higher screen resolution. That was all.

Re:A Mistep? (2, Insightful)

Yosho (135835) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336650)

In a nutshell: people are upset because their hopes were too high. The original Doom revolutionized the genre; they were expecting Doom 3 to do the same, and instead it ended up just being a pretty good game, but nothing revolutionary. If it had been given a different name and produced by some company people had never heard of, people would've heaped praise upon it for being a surprisingly good game from a new company.

they seem like more of a tech company, (5, Insightful)

hey0you0guy (1003040) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336034)

not a games company. Yes they make games, but their engines are what shine. The doom 3 technology looked fantastic. It's when other companies license id's engines. That's when we see a better game.

Re:they seem like more of a tech company, (2, Interesting)

wild_quinine (998562) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336556)

not a games company. Yes they make games, but their engines are what shine. The doom 3 technology looked fantastic. It's when other companies license id's engines. That's when we see a better game.
The startling thing is how few licencees there were for Doom 3 engine. Prey, Quake Wars...

Call of Duty was released using Quake 3 engine SIX YEARS after it debuted, and was arguably the last AAA Q3 engine game - one of seemingly hundreds of titles.

Where are all the Doom3 tech games?

GOAT SEX GOAT SEX GOAT SEX (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336038)

Goat sex [twofo.co.uk]

Hordes from Hell? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336050)

I thought id was currently working on Rage and Quake Zero. I hope they're not spreading themselves too thin. Unless Doom 4 will be like Doom 2, same engine as its predecessor, just more levels.

But after Doom 3, Quake 4, and Prey, I've played as many id Tech 4 shooters as I can handle.

Re:Hordes from Hell? (1)

neokushan (932374) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336102)

Well they did announce Tech 5 at that mac expo a while back, so at least it'll be something newish.
Lets just hope it's a good engine and not just a good LOOKING engine.

The real question is (1)

Daimanta (1140543) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336052)

Which one will be released first, Doom 4 or Duke Nukem Forever?

Oblig. (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336056)

Do You need a flashlight?

What was wrong with Doom 3? (2, Interesting)

Rik Sweeney (471717) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336072)

It had a fairly decent story that I would have found enjoyable if that script had been used for the movie. Perhaps the biggest problem was that Doom 3 suffered from the "walk backwards because that's where the enemies come from" syndrome or maybe not enough enemies on screen at a time.

I don't know what was wrong with it, but I'm sure someone else will let me know what problems they had with it...

Re:What was wrong with Doom 3? (1)

Pazy (1169639) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336142)

My only problem was the lack of varied enviroments, with all the grey corridors I was never sure whether I was progressing. Otherwise I just enjoyed the experience, and enjoy repeating it everynow and then. The multiplayer on the other hand was useless with inconsistent Fp/s and arbitrary lag. I can deal with low Fp/s (Im in a Cod4 clan doing scrims when I have 10fp/s lol) but not inconsistent. Fix those problems and ill be Id's fanboy troll for then :D (kidding, Ill love the game though)

the problems with doom 3 (5, Informative)

thermian (1267986) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336364)

1: Monsters

The monsters were pretty much all encountered one at a time orm in small groups only. This wasn't how it was in doom 1 or 2, where you often found yourself in a large room surrounded by lots of different things that wanted you dead.

2: Weapons

Ok-ish, but I found them to be balanced towards a slower pace of fighting them was the case in doom 1/2.

3: Lighting

Neither doom 1 nor doom 2 were that dark all the time. Since when was it required that you constantly be walking around in poor lighting in order for it to be a proper fps? Darkness did occur in doom 1 and 2, but it was well used, and scary.I was constantly irritated by the darkness, never entertained.

4: Fear

On the subject of fear, well, doom 3 was too similar to other games to scare me. I was bored a lot of the time.
The first time a monster appears out of nowhere was a little starling, but when the only nerve inducing element is 'where will the next monster come from', it gets old real fast. There are a lot more ways to induce fear then just monster spawns, but Id seemed not to recall this.

5: Vehicles

Awful, really, really, awful. We've got used to vehicles like the warthog in Halo, and the various cars in Half life 2, and they give us bathtubs on wonky wheels.

5: undoominess

They wanted a slight departure from the original dooms, but this was a completely different game that took the doom name and otherwise failed to remind me of the originals in any respect, bar the vague similarity in shape of some monsters.

Just what I always wanted... (1)

Lilith's Heart-shape (1224784) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336094)

Yet another FPS in which a lone soldier takes on the legions of Hell, starting off with nothing but his trusty .45 semi-automatic. I'm going to reserve a copy right away, yeah!

Re:Just what I always wanted... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336260)

Yet another FPS in which a lone soldier takes on the legions of Hell, starting off with nothing but his trusty .45 semi-automatic. I'm going to reserve a copy right away, yeah!
You're so edgy. How can I learn to be as cool as you?

Maybe I'm being elitist here... (4, Insightful)

Machine9 (627913) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336124)

...but I think people who used duct-tape mods for DooM3 were playing it "wrong".

Yes, the flashlight was an ENORMOUS hassle to play with at first, but I'll be damned if the thing didn't ramp up the adrenaline rush tremendously... constantly balancing between seeing where you're going and being able to defend yourself was very very tense and scary; I loved every moment of it.

Re:Maybe I'm being elitist here... (2, Interesting)

spookymonster (238226) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336692)

I only got the duct tape mod after switching back and forth with the flashlight got boring... ...which means I played the game 'properly' for all of 20 minutes.

I think a better solution would've been to mimic Half-Life's flashlight: it's always available, but you'll want to save the battery for when you really need it.

Realistically, where were the night-vision goggles? The technology to create them must have been lost sometime between now and our colonization of Mars. Maybe even have it so the monsters only appear when seen with the naked eye, so you have to take off the goggles to attack them?

i REALLY liked the original doom (1)

circletimessquare (444983) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336140)

and could care less about everything that came after

i still play it today sometimes, because its low time commitment

i don't want all immersive environments and storylines that eat up hours of my day. i have a life. i want to waste 5-10 minutes pointing a shotgun at imps, then get back to what i have to do

maybe if they placed modern graphics rendering on top of the old 2D control system, i would take a look

no, i'm not insane: 2D controls dumbs down the game in the RIGHT way: pure enjoyment, pure... id

Re:i REALLY liked the original doom (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336358)

and could care less about everything that came after

Going by the rest of your post, I suppose you meant "couldn't." This might seem like nit-picking, but writing could instead of couldn't is like writing true instead of false.

Re:i REALLY liked the original doom (1)

Hatta (162192) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336520)

You're quite right. I'd be happy if they just published more WADs for the original Doom. There hasn't been much that really competes with single player Doom in terms of fast paced action and creative level design. FPSs kind of split between high action multiplayer games like Q3A and plot heavy single player like Half Life. Doom 4 should bridge that gap once again.

So what you're saying is... (3, Funny)

neokushan (932374) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336146)

Are all of the above comments trying to say that Doom 5 is....*gasps*....doomed?

They need a custom HTTP 503 page... (2, Insightful)

tcopeland (32225) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336162)

$ wget -S http://www.idsoftware.com/ [idsoftware.com]
--08:57:08-- http://www.idsoftware.com/ [idsoftware.com]
                      => `index.html'
Resolving www.idsoftware.com... 192.246.40.185
Connecting to www.idsoftware.com|192.246.40.185|:80... connected.
HTTP request sent, awaiting response...
    HTTP/1.1 503 Service Unavailable
    Content-Type: text/html
    Date: Thu, 08 May 2008 12:57:20 GMT
    Connection: close
    Content-Length: 28
08:57:08 ERROR 503: Service Unavailable.


I recently gave my DOOM 3 box to a friend who bought a new laptop... after several years the game should be playable now on a medium-powered laptop. That's the way to do it - buy the "3.years.ago" game of the year and play it with all the dials turned up.

Re:They need a custom HTTP 503 page... (1)

prestomation (583502) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336670)

When Doom3 came out, I remember playing it on my brothers then-2yr old box...A P4 and a Geforce 4 TI series. Sure, the graphics weren't cranked, but it looks beautiful and scared me just the same. I remember being amazed it looked so good and ran as well as it did on then aging hardware. Were the requirements really that high?

history (2, Interesting)

kraemer (637938) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336234)

I followed Doom3's progress with great anticipation. Right from the first showing of the tech at a Steve Jobs keynote I was hooked. I went to E3 in 2002 with Redwood and watched the first big public showing in the "Doom3 theater". It was seriously awesome and the graphics world was rocked by its coolness. The E3 judges couldn't believe the lighting was real time 3d. Many more screen shots and cool trailers would follow until the game finally shipped. And then I was pretty underwhelmed. The graphics were cool and the ending animations were quite photo realistic, but I kept asking myself, where in the hell did most of the stuff from the E3 showing disappear to? There was a lot of story and characters that just changed or got yanked completely. What the heck? The way the player was stalked and killed by the demon knight was so cool in the e3 demo, yet so totally unexciting in the actual game... If they could make a game that captures the essence of what was shown at E3 2002. I would be interested...

Make a RPG (1)

genner (694963) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336298)

The doom rpg for the cell phone was actually quite good. They need to revisit this idea for the PC.

First Screenshot (4, Funny)

imbaczek (690596) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336322)

link here: doom4 screenshot [imageshack.us] .

Re:First Screenshot (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336362)

link here: doom4 screenshot [imageshack.us] .
This joke never gets old.

Mod parent up! (0)

johannesg (664142) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336540)

Somebody mod this guy funny ;-)

Off centered torch (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23336326)

Am I the only one who couldn't stand the off centered torch? it was annoying to be looking at your cursor but then having to look at the torch light off centered.

Started to really bother my eyes pretty quickly (And i never seem to have any trouble with anything else) and I could never play it for long.

I didn't even care about the lack of a torch on the machine gun

Fool me once, shame on you (0, Troll)

sm62704 (957197) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336438)

Fool me twice, shame on me.

I'd been playing DOOM since I played the first one on my old 386, with the graphics turned down enough that it was playable. As soon as I saw DOOM 2 on the shelf I bought it, too. I had hundreds of user-created levels for the two DOOMS.

DOOM 3 came out. I'd just had my CPU fry from its fan failing, and bought a new motherboard and video card. I bought DOOM 3, knowing I had enough hardware to throw at the game.

It required the new Windows OS, XP. Sixty bucks for a game that wouldn't run on my OS. It still sits on the shelf uninstalled. I didn't RTFA, but don't think I have to to know that it's going to require a four CPU machine with a $10,000 video card and Windows Vista (service pack six) to run.

I'm done with Id's software. R.I.P. Springfield Fragfest.

-mcgrew

Re:Fool me once, shame on you (1)

SCHecklerX (229973) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336624)

It runs fine on linux.

Re:Fool me once, shame on you (1)

repvik (96666) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336732)

I'd been playing DOOM since I played the first one on my old 386, with the graphics turned down enough that it was playable.

Was there any adjustments to the graphics in DooM?

I'll stick to... (1)

tiny1877 (1060160) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336442)

...playing Doom on Rockbox on my Sansa.

I'm tired of Doom (2, Interesting)

elrous0 (869638) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336492)

Is running down and endless series of boring hallways, triggering bad guys who appear out of thin air, really going to cut it in this era of open FPS's and sandbox games like Half-life 2, GTA, Crysis, et. al.?

Come on Carmack! (3, Insightful)

FoolsGold (1139759) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336570)

You have a Slashdot account - http://slashdot.org/users.pl?op=userinfo&nick=John+Carmack [slashdot.org] , say something about D4/ Make it a Slashdot exclusive! Meet your adoring fans so they mod you (Score:5, OMFG!!) or something; it'll be fun.

Linux (1)

SCHecklerX (229973) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336580)

Doom 3 was ok. I would have preferred to play HL2, but alas, I have no windoze boxen at home. Hopefully Doom4 will have a linux version to give me something to do when I'm bored at home.

Doom RetCon (2, Funny)

Enderandrew (866215) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336634)

Doom 1-3 go out the window, and Doom 4 is based on the uber-successful movie!

Stop flogging the greasy spot (5, Insightful)

Leo Sasquatch (977162) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336684)

the horse is long since gone.

Wolfenstein - great idea. Doom, brilliant sequel. Doom 2 - nice, more levels. Quake, wow.

Doom 3 - where's the duct tape? Or string - anything really. Where's the £4.99 headband torch I keep in my backpack?

Nobody really wants to break the FPS formula, least of all the guys who practically invented it. It'll be Doom with shiny graphics, more polygons in the average monster's arse than comprised an entire level from the original Doom, and it'll still be shite, because it's been done to death now for 15 years. The shotgun will be a great weapon for 90% of the game, and be the only weapon for which there's ever enough ammo. Despite being set in the future, and on some alien world, the weapons will have been toned down to the sort of sub-standard kack you wouldn't give to a modern day grunt. Nobody involved with the game will have the slightest idea about current or future military hardware, or know where to find a copy of Jane's Infantry Weapons. There will be no metalstorms, no gauss rifles, no sabot rounds, no poison darts, no armour-piercing rounds. The sniper rifle will carry 5 rounds at best, and any weapon capable of killing an enemy quickly will have almost no ammo available as that might render it somehow useful. You will find weapons dropped by other groups of people who'd been previously ambushed by the monsters. Quite why you'd want to pick them up is unclear, as they clearly didn't do their last owners a blind bit of good.

As for the environment, if there's enough light to see, it'll be drab and featureless as otherwise it might be possible to work out where you are. The colour palette will be green, brown, and grey. Wood will not burn, glass will withstand a rocket launcher if it has a bit of chicken wire in it, and despite carrying around 200lbs of explosives, the door will not open if you don't have the access code. Using a grenade to go through the plasterboard walls will not be an option.

The monsters will not react in any way (stagger, pain, fear) to being shot in the nose with a .45 hollowpoint. Until you do it enough times to kill them at which point they die instantly, but until that point they will be at full combat effectiveness. You can kneecap a monster and it will still be able to chase you at full speed. If a monster is armoured, you can shoot it in its eyes and open mouth as much as you like without hurting it unduly, because they are every bit as heavily armoured as its scaly, plated hide. Half the monsters will have ridiculous hit points, and the big ones will be somehow impervious to your weapons and the laws of physics until the point where they rear up and reveal their weak point.

In short, it will have every flaw that every other FPS has, but because it's got the magic word 'Doom' written all over it, it will sell many copies and the usual fanboys will be sucking its dick because it's so shiny.

Here's something I'd love to see happen before they write one line of code on this game. Line up every developer, and designer who's going to work on the game, and shoot them in the thigh from 4 feet away with a .22 air pistol. They can wear jeans, so the pellet won't penetrate skin. As they're rolling around on the ground in pain, or hopping and screaming and cursing, tell them to remember what it felt like when they come to design the weapons, the monsters and the monsters' reactions to getting hit.

Besides, it'd be a major hit as a YouTube video.

Slashdotted (1)

JeepFanatic (993244) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336708)

The site's down already.

Re:Slashdotted (1)

JeepFanatic (993244) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336720)

I take that back. Seems to be back up and running now.

Played out (4, Insightful)

Konster (252488) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336710)

This IP was played out and over cooked with Doom 3. Strip out all the good graphics and what you have left was a rehash of a rehash. Doom 4 will push the rehash to new realms with fancy graphics and game play that is a decade away from good.

HL2 and its follow up episodes are good, satisfyingly and resoundingly good. With the release of the Orange Box, Valve blew the lid off of gaming. HL2 Episode 2 is GOOD. Team Fortress 2 is excellent. Portal is the game that shocked everyone in how excellent a new concept combined with excellent writing produced one of the best games ever.

Sure, one can say that Valve is rehashing old stories like ID is with Doom; but they aren't. HL1+HL2+ Episodes are expanding upon a story line that is a decade old...it is still fresh, and fun. Each new bit builds upon the last bit and extends it.

ID and Carmack are going to foist a re-engined same ole' same ole' upon us, just like they did with Doom 3, just like Epic did with the very badly done UT3.

I said that Doom 3 was the most accurate flashlight simulator to date; and I was right. They have the graphics tech, but no plot, no story and no direction. Worse, they have no passion.

Doom 3 was made by clock punchers.

Portal was made by people that love games, game design and gamers.

Doom 4 will be made by people that love John Carmack.

Doom3 (1)

CFBMoo1 (157453) | more than 6 years ago | (#23336726)

I enjoyed it, some of the cut scenes were really good. Guy crawling out of the hole and seeing the cyber demon and especially the lady who turned in to a burning skull were good to me.

The flashlight was my only grumble the whole time. I played it through w/out duct tape. Still it was a bugger.
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