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Dead Goldfish Offered The Vote In Illinois

samzenpus posted about 6 years ago | from the Mr.-Limpet dept.

It's funny.  Laugh. 216

Election officials in northern Chicago want to know why voter registration material was sent to Princess, a dead goldfish. "I am just stunned at the level of people compromising the integrity of the voting process," said Lake County Clerk Willard Helander, a Republican, who said she has spotted problems with nearly 1,000 voter registrations this year. Beth Nudelman, who owned Princess, said the fish may have got on a mailing list because the family once filled in her name when they got a second phone line for a computer. When will we recognize a goldfish's right to vote?

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One thing's for sure (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25458209)

That fish will vote the Democrat line.

Re:One thing's for sure (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25458487)

-nod- That's why it was killed. You've never heard of a conservative goldfish getting "The Ick" have you? Connect the dots.

The Obama Campaign (2, Funny)

Marxist Hacker 42 (638312) | about 6 years ago | (#25458219)

Has been push-polling my 5 year old son, so why not a goldfish?

Re:The Obama Campaign (0, Flamebait)

Wiarumas (919682) | about 6 years ago | (#25458629)

Well its safe to say that the Goldfish has more foreign policy experience than Palin.

Re:The Obama Campaign (3, Insightful)

El Royo (907295) | about 6 years ago | (#25459109)

Which is odd, since she has more executive experience than the other three folks involved in the race -- combined.

Re:The Obama Campaign (1)

Chickan (1070300) | about 6 years ago | (#25459201)

What? Mayer of a town of 8000? Running a state trying to secede from the union?

Re:The Obama Campaign (1)

eleuthero (812560) | about 6 years ago | (#25460417)

What? Mayer of a town of 8000? Running a state trying to secede from the union?

and if it were trying to secede... wouldn't that make her more qualified to be in the executive branch of a sovereign nation rather than less...?

Re:The Obama Campaign (2, Interesting)

Neoprofin (871029) | about 6 years ago | (#25462881)

Since when are they trying to secede?

I was just up there during their celebration of 50 years of statehood, people seemed pretty excited about it.

Re:The Obama Campaign (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25460579)

Unfortunately, by the metric being used by Palin's supporters, the guy running the tailor shop down the street has more executive experience than all four folks involved in the race.

Re:The Obama Campaign (3, Insightful)

Weasel Boy (13855) | about 6 years ago | (#25460855)

Perhaps this is why we tend to elect governors as president, not senators.

Re:The Obama Campaign (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25461273)

Which is odd, since she has more executive experience than the other three folks involved in the race -- combined.

Which pretty much puts the kibosh on the argument that 'experience' is the most important qualification.

Quantity vs. Quality of executive experience (3, Informative)

leftie (667677) | about 6 years ago | (#25462893)

Small town mayors and small state governors might have a certain x quantity of time on their resumes in the category of executive experience. But so do Pizza Hut managers.

I wouldn't for a moment consider either a small town mayors, small state governors, or a Pizza Hut managers to have the type of QUALITY of leadership experience required to seek national office.

It not just Sarah Palin that epic failed trying to move from small town mayor / governor to national candidate. Unfortunately, so did VT Gov. Howard Dean. Dean's horrible performance even with his orange hatted legions on the ground in the Iowa caucuses proved he had no large organization leadership experience. Now, with 4 years experience as Nat'l Party chair, Dean might be ready to seek national office today. Palin clearly isn't close to being ready for the national stage.

Obama, on the other hand, ran campaign organizations first in a large chunk of Chicago, then the state of Illinois, and then lead his national Presidential campaign to beat the Clintons nationally.

Re:Quantity vs. Quality of executive experience (2, Funny)

MyLongNickName (822545) | about 6 years ago | (#25462947)

I wouldn't for a moment consider either a small town mayors, small state governors, or a Pizza Hut managers to have the type of QUALITY of leadership experience required to seek national office.

That is what I said about Bill Clinton.

Re:The Obama Campaign (1)

flyingsquid (813711) | about 6 years ago | (#25463185)

Which is odd, since she has more executive experience than the other three folks involved in the race -- combined.

By your logic, the average student council president has more "executive experience" and is therefore ready to lead the nation. Give me a break. If McCain died of a heart attack, or got so old he withered away and dissolved into dust like that dude in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, and Palin took power... I'd say that Russia would reclaim Alaska withing 72 hours. You betcha!

Re:The Obama Campaign (0, Flamebait)

Agent__Smith (168715) | about 6 years ago | (#25461279)

Well its safe to say that the Goldfish has more foreign policy experience than Palin.

And it is also safe to say that the Goldfish had more executive experience than Obama and Joe the Bieden combined

Re:The Obama Campaign (1)

damn_registrars (1103043) | about 6 years ago | (#25458749)

Does your 5 year old son have his own phone line? I'm guessing the goldfish in question probably didn't.

Re:The Obama Campaign (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25458937)

Your post is probably the most hilarious "did you even read the fucking summary" ever

Re:The Obama Campaign (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25460265)

Nope. You just have horrible reading comprehension.

Re:The Obama Campaign (1)

Marxist Hacker 42 (638312) | about 6 years ago | (#25460887)

No, Christopher doesn't. My name is on the phone line in question.

Re:The Obama Campaign (1)

damn_registrars (1103043) | about 6 years ago | (#25463093)

No, Christopher doesn't. My name is on the phone line in question.

That is interesting, then. I figured that you may have purchased a phone line for your five-year-old (I'm sure it wouldn't be the first time its happened in this country).

I'll guess that you and your son don't have the same first name, since you said the campaign is calling for him and not you. Have you tried calling the local campaign office to get your son's name removed from the list?

Re:The Obama Campaign (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25461377)

Wow. Way to read the summary.

"Beth Nudelman, who owned Princess, said the fish may have got on a mailing list because the family once filled in her name when they got a second phone line for a computer."

Re:The Obama Campaign (3, Insightful)

bonch (38532) | about 6 years ago | (#25461865)

It gets worse. ACORN has been registering dead people, homeless people, Mickey Mouse, you name it. What was even more sickening is that Democrats on Huffington Post claimed Republicans were trying to "steal the election" by shutting down the "legitimate operations" of ACORN.

I can't trust either one of these fucking political parties.

Re:The Obama Campaign (1)

Cassius Corodes (1084513) | about 6 years ago | (#25462237)

Ok - ACORN is the victim of fraud here - some of its contractors were trying to rip it off by sending in false voter registration to get paid without doing any work. On top of that ACORN flagged most of them as suspicious. So you cannot claim this is an ACORN conspiracy when its a simple contracting fraud. Finally ACRON is not the democratic party. Both parties try and suck up to it from time to time when it suits them.

Registration Materials (3, Insightful)

MyLongNickName (822545) | about 6 years ago | (#25458257)

Oh no, it got sent registration materials. It did not get registered. The paperwork was sent out based on a request. It is the end of Democracy as we know it!

Re:Registration Materials (2, Insightful)

stinerman (812158) | about 6 years ago | (#25458953)

And if Princess registers, she will show up to the polling place and cast a ballot.

You think anyone would notice Princess isn't a qualified elector?

Re:Registration Materials (4, Insightful)

Straif (172656) | about 6 years ago | (#25459185)

Two words for this line of thinking: Absentee ballot.

Registration fraud is not just about making it possible to walk in and vote illegally in person, it also about just getting on the rolls so that a ballot can be requested by mail. And with the minimal validations being enforced in most states, it's not all that hard to do. There have already been reported cases of dead people having already voted, both federally and in the primaries.

Then of course there is the drive by voting trend that seems to be becoming more popular where people just enter a state long enough to register vote and leave (in direct violation of state voting laws). At least 14 cases have already been well documented (one an official Obama campaign worker and 13 others in an Obama associated 'get out the vote' group).

But to be fair in this stories case, this was more about a voter registration group just bulk mailing forms.

Re:Registration Materials (2, Insightful)

tverbeek (457094) | about 6 years ago | (#25460237)

This is getting out of hand, to be sure. In some states it's possible to register to vote even if your grandfather wasn't registered! Clearly voter registration requirements have become overly lax since the 19th century.

Re:Registration Materials (1)

Anonymous Cowpat (788193) | about 6 years ago | (#25460249)

There have already been reported cases of dead people having already voted, both federally and in the primaries.

Interesting side topic - if you kick the bucket between posting your absentee ballot and election day, is your vote supposed to count? (even if, in practice, nobody ever actually extracts the small number of votes which meet those criteria)

Re:Registration Materials (1)

Straif (172656) | about 6 years ago | (#25461013)

Short answer: sometimes.

since every state is different it just matters where you live (or used to live).

In South Dakota, depending on the day of the month you died, then no it doesn't count. If the election happens before the state elections board discovers your dead, which is done by a automated check every couple of weeks, then it would count but in general, if they know you're dead your ballot is dismissed.

In Florida as long as you were alive when you filled in your ballot then everything is legal.

Re:Registration Materials (1)

Neoprofin (871029) | about 6 years ago | (#25462915)

All I had to do to get my Absentee Ballot was sign a request.

Once you're on the roles it's as easy as that.

Re:Registration Materials (3, Insightful)

samkass (174571) | about 6 years ago | (#25459297)

It gets even WORSE! Can you believe that some people are distributing BLANK registration forms that let you enter ANY NAME YOU WANT in the "Name" field??1!one! Let's throw out the entire democratic system because it can't possibly be perfect!

To clarify the summary-- the registration forms (not the actual registration) were sent to the goldfish because the owner had lied about a name on phone records previously, entering the goldfish's name. The goldfish was not registered, and probably could not have come up with the ID (the form required a driver's license # or last-four SSN that matched the name) if it tried.

Why am I not worried?

Re:Registration Materials (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25460201)

If the goldfish had laser beams on his head, THEN you would be worried...

I'd be more concerned... (1, Insightful)

orthancstone (665890) | about 6 years ago | (#25458267)

if election officials actually provided the pet with the ABILITY (aka some form of proof that is acceptable at a voting location) to vote.

Re:I'd be more concerned... (2, Insightful)

XxtraLarGe (551297) | about 6 years ago | (#25458717)

The point is that someone would be ABLE to vote on princess's behalf at the voting location. Not all polls care about a voter's ID.

Re:I'd be more concerned... (4, Insightful)

jgtg32a (1173373) | about 6 years ago | (#25458955)

because requiring ID is racist

Re:I'd be more concerned... (1)

YodaToad (164273) | about 6 years ago | (#25459191)

Don't forget ageist!

Re:I'd be more concerned... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25461085)

Requiring ID isn't racist, but it is partisan. Its apparent intent - and its verifiable effect - is to disenfranchise voters who don't own cars, who tend to be poor, and tend to vote for Democrats. The fact that they're also disproportionately Black is not the point.

Re:I'd be more concerned... (2, Insightful)

Agent__Smith (168715) | about 6 years ago | (#25461379)

It also, in a state like mine, Arizona, helps weed out those who are here illegally, but who ACORN not only helped to get mortgages by the hundreds of thousands, but also helped find ways to register to vote. As these illegals tend to vote DEMOCRAT in disproportionate numbers, I guess you could call that partisan... I don't buy the "are poor and don't own vehicles" crap, as even many of the illegals purchase and own automobiles, and also, as an adult in this country, you can get a state ID that is not a driver license, and I would imagine that most do as you could not do anything from buy liquor and cigarettes to trying to open a checking account or apply for a job of any kind without one. So your point is garbage.

Re:I'd be more concerned... (1)

Neoprofin (871029) | about 6 years ago | (#25463015)

The "tend to be poor" argument is ridiculous.

At least in the state of Wisconsin getting a DL or ID costs $28 and is free to renew. Is there really such a large portion of the population that can't afford $28 lifetime? 13 cents a day for a year?

Discard that if you want, even when the government offered to pay for the IDs as part of the Real ID act it was unacceptable. People who don't carry any ID what so ever, at least in my experience, do it for the sole purpose of not being able to be identified, not because they couldn't if they wanted to.

Re:I'd be more concerned... (1)

orthancstone (665890) | about 6 years ago | (#25459283)

So there are polling locations that require NO form of identification (be it a registration card that has been certified and sent by the state, not application materials)? If so, I'm frightened by that more than people widely distributing applications to pets.

Re:I'd be more concerned... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25459521)

In California you don't need ID or any type of registration or certified materials to vote. You need to give your name--which they then look up on a list to verify you're registered to vote in the 'zone' which the polling place serves. The very worst part of the system is how the 'list' is posted outside the polling station with a list of all registered voters and their addresses--the only thing stopping me from voting on behalf of everyone registered at the polling station is being recognized by the polling station staff.

It is assumed that if the real 'Doc Johnson' ever showed up to vote after I voted on his behalf he'd be entitled to cast his vote provisionally. I've no idea how the state actually counts collisions in the voter pool.

Re:I'd be more concerned... (2, Informative)

phantomlord (38815) | about 6 years ago | (#25460107)

No identification is required in NY when you go to the polls... you just sign your name in the register of eligible voters and they conveniently give you a copy of your signature to look at while you do it.

Re:I'd be more concerned... (1)

faloi (738831) | about 6 years ago | (#25460357)

The majority of polling locations require no form of identification. A signature and your word that you are indeed Mickey Mouse is all that's required.

Re:I'd be more concerned... (1)

Bartab (233395) | about 6 years ago | (#25462633)

ID is not required in California, and while a signature is required it is not compared to anything.

Even in Iraq, they had purple dye for the fingers to stop double voting.

Re:I'd be more concerned... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25461123)

This election I get the feeling that if Princess had an Obama-Biden sticker on her goldfish bowl that would taken as proof that everything was on the up and up and that nothing shady was going on.

Gender-appropriate names (1)

Just Some Guy (3352) | about 6 years ago | (#25458279)

Willard? That's my first name (as it's the custom in my family to torture first sons with it for 9 generations now), and I've never heard it on a woman before.

Bad registration doesn't matter (2, Interesting)

JoshuaZ (1134087) | about 6 years ago | (#25458305)

Even if the fish had been registered it wouldn't matter. Voter registration fraud or voter registration errors aren't an issue unless actual voting fraud occurs which is much more difficult. None of the erroneously registered or requested to register individuals are going to actually vote.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25458477)

The problem is, with so many bad registrations, the people verifying them get overwhelmed, and more and more bad ones slip through, combine that with early voting and some of the lax voting laws in some states (some of which are swing states), and it becomes feasible to "swing" the election.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25459263)

with so many bad registrations, the people verifying them get overwhelmed, and more and more bad ones slip through, combine that with early voting and some of the lax voting laws in some states (some of which are swing states), and it becomes feasible to "swing" the election.

That would require the participation of thousands, if not tens of thousands, of people. You have to find that many people willing to do it, and somehow get every single one of them to keep quiet about it. Then you have to coordinate their efforts to spread them out thinly enough so no one will notice. You're taking a huge risk that a few of them will be caught, potentially exposing your conspiracy, and you still have no guarantee that all these people will actually vote the way you want once they're in the booth.
 
It's just not practical. There are easier ways to steal an election.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (1)

Cassius Corodes (1084513) | about 6 years ago | (#25462303)

Stop! What are you doing! You are ruining the conspiracy theory with your logic!

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (1)

Neoprofin (871029) | about 6 years ago | (#25463055)

Why does it take thousands? I could fill out 2000 registration apps every day for 4 years, and if that allowed me to send in 1000 absentee ballots the system is already utterly destroyed.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25463115)

BZZZZT! Wrong answer. It only takes a few, in key positions at polling stations, to use the false registrations to change election results. How do you think JFK stole the election?

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25458537)

Preventing voters from actually voting to me seems to be a much more serious issue than this nonsense...

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/23638322/block_the_vote [rollingstone.com]

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25458615)

Mod up parent!

The flaw here is the system that PAYS people to register people, which is of course an open invitation to fraud. But as parent said, as long as no one "fishy" votes, there's no problem.

The registration system just needs to be run on a volunteer basis. It won't stop the few retarded jokers who think it helps to register non-existant people, but at least there's no gain to doing so. No benefit = next to no fraud.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (2, Insightful)

Straif (172656) | about 6 years ago | (#25459239)

The problem with that thinking is that people are stuck on the concept of physically showing up to vote. As most states have some form of absentee voting system many of these fraudulent registrations can lead to actual votes.

There have already been reported cases of dead people voting through absentee ballots both federally and in the primaries.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25459485)

"The problem with that thinking is that people are stuck on the concept of physically showing up to vote. As most states have some form of absentee voting system many of these fraudulent registrations can lead to actual votes.

There have already been reported cases of dead people voting through absentee ballots both federally and in the primaries."

Links? I mean, there should be tons of court activity if people were voting on behalf of dead people, at least after the fact. This seems like an over-generalization, sort of like the idea that everyone on any sort of state assistance is a "welfare queen", even though the vast majority of people on assistance are not gaming or abusing it.

The question becomes, are you okay with disenfranchising thousands of people on the *possibility* that a small minority may actually cast an extra vote in error? Sounds like the idea of killing social benefits because some people *may* be abusing the system. The last election that was "stolen" wasn't due to voter fraud, but rather due to throwing ballots out en masse, understaffing polls in densely populated areas, etc [usccr.gov] .

If you pay people to register people to vote, a few of them are going to game the system (as was said earlier in the thread) for money. It doesn't mean that "teh democrats are going to steal the election!" Silently purging voter rolls, on the other hand, might do some damage, even if it's apparently unintentional [rockymountainnews.com] .

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (1)

Straif (172656) | about 6 years ago | (#25460905)

From what I could see as to the problems with voter access and understaffing it was almost entirely within Democratic controlled districts.

Since the voting districts in Florida are relatively self managing, meaning they pay for their own elections and set their own rules (although the local governments can request additional state funds if required), wouldn't this put the blame for poor voter services on the Democrats who ran those districts? The infamous Butterfly Ballot being a perfect example of how Democrats manage to screw up election they have 100% control over and yet still blame the Republicans.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (4, Informative)

ArcherB (796902) | about 6 years ago | (#25458783)

Even if the fish had been registered it wouldn't matter. Voter registration fraud or voter registration errors aren't an issue unless actual voting fraud occurs which is much more difficult. None of the erroneously registered or requested to register individuals are going to actually vote.

First, you can't have voter fraud without registration fraud. And once the vote takes place (ballot dropped in box), there is nothing you can do.

And yes, some of the "erroneously registered" have already voted in Ohio [nypost.com] :

The New Yorkers and nine other members from across the country are accused of packing themselves into a modest three-bedroom house in Columbus, waiting 30 days - and then registering, even though the Buckeye State is not their permanent residence.

Under Ohio law, a person who comes to the state for "temporary purposes only," without the intention of making it the "permanent place of abode" is not considered a resident. New permanent residents must live in Ohio 30 days before registering.

Four group members, including two of the New Yorkers, have already cast ballots, and six others requested absentee ballots from the county elections board.

So, I guess now it really is voter fraud and NOT just registration fraud!

I understand Princess the dead gold-fish did not vote, however.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (1)

JoshuaZ (1134087) | about 6 years ago | (#25458863)

That's actually a really bad example since a) the individuals in that case claim that they misunderstood the voting rules in Ohio b) they were real people who had changed their registration location to Ohio after living their for 30 days. This is distinct from the issues being brought up above such as registration of non-existent people or multiple registrations. c) None of the concerns about organizations like ACORN would deal with people transferring this way. Overall, this story is more about how lots of stupid people vote than about voter fraud.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (1, Flamebait)

frank_adrian314159 (469671) | about 6 years ago | (#25459469)

First, you can't have voter fraud without registration fraud.

This is a false statement. People can stuff ballot boxes without registering. As there is no registration needed to do this, there is no registration fraud. Machines can be hacked without registration. Again, since there is no registration, there is no registration fraud.

I understand that the line "No voter fraud without registration fraud" is one of the talking points of mouth-breathing Republicans, but it is a demonstrably false statement. I guess that's par for the course for them.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (1)

Neoprofin (871029) | about 6 years ago | (#25463077)

Would you settle for "Successful registration fraud would more than likely lead to voter fraud?"

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25459087)

Bull.

I'd like to point out that I understand that this was just a case of the family getting a registration packet for a fish that was pining for the fjords.

However, the large influx of fraudulent/comical/garbage registrations that ARE being submitted is using up resources that should be used to remove the following entries:
1. non-citizens who have driver's licenses, and so (in some states) are automatically registered to vote
2. felons whose voting rights have been stripped as part of being found guilty, but are still (or are being actively) registered
3. people who have mistakes on the registry form, and need those fixed in order for their vote to be counted

The first two dilute the legitimate voters' rights (I don't fly to Germany and vote in their elections!) and the third case disenfranchises legitimate people whose votes deserve to be counted. There are documented cases where known felons' votes are being tallied, specifically because the election boards are overwhelmed, and don't want to wrongfully exclude those whose rights have been restored. (It's fine with me that a felon whose right has been restored gets to vote.)

I'd also like to point out that in some states (Ohio) registration and voting happened the same day, and once the votes are accepted, there is no way to remove them from the process. So in those cases, registration fraud and voter fraud can happen simultaneously.

Everyone talks about a fair election, how about being fair to those of us who maintain our citizenship and stay out of trouble?

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (1)

KGIII (973947) | about 6 years ago | (#25460533)

I never really understood why a state would take a felon's right to vote away actually. Here in Maine they even encourage inmates to vote and do the absentee ballot for them.

I got to work on a project that involved automating the request for absentee ballots for incarcerated people, it was tied in with registering to vote as well and inmates who weren't registered would be registered in the town/county of the facility that held them.

It is my opinion that the vote is such a fundamental right that almost nothing should take that right away - including a felony conviction. I suppose a treason conviction or renouncing of citizenship should, of course, strip that right away but those are the only two I can think of off the top of my head.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (1)

EraserMouseMan (847479) | about 6 years ago | (#25459299)

Haven't you seen the Obama web adds all over the place encouraging people to register and cast their vote all in the same simple process?

Whoever registered this fish could have went ahead and cast the vote at the same time.

What's worse than hackable voting machines? A screwed up registration process that can't even tell if you are a dead goldfish. An "erroneous" but valid voter registration will thwart any voting machine.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25459601)

Haven't you seen the Obama web adds all over the place encouraging people to register and cast their vote all in the same simple process?

No. Link?

What's worse than hackable voting machines?

Not this. A few fake names on the voter roles is meaningless compared to the possibility of malicious code running on those machines.
 
This doesn't scale up. Malicious code, if properly designed, does.

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25460453)

>Haven't you seen the Obama web adds all over the place encouraging people to register and cast their vote all in the same simple process?

That would be "web ads", short for advertisements.

>Whoever registered this fish could have went ahead and cast the vote at the same time.

That would have "could have gone" ahead".

Glad to help!

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (2, Interesting)

Dave Walker (9461) | about 6 years ago | (#25459519)

Guess you missed the part where volunteer poll workers used "leftover" voter registrations at the end of the night to make up for the lack of legitimate votes in both Gary, Indiana and St. Louis, Missouri.

Voter registration fraud or voter registration errors aren't an issue unless actual voting fraud occurs which is much more difficult. I'm guessing you meant more difficult to prove.

Oops, guess you missed this too:

(Albuquerque, NM) - Public records released in New Mexico today confirm that fraudulent voter registrations are in fact turning into fraudulent votes. ACORN, currently under investigation by the FBI, is now confirmed to be responsible for producing fraudulent voter registrations and illegal votes in New Mexico. An inspection of public records has revealed that illegal votes were cast in New Mexico's 2008 primary election.

What color is the sky on your planet?
--
"They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security." -- Benjamin Franklin

Re:Bad registration doesn't matter (1)

SputnikPanic (927985) | about 6 years ago | (#25459829)

I completely disagree. All aspects of the voting system -- registration, actual voting, tallying -- need to be protected from tampering. Allowing false registration threatens to compromise the entire process, particularly when you consider states with no-ID laws, absentee voting, etc. Whether or not actual voting fraud takes places is not the issue; the fact that the potential for voting fraud exists is, in itself, enough that something should be done about it. After all, isn't this potential for fraud the very same principle that gets so many of us (rightly) worked up over Diebold/electronic voting?

PETA (5, Funny)

moniker127 (1290002) | about 6 years ago | (#25458311)

Looks like PETA finally got what they wanted. Damn lobbyists.

That's nothing (1)

hansamurai (907719) | about 6 years ago | (#25458315)

That's nothing, CowboyNeal even voted in 2004!

Re:That's nothing (1)

A nonymous Coward (7548) | about 6 years ago | (#25458451)

In Soviet Russia, YOU vote for CowboyNeal!

237.5 million (1)

GunDawg (1365295) | about 6 years ago | (#25458581)

That's how many times Mayor Daley of Chicago is registered to vote. ;)

No surprise about the goldfish.

Heck, people who lived in Illinois (specifically Cook County) who have died, still vote!

And "Willard" Hellander is female? (1, Interesting)

ROU Nuisance Value (253171) | about 6 years ago | (#25458619)

I'd say somebody in the Lake Country Republican party has: 1. Gender confusion 2. A need to have voter registration fraud vs. voter fraud explained to her/him/it. 3. The expectation of a really interesting experience on the day Princess the Goldfish shows up and requests a ballot. Don't you think this Republican meme has passed its sell-by date?

Re:And "Willard" Hellander is female? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25459101)

> 1. Gender confusion
Bigot!

Check the history (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25458719)

It would not be anything new for the dead to vote in Chicago in a fishy election. In as much as so many there have been sent to "sleep with the fishes(sic)" it might seem appropriate for fish to vote their displeasure and in that respect what is more appropriate then having a dead fish vote in Chicago?

In Cook County Todd Stroger did even need to win (1)

Joe The Dragon (967727) | about 6 years ago | (#25458741)

In Cook County Todd Stroger did even need to win the vote to get in office. Last year some came into the polling saying there dead family member is still on the voting list for years even after calling in about it.

Re:In Cook County Todd Stroger did even need to wi (1)

SydShamino (547793) | about 6 years ago | (#25460497)

I'm registered to vote twice (not intentionally). I registered and voted at age 18 in my parents' city, then went off to college in another state, continuing to vote in my home state via absentee ballot. (I never registered in my temporary state even though they allowed college kids to do so.)

After college I moved back to my parents' state, in a different city, and registered to vote in my new precinct when I updated my driver's license. Now, eight years later, my name still appears on the voter rolls in my parents' precinct. (How do I know? My dad has been precinct chair and seen it.) My dad has pointed it out personally to the registrar that I'm on the rolls there, haven't voted there in eight years, and indeed am registered and voting somewhere else in the state, and that I should be removed. The registrar said he could and would do nothing about it.

Actually, I'm upset that I'm listed twice and wish they would remove me. My state keeps talking about one of those state-wide voter database laws, with clauses to kick anyone with questionable registrations. I worry one of these years that I'll walk in to vote and be told that I can't because my registration was questionable and I was kicked off the rolls in both places.

Re:In Cook County Todd Stroger did even need to wi (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25461385)

I dunno man. Maybe you could like, I dunno, maybe, like uh... take some personal responsibility or something like that and like find out if there's like some forms or something like that that you could like fill out you know, and uh... like get it taken care of or something. Whatever.

Re:In Cook County Todd Stroger did even need to wi (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25460583)

In Cook County Todd Stroger did even need to win the vote to get in office.

Perhaps "...didn't even need to win.." would make more sense here. Then again, a bit more information about this anecdote (and relevant links) would also be helpful.

Last year some came into the polling saying there dead family member is still on the voting list for years even after calling in about it.

Again, perhaps you meant to say "Last year someone came into the polling place saying their dead family member was still on the voting list..."

Unless that "dead family member" showed up to vote, I wouldn't worry too much about it. On the other hand, I would be worried if all it took to remove someone from the voting rolls was some an unverified phone call.

Voter suppresion at work (1, Insightful)

yareckon (1236270) | about 6 years ago | (#25458805)

This is the humorous media end of a much more sinister campaign designed to convince people that lots of scary voter fraud is taking place and that we need to crack down at the polling places to stop it.

The republicans are scared stiff, and want everyone to put aside the rights of new voters in a cloud of suspicion and red tape that will clog voting places, keep folks standing in line and frustrated them into not voting in minority and heavily Democratic areas. Casting suspicion on the lists used to target voters for persuasive ads is one thing - many of these are commercial advertising lists. Saying that the actual voter list has bad names on it, which evil people put there, who intend to risk their liberty to vote more than once, is harder to believe.

Re:Voter suppresion at work (2, Interesting)

Detritus (11846) | about 6 years ago | (#25459361)

I've overheard people bragging about voting twice while I was standing in line for the polls. It's easy to do and rarely investigated or prosecuted. The integrity of the process is largely base upon the honor system.

Re:Voter suppresion at work (1, Flamebait)

YodaToad (164273) | about 6 years ago | (#25459475)

I agree. There has never, ever been any voter fraud and the sole purpose of actually proving you're who you say you are when you vote is a ploy to make sure minorities can't vote. Why should I need a photo Id when I vote, it's not like I need it for anything else like driving my car or buying cigarettes or alcohol.

Go ahead and keep living in your fantasy world where the sole act of saying nice things will get things done and the people who want to kill you will think more of you when you talk nice to them.

Re:Voter suppresion at work (2, Insightful)

PixelScuba (686633) | about 6 years ago | (#25460493)

Voting is a right, driving is a privilege.

Re:Voter suppresion at work (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25459665)

Notice how much more press coverage the supposed voter fraud is getting over the uncountable examples of voter suppression. And remember folks, this means the media is "liberally biased". Brought to you by the same people who think Sarah Palin's ability to see russia gives her foreign policy experience.

Voter fraud is a myth. (0, Troll)

NotInfinitumLabs (1150639) | about 6 years ago | (#25459241)

In their five year investigation of voter fraud, the Bush Administration found 120 prosecutable offenses of voter fraud, out of millions and millions of votes cast. Organized voter fraud is a myth, but organized voter suppression is very real. Republicans know that the higher the turnout, the more likely it is that the Democrat will win. So, they like to spread things like this around to encourage voter suppression efforts Like this one in Ohio [10tv.com] .

Re:Voter fraud is a myth. (1)

Straif (172656) | about 6 years ago | (#25460527)

Interesting definition of "supression" you have there, of course its the same one Dems use every election; "Requiring people to in any way validate their eligability to vote is supression". There is also the famous "making people stand in long lines is voter supression". In that last one the part they normally forget is that in many if not most of the areas with polling station problems are Democratically controlled. Meaning everything from which machine to use to the number ot have to the instructing of volunteers to the design of the ballot is in the hands of the local Democrats. But of course, if anything goes wrong it's all the evil Republicans fault. How many people could tell you that the infamous 'butterfly ballot' that caused so much trouble in Florida was a Democrat design run through Democrat controlled districts.

The case you linked was about requiring the Ohio Secretary of State to actually follow election law and create a link to the DMV or IRS to help validation voter registration information with at least one other verifiable data source. It was dismissed because the way the law is written, the GOP members filing the suit could not show standing in the court, meaning there was nothing wrong with the merits of the case, just that the people filing it were not the proper complaintants.

From the article itself 1/3 of new registrations in Ohio were found to have fraudulent information. And with most of the ACORN and ACORN like groups policies of deadline filing of registrations to flood the offices and reduce validation checks that can lead to a lot of inelligble people being listed on the voter rolls.

And if you want some more cases of voter fraud just check out the 14 Obama workers (one an official campaign worker and 13 others who work for an affiliated organization) who all did drive by voting. All registered to vote in Ohio (and several already did) when they had no intention of ever becoming an actual resident; a direct violation of Ohio law. They basically went to the state for 30 days to work on 'get out the vote' projects and then went home when done, making sure to vote there instead of the actual home states.

Just to get back to your first point the term 'prosecutable' is a very important. Who exactly do you prosecute when poll stations show registered votes for people who have been dead for several years? Or how about when cities have 105% voter registration? Very few cases of fraud are ever prosecuted because it's simply too hard to track down the actual culprits and Dems work as hard as possible to make sure that any effort to stop fraud up front are stopped dead in it's tracks.

Honestly, how hard is it for local governements (state or municple) to simply hire people to go door to door and register people and then offer a way for people who were missed to obtain registration papers later and then require some form of ID (either license or even a power bill with your address on it) to prove your identity when you show up at the polling station. They waste enough money on other things, why not on the most fundemental aspect of a democratic society.

My old girlfriend was a republican (1)

BigRiff (580967) | about 6 years ago | (#25459285)

She was a cold fish...

Dead goldfish? (1)

duckInferno (1275100) | about 6 years ago | (#25459321)

That's no way to talk about him. He's only in his eighties and probably would live long enough to get a shot at a second term.

Here is some clue for ya idjits to mod down.... (1)

jmorris42 (1458) | about 6 years ago | (#25459405)

I'm already hearing the apologists with their tired story that this is just registration fraud, no evidence of actual election fraud. Nothing to see here, move along.....

But they are wrong. Most are just repeating Kos talking points and aren't actually in on the scam, but they are useful idiots. So what IS the scam?

Go check out the CLOWARD-PIVEN STRATEGY [discoverthenetworks.org] for details. Basically the idea is to totally swamp the system so that there is insufficient manpower to detect fraud. So that is a win for them since it brings chaos. Be allowing them to actually commit fraud under the cover of all this noise is yet another win. Finally as they undermine public confidence in our elections they win yet again.

Numbers Dont Lie (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25459437)

I dont know what the big deal is...how many fraudulent votes could actually be cast in a statewide or national election? Doesnt this fall under the 'margin of error'?

Re:Numbers Dont Lie (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25460933)

I tend to agree with you, BUT think about Florida in 2000. Just a few hundred fraudulent votes would have been enough to change the outcome; I'm sure some people probably believe it did.

Abomination! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25459505)

only live goldfish should be allowed to vote

Are you kidding? (4, Interesting)

mcgrew (92797) | about 6 years ago | (#25459643)

This is Illinois, where' we're so patriotic even being dead doesn't keep us from voting! Being nonhuman doesn't keep us from voting!

VOTE EARLY! VOTE OFTEN!

Illinois is home to Al Capone and Richard Daily.

The last Democrat to be defeated by a Republican went to prison. The last Republican to be defeated by a Democrat is in prison right now. And our present Governor, a Democrat, will likely go to prison himself, as the Feds are scrutinizing him in the Rezco case.

Both Federal Senators are Democrats. The Governor is a Democrat. The state legislature is mostly Democrat. Obama is from Illinois. Guess who's going to win Illinois by a landslide, dead goldfish or no?

Which states are the fish-swing states? (1)

PolygamousRanchKid (1290638) | about 6 years ago | (#25460449)

Sorry, I must have missed this punditry ... which candidate has the most affinity for the fish electorate in the swing states?

The great seer, John Cleese, anticipated these problems back in the late 60's early 70's with his passive civil disobedience campaign, demanding a fish license (government ID) for "Eric, the Fish."

Since it was a "gold"-fish, I suspect that the usual group of Ron Paul supporters will be blamed for this.

It's shady business! (2, Informative)

socz (1057222) | about 6 years ago | (#25460485)

This is my experience: When I got my drivers license in my state (a republic) i couldn't swap out the first letter of my second name, which is J on my birth certificate for X. In the end, they're both pronounced exactly the same, but because of "legal issues" i can't have it with an X on my drivers license.

Go forward in time. I'm now 18 and able to register to vote. So I sign up with X instead of J, wondering if that'll go through EVEN THOUGH my birth certificate, social security number and drivers license along with all my other documentation in life so far has it with a J. Guess what? It went through!

So I now happily vote with an X for my middle initial and no one ever questions it. So what's so shady about this? Do you guys ever wonder how you get notices for jury duty? Really, have you ever considered where those names are pulled from? At least in my state, it's from voter registration records.

Since I registered, i've only received jury duty summons for X, never J, who legally doesn't exist! Yeah, something has to be done about all this. It shouldn't be so difficult. Mexico is infamous for it's election fraud. BUT the way the voter registration goes is excellent. Everyone has a voters credential. That is something that EVERYONE has, it's even more important that your drivers license. As a matter of fact, many people in rural areas don't have drivers licenses, but do have those voter cards.

I grew up believing "USA is #1 in the world." But after having gone out of the US and seeing more of the world, I don't believe that is the case in every aspect. Mexico is always looked down out of ignorance. But they have got their voting system down... it's fraud they can't eliminate :P

BTW, this reminds me of Bush's win in 2000... Mexicans said, "We thought we knew all of the dirty tricks on how to rig elections."

Cloward-Piven Strategy (1)

blackoutdustin (1002343) | about 6 years ago | (#25460861)

Give it a look see. it is not about voter fraud, it is about manufactured crisis and it can be pretty effective.

Re:Cloward-Piven Strategy (2)

NFNNMIDATA (449069) | about 6 years ago | (#25462713)

That is a fairly ridiculous conspiracy theory they've woven together there. I would rebut it with Hanlon's Razor [wikipedia.org] but it doesn't even merit that.

Wow - 30 days huh (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25461167)

So all I need to do is learn the registration and voting requirements in key states and wait after this term is over in this election?

Monkey see monkey do. I can learn from the Democratic seminar on "get out and vote" drives too.

See you all in 2012!

ACORN NEEDS TO BE ELIMINATED. (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 years ago | (#25462203)

ACORN is not only committing fraud constantly but are funded with tax payer dollars to boot.

They need to be shut down and ALL national and regional officers indicted immediately.

I have some more dead animules (2, Interesting)

fortapocalypse (1231686) | about 6 years ago | (#25462693)

Son, get your shovel. Let's go dig up some votes!

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