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VMware Promises Multiple OSs On One Cellphone

ScuttleMonkey posted more than 5 years ago | from the just-make-sure-i-can-strip-it-off-if-i-want dept.

Handhelds 90

superglaze writes to tell us that VMware has announced a large effort behind their Mobile Virtualization Platform, promising the possibility of multiple operating systems on mobile devices. "The company described MVP as a 'thin layer of software' that will be embedded in handsets and 'be optimized to run efficiently on low-power-consuming and memory-constrained mobile phones.' Asked whether MVP would offer something different from the abstraction already provided by mobile Java, VMware's European product director Fredrik Sjostedt told ZDNet UK that MVP would require less recoding. 'If you want to have an application run on a Java-specific appliance, you need to code it for Java,' Sjostedt said. 'What we're introducing with MVP is an [embedded] abstraction layer below that, between the physical hardware and the software layer.'"

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90 comments

All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (5, Funny)

eldavojohn (898314) | more than 5 years ago | (#25706911)

VMWare Promises Multiple OSs On One Cellphone

Just the other day I was having problems getting World of Warcraft working in Windows Mobile on my Heier Black Pearl Micro [gizmodo.com] while at the same time using VMWare to host a wiki on a completely secure LAMP stack. Seriously guys, it's 2008--we've defeated our greatest fear (the polar bear) and we've elected an African American president--so why are cell phones still in the stone age? Is it really too much to ask for me to be able to play my favorite game and host some simple PHP pages while driving down the highway accepting incoming phone calls?

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (4, Informative)

nysus (162232) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707025)

If you RTFA, it's not for end users but for vendors so they can easily roll out different platforms on different phones.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

HBI (604924) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707117)

Sounds like a huge market.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

postbigbang (761081) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707767)

Lost in the discussion was the sales target: 100 units total.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (2, Insightful)

HBI (604924) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709165)

Wouldn't it be easier to just write an emulator for the smartphone CPU architecture to run on x86?

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

postbigbang (761081) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709633)

Then they'd have to be responsible for the OS, rather than just profiling or virtualizing it.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

HBI (604924) | more than 5 years ago | (#25710341)

It would seem to me that most smartphone OS' would be hobbled by limited RAM were they to be virtualized on existing phone hardware.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

postbigbang (761081) | more than 5 years ago | (#25710557)

Not with so many flash cards out there these days. Flash tends to obviate the problem of where to store, and screen real estate in terms of pixels is small.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (3, Funny)

hockpatooie (312212) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709467)

Yo dawg, I heard you like smartphones so I put a VM on your smartphone so you can smartphone while you smartphone.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (4, Insightful)

Bearhouse (1034238) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707811)

Why they would want they do that? Increasingly, the handset suppliers are seeing the device software as being part of their value-add, brand differentiation and protection.

They don't want M$, Google Android or FOSS. Think iPhone.

Sounds like needless complexity on devices already challenged by small form factor, (memeory, battery lifre, CPU power...)

The only thing that could temp me would be security - open email (and attachments) in a VM wihout risking crashing - or infecting - my phone, which I also might be using for GPS navigation - hmmmm..

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

MightyYar (622222) | more than 5 years ago | (#25708415)

the handset suppliers are seeing the device software as being part of their value-add,

Maybe they are hoping that the carriers will want to spec phones that just run their own branded OS image? That would simplify carrier's spec process, so I can see the appeal for them. Instead of detailing every little menu item and feature, they could simply require that it be "VmWare Compatible".

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

Bearhouse (1034238) | more than 5 years ago | (#25708571)

See your point, but don't see how that gets round the problem of these devices being so tightly coupled, in terms of hw and os...would be a neat trick if you could ship stuff than ran under VM and was usable, despite the many different button placements, screen resolutions...

For example, I have a Blackberry Pearl - some Java apps are run fine, but are unusable from the UI standpoint.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

MightyYar (622222) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709435)

I agree that it seems unworkable - I was just speculating on their rationale.

I suppose that it COULD work, but phones would have to get a lot more standardized. Alternatively, they could just specify a touch screen and then the keyboard becomes optional.

Personally, I'd hate to see it because I think that the phone market is pretty "fun" with all of the innovation. Some things are just gimmicks, and others stick around. It'd be a shame to limit that market for the sake of standardization - it'd be similar to the PC market. No one can try something radical like switching processors or experimenting with interfaces because everything has to be standard enough to run a flavor of Windows. Even Macs are only mildly quirky now.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

Bearhouse (1034238) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709685)

Personally, I'd hate to see it because I think that the phone market is pretty "fun" with all of the innovation.

With you on that one - although I wish they'd standardise on the charges and other cables - I have a drawful of chargers and headsets...

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (2, Informative)

barzok (26681) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709763)

Increasingly, the handset suppliers are seeing the device software as being part of their value-add, brand differentiation and protection.

Outside the US, anyway.

Inside the US, it matters not what the handset maker's software can do. Verizon cripples them all and puts their own shitware & UI on them.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

Pastis (145655) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709887)

With something like Android, it takes little effort (e.g. a team of a few developers) to create support for a phone. See for example the time it takes to get android (basic support) on the FreeRunner.

Now as an end user, if I get the opportunity to flash out my phone easily to get access to an open platform, I'll do it very quickly. I did this with a PC, I don't see why I couldn't do it with a phone.

Split the carrier from the phone/os. Let the carrier be the ISP, and be done with that. The market is changing. If only 10% of that market becomes open, we're still talking about 10s of millions of devices.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time, hehehe (1)

davidsyes (765062) | more than 5 years ago | (#25710331)

And i at first was wondering if it was a pre-last act of desperation, given we recently read that a group (AMD?) showed that it now not only is possible for virtualization to hop between processors & families, but vendors, too. Then, i thought, "Damn! They're killing our Easy Bake Otis Spunkmeyer Mall operations... Shit, we have to start selling Chewy Gooey Betty Crocker Brownies, too for better product/platform diversification..."

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (2, Funny)

girlintraining (1395911) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707227)

Maybe some people like their cell phones to make phone calls without needing a reboot every few days, or being loaded up with a gigabyte of software in memory who's only purpose is to look in the mirror and say "Who's a pretty girl? I'm a pretty girl! Who's a pretty girl..."

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (2, Informative)

tripdizzle (1386273) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707359)

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

lorenzo.boccaccia (1263310) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707853)

I'm totally ok with the concept... but why they need to make them extra ugly?

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25707945)

and we've elected an African American president

Wow, I didn't know Obama was from Africa! But, wait... doesn't that mean he can't be president?

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

Dog-Cow (21281) | more than 5 years ago | (#25724833)

It's my understanding that Obama is one of the few genuine African Americans to have the terms applied to them. One of his parents is from America, the other from Africa.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

Locke2005 (849178) | more than 5 years ago | (#25708517)

Hear, hear! Why waste time working on things like battery life, lack of memory, underpowered CPUs, and high cost, when obviously the single biggest roadblock to widespread adoption of new phones is the lack of ability to simultaneously run multiple Operating Systems!
But seriously -- in what drug-addled delusional model of reality does this even begin to make sense? Customers don't want to pay for the extra memory, and Telcos don't want to pay the additional support costs. Overall, you would think the market would be driving towards making phones simpler, not adding unnecessary complexity.

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

Gazzonyx (982402) | more than 5 years ago | (#25711877)

Have you tried shifting some memory towards the LAMP stack, cranking down your VFS_cache_pressure, and booting WoW up under WINE/Crossover? Sure, your wikis performance will suffer, but if you take the URL down from your back window, maybe that'll keep the rest of us from pinging you while you game. Let me know if you get teamspeak working with bluetooth under WINE, I've been trying to get that to work forever!

Re:All I Can Say Is It's About Bloody Time (1)

rastoboy29 (807168) | more than 5 years ago | (#25718603)

Man you got modded funny, but I was sitting here thinking  how deep you are.

True, I am high.  But still, I'm just sayin'

Why? (3, Insightful)

internerdj (1319281) | more than 5 years ago | (#25706931)

Fine. My cell has a crappy OS, but I don't think it will be better if I jam a second or third crappy OS onto it.

Re:Why? (1)

LWATCDR (28044) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707233)

I am betting this will be more like a HAL than a traditional virtual system.
OS vendors will write to VMWare and then any phone that supports VMware will run the OS.
No real porting effort required.
Just another layer of abstraction.

Re:Why? (3, Funny)

Sneftel (15416) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707569)

Q: There are too many platforms. What should I do?
A: Make another platform!

Re:Why? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25713183)

or, better, make a platform for platforms!

dear penis (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25706937)

btw, i ate out your grandpas ass!!!

  ENOUGH OF THIS GAY BANTER, ON WITH THE TROLLING!!!

8====D~~

When I think of dirty old men, I think of Ike Thomas and when I think about Ike I get a hard-on that won't quit.

Sixty years ago, I worked in what was once my Grandfather's Greenhouses. Gramps had died a year earlier and Grandma, now in her seventies had been forced to sell to the competition. I got a job with the new owners and mostly worked the range by myself. That summer, they hired a man to help me get the benches ready for the fall planting.

Ike always looked like he was three days from a shave and his whiskers were dirty white, shaded by the brim of his battered felt fedora.

He did not chew tobacco but the corners of his mouth turned down in a way that, at any moment, I expected a trickle of thin, brown juice to creep down his chin. His bushy, brown eyebrows shaded pale, gray eyes.

The old-timer extended his hand, lifted his leg like a dog about to mark a bush and let go the loudest fart I ever heard. The old fellow then winked at me, "Ike Thomas is the name and playing pecker's my game."

I thought he said, "Checkers." I was nineteen, green as grass. I said, "I was never much good at that game."

"Now me," said Ike, "I just love jumping men . . ."

"I'll bet you do."

". . . and grabbing on to their peckers," said Ike.

"I though we were talking about . . ."

"You like jumping old men's peckers?"

I shook my head.

"I reckon we'll have to remedy that." Ike lifted his right leg and let go another tremendous fart. "He said, "We best be getting to work."

That summer of 1941 was a more innocent time. I learned most of the sex I knew from those little eight pager cartoon booklets of comic-page characters going at it. Young men read them in the privacy of an outside john, played with themselves, by themselves and didn't brag about it. Sometimes, we got off with a trusted friend and helped each other out.

Under the greenhouse glass, the temperature sometimes climbed over the hundred degree mark. I had worked stripped to the waist since April and was as brown as a berry. On only his second day on the job and in the middle of August, Ike wore old fashioned overalls. Those and socks in his high-top work shoes was every stitch he wore. When he bent forward, the bib front billowed out and I could see the white curly hairs on his chest and belly.

"Me? I just love to eat pussy!" Ike licked his lips from corner to corner then sticking his tongue out far enough that the tip could touch the end of his nose. He said, A man's not a man till he knows first hand, the flavor of a lady's pussy."

"People do that?"

He winked. "Of course the taste of a hard cock ain't to be sneezed at neither. Now you answer me, yes or no. Does a man's cock taste salty or not?"

"I never . . ."

"Well, old Ike's willing to let you find out."

"No way."

"Just teasing," said Ike. "But don't give me no sass or I'll show you my ass." He winked. "Might show it to you anyway, if you was to ask."

"Why would I do that?"

"Curiosity, maybe. I'm guessing you never had a good piece of man ass."

"I'm no queer."

"Now don't be getting judgmental. Enjoying what's at hand ain't being queer. It's taking pleasure where you find it with anybody willing." Ike slipped a hand into the side slit of his overalls and I could tell he was fondling and straightening out his cock. "Now I admit I got me a hole that satisfied a few guys."

I swallowed, hard.

Ike winked. "Care to be asshole buddies?"

***

We worked steadily until noon. Ike drew a worn pocket watch from the bib pocket of his loose overalls and croaked, "Bean time. But first its time to reel out our limber hoses and make with the golden arches before lunch."

I followed Ike to the end of the greenhouse where he stopped at the outside wall of the potting shed. He opened his fly, fished inside, and finger-hooked a soft white penis with a pouting foreskin puckered half an inch past the hidden head.

"Yes sir," breathed Ike, "this old peter needs some draining." He exhaled a sigh as a strong, yellow stream splattered against the boards and ran down to soak into the earthen floor.

He caught me looking down at him. He winked. "Like what you're viewing, Boy?"

I looked away.

"You taking a serious interest in old Ike's pecker?"

I shook my head.

"Well you just haul out yourn and let old Ike return the compliment."

Feeling trapped and really having to go, I fumbled at my fly, turned away slightly, withdrew my penis and strained to start.

"Take your time boy. Let it all hang out. Old Ike's the first to admit that he likes looking at another man's pecker." He flicked away the last drop of urine and shook his limp penis vigorously.

I tried not to look interested.

"Yes sir, this old peepee feels so good out, I just might leave it out." He turned to give me a better view.

"What if somebody walks in?"

Ike shrugged. He looked at my strong yellow stream beating against the boards and moved a step closer. "You got a nice one,boy."

I glanced over at him. His cock was definitely larger and beginning to stick straight out. I nodded toward his crotch. "Don't you think you should put that away?"

"I got me strictly a parlor prick," said Ike. "Barely measures six inches." He grinned. "Of course it's big enough around to make a mouthful." He ran a thumb and forefinger along its length and drawing his foreskin back enough to expose the tip of the pink head. "Yersiree." He grinned, revealing nicotine stained teeth. "It sure feels good, letting the old boy breathe."

I knew I should button up and move away. I watched his fingers moving up and down the thickening column.

"You like checking out this old man's cock?"

I nodded. In spite of myself, my cock began to swell.

"Maybe we should have ourselves a little pecker pulling party." Ike slid his fingers back and forth on his expanding shaft and winked. "I may be old but I'm not against doing some little pud pulling with a friend."

I shook my head.

"Maybe I'll give my balls some air. Would you like a viewing of old Ike's hairy balls?"

I swallowed hard and moistened my dry lips.

He opened another button on his fly and pulled out his scrotum. "Good God, It feels good to set 'em free. Now let's see yours."

"Why?"

"Just to show you're neighborly," said Ike.

"I don't think so." I buttoned up and moved into the potting shed.

Ike followed, his cock and balls protruding from the front of his overalls. "Overlook my informality." Ike grinned. "As you can see I ain't bashful."

I nodded and took my sandwich from the brown paper bag.

"Yessir," said Ike. "I just might have to have myself an old fashioned peter pulling all by my lonesome. He unhooked a shoulder strap and let his overalls drop around his ankles.

I took a bite of my sandwich but my eyes remained on Ike.

"Yessiree," said Ike, "I got a good one if I do say so myself. Gets nearly as hard as when I was eighteen. You know why?"

I shook my head.

"Cause I keep exercising him. When I was younger I was pulling on it three time a day. Still like to do him every day I can."

"Some say you'll go blind if you do that too much."

"Bull-loney!" Don't you believe that shit. I been pulling my pud for close to fifty years and I didn't start till I was fifteen."

I laughed.

"You laughing at my little peter, boy?"

"Your hat." I pointed to the soiled, brown fedora cocked on his head. That and his overalls draped about his ankles were his only items of apparel. In between was a chest full of gray curly hair, two hairy legs. Smack between them stood an erect, pale white cock with a tip of foreskin still hiding the head.

"I am one hairy S.O.B.," said Ike.

"I laughed at you wearing nothing but a hat."

"Covers up my bald spot," said Ike. "I got more hair on my ass than I got on my head. Want to see?"

"Your head?"

"No, Boy, my hairy ass and around my tight, brown asshole." He turned, reached back with both hands and parted his ass cheeks to reveal the small, puckered opening. "There it is, Boy, the entrance lots of good feelings. Tell me, Boy, how would you like to put it up old Ike's ass?"

"I don't think so."

"That'd be the best damned piece you ever got."

"We shouldn't be talking like this."

"C'mon now, confess, don't this make your cock perk up a little bit?"

"I reckon," I confessed.

"You ever seen an old man's hard cock before," asked Ike.

"My grandpa's when I was twelve or thirteen."

"How'd that come about?"

He was out in the barn and didn't know I was around. He dropped his pants. It was real big he did things to it. He saw me and he turned around real fast but I saw it."

"What did your grandpa do?"

"He said I shouldn't be watching him doing that. He said something like grandma wouldn't give him some,' that morning and that I should get out of there and leave a poor man in peace to do what he had to do."

"Did you want to join him."

"I might have if he'd asked. He didn't."

"I like showing off my cock," said Ike. "A hard-on is something I always been proud of. A hard-on proves a man's a man. Makes me feel like a man that can do things." He looked up at me and winked. "You getting a hard-on from all this talk, son?"

I nodded and looked away.

"Then maybe you should pull it out and show old Ike what you got."

"We shouldn't."

"Hey. A man's not a man till he jacked off with a buddy."

I wanted to but I was as nervous as hell.

Ike grinned and fingered his pecker. "C'mon, Boy, between friends, a little cock showing is perfectly fine. Lets see what you got in the cock and balls department."

In spite of my reluctance, I felt the stirring in my crotch. I had curiosity that needed satisfying. It had been a long, long time since I had walked in on my grandfather .

"C'mon let's see it all."

I shook my head.

"You can join the party anytime, said Ike. "Just drop your pants and pump away."

I had the urge. There was a tingling in my crotch. My cock was definitely willing and I had a terrible need to adjust myself down there. But my timidity and the strangeness of it all held me back.

Hope you don't mind if I play out this hand." Ike grinned. "It feels like I got a winner."

I stared at his gnarled hand sliding up and down that pale, white column and I could not look away. I wet my lips and shook my head.

Old Ike's about to spout a geyser." Ike breathed harder as he winked. "Now if I just had a long finger up my ass. You interested, boy?"

I shook my head.

The first, translucent, white glob crested the top of his cock and and arced to the dirt floor. Ike held his cock at the base with thumb and forefinger and tightened noticeably with each throb of ejaculation until he was finished.

I could not believe any man could do what he had done in front of another human being.

Ike sighed with pleasure and licked his fingers. "A man ain't a man till he's tasted his own juices."

He squatted, turned on the faucet and picked up the connected hose. He directed the water between his legs and on to his still dripping prick and milked the few remaining drops of white, sticky stuff into the puddle forming at his feet. "Cool water sure feels good on a cock that just shot its wad," said Ike.

***

"Cock-tale telling time," said Old Ike. It was the next day and he rubbed the front of his dirty,worn overalls where his bulge made the fly expand as his fingers smoothed the denim around the outline of his expanding cock.

I wasn't sure what he had in mind but I knew it wasn't something my straight-laced Grandma would approve of.

"Don't you like taking your cock out and jacking it?" Ike licked his lips.

I shook my head in denial.

"Sure you do. A young man in his prime has got to be pulling his pud."

I stared at his calloused hand moving over the growing bulge at his crotch.

"Like I said," continued Ike, "I got me barely six inches when he's standing up." He winked at me. "How much you got, son?"

"Almost seven inches . . ." I stuttered. "Last time I measured."

"And I'm betting it feels real good with your fist wrapped around it."

"I don't do . . ."

"Everybody does it." He scratched his balls and said,"I'll show you mine if you show me yours." Then, looking me in the eye, he lifted his leg like a dog at a tree and let out a long, noisy fart.

Denying that I jacked off, I said, "I saw yours yesterday."

"A man has got to take out his pecker every once in a while." He winked and his fingers played with a button on his fly. Care to join me today?"

"I don't think so."

"What's the matter, boy? You ashamed of what's hanging 'tween your skinny legs?"

"It's not for showing off."

"That would be so with a crowd of strangers but with a friend, in a friendly showdown, where's the harm?

"It shouldn't be shown to other people. My Grandma said that a long time ago when I went to the bathroom against a tree when I was seven.

"There's nothing like a joint pulling among friends to seal a friendship," said Ike.

I don't think so." I felt very much, ill at ease.

"Then what the fuck is it for," demanded the old man. "A good man shares his cock with his friends. How old are you boy?"

"Nineteen almost twenty."

You ever fucked a woman?"

"No."

"Ever fucked a man?"

"Of course not.

"Son, you ain't never lived till you've fired your load up a man's tight ass."

"I didn't know men did that to each other."

"Men shove it up men's asses men all the time. They just don't talk about it like they do pussy."

"You've done that?"

"I admit this old pecker's been up a few manholes. More than a few hard cocks have shagged this old ass over the years." He shook his head, wistfully, "I still have a hankering for a hard one up the old dirt chute."

"I think that would hurt."

"First time, it usually does," agreed Ike. He took a bite from his sandwich.

I looked at my watch. Ten minutes of our lunch hour had already passed.

"We got time for a quickie," said Ike. "There's no one around to say, stop, if were enjoying ourselves."

He unhooked the slide off the button of one shoulder-strap, pushed the bib of his overalls down to let them fall to his feet.

"Showtime," said Ike. Between his legs, white and hairy, his semi-hard cock emerged from a tangled mass of brown and gray pubic hair. The foreskin, still puckered beyond the head of the cock, extended downward forty-five degrees from the horizontal but was definitely on the rise.

I could only stare at the man. Until the day before, I had never seen an older man with an erection besides my grandpa.

Ike moved his fingers along the stalk of his manhood until the head partially emerged, purplish and broad. He removed his hand for a moment and it bobbled obscenely in the subdued light of the potting shed. Ike leaned back against a bin of clay pots like a model on display. "Like I said, boy, it gets the job done."

I found it difficult not to watch. "You shouldn't . . ."

"C'mon, boy. Show Ike your pecker. I'm betting it's nice and hard."

I grasped my belt and tugged on the open end. I slipped the waistband button and two more before pushing down my blue jeans and shorts down in one move. My cock bounced and slapped my belly as I straightened."

"That's a beaut." Ike stroked his pale, white cock with the purplish-pink head shining. "I'm betting it'll grow some more if you stroke it."

"We really shouldn't . . ."

"Now don't tell me you never stroked your hard peter with a buddy."

"I've done that," I finally admitted,. "But he was the same age as me and it was a long time ago." I though back to the last time Chuck and me jerked each other off in the loft of our old barn. Chuck wanted more as a going away present and we had sucked each other's dicks a little bit.

"Jackin's always better when you do it with somebody," said Ike. "Then you can lend each other a helping hand."

"I don't know about that," I said.

Ike's hand continued moving on his old cock as he leaned over to inspect mine. "God Damn! Boy. That cock looks good enough to eat." Ike licked his lips. "You ever had that baby sucked?"

I shook my head as I watched the old man stroke his hard, pale cock.

"Well boy, I'd say you're packing a real mouthful for some lucky gal or guy." He grinned. "Well c'mon. Let's see you get down to some serious jacking. Old Ike's way ahead of you."

I wrapped my fist around my stiff cock and moved the foreskin up and over the head on the up stroke. On the down stroke the expanded corona of the angry, purple head stared obscenely at the naked old man.

Ike toyed with his modest six inches. "What do you think of this old man's cock?" His fist rode down to his balls and a cockhead smaller than the barrel stared back at mine.

"I guess I'm thinking this is like doing it with my grandpa."

"You ever wish you could a done this with your grandpa?"

"I thought about it a lot."

"Ever see him with a hard-on."

"I told you about that!"

"Ever think about him doing your grandma?"

"I can't imagine her ever doing anything with a man.

"Take my word for it, sonny, we know she did it or you wouldn't be here." Begrudgingly I nodded in agreement.

"Everybody fucks," said old Ike. "They fuck or they jack off."

"If you say so."

"Say sonny, your cocks getting real juicy with slickum. Want old Ike to lick some of it away?"

"You wouldn't."

Ike licked his lips as he kept his hand pistoning up and down his hard cock. "You might be surprised what old Ike might do if he was in the mood for a taste of what comes out of a hard cock."

And that is what he proceeded to do. He sucked me dry.

Then he erupted in half-a-dozen spurts shooting out and onto the dirt floor of the potting shed. He gave his cock a flip and shucked t back into his overalls. He unwrapped a sandwich from its wax paper and proceed to eat without washing his hands. He took a bite and chewed. "Nothing like it boy, a good jacking clears the cobwebs from your crotch and gives a man an appetite."

***

The following day, We skipped the preliminaries. We dropped our pants. Ike got down on his knees and sucked me until I was hard and good and wet before he stood and turned.

"C'mon boy, Shove that pretty cock up old Ike's tight, brown hole and massage old Ike's prostate.

Ike bent forward and gripped the edge of the potting bench. The lean, white cheeked buttocks parted slightly and exposed the dark brown, crinkly, puckered star of his asshole "Now you go slow and ease it along until you've got it all the way in," he cautioned. "This old ass craves your young cock but it don't want too much too soon. You've got to let this old hole stretch to accommodate you."

"Are you sure you want to do this?"

"Easy boy, easy," he cautioned. "You feel a lot bigger than you look. Put a little more spit in your cock."

"It's awfully tight. I don't know if it's going to go or not."

"It'll go," said Ike. "There's been bigger boys than you up the old shit chute."

I slipped in the the last few inches.. "It's all in."

"I can tell," said Ike. "Your cock hairs are tickling my ass."

"Are you ready," I asked.

"How are you liking old Ike's hairy asshole so far?"

"It's real tight."

"Tighter than your fist?"

"Might be."

"Ready to throw a fuck into a man that reminds you of your grandpa."

"I reckon."

"I want you should do old Ike one more favor."

"What?"

While you're pumpin' my ass, would you reach around and play with my dick like you would your own? Would you do that for an old man?"

I reached around and took hold of his hard cock sticking out straight in front of him. I pilled the skin back and then pulled it up and over the expanded glans. I felt my own cock expand inside him as I manipulated his staff in my fingers. I imagined that my cock extended through him and I was playing with what came out the other side of him.

"C'mon, boy, ram that big cock up the old shitter and make me know it. God Damn! tickle that old prostate and make old Ike come!"

I came. And I came. Ike's tightened up on my cock and I throbbed Roman Candle bursts into that brown hole as I pressed into him. His hairy, scrawny ass flattened against my crotch and we were joined as tightly as two humans can be.

"A man's not a man till he's cum in another man." said old Ike. "You made it, boy. But still, a man's not a man till he's had a hard cock poked up his ass at least once."

Every time I think of that scene, I get another hard-on. Then I remember the next day when old Ike returned the favor.

I never have managed to come that hard again. If only Ike were here.

Re:dear penis (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25707225)

That's interesting. When I think about empty suits, I think about Barack Obama. And when I think about Barack, I get a hard on that won't quit. A couple weeks ago, I saw him in the men's room at the downtown library. Well, you know the rest.

Guide To The Barack Obongo Presidency (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25706947)

Congratulations on your purchase of a brand new nigger! If handled properly, your apeman will give years of valuable, if reluctant, service.

INSTALLING YOUR NIGGER.
You should install your nigger differently according to whether you have purchased the field or house model. Field niggers work best in a serial configuration, i.e. chained together. Chain your nigger to another nigger immediately after unpacking it, and don't even think about taking that chain off, ever. Many niggers start singing as soon as you put a chain on them. This habit can usually be thrashed out of them if nipped in the bud. House niggers work best as standalone units, but should be hobbled or hamstrung to prevent attempts at escape. At this stage, your nigger can also be given a name. Most owners use the same names over and over, since niggers become confused by too much data. Rufus, Rastus, Remus, Toby, Carslisle, Carlton, Hey-You!-Yes-you!, Yeller, Blackstar, and Sambo are all effective names for your new buck nigger. If your nigger is a ho, it should be called Latrelle, L'Tanya, or Jemima. Some owners call their nigger hoes Latrine for a joke. Pearl, Blossom, and Ivory are also righteous names for nigger hoes. These names go straight over your nigger's head, by the way.

CONFIGURING YOUR NIGGER
Owing to a design error, your nigger comes equipped with a tongue and vocal chords. Most niggers can master only a few basic human phrases with this apparatus - "muh dick" being the most popular. However, others make barking, yelping, yapping noises and appear to be in some pain, so you should probably call a vet and have him remove your nigger's tongue. Once de-tongued your nigger will be a lot happier - at least, you won't hear it complaining anywhere near as much. Niggers have nothing interesting to say, anyway. Many owners also castrate their niggers for health reasons (yours, mine, and that of women, not the nigger's). This is strongly recommended, and frankly, it's a mystery why this is not done on the boat

HOUSING YOUR NIGGER.
Your nigger can be accommodated in cages with stout iron bars. Make sure, however, that the bars are wide enough to push pieces of nigger food through. The rule of thumb is, four niggers per square yard of cage. So a fifteen foot by thirty foot nigger cage can accommodate two hundred niggers. You can site a nigger cage anywhere, even on soft ground. Don't worry about your nigger fashioning makeshift shovels out of odd pieces of wood and digging an escape tunnel under the bars of the cage. Niggers never invented the shovel before and they're not about to now. In any case, your nigger is certainly too lazy to attempt escape. As long as the free food holds out, your nigger is living better than it did in Africa, so it will stay put. Buck niggers and hoe niggers can be safely accommodated in the same cage, as bucks never attempt sex with black hoes.

FEEDING YOUR NIGGER.
Your Nigger likes fried chicken, corn bread, and watermelon. You should therefore give it none of these things because its lazy ass almost certainly doesn't deserve it. Instead, feed it on porridge with salt, and creek water. Your nigger will supplement its diet with whatever it finds in the fields, other niggers, etc. Experienced nigger owners sometimes push watermelon slices through the bars of the nigger cage at the end of the day as a treat, but only if all niggers have worked well and nothing has been stolen that day. Mike of the Old Ranch Plantation reports that this last one is a killer, since all niggers steal something almost every single day of their lives. He reports he doesn't have to spend much on free watermelon for his niggers as a result. You should never allow your nigger meal breaks while at work, since if it stops work for more than ten minutes it will need to be retrained. You would be surprised how long it takes to teach a nigger to pick cotton. You really would. Coffee beans? Don't ask. You have no idea.

MAKING YOUR NIGGER WORK.
Niggers are very, very averse to work of any kind. The nigger's most prominent anatomical feature, after all, its oversized buttocks, which have evolved to make it more comfortable for your nigger to sit around all day doing nothing for its entire life. Niggers are often good runners, too, to enable them to sprint quickly in the opposite direction if they see work heading their way. The solution to this is to *dupe* your nigger into working. After installation, encourage it towards the cotton field with blows of a wooden club, fence post, baseball bat, etc., and then tell it that all that cotton belongs to a white man, who won't be back until tomorrow. Your nigger will then frantically compete with the other field niggers to steal as much of that cotton as it can before the white man returns. At the end of the day, return your nigger to its cage and laugh at its stupidity, then repeat the same trick every day indefinitely. Your nigger comes equipped with the standard nigger IQ of 75 and a memory to match, so it will forget this trick overnight. Niggers can start work at around 5am. You should then return to bed and come back at around 10am. Your niggers can then work through until around 10pm or whenever the light fades.

ENTERTAINING YOUR NIGGER.
Your nigger enjoys play, like most animals, so you should play with it regularly. A happy smiling nigger works best. Games niggers enjoy include: 1) A good thrashing: every few days, take your nigger's pants down, hang it up by its heels, and have some of your other niggers thrash it with a club or whip. Your nigger will signal its intense enjoyment by shrieking and sobbing. 2) Lynch the nigger: niggers are cheap and there are millions more where yours came from. So every now and then, push the boat out a bit and lynch a nigger.

Lynchings are best done with a rope over the branch of a tree, and niggers just love to be lynched. It makes them feel special. Make your other niggers watch. They'll be so grateful, they'll work harder for a day or two (and then you can lynch another one). 3) Nigger dragging: Tie your nigger by one wrist to the tow bar on the back of suitable vehicle, then drive away at approximately 50mph. Your nigger's shrieks of enjoyment will be heard for miles. It will shriek until it falls apart. To prolong the fun for the nigger, do *NOT* drag him by his feet, as his head comes off too soon. This is painless for the nigger, but spoils the fun. Always wear a seatbelt and never exceed the speed limit. 4) Playing on the PNL: a variation on (2), except you can lynch your nigger out in the fields, thus saving work time. Niggers enjoy this game best if the PNL is operated by a man in a tall white hood. 5) Hunt the nigger: a variation of Hunt the Slipper, but played outdoors, with Dobermans. WARNING: do not let your Dobermans bite a nigger, as they are highly toxic.

DISPOSAL OF DEAD NIGGERS.
Niggers die on average at around 40, which some might say is 40 years too late, but there you go. Most people prefer their niggers dead, in fact. When yours dies, report the license number of the car that did the drive-by shooting of your nigger. The police will collect the nigger and dispose of it for you.

COMMON PROBLEMS WITH NIGGERS - MY NIGGER IS VERY AGGRESIVE
Have it put down, for god's sake. Who needs an uppity nigger? What are we, short of niggers or something?

MY NIGGER KEEPS RAPING WHITE WOMEN
They all do this. Shorten your nigger's chain so it can't reach any white women, and arm heavily any white women who might go near it.

WILL MY NIGGER ATTACK ME?
Not unless it outnumbers you 20 to 1, and even then, it's not likely. If niggers successfully overthrew their owners, they'd have to sort out their own food. This is probably why nigger uprisings were nonexistent (until some fool gave them rights).

MY NIGGER bitches ABOUT ITS "RIGHTS" AND "RACISM".
Yeah, well, it would. Tell it to shut the fuck up.

MY NIGGER'S HIDE IS A FUNNY COLOR. - WHAT IS THE CORRECT SHADE FOR A NIGGER?
A nigger's skin is actually more or less transparent. That brown color you can see is the shit your nigger is full of. This is why some models of nigger are sold as "The Shitskin".

MY NIGGER ACTS LIKE A NIGGER, BUT IS WHITE.
What you have there is a "wigger". Rough crowd. WOW!

IS THAT LIKE AN ALBINO? ARE THEY RARE?
They're as common as dog shit and about as valuable. In fact, one of them was President between 1992 and 2000. Put your wigger in a cage with a few hundred genuine niggers and you'll soon find it stops acting like a nigger. However, leave it in the cage and let the niggers dispose of it. The best thing for any wigger is a dose of TNB.

MY NIGGER SMELLS REALLY BAD
And you were expecting what?

SHOULD I STORE MY DEAD NIGGER?
When you came in here, did you see a sign that said "Dead nigger storage"? That's because there ain't no goddamn sign.

Samsung? (4, Informative)

TheRaven64 (641858) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707015)

I saw a demo by Samsung a while back of their ARM port of Xen running multiple operating systems on a mobile phone [xen.org] . Not sure what the status of the technology is now, but they had some pretty nice ideas with the driver model and were talking about live-migrating your VM from your phone to your TV when you got home.

lol you undid your moderation (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25707185)

A couple weeks ago, while browsing around the library downtown, I had to take a piss. As I entered the john, Barack Obama -- the messiah himself -- came out of one of the booths. I stood at the urinal looking at him out of the corner of my eye as he washed his hands. He didn't once look at me. He was busy and in any case I was sure the secret service wouldn't even let me shake his hand.

As soon as he left I darted into the booth he'd vacated, hoping there might be a lingering smell of shit and even a seat still warm from his sturdy ass. I found not only the smell but the shit itself. He'd forgotten to flush. And what a treasure he had left behind. Three or four beautiful specimens floated in the bowl. It apparently had been a fairly dry, constipated shit, for all were fat, stiff, and ruggedly textured. The real prize was a great feast of turd -- a nine inch gastrointestinal triumph as thick as his cock -- or at least as I imagined it!

I knelt before the bowl, inhaling the rich brown fragrance and wondered if I should obey the impulse building up inside me. I'd always been a liberal democrat and had been on the Obama train since last year. Of course I'd had fantasies of meeting him, sucking his cock and balls, not to mention sucking his asshole clean, but I never imagined I would have the chance. Now, here I was, confronted with the most beautiful five-pound turd I'd ever feasted my eyes on, a sausage fit to star in any fantasy and one I knew to have been hatched from the asshole of Barack Obama, the chosen one.

Why not? I plucked it from the bowl, holding it with both hands to keep it from breaking. I lifted it to my nose. It smelled like rich, ripe limburger (horrid, but thrilling), yet had the consistency of cheddar. What is cheese anyway but milk turning to shit without the benefit of a digestive tract?

I gave it a lick and found that it tasted better then it smelled.

I hesitated no longer. I shoved the fucking thing as far into my mouth as I could get it and sucked on it like a big half nigger cock, beating my meat like a madman. I wanted to completely engulf it and bit off a large chunk, flooding my mouth with the intense, bittersweet flavor. To my delight I found that while the water in the bowl had chilled the outside of the turd, it was still warm inside. As I chewed I discovered that it was filled with hard little bits of something I soon identified as peanuts. He hadn't chewed them carefully and they'd passed through his body virtually unchanged. I ate it greedily, sending lump after peanutty lump sliding scratchily down my throat. My only regret was that Barack Obama wasn't there to see my loyalty and wash it down with his piss.

I soon reached a terrific climax. I caught my cum in the cupped palm of my hand and drank it down. Believe me, there is no more delightful combination of flavors than the hot sweetness of cum with the rich bitterness of shit. It's even better than listening to an Obama speech!

Afterwards I was sorry that I hadn't made it last longer. But then I realized that I still had a lot of fun in store for me. There was still a clutch of virile turds left in the bowl. I tenderly fished them out, rolled them into my handkerchief, and stashed them in my briefcase. In the week to come I found all kinds of ways to eat the shit without bolting it right down. Once eaten it's gone forever unless you want to filch it third hand out of your own asshole. Not an unreasonable recourse in moments of desperation or simple boredom.

I stored the turds in the refrigerator when I was not using them but within a week they were all gone. The last one I held in my mouth without chewing, letting it slowly dissolve. I had liquid shit trickling down my throat for nearly four hours. I must have had six orgasms in the process.

I often think of Barack Obama dropping solid gold out of his sweet, pink asshole every day, never knowing what joy it could, and at least once did, bring to a grateful democrat.

Re:Samsung? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25707229)

Why? So there can be an annoying pop-up when someone calls and I'm watching TV? Sounds nice and all but I'll pass on migrating the VM to my TV.

Re:Samsung? (2, Interesting)

TheRaven64 (641858) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707321)

Because your next generation TV will have a quad-core 1GHz ARM CPU. You can use it as a general purpose computer and then migrate your VM to your phone when you leave.

Re:Samsung? (1)

Gazzonyx (982402) | more than 5 years ago | (#25711973)

Make it over bluetooth and I'm in. I want 300 MS downtime, at most, as I walk to the door! If it takes longer than that, it'll have to finish over wifi as I leave the driveway.

Re:Samsung? (1)

Toe, The (545098) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707835)

Give the manufacturers another 75 years and we might even have a fully integrated lifestyle technology solution.

Science fiction authors of the 70s and 80s never would have believed we'd be this slow getting there. We can't even have discussions with our houses about their appliances. Heck, most people can't even have the lights come on when they enter the room.

Sure, there are more pressing problems in the world, but... wouldn't you think household/lifestyle integrations would be progressing faster than they seem to be?

Re:Samsung? (1)

jonbryce (703250) | more than 5 years ago | (#25718853)

I think the reason they haven't progressed that much is that there isn't the demand for it.

The light switch is still the simplest and most obvious UI for a light. You can get motion detectors for lights, only problem is that you have to wave your arms around every few minutes to switch the lights back on.

We still use bi-metallic strips for our heating control systems, because they are simple, they work reliably and do the job just as well as a more complex system.

As for the fridge ordering my shopping, how does it know whether or not I want the same thing again, I want to try something different, or I'm going on holiday, so I don't want a replacement just now, or I'm having a party, so I need much larger quantities. Much easier just to order it myself.

In other news... (1)

girlintraining (1395911) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707085)

"corporate phone personality", eh? So now my phone will be anal-retentive, calls will take 3-5 days before succeeding, and it'll come with this whiny voice asking me for the red stapler back? Will I have to ask permission to go to the bathroom too? This isn't what I signed up for when I became a geek. If I were the mother of these engineers, I'd force them to sing the entire set of all three High School Musical songs to them as punishment. And they would't be allowed to hangout with their friends in management anymore, because they're clearly a bad influence.

Wrong tags (1)

ari_j (90255) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707125)

Whoever tagged this "probleminsearchofasolution," can you explain that? The expression is "a solution in search of a problem" but maybe I am missing a turn of phrase relevant to this story.

Re:Wrong tags (1)

HBI (604924) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707165)

"Someone was dumb" seemed like an adequate solution to me.

Another one.... (3, Insightful)

Kaptain Kruton (854928) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707207)

I suspect this is yet another project in which a company asked, "can we do it?" without asking, "should we do it?" I doubt much of a market exists for users that want to run more than one OS on a cell phone. Also, abstraction layer the company and article speak of sounds similar to the Java virtual machine, but on a slightly lower level. I am not very familiar with complex mobile devices, but can see very little benefit in creating another layer of abstraction at a lower level to simply allow quicker development of programs, when developers can already do that with Java if they want programs portable amongst devices.

Re:Another one.... (4, Insightful)

Comatose51 (687974) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707613)

The idea behind a VM isn't simply to run multiple OSes. That's just one benefit. Imagine behind able to transfer the entire state of your machine between different physical hardware. VMware can already do this with x86 machines with VMotion. How they're looking for possible wider applications. How about being able to transfer everything on your old phone to a new phone? Or how about backing up everything on the phone somewhere? Or if you work in IT for a large company, wouldn't it be nice for your users if the loaner Blackberry can be customized and always stay the same for the user no matter which physical device is assigned? Don't forget how limited the Internet's applications were when it was first started. Innovation can happen when we apply old ideas to new areas.

Re:Another one.... (1)

blincoln (592401) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707879)

Imagine behind able to transfer the entire state of your machine between different physical hardware.

So you're arguing for virtualizing the entire OS as a workaround for application vendors who can't be bothered to write configuration-migrating utilities? For a *cellphone*?

I know I'm getting old, but isn't that a *bit* of overkill? And if the vendor can't be bothered to understand their configuration file/database well enough to migrate just those settings, do you really want to be running their software at all?

Re:Another one.... (1)

jonbryce (703250) | more than 5 years ago | (#25718869)

I bluetoothed my contact list across. Works fine. You don't need virtualisation to do that, just a standard format for information exchange, which already exists.

My current phone backs up everything onto an exchange server. Blackberry server does the same thing.

Re:Another one.... (3, Insightful)

BitZtream (692029) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709369)

A lower level abastraction layer below the java VM ... you mean like the OS itself?

All this VM stuff is becoming truely silly. Its really the OSes job to do all this crap, but since all the OS people can't get together in a sane manner, we have people making hardware virtualization to accomplish what the OS should be doing already.

All we're going to do is end up with a VMWare OS(Or Xen, KVM, virtual iron, insert your favorite here, sorry I don't remember it), and another second level OS running on top of it. (*BSD, Linux, Solaris, Windows whatever).

This whole thing is just silly and completely redundant, not just on mobile phones but on standard PCs and servers.

We don't need a VM to get our jobs done, we need all the OS people to understand that we want common interfaces to code against, kinda like what POSIX sorta wanted to be but really wasn't.

The OS is supposed to be our hardware abstraction layer, not a hypervisor that does hardware abstraction so our OS can do hardware abstraction so our apps can not no anything about the multiple levels of hardware abstraction.

Re:Another one.... (1)

hab136 (30884) | more than 5 years ago | (#25718719)

All this VM stuff is becoming truely silly. Its really the OSes job to do all this crap, but since all the OS people can't get together in a sane manner, we have people making hardware virtualization to accomplish what the OS should be doing already.

Is it the operating system's job to migrate to a new physical machine if the one its running on catches on fire? Without stopping?
Is it the operating system's job to consolidate multiple discrete machines with different purposes, users, and security on to the same physical hardware while keeping them separated logically?
Is it the operating system's job to reliably checkpoint and playback operation of all apps and the operating system itself?
Is it the operating system's job to correctly run old applications in a supported old version of the OS? For example, a legacy CP/M or OS/2 app that controls custom machinery.

OS/360, Solaris Zones, and user-mode Linux do some of these; however it does make sense to have a VM layer underneath the OS, especially when you have needs for multiple OSes.

Why have every OS implement these things when you can just have a VM layer doing it, and provide an additional layer of control and security beyond what the OS provides?

Re:Another one.... (1)

badkarmadayaccount (1346167) | more than 5 years ago | (#25737235)

Simple: a smalltalk-esque userspace image that hops between kernels.

Re:Another one.... (1)

hab136 (30884) | more than 5 years ago | (#25745263)

Simple: a smalltalk-esque userspace image that hops between kernels.

That's.. exactly what VMs are. Except instead of rewriting everything to Smalltalk or Java bytecode, it's left as x86 code.
You can't exactly pause a Smalltalk image during the middle of a network operation, move it to a new kernel, and have it resume as if nothing happened (and within a half second).

Re:Another one.... (1)

badkarmadayaccount (1346167) | more than 5 years ago | (#25748501)

Simple: a smalltalk-esque userspace image that hops between kernels.

Take a good look at that and tell me what you see. BTW, i was implying that the kernel should be able to swap the in-RAM userland image in situ without making a hassle, I mean there is no good reason not to. Instead of crufting it up with things that are hardware independent and pointless to be there, like the file system, lets put something useful in there, for a change.

Re:Another one.... (1)

badkarmadayaccount (1346167) | more than 5 years ago | (#25748547)

Damn it, replying to myself... Whatever. Um, did you say Java bytecode? You do realize that the concept of a easy to handle image of an application and its state are specific to the smalltalk VM environment?

Re:Another one.... (1)

hab136 (30884) | more than 5 years ago | (#25871317)

Damn it, replying to myself... Whatever. Um, did you say Java bytecode? You do realize that the concept of a easy to handle image of an application and its state are specific to the smalltalk VM environment?

For different definitions of "easy", sure. You can serialize out Java apps with their state, but you have to write the serialization wrapper yourself instead of being built into the environment.

http://java.sun.com/developer/technicalArticles/Programming/serialization/ [sun.com]

Re:Another one.... (1)

hab136 (30884) | more than 5 years ago | (#25871355)

Simple: a smalltalk-esque userspace image that hops between kernels.

Take a good look at that and tell me what you see.

Bold print? :)

BTW, i was implying that the kernel should be able to swap the in-RAM userland image in situ without making a hassle, I mean there is no good reason not to.

Ah, you want the kernel to remain hardware dependent but the entire userland to move around. Every API that userland can touch would have to be image-aware, in addition to the kernels on the machines sharing state (whether one-time for moving or continuously for fault tolerance). But yeah, that'd be interesting - for that one OS.

Instead of crufting it up with things that are hardware independent and pointless to be there, like the file system, lets put something useful in there, for a change.

I don't understand what you're trying to say here. Crufting what up? The kernel? Where should the filesystem modules live?

Re:Another one.... (1)

BitZtream (692029) | more than 5 years ago | (#25849989)

I know the reply is late, but uhm, for almost all of your questions, YES it is the operating systems responsibility.

Just because you haven't seen an operating system that actually works for shit doesn't mean its not there.

And stop listening to all the advertising VMware is selling, when your VM server catches fire and suddenly stops, its not going to mysteriously appear on another VM server without stopping. The machine has to be moved to a new VM server. That move has to be triggered while the original server is alive and well or the contents of ram will be lost meaning you have to boot on the new VM server. Second, while the move is in progress the VM has to be paused so the memory contents are consistent, while this is normally a quick process compared to booting, its not instant and you will most certainly notice the pause on anything with a usable amount of ram.

Learn a little bit about what ACTUALLY happens before you start talking about what marketing tells you happens, it doesn't actually work as flawlessly as you think it does, sorry.

Re:Another one.... (1)

hab136 (30884) | more than 5 years ago | (#25871373)

I know the reply is late, but uhm, for almost all of your questions, YES it is the operating systems responsibility.

If every operating system has to implement these things.. uh.. we might be waiting a while. Old operating systems stay around for a long, long time - Microsoft just this year stopped selling Windows 3.1. OS/2 still exists in some places, as does DOS and SCO. XP and Windows Server 2000/2003 will be around a while too. While some operating systems now include some virtualization features, it will probably continue to be useful for some time to virtualize operating systems that don't include their own virtualization.

If you're already running a virtualization layer for some OSes, why not have the layer generic and separate for all OSes? Is there any advantage to having the OS try to virtualize itself? Why should it be the operating system's job to provide these capabilities? (My answer: it shouldn't be the operating system's job; it should be another layer)

Just because you haven't seen an operating system that actually works for shit doesn't mean its not there.

I'm pretty sure we're discussing responsibilities, not capabilities - but I'd love to hear about more OSes that provide these capabilities in-built. We previously mentioned OS/360, Solaris Zones, and userland Linux, which provide some of these capabilities (mainframe OSes more than the others, DLPARs [wikipedia.org] are awesome, but not the end-all-be-all).

And stop listening to all the advertising VMware is selling, when your VM server catches fire and suddenly stops, its not going to mysteriously appear on another VM server without stopping. The machine has to be moved to a new VM server. That move has to be triggered while the original server is alive and well or the contents of ram will be lost meaning you have to boot on the new VM server. Second, while the move is in progress the VM has to be paused so the memory contents are consistent, while this is normally a quick process compared to booting, its not instant and you will most certainly notice the pause on anything with a usable amount of ram.

Learn a little bit about what ACTUALLY happens before you start talking about what marketing tells you happens, it doesn't actually work as flawlessly as you think it does, sorry.

Good point; one of the capabilities I mentioned is not available today from VMWare, and it helps to know current capabilities. Right now you have to move the VM before you set the server on fire. In the future (2009?) you can set the server on fire without previously moving the VM:

http://www.vmware.com/technology/virtual-datacenter-os/application.html [vmware.com]

# It then uses vLockstep technology to keep the primary and secondary virtual machines in exactly the same state on another server.
# In the event of hardware failure on the primary virtual machine, the secondary takes over with no disruption to users

I believe certain mainframes have something similar already (though for the life of me I can't remember the name, and Google is failing me.. something about a 10 kilometer limit for fiber interconnect for it to work) - basically two machines execute the same code in tandem, but the result (and I/O) is only used from one. Everything from memory to I/O state to CPU registers is sync'd to within a second.

Anyways, I don't think the current availability of this capability affects whether or not it (or the other capabilities) are the role of the OS or a separate VM layer, which what we were discussing. I'm still of the mind that these capabilities are best served by a separate VM layer under the OS, if for no other reason than organizations need to support multiple operating systems.

My computer (1)

hey (83763) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707319)

I am not yet running multiple OSes on my PC yet. I don't want them virtualized because (I figure) they'll run slower. I kinda feel that way about my phone too. Still they are looking ahead. It might help somebody/someday. So why not.

Will customers really want this ? (i.e. carriers) (5, Interesting)

neurocutie (677249) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707351)

Aside from the obvious technical hurtles (underpowered CPUs, insufficient memory, insufficient flash ROM to store multiple OSs, few user-installable mobile OSs with device-specific "plug'n'play" support, etc), there would seem to be one glaring obstacle... the carriers.

Lest anyone forget, the true customers for mobile devices are not individual consumers, but the carriers. And it is going to be a long time, if ever, before that will change. Indeed recent trends continue, if not increase, the extent of device-carrier lock-in, although often in more subtle ways that simply a software lock. The biggest trend is non-interoperable data services, either via authentication protocols that are carrier-specific, or simply spectrum differences (e.g. Tmobile's 3G bands are different than AT&T's or European 3G bands, even though all are considered "GSM").

So given this, why exactly would a carrier be interested in provide its customers with the ability to run multiple OSs on their mobile devices. And it is far more complicated from a technical and licensing standpoint than on a generic PC. Mobile OSs are not licensed by individual customers, and they are totally not set up to be installed on arbitrary mobile hardware. For example, a Palm 700p and a 700w are almost the same hardware, but it is not possible and no one has even tried to put PalmOS from the 700p on a 700w, or vice versa, WinMo from the 700w to a 700p. The only notable efforts in this vein are attempts to port Android to HTC WinMo devices (with marginal but possible future success). However that is only possible because Android is open source. And there is not obvious benefit to the carrier for doing this...

Indeed carriers, particularly Verizon (but all of them) generally try to restrict and remove features intrinsic to OEM devices (e.g. phone as modem features, WiFi, MMS, app suites like Pocket Office), in order to limit the individual customer's capabilities and force the carriers customers into specific "business models" for services (e.g. pay extra for phone as model, pay for data instead of free Wifi, etc). The freedom to run multiple OSs would necessarily give individual customers to circumvent these artificial, deliberate carrier-imposed restrictions -- something the carriers obviously would not want.

All in all sounds like a huge amount of work required with little upside for the real customers, i.e. the carriers. Until the wireless networks are truly "open access", with the power of device choice in the hands of consumers, not the carriers, the effort of multiple OSs seems doomed to failure...

Re:Will customers really want this ? (i.e. carrier (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25707635)

Perhaps in the United States. In most of Europe all the phones are not subsidized by the carriers, are paid by the customers and are unlocked.

Data, networks, frequencies. They are all standard and can be connected to with any phone on the market.

Re:Will customers really want this ? (i.e. carrier (3, Insightful)

FourthAge (1377519) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707647)

why exactly would a carrier be interested in provide its customers with the ability to run multiple OSs on their mobile devices. And it is far more complicated from a technical and licensing standpoint than on a generic PC.

Maybe because it makes licensing simpler!

Suppose you want your phone to run Linux, and you'd like the users to be able to install their own kernels and whatever other software they want, but you need to stop them messing with the GSM/3G stack in order to satisfy the FCC and the carrier. How do you do it? Answer: use virtualisation to split the software environment into two parts - "secure" and "open". Now your users get what they want (open software environment), and so do the carriers (some parts are still locked down).

This is cheaper than the other way to solve the problem (using two separate computers). It also uses less energy. Even if a company doesn't care about Linux, they might still want to run complex consumer applications on their phones, requiring strong separation of privileges that are hard to assure in a large consumer OS kernel. x86 Windows XP on a phone? With a CPU like Intel Atom, hypervisor-level security and "PC on a chip" hardware, why not?

There's enough reason to do this that all the mobile phone companies are involved with it in some way. Somebody mentioned a Xen version of this VMware system, and there's a port of L4 being made for this purpose as well [acm.org] .

Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (2, Insightful)

CPE1704TKS (995414) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707469)

It might be that you guys don't understand the benefits, but now that cell phones become part of the virtualization game, it really means that you can extend things almost anywhere. Think about what happened when the Internet moved out to cell phones, people are instantly connected to everything they want. They can communicate, etc from anywhere in the world.

If you can virtualize your desktop onto your cell phone, think about the possibilities. You're working at your desk and then you need to go on a trip to a different country. You "download" your desktop onto your cell phone/iPhone or whatever, and then you can keep working, and even maintain network connectivity. By the time this becomes mainstream, I'm sure cell phones will have multi-GHz equivalent chips with 20+ gb storage. Then, when you get to the hotel, you connect up your cell phone to the hotel's docking system with monitor and keyboard, etc.

You keep working, and then when you get back to the office, just transfer your virtual machine back onto your desktop. Or, if you want, just keep working from your cell phone.

Who knows what the possibilities will be, but this seems to be the point. Processors aren't getting much faster, guys, and the applications that need them have pretty much ended. I'm still using my 1 GHz laptop from 2004 without skipping a beat, and I don't imagine things needing much more than this for the next 5 years. I'm sure within a few years the cell phones will be more powerful than this.

Re:Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (4, Insightful)

blincoln (592401) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707939)

You are using "virtualize" in the marketing sense. There is no good reason to virtualize the entire OS of a desktop machine just so that you can copy your documents and preferences to a cellphone and back. That's not using a sledgehammer instead of a flyswatter. It's building a fleet of space-tugs, sending them to the asteroid belt to bring back asteroids, and then dropping those asteroids from orbit onto the flies.

Re:Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (3, Insightful)

CPE1704TKS (995414) | more than 5 years ago | (#25708339)

No, you get it, you're being far too small-minded about this. You have this single concept of what virtualization should be, and you're wrong because you can't see what it could bring in the future.

It's not about copying your documents back and forth. The entire interaction between you and your computer totally changes. Why exactly do I care where my desktop is running as long as I have access to it. Do I really want to copy my documents back and forth onto a single USB drive? Yeah, that's how we do it right now, but why even bother? Why not just have a single copy of my "desktop" and move it around from location to location. Who knows, maybe the cell phone will be the desktop in the future, and you just switch form factors depending on where you are or what you want to do. Virtualization is the first step to this, creating a homogeneous environment.

Look at the difference between having your POP3 client vs having all your mail on Gmail. Would you consider that the same as dropping asteroids onto a fly? With a POP3 client, you need to copy around all your mail files whenever you want to move around, you need to know the specific server settings, etc. I know this because my mother-in-law came over last month and needed me to set up her POP3 client for her because it didn't work here. If she used Gmail, things would "just work". Same thing goes with virtualization, you can copy your documents around, but maybe the computer you're using doesn't have the same set up. Maybe the versions of MS Word are different, etc.

Moving this concept out to cell phones is the next step, just like it was for email. I think it will take another 5 years, but I'm sure it's on its way. People will probably be docking their iPhones at work to download the desktop, working from home from their home docking station, etc.

Re:Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (1)

Compholio (770966) | more than 5 years ago | (#25708661)

People tried this with networking, even on a fully gigabit network it's waaaay too slow to transfer everything to do with your "desktop" between instances of you logging in. For the foreseeable future there's no way to do what you talk about without having a physical medium where your files are directly stored and retrieved as needed (which is how many people use their flash drives now).

Re:Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (1)

Ant P. (974313) | more than 5 years ago | (#25711539)

Why not just have a single copy of my "desktop" and move it around from location to location.

Why carry around an entire fucking OS when a simple rsync or nfs mount over a vpn of /home/~ would suffice?

Re:Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (1)

badkarmadayaccount (1346167) | more than 5 years ago | (#25737325)

Not enough buzzwords.

Re:Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (1)

blirp (147278) | more than 5 years ago | (#25708855)

You keep working, and then when you get back to the office, just transfer your virtual machine back onto your desktop. Or, if you want, just keep working from your cell phone.

But the strange thing is that the kind of work you can actually usefully do on these devices, really is all in your head. So time off from the computer, thinking, usually makes for a better product ...

M.

Re:Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (1)

Teckla (630646) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709683)

I would mod you up if I had mod points right now. What you describe is very similar to what I would like to do.

There are 3 computers I use regularly, my work PC, my home PC, and my wife's PC. I would like to be able to switch between these interchangeably, with my entire "operating system" coming with me when I sit down at one of these PCs.

Right now I can partially achieve what I want by running VirtualBox or VMware (or whatever) and copying the "virtual hard drive" to/from my USB flash drive. However, the entire process is still very manual and error prone, plus high capacity (32+ GB) USB flash drives are kind of expensive, and slow to transfer that much data.

Also, it requires I shutdown the "virtual OS" and un-mount the "virtual hard drive" (making it safe to copy). Live migration of my running virtual operating system would be awesome.

Ideally, I would like a solution that keeps my three "virtual hard drives" (on my work PC, my home PC, and my wife's PC) in sync via some kind of daemon or server that tracks changes and propagates the changes to the other locations seamlessly, and allows live migrations, all completely seamlessly and effortlessly.

Re:Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (1)

jonbryce (703250) | more than 5 years ago | (#25718921)

VMWare etc is not going to help you here.

I use a combination of RSync, Exchange, Remote Desktop and Samba to achieve what you are looking for.

It so happens that my Windows 2003 server runs on VMWare, but that is so I have less boxes under my desk. Not so I can move things around.

Re:Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (1)

jonaskoelker (922170) | more than 5 years ago | (#25712439)

If you can virtualize your desktop onto your cell phone, think about the possibilities. You're working at your desk and then you need to go on a trip to a different country. You "download" your desktop onto your cell phone/iPhone or whatever, and then you can keep working, and even maintain network connectivity.

Or I just pick up my laptop and put it in the bag. Now I have something with a trackpoint and a keyboard best operated by more than one finger. Oh, and it can also compile stuff reasonably fast, it can switch between applications and I can see more than four lines of code on the screen.

True, it doesn't last several days on a single battery charge. And it doesn't fit in my pocket. On the other hand, I don't run emacs and compiz on my phone these days; and the places where I only have the computer I can store in my pocket, yet want to do some computing, are rather limited.

The only benefit for me and my particular ways would be if I could sync my phone calendar with my oracle calendar at the university and my wyrd/remind calendar on my desktop and ~/todo.txt on my laptop. That'd be nice.

Other than that, I'm not sold yet. On the other hand, you said virtualization was the future, not the present ;)

Re:Virtualization is the future, esp for desktop (1)

jonbryce (703250) | more than 5 years ago | (#25718937)

You could have your phone and your laptop both talking to an Exchange server, or some similar groupware server from a competitor. I don't see where virtulisation comes into it.

Increased battery life? (1)

jep77 (1357465) | more than 5 years ago | (#25707571)

The first thing that came to my mind when I read this was extended battery life. With my old phone, which was only a phone, the battery lasted for days and days. My Tilt won't make it 24 hours unless I never actually use it and I have good signal quality the whole time.
Maybe, through virtualization, my phone could be "just a phone" until I need the rest of the stuff. If you run "phone" as one VM and "mobile computer" as another VM and only start it up when you actually need the mobile computer stuff. That's gotta lead to longer battery life... assuming, of course, the virtualization platform doesn't eat up what I'm saving by not running the extra stuff.

Alas, it will probably only be used as a marketing gimmick which will, in the end, just cost me more money.

Re:Increased battery life? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25707743)

Thank you, I had nearly forgotten to blink.

Not just for phones (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25708083)

From TFA: "The Cortex-A8 and Cortex-A9 processors could soon find their way into netbooks and mobile internet devices (MIDs) as well as smartphones, which would increase the potential market for MVP."

If this makes more features available on netbooks, etc., then the process of making a (already sizable) dent into the traditional laptop market will only accelerate.

I'd like to see the entrenched architecture (x86+M$) take a beating; maybe they'll start listening to their customers.

VMware's vClient initiative (3, Informative)

ErMaC (131019) | more than 5 years ago | (#25708279)

For those of you thinking that this is a solution in search of a problem, let me outline where VMware is going with this.
At VMworld this year, Paul Maritz (VMware CEO) outlined their strategy for the future of the desktop - a world where users are given access to applications and data regardless of the end device. Today we see desktops as more device-centric, rather than people centric. VDI (Virtual Desktop Infrastructure) is a step in the direction of device-independence. It doesn't matter if I'm at work, at home, or on the road, I can get to the same desktop, applications, and data.
But going forward VMware is looking at delivering the entire desktop steamed down as a VM to a "client hypervisor", so instead of viewing as it runs remotely in a datacenter, the data is streamed down and processed locally so there's no lag induced by a high-latency link or something like that.
This works great for ordinary PCs or x86-based thin clients. Where VMware is going is taking their hypervisor layer and moving it to the mobile device, so that a user can get their same desktop (or a subset of its functionality) even from their PDA/smartphone. That's the purpose of this technology long term - it's not so you can run Android in a VM on your iPhone.

Re:VMware's vClient initiative (1)

gtall (79522) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709303)

"But going forward"...did you swallow a marketbot?

Gerry

Want!!!!!! (1)

Lvdata (1214190) | more than 5 years ago | (#25708293)

I just got a Sprint Touch Pro, and I am having problems deciding on what WM6.1 OS variant to run. I'd LIKE to have

1. The original HTC/Sprint Rom - backup mostly
2. A optimized / striped down version of WM6.1 without all the Sprint crapware (Sprint TV and music, and misc memory and cpu wasting Sprint branding)
3. Google Android

There IS plenty of memory for all three. 45 min to reflash is a PITA, and I loose all my settings each time I do. A simple reboot and chose my OS at boot time is much preferred. My personal laptop is already setup this way, with multiple VM's for personal and work.

Ah multiple OS's, thats handy (1)

tgd (2822) | more than 5 years ago | (#25708387)

Which one will the root shell be running in when I type reboot?

Serious question (1)

Toll_Free (1295136) | more than 5 years ago | (#25708569)

What's the point?

You already have (in most smartphones) an operating system for the radio and one for the system the user sees.

I mean, is it necessary to run Android and Windows Mobile at the same time, or at all, on the same phone?

People might argue DEVELOPERS, DEVELOPERS, DEVELOPERS, but I argue right back, isn't it more intelligent to design software FOR AND ON the device your designing it for? I mean, I'm all for productivity, but it seems like you end up with better software beta testing it on the actual product, and not a simulator.

So seriously, what is the actual, real-world use for VMWare on a cellphone? Just the coolness, or does it actually have a mission critical place?

--Toll_Free

Yes but... (1)

beansprouts (1380955) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709287)

will it support emacs?

1st thing 1st! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25709357)

Can they develop a mobile OS that

Yes but... (1)

beansprouts (1380955) | more than 5 years ago | (#25709381)

will a pocket-sized cluster of these running load-balanced Apache in the background, a Windows VM for Office apps on the go all tied together by Exposé get me more booty is what I want to know!!

Try again (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25709489)

Can they develop a mobile OS that doesn't suck first????

Or do it now with JPC! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25709873)

Or you could do it now with JPC! http://www-jpc.physics.ox.ac.uk/

Those guys were booting dos and linux on mobile phones 2 years ago! JPC lets you run any native code you like in Java.

But... (1)

pesho (843750) | more than 5 years ago | (#25710689)

... do they promise additional cell phone batteries and a pocket air conditioning system to go along with it.

Nothing new... yet another time... (1)

x0ra (1249540) | more than 5 years ago | (#25711109)

It already exist: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS8417344656.html [linuxdevices.com] . However, their solution runs a custom RTOS for modem control and a Linux kernel for the multimedia and MMI.

huh? (1)

nurb432 (527695) | more than 5 years ago | (#25711409)

Except for developers what practical value will this be?

I want specs! (1)

mmu_man (107529) | more than 5 years ago | (#25718285)

I don't need faked hardware, I just want the real specs to port Haiku to them! After all the marketing buzz about "mobile desktop", that means those are the same as PCs, for which at least here tied sale is illegal. But of course providing alternative OSes means specs are needed...

Already available (1)

ericdujardin (623023) | more than 5 years ago | (#25722945)

At least two companies have been focusing on OS virtualization on mobile phones for several years, namely Virtuallogix and Trango. They both advertize the interest of running both an RTOS specialized on real-time mobile network protocol handling, and a generic-purpose OS for user applications. Security is also a motivation, especially if phone-based payment systems develop. I believe there are already models running Virtuallogix software on sale now, just check their web site. So VmWare is just saying that they're going to duplicate these products, unless they plan to buy one of these companies.

Re:Already available (1)

ericdujardin (623023) | more than 5 years ago | (#25736533)

Yeah I was right ! They're buying Trango.
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