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Ballmer Says Vista Selling Really Well

CmdrTaco posted more than 6 years ago | from the yeah-but-to-who dept.

Windows 692

An anonymous reader writes "Steve Ballmer is in no way disappointed with Windows Vista. It is selling 'incredibly well,' he told a press conference in Herzeliya, Israel today. 'Vista sells on almost 100 per cent of all the new consumer PCs around the world,' the Microsoft CEO proclaimed. He added that the operating system was also selling on '45 percent of all of new business PCs.' Which is enlightening, since business users are about the only buyers of new PCs that get a choice." Anyone know anybody who bought Vista except as bundled with hardware?

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692 comments

upgrade rights, smoke and mirrors (1, Interesting)

twitter (104583) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527708)

I wonder how he defines a business and how many of those businesses are exercising their "downgrade rights". There are a lot more small businesses than big ones. Small business has far less choice and sometimes it's cheaper to buy retail. Even big business may get a better deal when offered computers with Vista that did not sell in retail channels - M$ can make any deal it wants. The bottom line for big business is that Vista has single didgit deployment and many companies are talking about skipping Vista [slashdot.org] .

Nothing is moving, Apple is handing him his ass. (0, Troll)

Odder (1288958) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527770)

Vista might come on a large fraction of retail computers but those computers are not really selling well. The biggest reason Apple dominates sales of $1000 and up PC sales [slashdot.org] is because no one is willing to pay that much for Vista.

Re:Nothing is moving, Apple is handing him his ass (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527986)

I think the reason is that Apple is the only vendor whose all products are over $1000 each and also that nobody else (other vendors) is really interested in that overpriced market.

Re:Nothing is moving, Apple is handing him his ass (4, Insightful)

Moofie (22272) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528096)

I guarantee they're interested. They just can't compete.

HP, Dell, Lenovo, Asus, etc not interested in $E3? (5, Funny)

Odder (1288958) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528178)

All of them have their $4,000 laptops and Media Centers, but Apple sells twice as many as them combined. Tell me another good joke about vendors not being interested in high margin business and I'll tell you a good joke about a $400 OS and a $450 Office suite. Steve Ballmer is blowing smoke from his crack pipe.

Not true at all (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527718)

Which is enlightening, since business users are about the only buyers of new PCs that get a choice

Not true at all. Business users are the ones that are most likely to not get a choice. The IT department will choose for them based on what they feel like supporting. A large portion of IT departments are run by slashdotters who are fed "Vista sux0rz" nonsense, so this is completely understandable.

Re:Not true at all (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528014)

My IT dept must be filled with morons them, since they couldn't run Weblogic10 + Eclipse + BEA Worshop on Windows Vista in a machine with 2GB of ram.
5 Min to deploy a webapp in a development enviroment is just too much.

Re:Not true at all (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528176)

shhhhhhhhhh you are ruining the slashdot fanboy groupthink. Microsoft are evil and everyone hates vista remember?

Who does he think he's fooling? (5, Informative)

westbake (1275576) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527722)

Even Time magazine has notice Microsoft is "an Empire in rapid decline" [time.com] .


Who's this message directed at? The last people he's going to fool are corporate users. Home users continue to avoid buying new computers because what they have is working just fine. Even if he could convince them to go buy, they have a giant selection of $500 and less Vista failure laptops to chose from if they don't just buy a $300 EEE PC with GNU/Linux.

Stop calling it GNU/Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527998)

you slimy hypocrite!

Re:Stop calling it GNU/Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528074)

Sorry, the GP probably meant to call it GNU.

Re:Who does he think he's fooling? (4, Informative)

trifish (826353) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528132)

And, in the mean time, 15% of desktop users [hitslink.com] use Windows Vista.

I don't really get all the Vista hatred (1, Informative)

ChowRiit (939581) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527736)

I bought Vista, I use Vista, and once I turned off UAC I've had no problems with Vista. I think the hatred for it is overstated, and largely perpetuated by people who don't use it - the only problem I've had is a lack of printer drivers for a printer, and that's because Samsung want to sell new printers rather than make new drivers for their old ones...

Wait, this is /. - I mean, uh, Microsoft suck!

It's PC Magazine and just about everyone. (5, Informative)

ibane (1294214) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527860)

PC Magazine's editor sure gave Vista the thumbs down [slashdot.org] . The only thing any of my friends ever tell me is that "It looks nicer" so they like it but they have more problems with it than XP. That kind of opinion does not make me want to risk buying a new PC.

Re:It's PC Magazine and just about everyone. (1)

Tubal-Cain (1289912) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527948)

You are basing your decision on the opinions of your non-technical friends and not the informed, logical, and totally unbiased opinion of the /. hive mind?
Not that your friends are wrong, of course.

Re:It's PC Magazine and just about everyone. (4, Insightful)

DAldredge (2353) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528002)

Never thought I would see the day when PC Magazine was help up to be a reliable source of information on /.

Re:It's PC Magazine and just about everyone. (1)

nawcom (941663) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528122)

Heh of course your friends don't look at other operating systems. I still giggle when I see people show off that Flip3D thing.

Re:It's PC Magazine and just about everyone. (4, Informative)

Planesdragon (210349) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528150)

5 reasons a geek should buy Vista, off the top of my head:

* 4 GB of memory supported on 32-bit Vista.
* Backup to DVD-R or CD-R
* MUCH better Wi-Fi control
* Restore Points can be set for user files, not just system files
* New UI technique -- hit windows key, type the name of your file or program, and hit enter. (The upgraded Explorer has a whole bunch of new and useful bits, but this is the one I miss the most from the Beta.)

If I could upgrade the three PCs my wife and I have for less than $100 total, I'd do it. But since I can't, Vista isn't worth the upgrade price -- but I wouldn't shy away from it if I were purchasing a new computer.

How falking ridiculous... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527916)

Talk about your reverse psychology astroturfing! How can you not get the hatred directed at Vista when the first quality you mention about it is the fact you had to turn off UAC? That in itself has got your average consumer in fits over the junk OS. Some day a smart cookie will link all you astrofurfers back to your desks at Redmond it's so blatant.

Re:How falking ridiculous... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528022)

That and the higher footprint are really the only issues with Vista that I have encountered, though. It also fixes a lot of the little annoyances with XP and brings some nice interface tweaks, granted that many of them have been in Brand X competing product for years, along with having generally better stability and security. I love the search bar that also doubles as a run prompt, and being able to 'merge' folders in Explorer rather than just overwrite them is a nice plus as well. Really, my only issue with User Account Control is how it blacks your entire screen stopping you from whatever you're doing. If there was some way to just make it another window, people probably wouldn't be turning it off.

Re:I don't really get all the Vista hatred (2, Interesting)

bloodninja (1291306) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527990)

the only problem I've had is a lack of printer drivers for a printer, and that's because Samsung want to sell new printers rather than make new drivers for their old ones...
Hey, that's same same problem that I have with my lugg^H^H^H^H Ubuntu. Seriously, I've installed Ubuntu on a machine and told the user that it was the latest version of Windows. It's that easy to use, so long as the user is not tainted with the L word. What does paying for Vista get the average home user, who is not tied to some particular business software? That is the reason Vista is failing. It's only real market is for users who need applications that run on Windows, and many of those applications only run on XP.

Re:I don't really get all the Vista hatred (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528028)

If it's not a problem for you that a dual core laptop with vista boots up and performs worse than a single core sub ghz with linux, xp, or osx, then vista is fine, indeed.

Re:I don't really get all the Vista hatred (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528032)

I've had the awesome experience of supporting a couple of early adopters. Vista is a a slow, bloated, bug-ridden POS and you're not fooling anybody by claiming otherwise.

I think the hatred for it is overstated, and largely perpetuated by people who don't use it
Sorry pal, I've supported Windows on some level since NT4. Sounds to me like it's you who's attempting to perpetuate a falsehood because pretty much everyone who uses or supports OSX and Linux desktops thinks vista is a steaming pile of crap.

Re:I don't really get all the Vista hatred (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528044)

My reasons for hating Vista?

- User control sucks, and it sucks to code for. Yeah, it can be disabled, but you can't count on that in your apps - and it's a bitch on older software.
- Many apps and games are broken. Obvious point. - It takes damn-near twice the processing power and memory that XP does, no matter how you look at it.
- They're artificially forcing it down people's throats by trying to restricting software to be Vista-only when it'd run fine (possibly better) on XP.
- Mostly all the menus and configurations were changed. I say changed and not improved, because they haven't improved (from my point of view).
- Many misc UI changes. See previous point.

Short summary, there is no good reason for me to be wanting Vista, aside from the fact that MS and other companies (most likely for extra money from MS) are trying to force it down my throat. (Besides, the effective forcing [and quit the "you have a choice" crap - that shit doesn't apply in the real world] sounds like monopoly abuse to me. -- And for the record, I don't even hate Microsoft. They *can* make excellent software, and I use Windows XP Professional exclusively.)

Re:I don't really get all the Vista hatred (3, Insightful)

JackieBrown (987087) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528054)

You turned off UAC? Why not turn off aero as well?

What is the point of upgrading?

And, more importantly, by doing this, your experience is not a typical vista experience for the average user.

Re:I don't really get all the Vista hatred (4, Interesting)

fchambers (719227) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528078)

I was forced to take Vista. I tried it. It couldn't find anything on my network except my fax machine and the user interface for a modular print server, but not the printer. I finally hard coded the address and then it had driver issues. The printer was a plain vanilla HP laserjet. I replaced Vista ASAP with Ubuntu which immediately connected to everything. I wasted 90 minutes downloading approximately 150 updates out of the box. I guess HP didn't care if it was current or maybe Vista has so many issues that it needed that many new updates during shipping.

The Question (2, Informative)

LBArrettAnderson (655246) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527738)

I have 2 computers running Vista. Neither of them came bundled with it. I am very happy with Vista... I haven't had any problems at all (even though I will likely be modded as such, I am not trolling).

Re:The Question (2, Funny)

jo42 (227475) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527842)

All the computers I've bought and came with Vista, five of them so far, are running Windows XP. A polished, gold painted turd is still a turd.

another (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527742)

anti Microsoft thread on /.

Bad Vista (5, Interesting)

awarrenfells (1289658) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527748)

I don't know anyone that bought vista unbundled with any hardware, but I think it is interesting to note that of all the customers I provide technical support for, nearly 90% of them have all stated how much they hated vista. The consumers speak for themselves. Maybe they should be given a choice as well. Though, given the current trend and opinion, that may very well cause Vista sales to bomb.

Re:Bad Vista (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527788)

People who need technical support tend to hate whatever software they need support for.

Re:Bad Vista (4, Insightful)

LBArrettAnderson (655246) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527794)

of all the customers I provide technical support for, nearly 90% of them have all stated how much they hated vista

so... 90% of them have stated whether or not they hate vista? You do realize that your phrasing would include satisfied people in those 90%. But I'll assume that you meant that 90% hated it. You are providing technical support for those people! Of course they aren't happy with something. They screwed something up on their computer, and they are blaming Vista for it.

Re:Bad Vista (4, Informative)

awarrenfells (1289658) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527878)

Let me rephrase, of the Vista Customer's I have worked with, 90% of them have stated that they hated vista. As far as the technical support side, I don't support Vista, just their "internets" :P And usually the reason they don't like vista is because it runs so darn slow, and for strange reasons it plays magic tricks with people's NIC around windows update time =D

He is saying that new PCs are selling well (3)

ctid (449118) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527750)

Most PCs come with Vista by default (it is a bit of a hassle to buy without) so new PCs are sellng well.

Stupid question (1)

Harold Halloway (1047486) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527752)

"Anyone know anybody who bought Vista except as bundled with hardware?"

Yes.

Re:Stupid question (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527834)

If by bought you mean "downloaded from The Pirate Bay", then yes.

Re:Stupid question (1)

Harold Halloway (1047486) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527954)

There's a difference??

Re:Stupid question (1)

HTMLSpinnr (531389) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528108)

When our local CompUSA was going under last year or so, I found Vista Ultimate Upgrade discounted to $150. I decided to buy it at that point simply to know what I'd be supporting in a year or so. Still running the 64-bit iteration on my primary machine (tri-booting w/ XP Home and FC 9). Other than old hardware driver challenges and a healthy diet for RAM, I have had little other to complain about. If I thought my kids' machine could handle it, I'd probably spend the $50 for the family upgrade there too.

On the flip side, the OEM copy that came on my wife's Dell Inspiron on the other hand has been a ton of trouble. Rebooting instead of sleeping (thanks, SP1) seems to be the biggest issue.

So anecdotally, for applications where Vista was purchased on purpose, users are likely having a better experience than those who received it bundled with hardware!

I believe it (5, Insightful)

aggie_knight (611726) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527756)

And in other news, President Bush says the War in Iraq is going "really, really well".

faint praise (4, Insightful)

Dolohov (114209) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527768)

Note that he didn't say that he's proud of it because it's good software, but because it "has had a good unit volume market reaction." In other words, he's not proud of his programmers, he's proud of his marketers.

Re:faint praise (1)

gzipped_tar (1151931) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527886)

So what?

Re:faint praise (1)

Dolohov (114209) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527934)

One could ask the same question of the original post.

You can sell TURD with 100% of new pcs (0, Troll)

unity100 (970058) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527774)

if you forcefully bundled your turd with the new pc, by using laws you have bought in the countries you sell them.

thats how your vista is selling.

please (2, Informative)

unity100 (970058) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528138)

some fanboi who modded parent post troll come up and explain me how you can fail in selling something if you forcefully bundle them with new computers.

Indeed, (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527778)

Ballmer says a lot of things.

Almost no-one buys Windows unbundled anyway. (1)

wvmarle (1070040) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527786)

Come on, editors:

Anyone know anybody who bought Vista except as bundled with hardware?
You can make that into "... bought any version of Windows except bundled...".
There will be some people who buy the boxed version, but very very few. The vast majority buys Windows only with a new computer. Oh sorry, make that gets Windows with a new computer. There is after all no separate pricing for Windows, it is simply included. And by many users thus perceived as free.
Windows you get with your computer, Windows you don't buy. And it will be a very very long time before that idea is gone.

Re:Almost no-one buys Windows unbundled anyway. (1)

Kippesoep (712796) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527974)

I suppose you're too young to remember the Windows 95 launch? With that, and to a lesser extent Windows XP, people were queuing up in front of the stores which opened at midnight because people wanted to get it on release day. The hype was so big back then that even people who didn't own a computer (yes, they exist, especially in 1995) bought Windows 95 because it was the thing to have. I bought Vista separately and am quite happy with it except for a few minor niggles. (I actually have 2 copies of Vista Ultimate, the second one being a freebie which I haven't installed).

Customers want both. (4, Insightful)

Hankapobe (1290722) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527792)

âoeWhat we have learned is that maybe our customers care a little bit more about compatibility and a little bit less about securityâ he ventured.

Absolutely not! This isn't an either or choice. Your customers want both! That's why, many of your customers are moving to patforms that offer both. 45% businesses choose Vista? What about the other 55% of businesses?. What did they choose - hmmmmm?

Re:Customers want both. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527838)

XP. which has better compatibility and less security. making his statement true.

XP? Really? (2, Interesting)

Hankapobe (1290722) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527942)

XP. which has better compatibility and less security. making his statement true.

Are business really just sticky with XP? Or are they moving over a Linux distro or OSX for that matter? I have a feeling that the Linux numbers are going to start increasing drastically. Just a hunch.

Re:Customers want both. (3, Informative)

Kjella (173770) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528012)

Uhh... Windows XP? You know, most businesses are very conservative and would rather stretch their experience on XP rather than cause hardware upgrade, software upgrades, training, system administration changes, possibly new incompatibilities and instabilities and so on and so forth. Making sure your employees have the latest version of clippy is hardly what improves margins...

Re:Customers want both. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528100)

What did they choose - hmmmmm?

Umm, let's see, what's the most widely used desktop OS in the world and one with arguably the best compatibility with the largest number of business applications of all OS's? Isn't it Windows XP?

Get real.

I can't disagree (5, Funny)

Undead NDR (1252916) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527796)

If it sold more than zero copies, that qualifies as "incredibly well" for me too.

People like Vista because it's shiny (5, Insightful)

Flavio (12072) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527806)

I don't know anyone who actually bought Vista unbundled, but I know plenty of people who got it pre-installed and kept using it.

They experience Vista's problems and huge system requirements, but they keep using it anyway. Maybe it's because they don't want to admit to themselves that they indirectly bought garbage. But I think it's because they want the newest, shiniest product, regardless of whether it's better.

Fact: most people are MORONS.

Re:People like Vista because it's shiny (1)

sw155kn1f3 (600118) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527884)

I always hear about vista problems.. What are they exactly? Never used vista myself though, thank you, I'll stick with my oem xp on laptop and pc and occasionally linux. But soon I'll be moving to core 2 duo and want to know if it's even worth to bother or it's fine?

Re:People like Vista because it's shiny (1)

closer2it (926190) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527970)

If you want that Duo Core juice to what really matters, stick with XP.

Just plain simple.

Re:People like Vista because it's shiny (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527900)

Fact: most people are MORONS. ... and your post proves that you're an intellectual giant...

Re:People like Vista because it's shiny (0, Troll)

Santana (103744) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527978)

One of my reasons to buy a MacBook (which is my first Mac by the way) was precisely for avoiding Vista. I was not willing pay for Vista.

  My co-workers, which are Windows-minded because don't know any better, are thinking of trying a Mac now.

Re:People like Vista because it's shiny (1)

HyperQuantum (1032422) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528076)

Fact: most people are MORONS.
Maybe, but most people don't know that they have the option of using something else. They think that on a PC you *must* use Windows.

I bought it (1)

gEvil (beta) (945888) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527808)

I'm somewhat ashamed to admit that I recently bought an OEM copy of Vista.

About a month ago I started getting random video corruption issues when waking from hibernate on my 2yo XP machine (it only happened when waking from hibernate). I narrowed it down to a software issue, and the only fix after a while was a reinstall. The machine was a refurb HP box, so the only XP install media I have are the restore CDs I burned, which contain all the crap I spent a month or so clearing out when I first got the machine. Since I was getting a new hard drive to start fresh with anyways and I didn't want to use the restore discs, my choices were either spending a hundred bucks on an OEM XP disc (btw, I could never get my "genuine product key" to work with any install CDs I downloaded) or spend a hundred bucks for an OEM Vista Premium disc. I opted for Vista. And honestly, once you turn off a bunch of the annoying crap, it's really not too bad. Some of the things they've added are pretty nice. The only issue I have is slightly stuttering sound, but since I rarely have my speakers on, it's not a huge deal. At some point I'm going to get an iMac and attempt to transfer this license over to that machine (we'll see how that goes).

Re:I bought it (1)

bloodninja (1291306) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528068)

Since I was getting a new hard drive to start fresh with anyways and I didn't want to use the restore discs, my choices were either spending a hundred bucks on an OEM XP disc (btw, I could never get my "genuine product key" to work with any install CDs I downloaded) or spend a hundred bucks for an OEM Vista Premium disc.
You realize that you have another option, don't you? [ubuntu.com]

Yah (0)

lifebouy (115193) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527810)

My linux laptop should be arriving today. Not that I'm a new convert, though. I've been using both windows and linux for 11 years. Purchase Vista? Let's just say it's not likely. Frankly, of all the software I still like to use on windows, none of it works as well in Vista as it does in XP. So of course I won't pay for that crapware, ever.

Vista not so bad (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527812)

I sometimes have to use Vista and XP, and when I use XP, I do find myself missing some of the features of Vista's interface.

What I mainly like are the click-while-holding-alt-tab thing, and the fact that I can hit the windows key and immediately start typing into a search box to match whatever program I'm looking for. Also the enforcement of the security model is a nuisance, but I do consider it an advantage on the whole.

So, if I were buying a new PC and I had to get Windows, I'd choose Vista Business over XP Pro. But I wouldn't actually buy Vista for an old machine... and when I can I'll use Ubuntu over any Windows any day.

Re:Vista not so bad (3, Informative)

Nicolay77 (258497) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527928)

and the fact that I can hit the windows key and immediately start typing into a search box to match whatever program I'm looking for.
I prefer to install Launchy [launchy.net] than pay for Vista.

Yes ... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527816)

I do. I know myself perfectly well.

I know some... (1)

swillden (191260) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527818)

Anyone know anybody who bought Vista except as bundled with hardware?

Yep.

The better question is "Anyone know anybody who bought Vista except as bundled with hardware, and doesn't regret it?".

I don't.

Re:I know some... (2, Funny)

ScrewMaster (602015) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527904)

I don't.

Don't know anybody, or don't regret it?

Re:I know some... (2, Funny)

ColdWetDog (752185) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527980)

Don't know anybody, or don't regret it?

This is Slashdot. The answer should be obvious. No need to rub it in.

Re:I know some... (0)

DAldredge (2353) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528030)

I purchased it and I do not regret it one bit.

For Compatibility Testing (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527824)

I bought a copy for compatibility testing that I run in a virtual machine. A side benefit is that I get to compare versions of Windows side-by-side. It's enlightening. Vista is slower in every respect than its predecessors, and it's more difficult to use.


On the other hand, it is shinier.

Not willingly.. (4, Informative)

crossmr (957846) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527832)

Not all business users have a choice. Dell gives you a choice. HP does not.
We're an HP value-add reseller and we can't get xw4400 workstations without vista. We had to request a downgrade kit (they will only give 1 to each business address, even though we order hundreds of these a year) and then downgrade them to XP.

I had some friends who have it on their new laptops...

Re:Not willingly.. (1)

tritter (1294692) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527922)

I had no choice when I bought my notebook a year ago. I wanted XP or no OS (since I use Linux), but the salesperson said it's not possible to do so. So I'm one of these "Vista buyers". I don't believe any of these statistics.

Re:Not willingly.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528042)

I somewhat agree here.

At my company the PC's we buy have Vista on them (still the cheapest PC's we can get in our hardware spec range). We then image them with an XP image.

That said, we do plan on switching to Vista by years end.http://tech.slashdot.org/tech/08/05/24/1154204.shtml#
Quote Parent

Downgrade to XP costs money. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527848)

I was pricing a new laptop yesterday at lenovo and they all come with Vista Home for 'free' but a downgrade to XP or an upgrade to Vista Business which can then be manually downgraded for free costs 50 bucks. That's a good way to force adoption.

boughtVista (5, Informative)

Paradise Pete (33184) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527850)

Anyone know anybody who bought Vista except as bundled with hardware?

I know two people. One is now using XP, and the other got so mad he bought a Mac.

Sells well when you have no choice (4, Insightful)

gilesjuk (604902) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527858)

Saying Vista sells with new PCs is like saying people want junk mail because they choose to have a letter box.

Volume licenses (4, Insightful)

Robber Baron (112304) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527868)

I bought volume licenses of Vista. Of course I promptly installed XP on all the boxes the licenses were for.
Same goes for Server 2008. I bought a Server 2008 open license edition and promptly installed server 2003. I needed it for an accounting app, but I wasn't going to install 2008...I don't trust it. Besides, servers should NEVER require activation or validation! EVER! That's a deal-breaker IMO.
(Don't worry, that server 2003 instance is only a VM running on a linux box.)
So what have we learned? That just because their FUCKED UP licensing model REQUIRES you to buy the new license in order to use the older, more functional versions doesn't mean that the product is a success. That ambulatory heap of festering dogshit that calls itself "Steve Ballmer" really has nothing to crow about.

Re:Volume licenses (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527962)

I'm in the same boat. My company has purchased many Vista, Office 2007, and Server 2008 licenses. We don't have any of those products actually installed and running yet. Microsoft volume licensing is complete garbage.

Re:Volume licenses (1)

bloodninja (1291306) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528116)

That just because their FUCKED UP licensing model REQUIRES you to buy the new license in order to use the older, more functional versions doesn't mean that the product is a success.
Unless you measure success in dollars.

Does MSDN Count? (1)

Artanin (249938) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527876)

We are using on a few of the Admin workstations(the beefy ones) only cause we have a MSDN subscription. We bought the machines with XP on them. The machines are about 2 months old!

Do they count "downgrade rights" as a Vista sale? (5, Insightful)

RCSInfo (847666) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527898)

HP and Dell are both willing to sell you a business PC with a Vista Business edition COA label on the side thats preloaded with XP Pro. Since the Vista Business and Premium edition EULA allows this "downgrade", its a pretty good deal all around. Business customers can get XP out of the box, but have the option to re-image the PC with Vista down the road if they feel the need. I'd guess that Microsoft still chalks up the sale as a Vista machine, so they can continue to spin the PR story of Vista's success.

I bought it (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23527906)

Slashdot sucks

I know somebody who bought vista non bundled (1)

Gromius (677157) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527918)

me.

I made a conscious decision to purchase a copy of vista home when building my recent box from parts. For what its worth I use linux extensively at work and dual boot and I like linux. Vista was frustrating at first but actually its pretty much like XP but fractionally better in a few areas. What I dislike about it is that they didnt push the boat out enough with the ui candy, I would kill for multiple desktops and expose (features both Mac and Linux have). And would it freaking kill them to have an "always on top" button on each window, linux has had that for like ever. For these reasons windows isnt my work OS but it makes a pretty nice play OS which for as sad as it is, linux and Mac OS arent fully there yet.

So to summaries, basically Vista a better option on a new PC at home than XP in my opinion. It beats Mac OS and Linux for "play" in my opinion but fairs worse for "work". However on my laptop bought just pre-vista, I have no desire to upgrade it to Vista from XP as it the slight improvements from Vista arent worth it.

Vista Media Center is worth the price of admission (2, Funny)

LaughingCoder (914424) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527926)

Seriously - Vista Media Center is very well done. Couple it with the excellent HDHomerun () and you will have a pretty awesome Hi-Def DVR setup. And as to the question posed, yes, I *purchased* a copy of Vista Home Premium for my son's machine. He likes it a lot. Incidentally, he was upgraded from Win2K, not XP, so there were quite a few new features for him to explore/try.

Counterfeit sales (5, Interesting)

clarkn0va (807617) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527960)

My brother-in-law works for a small company (~60) and informs me that they recently bought some corporate vista licensing for the sole purpose of the continued right to install xp on new machines. So if by 'vista sales' they mean 'a sale of the right to continue to use xp on new installs' then yeah, I can account for a few of these 'vista sales'.

Or at least that's how I understood the deal. Correct me if I'm wrong.

db

Vista is a hard sell!!!! (2, Informative)

surfduke (656872) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527972)

I sell computers and parts to over 4000 schools, universities and gov't agencies... Other than bundled Vista, which they all want Ultimate or business so they can downgrade to XPP... Not 1 purchase of Vista other than an experimental copy in which the head of technology for a 330 school district used Vista for 2 days then erased it and put XPP back on... Microsoft is fooling themselves and trying to pull the wool over our eyes. Vista is a load of crap and MS thinks we are so stupid enough to fall for their marketing nightmere!

And bush says Iraq is a huge success (2, Funny)

sizzzzlerz (714878) | more than 6 years ago | (#23527992)

nc

Also... (1)

Lakofka (747128) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528034)

... says he's not bald. I like Vista because it's shiny and I make no apology for liking shiny things. Once you switch all the annoying stuff off it's pretty much XP with built-in WindowBlinds lite. That doesn't make it a worthy successor to XP.

Riiiight (2, Insightful)

Drakin020 (980931) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528050)

Yes because guy's like me who purchases new computers for our company who are forced to buy Vista, don't just reinstall XP once we get it.

Sure you sold a copy of Vista, that doesn't mean were using it.

Used it for 2 months, but was too buggy... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528056)

I purchased a new XPS m1530 laptop from DELL which came only with Vista. I used it for a month or two, but even after SP1 it was still too slow to watch videos without hiccups, programs took too long to load, and although I liked the eye-candy it just wasn't worth the trouble.

I found forums that listed the Windows XP drivers for for the hardware the laptop uses, installed XP and everything was so quick, and I had no hiccups when watching video. I do miss the eye-candy, but to go through a day without rebooting windows for a crash is heaven...

I have also installed Linux on this laptop, and I got mostly everything, but there is a problem keeping the wi-fi working (after about an hour I would lose the connection and only a reboot would allow me to reconnect, so that got annoying and I put XP back on it.

It may be the case Vista not working well with this laptop is DELL's fault, but XP has had absolutely no issues so far.

Ten Percent (3, Interesting)

braindead_in (933655) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528110)

I distribute a moderately popular software for windows (simple call recording tool for Skype called Call Graph). But from my stats, only 10 % of my users are on Vista. :)

old machine / new machine crossroad (4, Insightful)

gadget junkie (618542) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528126)

I've been using computers in business for 20 years now, and I was what is commonly defined a "power user"

Why am I using the past here? because, for the first time since I started 20 years back, I see absolutely no use changing to a new machine. I use Excel. I use Access.there are some other apps that work well on XP. my machine is 3 years old, in the prime of an optimized and no nonsense life. I do not play big computer games at work. THAT's the real problem with Vista. Users have to change/upgrade machine to use Vista. what for?

I think that business users might go to Linux, but what they'd really want would be to stay as they are for years to come.

Vista is Great! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528130)

Hang on a tick there! As a long time Windows and Linux user (and a Vista beta tester), I must say Vista is fantastic! ... oh, did I mention my latest machine is a Mac? Turns out, I wanted a POSIX machine with a usable interface. With Vista bundled on any machine you would want to buy, the choice was easy...

Vista availability is on a rental basis. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528140)

If you go to any large retailer what you find is that a full version of vista basic is not available. Only an upgrade disk. However if you want to buy a cheapo pc you get vista basic OEM. Which is the only version that might run on an older computer. No more shops selling OEM licences to individuals that want to tinker. This policy is really doing in the used hardware and small computer shops!

This is how vista is being sold. In effect this stops people from building there own from older hardware. The obvious reason for this is to appease the hardware vendors, and make it so that the consumer has even less choice as to how and from who to buy!

Piracy and Downgrading (2, Informative)

dalmiroy2k (768278) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528146)

Keep in mind that a lot of people:

1) Use pirate versions of Vista, mostly in Latinoamerica and Asia.
2) Downgrade right away to XP or Ubuntu, usually wasting the license that came with the PC.

So I wouldn't take sales as a factor here.

Its good for free (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528152)

My school offered Vista Business edition as a free download. Its a good price for it, although I did spend $70 on 2gb of ram to make it run smoother.

My new laptop came with Vista.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23528154)

...and within 4 hours, I had downgraded to XP.

Don't get me wrong - I use Vista on another computer and it's... ok. That machine, however, is a quad-core behemoth with 4GB and a RAID0 config with 2 WD Raptors.
On that sort of machine, Vista runs adequately (once you turn off error reporting, windows defender, windows search, and that performance boosting service who's name escapes me - y'know the one that defrags your hard disk in the background and won't stop for love nor money).

On my new laptop, however, a simple 2GHz dual-core machine with 2GB RAM and a GeForce 8600M, Vista was a disaster.
My god, it took forever to do anything - and it wasn't because of the bundled software (which I removed immediately - not that there was much in the first place). I played a few games, tried using lightwave, etc etc and found it grim and unresponsive.

Installed XP and, lo and behold, everything is much better. Frame rates are improved, rendering times reduce dramatically, it's a pleasure to use. Well, insofar as a MS OS is a pleasure to use.

Thankfully I've left enough space on the disk to install a Linux distro. Have just tried Ubuntu 8.04 but, after an update, it now only sees one core. Hmmm. I think I'll give Fedora a try..

Yeah, of course (1)

gerbosan (1295084) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528156)

What the heck has this guy studied?
an MBA? from now on won't believe an MBA ever in my life.
Another clear example that higher management never listens to customers, neither care.

Microsoft's blunder is my opportunity (1)

Xanavi (1197431) | more than 6 years ago | (#23528166)

I for one am making a lot of money installing XP on Vista bundled computers. $80 a pop makes my car payments. Thank god for iastor.sys! I got seduced by Vista and the eye candy more than once. Never stuck with it for more than 2 days. I am very curious if the real culprit is NT6 or the sludge poured on top.
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