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66% Apple Market Share For Sales of High-End PCs

kdawson posted more than 5 years ago | from the factory-to-fingers dept.

Businesses 724

An anonymous reader lets us know about a recent analysis of retail computer sales numbers that shines a spotlight on Apple's sales growth as the PC market has flattened. In the lucrative >$1,000 PC segment, in the first quarter of 2008, Apple's retail market share was 66%. This includes a 64% market share for laptops and a market share for desktops of 70%. The article attributes the bulk of this success to Apple's stores. Fortune picked up this report and pointed out the somewhat obvious fact that the >$1,000 PC segment is Apple's by default, since Dell, HP, and Lenovo sell the bulk of their machines in the $500-$750 range, and Apple has only one model selling for less than $1,000. As the analyst said, "If you don't give people a choice [in the Apple stores], people will spend more."

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masturbation in 3,2,1 (5, Funny)

timmarhy (659436) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471136)

fanboys GO

Re:masturbation in 3,2,1 (5, Funny)

SpeedyG5 (762403) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471170)

anti-fanboys post in . . . doh!

66%? What a coincidence. (-1, Troll)

Leftist Troll (825839) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471250)

Studies show that 66% of Mac users are sexually aroused by homo-erotic images.

Re:66%? What a coincidence. (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471438)

Studies show that 66% of Mac users are sexually aroused by homo-erotic images.

It's true. A little known fact is that Mac users are so well endowed that the part that gets aroused accounts for an astounding 66% of the body. You can look it up.

Windows Fanboys are what we are reading about. (5, Insightful)

Erris (531066) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471182)

It's funny to watch Windows Fanboys write about Mac. Somehow, they always loop the discussion around to their favorite software. Check out this exchange from the fine Apple Watch article:

"iMacs are growing and the Windows desktop ain't. No matter how you look at it, Apple is outperforming Windows." [Stephen, CEO of NDP]

A statement like that raises the question: Is Windows Vista the problem? The operating system has met with a cool reception, even with Microsoft claiming 140 million licenses have been shipped. "I don't believe that Vista's to blame," Stephen responded. "The vast majority of consumers don't care [about the installed operating system]."

Really? For about a year now, studies have shown that everyone knows about Vista but no one wants it. It's poor performance has convinced all but the most self loathing of people that Windows is not going anywhere. But finally, Apple is now using almost exactly the same hardware - How can anyone not see that the only remaining difference is software that does not suck?

You have to wonder if any of these people have ever used anything but Windows for more than a week in the last ten years.

What a great threadjack. (3, Interesting)

gnutoo (1154137) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471238)

Very funny, you flipped a troll conversation about Apple fanboys into a Windows fanboy send up. It is as if the entire energy and malice of the GP was turned onto the GP by a subtle shift in balance.

What a great shill. (0, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471276)

Yes, "threadjack". That's twitter-speak [slashdot.org] for karma whoring and shilling your own posts.

Re:What a great threadjack. (0, Offtopic)

mcpkaaos (449561) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471324)

It is as if you are speaking to a different person by a subtle shift in login.

Re:What a great threadjack. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471366)

a Windows fanboy send up. It is as if the entire energy and malice of the GP was turned onto the GP by a subtle shift in balance.

OK, I have to ask. Who are you and why do you write like this? Do you also actually *speak* like this?

And who the hell cares about some trolls making lame jokes about Apple? Seems you wasted a lot of energy getting your head up the OPs ass, for what?

Re:What a great threadjack. (0, Offtopic)

Tubal-Cain (1289912) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471426)

Twitter is pretty incoherent tonight.

be careful (0, Flamebait)

Mactrope (1256892) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471592)

It's hard to act all big while you are busy crying like a little girl about twitter. If you do that, you won't get your big laughs from calling Mac users trendy fags and people might notice that your favorite OS sucks.

Mommy, mommy, make him stop!

twitter is what we're reading about (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471290)

You've pretty much stopped pretending that Erris, gnutoo, inTheLoo, westbake, willeyhill, Odder and so on are not your sockpuppets, have you?

WinMac Fanboy Haiku Ceremony. (0)

inTheLoo (1255256) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471354)

PC sells at twice price
gay store must be to blame
Vista bury Mac.

The ceremony traditionally ends with the host asking, "Just tell me it's not a Mac." The guest responds, "Yes, it's a Mac." The host then throws chairs and chants something about "Developers, developers, developers. [slashdot.org] "

Re:WinMac Fanboy Haiku Ceremony. (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471512)

Isn't this another one of twitter's accounts? I think I'm losing track and I can't foe them quickly enough :(

There is no judo chop. (5, Insightful)

gnutoo (1154137) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471542)

It's all about pinning your opponent and cutting off their air supply.

How long will all the other laptop makers be able to hide the losses their "premium" laptops must be suffering because no one wants Vista? While they "race to the bottom" Apple is selling exactly the same hardware for twice as much. The only difference is software. The blackout will come soon.

$1,000 market dominance... (5, Interesting)

Totenglocke (1291680) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471154)

is exactly why I don't own an Apple. I'd love to have a Macbook Pro, but I just can't justify paying that much for yet another computer. I really think Apple would increase their market share of all systems if they lowered their prices or at least had models that started at lower prices.

Re:$1,000 market dominance... (3, Insightful)

arbiter1 (1204146) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471212)

that is reason apple biggest sellers are 1000+$ machines, anything under that you can't really do anything with.

Re:$1,000 market dominance... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471244)

Are you kidding? A mini is a full featured desktop that can handle just about anything. Probably not great for games, but if you're buying a computer for games, you should be buying a PC anyway. Not sure why you think there's a magic point at 1000 dollars under which "you can't really do anything with" because that simply is not true at all.

Re:$1,000 market dominance... (-1, Troll)

story645 (1278106) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471504)

Because all the laptops (mac's real market for computers-and I can't even find one under a 1000 at the moment) under 1000 aren't really useful. They give those things (actually the macbooks-which a 'lil over the 1000 price point) for free to the honor's college kids at my school, and well half the engineers/architects I know wanna buy dell's and the like 'cause the macbooks can barely handle their apps, when compatibility issues don't start up.
The mac mini is utterly adorable-but I can but a more powerful dell for the same price (or a fit-pc for cheaper)-most people who really care about a small pc just by a laptop.

Re:$1,000 market dominance... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471284)

I may have missed something, but what is it that you want to do that you can't on an $800 Lenovo T61 with a 2.0 ghz Core 2 Duo and 2gb of ram?

Re:$1,000 market dominance... (-1, Flamebait)

XnavxeMiyyep (782119) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471386)

what is it that you want to do that you can't on an $800 Lenovo T61 with a 2.0 ghz Core 2 Duo and 2gb of ram?

Your mom.

Re:$1,000 market dominance... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471396)

what is it that you want to do that you can't on an $800 Lenovo T61
Running what... Windows? How about boot the machine in less than 10 minutes?

Re:$1,000 market dominance... (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471286)

You know, just the other day, I was looking at a Dell laptop running Ubuntu. I decided to compare it to the current MacBook. After upgrading the Dell to match Apple's stock options, the Dell was $100 more expensive (and still had a slower C2D processor and less disk space).

On one hand, Dell's plain model would suit most people fine. On the other, you get more for your money with a Mac. And ultimately, it works for the consumer's benefit. Macs depreciate much more slowly than Dells, meaning they can get a kick ass fast machine for less than even the cheapie Dell, if they trade in.

Re:$1,000 market dominance... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471342)

How exactly is this trolling? I sense an Apple fanboy with mod points....

Those with money to burn... (2, Funny)

Aardpig (622459) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471156)

...will always find someone to tend the fire. Still, I'm sure they sleep better knowing that they're 'Trendy Mac', rather than 'Fat, Sad PC'.

* What they don't realize, of course, is that PC only got fat because Mac's mother gave him a cookie every time he fucked her.

Correction (2, Insightful)

JavaBasedOS (1217930) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471162)

"If you don't give people a choice [in the Apple stores], people will take their money somewhere else."

Honestly, Apples are overpriced for what hardware and software they contain. Sure they may use a stable UNIX based OS, but you can get just that with any respectable Linux OS (Debian, Ubuntu, etc., depending on the person's preference.)

Re:Correction (4, Insightful)

75th Trombone (581309) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471236)

But for many people, they are NOT overpriced for the superior apps written for them. Most *n?x apps are by and best for nerds who love to tinker with every option of every program; most Windows apps are just thrown together to make a quick buck.

But Mac apps, on average, are more thoughtfully designed and crafted than their equivalents on PCs.

That is the very real difference between Macs and PCs, and that's why some people (including, for the first time, in the very near future, myself) are willing to pay the Apple premium.

It really is preference (1)

Stevenovitch (1292358) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471252)

For windows users using Mac programs is extremely painful and unintuitive and I'm sure the same is true the other way around. Why one side is willing to pay more has a lot more to do with the fact that there is competition in the PC market.

Re:It really is preference (3, Interesting)

Divebus (860563) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471574)

For windows users using Mac programs is extremely painful and unintuitive and I'm sure the same is true the other way around.
I haven't heard that out of the 60-some people I've introduced to Macs. Everyone is used to menu driven things and take to anything new very quickly. My experience says you just show new users the differences and within a short time they're buying a Mac for themselves. Why? Not because it's shiny or anything but because OS X isn't nearly as needy as Windows.

Re:Correction (0, Troll)

erlehmann (1045500) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471268)

But Mac apps, on average, are more thoughtfully designed and crafted than their equivalents on PCs.

Yeah, mac design is really superiour. FYI: Last time I checked one could choose between a blue-gray and a gray-blue color scheme. Great !

Re:Correction (0)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471398)

Yeah, mac design is really superiour. FYI: Last time I checked one could choose between a blue-gray and a gray-blue color scheme. Great !
Yeah, that's a muUUUuch bigger problem than the fun you have setting up dual monitors in Windows.

Re:Correction (1)

Warll (1211492) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471444)

You mean like plugging them in? Because you know thats all I did, and it was on "evil" Vista!

Re:Correction (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471538)

Took me about a minute to set it up. The hell are you talking about?

Re:Correction (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471550)

Since when was this a problem in Windows? I've used anywhere from 2-4 monitors over the past couple of years and Windows (XP and Vista) has no issues accommodating them. Like another poster, I simply plugged them in.

Windows ain't perfect, but if you're going to unleash an uninformed Mac fanboygasm, at least pick a better target.

Ayup. (0)

Squeeze Truck (2971) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471346)

Though I've been using PCs for 20 years of my life I'm about to become a first-time Apple customer myself.

Re:Ayup. (1)

HeavyDevelopment (1117531) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471506)

I did it (hell I was a user of DOS) and never looked back. Fully vested with great set up (MacBook Pro and Mac Pro). BTW, Apple hardware runs Widows better than any Dell, HP, et all I've had. Take the plunge, the water is terrific.

Re:Correction (1)

NosTROLLdamus (979044) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471356)

But Mac apps, on average, are more thoughtfully designed and crafted than their equivalents on PCs.
LAME What you really mean is YOU PERSONALLY like mac stuff better. And that's fine to say, a computer is a tool and you can use what you want, but don't try to butter it up with all this bullshit.

Re:Correction (5, Insightful)

0100010001010011 (652467) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471300)

You're joking right? It took me a few months to finally figure out how to get a RAID card in my debian box to work (Had to recompile the kernel with support for that card).

Oh and with 2.6.24 they completely changed away things were. Apparently there's IT821X kernel drivers, then there's libata. So magically when upgraded my kernel all my hd* drives are now sd* drives. But wait, with libata (or was it the IT drivers) it didn't support UDMA. So I was stuck transferring at a whopping 3-4 MB/s. Recompile again. Shit, now grub thinks my hda is sdi. Reboot again and change grub menu. Ahh, finally... no wait. I have to put a noraid=1 at the grub so that the drive doesn't enable RAID. A short 8 hours after doing a simple kernel recompile I'm back up and running.

Don't get my wrong, I love my linux home server. But in no way does even Ubuntu come close to having everything integrated and 'just working'.

There's a reason my MacBookPro is my main machine, because some days I don't want to tinker with all of that. My grandma finally wants to get online. My parent asked me what I suggested and honestly an old G4 in simple finder with a few applications: iPhoto, Safari, Mail (if that). SSH will be enabled and I'll have an account for fixing most things.

Re:Correction (1)

0100010001010011 (652467) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471312)

And just so I don't sound like a complete idiot. The 'months' was googling and waiting for the drivers to make it into the kernel. When I first got the cards there was little/no support for them in the kernel.

Re:Correction (3, Insightful)

the_womble (580291) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471584)

My grandma finally wants to get online.

Your grandma uses RAID?

Most things that desktop users does work out of the box with Linu. The only common problem is with wireless networking: if you buy a PC with Linux pre-installed (from Sytem76 for example), even that will not be a problem.

How easy is it to get MacOS working on random PC hardware? Compare like with like and Linux looks pretty good.

Re:Correction (1)

NMerriam (15122) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471332)

Sure they may use a stable UNIX based OS, but you can get just that with any respectable Linux OS (Debian, Ubuntu, etc., depending on the person's preference.)

Only if you don't want to use any major commercial apps with any kind of support. The reason people are spending money on the Mac is that it's the best of all worlds -- a true UNIX system with commercial, user-friendly apps apps, full hardware/software support, and it even integrates your windows stuff right on the desktop with none of the drawbacks of WINE or other hacks. Heck, Fusion is even supporting some Direct3D on the Mac now, which would be useful if Apple had any 21st century GPUs in their consumer systems.

For U.S. Retail sales only. (5, Interesting)

TinyManCan (580322) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471164)

These numbers don't really represent that much. They are for U.S. Retail sales. Since Apple is very dominant in the (tiny) retail computer sales industry, its not a shocker that they have high market share in a slice of that market.

If you were to count BTO computers sold over phone or internet in the U.S. Apple's market share would drop. Add the rest of the world and Apple's market share shrinks even more.

That said, Apple is gaining speed and is only going to be selling more computers for the foreseeable future.

Re:For U.S. Retail sales only. (1)

NMerriam (15122) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471434)

Yeah, that's the biggest flaw in this report -- I doubt many >$1000 PCs are sold at retail overall, folks tend to buy anything over $1000 direct from the OEM, not a reseller. in that price range people usually want to select certain options or configurations, it's mainly the ~$500 email/web boxes that people buy off the shelf at Fry's or Best Buy as-is.

So it seems fairly meaningless in terms of drawing any useful conclusions, other than simply verifying in another way that Apple's retail strategy is very successful, which we already knew since they're one of the most profitable per-square foot retail operations in the world.

Re:For U.S. Retail sales only. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471470)

Don't forget about people who assemble their own computers. Most serious PC users buy and assemble their own computers from individual parts if only because its cheaper. The after market sale for RAM and hard drives isn't exactly niche.

You get... (1, Insightful)

MsGeek (162936) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471204)

...what you pay for. Most of those computers mentioned in the article are made from the absolute cheapest parts that HP, Dell, Lenovo, etc. can get. Apple tends to use the best parts they can get, and the results speak for themselves. I have Macs that are still in running order after 20 years.

Re:You get... (5, Insightful)

miratrix (601203) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471288)

Of course! Only the prettiest and the healthiest Core 2 Duo's are hand picked by the Intel engineers in bunny suits and lovingly put down on the MacBook motherboards.

This, of course, is in contrast to the Core 2 Duo's that goes into the Dell laptop - they're from the bottom of the barrel and they are shoveled into the sockets by some off-shored child labor getting paid 25 cents an hour, not getting that TLC that the Apple counterparts get. No wonder the Core 2 Duo's in Dells are so dysfunctional!

You can't win for losing. (3, Interesting)

inTheLoo (1255256) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471450)

You have one of two cases and I don't think you like the one you already chose:

  1. The hardware identical, so people are paying the premium for software that works.
  2. The hardware is different and that's what people are paying for.

Both of these are losers for Windows fanboys, but the first is closer to true and th worst. The fact is that people are paying twice as much for Macs and the only difference is software and marginally better hardware. There are "premium" Wintel laptops but they are sitting on the shelf because people are buying twice as many premium Apples. The real bummer for those other hardware makers is that they have produced far more laptops than Apple can and must be piling up big losses while Apple is having trouble metting demand.

You joke about it but you have nothing but insults.

Re:You get... (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471494)

Haha, only serious, right? First off, in order to get a Dell laptop with a comparable processor, you have to go to the XPS line. You're not going to get an equivalent Core 2 Duo without jumping up to the high cost lines.

But even then, you're stuck with the cheapest EVERYTHING ELSE. A computer isn't just the processor.

You have the motherboard, the memory, the hard drive, the video card, the sound card, the battery, the power adapter, the integrated peripherals like webcam and microphone, the keyboard, the mouse, the case, the ports and where they're located, and so on.

Yeah, they both use Intel Core 2 Duo processors from the same source. But you'd better believe that you're not getting the same quality everything else on a Dell as you are on an Apple.

Trust me on this. A Dell laptop lasts a maximum of two years without major repair. Either the hard drive dies or the memory dies. That's not to mention the Dell batteries which become useless just after the warranty expires. Guess who works at a company that has a contract with Dell to provide all our PCs.

Re:You get... (1, Insightful)

UnknowingFool (672806) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471514)

That would be true if the Core 2 Duo or CPU was the only part in a computer. The last time I checked a computer consisted of other parts like HD, optical drive, etc. I think motherboards alone consist of dozens of chips.

Re:You get... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471556)

Hmmm. That post scores "5: Informative"...

Are the engineers in Playboy bunny suits?

Re:You get... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471348)

You are joking right? You do know that pretty much all Apple's, Lenovo's, HP's, etc are made by the same few companies in China?

At the moment, a Mac is just another PC with a higher price tag and a crappy, but easy to use, Unix based operating system.

Re: You get... (1)

Stevenovitch (1292358) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471352)

When you build your own PC you also get the best parts at way under a grand, and every time I've done it's lasted up until I wanted to upgrade... except that one that spontaneously combusted. hrm.... upgrading and building your own... how do you translate that into Mac speak?

More unfortunately (1)

garry_k (1204760) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471404)

They were also obsoleted by Apple within 3 years of manufacture. Apple has screwed their customer base over and over, and their customer base has such a short memory. I have seen 8 year old PCs still running and doing what was expected of them and still useful. PC users expect their 8 year old software to run on any Windows OS (horrible handicap for any OS). I have some customers who are still running their Lotus 123 for DOS on XP. I also hear more and more complaints from Apple users about quality control and buggy software so I think that Apple users wear rose colored glasses.

Re:You get... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471472)

You get 4 reboots in a row when a printer driver fails to work properly and completely freezes up after it has been quite operational for 3 months. Add to that twice removing drivers and reinstalling them, getting intermittent errors before finally giving up and printing from a PC

Don't forget Finder's crappy interface, the feeling of being buried under windows and having to shovel your way through just to find other windows, inability to alt-tab properly, inability to maximize windows, the idiotic application menu completely separated from the window (extremely useful when using dual screens and your window is on one monitor and the application menu on another), Mail crashes when trying to change incoming mail sounds to custom sounds... but hey, at least the "force quit" menu option is easy to find. Oh, spinny-clown-ball-of-death, I love you so much more than the blue screen of death.

Sometimes, I get the feeling apple is only "stable" because they learned how to walk a tight rope between stability and instability, by not actually making good software that runs well and following good software development practices, but by making software that only runs on a specific kind of hardware, the superior hardware you refer to. With each new iteration of their OS, they try to find a breaking point of their OS, and try to get it *just* stable enough to be more stable than Windows (which, btw, are designed to run on any piece of crap hardware you could throw at it. (Notice I said 'designed', not 'developed').

There's also the added bonus of smugness that they sell to apple users that their computers are actually superior because they have "better" hardware.

I should know, I'm a Mac user.

Still, I know I can trust my MBP because it's light enough. "Never trust a computer you can't throw out the window." Woz, don't tempt me.

Re:You get... (1)

^_^x (178540) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471476)

Actually you should look up some of the things that have happened with the Macbook Pro. Not the batteries, but the hissing noise, playing things full volume with headphones plugged in in Windows, power buttons that sink in and have to be replaced, noisy headphone jack, or striped screen to name the common ones.

I have one from work and I love the thing because none of that has happened, but you get no better hardware quality than Dell or Lenovo; a bit worse I'd say. I found a while ago when I searched for a maker of high end laptops that hasn't had a wave of quality issues that that distinction goes to Sony. Though if I had to recommend one I'd say they're still too costly for what you get. Dell Inspiron and Latitudes are nice and if they have any shoddy parts they'll die under warranty. They're also pretty easy to open up and strip down - you can find service manuals for them online. If you're paranoid about low quality, check the RAM - I've had a lot at work with bad Samsung RAM lately. Hynix seems fine. Other defects I'd say are less than 1% of the ones we set up lately.

spin at it's best. (1, Insightful)

timmarhy (659436) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471216)

way to try spin the fact mac's are a rip off into something positive. "zomg apple sells nothing under $1000, and since no one but mac fans are dumb enough to spend that much they rule!"

Re:spin at it's best. (1)

Squeeze Truck (2971) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471416)

I rememebr when the high-end workstation market was something very significant, highly-coveted, and dominated by the likes of Sun and SGI. Those boxen often sold for upwards of $15,000. This is not a new niche.

The specs on the new power macs are truly awesome to behold. They're completely deserving of the the title high-end.

High End (1)

mosb1000 (710161) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471492)

Though you should note that their definition of high-end is >$1,000 which includes all their laptops, and the iMac. What is the world coming to? I remember when the imac was the bargain-basement mac that everyone said would fail. Now it's high-end.

i see only percentages in that article (1)

siddesu (698447) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471220)

what does this amount to in real numbers, and what is the amount relative to the whole notebook market?

notebooks have been more or less a commodity for quite some time now, so i can't imagine super-expensive notebooks represent that huge a share of the market.

Re:i see only percentages in that article (1)

The End Of Days (1243248) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471302)

Will we get updated stats (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471226)

When people start returning their Macs next year after their OS has slowed to a painful crawl?

One output slanted me (1)

Irish_Samurai (224931) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471254)

I couldn't find one with HDMI output, so I went PC laptop.

Maybe I'm ignorant.

Re:One output slanted me (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471370)


while HDMI doesn't == DVI, they are very, very close. All current macs have DVI, so for an extra ~ $26, they all have HDMI as well.

Re:One output slanted me (1)

dfghjk (711126) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471586)

Don't forget the extra software you have to purchase to have any realistic chance of making that cable work right. Connecting a mac to an HDMI set via DVI is a nightmare.

why the analysts are always wrong... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471310)

As the analyst said, "If you don't give people a choice [in the Apple stores], people will spend more."

well, duh.... and you know, people also don't need to go to an apple store. their choice was to walk into an actual physical store.

Lies, Damn Lies, and Apple sales figures (3, Insightful)

Rix (54095) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471368)

Take a look at a brick and mortar store retail store that sells computers. You probably won't see anything over $1000, because that's not what the market that buys computers there wants.

People going to Staples or whatever to buy a PC want a cheap office machine, emphasis on cheap, and they want it immediately. People willing to spend more or wait a few days will either order from somewhere like Dell, have a whitebox store assemble one from parts, or just do it themselves.

How did they lose market share? (1)

enoz (1181117) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471410)

Laughably assuming there is truth in the summary, since the >$1000 PC is Apple's by default (according to Fortune) how in the hell can Apple only have 66% market share?

Industrial design does matter (4, Insightful)

Toe, The (545098) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471414)

OK, I'll take some fanboy bait...

The bang-for-buck of Apple's hardware plus their software is a little difficult to justify by itself (though it is arguably a better deal than Windows and a lot less setup than linux). But the industrial design should not be overlooked as a value factor.

Compare a "cheap" consumer-grade MacBook [apple.com] to a similar consumer-grade Dell [dell.com] . The MacBook not only looks svelte and (to some) cool, it also is simply more convenient to deal with. If your computer is something that you use a lot, some of these little details can be very important.

I really appreciate the way a MacBook is almost completely silent. That it slips into the lid of a briefcase. That its speakers, microphone, and camera are all accessible but almost invisible. That I can click, right-click, scroll, pan, and more without moving my hand from one place. That it stays out of my way while I use it, instead of calling attention to itself: no blinking lights, no flashy logos in my face, no stupid buttons all over: it is just a screen with easy-to-use input devices.

Re:Industrial design does matter (1)

Warll (1211492) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471508)

I just don't get it! Why do people keep comparing Apples to Dells? Dell isn't even the largest PC box mover, HP got that title what a year and a half ago?

Re:Industrial design does matter (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471578)

"The MacBook not only looks svelte and (to some) cool, it also is simply more convenient to deal with." ...yeah, if you don't want two buttons for the integrated touchpad. using the (whatever it is) key is clumsy. The two point scroll motion is cool, but not worth the trade IMO.

At least with the desktops you can change out the mouse.

Re:Industrial design does matter (1)

Toe, The (545098) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471600)

On any MacBook or MacBook Pro... just tap the touchpad with two fingers: that is a right-click.

If it doesn't work on a MacBook you try it in, it can be changed in System Preferences.

I never use the mouse button. Tapping and two-finger-tapping is vastly more efficient.

People see what they want to see (1, Insightful)

93 Escort Wagon (326346) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471440)

As the analyst said, "If you don't give people a choice [in the Apple stores], people will spend more."
Yeah that makes perfect sense because, oh I don't know, it's not like they can turn around and walk out without buying anything. No one ever does THAT.

People that buy Apple computers do so because they think they're getting their money's worth. People who buy higher-end PCs are the same. Dell has been mentioned already in this discussion - well they have laptops that cost several grand, and people buy them... even though Dell also has laptops for $500 or thereabouts.

No choice? (1)

whichpaul (733708) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471448)

"If you don't give people a choice [in the Apple stores], people will spend more."

What kind of logic is this? This analyst is saying that people who purchase Apple computers are forced into paying higher prices. I think this statistic is a strong indication of "free choice" at work. Regular PC stores are a-dime-a-dozen yet Apple's sales are built on consumers who walk past 10 of these to choose an Apple computer.

Cue much hand-wringing by the Wintel crowd... (2, Insightful)

amper (33785) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471478)

As the analyst said, "If you don't give people a choice [in the Apple stores], people will spend more."

Translation to reality:

"If you give people the choice between, as an example, a $2500 Wintel PC and a $500 Wintel PC, both of which offer the same crappy Windows Experience, most people will choose to invest less of their money in a losing proposition."

What truly amazes me is that, apparently, a full third of the people who can afford a superior product nonetheless invest in the inferior version.

Re:Cue much hand-wringing by the Wintel crowd... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471570)

Of course, with a Mac you pay $2500 for the $500 PC with OSX and a tacky case.

Good example of playing with statistics (4, Insightful)

gsgriffin (1195771) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471484)

Uh, this is nothing exciting. How many PC's have you bought in a store. Not many. This is retail outlets. Dell sells three times as many computers and tons more over $1000 direct from them to you without the overhead cost of a store filled with cool glass displays and backlighting. The apple stores are designed to be more like a nightclub. They want people to come in and fall in love with the piece of hardware and its smooth round corners. You spend the extra money so you can make love to it. Post the stats on all computer sales and see Apple still with a very small bite of the global sales. Don't get too excited Macaddicts.

Another Mac sales tale (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#23471500)

I recently purchased a MacBook from a large retail chain store here in Australia. While chatting with the salesman I asked him how the Apple machines (which they have only recently started stocking) were selling. His answer, which rather surprised me: "I reckon we're selling as many Mac's as all the other brands combined - easily".

But upon further consideration, standing there looking from the Mac's (iMacs, MacBooks, Pros) to the mostly bland clunky looking windows powered alternatives, I began to think well why not? They look a whole lot funkier are generally in the same price range as similarly spec'd non-apple machines and don't run Vista.

Maybe it's different in the US but here in AU I really don't see Apple hardware as expensive when comparable PC boxen are generally about the same price or more, especially for a well known brand.

Vista runs on machines $1000 ? (0)

VinylRecords (1292374) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471510)

I'm surprised at this statistic as I thought that it required a Machine > $1000 to run Windows Vista efficiently, which is what most PCs ship with currently. I can't believe people are buying cheap machines to run the system hog Vista on.

Bad Title useless result (1)

Eskarel (565631) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471524)

First of >$1000 does not mean high end it means expensive. Yes many Expensive PC's are also high end PC's, but that's not always the case. You wouldn't call a macbook Air high end, whatever else it may have going for it. Even defining a high end computer is a bit of a difficulty, are we talking performance, features, or just the extreme end of a particular market(such as the Air).

Second $US 1000 buys you an awful lot of computer(at least in the US) these days, nearly anyone who needs something more powerful than that is likely to either build it themselves or get it built by someone whose sales won't be included in this survey. I don't see anywhere where they're counting consumer grade CPU sales from AMD and Intel or the like, or anything else.

If you want to use this data to argue that Mac is the only large bulk premium grade computer retailer left in the united states, and that they have the largest percentage of that market, then go right ahead. This is of course patently obvious to anyone as the decrease in the cost of PC components coupled with the move away from pre-built PC's as well as the major PC retailers move towards low cost PC's should make thsi pretty obvious.

The fact that Mac can exist in a market that has pretty much died for PC's is an interesting idea and perhaps one which might be worthy of some discussion, but meaningless statistics like this are really rather pointless. A bit like claiming that if Intel or AMD chip sales were higher than the sales of SPARC processors that Sun was failing in the server market.

I'm sure that this has nothing to do with Vista... (1)

loraksus (171574) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471558)

...being the only choice in PC sales, running on laptops and desktops that are woefully underpowered in an attempt to create a machine that sells under a certain price point.

Now, granted, there are exceptions, but most of the stuff out on retail shelves runs like shit because it is underpowered for vista, something compounded by the fact they are loaded with pre-installed crapware and norton antivirus 30 day trials. When your floor model takes 8 seconds to pop up the start menu, you've already lost the sale...

It doesn't help that PC "salespeople" act like scumbags and push high margin items with high pressure tactics. The general public, by this time, have probably already gotten screwed once by a previous purchase and they are wary of buying from someone who acts like the last douchebag who sold them a PC.

I'm not a mac fanboy, but I can clearly see the whole retail PC market is becoming a worse experience every year. I can also see the appeal for some to go to the apple store. I'm sure mall placement helps too - I think people tend to make stupid financial decisions in malls.

Price != High End (1, Troll)

TheNetAvenger (624455) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471590)

Price does not equal high-end. Considering you can't even buy a Mac or Macbook with what is the current technology high-end, this is more than a bit misleading.

Show me a Macbook with a 7950GTX let alone a 8800M video Card, or god forbid, an SLI video notebook. We still have OLD 2005 notebooks with 1920x1200 17" displays that runs circles around Macbooks, and even most Mac Desktops. And this is really sad... (Our graphic designers run from Mac Hardware for these reasons alone)

Even the desktop models are medium range technology, and to get high-end performance, you have to replace Video at the minimum as well.

(And this doesn't even touch the horrid Apple LCDs in notebooks, especially the newly beloved OLED notbooks that tests show lose 20% of their color fidelity within six months of usage (1000 hours).)

For overpriced computers, Apple has more suckers... As for 'high-end' computing Apple doesn't even make a high end computer.

Note to commenters (5, Insightful)

catdevnull (531283) | more than 5 years ago | (#23471598)

Just a friendly note to all other commenters posting in this and any other thread:

Don't be a jackass. Seriously, If you have an opinion, express it thoughtfully but avoid assigning labels to those with different opinions.

For example:
"Apple fanboys are so stupid--they'll pay too much money for a computer they can't upgrade or build for themselves."

This is how an immature person makes an argument. I know I'm asking a lot here on slashdot, but it would be great to see the above opinion expressed in the following way:

"I'm not sure it's wise to spend one's money on a computer that can't be upgraded or one that can't be assembled from parts you pick for yourself. For me, the convenience tax and premium prices for Apple hardware are way too high to be justified."

Macintosh users should note that taking the former flamebait only reinforces the baiting behavior. You paid a pretty penny for the computer you're using to respond so try to use more than just the "CFCKYUO" keys in your response. As much as you might try, it's futile to explain the subjective nature of the "Mac experience" to the kind of person who types flamebait anyways.

Just say no to flamebait.
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