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Windows 7 Trades Email and Photo Apps For Downloadable Ones

timothy posted about 6 years ago | from the unlike-those-bundlers-at-canonical-red-hat-etc dept.

Microsoft 496

arcticstoat writes "Microsoft has said that it plans to remove a lot of the standard apps from Windows 7 in order to make the new OS 'cleaner.' Among the apps for the chop are Windows Mail, Windows Photo Gallery and Windows Movie Maker, which will no longer be included with the operating system as standard. Instead, equivalent versions of the apps will be available from Microsoft's Windows Live download service as optional free downloads, much like the new BETA versions of the apps that Windows Live offers today." Meanwhile, jammag writes that "tech pundit Mike Elgan posits that the rushed-to-market Windows 7 — due in 2010, now being beta released this October — may in fact merely be Vista with new packaging.

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Windows 7 (4, Funny)

Ethanol-fueled (1125189) | about 6 years ago | (#25140809)

Is that the new Mojave thing we've been hearing about?

Re:Windows 7 (5, Funny)

Kifoth (980005) | about 6 years ago | (#25140903)

No, it's Vista Service Pack 2.

Re:Windows 7 (5, Funny)

betterunixthanunix (980855) | about 6 years ago | (#25141325)

Vista SP2 is going to remove my email (Thunderbird) and photo apps (Picasa)?

Re:Windows 7 (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141351)

Nope, the author is a hack who is just trying to evoke anti-MS feelings to get people to read his story. Who takes statements like "I presented ____ a public challenge" seriously? It's like the group doing the data recovery challenge - there's no incentive to take the challenge, and plenty of reason not to.

Among those reasons: what happens when someone promises a feature that is canceled or modified for quality control purposes? Does it suddenly become a failure to deliver, or is it delivering a skillfully polished ecosystem? Who gets to decide? Not this hack, that's for certain.

frist ps0t (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25140817)

lol wut

first dong (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25140819)

the penis is a myth!

Re:first dong (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25140847)

the penis is a myth!

Well, mine is the stuff of legend, but it's hardly a myth. :-P

Re:first dong (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25140887)

Pics or GTFO

Re:first dong (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25140995)

You must be a Mac user.

Re:first dong (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141231)

Not yet, I'm not. :P

This webification has gone too far. (-1, Offtopic)

tjstork (137384) | about 6 years ago | (#25140825)

Man, I actually think with Vista, Microsoft finally got Windows mail right. I mean, it's a pretty darn nice little client and web based everything sucks. gmail is a good web mail but I would prefer a real client any day of the week. Even Linux Evolution is a better email than any web based email...

somebody has to get rid of Ray Ozzie at Microsoft. Mr. Zroom or whatever he is has just a moron.

Re:This webification has gone too far. (4, Funny)

not already in use (972294) | about 6 years ago | (#25140857)

Not RTFA is bad enough, but apparently you didn't even bother to read the summary.

You guys can't even read... (-1, Flamebait)

tjstork (137384) | about 6 years ago | (#25141031)

I read the article. It says they are taking out the email client from Windows 7 that shipped in Vista and that was Outlook Express before that and has been shipping with Windows since I think even Windows 95. I happen to like that email client and said so...

I'm only be rated as off topic because this board is filled with Linux zealots... you know, a bunch of free speech types that just want to censor everything that they disagree with.

Re:You guys can't even read... (1)

hunterkll (949515) | about 6 years ago | (#25141065)

Downloadable version instead of pre-packaged, you know..... You can still get the same thing, you just have to take the extra step to download it... and if you are in a situation where you can download email, you can download the client, as well. :)

Re:You guys can't even read... (1)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | about 6 years ago | (#25141287)

I think you should try speaking slower to him. He thinks Outlook Express^W^WWindows Mail is a good mail client, after all. (Now, MS fanboys, be careful here....I actually *like* Outlook (the real deal) -- as long as it's set up sanely (i.e., Security Zone is set to 'Restricted sites') and the Exchange server has good antivirus and antispam filtering -- and actually use Outlook when I have to use Windows.)

Re:You guys can't even read... (1)

nschubach (922175) | about 6 years ago | (#25141323)

I'm only be rated as off topic because this board is filled with Linux zealots... you know, a bunch of free speech types that just want to censor everything that they disagree with.

Keep that attitude and you'll be labeled as a Troll too. Now get off my bridge. ;)

When I used Windows though, Outlook Express was my favored email client until I found Thunderbird. As a "Linux Zealot" I will assure you that I don't dislike the supporters of closed software, just anyone spreading fud about it or its supporters.

Re:You guys can't even read... (1)

MightyYar (622222) | about 6 years ago | (#25141379)

I'm only be rated as off topic because this board is filled with Linux zealots...

People might be nicer to you (and mod you higher) if you didn't call people morons.

You misunderstood the summary and article. They are not replacing them with web apps, but leaving them off of the install disk for you to install optionally.

THAT, along with your name-calling, is why you were modded down.

Re:This webification has gone too far. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25140867)

downloadable apps, not web apps

Re:This webification has gone too far. (3, Insightful)

gstoddart (321705) | about 6 years ago | (#25140895)

gmail is a good web mail but I would prefer a real client any day of the week. Even Linux Evolution is a better email than any web based email...

Well, web-based email has the benefit of being accessible from wherever you're at. That's a huge advantage -- when I'm visiting my family, it's nice to be able to check my email.

Plus, it's not like you can't use your favorite POP client to connect to gmail and read your mail in whatever client you like.

Cheers

IMAP much? (1)

mpapet (761907) | about 6 years ago | (#25141315)

Cached IMAP is supported in a few clients, Firebird and kmail come to mind...

Re:IMAP much? (1)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | about 6 years ago | (#25141409)

Cached IMAP is supported in a few clients, Firebird and kmail come to mind...

You mean Thunderbird. 'Firebird' was the second name ('Phoenix' being the first) of Mozilla Firefox before it became Mozilla Firefox.

Also, aside from Thunderbird and Kmail, Evolution does as well.

While this may not please some... (5, Insightful)

Drakin020 (980931) | about 6 years ago | (#25140829)

I rather like the idea of having an OS with as little on it as possible.

That way I can add what I see fit, much like the Server OS.

Hey it's a step in the right direction.

Re:While this may not please some... (4, Insightful)

mcsqueak (1043736) | about 6 years ago | (#25141005)

I rather like the idea of having an OS with as little on it as possible.

Exactly! I know from a marketing standpoint you want to cram in as much of your own products as possible, in order to keep your brand in front of the customer, but having a truly modular OS would be very nice indeed.

As a "non-technical user" there are a lot of Windows services that I don't use that would be nice to remove without having to worry about undermining the stability and underlying structure of the OS.

Re:While this may not please some... (4, Funny)

Teckla (630646) | about 6 years ago | (#25141109)

I rather like the idea of having an OS with as little on it as possible.

That way I can add what I see fit, much like the Server OS.

Hey it's a step in the right direction.

Next, they should create some kind of ... I don't know, package or application manager maybe, which would allow users to easily add/remove programs ... might have to wait until Windows 8 or 9 for that, though. But, never fear, Microsoft can innovate it. :-)

Re:While this may not please some... (5, Insightful)

Daryen (1138567) | about 6 years ago | (#25141341)

I know you were just kidding, but I'd like to contribute.

The Windows Add/Remove Programs menu doesn't even begin to cover what should be removable from the Operating System. Internet Explorer is the back end for a number of programs and cannot be fully removed, a few programs even rely on MSN Messenger and will not allow you to remove it if they are installed. There are all sorts of extra services running, like one for office that waits for it to be installed so it can clean it up. There's Alexa, a never ending assortment of drivers for ancient equipment. The system restore and hibernation services are installed and running whether you want them or not. And even in XP (although this is worse in Vista) the indexing service.

There are replacements for every single one of these applications that are better than the original, yet there is no way to easily remove them. You should check out the nLite program for making your own Windows image to get an idea of all of the cruft that is built into Windows (and isn't anywhere in the add/remove programs menu). With Linux, everything outside of the Kernel can be removed, usually without even restarting. With Windows you need to reinstall just to remove most of this junk, and that's assuming you have the administrative knowledge to make your own custom image.

Re:While this may not please some... (1)

Shade of Pyrrhus (992978) | about 6 years ago | (#25141373)

But, never fear, Microsoft can innovate it.

And patent it!

As long... (4, Insightful)

Shados (741919) | about 6 years ago | (#25140849)

As long as they make sure that OEMs include some. Any, doesn't matter if its Outlook, Windows Live Mail, or whatever third party or open source app you want... Else customers will not be too happy out of the box.

However, historically, with other things that were not included (like, let say, anti-virus for a while), the total trash that OEMs put on it (because they're paid to) really sucks ass, even if there are free alternatives that are really, really good.

Customers are not going to be happy...

Re:As long... (3, Insightful)

Dionysus (12737) | about 6 years ago | (#25141119)

When it comes to apps like Windows Mail, I doubt the average person will notice. My impression is that most non-geek, people use webmail.

Re:As long... (1)

PainKilleR-CE (597083) | about 6 years ago | (#25141233)

They'll just send you to windowslive.com when you click on the icon for email in the little tour thing that starts up on every new Windows installation. Then they'll walk you through setting up Passport err Live ID or whatever they call it now, and maybe they'll be able to actually download the software that would have come with a previous version of Windows at that point.

Or maybe they'll just say screw it and download someone else's product.

Re:As long... (2, Insightful)

jonbryce (703250) | about 6 years ago | (#25141401)

Most non-slashdotters use Internet Explorer for their email which is still shipping with Windows, or Outlook, which has never shipped with it.

EU lawsuit workaround + OpenSuse DVD FTW (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25140855)

To prevent issues in EU, MS does so.

However, some people with dial-up (there are still many) may find it difficult to download the apps.

OpenSuse DVD FTW!!! It comes with loads of apps. MS and Novell deal = profit

Re:EU lawsuit workaround + OpenSuse DVD FTW (1)

Thelasko (1196535) | about 6 years ago | (#25141125)

Yes, Microsoft was likely forced to do so because of the many lawsuits that were brought against them for bundling software. It would be a huge disadvantage for them to leave this software out, as it only increases the chances of the user downloading a competing product. Why should people go download Windows Mail over Thunderbird?

Yes, let's remove the two most-used programs (1)

InterBigs (780612) | about 6 years ago | (#25140861)

It's great that Microsoft wants to trim down their OS, but Mail and Photo applications seem like pretty basic apps to me. I'm glad Mac OS X comes with (the excellent) Mail.app and iPhoto. Then again, they're both a lot nicer than the Windows standard applications. So maybe it's a good decision by Microsoft to trim these after all, so people can download Thunderbird and Picasa or whatever. Why do I care anyway, I haven't used Windows in 4 years :)

Re:Yes, let's remove the two most-used programs (3, Insightful)

Vancorps (746090) | about 6 years ago | (#25140891)

You realize that Microsoft got in trouble for that right? Given the current climate it's okay for Apple to do it legally but if Microsoft included all the apps that Apple does then they'd be back in court the next day.

Re:Yes, let's remove the two most-used programs (5, Informative)

UnknowingFool (672806) | about 6 years ago | (#25141149)

Partly right. Microsoft didn't get prosecuted for merely being a monopoly or for bundling apps with their OS. They were prosecuted for abusing their monopoly to force competitors out of the market with unsavory tactics including threatening their own hardware partners. Intel wanted to develop a faster, cleaner Java compiler. Microsoft called a meeting insinuating that they were going to favor AMD in their development if they did. The made sure that their OEMs understood that to keep their OEMs prices, the OEMs would not pre-load Netscape onto their machines, etc.

For Apple to do the same thing, they would have to threaten BestBuy and Fry's that loading Picasa2 would be not tolerated and the like. Also Apple would make it nearly impossible to uninstall Mail or iPhoto. Right now to do that is the same as any other app: delete it. Now you can't fully uninstall QuickTime as some of the basic libraries of QuickTime are used in their Quartz rendering engine. But nothing stops you from using another movie player.

windows mail (1)

Haxx (314221) | about 6 years ago | (#25140863)

  I haven't used windows mail since I set up a small nt4 network for a company who refused to buy an email server back in '99.

Re:windows mail (1)

Vancorps (746090) | about 6 years ago | (#25140915)

I think you are referring to Outlook Express as Windows Mail is actually a new product and is far superior.

Re:windows mail (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141285)

It's called Window Live Mail, and it's slightly better than Outlook Express. Mostly it's the same program with a slicker but functionally equivalent interface.

Re:windows mail (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141103)

Are you thinking of Microsoft Mail - which was horrid = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Mail ????

*Microsoft* Mail is different than *Windows Mail*

standard apps? (1)

damn_registrars (1103043) | about 6 years ago | (#25140869)

Windows Movie Maker

What version of Windows did that ship with? I don't recall seeing that as a standard feature before... To say nothing of whether or not I think such a program deserves to be categorized as a "standard application" for an operating system.

Re:standard apps? (4, Informative)

andrewd18 (989408) | about 6 years ago | (#25140905)

Reinstalled your XP anytime recently? There's a basic version installed with the OS, assuming you didn't customize it with nLite.

Re:standard apps? (1)

armanox (826486) | about 6 years ago | (#25140947)

That was included by default starting with Windows XP - in all editions.

Re:standard apps? (1)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | about 6 years ago | (#25141317)

Erm, wasn't included until SP1, but other than that you're right.

Re:standard apps? (1)

Vancorps (746090) | about 6 years ago | (#25140949)

Came with XP SP1, SP2, and SP3 retail and OEM releases.

Re:standard apps? (1)

clark0r (925569) | about 6 years ago | (#25141143)

my VLK copy doesn't. it's a Microsoft branded CD, not any OEM disk.

Re:standard apps? (1)

Bohabo (1273432) | about 6 years ago | (#25140991)

To my knowledge, it's shipped with every home version of Windows since ME.

Re:standard apps? (1)

IBBoard (1128019) | about 6 years ago | (#25141171)

Not that I've had Windows as my main install for ages (it's now relegated to a virtual machine) but I read "Movie Maker" in the list and went "Huzzah! They've finally decided to ditch that crappy app they install in XP that I've never wanted to use and that I'd find a better alternative of if I did want to make movies". I've never understood why it was one of the core apps.

Stupid (4, Insightful)

bigstrat2003 (1058574) | about 6 years ago | (#25140871)

Among the apps for the chop are Windows Mail...

Er... I guess you don't see it this way, Microsoft, but I sure as hell always thought that checking your e-mail was basic computer functionality in this day and age. But hey, what do I know?

Microsoft can talk about a "cleaner" OS all they want, but watch them change their tune when people scream about not being able to check their e-mail on a new PC.

Re:Stupid (1)

TimothyDavis (1124707) | about 6 years ago | (#25140935)

What part of downloading it later did you not understand? Personally, I like the notion that I don't have to install a whole lot of crap that I wouldn't use otherwise.

Re:Stupid (3, Insightful)

bigstrat2003 (1058574) | about 6 years ago | (#25141095)

Dude, we're talking about normal users here. There are people who won't know that you can download it, even if Microsoft puts a bright red flashing splash screen up when you first start Windows 7. This is a bad idea. Besides, I'm sure that your porn/warez/mp3/whatever collection won't suffer with the 100 MB that you free up by not having this.

Re:Stupid (4, Insightful)

Dionysus (12737) | about 6 years ago | (#25141137)

Dude, normal users use webmail. They don't even know how to set up pop to download their email.

Re:Stupid (1)

sadgoblin (1269500) | about 6 years ago | (#25141271)

Remember this [slashdot.org] ? I think most of them will get pretty mad once they can't find the mail application on their freshly installed OS.

Re:Stupid (1)

dotgain (630123) | about 6 years ago | (#25141399)

Personally, I like the notion of not having to download a whole lot of crap that I'm bound to use on Day 1.

Re:Stupid (3, Insightful)

Drakin020 (980931) | about 6 years ago | (#25140973)

The majority of people are just fine using web mail via gmail, hotmail, yahoo etc...

It's not going to be an issue.

Re:Stupid (2, Insightful)

at.drinian (1180281) | about 6 years ago | (#25141131)

The sort of people who you think would use a pre-loaded mail program are in fact using webmail as we speak -- and wouldn't have a clue how to set up a POP or IMAP account anyway. This is a good step.

Re:Stupid (1)

clark0r (925569) | about 6 years ago | (#25141165)

there's nothing to say that windows won't automatically download these during the initial setup. if there's a wizard to select to have them automatically download during windows first boot, then that would be a good way of helping n00bs out.

Re:Stupid (1)

imsabbel (611519) | about 6 years ago | (#25141211)

Those people are NEVER smart enough to enter an smtp/imap address anyway.

Re:Stupid (1)

bigstrat2003 (1058574) | about 6 years ago | (#25141333)

Well, no. They terrorize their ISP's tech support instead.

Will they take MSIE out as well? (5, Insightful)

erroneus (253617) | about 6 years ago | (#25140873)

That would be newsworthy!

Re:Will they take MSIE out as well? (5, Insightful)

qoncept (599709) | about 6 years ago | (#25141145)

Nothing like not being able to download a web browser because you don't have a web browser!

Re:Will they take MSIE out as well? (1)

77Punker (673758) | about 6 years ago | (#25141201)

They should just include cURL, then people can download whatever they want. (sarcasm)

Re:Will they take MSIE out as well? (2, Funny)

Qalthos (1220310) | about 6 years ago | (#25141177)

Yeah, really... let's think about that for a minute:

User installs Windows, only to find no browser installed by default. "That's okay," says the user, "I'll just download one... from the Internet... without a browser..."

Easily removable and decoupled from the system I could see. But let's not get silly.

The "Internet" does not start with "E" (1)

erroneus (253617) | about 6 years ago | (#25141275)

Not only would it appease various legal observers by following the instructions given to them by courts, it would be the right thing to do.

All that would be needed in its place would be "select the browser of your choice" followed by a menu which would include MSIE, Firefox, Opera, Safari or any of the others that don't come to mind.

Re:Will they take MSIE out as well? (2, Insightful)

supernova_hq (1014429) | about 6 years ago | (#25141343)

The problem would be that they would probably make some kind of proprietary "download windows program" system that doesn't even use the browser. This would be similar to Linux's repositories, but you would not be able to change the list of download servers. So yes, you would need to download IE, install IE, then download FF and install FF... :(

deadly sins... (0, Offtopic)

Speare (84249) | about 6 years ago | (#25140917)

Anyone else bemused by the screen mockups using a "Windows Se7en" logo written that way? As in the gore-thrill movie of a killer highlighting the se7en deadly sins?

So what you're saying is... (2, Insightful)

MisterSquirrel (1023517) | about 6 years ago | (#25140919)

... they're making it more like Linux distros?

Excellent idea.

Re:So what you're saying is... (2, Insightful)

Drakin020 (980931) | about 6 years ago | (#25141017)

Or a less flamebait'ish way would be to say that they are making it more like their Server OS...But hey...whatever floats your boat.

Re:So what you're saying is... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141173)

yeah, because the last time i downloaded the most popular linux distro it hadn't already installed openoffice, pidgin, gimp, a handful of games, a bittorrent client or an e-mail client... get real about your fanboism here, linux distros do the bloat thing just fine.

Re:So what you're saying is... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141179)

God, I hope not. You'd need a degree in computer science or a lifetime sitting in a darkened room just to memorise all the nonsensical syntax required to perform basic tasks which can be accomplished in a few clicks of the mouse on Windows or Mac OS.

Yeah, excellent idea.

vista on the outside (1)

hcrejazz (1371323) | about 6 years ago | (#25140941)

Whoa vista with the name changed to windows 7. I wonder if this will trick corporate into upgrading..

So after years of... (1)

YanceyAI (192279) | about 6 years ago | (#25140959)

...users complaining that MS adds too much to their OS, they're listening? Bull!!!

It' not about the apps (5, Insightful)

fishthegeek (943099) | about 6 years ago | (#25140963)

It's about the training of the consumer to accept upselling to subscription based services.

Re:It' not about the apps (1)

DigitAl56K (805623) | about 6 years ago | (#25141263)

This does not sound like a subscription issue to me. Download once does not imply subscription.

What it does sound like is more apps/functionality being secured by Genuine Advantage. I wonder if these apps will also become part of the top pricing tier SKUs after MS failed to deliver much of interest to Vista Ultimate users.

Honestly, what's a "research" (1, Informative)

stonecypher (118140) | about 6 years ago | (#25141019)

Mike Elgan doesn't know what he's talking about. Microsoft has been discussing the significant kernel changes in MinWin for more than a year now. It's a _huge_ technological difference, biggest since 98 ->L xp.

Re:Honestly, what's a "research" (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141261)

Except minwin was chopped from Windows 7-- and instead they're going with an 'evolution' of the NT-series Vista kernel.

Re:Honestly, what's a "research" (1)

arotenbe (1203922) | about 6 years ago | (#25141403)

In fact, Slashdot ran a story on it [slashdot.org] a while back. It's the same thing they did with Vista: announce some huge redesign, then progressively scale it back until the only thing changed is the UI.

Interestingly, every other OS except Windows 7 includes all of these programs and more by default. Basically, Microsoft is trading a lack of functionality for not having to implement a decent uninstall feature (or, even better, a package manager).

Idiotic move (1)

melted (227442) | about 6 years ago | (#25141033)

I think the motivation there is to stuff the OS with download links so that people go to Live.com and download this crud from there instead. This is typical for people who have never offered any software for download and install from their web site. The harsh reality is that only a few percent of users will download, and out of those who do, not all will install. So they'll see a very temporary blip followed by people just going to Google instead. If I have to download, I might as well download Picasa and Thunderbird instead.

At least get the name right... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141043)

It's going to be known as "Microsoft Windows Vista 7" or "Vista 7" for short. There is NO "Windows 7", just Vista gussied up a bit.

A pig is still a pig, even when it's in a dress. (Wish I had known that when I was 20 yo!)

Wow, really. (1)

Auckerman (223266) | about 6 years ago | (#25141075)

If the final product of a redesign of an unfavorably viewed operating system has it's e-mail client be written in such a way that it's seen as bloat, you need to seriously reconsider your design philosophy. How hard could it be Microsoft, make the applications in a way that does NOT mix their files and settings into the operating system, has all the files stored in one folder (per application), and uses no registry settings what so ever. Then it won't be bloat, because it's merely existence on the system will have no affect on total performance. Lead the way to proper application development while making it easy for other developers to do so too and sometime in the future shut off the old way of doing things.

I honestly don't understand why they aren't doing that.

Re:Wow, really. (1)

Dan667 (564390) | about 6 years ago | (#25141251)

They should get rid of the registry all together. It is a wasteland of bloat and causes more problems than it solves.

Not going to complain (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141093)

If Windows 7 is to Vista what XP SP2 was to XP, then I have no problem with it.

I just need enough of the OS to run in a virtual machine so I can use my legacy crap.

They forgot IE (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141127)

It's a shame, really.

New Vista? (5, Insightful)

Sasayaki (1096761) | about 6 years ago | (#25141129)

Well, if it's Vista minus the bloatware, DRM and huge resource requirements... it might be actually a decent operating system.

Interesting that Microsoft appears to be actually listening to their users over Vista. That, or they're panicking and being forced to...

Re:New Vista? (1)

elysiana (1152995) | about 6 years ago | (#25141377)

One out of three ain't bad...

Auto-Update (3, Insightful)

Light303 (1335283) | about 6 years ago | (#25141133)

I can already see Windows7 being shipped without all that useless bloatware ...
... and having it all installed again after selecting all "important" "security" updates ...

I'm a slashdot user.... (5, Funny)

webappsec (854813) | about 6 years ago | (#25141141)

and no matter what Microsoft does I'm going to bitch and complain about how they should/shouldn't have done it years ago and that Linux is far superior.

as long as they keep minesweeper and freecell (1)

Trepidity (597) | about 6 years ago | (#25141147)

Sure, when you're stuck on a windows box with time to kill, there's always web games if it's got an internet connection and a browser, but I like being able to assume that I'll always have Minesweeper and FreeCell to waste my time.

Vista or 7? (2, Informative)

puppyfox (833883) | about 6 years ago | (#25141169)

A few months ago I specifically asked how will Windows 7 differ from Vista to a friend of mine who happens to be a Project Manager in the Windows team. He obviously couldn't go into too many details, but admitted that the changes are "evolutionary", not "revolutionary", so it's NOT going to be anything like the 3.1 to 95 or XP to Vista transitions. It's more like Windows 95 to 98 (my friend confirmed my analogy was appropriate).

You can call it repackaging if you want, and it may not even be worth an upgrade, but it could work well enough for people to move on from XP. There's a chance, after all Windows 2008 is better than Windows 2003, and mostly because it's more nimble and modular when you install it.

One component I'd like to see made optional (1)

jandrese (485) | about 6 years ago | (#25141175)

The only thing that would save it is if they make the DRM stuff an optional module you have to download.

Suits me just fine (1)

Duncan Blackthorne (1095849) | about 6 years ago | (#25141199)

That'll save me -- and likely many people -- the trouble of having to get the chainsaw and hack Outlook Express out of the thing, and installing something like Thunderbird. Of course that'll be about 10 years from now; I'm just today starting to transition my main desktop machine over to XP this week.

Re:Suits me just fine (1)

Vancorps (746090) | about 6 years ago | (#25141339)

You can't just remove it from Add/Remove Programs? What version of Windows are you running? I don't even install it with my nlite stuff. Sure there are some extra files left over but you're not running them.

Outlook Express was crap so I can understand wanting to remove it. Windows Mail is a decent and well streamlined app though.

Windows 95-Windows 98 anyone? (1)

jd142 (129673) | about 6 years ago | (#25141255)

I'd be surprised if Windows 7 really was a huge re-working of the OS. It seems like they are following the same path they did when they released Windows 98. 98 looked and felt almost identical to 95, but had enough improvements that it made people want to switch.

Telnet? (1)

ThanatosMinor (1046978) | about 6 years ago | (#25141303)

Leaner can be better and I'm all for not having all kinds of pointless apps in my OS installation, but I hope they think about what's necessary a little harder than they did when deciding to remove the telnet client from the default install of Vista.
How about putting in some more useful utilities and maybe a truly powerful CLI that can rival bash?

Windows 7 and touch technology (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25141305)

"So in May, Windows 7 was envisioned as something with multi-touch "throughout the OS," and potentially with a photo tool for managing pictures with your fingers"

I don't understand the fascination with touch technology for a desktop PC. For something like the iphone it makes sense, as you don't want to carry a mouse around with you or even have to pull out a stylus to interact with it. I have no desire to sit at my desk with my arms extended constantly, applying fingerprints to my monitor when I have a perfectly good mouse (trackball in my case) that I can use with my arms relaxed at my side.

Captain Obvious strikes again (1)

jollyreaper (513215) | about 6 years ago | (#25141331)

"tech pundit Mike Elgan posits that the rushed-to-market Windows 7 -- due in 2010, now being beta released this October -- may in fact merely be Vista with new packaging.

Well, duh! It was either that or simply reissue XP as-is and call it Windows Classic.

other software (1)

samsonov (581161) | about 6 years ago | (#25141355)

how about IE? oh yeah, forgot that it was integrated into the OS...

Leap Frog Development (1)

aarenz (1009365) | about 6 years ago | (#25141365)

How many people remember the MS method? The team and desingers that made Vista, should be working on Windows 8. If they follow their normal plan, then windows 7 would be XP with some touch ups similar to vista. The code cutover to the next team usually happens during one of the betas, so they had a large part of the next OS done before they released Vista. It may be that they just redress Vista, but more likely it will have some bad traits from XP rather than the bad items from Vista.

freshly done (1)

floatingrunner (621481) | about 6 years ago | (#25141371)

it's a start. not prefect but at least i feel safer not worrying about lots of things in my compy that i won't ever use or even look at.

Good move on marketing wise... (1)

Fezzick (913356) | about 6 years ago | (#25141393)

I think its actually a great idea on their part...

Remove all the accessory apps, and make them available free for download all in one place. That way, people can see a list of all these great free applications that are available only on Windows.

Much better than having them preinstalled and Joe SixPack not knowing that they're there among all the other crappy OEM software. Probably also puts them in better light with the EU too.

No more Windows Movie Maker? (1)

supernova_hq (1014429) | about 6 years ago | (#25141395)

I run Linux with a small XP install for my games (I have really bad ATI drivers for Linux) where I have stripped out everything right down to the calculator. Well, everything but Windows Movie Maker...

When you can uninstall the freaking calculator, but not a bloated, seldom used video editor, there is something SERIOUSLY wrong with your operating system!
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