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Irish Gov't Seeks To Rein In Cyber Bullying

timothy posted more than 5 years ago | from the hands-stuck-in-wringing-position dept.

Social Networks 211

An anonymous reader points out a story on the Irish Times that says "the Irish government is looking for ways to combat 'cyber-bullying' after data indicated that a significant percentage of young children are subjected to this kind of abuse via their mobile phone and popular social network accounts. The industry has been asked to come up with solutions for this problem and a government office is due to publish a guide on the issue in the near future. Surely this is a problem faced by children in all developed countries these days." Add "for the children" to the list of reasons to track the Web-site habits of mobile web users in Ireland.

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Eat my goatse'd penis! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758443)

Eat my goatse'd [goatse.cz] penis!

Just plain bullying (5, Insightful)

bigtomrodney (993427) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758467)

As an Irish person I'm glad that something is being done about bullying. I was bullied at school a lot and when not being beaten was subject to horrendous psychological bullying.

The main point here though is that so-called "Cyber-bullying" is just bullying. Various organisations have been sensationalising this issue by prefixing [i]cyber[/i] and pretending it's a new issue. What about when I was receiving phone calls at all hours? Was that cyber-bullying? It was just called bullying in my day.

I really think that this whole issue is doing more to harm the reputation of the internet/computers/phones than it is to resolve the larger issue of bullying. All I expect to see from this is a large set of draconian yet ineffective restrictions placed around communication media and this is something that disgusts me for a lot of reasons.

Re:Just plain bullying (4, Insightful)

bigtomrodney (993427) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758483)

Apologies for replying to myself but my first post doesn't read back the way I intended it to.

I would like something to be done about bullying as a whole, but I suspect that when implemented under the banner of cyber-bullying it will completely miss the point and will likely be doomed to failure. The emphasis on the 'cyber' aspect tells me it'll be cheap and ineffective technological measure when we could be using this opportunity to tackle bullying in the wider scheme.

Re:Just plain bullying (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758543)

You want a fix to bullying go after the parents who raise their children to be a bully, and to the parents that don't teach their children how to cope with being bullied. Both are important if you cant learn to stick up for yourself as you are growing up god forbid when it comes time to step into the real deal where people are cut-throat just put a nicer face on it.

Re:Just plain bullying (5, Insightful)

bigtomrodney (993427) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758599)

and to the parents that don't teach their children how to cope with being bullied.

Bollocks . When mob mentality comes into it, you see how well you stand up against 15-20 people. It's starts with the leader of the cool gang, then it's the cool gang and then it's the people siding with the rest of them to keep on the good side.

It's amazing how one or two bad apples can turn the tables. It is not the Hollywood image of one bigger kid pushing people around - far from it. The big kids, much like bigger dogs, have nothing to prove.

I used to be bullied (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758621)

It stopped when I was legally able to drive. Nothing concentrates the mind of someone who beat you up in the playground as much as seeing you accelerate towards them and swerve away at the last second later in the day.

Re:Just plain bullying (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758719)

Who said its a hollywood style bullying? You learn or you suffer its true for anything in life. Learn to adapt or go extinct etc... If you prepare your children for life they should not be in that situation in the first place and if they do find themselves in it they should have the skills to deal with it.

There are always going to be people that try to assert themselves by being a bully to someone be it physical or mental.

Re:Just plain bullying (3, Interesting)

VoidCrow (836595) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758741)

I second that bollocks. However, three or four of our bullies were built like Biffa Bacon, one of them used an air-pistol to bushwhack other kids on the way to the sweet shop, and they were the main culprits in a group of 15-20 people. Kids who showed obvious transgender behaviour were basically permenent toast. Geeks frequently got hassled. None of the big kids who *weren't* bullies got picked on.

This is a *basic* problem. In adult life, sociopaths end up running countries, religions, and/or large amoral corporations. I'm guessing but willing to bet that a significant percentage of school bullies are sociopaths. Until we can reliably diagnose this and correct the tendency, we will continue to have a problem. Half-assed attempts to monitor and censor the web in a supposed attempt to combat this are just equal epic fail.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

theaveng (1243528) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758911)

If there are any adult nearby who observe this behavior, then they should step-in and break-up the clique. And lecture them in detention about why they are adults (capable of reproduction, et cetera), and they should be acting like adults, not insulting their peers.

Re:Just plain bullying (4, Insightful)

characterZer0 (138196) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759363)

Oh please. Adults act exactly the same way.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

HungryHobo (1314109) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759489)

And this will make a difference how? last time I checked assholes tend not to listen.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

umghhh (965931) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759515)

So what you say we should pump them with tranquilizers or what? I can agree that recognizing who is doing it may help but it can only do this much. I suppose there are many things that one can do - supervising the youth is one thing. The other is supporting youngsters in organizing themselves. That comes handy later too when it comes to fighting pricks in high offices. Of course that can deteriorate into gang fight but that is why you should educate people into thinking global about this and to teach them to respect others, ethics etc.

I guess not all can be prevented anyway but at least we can try this way.

Re:Just plain bullying (2, Informative)

redscare2k4 (1178243) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759061)

The best way to fight that kind of mob bulling IMO:

You pick the weakest of that mob. There's always that kind of guy that becomes a bully just to avoid being the victim instead, but that it's not physically strong. Find him when he's alone and beat the crap out of him. No mercy, no remorse. Beat him to a bloody pulp.

When the rest of the pack see that you're not a wimp and that if pushed too far you will stand your ground, they'll leave you alone. It's not a pretty advice, to pick on the weak. But the world is not a pretty place neither.

Re:Just plain bullying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759185)

Make it prettier, beat the leader instead.

Usually there's one standing in front making the trouble supported by a bunch of other fellows behind him. In younger days I learned to kick 'em in the nuts real hard soon and unexpected. No way the other wusses are going to do anything if their stupid nazi leader is laying on the ground crying!

Yes they thought I was crazy but at least they left me allone.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

aproposofwhat (1019098) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759289)

I agree 100%

When faced with a gang, you either run like hell, or if you can't, you take out the biggest threat first.

That's not always the biggest thug - it could be the little clever bastard that directs things.

Nobody has ever tried to bully me more than once - even in adult life I am quite prepared to stand up to bullying, and make sure I do it in public, where everyone can see what's going on and the bully gets humiliated in front of their peers.

Cyber-bullying is a different matter - by its very nature it is more private (text harrassment, posts to social networking sites, etc.), so what needs to be looked at is how to bring the bullies to public account.

Not being a prolific user of that sort of thing, I don't have an answer, but I'm sure there is one.

Re:Just plain bullying (2, Insightful)

HungryHobo (1314109) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759343)

If someone start senting your child death threats written on postcards there's already a system. Email and texts are no different.New tech doesn't always need new rules.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

redscare2k4 (1178243) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759337)

My initial assumption was that you're unable to beat the big bully (or at least harm him enough to make him reconsider his actions). But if you can face him, please be my guest and make him a new face :D

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

blind biker (1066130) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759125)

I agree with this and all the other posts in this thread you wrote. Sometimes people who were bullied are reluctant to talk about it. You are, I think, corageous to be so open about it - I know I still feel it's hard to talk about this kind of experience.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

Lumpy (12016) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759327)

When mob mentality comes into it, you see how well you stand up against 15-20 people.

1 handgun will disperse an angry mob of 20 very fast.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

Jaysyn (203771) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759509)

I agree, we should start arming 13 year-olds immediately. Won't someone think of the Children!

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

El Torico (732160) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759345)

Bollocks . When mob mentality comes into it, you see how well you stand up against 15-20 people. It's starts with the leader of the cool gang, then it's the cool gang and then it's the people siding with the rest of them to keep on the good side.

Sounds like politics.

Re:Just plain bullying (4, Interesting)

jonaskoelker (922170) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758935)

if you cant learn to stick up for yourself as you are growing up god forbid when it comes time to step into the real deal where people are cut-throat just put a nicer face on it.

Let's have a Skinnerian look on this: rewarded behavior is repeated, punished behavior is not. Behavior that elicits no response, either good or bad, is not repeated, but that's learned slower.

To make bullying stop, you either have to not respond at all, or to punish the bullies. How could you punish them? Beat them up? I've done that a few times, doesn't work; plus, you get punished for it when people tell on you. Call them names? They don't care. Break their stuff? They'll enact their revenge. They're always better armed than you, because there are more of them. When ever you try standing up for yourself, they tread on you some more, and the "justice" system treads on you as well.

Then you can do nothing. That makes you an easy target, and it means you effectively don't mind them calling you names, punching your lunch out of your hands and onto the floor, breaking your stuff and being violent towards you.

You're saying that people should either fight an unwinnable war, or let themselves be conquered without offering any resistance. Right?

Re:Just plain bullying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759001)

You come at it with the fact that you lost already in your head. No wonder none of the things you listed worked for you. The bully might be the root of the problem, but you and others like you are the ones that feed them. Do you really want to teach your children not to stick up for themselves since it wont do any good etc etc?

Of course growing up you mind people calling you names. Learn to be better at coming back at them or dont get involved. They beat you up either fight back or get a friend thats meaner than them. There are so many different ways to deal with different situations. As an adult you should know that there are some ways better than others. You learn this as you experience the cause and affect of what you and others around you do/experience.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

aproposofwhat (1019098) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759325)

The only way to deal with bullies is to fight back.

So you might get punished for it?

Great - take your punishment, but remember that if you've done it right (beat the living crap out of the head bully, for example), nobody is going to want to fuck with you.

Make sure that people know that there's a cost involved in pushing you around, and they'll back off - be prepared to pay the price in punishment from authority, and it's cheaper in the long run.

Re:Just plain bullying (4, Insightful)

HungryHobo (1314109) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759403)

Disproportionate retaliation works great.
I remember a few grades below me there was one of those overgrown douche-wads who tended to push round the others because he could. Well one day he went after a weedy little guy who happened to have balls like church bells.
The ambulance took the dickhead away with a 5 inch strip of skin missing from the side of his face and since the teachers heard the full story all the little guy got was a few detentions.
Big guy stopped hassling others and nobody ever fucked with the little guy every again.

We also had a case where a gang of 8 guys attacked some of my friends, I'll give the full story if anyone wants but it ended with a mob or 70 chasing them across the quad. We had plenty of fights at our school but gangs of tough guys attacking individuals simply wasn't tolerated by the students themselves.

School is basically like prison with less rape and more monotonous labour.

Ironic you've posted anonymously (2, Interesting)

fantomas (94850) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759051)

It's ironic the person who says bullying doesn't exist and you should learn to deal with it hasn't got the courage to post with even a slashdot identity, but as anonymous coward.

Suggests they are too scared to stand by their posting, are frightened of being bullied?

Re:Ironic you've posted anonymously (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759347)

Whats it matter on a forum what your handle is? I know I set a /. account up ages ago but for the life of me I dont remember nor care about remembering what it is. I can post just fine w/o it and it doesnt make something said any less valid. Whats funny is I never said bullying does not exist and you yourself have proved that point quite well with your attempt and being a big bad bully by trying to put someone down because they dont login.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

Bearhouse (1034238) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758629)

Sadly, you are probably correct. However, this problem has been around for a very long time, so it's not probable that anything new will be found for 'traditional' bullying.

However, new technologies raise new opportunities, and concerns, and thus require new responses.

I believe there was a case recently where some poor child committed suicide after being persecuted online. So, yes, I think they should do something specfic about this.

Having said that, as a parent I recognise that the best thing to do is to keep a close and protective eye on your kids. If technology could help me with that, (a warning SMS / email that your kid is geting lost of IMs or mails with bad keywords), then I'd go for that.

Can't see that kind of thing getting past privacy concerns, though...

Re:Just plain bullying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758683)

"bad words" wtf the fuck crack are you on, i'd want an sms if my kid wasn't learning how to swear properly.

Re:Just plain bullying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758707)

Watching your child too closely can generate some Catch 22 situations. The most relevent one here would be not only the local bullies marking the kid as a target for bullying, but also others who aren't normally the bullying type deciding to pick on them just because they view you as an overprotective parent.

Re:Just plain bullying (5, Insightful)

theaveng (1243528) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758897)

The solution is to stop raising a bunch of rude brats. The parents/teachers need to tell teenagers, "You have the body of an adult (reproduction, et cetera), and now it's time to start acting like one. Abuse of your peers will Not be tolerated." The bullying messages and phone calls are just a symptom, and treating the symptom is not going to cure the disease. You need to go directly to the source and teach teens to act with manners & that insulting other people is Not acceptable.

I too was bullied as a kid, not with internet but with verbal abuse, which led me to keep quiet so nobody noticed me. I never "escaped" that verbal abuse until I found myself in college with an adviser who refused to tolerate such behavior from his students. That's what we need today, but starting at age 13. If we can teach teens about adult behaviors like sex, then surely we can teach them manners too.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

theaveng (1243528) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758933)

P.S.

When my mom was a U.S. high school girl in the 1940s, she had to take classes in Etiquette. I don't know why U.S. schools stop teaching such things, but it's time to start doing it again. It's not enough to just recite numbers and dates. A citizen must also know how to interact with one's peers without degrading them.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

the_womble (580291) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758723)

it'll be cheap and ineffective technological measure

Its cheap, and effective: effective in convincing the voters (and themselves) that the government is "doing something".

Also, the Irish government is probably happy to announce anything that will distract attention from the economic problems they will have if Obama cracks down on American companies using transfer pricing to move profits to low tax countries.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

PinkyDead (862370) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758921)

My kids are in school in Ireland as we speak, and as a parent I have come across a number of incidents where bullying was an issue and in every case the problems were dealt with very effectively under the existing guidelines by the school.

I only point this out, because it appears from your posting that you are suggesting that there is no framework in Ireland for dealing with this and this cyber-bullying measure is the first one - that's not true.

Now, my kids are in primary school - and I do have concerns about their move to secondary school. However, I believe that the structures that are in place in the primary schools are instilling values that didn't exist before and will probably move with them as they progress forward.

Re:Just plain bullying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759533)

"The emphasis on the 'cyber' aspect tells me it'll be cheap and ineffective technological measure when we could be using this opportunity to tackle bullying in the wider scheme."

That seems to imply that there is a way to tackle bullying in the wider scheme, which strikes me as unduly optimistic. Bullying is normal behaviour for juvenile Homo sapiens, and if anyone knows of a society or a period in history where this is not/has not been the case then please feel free to correct me.

Marketing Just plain bullying (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758553)

Various organisations have been sensationalising this issue by prefixing cyber and pretending it's a new issue.

Paradigm shift. Next maybe comes eBullying, iBullying, meta-bullying, cloud-bullying,,,,,? Kind of like patenting thousands of years old business practices done on a computer.

Re:Marketing Just plain bullying (1)

moteyalpha (1228680) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758637)

Well I think that the government should be the one stop shop for bullying as it makes sense and it allows everybody to be treated as criminals. It would lead to a consistent quality control of abuse and interference. Is bombing and laying waste to entire countries considered geo-bullying. </satire>

Re:Marketing Just plain bullying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758885)

Various organisations have been sensationalising this issue by prefixing cyber and pretending it's a new issue.

So, does this mean all the cyber-sex I've done is, in fact, real sex? Can I tell my friends?

Re:Just plain bullying (4, Insightful)

Chrisje (471362) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758571)

I can't agree more. On the risk of sounding jaded/damaged, I have the following comments:

As someone that got bullied in the Netherlands I can vouch for the fact that the solution shouldn't come from outside. After many years of psychological and physical bullying (I still have a skull fracture scar to show for it), I decided to fight back at the age of 13. I did this in such a way that I immediately got left alone for the rest of my school years.

Take the biggest bully. Hurt him. A lot. Publicly. Even if you end up on the losing end of the fight at large, it's over. People might think you're a psycho, but it beats being bullied. Turning to a mobile operator to "prevent" bullying is sheer nonsense. The wankers will always find a way. It's not an Irish problem and it's not a problem of technology. It's about me sending my kid to self defense classes as soon as he's old enough.

I've found that those that excel at violence really don't need to use it.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

JockTroll (996521) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758685)

Well said. And that's why you should consider yourself a jock, a real Alpha.

You did exactly the right thing, and you speak the truth: even if you lose, you still win in this case, because bullies are after *easy* victims. If you fight back, they risk to lose and if they lose once, they have lost forever.

Re:Just plain bullying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759087)

Take the biggest bully. Hurt him. A lot. Publicly. Even if you end up on the losing end of the fight at large, it's over. People might think you're a psycho, but it beats being bullied.

This is not pretty advice, but it is good advice.

When I was in middle school I was bullied up until the second day of 8th grade. I used to get beaten up, etc. after every gym class, after school -- the usual stuff.

One day, I just thought fuck it. In the locker room after gym, my usual tormenters encircled me. I picked the closest one who was about my size and launched myself at him. I tackled him, and proceeded to beat the living shit out of him. I stopped shortly after drawing blood. Nobody attacked me. The rest of the kids looked at me like I was goddamn freak of nature, and edged away from me for the next couple days -- it was pretty uncomfortable for all involved, but you know what? I never got so much as taunted again.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

gargletheape (894880) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758595)

As an Irish person I'm glad that something is being done about bullying. I was bullied at school a lot and when not being beaten was subject to horrendous psychological bullying.

It's Irish Evil, I tell ya! http://www.qwantz.com/archive/000816.html [qwantz.com]

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

JockTroll (996521) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758655)

"I was bullied at school a lot and when not being beaten was subject to horrendous psychological bullying."

Oh, poor loserboy nerd. Do you want the almighty State to protect you? Do you want someone else to make up for your own inadequacy? Expect no sympathy, you ain't gonna get it.

EVERYBODY gets bullied, that's a fact of life. The nerd is bullied, the jock is bullied. But the jock FIGHTS BACK. The bully is an insecure, wannabe Alpha who needs to resort to bullyism to make up for his inherent weakness. True Alphas - like jocks - do not need any reassurance. They ARE superior, they know it. Someone bullies you, you punch his lights out. You beat him up. You show no fear, you pummel the guy and make him bleed. He harasses you psychologically? So what, is your mind so weak it cannot stand it? Then resort to physical violence. If you're a weakling, then grow strong. It's a freakin' fact of life: if you're weak, you're preyed upon so toughen up. Nobody messes with the tough guy. To psychological bullying you respond with massive violence. Bash his head against a table corner until the skin breaks. The bullies travel in pack? Target the leader, if you rough him up in front of his underlings he will lose respect and never gain it back.

Afraid to do it on school ground because the system likes to punish the victim? Then do it outside. Plenty of occasions to do it there. Learn to punch right, dammit, flailing your scarecrow arms in the air ain't no fighting. Hit the body, hit it hard, hit it where it hurts. Strike the head, the temples, the jaw. Kick the joints. Don't be afraid to use improvised melee weapons. Your target will have no mercy, so you need to forget about compassion. The bully's destruction is your salvation. That's the way a jock thinks, and that's why jocks rule.

But you can't fight, can you? No, you can't because you're a nerd. You're a born victim. It's your role. You crave it. You want to be an underdog and think some magical inexistent intellectual quality makes you better than others. News for you, genius, it ain't so. You ain't special. You're just a willing victim, which is an offence towards REAL victims who would like to fight back. You're an embarassment to evolution.

Now, this is why we jocks beat you nerds up. It ain't bullying, it's nature. You are non-competitive weaklings, we're highly competitive specimens. We cannot tolerate your existence. Even shitting on your faces is becoming a waste of excrements.

Re:Just plain bullying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758755)

Advice doesn't get any worse than this.

If your advice gets followed, the "victim" as you see things ends up in juvenile detention, and then in prison, where he'll never get out and will probably be not just bullied, but regularly raped.

Another writer above had it right: Send kids to self-defense courses as soon as they are old enough. THREE YEARS OLD is the most effective age for kids to start learning self defense. (There are lots of successful Taekwon-Do and Karate courses for kids that age.. and starting at that age makes it inherent and automatic as a response mechanism, and no "bad habits" have to be "unlearned.")

Once kids HAVE the ability to defend themselves (this actually goes for adults too) they will find they pretty much never have to use it.

I was bullied horribly as a child, even though I am a "born alpha male." I was targeted by bullies specifically because I was an alpha personality, but I was small.. and without any skills for defense nor offence. I was not able to successfully combat the bullying. I tried. I hit people. I bashed their skulls against walls. I threw furniture at them. I stabbed them with pencils. I did this whether I was being bullied by other students, or by teachers, which happened occasionally.

If I had done these things in the world of today, rather than the world of 25-35 years ago, I would have ended up in prison instead of being repeatedly suspended from school.

The bullying stopped for me when I finally matured.. at age 17.. I grew about 9 inches in the space of a year and filled out, and people no longer wanted to run the risk of my retaliation because I had become larger than they were. I suddently towered several inches over the heads of most of the bullies.

If I had known how to properly combat them by age 5-6, I wouldn't have had 12 years of bullying all through primary and secondary school, and would have grown up a much different person.

Now if someone tries to bully me, I stand right in their face. I don't have to DO anything other than face them down.. the confidence from having studied Taekwon-Do in my early 30's allows me to stand toe-to-toe with pretty much anyone.

It boils down to having the confidence that stems from KNOWING that you can defend yourself if necessary.. actually defending yourself is generally not required.

Re:Just plain bullying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758851)

Have you ever heard of "blaming the victim"? It is what you do.

What advice would you give to someone who was the victim of, for example, a rape? To fight back? Is that nature as well?

We are people, and we are, or should be above, nature and impulses.

Posting anonymous because I do not want to undo my moderation of you

Re:Just plain bullying (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759303)

JockTroll, this is the first legitimate advice you have given, that I can remember.

To all of you people who want to "take the high road" and not "risk punishment", well, you're wrong. If you do it right, out of the eyes of the pussy teachers who would seek to punish YOU, then you are safe. The bully who just lost face isn't going to "tell". And if they do, well, at age fourteen or whatever, the potential punishment is far outweighed by the lack of psychological and physical scars you will still probably still carry twenty years down the road.

Once a victim, always a victim, until you BREAK that victimhood. Kudos, JockTroll. You have just graduated from lawn sprinkler to mentor.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

TheDarkMaster (1292526) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758791)

The best solution for a bully is a month on hospital. Serious. At best, death by cruel manners. We cannot allow a bully to be free on a normal society, he needs to be jauled.

Re:Just plain bullying (2, Informative)

smithsan (1407153) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758805)

Cyber bullying has existed for quite a while, it is only coming to attention recently because the media is picking up on it.Cyber bullying is worse than physical or verbal bullying because it is not done face to face, so bullies don't feel sorry for their victims. --------- smithsan DUI News Blog [legalx.net]

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

HungryHobo (1314109) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759419)

Hah!
Like they feel sorry in person.
total bullshit.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

Cro Magnon (467622) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759519)

Hah!
Like they feel sorry in person.
total bullshit.

The guy that bullied me in person was sorry afterwards. I made sure of that.

Re:Just plain bullying (1)

Shadow_139 (707786) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758867)

It is not the schools, government or ISP responsibility. It is full up to the parents inform and watch over there kids usage of any technology. This includes TV, Internet, Phone, etc. I just hoping the fecking Irish gov to not rush in an US Patriot Act/Nazi style Surveillance laws with out any planning,foresight or research into what can go wrong because of this report and the shooting of Shane Geogregan.

Re:Just plain bullying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759291)

Yes. but something needs to be done. I personally believe that a parent should be responsible and that I should be able to go over and beat the shit out of a parent who's child is bullying without legal repercussions. Of coure that is the 3rd strike. 4th strike I get to beat the shit out of the kid legally and without repercussions. Honestly these kids need to be beaten and beaten a LOT.

I remember my bully from gradeschool/jr high. I ended when I went nuts and gave him a concussion. he was 3X my size and far stronger but when you have pure anger/rage you can easily overpower some dumb ass weightlifter. I broke his ribs, arm and cracked his skull, and then went after his friends. All of the football team was afraid of me from then on, I never had a bullying problem because even the burn-out potheads knew I was going to rip their heads off ans shit down their neck. This is the only thing kids understand, if I do this I'll get severely beaten.

Beat your children and fix society. I should have beaten mine far more.

The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is... (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758481)

Irish kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.

The writer says, "Surely this is a problem faced by children in all developed countries these days." I would think that it's actually worse here because people seem to become more and more rude in real-life with every passing second.. and the (falsely) perceived anonymity of "hiding behind" a social networking engine or a mobile phone tends to exacerbate the issue.
Another part of the problem is that most Irish kids are shuttled to and from school in big feckin' SUV's [which should be banned in this country anyway..especially UK-made Range Rovers], and rarely actually socialise with other kids outside of school. This lack of socialisation isolates kids from seeing the pain inflicted by their actions. If they don't see the pain caused, then they have no empathy for the "victim." Here as in the U.S. children are almost completely isolated from adults in the name of "keeping them safe from perverts" and never learn any social skills from adults either.

In true American style, the Irish, instead of addressing the problems being generated by people, want to enact idiotic, ineffectual regulations and monitor the tools these people use. This approach will not work.

Why are the people in charge always so fucking stupid and clueless?

Re:The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is.. (2, Insightful)

codeButcher (223668) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758533)

Why are the people in charge always so fucking stupid and clueless?

Perhaps because the people who put them in charge (being a democracy and all that) are even more stupid and clueless? After all, half of the population have below-average IQs [slashdot.org] .

Re:The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is.. (1)

rolfwind (528248) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758567)

Half the people have under median IQs you mean.

Not average. For an extreme example, 9 people have 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104 IQ respectively and #10 has 150. The average IQ in that room would be 105, and 9 out of 10 would have below average IQ.

You keep using this word.... (1)

PinkyDead (862370) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758625)

The GP would be correct if the population was evenly distributed. This is not likely in a population of 10, but is probable in a population of 5,000,000.

(This obviously doesn't apply in Cork, where they're all thick.)

Re:You keep using this word.... (1)

naglep (709515) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758975)

Back to the pale with you, Jackeen!! Not all Cork people are thick, like.

Re:You keep using this word.... (1)

PinkyDead (862370) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759257)

Sorry, I didn't understand a word of that.

Maybe you could take the potato out of your mouth!

Re:The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is.. (3, Informative)

Dr_Barnowl (709838) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758645)

Yes, that would be true for that particular sample, but the IQ of a population is defined in terms of the distribution of intelligence [wikipedia.org] - and 100 is defined as the median intelligence. Since intelligence follows a normal distribution, median coincides with mean (average), and half the people have below average IQ.

Your sample represents a skewed distribution, but if we take your numbers to be the score an arbitrary intelligence test used to rate IQ, the median score is 123. So to have a 100 IQ, you'd have to score 123, placing the lower 9 in your group firmly under the wire.

Re:The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is.. (1)

KenMcM (1293074) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758767)

"Average" can be used to refer to either the mean or the median. More often than not, however, it us used to mean "the mean". If you want to be more specific, you can use "median" or "mean" rather than "average". Seems the GP decided not to.

Re:The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is.. (1)

codeButcher (223668) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758853)

Thank you.

Not that I'm normally mean or anything, but what's the use of a subtly insulting joke if those it insults, don't understand what the terms that one employs mean? That's as good a reason as any to use the more generally understood and colloquial term.

And then there are some that thought that post was all about statistics.... >:->

Re:The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is.. (1)

VoidCrow (836595) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758937)

> manners are what lead to common-decency.

Untrue. Manners can be a way to express common decency, but there's nothing to stop a bright and manipulative asshole using them.

> t's actually worse here because people seem to become more and more rude in real-life with every passing second.. and the (falsely) perceived anonymity of "hiding behind" a social networking engine or a mobile phone tends to exacerbate the issue.

Also untrue. Vicious discussion on a social networking engine can wise you up to the rampant trollage and desensitise you to the things people say. It's possible to develop an immune system. It's different for different people.

> This lack of socialisation isolates kids from seeing the pain inflicted by their actions. If they don't see the pain caused, then they have no empathy for the "victim."

If they have no empathy, do they care about the pain, even when they perceive it? And what about sadism? Cats are sadistic - it's part of a cat's nature. Can't it also be part of human nature? After all, there's plenty of evidence to suggest that it might be. I think you harbour an implicit assumption that people have a better nature. I'd say *some* people, maybe most, have a better nature. And then again, every so often, you encounter a werewolf.

Re:The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is.. (1)

ObsessiveMathsFreak (773371) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759141)

Irish kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.

Here! Who the fuck do you think you are spouting that kind of shite! I was raised to sit up straight, and be polite, and peel me spuds before aeatin' 'em. I'm as polite and well mannered a Irishman as ever you'd meet. So feck off with yourself!

Re:The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759207)

You're not a child of today's Ireland.. if you WERE raised etc... It's YOUR generation's kids that are not learning any manners... and both the beginning of your first and the end of your second sentence kind of prove my point anyhow.

Re:The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is.. (1)

Lumpy (12016) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759369)

Irish kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.

American kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.

British kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.

German kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.

French kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.

ALL kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.

Honestly it's a problem of parenting, it has existed for 75,000,000 years when Ugh bullied Snoo near the bubbling tar pits. Most parents don't care to force their kids to be polite and have manners let along teach them respect. Most of these parents tailgate the cars in front of them and break the law at will teaching the kids that you only act civilized when you have to.

Well.. (1)

Shivinski (1053538) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758497)

..I personally think they should bring bullies back...might help get all us geeks out the house...
*hides in basement*

This is a realworld issue, no need for the cyber (1, Redundant)

rolfwind (528248) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758591)

tag. This isn't like paedophiles preying on targets, using the internet as the means of finding their victims in hopes of targeting them in real life.

This is the opposite. The bully already knows his victims, and uses the internet just as another avenue to further that bullying.

I don't know a definite answer, but attaching cyber to it seems nothing but a way to get people's fears up to pass stupid laws.

Re:This is a realworld issue, no need for the cybe (1)

Chrisq (894406) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758627)

This is true, any law that can be bypassed by using the mail instead of email is pretty stupid.

TattleText(TM) (3, Funny)

EdIII (1114411) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758597)

Well since filtering and heuristic analysis is probably impossible, I suggest TattleText(TM). The poor child can simply forward the offending text to a central authority. The central authority can then call the bully's mom.

Problem Solved.

ok im irish (0)

ionix5891 (1228718) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758609)

but i dont like this turn of events

i dont like the idea of "nanny" government spying on citizens [slashdot.org]

they cant play the terrorist card like they do US because they would get laughed at (we have terrorists here who don't hide in caves and behave like the mafia)

so they turn around and play "will someone think of the children" card

now i understand that bullying is a big issue in schools, but the parents of the offenders should be punished not all mobile phone users

Learn a lesson from America (5, Insightful)

MikeRT (947531) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758649)

The main reason we have a lot of bullying is that we have policies that don't allow students to ever confront bullies and use force to defend themselves when attacked. If a student punches a bully in the face for trying to do some sort of nasty physical bullying, like locking them in a locker, they can get suspended/expelled and arrested.

Let the victims of bullies stand up for themselves. It used to work in this country. When my dad was bullied at an early age back in the 1950s, he and the bully got into a fight and the bully got beaten up. The principle not only didn't care about the harm done to the bully, but hauled him into his office and called his parents to let him know that he had gotten beaten up by a kid who he had severely bullied. Back then the courts would have laughed any lawsuit over that out of court and would have probably awarded legal fees to my grandmother if she had to hire a lawyer to defend my dad.

The solution to bullying isn't "education," it's letting them get subjected to the consequences of their actions. I would consider it poetic justice if in a modern incident like what happened to my dad, the kid not only beat up the bully, but posted the video to Youtube for the whole world to mock the shit out of the bully.

Don't give me that "oh they're hurting on the inside" argument for treating them like a wounded animal, instead of a predator. Most people choose to not become like those who hurt them. Those that do choose that path shouldn't be shown any particular mercy by society or the legal system when their victims put them harshly in their place.

Re:Learn a lesson from America (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758753)

The main reason we have a lot of bullying is that we have policies that don't allow students to ever confront bullies and use force to defend themselves when attacked. If a student punches a bully in the face for trying to do some sort of nasty physical bullying, like locking them in a locker, they can get suspended/expelled and arrested.

Well in Ireland, you just have to make sure your child is under 14, then your child can beat the crap of the bully with no worries as the Gardai won't touch them

Re:Learn a lesson from America (1)

Andr T. (1006215) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758793)

When my dad was bullied at an early age back in the 1950s, he and the bully got into a fight and the bully got beaten up.

I agree with most of what you said, but you have to face the fact that many (if not most) of the children that are bullied are wannabe nerds with low or no athletic advantage over the bullys. There are many cases where the school has to take some kind of measure because the kid can't stand up for himself.

This makes me think of all those comedies where the nerds beat the *blip* out of the bullys in the end. But, infortunately, this doesn't always happen in real life.

Re:Learn a lesson from America (1)

Andr T. (1006215) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758801)

Sorry, misspelled unfortunately.

Re:Learn a lesson from America (3, Interesting)

Kokuyo (549451) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758833)

I agree. I was bullied a lot during school and it stopped when I actually threw the guy on the teachers desk. Sure, during the next break I got some but the fact that I didn't run away actually did the rest. Never had a problem again.

Bullying is just to easy. The consequences are minor and the work involved is negligible. Since you can't do anything about the work it takes, change something about the consequences.

What I never understood was that often teachers took the side of the bully. I always assumed that probably the parents of those kids weren't much better and the teachers were just afraid.

I, for one, will teach my kids that when someone tries to bully them they have to retaliate decisively, brutally and make sure everyone knows that crossing them means physical damage.

School is like the world during the cold war. You need to demonstrate your power just enough so you never have to actually use it.

Re:Learn a lesson from America (1)

TheJasper (1031512) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759421)

Thank you very much! I was bullied in school and believe me I spent quite some time visiting with the principal, vice principal...I regret nothing of the violence I used to teach bullies to leave me alone. Except a few cases where I overreacted but kids will be kids.
I actually had a brilliant principal when I was in elementary school. She never approved of fighting but she treated it as an issue with two sides and made sure to know both sides. Pity more people don't use that approach.

Re:Learn a lesson from America (1)

westlake (615356) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758855)

The main reason we have a lot of bullying is that we have policies that don't allow students to ever confront bullies and use force to defend themselves when attacked. If a student punches a bully in the face for trying to do some sort of nasty physical bullying, like locking them in a locker, they can get suspended/expelled and arrested.
.

Real-world examples seem in order here.

Because in searching Google they are mighty hard to find.

The arrest of the victim, one suspects, is most likely to happen when he responds with a gun and not with his fists. When he strikes back later - and lethally.

To encourage this cycle of action and reaction is in no healthy or productive of a solution.

Re:Learn a lesson from America (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758889)

Wow, what a terribly bad idea.

Most kids get bullied because they're weaker than the bully else the bully wouldn't usually have the balls to bully them in the first place.

Your plan sounds like a sure fire way to get weaker kids starting a fight they can't win and getting even more seriously beat up or in the absolute minority cases where the bully is weaker than the person he's bullying claiming that it's him that's the victim and the real victim getting in trouble for it.

This absolutely wouldn't work unless the person dealing the punishment was someone in a position where they clearly could give the bully a response they deserve like a teacher. Even then this does nothing to ensure the teacher is giving the right kids their punishment and opens the door for adults that just like beating kids for the sake of it to get away with it. Whilst bullying wasn't an issue I can think of numerous occasions where at school I got blamed for someone else pratting about or view versa because the teacher didn't really realise what was going on.

Bullies are all to often popular kids too so it's not like you can even rely on consensus amongst students.

Of course, when the kids really do snap because of bullies, i.e. Columbine and Virginia tech. they're suddenly referred to as phsycopaths too. Whilst I don't suggest the victims of these tragedies deserved to die I do think perhaps one of the better ways of dealing with bullies is not to call these kids crazy phsycopaths but to call them what they were- normal kids that'd just been pushed that step too far. Calling them psycopaths means other kids will think "Oh they were just a bunch of fringe nutcases, that'll never happen here", call them what they were and kids might think "Hmm, I really don't wanna bully this kid to the point where he comes in and guns me and all my friends down".

It's a problem that's larger than just school though, I recall a recent BBC article that suggesed 1 in 4 people in the UK have been victim to workplace bullying, and I'm not convinced that bringing kids up to deck their boss is necessarily the best idea here either. In my experience bullies get their just desserts in the end either way, a kid that bullied me in school (albeit mildly, nothing I ever gave much of a damn about but enough for me to hate him) is now in prison for robbery. An old boss who refused me leave once or twice when he was in a mood and told me "You're never getting a promotion or any training whilst you're under me" just because he was a dick is stuck in the same old job where he's been turned down for promotions that have been handed to outsiders 3 times now whilst I've moved on elsewhere and am getting paid more but still see him regularly enough to be able to rub that fact in his face.

Finally, some people are lifes natural victims, I think we could do as well to teach these people a bit about bucking up their attitude, appearance or whatever to get themselves out of this rut than deal with the people bullying them because people like this will only go on to be bullied by the next if you deal with the current.

Re:Learn a lesson from America (2, Interesting)

redscare2k4 (1178243) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759095)

If you're too weak to even harm the big bully, pick one of the weakest bullies (those that are always around the big bad guy) and beat him. Hard. Bloody. The rest will take the hint that even if they can beat you, it's going to cost them a broken lip at the very least. Then they'll leave you alone.

Re:Learn a lesson from America (1)

houghi (78078) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758941)

I once beat up a bully and the school decided to call the police. Nobody ever bullied me again, so I would say it was worth it. I would do it again.

Learn a lesson from Germany (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758991)

I you read the German law correctly I think technically you are allowed to punch the bully. Few people understand that, but to defend against a current attack on your honor, you are covered by self defense.

Re:Learn a lesson from America (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759297)

Your Father was apparently bullied *ONCE* and stood up to the bully. That's not what this is about.

This is about the kids who do not have it within their power to fend off bullies, and end up being systematically abused for years, or even their entire lifetime.

Your Dad's solution was correct:.confront the bully, preferably in a very public way, and force them to feel what it's like to be humiliated, or at least make them fear that they will face retaliation instead of complacency if they target you.

For most who are bullied, fighting back is not possible because they have never been given the tools necessary to do so. Those tools are knowledge: Knowlege of self-defence, knowledge of "what do to" when you receive a bullying text message.. which again is simply standing up for yourself, right in the bully's face.

Your suggestion that the bullied beat up the bully and "post the video to YouTube".. uhm.. DUH.. that is BECOMING the bully. That doesn't solve the problem.. it makes the bully angry, and makes him want revenge, potentially escalating the violence rather than ending it.

Putting a bully in some kind of painful wristlock in front of a crowd, and warning him that you won't hold back next time, is all you need to do. The level of violence cannot exceed that of defence. It's when that occurs, that the bullied becomes the bully.

The saddest thing of all in relation to bullying, is that almost all of the most serious bullies, at least where I grew up in the U.S., become police officers so that they can bully people as much as they want, and hide behind a badge to do it.

"Industry"? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758653)

The industry has been asked to come up with solutions for this problem

"Industry"? Holy Ted Stevens Batman. There's a big clue that the Irish government doesn't know what it's doing - they think modern telecommunications is something corporate and centralized like the Water Board or Television. The worst part is they might get some outfit keen for contracts & power-grab to sell them some snake-oil, rather than tell them what idiots they are as iiNet of Australia has done.
http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/11/11/1329222 [slashdot.org]

Beat the bullies up. (1)

tjstork (137384) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758679)

There's nothing that helps a victim and a bully than the bully getting the shit kicked out of him. Bullies pick on people because they enjoy it, and until you make that enjoyment sting, they will keep right on doing it. I don't care how big the bully is, and how small you are, there is always a stick or something that you can use to level the odds.

Sometimes, a pretzel can do the trick!

I remember this one kid used to pick on me and always take my lunch or lunch money, and I got fed up with it. So I stuffed a pretzel full of x-acto blades and offered that up. I got into a mountain of trouble and heard that sorry song and dance about how we should accept bullies and be like ghandi and the bully was pissed...

but the bully never took my lunch money money again.

You are all soft (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758689)

All these stories of geeks being bullied in high school via the internet is rather pathetic.

The idea that someone is traumatized by not being able to visit facebook properly and they get bad texts makes you seem so soft that I don't know when to begin.

Bullying is when you fear for your safety. When the big kid(s) push you against a wall and threaten to beat your sorry ass. Although a soft geek may be loathe to admit it, there's a lot to be said for growing a set of balls and physically confronting someone.

Might as well confront the person sending you bad messages because if they were actually tough kids, they would threaten you with a beat-down to your face.

But I fear most of you are so spineless that you won't even get it. Bullying is something that is as old as man (and even older). Primates establish a pecking order. If you're being picked on, you get in the other person's face, even at the risk of taking a beatdown yourself. Fear is far worse than the reality of getting punched in the face. Although like I said, the idea that someone who is into sending you "bad" messages could deliver a beatdown is pretty small.

Learning self-defense skills is vitally important in this world. Always was, always will be.

with an iron fist (5, Funny)

teazen (876487) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758703)

Ah... my shoddy mastery of the English language made me read the headline as 'Irish government seeks to reign in cyber bullying', which to me seems to be a much more attainable goal.

Re:with an iron fist (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759137)

Cool.. as the originator of the post, I can confirm for you that the subject title was supplied by our beloved slashdot moderator. But, heck! the message still gets thru.

Here is the issue (3, Insightful)

rfc1394 (155777) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758743)

If the same behavior - one kid bullying another or saying unkind things - was occurring in a non-electronic medium, we usually would consider it the sort of thing where it's a matter for the kids to settle among themselves, or at most, by the kid's parent talking to the bully or the parent, which then usually stopped it. But now, we're going to add the ISP, school authorities, police and courts into the mix and create a tempest in a teapot.

The most someone can do electronically is say things; they can't strike you, or hurt you, or do anything to you unless you accept their comments about you as valid. Kids have had nasty cliques against other kids for dozens of centuries. We need to allow kids to learn to toughen up a bit, if we coddle them too much, they won't get through the real world, and when something comes along that mummy and daddy can't protect them against, they're going to be in a lot worse trouble.

You want to do something against physical threats, fine. You want to do something against extortion ("give me your lunch money or else"), that's something that should be taken care of. But if you're going to treat mere communication of meanness or cruelty as more serious than mere taunts in the absence of an actual threat of violence, then what you're effectively doing is treating words the same as actions. A dangerous path that ends up usually producing stupid overreactions, as a number of incidents here on Slashdot have been reported, where some kid is given an assignment to write a story or some report, but does so in an edgy or unconventional way, is considered a criminal or terrorist and is treated that way for doing nothing more than doing his classwork as he was asked to do it.

I remember one I did. We were asked to give a report in class on how to do something. Well, having read once how too many people cut their wrists the wrong way, I decided to be edgy and unconventional, and write a report on the correct way of how to commit suicide by slitting your wrists. When I stood up to read it, the kids in the class thought it was great, and the teacher even pointed out I drew in examples of how to correctly position the wrist so you cut the vein properly. (Most people bend the wrist inward; that's wrong, you should bend the wrist so it is pushed outward.) And that's all that happened (other than I think I got an A for being thorough). The teacher understood it was simply a student doing a report he knew would be different in order to have fun in class, not some "cry for help" of a depressed kid who was planning to kill himself.

Today, if some kid had done the same thing, I suspect that instead of taking it as the joke it was, he probably would have been called to the principal's office and maybe gotten detention for it, or possibly have to go see a shrink before being allowed to go back to school.

I think the previous one is backward (2, Interesting)

rfc1394 (155777) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758769)

Most people bend the wrist inward; that's wrong, you should bend the wrist so it is pushed outward.

It's been so long since I've done the report, that I think I wrote it backward in the example above, most people bend their wrist forward which pushes the vein inside and makes the suicide attempt less likely to be effective, you're supposed to bend your hand so the hand leans down so the wrist is bent inward, allowing better access to the veins to be cut.

I mean, I wouldn't want someone trying to commit suicide to use the original example wrong, have it fail to work and then sue me for giving them bad advice! :)

Re:Here is the issue (1)

$RANDOMLUSER (804576) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758955)

If the same behavior - one kid bullying another or saying unkind things - was occurring in a non-electronic medium, we usually would consider it the sort of thing where it's a matter for the kids to settle among themselves, or at most, by the kid's parent talking to the bully or the parent, which then usually stopped it. But now, we're going to add the ISP, school authorities, police and courts into the mix and create a tempest in a teapot.

Brilliant. That's exactly the problem. Well said.
Leaving it alone is the best thing for it.


And it's "Down, not Across" (the official motto/catchphrase of alt.sysadmin.recovery [faqs.org] ).

Re:Here is the issue (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759513)

by the kid's parent talking to the bully or the parent, which then usually stopped it.

What planet did you grow up on? You obviously don't know jack shit about bullies.
Telling mommy & daddy, or a teacher, or the police for that matter, just escalates the bullying to a higher level and makes is much worse.. it does not "usually stop it."

How long (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25758763)

It began with the banning of "hate speech".

Cyber bullying is the next of many small steps toward outlawing political criticism by citizens.

Re:How long (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759349)

It began with the banning of "hate speech". Cyber bullying is the next of many small steps toward outlawing political criticism by citizens.

Why do you say that? Are you a queer commie atheist or just a yard-monkey who knows no better?

Are there no harassment laws existing? (2, Interesting)

rfc1394 (155777) | more than 5 years ago | (#25758871)

The article mentioned how someone bullying someone else by causing their phone to ring "all hours of the day and night."

We have laws in the U.S., at least, that make it illegal to harass someone without a legitimate purpose of communication, by either excessively calling them or otherwise disturbing them for the purpose of making them upset. If they have this, then the victim of someone being called at all hours already has legal protections to stop this sort of thing if it's occurring, and no new laws are needed. If they don't, then perhaps this is what should have been done.

In fact, I like the way they're written here. If you call me, and use foul language to insult me, I can have you arrested for harassing me. On the other hand, if you call me, and irritate me so badly that I curse you out and insult you with the most degrading and harshest profanity I can think of, you can't do anything to me. Which makes sense: I didn't call you, you called me; if you disturb me, then you have to put up with my response to you. If you hadn't called me and bugged me, you would never have gotten the insult in the first place.

These are just attempts to grease the skids for more draconian restrictions on the Internet, using the boiling frog analogy. You can't drop a frog in boiling water, he'll jump out, but gradually increase the temperature and he'll sit there and allow himself to be boiled to death, or so the analogy goes. Make a huge grab for people's rights and they will squawk; nibble away in little pieces and they'll never notice until they're all gone, and by then it's too late, unless the "canary in the coal mine" starts screaming Chicken Little style at the beginning and refuses to allow even the first bite. (Talk about mixed metaphors!)

Re:Are there no harassment laws existing? (2, Interesting)

TheJasper (1031512) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759447)

Real world laws shouldn't be brought into the playground. At that point you are beyond simple childrens fights and in the adult realm. I'm not saying it isn't ever necessary but it's an extreme measure.
There are real world rules and playground rules. On the playground you should be able to get into fights, even bad fights, without immediately being a criminal. Children have to learn. Bring lawyers into it and you give more power to the bullies because they are the ones who will be actively trying to use and abuse those laws.

How to stop cyber bullying. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759015)

Its really easy actually.

Step 1. Walk away from the computer.

Problem solved.

I enjoy "trolling" or whatever you want to call it on IRC. And all the people that get "trolled" desrve it. Why, because they sit there and argue back nonsensical bullshit. If you really have a problem with someone online its really simple to solve it. Close the window and ignore the person.

The great enabler (2, Interesting)

jandersen (462034) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759167)

Bullying is bullying, whether it happens by means of computers or not, and it is never a pretty sight. The thing about computers and the internet is that they enable people to have a far longer reach and a greater impact; and it doesn't just enable "the good guys", unfortunately. So when they talk about cyberbullying, it isn't just some lame excuse for imposing new censorship, there is actually a very real problem. In the days before the internet, bullying in the school at least stopped when you got home; but now it is on your telephone and on the internet, and with the use of simple scripts you can make it go on non-stop without any effort at all.

And the other thing about doing things on the internet is that it is more anonymous - it is so much easier to be cruel to a person you don't have to watch, unless, of course, you get a kick out of seeing others in pain, and it is a lot easier to avoid getting caught. At least right up to the point where some kid chooses to end their life, which is a problem on the increase.

I don't think the schools or service providers can do anything about the problem on their own. It is something that requires the whole of the community to work together against it; and that is yet another thing the internet has has an influence on: there isn't a lot of community feeling left. On the up-side, however, the internet could potentially be used to mobilize the community against this kind of thing.

People keep droning on about the nanny state and how everything would be better if the government just stayed out of everything; but how would that be better, when nobody in the community are willing to get off their soft arses and solve the problems? We get a nanny state because we, with our inaction and unwillingness to take part in a community, ask for it. I think it is verging on the contemptible to whine and complain about state interference when people don't even try to do it better themselves.

Hey kids (2, Insightful)

Spatial (1235392) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759285)

Use the damn block/ignore button!

"child porn" excuse has failed, and now this ? (1)

unity100 (970058) | more than 5 years ago | (#25759415)

what the governments are doing to prevent bullying in schools ? what CAN they do ?

little. since most of the kids wont inform anyone that they are bullied, out of shame.

same goes for internet. internet is no different than 'real' life.

seems like another bullshitty excuse to try censorship.

How are they really gonna do this? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#25759545)

Send them all to the University of Notre Dame to become Fighting Irish fans... less bullying, more drinking; especially for those younger ones! Yeah, you 5+ kids out there! Stop cyberbullying and start doing jagerbombs!

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