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Real Racing In the Virtual World

timothy posted more than 6 years ago | from the actually-the-other-way-around dept.

Emulation (Games) 170

zebadee writes "The BBC has a story about a company aiming to pit gamers against the professionals. iOpener Media has a patented system that sucks in real-time GPS data from racing events and pumps it out to compatible games consoles and PCs. This means you can race in real-time against the like of Lewis Hamilton, Felipe Massa and Kimi Raikkonen. The company also claims to have an AI that solves the problem of overtaking and crashes." It would be great to see this applied to historical events and other game domains, too -- like trying to beat Amundsen to the South Pole, using best-known weather data.

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170 comments

I'm pretty sure... (5, Informative)

BZWingZero (1119881) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773361)

I'm pretty sure the Rocket Racing league is planning something similar.
According to the Wikipedia [wikipedia.org] , they are planning a game which will allow people to compete virtually along with actual racers.

Re:I'm pretty sure... (1)

Goldberg's Pants (139800) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774551)

Wasn't this done years and years ago? There was some software in the late 90's that did just this. I remember it being advertised in PC Gamer and the like. I think it used CART racing data, or possibly Toyota Atlantic. Can't for the life of me remember the name though.

And it's easy to beat Lewis Hamilton. Just make it out the pitlane in one piece.

Re:I'm pretty sure... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23775059)

like trying to beat Amundsen to the South Pole, using best-known weather data.

Or trying to shag his wife whilst he's away, using best-known titty data.

(the CAPTCHA is 'bosoms', har har har)

Re:I'm pretty sure... (1)

Per Wigren (5315) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775695)

Amundsen was unmarried.

Sports entertainment on slashdot (-1, Redundant)

vikstar (615372) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773371)

first post!

Re:Sports entertainment on slashdot (5, Funny)

wagnerrp (1305589) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773443)

Sadly... you fail.

Re:Sports entertainment on slashdot (1)

KGIII (973947) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774567)

I'm reminded of those folks who "try to commit suicide..." I mean, what the hell? If they tried, and failed, how the hell CAN they go on with their lives?

Re:Sports entertainment on slashdot (0, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23773467)

Awww, c'mon, how is this off topic? It is about interaction in a live racing event, and I won first post.

In real time? Sounds awfully complicated... (5, Insightful)

gapagos (1264716) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773375)

I mean it requires so much investment in live distribution of data and all that stuff, for probably a poor recreation of the actual professional performance...

What's wrong with a little delay, let the programmers watch the replays and all reliable information to create an accurate "Ghost" representation of the professional racer that can be later downloaded through a bonus pack or something?

That sounds so much easier to do, cheaper as well, and now that I think about it... why wasn't this thing thought of before? It doesn't need to be live at all.

Although I agree that live would probably be more exciting... but does even 1% of racing gamers actually KNOW precicely the days and times of each race start around the world?

Like last weekend was the Montreal F1 Grand Prix, and I believe that the official race was on Sunday, but I have no clue at what time it started, and the city is barely a 1h30 drive from mine, for hell's sake...

Sounds pretty pointless (5, Insightful)

EmbeddedJanitor (597831) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773471)

A major limiting factor for any RealWorld racing etc is self preservation. In other words, the risk analysis to determine how fast you are prepared to drive without killing yourself.

The virtual world racers have no such risks.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (5, Funny)

gapagos (1264716) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773509)

That is totally true.
Although imho you would replace "killing yourself" with "destroying your employer's vehicle which costs millions of dollars and forever to repair".

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (5, Insightful)

Cairnarvon (901868) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773557)

At least if you crash into something you're pretty much guaranteed to have all cameras on you, thereby giving the your advertisers more screen time. It balances out.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (5, Insightful)

gapagos (1264716) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773579)

Yes but does a company really like its logo been smashed into thousand of pieces of scrap metal?

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (1)

Psychotria (953670) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773683)

Not sure. Can't they paint a new one?

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (3, Informative)

Joebert (946227) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774161)

Only when there's hordes of people watching and nobody gets hurt.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (1)

StarkRG (888216) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774187)

Yeah, isn't that something they often go out of their way to do? Granted it's usually done with CG, but the effect is the same...

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23774329)

Yes.

You have to understand, the point of paying that much money is screen time and exposure, no matter what kind.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23774351)

As long as it has eyes on it, yes.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (5, Funny)

vux984 (928602) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774223)

Although imho you would replace "killing yourself" with "destroying your employer's vehicle which costs millions of dollars and forever to repair".

One of my favorite quotes from a driving instructor/professional driver was "If the driver doesn't come back with just the steering wheel once in a while, the rest of the team thinks he's not trying hard enough."

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (1)

KGIII (973947) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774585)

I'm not sure but that might be the best quote ever. Someone mod it up as "FRIGGEN HILLARIOUS AND SERIOUS ALL AT THE SAME TIME" or the likes.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (1)

p0tat03 (985078) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773601)

True, though this effect can be lessened by increasing the penalty for killing your virtual self.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (2, Funny)

dogdick (1290032) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773693)

Like the disk breaks and you can't play anymore.
Solved, I win. THats brain power in action. Now, to just retrofit all those Ps3s, xboxes and pcs with a mechanism to break the disk and trick people into buying it...

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (1)

smorken (990019) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774163)

Thats not enough penalty. What about wireless electrodes on the balls. They could set it up so they are surgically attached as part of the user agreement when you buy the console. Then when people say their PS3 has them by the balls it really wont just be a figure of speech.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (1)

Admiral Ag (829695) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774475)

Stop giving Microsoft ideas!!!

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (3, Funny)

Slimee (1246598) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774469)

Nah man, let's make it easier, at least for the xbox. When you crash, your xbox bricks and it's game over for you.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (-1, Troll)

maglor_83 (856254) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773733)

Everyone knows that racers aren't smart enough to fear death.

Yay generalizations! (1)

GameboyRMH (1153867) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773905)

You watch a few stupid movies (Talladega Nights was comedy, BTW) and now all racers are stupid. If only you had a clue...

On the other hand, fearing death and intelligence are pretty much completely unrelated IMO.

Re:Yay generalizations! (1)

lnjasdpppun (625899) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774125)

While they aren't stupid, I don't think they have much fear of crashing. Most racing cars are incredibly safe and the drivers themselves have learned over years of practice to not be scared of plowing into a wall because the fear itself will slow them down.

Re:Yay generalizations! No kidding (2, Interesting)

Toll_Free (1295136) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774323)

Being a racer myself, my uncle having held three world records, was one of the founders of ASRA, etc (as well as sitting here with a double compound fracture in my rt leg, broken hip and broken shoulder, all rt side), I can tell you this. It isn't fear, it's respect. My cousin was killed by his dad's car. In the garage, of all places. A malfunction on an electric switch activated the trans-brake and when they switched from alcohol to nitromethane, the car leaped forward and the wing of the dragster hit him in the head. He (my cousin)"acted" fearless, but at the same time, he rarely, if ever, had the throttle wide open on his quads, trucks or anything else he had. Before I learned the restraint that came with respect, I wrecked one of his quads, breaking my nose (simple wreck). Incidentally, my current accident was a mechanical failure.. Lucky to be alive, life-flight said. I won't be touching a bike again for a few years, I can tell you that much. Also, hope the paragraphs work this time. Last two posts where horrible with no line breaks. --Toll_Free

Re:Yay generalizations! No kidding (1)

Andrew Kismet (955764) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774505)

Next to the Preview and Submit options, there's the option for "Plain Old Text" or "HTML Formatted". Change it back to Plain old text and it'll be correctly formatted as you've done it within the textarea.

If you do it using HTML formatted, you're expected to insert your own <br / tags to create line breaks.

Re:Yay generalizations! No kidding (1)

KGIII (973947) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774611)

+1 Helping a Guy on Narcotic. (Sorry but had to say it. Been there myself.)

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (1)

Samah (729132) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774265)

Solution: If you "die", the game deletes itself from your hard drive, forcing you to reinstall. That gives you a pretty decent reason for self preservation. ;)

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (4, Insightful)

vux984 (928602) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774331)

In other words, the risk analysis to determine how fast you are prepared to drive without killing yourself.

Unlike games, and street racing, in professional race conditions, drivers are usually going as fast as they can go without losing control. The question is more about control (holding the line, maintaining ideal friction during turns), and efficiency (drafting, tire wear, fuel). Its really not about going faster. They're pushing the car as hard as they can.

In my limited race track experience the gas pedal is usually floored, except when the brakes are floored. And choosing when to switch from one to the other is part of holding the line. The only exception is through tight S-curves - where you are still going as fast as you can go while holding the line go without your wheels losing traction.

There is rarely a situation where a driver could be going faster, and not be immediately involved in an accident.

Risk analysis is a factor, to be sure, but good professional drivers are pretty good at getting right up against the edge of losing control without going over.

Personally I think the vast majority of gamers will lose to the pros everytime if the simulation is any good. It is much harder to gauge where the control line is in a video game... you don't have the g-force feedback, nor the feel of the tires that you'd have in real life. A pro driver can tell the difference without even trying between wet track, dry track, tell his air pressure is off, how worn his tires are, how warm his tires are, and how tight a turn he can take at what speed without slipping more than 10-15% based on all that ... when was the last time you played a game where that was really relevant...or that you could really tell the difference?

For the gamers to stand a chance the simulations will have to be markedly more forgiving than the real world... and that sort of defeats the point.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (2)

KGIII (973947) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774641)

How about crash metrics? If the crash is bad enough they're out for the season. If not so bad their out for the race our out for however long a "typical" pit crew would take to get that car back on the track? (I fully support a full body suit and VR with true impact at real G-Force level for this bugger just so I can watch them but I'm a crotchety old bastard.)

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (1)

KGIII (973947) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774577)

With F1 cars the data transmitted is insane. This strikes me as one of the projects FAR MORE suited for F/OSS than proprietary. Yes, yes this is me saying this.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (5, Interesting)

Burning1 (204959) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774661)

Have you ever raced? Because I have.

A racer interested in self preservation usually only reduces his speed by about 5%-10% of what is theoretically possible. Most motorcycle racers use lines that provide space to recover if they exceed traction limits, usually at the cost of position or lap times. Most racers use a delayed apex line that allows the driver to get on the throttle hard and early. If the vehicle does start to go out of control, there is usually plenty of room to recover.

Because exceeding the limits can be recovered, and because it usually reduces lap times, I highly doubt that being able to run near maximum speed would provide a significant advantage. After all, a casual gamer is just as likely as a racer to botch a corner and go off-line. If doing so hurts lap times badly enough, there is not a real advantage in getting so close to the edge.

The biggest advantage a simulated racer will have is that simulations tend to be a little watered down from reality, and are usually more predictable. Top gear had an excellent video on the matter, where Jeremy Clarkson attempted to beat his GT4 time in reality using the same car (Acura NSX) and course (Laguna Seca.) I'm sure you can find the video on YouTube.

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (1)

Racemaniac (1099281) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775149)

GT4, a simulation? seriously?
yeah, it's a bit more realistic than your average racer, but i really find it too bad that top gear didn't go for some decent driving sim... those half sim, half arcade games on consoles aren't even close to being a sim...

Re:Sounds pretty pointless (1)

SoupIsGoodFood_42 (521389) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775013)

Doesn't that apply to pretty much all computer games?

Re:In real time? Sounds awfully complicated... (4, Insightful)

wagnerrp (1305589) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773503)

let the programmers watch the replays and all reliable information to create an accurate "Ghost" representation of the professional racer
I think doing time trials against a professional ghost would be interesting, but actually racing against them is worthless. Once you reach them (or they reach you), and the AI kicks in, you're no longer racing the professional, but against the AI.

Re:In real time? Sounds awfully complicated... (2, Insightful)

dogdick (1290032) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773743)

The ghost person also doesn't know you are next to them, so they won't try tactics that slow other racers down in real life. Of course the AI could do it, but then its not real, and it would also affect where the ghost racer is . . . then the GPS would be off. Wee.

Re:In real time? Sounds awfully complicated... (1)

maglor_83 (856254) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773713)

I knew it started at 3AM Melbourne time. If you are into that sort of thing, you know it. Because its not as if its hard to find out. Formula1.com even converts it to your local time for you!

Re:In real time? Sounds awfully complicated... (4, Interesting)

drsquare (530038) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774107)

Although I agree that live would probably be more exciting... but does even 1% of racing gamers actually KNOW precicely the days and times of each race start around the world?
I'd suggest the opposite problem: the people who would be most interested in this, would be actually watching the race rather than playing games.

P.S. Lewis Hamilton, please stop crashing.

Re:In real time? Sounds awfully complicated... (2, Funny)

thatnerdguy (551590) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774801)

P.S. Lewis Hamilton, please stop crashing.


More like Red light means stop, mmmkay???

Re:In real time? Sounds awfully complicated... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23775625)

Although I agree that live would probably be more exciting... but does even 1% of racing gamers actually KNOW precicely the days and times of each race start around the world?

Like last weekend was the Montreal F1 Grand Prix, and I believe that the official race was on Sunday, but I have no clue at what time it started, and the city is barely a 1h30 drive from mine, for hell's sake...


Yeah, it's so difficult to use google to find the F1 calendar on the F1 website, select the race you're interested in and then click on the 'convert to my local times' button to see a detailed schedule adjusted for your local time zone. I think you'd have to be a rocket scientist *and* a brain surgeon to figure that out.

I want to race (1, Flamebait)

Monkey_Genius (669908) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773383)

Against Mario Andretti, Jackie Stewart, Niki Lauda, The Unser brothers, Dale Earnhardt, Cale Yarborough, Donnie Allison, Phil Hiil, Graham Hill, Tazio Nuvolari and all the other great names from racing's past. The current crop of drivers in motor racing are just so homogenized and boring.

Re:I want to race (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23773441)

Danica isn't homogenized or boring. Va va voom!

Re:I want to race (1)

KGIII (973947) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774669)

I'm being pedantic tonight... This is hardly "informative" even amongst the slashdot crowd.

What would *really* be cool (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23773387)

Feed the GPS data from cars stuck on the 405 in LA into the on-car computers during the Indy 500.

Re:What would *really* be cool (2, Funny)

amRadioHed (463061) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774447)

What's the point of live GPS updates from a parked vehicle?

Should be somewhat easier to beat them (1)

the_humeister (922869) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773389)

Especially given that the real drivers have to worry about crashing and losing a car whereas the gamer can just restart. On the other hand, perhaps it can help the driver himself since he can't be on the track 24/7.

All kinds of games!!! (5, Funny)

phantomfive (622387) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773399)

This would make The Oregon Trail new again!!

Or how about, Poll Chasing With the Best: On the Trail With Barak and Hillary.

Or Across the Ocean With Thor Heyerdahl: The Rowing Game.

Maybe from historical data we can recreate the spreading pattern of the black plague. Across Europe: A Flea's Tale.

The potential is limitless.

everyone has unique tastes (1)

xzvf (924443) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773409)

Not to begrudge a person of their fantasy, but following a bunch of dogs in the Antarctic at 10 miles a day sounds like it might be a niche market for this device. Real question... Is this a unique enough idea to be patented?

Re:everyone has unique tastes (1)

maglor_83 (856254) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773761)

Is this a unique enough idea to be patented?
I don't think its too bad. Certainly a hell of a lot better than a crapload of other stuff that gets patented, but that's not really saying anything.

Revisit "historical events". (5, Funny)

arthurpaliden (939626) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773411)

You could actually go to the cantina and see that Han Solo actually did shoot first.

Re:Revisit "historical events". (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23773967)

star wars is for fucking faggot dick smokers. shut the fuck up!!! shut up!!!! fuck star wars. it's a faggot movie. only faggots like it. get over your fucking youth and do something real. fuck that faggot shit. burn it and flush it down the shitter with all the faggots and their pr0n. fuck it.

Re:Revisit "historical events". (4, Funny)

Admiral Ag (829695) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774495)

star wars is for fucking faggot dick smokers. shut the fuck up!!! shut up!!!! fuck star wars. it's a faggot movie. only faggots like it. get over your fucking youth and do something real. fuck that faggot shit. burn it and flush it down the shitter with all the faggots and their pr0n. fuck it.
Wow, I had no idea. I've just thrown out my DVD box set and signed up for hetero restoration therapy.

Thank you Anonymous Coward for saving me.

Re:Revisit "historical events". (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23774799)

get over your fucking youth and do something real. fuck that faggot shit.

Like posting in the gaming section of Slashdot?

Re:Revisit "historical events". (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23774225)

Pah, LSW2 had this "technology" years ago. ;)

That's the worst idea I've ever heard in my life (5, Interesting)

iamdrscience (541136) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773417)

It would be great to see this applied to historical events and other game domains, too -- like trying to beat Amundsen to the South Pole, using best-known weather data.
This is horrible, this idea.

The possibilities are interesting, but the most exciting idea you can think of is a game where you spend 3+ months riding behind sled dogs across the Antarctic tundra? Sounds like Penn & Teller's Desert Bus [wikipedia.org] .

I mean, don't get me wrong, Roald Amundsen was an interesting guy with a great story, but that doesn't mean it would make a good videogame.

Re:That's the worst idea I've ever heard in my lif (4, Funny)

gapagos (1264716) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773493)

Don't worry.
We already have Dr. Mario; Paper Mario; Mario Tennis; Mario Kart; Mario Golf; Mario Baseball; Mario Pinball; Mario Party; Mario Soccer; Mario at the Olympics Games...
(See complete list at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Mario_games_by_genre [wikipedia.org] )

I'm sure we'll have Mario Antartica soon enough.
Just like Mario Cooking; Mario teethbrushing; Mario Ironing; Mario Masturbating...

WarioWare (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773547)

Just like Mario Cooking; Mario teethbrushing; Mario Ironing; Mario Masturbating...
No, those are more Wario games, three seconds at a time.

Re:That's the worst idea I've ever heard in my lif (0, Redundant)

Dun Malg (230075) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774607)

I'm sure we'll have Mario Antartica soon enough..
AntARCtica! It's fucking antarctica! AGH!

it should work well on the Wii (1)

Moraelin (679338) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775339)

Mario Masturbating


Well, that sounds like it would work perfectly with a wiimote.

Plus, they've already done something like that to Conker [wikipedia.org] . A cutesy, kids' games squirrel turned into a serial-cussing, heavy-drinking, shit-dodging maniac. (And I mean, really, dodging dollops of feces.) Apparently just to make a point that Nintendo isn't a kiddies-only company any more, and now publishes that kind of stuff too. And as a bonus, why wait for deviant fanfic to rape your childhood memories and favourite characters, when you can get it done professionally by its creators?

So I'm kinda still waiting for when they get such ideas like, say, Mario or Link finally fucks the princess. I mean, seriously, after how often those guys save the princess, you'd think she'd put out by now. Hold the wiimote at your crotch and thrust. It's got sensors for that kind of thing, doesn't it? Maybe they'll even figure out how to use the balance board in it too ;)

Or for the all-important casual-gaming female demographic, something like Zelda's Vibrator Training. You know, while Link is busy with his crossbow ;)

Or how about playing the kidnapper and having some BDSM sessions with the princess? If the wiimote can be used as a tennis racket, why not as, say, a whip or paddle handle? ;)

And for the really deviant market segment, Mario Goatse. I'll let you figure that out on your own ;)

Re:That's the worst idea I've ever heard in my lif (1)

dredwerker (757816) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775579)

but if you make it lego Amundsen then it would be a hit ....

South Pole Position (1)

tverbeek (457094) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773421)

Would this Race-To-The-Pole game also include simulated frostbite?

Re:South Pole Position (4, Funny)

edgr (781723) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773551)

Maybe. Just like force-feedback controllers, you could put a cooling unit in the controller so your hands get very cold.

How would this work... (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23773463)

You can't really call it a race when the gamer sees and reacts to the real drivers, but the real drivers don't see or react to the gamers, can you?

Re:How would this work... (1, Interesting)

CptPicard (680154) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773559)

They claim to have some sort of adaptation AI there, but one would still have to keep the world in "sync" over longer periods of time... otherwise differences would just accumulate. So I suppose if some computer car needs to slow down because of you, it will just magically accelerate back to its current position or something... doesn't sound too realistic :)

Re:How would this work... (1)

rrohbeck (944847) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774581)

Easily fixed. All you need is a few RC cars.

Re:How would this work... (1)

Skippy_kangaroo (850507) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774887)

Sure you can. It's called Gran Turismo 1,2,3 and 4. The longest, loudest and most universal complaint about the AI is that it behaves like the gamer isn't there. If the Gran Turismo series can have such stellar sales despite this, I don't see that it would be much of a problem for this game.

Worthless (4, Insightful)

chanrobi (944359) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773531)

As a fairly new but hardcore motor racing simulation fanatic (F1 challenge, rFactor, GTR2, GPL) this article is just a load of hogwash. First, simply pumping the GPS data from real racecars into an online track is useless. Why?

Because you cannot replicate exactly

1) the track itself, the bumps, kerbs, asphalt, track layout
2) track conditions at the time the gps data for the "real" racers cars, ambient temp, track temp, rubber laid down by previous sessions, debris etc.
3) car setup (good luck getting real time telemtry of all the parameters of the car from the real F1 teams), this would reveal too much information to competitors

These 3 factors combine to change grip and ultimately laptimes.

As anyone who has raced competitively online will tell you - lap times in the virtual world is incomparable to real world runs with the same cars, same track. As a small example, some of the best line sim race drivers in the world are doing = 1.17 laptimes on the '02 version of silverstone in F1C. While the fastest lap in the real world was a 1:18.9.

Almost 2s difference. Which is huge. This is one example of many. The only way this situation can be rectified is by making a hyper realisitc simulation that has never been seen before or, start fudging grip, engine power and other statistics. Which by the way the article says it won't do because "it defeats the point". Yeah right.

Re:Worthless (4, Funny)

Psychotria (953670) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773735)

You are right. A better idea would be to get Mythbusters to hack up a remote-controlled car or two that we can put on the real race track. And when we lose horribly, blow it up.

Re:Worthless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23773839)

No way of replicating the pulling of +2Gs going around corners either.

Re:Worthless (1)

gethoht (757871) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773915)

I agree... Also, the real life racers are not aware or responding to your car and what it is doing on the track. They don't know your presence on the track and are therefore at a severe disadvantage.

All in all it is just a game, and does sound like alot of fun to me!

Re:Worthless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23775549)

I'm also an hardcore simracer, having organised major national simracing championships in France.

I find also this idea stupid, and I must add we don't really need it : a lot of professionnal drivers are now also racing online with us just for the fun.

I now some nascar drivers (like Dale Earnard JR) even organise their own online nascar league and in our championship, we had the chance to race against Robert Kubica in the Richard Burns Rally sim before he entered F1. Most racing drivers we see today used to play racing games and they join us naturally.

So the best is still to race with them online :)

Games just aren't reality. (5, Interesting)

elynnia (815633) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773591)

Jeremy Clarkson did an interesting segment on Top Gear a while when he drove around a racetrack in the very same car but once in Gran Turismo 4, and then in real life.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rkdWkAs9qmo [youtube.com]

He points out that no matter how realistic a game is, it is just not a real-life experience:
"The one thing I've learned today... is that you can have the skill to get this car around here in 1:40, and it could do 1:40... [but] it's that part of your brain that makes you frightened."

Of course, games are essentially there to entertain, and I'm sure that a lot of people will enjoy racing against the professionals from the comfort of their own couch. But just because you can play Guitar Hero and have a blast of a time doing so, it doesn't necessarily mean you can play the guitar.

Aly =]

Re:Games just aren't reality. (1)

Psychotria (953670) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773863)

Excellent link. And I bet he's a better driver than me.

Re:Games just aren't reality. (1)

trawg (308495) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774437)

But just because you can play Guitar Hero and have a blast of a time doing so, it doesn't necessarily mean you can play the guitar.
What if you can fly a plane in a flight simulator?!

Re:Games just aren't reality. (1)

Racemaniac (1099281) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775181)

yeah, gran turismo a sim -_-

i found it such a shame that they went for gran turismo. couldn't he have gone for something that's actually a sim... like the games of simbin, or things like live for speed and rfactor (haven't played those yet, but heard they are also good sims).

yeah, gran turismo may be a bit more realistic than your average racer. but it's still very unrealistic and simple. as if they'd ever make a true sim for a playstation or xbox, console gamers are obviously not the audience for such things.

Re:Games just aren't reality. (1)

DMUTPeregrine (612791) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775417)

That's what Guitar Rising [wikipedia.org] looks to be for: Guitar hero with a real guitar.

I see a big hole (3, Interesting)

jollyreaper (513215) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773625)

The real-world racers will not be reacting to the presence of the gamers. Hitting Speed Racist's car in a video game won't cause him to spin out in real life, though that would be a great WTF moment if it did. At best this will be like singing along with a pre-recorded tape, it'll look good but it won't be the same as actually performing with a real band who can improvise and react to your own performance.

Actually, this is making me think of the old Captain Power toys where you could wave the fighter at the screen while the show was on and your ship would "explode" (pop apart due to springs) if it got "hit" by an enemy robot. The funny thing is, those Captain Power toys would be entirely kick-ass today with our gaming systems and 3D controllers. The fighters were held by pistol grips with the part. For a modern version, make the pistol grip a detachable mount containing the electronics for a wireless controller for a system like Wii or the 360. The fighter part can be a stand-alone toy that can also be mounted atop the controller when playing the video game. From there, the fighter's attitude would control the action on the screen. The toy would respond to what's going on with appropriate vibration, lights, and sound effects. When sufficiently damaged, the whole thing can sproing apart just like Captain Planet's fighters did. And to really merchandise the situation, the game itself would have full storylines to go with each fighter and presumably the character that goes along with it. So you beat the game once with the blue fighter, that's nice, but the red fighter has a full story arc to play through as well. The game is included in the box with the fighter, essentially the same game each time but with different cinematics to go with the new character.

Something like this would be very successful.

Go Speed Racist Go! (5, Funny)

GameboyRMH (1153867) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774001)

Hitting Speed Racist's car
Here he comes! Here comes Speed Racist!
He's a bigot on wheels, he's a bigot
and he's gonna be hatin' on someone.

He's a racist so don't let him meet your friends,
If you do they might not talk to you again,

And when people are the wrong color
Or come from the wrong place,
You bet your life Speed Racist
will get all red-faced,

Go Speed Racist
Go Speed Racist
Go Speed Racist, Go!

May I be the first to make a Snow Crash reference? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23773647)

Can I race against Hiro Protagonist?

Sucks in realtime (1)

mefcon1 (671610) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773701)

Must be a Windows-based solution.

Race to the South Pole (3, Funny)

GMThomas (1115405) | more than 6 years ago | (#23773753)

"like trying to beat Amundsen to the South Pole, using best-known weather data." I've always wanted to play a game where after twelve hours of doing the exact same thing in a region that looks exactly the same no matter where you are, you still haven't gotten very far! The left arrow key will make you step with your left foot, and the right arrow key will make you step with your right. Careful not to hit one twice in a row - you will trip! Don't trip too much, or you might lose! Also, don't forget to rest and eat. Repeat this a few dozen times!

Re:Race to the South Pole (1)

hefa (133288) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774053)

I've always wanted to play a game where after twelve hours of doing the exact same thing ... you still haven't gotten very far! ... Also, don't forget to rest and eat. Repeat this a few dozen times!
You should try WoW!

Re:Race to the South Pole (1)

rubies (962985) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774501)

You might think that's funny, but the original version of Indy 500 for the PC was essentially that - especially if you tried racing the 500 in real time. Think 2+ hours sitting in front of the computer pressing left and right arrow, while blocky, pixelated tunnel vision burns into the back of your retinas. Ahh, those were the days.

Re:Race to the South Pole (1)

jamesh (87723) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774745)

That one was available on the Amiga too. You could use the mouse which made cornering much easier, but if you moved it too far you got a visit from the guru.

The thing I loved about that game was that it took a few seconds of loading, a few clicks, and then you were racing (s/racing/crashing into other cars/). A bit longer if you wanted to tinker with your car settings but you probably already had those saved anyway.

Console games these days take ages to load up, ages to flip between screens, and ages to restart once you crash. PC games are a bit better but not much. I miss the old days :(

Re:Race to the South Pole (1)

zippthorne (748122) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775053)

If you stop eating, you're not racing Amundsen. You're racing Scott.

How good is that AI? (1)

Cathoderoytube (1088737) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774101)

What if you're dealing with a Road Rash type game where you can get out of your car and run around on the track? Would the AI simulate the driver running around on the track swinging a chain at the other drivers as they speed by him or what? I think this is an issue that needs to be addressed.

Maybe something other than Formula One ... (1)

Hektor_Troy (262592) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774147)

As has been mentioned, in game you can do much faster times than real life drivers, and getting live telemetry from the cars during races might be tricky.

So why not use delayed telemetry? And maybe use endurance racing instead of formula racing? Most endurance races have different classes of vehicles, so you're constantly "fighting" traffic (especially if you're in the fastest classes), gamewise you could have to earn your way up from GT2 to GT1 to LMP2 to LMP1 (to use Le Mans standards).

Le Mans alone would qualify as at least 24 hours of gaming ;)

chessgames.com has been doing this for a while (3, Interesting)

JTMoon (952394) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774295)

www.chessgames.com has been hosting matches against the opening moves of real historical chess matches.
You can play against chess champions of centuries past or the modern day. (you have to pay to play against historical players, you can replay historical chess matches for free).

I think this is an awesome idea for games.
Of course, the constraint is a limited number of games where this is applicable (for example, it wouldn't make any sense to play against the replayed opening moves of a Halo 3 match...)

-J_Tom_Moon_79

some dots missing from a and o (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23774379)

The name is not Raikkonen.

Realism sucks. (1)

Nullav (1053766) | more than 6 years ago | (#23774411)

There's no risk, so why would I want to go around an oval hundreds of times with people who can't see me (and probably won't even 'hit' me because of that). Unlike the people I'd be going against, I have no reason to worry about snapping my neck or being in a burning aluminum cage if I screw up, so I'm going as fast as I can, perhaps saying 'oops' if I hit a wall. Besides that, real tracks are boring as hell.

RL is unbeatable (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#23774477)

In a real race car you have much more sensory input to tell you what the cars doing and many more queues to respond to. Most racing games compenstate for this by artificially tweaking the physics engine to cope with the inputs, something akin to stability control in a real car in fact. In a real car you cannot mash the accelerator or brake and wrench the wheel while cornering at the limit the same way you can in even the most realistic console and PC driving sims. If you do this in a real car - DO try this at home kids to prove a point - you will spin like a top and end up going backwards into the scenery at a high speed.

Add to that, brakes seem to be infintely fade resistant, tyres indestructable, and surfaces uncharceristly smooth. A typical road car has no brakes or grip after 1-2 laps of a real race track at full whack.

Even the most stable cars are senstive to subtle inputs and weight shifts at the tiller when on the limit.

In the most realistic of driving sim engines you'll find cars uncontrollable with a keyboard, mouse or joystick. Even with a linear wheel and analog pedals you still have no sense of g-forces and will end up off the track in no time.

If this comes to pass, I won't really be suprised if gamers get within .1 of a second lap times or even do better. Simply because of this effect. If the physic sim was real enough then the real life drives would have a huge advantage.

Still... this would be seriously fun though,can't wait to see it done ... but the real-life pros would seriously pwn game fanboi n00bs

1978 (1)

supertsaar (540181) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775435)

" It would be great to see this applied to historical events and other game domains, too -- like trying to beat Amundsen to the South Pole, using best-known weather data. "
I want to be Rensenbrink in the 1978 World Cup final.....

game? (1)

Stooshie (993666) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775745)

... like trying to beat Amundsen to the South Pole ...

That may take some time.

Crashes (1)

Krommenaas (726204) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775747)

"The company also claims to have an AI that solves the problem of overtaking and crashes" - that must be some amazing piece of AI if it can let Kimi Raikonen's car spin off the track when I virtually crash into him. Or, less dramatically, can prevent him from crashing into the virtual me when I'm overtaking/being overtaken by him. This whole idea is bogus.

*I* want to race Max Mosley (2, Funny)

Eternal Vigilance (573501) | more than 6 years ago | (#23775767)

Though with one slight change to the rules - first one to finish loses. :-)

"This fantastic result was a complete team effort. We really spanked the competition today."
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