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Non-Chinese proof of this? (0, Flamebait)

MrMista_B (891430) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179019)

Forgive my skepticism, but this is exactly the sort of thing that China commonly lies about.

If true, it is a wonderous and stunning achievement, and they have my utpost respect and admiration.

However... again, this is exactly the sort of thing that China lies about.

Are there any sources of information on the validity of this that aren't controlled by the Chinese government, that verify their claims?

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (4, Insightful)

pembo13 (770295) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179067)

See, I don't mind being skeptical. What I don't understand is this blind of some countries, and unbridled skepticism of others.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179077)

What's there to be skeptical about? It's CHINKS IN SPACE!!

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (2, Insightful)

SecurityGuy (217807) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179117)

I think it's something about announcing launches, with detailed transcripts of conversations, before they happen. Sending underage athletes to international events, swearing they're of age even after evidence is found that they're not. Sadly, the list goes on and on.

At some point, distrust and skepticism becomes the norm.

Your point is well taken that all governments lie, and necessarily so. Some governments lie a lot about things that don't seem worth lying about.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (0, Redundant)

Compulawyer (318018) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179231)

Hear hear!

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179359)

American shit-eaters of the broken economy country are jealous again!!!
Your country is a piece of shit and owes to China more than 5 trillion dollars in foreign debit!
You are the most pathetic loser place in the planet! You are falling down hard and quick!
That is why China, and Russia, and Venezuela, and Iran, and North Korea and all the other countries you invaded and explored are getting together for the day that we going to destroy your pathetic country and take our revenge!

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179537)

Just try not to kill everyone on the planet when you do it, mmmkay?

And also... (0, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179919)

While you are counting all that money don't forget that your factories are now all moving out of China to places like Vietnam where labor is cheaper...

Oh and seeing that the businesses that are designing, distributing, and purchasing all of the factory output are almost all foreign...
Hey! You aren't going to be part of the revenue stream anymore!!! I bet that the $5,000 per person in debt will go a long way when after the inflated wage structure crashes...

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (4, Insightful)

lysergic.acid (845423) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179417)

i would have agreed with you when i first read that article yesterday, but i couldn't understand why the Chinese government would lie about a launch that they already spent so much time and money preparing for, and were clearly going to carry out.

it wasn't until some other slashdotters remarked that this could have simply been a prepped news story, which is a common practice in mainstream media, and that the transcripts were probably holder text--still a bad idea i think, but at least understandable.

and it should be noted that this time there was live video footage. and it would be a pretty stupid thing to try to fake a space mission. i mean, cheating in the olympics, or any other sports, is something that you can get away with (and i have no doubt that plenty of countries have gotten away with on many occasions), but faking a space mission is more along the lines of lying about achieving cold fusion. there's just simply no way you can deceive people about that for more than a few weeks or months at most. so unless they plan on being ridiculed by the world later, it would be a very stupid thing to do.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (1)

sydneyfong (410107) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179579)

so unless they plan on being ridiculed by the world later, it would be a very stupid thing to do.

Exactly. I am still amazed by the people here who think the Chinese government could be that stupid on a national scale.

Even the Bush administration isn't that crazy.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (5, Funny)

calmofthestorm (1344385) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179727)

The Bush administration did fake the Iraq war to scare Americans into voting Democratic. I am so sick of these liberal ploys to take over the white house.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179717)

As Steve Jobs has died...

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179835)

and it should be noted that this time there was live video footage. and it would be a pretty stupid thing to try to fake a space mission. i mean, cheating in the olympics, or any other sports, is something that you can get away with (and i have no doubt that plenty of countries have gotten away with on many occasions), but faking a space mission is more along the lines of lying about achieving cold fusion. there's just simply no way you can deceive people about that for more than a few weeks or months at most. so unless they plan on being ridiculed by the world later, it would be a very stupid thing to do.

Oh, so you're one of those people who believe that the US landed on the Moon?

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (5, Interesting)

Nethemas the Great (909900) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179467)

I think it's something about announcing launches, with detailed transcripts of conversations, before they happen.

If I am remembering correctly a news outlet in China published "accidentally," the story with a conversation transcript. While it is possible that that was exactly what was going to be published following the launch/spacewalk it could well have been a "template" for the real story to be published after the launch. China likes to script and practice things with meticulous detail prior to the actual "public" event. They're trying to prove to the world and themselves that they are worthy of attention as a global powerhouse and it starts for them by putting their best foot forward. They don't want mistakes and/or embarassments and this is their way of mitigating it.

These folks have done in 10 years what has taken over 100 in the US in terms of industrialization and economics. Cut them a bit of slack... I'm grateful to the Chinese for their pursuit of space exploration. It provides healthy competition that has been lacking since the fall of the USSR. It may well be what is needed to get the money flowing back into NASA and instead of the likes of Blackwater and DoD more generally. Even if there's a bit of exageration--which may or may not be the case--it isn't as if we weren't doing the same thing to the Russians with our own space program.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (1)

zoogies (879569) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179775)

Why is this modded troll?

Seriously, guys.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (1)

pembo13 (770295) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179503)

Hey, I am not suggesting that you blindly trust the Chinese government to tell the truth.

er ... cough, cough ... (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179565)

I think it's something about announcing launches, with detailed transcripts of conversations, before they happen. Sending underage athletes to international events, swearing they're of age even after evidence is found that they're not. Sadly, the list goes on and on.

At some point, distrust and skepticism becomes the norm.

Your point is well taken that all governments lie, and necessarily so. Some governments lie a lot about things that don't seem worth lying about.

I think it's something about announcing imminent danger and WMD's, with detailed descriptions and sworn statements, when they don't exist. Sending armies to make war under false pretenses, swearing that enormous threats exist even after zero evidence is found that they exist. Tragically, the list goes on and on.

At some point, distrust and skepticism becomes the norm.

Your point is well taken that all governments lie. Some governments lie a lot about things that then cause a lot of unnecessary death, misery and anguish for others.

Still, their people get to keep driving Hummers, so that makes it OK, right?

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179637)

I think it's something about announcing launches, with detailed transcripts of conversations, before they happen. Sending underage athletes to international events, swearing they're of age even after evidence is found that they're not. Sadly, the list goes on and on.

At some point, distrust and skepticism becomes the norm.

Your point is well taken that all governments lie, and necessarily so. Some governments lie a lot about things that don't seem worth lying about.

You are clearly an idiot. What kind of person/people (other than you) as prestigious as the People's Republic of China would lie about something like this? If you don't have something smart and worthy to share, don't share it. You don't even deserve to be connected to the Internet.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (3, Informative)

MrMista_B (891430) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179137)

Oh, I don't blindly trust any countries government. Rather, I trust any countries government to say only what makes them look best, true or not.

More importantly, because just recently, China announced the exactly same story http://news.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/09/25/2145209 [slashdot.org] *before* they had even *launched*...

Well.

Just as it's not good to discount /everything/ that some countries announce, sometimes the skepticism is well earned.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (1)

Neoprofin (871029) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179175)

I have to agree though, considering just how recently they announced their successful launch before they ever left the ground.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179115)

That's probably why they broadcasted it "live" on TV?

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (1, Troll)

Compulawyer (318018) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179239)

The same way the fireworks at the opening ceremonies of the Olympics were broadcast "live" ?

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (2, Insightful)

zoogies (879569) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179781)

You mean the fireworks that actually happened? How much do you know about your supposed fake fireworks anyway?

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (4, Insightful)

CWRUisTakingMyMoney (939585) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179911)

To clarify (and agree), the fireworks depicted during the opening ceremony did in fact go off as shown. The actual footage everyone saw, unless they were in Beijing, was a computer-rendered simulation of the same fireworks. The reason they were animated for broadcast is that the shot shown of the fireworks would have been at best difficult and dangerous, and at worst impossible, to do for real and live. I don't really see the big deal for this; it's basically some special effects showing an angle that couldn't otherwise be shown. It's like all the news networks doing a story about West Bumfuck, Iowa, and using Google Earth to do a fairly nifty zoom-in-from-orbit effect because that obviously can't be done for real. But nobody screams at CNN for that. Of course, that being said, I don't exactly give China the benefit of the doubt for things they have a real motive to lie about, like space missions.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (3, Informative)

8127972 (73495) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179129)

Your skepticism is likely well placed. These are the same people who posted details about the launch hours before the actual launch took place:

http://gizmodo.com/5054776/china-launch-success-hits-web-hours-before-actual-blast+off [gizmodo.com]

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (4, Insightful)

DavidD_CA (750156) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179341)

I don't think it's that unusual for a press agency to write about events before they happen. They're expected to put out a release almost immediately to various wires (like AP), or they'll get scooped by other reporters and bloggers.

I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt and suggest that they wrote the release as I would expect, and it somehow got out before it should have.

You can also bet that both of our US Presidential candidates are already working on their acceptance speeches, and will have them completed days before the election even takes place. I'm sure their campaigns' press releases already have quotes in them, too.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (4, Interesting)

Richard_at_work (517087) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179367)

Yeah, like theres never been a press report of a major event that hasn't gone out accidentally before time? Like, say, the BBC News report of Building 7 collapsing several minutes before it actually did.....

It was a fuckup, nothing more imho.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179283)

They delivered some Beijing Duck to the ISS

Chinese Food [youtube.com]

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (1)

vertinox (846076) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179325)

Forgive my skepticism, but this is exactly the sort of thing that China commonly lies about.

The fact they had a spacewalk or the fact they did it without loss of human life?

Really, there is nothing gained long term if they lie about a space walk and frankly Soviets did it without lying. They could have, but so could the Americans about the moon.

Secondly, it would be easier to send up a few people to die than actually fake it. Not to mention that anyone can intercept the signals they are broadcasting. Sure they could have sent up a video to broadcast from space, but if they are going to do that they just need to shove someone out into space and get home without incident.

Bah! (1)

Greyfox (87712) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179371)

It's CHINA! There are, like, a BILLION of them! They could get to the moon by standing on each others' shoulders!

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (2, Funny)

jollyreaper (513215) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179507)

Forgive my skepticism, but this is exactly the sort of thing that China commonly lies about.

Finally conspiracy tards will be satisfied, there really will be a faked moon landing.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (1)

cyfer2000 (548592) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179733)

And there is only a faked laser reflector on the moon too.

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (1)

sycotic (26352) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179585)

Surely someone can get out a telescope and see if there is a little man floating around in the sky?

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (1)

sydneyfong (410107) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179627)

Given that China is emerging as a new player in space technology, the USA is probably watching the event closely. Ask them.

But then, this is exactly the sort of thing that US government lies about ;-p (other countries having threatening technology that could be applied for military use)

Seriously, when has China lied about space missions?

Re:Non-Chinese proof of this? (5, Funny)

freya_bacchus (764907) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179737)

china faked a spacewalk and the US faked a moonlanding, US still ahead

Nothing to see here...

Successful Spacewalk at 8:40am! (3, Funny)

Toonol (1057698) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179027)

This announcement brought to you by the freedom-loving Chinese Press at 7:20am.

Re:Successful Spacewalk at 8:40am! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179131)

I was thinking:

"This announcement brought to you by the Chinese Ministry of Truth"

Is it for real this time? (2, Interesting)

johanatan (1159309) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179043)

I wonder if the dialog amongst the spacemen was any different this time?

SZ7 (1)

garconcn (1087697) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179073)

Congratulation!

Re:SZ7 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179505)

Thank!

Old news (5, Funny)

SL Baur (19540) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179079)

I read about this last week on an English language Chinese news website.

American Presidential Election Results...? (1)

PolygamousRanchKid (1290638) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179557)

. . . so I guess I won't have to stay up on election night waiting for the results . . .

That site will have them a week in advance . . . yoo-hoo!

Right. (1, Troll)

Kid Zero (4866) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179087)

This is an important step in China's goal of building an orbiting space station and sending astronauts to the moon

Yeah, right. You've got a couple more steps before you can move into the Moon Base, speedy.

That's not quite the point... (5, Insightful)

interactive_civilian (205158) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179179)

The point is that they are building their space program. You have to consider Asian, and especially East Asian thinking. They aren't like the west with its "profit immediately or forget about it" thinking. When I see China putting men into space (the third country to do so after Soviet Russia and then the USA) and now doing space walks, that means they already have a long term plan to set up semi-permanent if not permanent colonies in orbit or on other celestial bodies.

See, they are not in a space race. They are doing this for their more distant future. When they do something like this, they aren't thinking of the next quarter's profits or even the next year's. They are thinking in terms of the next generation or the generation after.

And, I applaud them for it. It is nice to see homo sapiens thinking long term about getting off this pale blue dot of ours, and not only thinking about it but taking active steps towards such a goal. I couldn't care less what language they are speaking or what country they are from. They are humans and they are making the effort that others seem to have given up on. Power to them.

Re:That's not quite the point... (1, Troll)

Tweenk (1274968) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179423)

When they do something like this, they aren't thinking of the next quarter's profits or even the next year's.

Instead, they are thinking about the propaganda benefits. It's something they must do to remain in power, so in a way they are also thinking short-term. Their primary motivation is not the advancement of humanity but maintaining the iron grip on the peoples' minds. Soviets have been there before.

PS: I think this was not faked, because propaganda has not to lie at least sometimes to work.

Re:That's not quite the point... (3, Insightful)

zoogies (879569) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179789)

What was the point of landing on the moon? Advancement of humanity, or inspiring the nation? "Propaganda benefits", you could say. We just really, really needed to prove that we could beat the Soviets.

Long-term planning (5, Insightful)

Comboman (895500) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179475)

You have to consider Asian, and especially East Asian thinking. They aren't like the west with its "profit immediately or forget about it" thinking.

Riiiiight. Because putting melamine in milk powder and antifreeze in toothpaste isn't about immediate profits, it's a long-term strategy for building a trusted brand.

Re:Long-term planning (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179651)

And putting the mad into cows. Oops, that's a Western specialty.

Face it, Western farmers didn't know what would happen from feeding sheeps' brains to cows. And Chinese manufacturers didn't know the consequences of spiking milk with melamine -- they thought they were improving the milk. You're just a hypocrite if you think only China makes fatal mistakes.

Re:Long-term planning (4, Insightful)

S.O.B. (136083) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179879)

And Chinese manufacturers didn't know the consequences of spiking milk with melamine -- they thought they were improving the milk. You're just a hypocrite if you think only China makes fatal mistakes.

Of course they knew exactly what they were doing. According to this article in April of 2007 from the New York Times [nytimes.com] it was an open "secret" that melamine could increase the appearance of protein in animal and human food products without adding any nutritional value.

"Many companies buy melamine scrap to make animal feed, such as fish feed," said Ji Denghui, general manager of the Fujian Sanming Dinghui Chemical Company, which sells melamine. "I don't know if there's a regulation on it. Probably not. No law or regulation says 'don't do it,' so everyone's doing it. The laws in China are like that, aren't they? If there's no accident, there won't be any regulation."

I'm amazed at how many apologists there are for these violations of public health by Chinese businesses and the lack of oversight by the Chinese government, a government that has no accountability to anyone. And because of how much China exports these corrupt business practices affect the health of people outside their borders.

I for one try, as much as possible, to avoid any products that come from China because I have no idea what I'm getting.

Re:Long-term planning (1)

cyfer2000 (548592) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179799)

This is a trick, a step in their long term strategy to make you think they are "profit immediately" type.

Re:That's not quite the point... (1)

Kjella (173770) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179613)

As much as I'd like to subscribe to that theory I think both this, the Olympics and several others activities they do is mostly about national pride. Whether it was the Cold War, the UN (where Taiwan had China's seat), the G8 (where Russia is a member and China not) and many other places China never seemed to get much attention nor cared much about it. With the turn to market economy though, clearly they've also wanted to show the world their prowess in engineering (olympic stadiums), culture (spectacular shows), sports (most gold medals), science and technology (spacewalk), environmentalism (they tried) and so on. Nothing negative or unusual about that, most people are proud over their country and its achievements and a lot of symbolic value that has all sort of positive effects. Some negative too but I don't see any reason to Godwin this story. I'm just saying that I think they do it a lot more for the here and now than any long term idealistic notion of mankind travelling the stars.

it is the same business (2, Insightful)

hackingbear (988354) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179671)

While they can make up whatever high goals -- to boost nationalism, to save the world, or whatever -- the entire execution is contingent on money and profits. China is a highly profit-driven place; a lot more than rich places. Companies have to see profits to do the tasks. And just like the U.S. and everywhere else in the world, China has to face the hurdle of creating job opportunities. Huge projects like these can save thousands jobs in their defunct state-owned factories. They also need to absorbs millions of college graduates every single year. Along the lines, officials also need to use these opportunities to take bribes to profit themselves.

That's exactly what happen in the U.S.: many companies need NASA projects for which they will hire thousands of people. Think about the scenario of laying off all the workers for the Shuttle program. Along the line, the politicians need to get donations.

So while pride and nationalism may play a role, these are largely about business and money.

Re:That's not quite the point... (2, Insightful)

sydneyfong (410107) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179705)

Yes and no.

In China, the lack of democracy means that you could plan for a distant future, as opposed to how you could get yourself (or your party) elected next term. In the west it's not "profit immediately or forget it" -- but rather "profit immediately, or otherwise the other party will revert it next term". China's current top-down approach in administration means it could move things with a definite purpose, rather than many individual working on their own interests.

But then, short term thinking is a common trait of the human species. On a national scale China is definitely heading in a clear and steady direction, but in smaller things I doubt there's much differences between the Chinese and anything else. For example, The Chinese, despite official prohibition, are really into gambling -- more so than the average westerner. And of course gambling is going to cause you to lose a lot of money in the long run...

The milk crisis in China now is of course another example as pointed out by another poster.

Re:Right. (1)

Frosty Piss (770223) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179351)

Yeah, right. You've got a couple more steps before you can move into the Moon Base, speedy.

Not a problem, it's all CG.

Re:Right. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179883)

First US Spacewalk: Gemini 4, 1965
First US Moonwalk: Apollo 11, 1969

Just one question... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179135)

Was that published before or after they left the spacecraft?

Why this anti-chinese winds? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179141)

Why are all posts so anti-chinese?

I love democracy and I live in a liberal western democratic country (Sweden), but I do not at all understand why all posts have to be so negative.

Lets critisize china when they do something bad. When they do something good like this, lets congratulate them! This is a great step forward, not only for china, but for all of humankind.

I honestly believe that China will be the space super-power during the 21st century and the faster they get there the better for ALL OF US - EVEN AMERICANS!

So lets just cheer and celebrate this success! Congratulate the astronauts and engineers that made this possible. It is impressive and it is a fantastic work no matter if you are a russian, american or chinese.

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (2, Insightful)

pjt33 (739471) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179209)

When you say, "All posts", by my count there were 14 posts before yours. One of them was congratulating China, and the rest rather than being anti-Chinese were debating whether the article was true or not, given the history of Chinese news reporting - with two links to articles about previous false reporting on this very issue in the Chinese press. I'm sure some of the posters will be willing to congratulate China once they have independent verification of the feat.

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179221)

There are people starving to death in China. Yet they choose to use money for arms race. So it is evil.

Nobody doubts that China will be THE next super power, much more so than Amerika ever was.

You and perhaps your children will learn to hate the yellow race, take my word.

Jealousy, of course (4, Insightful)

Chemisor (97276) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179237)

China is sending men into space. We are scrapping our only way of getting into space. Talk about progress...

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (1, Flamebait)

moderatorrater (1095745) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179257)

Why are all posts so anti-chinese?

Because they're an authoritarian government that lies all the time?

This is a great step forward, not only for china, but for all of humankind.

This is almost old hat for Russian and American astronauts (or cosmonauts or whatever). Any country could work with those two space programs and complete a space walk on their own. I wouldn't be surprised if the ESA has already done this as well and I just haven't heard of it. In other words, the third or fourth country doing this isn't a great step forward for all humankind, it's one more country catching up to where other countries were decades ago.

In addition, China's extra space capacity isn't a good thing. Space so far has been nothing but a wagging match between Russia and the US, it's been relatively free of military conflict. If we want space to become something other than a place to conduct science and take some pictures, then increasing China's space capabilities is a great way to start.

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179321)

Because they're an authoritarian government that lies all the time?

that sounds like a certain western country we all know about

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (1)

Richard_at_work (517087) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179403)

So, competition is good, unless its by a country you really dont like? That seems to be what you are saying...

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (4, Insightful)

vertinox (846076) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179445)

Because they're an authoritarian government that lies all the time?

As compared to our pseudo-authoritarian government that lies all the time?

Sure I can speak out against the government and not worry about being hauled off (generally), but the USA actually has a greater ratio of its citizens in prisons than China does in there.

So statically, if you are an US citizen you are more likley to be in prison than you are a Chinese citizen. Maybe we just have more criminals over here, but sometimes it just feels like this anti-Chinese sentiment is pot calling kettle black.

Also the top three nations of users of the death penalty are China, Iran, and the US (in that order). Seems like we have a lot in common.

Sometimes I start to wonder to myself that the only difference between the USA and China is that over there they know they aren't free while over here we're just duped into thinking that we are until we actually break a law.

Yeah, given the choice I'd rather live here than over there, but sometimes I wonder if only that pent up frustration against China could be directed at our own government so that we can actually someday hopefully change the path towards a more democratic state for everyone and not just those are in the majority way of thinking.

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (1)

randomc0de (928231) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179553)

sometimes it just feels like this anti-Chinese sentiment is pot calling kettle black.

What if the pot and the kettle are both black, and we just hope to god screaming about it might clean things up.
What's your alternative? That we stop complaining, stfu, and slit our wrists?

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (1)

sydneyfong (410107) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179555)

Sometimes I start to wonder to myself that the only difference between the USA and China is that over there they know they aren't free while over here we're just duped into thinking that we are until we actually break a law.

As an outsider (non-American) I don't wonder -- I think that ;-p

Most people in China know what they're missing out (Chinese don't know about the Tienanmen Square incident? You gotta be kidding. It was widely reported until the day of the crackdown). Most Americans think America is the land of the free. Eh.

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (1)

Korveck (1145695) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179779)

"Sure I can speak out against the government and not worry about being hauled off (generally), but the USA actually has a greater ratio of its citizens in prisons than China does in there.

So statically, if you are an US citizen you are more likley to be in prison than you are a Chinese citizen. Maybe we just have more criminals over here, but sometimes it just feels like this anti-Chinese sentiment is pot calling kettle black."

That's a misleading statistic. China's population is so much larger than the US. Do you think China can afford putting so many people in prison? Don't forget China executes far more criminals, who would be serving decades or whole life in prison in US for the same crime committed.

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179791)

Perhaps the higher capital punishment levels in China explains the lower prisoner to population ratios, or perhaps they just Lie about their prison population.

Amazingly some people thought to label you as insightful, astonishing. By the way, had any milk lately?

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (1)

Sam00 (1251706) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179801)

the USA actually has a greater ratio of its citizens in prisons than China does in there.

As if statistics concerning people in prison in China were valid. I lol'd.

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (1)

copponex (13876) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179489)

Why are all posts so anti-chinese?

Because they're an authoritarian government that lies all the time?

Name one non-authoritarian government, or even one that tells the truth.

This is almost old hat for Russian and American astronauts (or cosmonauts or whatever). Any country could work with those two space programs and complete a space walk on their own. I wouldn't be surprised if the ESA has already done this as well and I just haven't heard of it. In other words, the third or fourth country doing this isn't a great step forward for all humankind, it's one more country catching up to where other countries were decades ago.

In addition, China's extra space capacity isn't a good thing. Space so far has been nothing but a wagging match between Russia and the US, it's been relatively free of military conflict. If we want space to become something other than a place to conduct science and take some pictures, then increasing China's space capabilities is a great way to start.

China is letting the West know that the militarization of space is a game that they can play as well. The technology required to put a human in space isn't anything to sneeze at. Considering that China's economy was a failure in the same period that we had the Apollo program, it's one of the many signs that they are ready to become the worlds most powerful economy.

We'd do well to recognize real threats, like resource wars involving the militarization of space between world powers, and have some diplomatic summits to address these issues now before they are species threatening. This would require serious politics, which I'm afraid isn't possible in America, especially with viewpoints like the one you just presented.

Russia is going to present their draft UN resolution against the militarization of space on September 29th. It will not be covered in a major way by any American news organization.

Here's an interesting paper from 1989 discussing the topic. It's conclusion: the world must develop a new ethic towards war -- someday -- to avoid the destruction of every major civilization, but until then, the US needs to build weapons for placement in orbit. I'm not sure the writer realized what he was saying.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/space/library/report/1989/DCA.htm [globalsecurity.org]

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179655)

If we want space to become something other than a place to conduct science and take some pictures, then increasing China's space capabilities is a great way to start.

Sounds good to me. Conducting science (I doubt that most of the long-term zero g experiments are that crucial) and taking pictures is the first thing to be hit by budget cuts. If there were commercial interests behind it, space exploration would certainly be in a better state than now. If these expanded interests include space militarization then so be it, nukes can be delivered anywhere on the planet without being launched from space so it'll hardly make matters worse. Besides, GPS and spy satellites could be counted as parts of military conflicts even now.

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179313)

Wow, refreshingly sober post amid considerable "my penis is shrinking and I have to strike out at somebody" comments.

I guess some people just cannot stand others doing well, especially when their own economy is in the toilet, crime is getting out of control, and their own society is in almost certain decline.

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (1)

MrMista_B (891430) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179347)

Oh, I'm perfectly willing to celebrate, once I know it's true. Remember, just awhile ago, the posted details of the launch, /before/ they launched: http://gizmodo.com/5054776/china-launch-success-hits-web-hours-before-actual-blast+off [gizmodo.com]

Why is it anti-Chinese to want to celebrate /real/ Chinese achievements?

The concern that I have is that this may also be faked.

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (1)

rocketman768 (838734) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179385)

I guess you're right.

Good job Chinese! You're following the U.S.' footsteps to faking the world that you're going to the moon! Hooray!

:)

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179633)

Why are all posts so anti-chinese?

I love democracy and I live in a liberal western democratic country (Sweden), but I do not at all understand why all posts have to be so negative.

Because they are fascists. Fascism is an anathema to democracy and freedom.

Your post is akin to asking why good and evil cannot coexist together in harmony.

[And yes, I, as a free person, am going to say that democracy is good and fascism is evil.]

Re:Why this anti-chinese winds? (1)

Mr. Stibbons (1204588) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179725)

I can definitely see why many people are skeptical about this. As a previous poster mentioned, after enough lying/propaganda, it gets hard to simply take their word for it. I myself have to seriously wonder. However, I am inclined to believe them, this time, at least. Achieving a spacewalk shouldn't be that hard for a sufficiently modern, industrialized society. And if they really have, then YES! Let's celebrate! Not just for their own success, but for the sense of competition that (hopefully) our scientists and (especially) politicians will feel to actually push forward again in this area.

As an avid consumer of their products (0, Redundant)

future assassin (639396) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179145)

I for one welcome our Chinese space walking overlords.

competition (5, Insightful)

wizardforce (1005805) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179153)

Hopefully China will make a real push for space forcing the US to get off its arse in regard to the final frontier...

Re:competition (1)

Nutria (679911) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179241)

forcing the US to get off its arse in regard to the final frontier...

A country that sends half it's money to foreigners and transfers the other half from Earners to Dead Weight isn't going anywhere.

Re:competition (1)

evilviper (135110) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179673)

Hopefully China will make a real push for space forcing the US to get off its arse in regard to the final frontier...

Yes, because The Universe works on the "finders, keepers" principle.

Re:competition (1)

wizardforce (1005805) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179889)

whoever gets space travel pinned down first is going to have a pretty good advantage over other nations. The GPS constellation, satellites in general and space resources [energy, research and mining to name a few]

Re:competition (1)

Tweenk (1274968) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179687)

Why do we take the notion that space exploration and colonization is desirable as granted? Will it make us feel better, or is this some attempt to find new resources to fuel our consumerist frenzy for which the Earth is becoming too small? Would you want to live on another planet in the solar system, where you couldn't go outside without a pressure suit, where you'd have to depend on complicated machines to support every second of your fragile life?

Of course there are other important considerations, including less egoistic ones. However, the gist remains valid. The concept of colonizing other planets is exciting, and this may happen in some very distant future, but for now the fact is that Earth is the best place for us, and I for one wouldn't want to live anywhere else. Rather than finding new worlds to consume we could start caring more about our own, so it remains the best place for humans to live.

Re:competition (1)

wizardforce (1005805) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179863)

there is nothing wrong with consumption, there is most definitely something wrong with exhausting Earth's resources and forcibly taking resources against the will of one person for the benefit of another. limiting consumption in of its self will not solve the problem, only prolong it- what we need to do is find less ecologically damaging methods of producing what we need. don't forget that some of the most ecologically damaging technologies were born out of poverty not excess [see china]

Why do we take the notion that space exploration and colonization is desirable as granted?

because Earth has a finite quantity of resources that we'd be foolish to exhaust and frankly given a choice between exhausting all of the resources of Earth, our home planet and all its inhabitants and some dead rock out in space, I'll take exhausting the dead rock in space any day.

Would you want to live on another planet in the solar system, where you couldn't go outside without a pressure suit, where you'd have to depend on complicated machines to support every second of your fragile life?

well, yes if I had the opportunity I'd be all for taking the risk. Why? I'd rather risk my life to learn something new and explore than sit here on Earth completely safe but unable to go out and explore what is out there.

Rather than finding new worlds to consume we could start caring more about our own

why do you assume that it needs to be one or the other? .2% of our GDP goes to space exploration, less than .0001% resulted in spaceship one and the beginnings of space tourism. by contrast, we spent nearly 6% of our GDP on the military [holy forty times that batman], much of which is used for meddling in our countys' affairs, heck we have 200,000 troops sitting in Germany and Japan [our allies no less] consuming an order of a magnitude more resources than the space program ever did for no good reason! I think you're confused as to where our resources are being wasted.

Sponsored by... (5, Funny)

TheModelEskimo (968202) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179159)

...your local Walmart.

You mean Taikonaut (1)

OricAtmos48K (979353) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179189)

A chinese astronaut is called ...

Re:You mean Taikonaut (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179345)

No, they are not called "Taikonauts".
That's a:
1) stupid term made up by a translator.
2) stupid idea to have a different term for each country's astronauts.

We went over this last time this discussion came up. (article about the plans for a spacewalk)

They mean that the space walk is tomorrow! (2, Funny)

itsybitsy (149808) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179205)

Since they like to make announcements of upcoming events as if they already occurred it's likely that they really mean that the the space walk is happening tomorrow.

Re:They mean that the space walk is tomorrow! (1)

guyminuslife (1349809) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179225)

You...stole...my...post!

........spacewalk (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179247)

* Rawr Rawr Rawr ra ra ra*... cookie cutter anti-china rant.

Re:........spacewalk (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179307)

Hi! I'm just another ameritard and I agree with your rant.

Re:........spacewalk (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179449)

I'm an American and I'm better than you.

Chinese Astronauts Completed First Spacewalk... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179265)

...tomorrow.

Nice! (3, Funny)

JackassJedi (1263412) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179389)

http://www.universetoday.com/2008/09/27/chinas-first-spacewalk-a-success-video/ [universetoday.com]

"Zhai lifted himself through the hatch and waved at the camera attached to the service module on the outside of the craft, with Earth looming overhead."

"He then tried to take off the helmet for a 'nicer portrait shot'."

(After the implosion of his body, another astronaut from the 344 person manned spacecraft was sent to replace him.)

Misread the name (3, Funny)

Speare (84249) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179391)

I misread the name of the taikonaut.

Chinese astronaut Zhang Ziyi successfully spent 18 minutes in a tethered spacewalk outside the spacecraft Shenzhou 7.

My first thought, "that's pretty dangerous, in every movie she's been in, her clothes are ripped off suddenly and forcefully."

This is a great day for science (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179457)

This is great for science. I welcome china to the space-exploration community and hope that we can all co-operate with each other to further understanding.

Obviously a fake (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179485)

Check out the video [bbc.co.uk]

The cut to the long shot at the end with the guy clearly dangling from wires is hilarious! Like a bad pantomime.

Old News (1)

BobandMax (95054) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179595)

This is old, I read about it before it happened.

I enjoy most comments here! (0, Flamebait)

humaniverse (838580) | more than 5 years ago | (#25179653)

I'm Chinese. Guess what? Most people here have same attitude as world old empire: British and even old China empire. Failing but not realizing. I hope all of you hold this attitude. We'll have much better chance to success. so happy.

Another Urban Myth... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25179665)

The Great Firewall of China is visible from space.

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