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Wine 1.0-rc2 Released

kdawson posted more than 6 years ago | from the very-good-year dept.

Upgrades 138

An anonymous reader writes notes the availability of Wine 1.0-rc2. Binaries for major distros are up now.

Sorry! There are no comments related to the filter you selected.

Spill (2)

Jeremiah Cornelius (137) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530332)

Spill the WINE and take that PERL.

Re:Spill (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23530342)

first reply to first post

Re:Spill (0, Offtopic)

Shadow of Eternity (795165) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530374)

Technically there's two first posts since both of them were posted at 3:16.

Re:Spill (2, Insightful)

Daimanta (1140543) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530528)

Technically Pi equals 3.14 because they both start with 3.1

Re:Spill (1)

Shadow of Eternity (795165) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530712)

well if you're going by that I'm on the bottom so I posted before him >P

Re:Spill (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23531298)

I could feel hot flames of fire roaring at my back

Re:Spill (1)

Jeremiah Cornelius (137) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532352)

Try and find the Isley Brothers cover of this. No jokin'. Fantastic!

Re:Spill (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23532458)

Re:Spill (1)

Jeremiah Cornelius (137) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532784)

Right on! Naked to the World!

Astounding... (5, Funny)

Shadow of Eternity (795165) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530336)

Kdawson appears to finally have posted something that is news, for nerds, and matters. I wonder who stole his password.

Re:Astounding... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23530988)

Don't worry, he will post the dupe any time soon to make up for it.

Re:Astounding... (-1, Troll)

glassware (195317) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531378)

Are you serious? A release candidate for a random open source project is released, and that's news you care about?

Why not just subscribe to an "auto-download-patches" RSS feed and stop taking up space on a news for humans website?

Re:Astounding... (4, Insightful)

Mad Merlin (837387) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531552)

Are you serious? A release candidate for a random open source project is released, and that's news you care about?

Perhaps if you were paying attention, you'd know that Wine 1.0 has been 15 years in the making. Furthermore, Wine is hardly "a random open source project", Wine reaching 1.0 is a very significant milestone.

Re:Astounding... (1)

gustgr (695173) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532636)

Yeah, a very significant milestone that was already reported [slashdot.org] when RC1 was released, not a long time ago. I wonder if the next RCs will be all posted here as well.

News? Sure. Relevant? Not quite. Should be in frontpage? Definitely no.

Re:Astounding... (1)

neomunk (913773) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532992)

That's it, you're not allowed to come to the party when rc is finally dropped from the release number.

No pin the tail on CowboyNeal for you Mr. Snarky Poster. :-P

Re:Astounding... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23533160)

And what is special about "1.0" compared to 0.9.61 or other future releases? "1.0" doesn't mean anything particular and it doesn't change the fact that WINE is still a WIP.

Re:Astounding... (2, Informative)

DuckDodgers (541817) | more than 6 years ago | (#23533883)

If you read the website, Wine has some internal APIs it uses. For the previous releases, those APIs were subject to change. From 1.0 forward, they are expected to remain stable.

So from an end-user perspective, the move to 1.0 is not noteworthy as a release. But for developers, you hope that contributing to the project becomes easier with a higher likelihood of forward compatibiliy.

Re:Astounding... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23531722)

a random open source project

That's like calling Debian "a random Linux distro."

news for humans

That aint what it says up there at the top.

Re:Astounding... (1)

Tubal-Cain (1289912) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531782)

news for humans
/. is for nerds, not those vile "humans". You must be thinking of Ubuntu.

Re:Astounding... (1)

somersault (912633) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531802)

He can't have been - that's just a random open source project, not important enough for the likes of him to think about!

Re:Astounding... (1)

Geek of Tech (678002) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532718)

I very distinctly read that as News for Nerds. I don't know anything people visit this site too! That's a completely different audience!

Sweet! (2, Informative)

locokamil (850008) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530414)

Wait, wait, wait.

Are you telling me that it is now possible to run Visual Studio 2005... IN LINUX?

See ya, Windows! I won't be calling you again. Ever.

Re:Sweet! (5, Funny)

Derek Loev (1050412) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530438)

Disappointment in 5...4...3...2...1.

Re:Sweet! (1)

jamstar7 (694492) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530536)

Meh. My copy of Master of Orion 2 still freezes with a hung cursor within seconds of starting it. Still haven't figured out the magic words to fix it yet.

Re:Sweet! (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23530606)

Dosbox?

Re:Sweet! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23531290)

Still haven't figured out the magic words to fix it yet.
"Please work, you unwieldy behemoth!"?

Re:Sweet! (2, Interesting)

Tolaris (31078) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531420)

MOO2 runs just fine in dosbox. The DOS version is considered the better one for network multiplayer, too. Now isn't that frightening?

1.0? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23530488)

It's still "rc", but does this mean that Wine is, at long last, becoming *ready*? Will Hitler, Stalin, Mao, etc start making snowmen there where they are?

Re:1.0? (1)

Tubal-Cain (1289912) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531800)

Yes. The project entered a 1-month "bugfixes only" mode with the release of RC1.

But what we really want to know is... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23530600)

Will it run on windows?

Re:But what we really want to know is... (1)

neomunk (913773) | more than 6 years ago | (#23533002)

Yes, under cygwin.

Iteratively actually, IIRC.

really getting good (3, Informative)

oever (233119) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530610)

Even though using Wine for apps remains a hit and miss, I've had some very good experiences working with it. At work, I'm developing a closed source Delphi application. Even though the full Delphi 2007 development environment does not run in Wine, I can run the compiler and the resulting application which is very complex (lots of COM and OpenGL) runs for 95% in Wine. It's good to know that we can get this working if customers start asking for it.

If you want to help: (5, Informative)

Daimanta (1140543) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530662)

If you have a Windows installation

Go to this page : http://test.winehq.org/data/3c1c6172779510a7ed693d922fb3061948999ea1/ [winehq.org]

Click on the big alphanumerical hyperlink and download the exe.

Give an alias and run it.

This will do conformance tests on your computer and it is very important to the wine project.

Don't try to do anything usefull while testing since it will do a wide range of things including directX tests which will make your screen display colorfields.

If you get errors or crashes, just click on OK or close. This is part of the testing. I'm sure the people working on the wine project will be very happy with it.

MOD PARENT UP! (1)

StCredZero (169093) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530772)

Parent deserves to be modded up Informative!

Re:MOD PARENT UP! (1)

vax (251660) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530824)

agreed.. thats what the wine movement really needs is to hammer the kinks out..

man they have came a LONG way though.

I remember when the most basic programs barely ran.. now I'm hearing the adobe suite is working..

promising indeed!

Re:MOD PARENT UP! (1)

mrbluze (1034940) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531448)

just a word of advice, if you suffer from epilepsy don't look at the computer while running the test!

Re:MOD PARENT UP! (1)

neomunk (913773) | more than 6 years ago | (#23533020)

Cmon, I don't see why not. What's the worst that could go wronnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn

Re:If you want to help: (1)

hansraj (458504) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530786)

Does it help wine project in any way if I run those tests with a windows installation running under a virtual machine?

I would sure like to help by playing my little part and I also have a native windows installation on my laptop but I wouldn't want to boot into it unless I really need to :)

Re:If you want to help: (1)

Daimanta (1140543) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530802)

To tell you the truth, I have no idea whatsoever. My personal guess is, that since it's a working XP installation it ought to work. If you try it anyway and it works I would like to hear the results.

Re:If you want to help: (1)

hansraj (458504) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531076)

Since you said you wanted to see the results I decided to reply to your post to inform you that I submitted it under the alias xp-virtualbox. Have a look ;-)

Re:If you want to help: (1)

Daimanta (1140543) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531134)

Works fine, you don't seem to have an exceptional amount of errors or anything of that nature. I guess that means that virtual boxes allow conformance tests just fine. Thanks for trying :)

Re:If you want to help: (1)

Moridineas (213502) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531456)

Submitted one "XpSp2Parallels" running in Parallels on OSX.

What exactly is this testing, and what do the results mean?

Re:If you want to help: (1)

Matt Perry (793115) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531518)

What exactly is this testing, and what do the results mean?
This page [gla.ac.uk] will answer that question. In short, the program performs tests to check for regressions in the Wine code.

Re:If you want to help: (1)

MichaelSmith (789609) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531580)

Looking for a bit of advice.

My wife is an architect. She has just started using CAD (Autodesk Revit). We were at the shop yesterday looking for a new windows box for her to use but she fell in love with an iMAC which was on display.

I can get more RAM for the MAC, and parallels, but is it likely to be practical to run Revit on parallels? I know that it would be hopeless on vmware. She needs mouse interaction to be perfect.

I am just looking for an indication of how fast windows runs in parallels.

Thanks.

Re:If you want to help: (1)

Moridineas (213502) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531708)

To be honest, I'm not sure what to tell you. Definitely load it up with as much ram as you can, if you decide to go this route!

Every day kind of windows things like running Internet Explorer are flawless and fast. I've had a little luck with some games, but performance is diminished. Since AutoCAD is graphical, I would imagine the answer is a big "it depends." It does seem like there are a number of google hits for Parallels and Revit,s you might have some luck reading forums etc.

Also (I'm sure you know this already) but you can dual boot from OSX into windows, and in that case it will be a completely normal windows install.

Re:If you want to help: (1)

KURAAKU Deibiddo (740939) | more than 6 years ago | (#23533092)

I use VMware Fusion regularly on Mac OS X, and do not have any problems with the mouse integration; both the trackpad on my MacBook Pro and any attached mice work as they should. Is there some reason that you feel this isn't the case?

From my experience, VMware Fusion (especially the latest 2.0 beta) seems superior to Parallels, and is more portable (e.g. if you want to use a virtual machine on a non-Mac OS, i.e. in VMware Player or Workstation). If you use the beta, be sure to turn off debugging for better performance.

Just make sure that you're using XP with it, so you can take advantage of hardware-accelerated DirectX, and that you give it a good chunk of RAM. Also, if you're talking about a dual-core iMac, which you most likely are, let it use 2 virtual processors. You'll notice a difference.

Hope this helps.

Re:If you want to help: (1)

Mad Merlin (837387) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531712)

They're conformance tests, so they check the behaviour of various API calls to make sure that a) Windows does what it's supposed to, and b) Wine does what Windows does.

The first point is significant because MSDN is wrong quite often, and the API often changes behaviour from one Windows version to the next. So the only way to find out what Wine should really be doing is to write conformance tests and run them everywhere you can.

Re:If you want to help: (1)

RichMan (8097) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531012)

Up to date winXP with a few "standard" services disabled. Got an error or 2 then got BSOD'd.

Is there a way to capture a report from this?

Re:If you want to help: (1)

Daimanta (1140543) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531048)

I'm afraid you can't. At the end of the test, the program asks you if you want to submit the test data. Before that nothing happens unless you click abort and then send the results I believe.

Re:If you want to help: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23531156)

Likewise, except on an Intel Mac running XP. People who run this should know that there's a real risk of BSOD and full system crash, which, apparently, makes the whole testing attempt worthless. We are not amused.

Re:If you want to help: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23531508)

Same here,

Tried on a thinkpad X31, got two bsod in a row and thought "ok, this isn't going to work, is it?"

Not sure how to capture the bsod text or if this could help wine.

Re:If you want to help: (1)

Psychotria (953670) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532996)

Ditto

Re:If you want to help: (3, Informative)

JoshJ (1009085) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531106)

Posting here so I can find the link in my profile when I boot into windows. Please disregard.

Re:If you want to help: (4, Funny)

hansraj (458504) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531184)

OK.

Re:If you want to help: (2, Insightful)

Khaed (544779) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531844)

You could just e-mail yourself the link. Not that this post has hurt your karma any, just a suggestion.

I do that for trivial things I want to share between Windows/Linux/different computers (ie, things not worth getting out a thumb drive for.)

Re:If you want to help: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23532372)

Mod points on drugs :)

Re:If you want to help: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23531192)



Ah well winmm_test.exe brought my system to a complete halt... Handle with care!

Re:If you want to help: (1)

nschubach (922175) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531900)

Nice link.. however... How do I know that's the latest build? Up top there is a link to go to the "Next Build" and it takes me to a new glob of numbers. How do we know we aren't giving them old data?

I mean, if you keep going, the last one that has a meaningful date in it is: http://test.winehq.org/data/200805201000/ [winehq.org] from 4 days ago, I'm assuming.

Re:If you want to help: (2, Informative)

Daimanta (1140543) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532032)

Look at http://www.astro.gla.ac.uk/users/paulm/WRT/CrossBuilt/ [gla.ac.uk] . See the the exe at the bottom. That's the latest one and the one I have linked to. Also, if you sort http://test.winehq.org/data/ [winehq.org] to the "last modified" parameter, this one ends on top. Conclusive proof I reckon.

Re:If you want to help: (2, Insightful)

nschubach (922175) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532138)

Why not link to: http://www.astro.gla.ac.uk/users/paulm/WRT/CrossBuilt/winetest-latest.exe [gla.ac.uk] instead? Isn't that guaranteed to be the latest?

Re:If you want to help: (1)

Daimanta (1140543) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532234)

True, but I normally go directly to the data pages. But you have a point. The next time an article about Wine appears I'll change the link to the one that is always correct.

By the way, the conformance is going A OK. They are a huge success and the number of reports is 5 times the usual. Thanks for the help, /.

Re:If you want to help: (1)

nschubach (922175) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532296)

I submitted mine. ;) I was mainly just curious. The link you posted had no date/time or evidence to point to it being the latest. I wasn't "calling you out." I was just trying to make sure the effort wasn't fruitless.

Re:If you want to help: (5, Funny)

mentaldrano (674767) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532238)

If you have a Windows installation
This is /. - almost everyone here runs Windows while secretly pretending to be a Linux guru.

The people who do run Linux pretend to run *BSD, to maintain their elite status.

No one actually runs *BSD except Theo de Raadt (he actually runs NetBSD, OpenBSD is a hoax) ~

Re:If you want to help: (1)

UncleTogie (1004853) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532532)

What if the test generates an error in d3d9_test.exe, and reboots the PC shortly thereafter?

Blue screen (1)

Psychotria (953670) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532990)

Well, that's interesting. I got a BSOD about 60% through the tests... not seen one of them in a while.

Re:If you want to help: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23533062)

got an explorer.exe crash but that's about it. submitted and hope it helps!

Re:If you want to help: (5, Interesting)

jeremy_white (598942) | more than 6 years ago | (#23533419)

If you have a Linux installation, then you can help with this:
http://wiki.winehq.org/MakeTestFailures [winehq.org]
and
http://wiki.winehq.org/ConformanceTests [winehq.org]

For those wondering where the latest data is: in http://test.winehq.org [winehq.org] , click on the "Last Modified" column twice, that will bring the latest data to the top.

Thanks to everyone who submitted data so far! We have enough reports for XP now, but any other version of Windows would be handy.

Be sure to run this again when wine-1.0-rc3 comes out next week.

Cheers,

Jeremy

Re:If you want to help: (1)

Mostly a lurker (634878) | more than 6 years ago | (#23533553)

Are you interested in the Minidumps if the test causes a BSOD?

Catch 22 situation (3, Interesting)

dr.Flake (601029) | more than 6 years ago | (#23530800)

Unfortunately,
If you look at the AppDb you'll see a lot of apps still not working 100%. F.i. Graphpad prism disappointed me last week. Most of them don't work because of some minor glitz. Before you say, well fix it you stupid, repairing them would introduce new regressions.

I think its mostly because of some "hacks" used by lazy/clever/performance programmer, but therefore very intolerant to a "windows-like" environment.

I hope Wine will get to the point, where it's influence will force programmers to stick to the specifications, as his/her boss is asking:" but will it also run under Wine???".

Ps. I hope the number of RC's will remain below 40.

Re:Catch 22 situation (3, Insightful)

SanityInAnarchy (655584) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532470)

I think its mostly because of some "hacks" used by lazy/clever/performance programmer, but therefore very intolerant to a "windows-like" environment.
Do you have anything to back this up?

Because Windows itself is incredibly hackish, especially when it comes to backwards compatibility. If Wine was simply striving to be a good Win32 implementation, they'd be pretty much done already -- someone developing an app, from the ground up, to be able to run on Windows and Wine shouldn't have too much more trouble than someone designing a web app, from the ground up, to run in IE and Firefox.

But Wine strives for bug-for-bug compatibility. There are a lot of bugs in Windows, and a lot of apps depend on those bugs.

I hope Wine will get to the point, where it's influence will force programmers to stick to the specifications, as his/her boss is asking:" but will it also run under Wine???".
That assumes something else -- that Windows sticks to the specs. On top of all of the above, Windows doesn't stick to the specs.

Microsoft Office 2003 bug fix (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23530970)

Bug fix 13343: Microsoft Office 2003 won't install
Great! Finally, I can install Wine without worrying about accidentally installing Office 2003.

Thanks, guys! Great work!

Does Wine work... (2, Interesting)

dargaud (518470) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531278)

I have tried Wine a few times without success and the documentation was sparse at the time. It has probably improved, but anyone cares to tell me:
- can you run a windows installer and then run the installed program ?
- can you do this also if the installer puts some dlls in the windows system directory ?
- what kind of programs won't work ? .NET ? ActiveX ? DirectX ?
- Photophop ?
- How much of a performance hit do you take ?

Re:Does Wine work... (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23531382)

-Yes, usually.
-Yes, usually.
-Specific programs don't work, not general categories.
-Mostly. Go check out its entry on "appDB.winehq.org" for specifics.
-Wine isn't an emulator. For programs that wine works properly with there is no performance hit.

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

Lonewolf666 (259450) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531452)

So far, the only program I have really tried is DOD:Source, a Steam game. But based on this:
-Running the installer worked
-I had to fiddle with the WINE registry a bit, fortunately some forum explained how to do that
-now DOD runs crash-free (since yesterday, RC1 still had a bug that made it crash)
-yes, DirectX works (good enough to support the HL2 engine, but probably not 100% complete yet)
-the performance hit is significant, so don't expect to run the very latest games on WINE yet

Re:Does Wine work... (2, Interesting)

Mad Merlin (837387) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531756)

-the performance hit is significant, so don't expect to run the very latest games on WINE yet

There's no inherent performance hit with using Wine, indeed many programs/games run at the same speed (or faster) than on Windows itself. The places where you see slowdown is typically where support is incomplete, possibly causing software fallbacks.

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

Lonewolf666 (259450) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531902)

Well, DOD is slower under WINE. At least with the default settings of WINE. I have not researched the exact cause of the slowdown, so it could be any of the following:
-The NVidia Linux drivers being inferior to the Windows ones (I'm running their closed source driver for Linux).
-more overhead in the Xserver compared to the Windows DirectX API
-overhead in WINE's translation from DirectX to OpenGL, including software fallbacks as you suggested.

Obviously not all of those would be the fault of the WINE team, and the results may differ for other games. Especially if the game uses OpenGL on Windows, in that case I'd expect the translation to Linux API calls to be much simpler.

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

SanityInAnarchy (655584) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532630)

My guess here is that it's mostly going to be either the NVidia Linux drivers, or the DirectX-in-OpenGL implementation.

The only games I've tried to get working under Wine lately are a small 2D MMO called Nexus TK, for which performance hardly matters (but it's nice to be able to force it into a window), and Warcraft III, which has some hidden OpenGL mode, and works flawlessly once you put it in that mode.

For the most part, though, I have a few games that are worth booting into Windows for, and which I'll be playing for large amounts of time. And then I have a few games that work well enough under Wine. But most of the games I play have native Linux versions -- most recently, Penny Arcade's Rainslick Precipice of Darkness.

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

SanityInAnarchy (655584) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532488)

I'm going to guess that most of the performance hit here is in the DirectX implementation, though I'm not sure. Are recent OpenGL games slower under Wine?

To take a much older example, Quake 3 Arena ran faster under Wine/Linux than it did under Windows 2000 (on the same machine), and the native Linux version was even faster than that. So any performance hit is really a particular implementation of Wine, combined with a particular app -- sometimes it's faster, sometimes it's slower, just like sometimes it works, and sometimes not.

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

pembo13 (770295) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531624)

Simply going to the winehq site will give you most, if not all that information.

Re:Does Wine work... (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23531694)

- can you run a windows installer and then run the installed program ?

Yes, unless the installer tries to do something that wine doesn't support.

- can you do this also if the installer puts some dlls in the windows system directory ?

Yes. Wine keeps its own windows system directory and applications can put their junk anywhere on the virtual C drive.

- what kind of programs won't work ? .NET ? ActiveX ? DirectX ?

I tried to install a .NET program the other day and it failed at the very end with an error I didn't understand. The program didn't work either.

- Photophop ?

Supposedly. You can look up support for applications at appdb.winehq.org

- How much of a performance hit do you take ?

It depends on the application. For some games there is no difference. For others, they are much slower.

Re:Does Wine work... (2, Interesting)

ACS Solver (1068112) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532004)

From personal experience:

- You can run a Windows installer, that's the normal way of installing software under Wine, in fact. Standard installers work fine most of the time.
- You need to override some DLLs for some application - fortunately it's easily done through wineconfig, and the Wine App DB is helpful in specifying settings that improve the compatibility for a certain app. Generally, installers that want to put stuff into c:\windows aren't a problem as Wine maintains a virtual C: drive.
- Some .NET apps may actually run natively if you use Mono. I've found Wine .NET support to be so-so. DirectX is well-supported. DX8 is fully supported, DX9 is for the most part. I've played Half-Life 2 successfully with Wine, although for the Episodes, you need to turn HDR off - that's an example of a missing DX9 feature in Wine. Sometimes you may take a performance hit if software fallbacks are required.
- Photoshop runs well. In fact, Photoshop is one of the applications that Wine 1.0 is supposed to run perfectly.
- Performance is very application-specific. Sometimes they'll run at Windows performance levels or even better. HL2 performed as well as on Windows for me, while Civilization 4 performs somewhat worse, and Oblivion (though it's been a long time since I ran it) performed considerably worse. The small utility applications I often use Wine for run as well as on Windows.

As a user, one of the bigger problems I notice with Wine are regression bugs. It's not uncommon for an app to work well in one version, be very much broken in the next, and so on. It's something frequently experienced with Deus Ex - sometimes Wine runs it perfectly, sometimes it crashes after startup. Wine generally avoids implementing application-specific code to make certain applications work properly, which sometimes makes compatibility difficult.

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

drspliff (652992) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532206)

I've found the Photoshop support in the latest point releases to still have quite a few issues.

Photoshop 7 is well supported and has been for a while.
CS is well supported although there are a few quirks.
CS2 works well enough to be usable, but activation is broken for numerous reasons (although a solution has been worked out).
CS3 doesn't work at all.

Considering I've spent a great deal of time and money on training and software, and regularly depend on the features of CS2 and CS3, only being able to use CS and Photoshop 7 is a real downer.

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

edschurr (999028) | more than 6 years ago | (#23533265)

Running Windows in a virtual machine and Photoshop CS3 on top of it might work. I have a dual-core Pentium D 2.8 Ghz and 4 GB of fast memory and am optimistic that I can get it running, well even, based on the anecdotes I've read. However I'm still comparing VMware, VirtualBox, Xen and QEMU and haven't tried anything yet.

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

Ceriel Nosforit (682174) | more than 6 years ago | (#23534359)

CS3 doesn't work at all.
Windows users frequently have the same issue with CS3, so that's not saying much. ;)

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

rts008 (812749) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532176)

Best results for me with Kubuntu 7.10 and 8.04 have been to install WINE from the distro repository, then run wineconfig to *sort of like* get a combination of 'control panel' and 'device manager', set this up, then for example:
I popped in an install cd for Fallout, navigated to the cd in Konqueror, right clicked on the 'setup.exe' file, selcted 'run with wine' and it was just like being on windows after that until I exited the finished install.
To further the "Windows" experience, you can then go your applications button (Kmenu for me), go to Wine, then you will have four entries:
1. Programs-select this and it will list the installed app's folder, then the .exe that starts the app- just like using the Windows Start button to launch an app.

You can also use a file manager to do the same- /home/.wine/drive_c/Program Files/yadda yadda yadda.

Or even better open a terminal and just launch the app in wine.

I set up wine in win98 compatibility mode, as the games I like are a bit old and just run better in 98 than xp.

And the forums and online Doc's are a lot better than they used to be. That's how this n00b got back to playing Fallout and Fallout2.

Unfortuneately, I have not been able to get Tom Clancey's SSN to work. :(

Basically, I'm 2 out of 5:
Fallout, Fallout 2 both work great.
SSN, Flanker 2.0, and Connectix Virtual Game Station, no go-

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

mscdex (774392) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532576)

As far as .NET support goes, I can attest that managed C++ (console) applications work for me under Wine as of the latest releases. This is important because it may be a long time before Mono is able to support managed C++ applications at all. But for pretty much all other cases, Mono is probably your better bet to get .NET code running. Especially with the recent announcement with regards to WinForms 2.0 support.

Re:Does Wine work... (2, Informative)

SanityInAnarchy (655584) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532608)

- can you run a windows installer and then run the installed program ?
Integration is fairly good, for a single user. With the standard Ubuntu Wine package, you can double-click on EXEs to run them. Installers work fine, and at least on Kubuntu, they can install working shortcuts to your desktop, and the Windows start menu is under the K-menu, under "Wine" (so I can go K->Wine->Programs->Accessories->Notepad, for example).

- can you do this also if the installer puts some dlls in the windows system directory ?
Wine lives in ~/.wine, with a fake C drive at ~/.wine/drive_c (by default). So I don't really see any reason this wouldn't work -- the DLL would go in ~/.wine/drive_c/windows/wherever.

However, drivers won't work, for obvious reasons. In very few instances, there will be a separate project to wrap a DLL for Linux -- captive ntfs, ndiswrapper, etc -- but these are considered workarounds until a native, open Linux version can be written.

- what kind of programs won't work ? .NET ? ActiveX ? DirectX ?
DirectX works fine, but won't be as fast as OpenGL. Don't know about ActiveX, but you can run up to IE6 under Wine, and (last I checked) you can use the IE7 engine in IE6 -- and, going the other way, Wine can embed a Gecko engine for when an app requests a web browser via ActiveX (for example, the MOTD on Counter-Strike servers is HTML).

Haven't looked into .NET in awhile. If it's a pure .NET project, there's a separate project for that: Mono. [mono-project.com] Because .NET is compile-once, run anywhere, like Java, a .NET app running under Mono should do about as well as it does under Windows. Because .NET on Windows is so tightly integrated, and makes it so easy to call out to native DLLs, many .NET apps don't work under Mono, and never will.

I believe there are voodoo ways of combining Mono and Wine, but I don't know how to do that. I don't know if Microsoft's own .NET runtime works under Wine.

- Photophop ?
What's Photophop?

Seriously, look it up yourself: Most apps are listed at AppDB [winehq.com] , and PhotoShop CS2 is listed as Platinum [winehq.org] , which is the highest possible rating.

- How much of a performance hit do you take ?
Again, look at AppDB. It depends on the app whether it will run at all, and how fast it will run. Some apps -- even some games -- run faster under Wine than under Windows. Some run slower. Most, especially office apps, have no perceptible difference, so I don't usually care to benchmark it.

For me, by now, the procedure for testing a Wine app is to first, try it on a clean ~/.wine (or set WINEPREFIX -- I actually regularly keep multiple Wine directories around) -- if it works in the simplest way possible, I'll do that. Otherwise, especially if it's a game (and especially if it's a Blizzard game, which defaults to DirectX but can be coerced into OpenGL mode), Google for that app under Wine, and check AppDB.

If I find a workable solution, I use it. Otherwise, I boot a real Windows, either natively or in a VM. I'm not a Wine developer, and I don't want to be.

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

Spy der Mann (805235) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532728)

Most of the time i use WINE to run games and windows-only emulators. For serious work, I use linux or cross-platform apps.

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

RichMan (8097) | more than 6 years ago | (#23533803)

I run World of Warcraft.

- installer runs
- C:\Program_Files C:\.. all exist fake hierarchy
- very little performance hit some things are faster

Re:Does Wine work... (1)

Ceriel Nosforit (682174) | more than 6 years ago | (#23534301)

I run Photoshop and Guild Wars under Wine on UbuntuStudio.

Guild Wars has no anti-alias under Wine, and consequently the performance is better than on Windows. I've seen a few graphical glitches, but they're nowhere near as bad as under Cedega.

No more Corel Wine support, thanks to Microsoft (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23531558)

Why isn't Microsoft working with the Wine project?

Why hasn't Microsoft absolved the Wine project from any lawsuits?

Where is Microsoft doing anything to increase interoperability with Linux and Windows as they have said they were several times?

Where is DirectX for Linux from Microsoft?

Why does Microsoft have an interoperability forum on their website where you can discuss it but no ports of their software for Linux? How many years and versions of Microsoft Office, Media Player, Internet Explorer, and other tools have been released without a Linux version for purchase (and the latter examples, for download)?

Why should we have to rely on Wine, Cedega, and other projects to attempt support for Windows programs on Linux when Microsoft has claimed they were all about Open Source and interoperability?

When will justice come down on Microsoft for its crimes? Is the Department of Justice blind?

Where is the law in the USA? In the palms greased by Microsoft money?

Corel was working towards Wine version 1 when they entered an agreement with Microsoft, and shortly after did away with Corel Linux and Wine funding/support. Thanks Microsoft, I thought you weren't anti-Linux like those Corel people said years ago, what a fucking joke!

Re:No more Corel Wine support, thanks to Microsoft (1)

Tubal-Cain (1289912) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531924)

Troll, but I'll bite.

Why isn't Microsoft working with the Wine project?
Why should they help a direct competitor?

Why hasn't Microsoft absolved the Wine project from any lawsuits?
What can MS sue them for?

Where is Microsoft doing anything to increase interoperability with Linux and Windows as they have said they were several times?
Some work with Novell in the network integration area, and they (begrudgingly) handed over neccisary details of AD to SAMBA.

Where is DirectX for Linux from Microsoft?
Why would we want that? I think we would prefer that games be written in OpenGL.

Why does Microsoft have an interoperability forum on their website where you can discuss it but no ports of their software for Linux? How many years and versions of Microsoft Office, Media Player, Internet Explorer, and other tools have been released without a Linux version for purchase (and the latter examples, for download)? Why should we have to rely on Wine, Cedega, and other projects to attempt support for Windows programs on Linux when Microsoft has claimed they were all about Open Source and interoperability?
Because it looks good to the press. We all have known that for some time now.

When will justice come down on Microsoft for its crimes? Is the Department of Justice blind?
Thursday

Re:No more Corel Wine support, thanks to Microsoft (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23533166)

typical non-informative MS shill response. Do you like eggs, Ballmer monkey munchkin?

Increment (1)

fulldecent (598482) | more than 6 years ago | (#23531640)

It seems like incremental reporting would be useful here. If everyone stops sending reports starting at test #5, they can be reasonably sure that test #5 is crashing.

Ran the test and... (1)

another joe (1132353) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532050)

Several error msgs from windows,didn't send info. Should have for the heck of it. Said it uploaded test results. Completed with no desktop icons, background ok. Rebooted from task manager. Icons rearranged. Searched for new hardware. Sound drivers? Killed firefox. Had to download with IE and reinstall. Hope the test helped.

15 years in the making... (1)

Donniedarkness (895066) | more than 6 years ago | (#23532988)

I'm wondering if it'll run The Sims 2.... That's the only thing that my girlfriend misses about Windows.

Regardless, WINE is an amazing project.

Re:15 years in the making... (1)

nawcom (941663) | more than 6 years ago | (#23533321)

http://appdb.winehq.org/appview.php?iAppId=1942 [winehq.org] nope, sorry to ruin your evening. However, Sims 2 has a Mac OS X version, and with a little help [osx86project.org] You can run it on your PC. I was first a linux user, and when I studied up on the bsd backend of OS X, I became interested. OS X comes with X11, so you can compile most unix(ala linux included) apps on OS X. Anyway, hope this sortof helps

No Mac binaries (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23534177)

STILL no native build for OS X.

Favoritism to CrossOver, perhaps?
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