Beta
×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

Apple Climbs Into Third Place In U.S. PC Market

timothy posted more than 6 years ago | from the your-only-possible-choices-are-vista-and-os-x dept.

OS X 1019

Tibor the Hun writes "According to Gartner and IDC, Apple now has between 7.8 and 8.5% of market share. While those numbers are not astonishing, they are not insignificant, and their growth does not seem to be slowing down. Will the pearly gates of acceptance open up for them once they reach the magic 10%, and will that have a positive effect on desktop Linux adoption? Hard to tell, but it's good to see that normal people (not just us geeks) are choosing to go with a different OS, rather than staying with the headache-inducing Windows."

Sorry! There are no comments related to the filter you selected.

Normal People? (5, Funny)

ColdWetDog (752185) | more than 6 years ago | (#24230921)

Hard to tell, but it's good to see that normal people (not just us geeks) are choosing to go with a different OS, rather than staying with the headache-inducing Windows."

And since when have Apple users been considered "normal" around here?

Or did you really mean 'orthogonal'

Re:Normal People? (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24230951)

@sig: Your mother was a hamster and your father smelled of elderberries!

Re:Normal People? (1)

von_rick (944421) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231023)

@sig: Your mother was a hamster and your father smelled of [b]elderberries[/b]!

That's be eldeberries. @ColdWetDog: Apple users are considered normal, but Apple isn't. Hate the sin not the sinner kinda.

Re:Normal People? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24231101)

No it wouldn't.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elderberries

Re:Normal People? (4, Funny)

ColdWetDog (752185) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231173)

That's be eldeberries. @ColdWetDog: Apple users are considered normal, but Apple isn't. Hate the sin not the sinner kinda.

Are you sure you have that one right? Macs these days are basically Intel boxes with blinky keyboards and bog standard innards (OK, the MacPro innards are pretty neat but memory card risers have been around since at least S-100 bus days).

It's the Mac users that are bat-shit insane (absent myself, of course - I'm OK, just ask my dog).

Re:Normal People? (5, Funny)

mark72005 (1233572) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231285)

I consider myself a brand whore first and batshit insane second.

Re:Normal People? (4, Funny)

ByOhTek (1181381) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231331)

I did, he said

*sniff* *sniff* *snarl* *growl* *bark* *growl* *bite*

I didn't hear the rest, I was rather distracted from the blood oozing from my arm. Sorry.

Re:Normal People? (1, Troll)

Smidge207 (1278042) | more than 6 years ago | (#24230957)

Or did you really mean 'orthogonal'

Yeah...because all Apple users are at right-angles with the rest of the world...right.

=Smidge=

Re:Normal People? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24231311)

Agreed, they are skew.

They aren't even on the same plane of existance, except for a very small point.

Re:Normal People? (2, Insightful)

bigstrat2003 (1058574) | more than 6 years ago | (#24230959)

Not to mention, what's with the flamebait shot at the end of the summary? Headache-inducing Windows? First, anyone who can't get Windows to run decently should be turning in their geek card already. Second, those kind of cheap shots are the things which start flame wars, I'm not sure how it deserves to be in TFS.

Re:Normal People? (4, Funny)

Foofoobar (318279) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231029)

First, anyone who can't get Windows to run decently should be turning in their geek card already...

I'm sorry but anyone who can run Windows and has been ISSUED a geek card should turn it in immediately.

Re:Normal People? (4, Insightful)

eln (21727) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231087)

Just because you CAN run Windows doesn't mean you do. In most cases, all it takes to run Windows is to pop in the disk and let it install, and things just work. However, much like hitting yourself with a hammer, just because it's easy doesn't make it a good idea.

Re:Normal People? (5, Insightful)

paroneayea (642895) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231037)

anyone who can't get Windows to run decently should be turning in their geek card already.

Really? Seriously?

Okay. I can get windows to run. Really, I can. That doesn't mean it isn't a fucking pain in the ass, a terrible user experience, and a waste of resources. Sorry, I have plenty of reasons to get headaches from windows. Not being geeky enough to handle it isn't one them.

Re:Normal People? (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24231171)

"Okay. I can get Ubuntu to run. Really, I can. That doesn't mean it isn't a fucking pain in the ass, a terrible user experience, and refuses to recognize the built-in card reader. Sorry, I have plenty of reasons to get headaches from Linux. Not being geeky enough to handle it isn't one them."

What what whaaaaaaat? I'm not allowed to demonstrate you can use that argument for -any- operating suite?

On the up side, the above wouldn't apply to OS X unless I got a clone machine *smirk*

Re:Normal People? (1)

nawcom (941663) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231403)

On the up side, the above wouldn't apply to OS X unless I got a clone machine *smirk*

One of these days someone needs to point out what a Mac clone is now a days. it's an intel compatible PC.

Yep, that's right, you know all of those "IBM clones" everyone uses? As of now they are also "Mac clones." The only difference is EFI versus the ancient BIOS, and there are nice little wrappers that take care of that :) And with motherboards now coming out with EFI, those things are "Mac Clones" right out of the box.

Re:Normal People? (4, Interesting)

AP31R0N (723649) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231305)

So what are you doing wrong? XP works beautifully for me and everyone i know. Worked really well for the 100+ users and 150+ machines for which i was sys admin.

Also, learn the difference between facts and opinions.

Re:Normal People? (1)

Ariastis (797888) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231061)

Its not 7.8 - 8.5 of geeks ; its 7.8-8.5% of everyone.

Most of them don't have a geek card and do get a headache when Windows Crashes(TM)

Re:Normal People? (4, Insightful)

Dirk Pitt (90561) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231073)

Since when is M$ bashing flamebait on slashdot? Are you new here?

And just because most of us can maintain a windows box doesn't mean we like it - my mechanic maintains my old Land Rover, but it certainly induces headaches.

Re:Normal People? (2, Funny)

bigstrat2003 (1058574) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231131)

Since when is M$ bashing flamebait on slashdot? Are you new here?

Commonly accepted flamebait, but flamebait nonetheless.

Re:Normal People? (1, Troll)

je ne sais quoi (987177) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231139)

First, anyone who can't get Windows to run decently should be turning in their geek card already.

I argue that it's actually impossible to get Windows to run decently no matter how much of a geek you are because the software is written poorly and is designed to annoy the user. Even if we take you at your word about getting windows to "run well", meaning installed as the code is written, it's not that I can't do it, I don't want to. This is because it's a POS operating system. So, from my point of view, these aren't "cheap shots" in the introduction but a statement that largely agrees with my experience.

Re:Normal People? (5, Interesting)

bigstrat2003 (1058574) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231207)

I argue that it's actually impossible to get Windows to run decently no matter how much of a geek you are because the software is written poorly and is designed to annoy the user.

Ah, counterexamples, the one useful function of anecdotal evidence. I run Vista beautifully. It doesn't get in my way, it runs the software I want it to, it just works. So yes, it is possible. Without much effort, either, I might add.

Re:Normal People? (1)

kannibal_klown (531544) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231275)

I'd go for Vista on my secondary partition (I have a MacBook Pro).

But when I'm in Windows it's usually to do J2EE and/or Oracle development. And when doing that I like as much RAM available as possible. Vista takes up more resources than I'd like.

Re:Normal People? (1)

iminplaya (723125) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231155)

Yeah well, trick is to do it without getting a headache. And starting flamewars is how you gets hits. A very effective marketing technique.

Re:Normal People? (4, Insightful)

Red Flayer (890720) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231205)

Second, those kind of cheap shots are the things which start flame wars, I'm not sure how it deserves to be in TFS

Flame war == more comments == more page hits == more ad impressions.

Besides, instigating an MS-bashing comment flood is like firing up your favorite game and playing through it in 'easy' mode.

So once in a while, even though it's been done before, we get to have an anti-MS free for all, because it's easy. And fun.

My favorite part are the people who complain about trollish summaries, because I get to imagine how their panties got in such a tight knot. :)

Re:Normal People? (0, Flamebait)

bigstrat2003 (1058574) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231245)

My favorite part are the people who complain about trollish summaries, because I get to imagine how their panties got in such a tight knot.

I believe a far better insult to use against me would have been "sand in their vagina" (no, I'm not a chick). ;)

Anyways, it doesn't really make me lose any sleep at night, or rant and rave and foam at the mouth, but it does make me scratch my head and wonder how that got in there. Surely editors should at least make sure the submission is troll/flame free before posting it?

Re:Normal People? (1)

Red Flayer (890720) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231333)

Surely editors should at least make sure the submission is troll/flame free before posting it?

Not to rehash the old "you must be new here" canard[1], but really, YMBNH. One of the jobs of the editors seems to be ensuring that the submission has some kind of troll/flame in it. That pretty much guarantees a lot of posts in the comments.

Except it's true... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24231253)

Windows is headache inducing! Strange things happen during normal everyday use on that OS and being such a clusterfuck of bad legacy design decisions, it's easier to reinstall from scratch than fix anything but the simplest of OS problems. Windows is braindamaged by design, admittedly some of that is legacy design yet it's still handicapped by comparison to a modern desktop unix (which puts the legacy argument in perspective).

OSX doesn't always get it right either but it's infinitely less frustrating than Windows in everyday use. Delving even further, as much as I hate apples plists, I'll take them over the Windows registry any day of the week!

Re:Normal People? (3, Interesting)

kramer2718 (598033) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231217)

Hard to tell, but it's good to see that normal people (not just us geeks) are choosing to go with a different OS, rather than staying with the headache-inducing Windows."

And since when have Apple users been considered "normal" around here?

Or did you really mean 'orthogonal'

Apple users are definitely wacky. I bought a MacBook recently because of the stability, ease of administration, nice kernel, reasonable dev environment, etc.

Now I can't stand it. The Apple GUI is a piece of shit. They have gone to weird symbols in their GUI instead of nice buttons with labels.

Example: I needed to add a user. I bought up the little user management app and didn't see any add user button. After a short Google, I found that to add a user, you click the small plus sign at the bottom. Maybe I should have figured that out without Googling, but it sure didn't seem obvious at the time.

It seems like Apple is generally going for a pretty interface over a useful interface. That may impress some people but it drives me batshit. The only question now is whether to put KDE on top of OS X or put some Linux Distro on it.

I heard so many great reviews of Mac and now I'm looking at having paid too much money for a Linux notebook ... sigh.

Re:Normal People? (1)

mark72005 (1233572) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231329)

I find the user interface to be very good. But I did run into these kinds of troubles with getting acclimated. It just takes some time to get used to the subtle differences.

We could all do it in windows instantly (well, after the long delay for the control panel subscreen to open), but how many years have we had to familiarize ourselves with Windows?

Re:Normal People? (5, Insightful)

truthsearch (249536) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231381)

I converted to Macs a few years ago and found the OS X interface to be the most intuitive I've ever used. The plus and minus signs at the bottom of lists seems obviously to imply add and remove.

Windows always took me a while to learn the nuances. And then another version with a changed interface would force me to learn the changes. But with OS X I typically just ask myself how something should work and there it is, right where I'd expect it.

So far I've found that most people's issues with learning the OS X interface is actually unlearning another interface.

Re:Normal People? (1)

ceoyoyo (59147) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231391)

To add an item to a list you click on the plus sign at the bottom of the list... yeah, that's non-intuitive, all right.

Re:Normal People? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24231399)

You didn't see the "?" button on the Accounts pane? Clicking that clearly outlines what you need to know.

The "+" and "-" and similar buttons are used almost universally and consistently throughout Mac OS X, Apple applications and 3rd party applications.

It isn't about being pretty but consistent and directly useful/discoverable without clutter.

I've been wondering.. (4, Interesting)

QuantumRiff (120817) | more than 6 years ago | (#24230929)

when will a project similar to WINE come out for OSX? I have seen all sorts of apps that run on Mac and/or PC's but not linux. One would think it would almost be easier to "not emulate" the OSX software, as it is mostly unix based. If more software starts coming out for mac and PC, it might be easier to get the Mac software running under linux.

Re:I've been wondering.. (4, Funny)

bunratty (545641) | more than 6 years ago | (#24230987)

If the Windows emulator for Linux is Wine, I guess the Mac emulator for Linux would be Mace?

Re:I've been wondering.. (4, Funny)

snl2587 (1177409) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231069)

It's a "compatibility layer", you insensitive clod!

Re:I've been wondering.. (1)

poormanjoe (889634) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231161)

*W*ine *I*s *N*ot (an) *E*mulator......maybe "Mine" to signify it as the Mac version

Re:I've been wondering.. (4, Informative)

Sonic McTails (700139) | more than 6 years ago | (#24230993)

Try using Darwine (http://darwine.sourceforge.net/), or if you wish for commercial support, use CrossOver Office for Macintosh.

Re:I've been wondering.. (1)

mhall119 (1035984) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231033)

I think he meant a way to run OSX applications in Linux, not a way to run Windows apps in OSX.

Re:I've been wondering.. (2, Informative)

QuantumRiff (120817) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231057)

Sorry, my post was a bit unclear. I want a project that will let me run OSX apps on a linux machine, just like with WINE, we can run Win32 apps on linux machines..

Re:I've been wondering.. (1)

shawnce (146129) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231011)

Mac OS X is far from mostly unix based.

Re:I've been wondering.. (2, Insightful)

kellyb9 (954229) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231021)

when will a project similar to WINE come out for OSX?

When enterprising Mac users develop it.

Re:I've been wondering.. (1)

clang_jangle (975789) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231059)

To run most OS X software in Linux, the GUI would have to be ported from aqua to either GTK, QT, tcl, or whatever can run on x-windows. Also, OS X is not really known for its "must have" apps, unless you want to count multimedia stuff -- and that requires way more than just portng a GUI (core video, core audio, etc).

Re:I've been wondering.. (1)

unhooked (21010) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231179)

>when will a project similar to WINE come out for OSX?

You mean something like WINE?
http://www.winehq.org/ [winehq.org]
-Wine provides both a development toolkit for porting Windows source code to Unix -as well as a program loader, allowing many unmodified Windows programs to run on -x86-based Unixes, including Linux, FreeBSD, Mac OS X, and Solaris.

GNUstep (4, Informative)

sagefire.org (731545) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231323)

That would be GNUstep http://gnustep.org/ [gnustep.org]

It's got a long way to go, but eventually, they intend to make .apps from OSX run natively. Remember mac OSX is really NeXTstep 5 (or something).

Re:I've been wondering.. (1)

yomegaman (516565) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231341)

The project you're think of is called GNUStep.

Astonishing indeed! (5, Insightful)

dazedNconfuzed (154242) | more than 6 years ago | (#24230969)

While those numbers are not astonishing

Not astonishing? A single company, offering a proprietary product*, is outdoing nearly all of several hundred companies combined who build to a given standard! Astonishing indeed!

* - including hardware, OS, and a broad range of application software

Re:Astonishing indeed! (1)

VGPowerlord (621254) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231083)

Actually, are there hundreds of companies any more? HP, Dell, and Acer (the first, second, and third largest companies in computer sales) have been buying up other companies left and right.

Re:Astonishing indeed! (3, Interesting)

kellyb9 (954229) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231097)

To me - it really isn't all that astonishing. While I believe Mac usage has gone up pretty drastically over the last several years. They are the only one selling their product. If someone wants a Mac, they have to go to Apple to buy it. And since they've created a culture, where their product is not only percieved as more efficient and better but also as trendy, I don't really find it that suprising. Still 10% is comparitivly a drop in the bucket.

Re:Astonishing indeed! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24231377)

Still 10% is comparitivly a drop in the bucket.

Well, technically, 10% is 10% of the bucket. Unless your bucket only holds 10 drops.

"Magic 10%" (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24230975)

Why is 10% "magic"? This number is significant because that's how many fingers we have?

Re:"Magic 10%" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24231035)

I have 9 fingers, you insensitive clod!

Re:"Magic 10%" (1)

electricbern (1222632) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231211)

Oh, hello Mr. President [wikipedia.org] .

Re:"Magic 10%" (4, Interesting)

dotpavan (829804) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231047)

Why is 10% "magic"? This number is significant because that's how many fingers we have?
Because it has reached double digit

Re:"Magic 10%" (1)

von_rick (944421) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231137)

But it has already cross double digit in base-8.

Re:"Magic 10%" (2, Funny)

mhall119 (1035984) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231063)

The other 90% is perspiration, or something to that effect.

Re:"Magic 10%" (5, Funny)

Leftist Troll (825839) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231195)

10% is the glass ceiling for Apple marketshare. It is estimated that roughly 10% of the population is gay; beyond that, Apple is going to face an uphill battle.

Reaching corollary (4, Interesting)

Palshife (60519) | more than 6 years ago | (#24230977)

Will the pearly gates of acceptance open up for them once they reach the magic 10%, and will that have a positive effect on desktop Linux adoption?

Wow, talk about a strange corollary. Linux desktop adoption has nothing at all to do with Mac market share. It would have been just as valid to write, "Will the pearly gates of acceptance open up for them once they reach the magic 10%, and will that lead a surge in kitten adoptions?"

Personally, though, adopt a cat anyway.

Re:Reaching corollary (0, Offtopic)

JCSoRocks (1142053) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231075)

Cats are only good for ONE THING [icanhascheezburger.com] .

Re:Reaching corollary (4, Funny)

bigstrat2003 (1058574) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231079)

Personally, though, adopt a cat anyway.

Whoa, there. Why would we want to adopt a pet which loathes our existence no matter how much good we do for it? I mean, come on. That's like having a really cranky girlfriend/wife without the sex! Or a teenager. Neither of which is something you want.

Re:Reaching corollary (1)

conteXXt (249905) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231165)

Of course not! Sex with a teenager is illegal. Or did you mean the cat?

Re:Reaching corollary (1)

bigstrat2003 (1058574) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231287)

Yes.

Re:Reaching corollary (4, Funny)

UncleTogie (1004853) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231261)

Whoa, there. Why would we want to adopt a pet which loathes our existence no matter how much good we do for it?

Sound like you need The Engineer's Guide to Cats... [youtube.com]

...and if you still can't stand them, there's a simple method to make a cat sound like a dog:

1. Douse cat in gasoline.

2. Flick a lit match at the cat, and presto:

3. It goes "*WOOF!*"

Thank you, I'll be here all week. Don't forget to tip your waitresses and bartenders, and please.... try the fish.

Re:Reaching corollary (2, Insightful)

mhall119 (1035984) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231129)

They're not quite as disconnected as kitten adoption.

The more people that use a non-Windows OS, the less of a monopoly Windows has on the ecosystem, and that will make application developers think about portability and compatibility, which will make more software and services available on Linux.

Re:Reaching corollary (1)

Timothy Brownawell (627747) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231175)

I would think that that's based on the idea that Linux adoption is held down by the Windows monopoly (which Apple is supposed to be breaking), rather than by poor awareness and lack of polish.

Re:Reaching corollary (1)

gamanimatron (1327245) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231177)

I was wondering about that, too (the acceptance thing, not the kitten thing). Maybe the idea is that if Windows market share gets diluted "enough", more companies will start thinking about cross-OS development and distribution of their products.

I'm pretty sure this is a vain hope, though. The markets for most products segment nicely along exactly the same lines as OS adoption, and it'll take more than another 2% market share for Apple to have any impact on that. Not to mention that Apple would likely be *happier* to further fragment the software market, 'cause differentiation is the name of that game.

Re:Reaching corollary (1)

flanksteak (69032) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231213)

I didn't get that either. I don't see any way that increased OS X market share is going to help Linux on the desktop.

Oh, and I already have a cat. One is enough for me.

Re:Reaching corollary (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24231215)

As a long time Mac user, I'd agree that Mac market share will not have an immediate affect on Linux adoption.
But, given that OS X has its foundations in Unix, I have known a number of users who, after using OS X and taking a boo at the underpinnings, have switched to Linux. And best of all, most of these people moving from Mac to Linux are not considered highly technical; they just want more granularity than OS X provides, and want to see what else is out there.
Personally, my stance is that OS X adoption can only help the Linux community; at least, more than Windows adoption (not counting disgruntled Vista/debased XP users, of course).

Re:Reaching corollary (1)

cowscows (103644) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231219)

There's a connection, albeit an indirect one, and a slow acting one. The connection has less to do with MacOS itself, and more to do with lessening Windows' grip on the industry.

Part of it is just pyschological. To many people, there's never really been any alternative OS to choose. There's just Windows. Getting people to agree that there are viable alternatives is the first step towards directing them towards a particular alternative.

But there are more practical aspects to it as well. A significant userbase outside of windows will accelerate the adoption of things like web standards, file format standards, etc..., which makes moving away from Windows more viable in general. And if you want to take it even further, if a company feels that it makes sense to write cross-platform software for Windows and MacOS instead of just focusing on Windows, then hopefully that means their code is more portable, which lowers the barrier to an eventual linux version.

Nothing's certain of course, and Linux desktop developers can't just sit back and expect Apple to solve all their problems somehow, but anything that chips away at the inertia of Windows makes things easier for everyone.

The ACTUAL choice is . . . (1)

Eg0Death (1282452) | more than 6 years ago | (#24230979)

Are they buying a different OS or a pretty box? Not to overgeneralize, but Fruit are pretty, and many of the Fruit owners I know bought it because it looks good. They have no concern for the OS.

Re:The ACTUAL choice is . . . (4, Insightful)

truthsearch (249536) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231143)

I've never known anyone to buy their first Apple desktop or laptop without trying it out first. Surely they notice the interface is different.

Re:The ACTUAL choice is . . . (1)

Eg0Death (1282452) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231303)

Yeah, I'm sure they notice, and Apple's interface is slicker. (Back to the "Pretty Fruit" theory.) Generally speaking, they aren't geek users, so the underlying functionality of the OS isn't the concern. I do know of one geek user who prefers Apple; he's married to one of Pixar's tech support staff.

Geeks? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24230983)

I be a pseudo-geek but I don't like Apple's "do it our way or the highway" approach to computing.

As opposed to... (4, Insightful)

argent (18001) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231095)

As opposed to Microsoft's "do it our way or the highway" approach to computing?

Re:As opposed to... (1)

Stevenovitch (1292358) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231199)

I was just thinking about that today as I upgraded my vid car for fifty bucks after using stardock's object dock to create an apple like toolbar on my desktop in place of that lame task bar.

I was saying to myself: "Damn you microsoft for making me do everything your way!"

headache inducing? (3, Interesting)

ya really (1257084) | more than 6 years ago | (#24230995)

Any browser can induce a boatload of headaches to those who are uninformed on how to use it. Aside from Vista and all of it's obvious headaches such as drivers and legacy software not working, XP and 2k were not quite as bad.

I think anyone will agree that even Linux can cause plenty of headaches as well if one is not careful. Sendmail was one of those battles I had a while ago.

Linus causes plenty of headaches (3, Insightful)

Joce640k (829181) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231153)

At least Windows users don't have to open a console window and recompile their webcam driver after the monthly patch.

This is total FUD (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24231019)

If TV and the movies have taught me anything, it's that at least 90% of the computers and laptops out there are Apples. Hell, even alien civilizations use Macs on their motherships.

Re:This is total FUD (0)

Penguin's Advocate (126803) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231185)

How is this FUD? I don't really see how news that Apple is approaching a 10% market share induces Fear, Uncertainty, or Doubt in anyone about competing products... Usually FUD relies more on "90% of people can't be wrong!" rather than "10% of people can't be wrong!"

(Disclaimer: This is not meant to imply that any percentage of people "can't be wrong")

Re:This is total FUD (1)

Sun.Jedi (1280674) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231299)

I just read a big fat WHOOOOOOSH.

Sounds Great (4, Insightful)

Stevenovitch (1292358) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231041)

I really can't see how anything but goodness can come from this. Afterall, if you really want to gain ground against an evil closed-source monopoly that charges too much for it's products, it makes perfect sense to switch to another company that even more protective of its source, charges even more for its products, and even has a nasty habit of keeping its platform as proprietary as possible.

Success!

Re:Sounds Great (3, Funny)

pak9rabid (1011935) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231223)

Afterall, if you really want to gain ground against an evil closed-source monopoly that charges too much for it's products...

Are you referring to Apple or Microsoft?

Re:Sounds Great (3, Interesting)

argent (18001) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231229)

it makes perfect sense to switch to another company that even more protective of its source

What, something happened to Apple Open Source [apple.com] ?

Oh no, it's all there, still tracking the latest release of OS X.

Damn, you scared me for a second...

(yes, I know they're only 99.44% pure and hold out a few kernel components, but "even more protective" than Microsoft? Give me a rotating plaid gold-decked break!)

Re:Sounds Great (1)

Stevenovitch (1292358) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231317)

Yeah, you're right, but you see how I was going for the three of three there? Don't piss on my parade.

PS which OSX distro do you run?

It was a lot higher back in the '80s (1, Interesting)

davidwr (791652) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231113)

Back before Windows 3.0 they had the destkop publishing market practically all to themselves.

Was it Steve Jobs who said the world would never need more than 2 shades of black and white?

Vista: Unix's MVP (5, Insightful)

rtobyr (846578) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231133)

Has anyone else noticed that after Vista came out, Microsoft seems to have been losing ground? Netbooks/UMPC's are selling with OEM Linux like hot cakes, and Apple is steadily gaining market share. I also bet that the disappointment with SP1 made it even worse for ol' Billy. Even if Windows 7 is all that and a bag of chips, it'll be too late because Joe the Layman will have seen that Linux really is ready for prime time.

Re:Vista: Unix's MVP (1)

tb()ne (625102) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231289)

Has anyone else noticed that after Vista came out, Microsoft seems to have been losing ground? Netbooks/UMPC's are selling with OEM Linux like hot cakes, and Apple is steadily gaining market share. I also bet that the disappointment with SP1 made it even worse for ol' Billy. Even if Windows 7 is all that and a bag of chips, it'll be too late because Joe the Layman will have seen that Linux really is ready for prime time.

I doubt Joe the Layman knows what Linux is, assuming he has even heard of it. But he has undoubtedly seen numerous Mac ads on TV and has noticed Mac stores popping up everywhere, full of big pretty iMacs and super-thin laptops.

Re:Vista: Unix's MVP (1)

ColdWetDog (752185) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231349)

Has anyone else noticed that after Vista came out, Microsoft seems to have been losing ground?

Sorry young'un - Microsoft has been losing ground even before Byte became popular. I believe at one time, even Netcraft confirmed it.

Likely it will still be losing ground when your kids are posting on whatever equivalent to Slashdot is found in the Mysterious Future.

well.... (1)

halfEvilTech (1171369) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231147)

they only surpassed Gateway/Acer so that is not much of a bragging right.

Games and Marketshare (3, Insightful)

Danathar (267989) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231181)

I REALLY hope that increased Marketshare will motivate games being ported to OS X. I fear it will have to be at least 20% for that to happen though.

The New Apple Walled Garden (4, Interesting)

ionix5891 (1228718) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231221)

Geeks and enthusiasts wearing Wordpress t-shirts, using laptops covered in Data Portability, Microformats and RSS stickers lined up enthusiastically on Friday to purchase a device that is completely proprietary, controlled and wrapped in DRM. The irony was lost on some as they ran home, docked their new devices into a proprietary media player and downloaded closed source applications wrapped in DRM.

I am referring to the new iPhone - and the new Apple iPhone SDK that allows developers to build 'native' applications. The announcement was greeted with a web-wide standing ovation, especially from the developer community. The same community who demand all from Microsoft, feel gifted and special when Apple give them an inch of rope. When Microsoft introduced DRM into Media Player it was bad bad bad - and it wasn't even mandatory, it simply allowed content owners a way to distribute and sell content from anywhere.

Apple has wrapped the iPhone SDK in enough licensing, security controls and right management that it would make the Microsoft Active Desktop team blush. The phone and platform that is certain to soon take second spot behind Symbian in the smart phone market is also the most restricted and closed. Applications can only be installed from a single source, iTunes, and open source applications and distribution is near impossible. How do you install an iPhone application without iTunes? Where are the community advocates arguing for a standard interface, openess and free code?

What is more worrying is what the next move could be. Now that there is an AppStore with applications in iTunes, why wouldn't Apple move next to distribute all applications through iTunes - both desktop and mobile? There is no reason for them not to - the response to AppStore has been so enthusiastic that it is almost assured that you will start seeing desktop apps distributed in the same way. As soon as users are ground into looking at everything through iTunes, distribution of software in the traditional manner would be near impossible. Apple would become the gatekeeper, and both developers and users will enthusiastically pay the toll in exchange for pretty devices with pretty applications.

Apple has a very strong following in the open source community, and I can no longer understand it nor justify my own support (I am writing this on a Macbook). They built OS X on FreeBSD (a project I have enthusiastically supported, contributed to and been a user of for 10 years or more), they built Safari on KHTML, and are now using libraries such as SproutCore in MobileMe. They have taken open source and everything it built and leveraged it to get to market faster - yet they have now, with iTunes and the new SDK, built a layer on top of it that excludes others. For Apple, open source is great when it furthers their own goals, but not when using it with Apple software where it may further the goals of others.

The solution is simple. If you truly believe in open standards, open source and the good that it has created, then don't accept it. The spirit of open source was about building on the work of others in a transparent fashion, as the gains further the common good of all. Despite not taking over the desktop market, the philosophy and its resultants have destroyed the old enterprise market and many others. Open source and standards keep Microsoft and other big companies on their toes, the movement as a whole and the philosophy is very real. The solution isn't to adopt new licenses to try and prevent this, as it results in the mess that is GPL v 3.

It should be very possible to attach a simple BSD license to code, and if a large company utilizes the effort from others in a way that is unacceptable - the market should be able to sort that out, we simply wont buy it. The community needs to do more than just wear their support for openess and standards on their sleeves (and on their laptops). The problem with Apple is that the blind demand is driven by a distorted reality, so those same developers who poured thousands of hours into the BSD kernel now turn around and purchase an iPhone running that code, but it is now tied up in DRM, licenses and restrictions placed there by others.

Did the Gartner report have more information? (2, Insightful)

kithrup (778358) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231231)

The summaries I've seen indicated that Apple had gotten to 3rd place in terms of hardware sales -- not that people were sticking with Mac OS X instead of Windows on their new machines.

I assume, of course, that a large number of people who buy a Mac stick with the native OS... but I'm not a market research firm, so I don't have to have actual data to back my beliefs :).

You think that's enough people to show up? (1)

argent (18001) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231335)

I don't think I've run into anyone outside slashdot who bought a Mac but didn't run OS X on it. Given the high cost, marginal hardware, and oddball design of Apple's hardware it still seems weird to get anything less than the whole ball of wax.

But I'd also be interested in actual figures for "Joe Consumer".

Normal people using macs now? (5, Interesting)

Zakabog (603757) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231241)

Hard to tell, but it's good to see that normal people (not just us geeks) are choosing to go with a different OS

Most of the Mac owners I know are normal people. Either students that got an imac laptop from their school, older people who wanted an easy to use computer, or an artist (musician, photographer, graphic designer, etc.) who wanted a powerful machine that wouldn't get infected with a ton of spyware and viruses in a week.

None of the Mac owners I know (besides myself) are very tech savvy, they just know that their iPod works great, their PC is always infected with "viruses" (usually some spyware they installed cause it promised free smileys), and their friend's Mac never has any problems. Personally I didn't buy a Mac just for a different OS. If I want to toy around in something other than Windows, I just go install Linux on whatever old computers are lying around the house. I bought the Mac specifically for Aperture, and Final Cut Pro since I do a lot of photography and video work. I know there exists open source software or expensive Windows software to do that stuff, it's just none of it is as powerful or easy to use as the Mac versions. I don't need Mac OS to have a stable computer, I just like the software that exists for the Mac.

Re:Normal people using macs now? (1)

Colonel Korn (1258968) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231347)

The few dozen Mac users I've known over the years (those who repeatedly buy Macs, not just one before switching to something else) are all either grandparents or students who share one trait: lack of computer savvy. If you don't know what you're doing but want to be able to send email, a Mac is a common choice.

Hard to tell, but it's good to see that normal people (not just us geeks) are choosing to go with a different OS

Most of the Mac owners I know are normal people. Either students that got an imac laptop from their school, older people who wanted an easy to use computer, or an artist (musician, photographer, graphic designer, etc.) who wanted a powerful machine that wouldn't get infected with a ton of spyware and viruses in a week.

None of the Mac owners I know (besides myself) are very tech savvy, they just know that their iPod works great, their PC is always infected with "viruses" (usually some spyware they installed cause it promised free smileys), and their friend's Mac never has any problems. Personally I didn't buy a Mac just for a different OS. If I want to toy around in something other than Windows, I just go install Linux on whatever old computers are lying around the house. I bought the Mac specifically for Aperture, and Final Cut Pro since I do a lot of photography and video work. I know there exists open source software or expensive Windows software to do that stuff, it's just none of it is as powerful or easy to use as the Mac versions. I don't need Mac OS to have a stable computer, I just like the software that exists for the Mac.

Why would OSX increase linux sales? (4, Interesting)

HockeyPuck (141947) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231251)

I use linux/*nix all day long at work, and I have a mac at home, yet there's very few things that I use on OSX that are *nix related. Maybe running 'top' is about it, and that's a rarity. I picked OSX because of the applications and how they are all integrated in with each other, pure and simple. My laptop at work is a company provided XP system and while not having the polish/eye candy that OSX has, it gets the job done.

When linux distros have the same ease of use, smooth upgrades and most importantly application integration (with each other AND the OS), then I can see people like myself thinking about saving a few bucks and going with Linux instead.

I assume that when I buy a dishwasher, the interface is intuitive and it just works, why should we treat computers any differently?

Apples and Oranges? (2, Insightful)

Andy_R (114137) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231265)

These figures just count units shipped in the US, they exclude mini-notebooks and handhelds and don't take into account profitability or unit costs.

If you go by market capitalisation, Apple isn't behind Dell and HP, it's ahead of both, but behind IBM who don't even get a look-in in the units shipped list.

Re:Apples and Oranges? (1)

SeeManRun (1040704) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231361)

What does the valuation of a company have anything to do with this article? Apple is worth a lot more than the other companies because they sell a brand, always have, probably always will. Their computers are nothing other than a pretty package with a pretty GUI on an old reliable system that comes at a price that is nearly 2x what a DUI system of similar specs and OS would cost. Brand awareness is everything to Apple. Dell makes way more money than Apple does, yet they are worth 1/4 as much. Brand is Apple's genius.

Confirmed: (4, Funny)

sootman (158191) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231267)

2008 will be the year of OS X on the desktop! :-)

No mention of Linux here? UNDER ONE PERCENT !! (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 6 years ago | (#24231281)

Linux seems to be not desirable, according to gartner and idc and yes, netcraft DOES confirm it !!

Not for Long? (1)

failedlogic (627314) | more than 6 years ago | (#24231353)

This upward trend in marketshare trend might be over if Pystar wins their court case.

On a side note, I still like desktop towers as opposed to laptops and mini-computers. But I quess the market is headed in the laptop and iMac direction.

Load More Comments
Slashdot Login

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?