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Testing the KDE 4.2 Release Candidate, On Windows

timothy posted more than 5 years ago | from the pleasant-stroll-through-the-shooting-range dept.

KDE 272

Verunks writes "Ars takes the KDE 4.2 release candidate out for a test drive on Windows. The popular open source desktop environment has moved beyond Linux and is becoming increasingly robust on other platforms. Even KDE's Plasma desktop shell is now Windows-compatible."

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Your official guide to the Jigaboo presidency (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621469)

Congratulations on your purchase of a brand new nigger! If handled properly, your apeman will give years of valuable, if reluctant, service.

INSTALLING YOUR NIGGER.
You should install your nigger differently according to whether you have purchased the field or house model. Field niggers work best in a serial configuration, i.e. chained together. Chain your nigger to another nigger immediately after unpacking it, and don't even think about taking that chain off, ever. Many niggers start singing as soon as you put a chain on them. This habit can usually be thrashed out of them if nipped in the bud. House niggers work best as standalone units, but should be hobbled or hamstrung to prevent attempts at escape. At this stage, your nigger can also be given a name. Most owners use the same names over and over, since niggers become confused by too much data. Rufus, Rastus, Remus, Toby, Carslisle, Carlton, Hey-You!-Yes-you!, Yeller, Blackstar, and Sambo are all effective names for your new buck nigger. If your nigger is a ho, it should be called Latrelle, L'Tanya, or Jemima. Some owners call their nigger hoes Latrine for a joke. Pearl, Blossom, and Ivory are also righteous names for nigger hoes. These names go straight over your nigger's head, by the way.

CONFIGURING YOUR NIGGER
Owing to a design error, your nigger comes equipped with a tongue and vocal chords. Most niggers can master only a few basic human phrases with this apparatus - "muh dick" being the most popular. However, others make barking, yelping, yapping noises and appear to be in some pain, so you should probably call a vet and have him remove your nigger's tongue. Once de-tongued your nigger will be a lot happier - at least, you won't hear it complaining anywhere near as much. Niggers have nothing interesting to say, anyway. Many owners also castrate their niggers for health reasons (yours, mine, and that of women, not the nigger's). This is strongly recommended, and frankly, it's a mystery why this is not done on the boat

HOUSING YOUR NIGGER.
Your nigger can be accommodated in cages with stout iron bars. Make sure, however, that the bars are wide enough to push pieces of nigger food through. The rule of thumb is, four niggers per square yard of cage. So a fifteen foot by thirty foot nigger cage can accommodate two hundred niggers. You can site a nigger cage anywhere, even on soft ground. Don't worry about your nigger fashioning makeshift shovels out of odd pieces of wood and digging an escape tunnel under the bars of the cage. Niggers never invented the shovel before and they're not about to now. In any case, your nigger is certainly too lazy to attempt escape. As long as the free food holds out, your nigger is living better than it did in Africa, so it will stay put. Buck niggers and hoe niggers can be safely accommodated in the same cage, as bucks never attempt sex with black hoes.

FEEDING YOUR NIGGER.
Your Nigger likes fried chicken, corn bread, and watermelon. You should therefore give it none of these things because its lazy ass almost certainly doesn't deserve it. Instead, feed it on porridge with salt, and creek water. Your nigger will supplement its diet with whatever it finds in the fields, other niggers, etc. Experienced nigger owners sometimes push watermelon slices through the bars of the nigger cage at the end of the day as a treat, but only if all niggers have worked well and nothing has been stolen that day. Mike of the Old Ranch Plantation reports that this last one is a killer, since all niggers steal something almost every single day of their lives. He reports he doesn't have to spend much on free watermelon for his niggers as a result. You should never allow your nigger meal breaks while at work, since if it stops work for more than ten minutes it will need to be retrained. You would be surprised how long it takes to teach a nigger to pick cotton. You really would. Coffee beans? Don't ask. You have no idea.

MAKING YOUR NIGGER WORK.
Niggers are very, very averse to work of any kind. The nigger's most prominent anatomical feature, after all, its oversized buttocks, which have evolved to make it more comfortable for your nigger to sit around all day doing nothing for its entire life. Niggers are often good runners, too, to enable them to sprint quickly in the opposite direction if they see work heading their way. The solution to this is to *dupe* your nigger into working. After installation, encourage it towards the cotton field with blows of a wooden club, fence post, baseball bat, etc., and then tell it that all that cotton belongs to a white man, who won't be back until tomorrow. Your nigger will then frantically compete with the other field niggers to steal as much of that cotton as it can before the white man returns. At the end of the day, return your nigger to its cage and laugh at its stupidity, then repeat the same trick every day indefinitely. Your nigger comes equipped with the standard nigger IQ of 75 and a memory to match, so it will forget this trick overnight. Niggers can start work at around 5am. You should then return to bed and come back at around 10am. Your niggers can then work through until around 10pm or whenever the light fades.

ENTERTAINING YOUR NIGGER.
Your nigger enjoys play, like most animals, so you should play with it regularly. A happy smiling nigger works best. Games niggers enjoy include: 1) A good thrashing: every few days, take your nigger's pants down, hang it up by its heels, and have some of your other niggers thrash it with a club or whip. Your nigger will signal its intense enjoyment by shrieking and sobbing. 2) Lynch the nigger: niggers are cheap and there are millions more where yours came from. So every now and then, push the boat out a bit and lynch a nigger.

Lynchings are best done with a rope over the branch of a tree, and niggers just love to be lynched. It makes them feel special. Make your other niggers watch. They'll be so grateful, they'll work harder for a day or two (and then you can lynch another one). 3) Nigger dragging: Tie your nigger by one wrist to the tow bar on the back of suitable vehicle, then drive away at approximately 50mph. Your nigger's shrieks of enjoyment will be heard for miles. It will shriek until it falls apart. To prolong the fun for the nigger, do *NOT* drag him by his feet, as his head comes off too soon. This is painless for the nigger, but spoils the fun. Always wear a seatbelt and never exceed the speed limit. 4) Playing on the PNL: a variation on (2), except you can lynch your nigger out in the fields, thus saving work time. Niggers enjoy this game best if the PNL is operated by a man in a tall white hood. 5) Hunt the nigger: a variation of Hunt the Slipper, but played outdoors, with Dobermans. WARNING: do not let your Dobermans bite a nigger, as they are highly toxic.

DISPOSAL OF DEAD NIGGERS.
Niggers die on average at around 40, which some might say is 40 years too late, but there you go. Most people prefer their niggers dead, in fact. When yours dies, report the license number of the car that did the drive-by shooting of your nigger. The police will collect the nigger and dispose of it for you.

COMMON PROBLEMS WITH NIGGERS - MY NIGGER IS VERY AGGRESIVE
Have it put down, for god's sake. Who needs an uppity nigger? What are we, short of niggers or something?

MY NIGGER KEEPS RAPING WHITE WOMEN
They all do this. Shorten your nigger's chain so it can't reach any white women, and arm heavily any white women who might go near it.

WILL MY NIGGER ATTACK ME?
Not unless it outnumbers you 20 to 1, and even then, it's not likely. If niggers successfully overthrew their owners, they'd have to sort out their own food. This is probably why nigger uprisings were nonexistent (until some fool gave them rights).

MY NIGGER BITCHES ABOUT ITS "RIGHTS" AND "RACISM".
Yeah, well, it would. Tell it to shut the fuck up.

MY NIGGER'S HIDE IS A FUNNY COLOR. - WHAT IS THE CORRECT SHADE FOR A NIGGER?
A nigger's skin is actually more or less transparent. That brown color you can see is the shit your nigger is full of. This is why some models of nigger are sold as "The Shitskin".

MY NIGGER ACTS LIKE A NIGGER, BUT IS WHITE.
What you have there is a "wigger". Rough crowd. WOW!

IS THAT LIKE AN ALBINO? ARE THEY RARE?
They're as common as dog shit and about as valuable. In fact, one of them was President between 1992 and 2000. Put your wigger in a cage with a few hundred genuine niggers and you'll soon find it stops acting like a nigger. However, leave it in the cage and let the niggers dispose of it. The best thing for any wigger is a dose of TNB.

MY NIGGER SMELLS REALLY BAD
And you were expecting what?

SHOULD I STORE MY DEAD NIGGER?
When you came in here, did you see a sign that said "Dead nigger storage"? .That's because there ain't no goddamn sign.

Re:Your official guide to the Jigaboo presidency (-1, Flamebait)

Dreadneck (982170) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621929)

Maybe the eugenics crowd is on to something. Eliminating fucktards like the above could only serve to improve the species.

Mod parent down, please. Better yet, just erase the fucking post.

Re:Your official guide to the Jigaboo presidency (0)

mrphoton (1349555) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622059)

Can we please remove the above post it is very offensive and should not be on slashdot.

Re:Your official guide to the Jigaboo presidency (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622135)

Your post if offensive and should not be on slashdot.

Re:Your official guide to the Jigaboo presidency (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622249)

Free speech > your right to not be offended.

Re:Your official guide to the Jigaboo presidency (-1, Offtopic)

L4t3r4lu5 (1216702) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622875)

Free speech does not mean yuo can say anything you want.

My right to not be offended does not infringe your right to free speech, it is true. However, my right to not be bombarded by racist trash on a technology news website is greater than your right to your fascist viewpoint.

I like that you have an opinion you feel strongly about, and that you wish to share it with others. That's your right. Just don't expect me to laugh and cheer with you when you do it in ear shot of me.

Now piss off, you fascist idiot.

Re:Your official guide to the Jigaboo presidency (2, Insightful)

stim (732091) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622263)

Yes, lets get into the habit of censuring posts, surely that wont ever get abused! Maybe not feeding the troll would be more effective. Welcome to the internet btw.

Re:Your official guide to the Jigaboo presidency (1)

AvitarX (172628) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622649)

Your insesative post is putting it on my radar.

It was -1 and I didn't see it, except somebody had to post a reply with a 0, thanks.

Sounds Great! (3, Interesting)

$RANDOMLUSER (804576) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621505)

As long as I can hit F4 and get a Bash terminal window into a Unix-like environment, I'm a happy guy.

Re:Sounds Great! (1)

jorgis (1151067) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621561)

Well, now you can get that AND the occasional BSoD! :D

Re:Sounds Great! (5, Funny)

InsertWittyNameHere (1438813) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621633)

Yes! You can hit Alt+F4, shutdown, reboot in a Unix-like OS, then hit F4 again. Easy as pie.

Re:Sounds Great! (1)

$RANDOMLUSER (804576) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621713)

What is this "reboot" you speak of?

Re:Sounds Great! (4, Funny)

xgr3gx (1068984) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621831)

I think it's that thing you have to do when something gets updated.
Web server...no that's not it.
Desktop environment... no.
Oh - X11! Wait, no.
Uuuuh. Why do we reboot?
Oh yeah, installing new hardware! Sometimes you have to power down for that!
Oh, and every year when I update my kernel, whether I need to or not.

Re:Sounds Great! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622131)

shutdown -r now

Re:Sounds Great! (5, Funny)

wisty (1335733) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622257)

UNIX - why reboot more often than you have sex?

Re:Sounds Great! (3, Funny)

ByOhTek (1181381) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621807)

None of my windows machines have had a BSoD in years!

I want my money back.

Re:Sounds Great! (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621897)

It doesn't count if you never turn them on anymore...

Re:Sounds Great! (2, Funny)

ByOhTek (1181381) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622209)

two are on all the time. Two more are on frequently.

Re:Sounds Great! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621693)

Never forget, computers are wonderful tools, but for most subjects students learn at that point in their lives (middle/high school in the US), computers aren't necessary. [zoy.org] [zoy.org] Think about the primary subjects - Math, Science, and Literature/Writing - where do you see the benefits in using computers? Obviously for English classes, having access to computers to type papers is handy, but it's hardly necessary. Computers can be used in math to help illustrate concepts, but you don't want the students using computers to do their work, otherwise they won't know how to do it without them. And much of science is math - again, not something you want students using computers for.

(This is mfh [slashdot.org] posting as AC for oblivious reasons)

Re:Sounds Great! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621837)

Shut the fuck up, Smidge [slashdot.org] , you're an idiot.

Re:Sounds Great! (2, Interesting)

Hatta (162192) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622141)

I don't think you can. The "shell" in the summary is what we UNIX folks would call a "window manager". Not that you can't get a somewhat workable shell in windows, it just requires cygwin.

I would really be interested in hearing how Cygwin plays with KDE4.2. Popping open a konsole to a cygwin bash shell would be really nice.

Re:Sounds Great! (1)

th173 (464208) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622537)

konsole is not yet ported and there is no other usable shell for windows (i don't want to connect with putty to a local ssh server just to have copy&paste working)

Re:Sounds Great! (1)

Abstrackt (609015) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622293)

You could probably rig something up with Autohotkey.

Re:Sounds Great! (2, Informative)

darkwhite (139802) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622499)

Konsole is not yet ported. Which makes me very sad since I switched to Windows 7 until KDE 4 stops being the trainwreck that it is, but I miss having a terminal emulator that doesn't suck (aka Konsole). Putty is pretty awful in comparison.

Re:Sounds Great! (2, Funny)

MrHanky (141717) | more than 5 years ago | (#26623037)

KDE 4.2.0 is out today, and isn't a trainwreck. There are a few annoyances left, but most of them should be gone by 4.2.2. But then again, 4.2.0 wouldn't be four-two-o if it wasn't a bit four twenty.

Re:Sounds Great! (1)

value_added (719364) | more than 5 years ago | (#26623041)

Konsole is not yet ported. Which makes me very sad since I switched to Windows 7 until KDE 4 stops being the trainwreck that it is, but I miss having a terminal emulator that doesn't suck (aka Konsole). Putty is pretty awful in comparison.

Agreed on putty, but hey, Windows users (including the leet PowerShell users) are still using cmd.exe, the notepad of terminals, and think it's fine.

Depending on your needs, Cygwin might suit you. Say what you want about emulation, there's something invaluable about have a standard set of unix tools available on a Windows system. Rxvt is the typically used as the default terminal, but there's been a lot of discussion about mintty [google.com] . Also, console [sourceforge.net] might be worth having a look at.

Re:Sounds Great! (4, Interesting)

TinBromide (921574) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622581)

you should try using AndLinux [andlinux.org] . It installs a build of linux that runs along side windows (via the colinux kernel). Its really nice to be able to double click a terminal icon and get a command terminal into a fully functional unix like environment in windows (you apt-get from the ubuntu repositories).

Really, no kidding! Try it.

MSYS (1)

Bill Dimm (463823) | more than 5 years ago | (#26623061)

You might want to try MSYS [mingw.org] . It provides a shell, a handful of common Unix commands, and it translates path names so you can type "/c/Program Files/" instead of "C:\Program Files\". It allows me to cry a lot less when I have to use Windows.

Kike Development Environment (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621515)

The only Kike Development Environment I want to see is a gas chamber.

Re:Kike Development Environment (2, Insightful)

mweather (1089505) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622165)

You prefer writing Mono apps for Gnome?

Why... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621525)

Here we are, 2009 - we're supposed to have replaced Win32 and all it's shortcomings by now. Why do we bother to test fire on Windows?

It's about freakin' time, too (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621529)

Now whats a KED?

All for a text editor (4, Interesting)

HungryHobo (1314109) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621573)

I installed this in order to use kate on windows. What can I say: I've grown attached to the editor. But I found that it no longer feels so crisp and clean as on linux.

Re:All for a text editor (2, Informative)

not already in use (972294) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621959)

FTA: The KDE port for Windows is still a work in progress and some aspects are still highly experimental

Re:All for a text editor (2, Informative)

Fallingcow (213461) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622975)

Notepad++ [sourceforge.net] .

The closest thing I've found in Linux is Geany, and it's a pale imitation. God, I wish I could get it to do highlighting on the corresponding open/close (x)html tag to the one the cursor is in--among other things.

I'm seriously considering running it in Wine; it's actually good enough to be worth that hassle. It's the only non-Adobe, non-game program that I miss from Windows.

Unless Kate has gotten better about resource usage and start time since I last used it, it's kind of a pig on any platform. So's Gedit, though to a much lesser extent. I've used both at different times, but eventually dumped them; even a featureful text editor has no business being so bloated.

Re:All for a text editor (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26623153)

I've tried it, works just fine on wine, no hassle during the installs, even when the numbering system was dates

Fixed it for you (0, Flamebait)

Fujisawa Sensei (207127) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621579)

Ars takes the KDE 4.2 release candidate out for a test drive on Windows. The much criticized open source desktop environment has moved beyond Linux and is becoming increasingly robust on other platforms. Even KDE's Plasma desktop shell is now Windows-compatible."

There I fixed it for you.

And yes I'm a KDE user, have been for around 10 years.

Re:Fixed it for you (3, Interesting)

SanityInAnarchy (655584) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621757)

Portability was one of the goals of KDE4, and it is encouraging to see it works.

Now if only the other parts of it would stop sucking...

Today's Daily KDE4 WTF: My clock has two lines. The first line is the time, in military time -- 08:31. This works fine. The second line is the date: Tue, 27 Jan. It might be 27 January, but I can't tell, because the T and half the u in Tue, and most of the n in Jan, are cut off.

I realize it's meant to be scalable, but why is it scalable right off the edges of the widget? And in a widget which is in the panel, by default?

Just one of many KDE4 WTFs which makes you wonder, "Forget QA, did anyone actually fucking boot it up to see if it was working?"

Re:Fixed it for you (4, Informative)

dotancohen (1015143) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621905)

Portability was one of the goals of KDE4, and it is encouraging to see it works.

Now if only the other parts of it would stop sucking...

Today's Daily KDE4 WTF: My clock has two lines. The first line is the time, in military time -- 08:31. This works fine. The second line is the date: Tue, 27 Jan. It might be 27 January, but I can't tell, because the T and half the u in Tue, and most of the n in Jan, are cut off.

I realize it's meant to be scalable, but why is it scalable right off the edges of the widget? And in a widget which is in the panel, by default?

Just one of many KDE4 WTFs which makes you wonder, "Forget QA, did anyone actually fucking boot it up to see if it was working?"

Please post a link to the bug report that you filed so that I can help triage it. Thanks.

Re:Fixed it for you (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622037)

Please post a link to the bug report that you filed so that I can help triage it. Thanks.

No. If your desktop environment wasn't tested on HIS computer under HIS operating system with HIS libraries, you failed. I mean, you could've stopped by his apartment all last week! He was available then! You have no excuse for this complete laziness.

(laugh, it's funny!)

Re:Fixed it for you (-1, Troll)

berend botje (1401731) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622093)

There shouldn't be bug report for this category of obvious flaws. If you had one look on the desktop you would have seen it.

But no, it is way more cool to add another KAdapter/KProtocol/KDecorator than simply making the whole thing useable.

You and your cabal are what's wrong with KDE development. You.

Re:Fixed it for you (4, Insightful)

entrigant (233266) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622331)

Has it really not crossed your mind that perhaps your experience is unique? Maybe you have a bad font or font handling library somewhere that is incorrectly reporting size that is atypical.

Maybe some other obscure combination of things that a tiny few people have causes this, and everyone that has experienced it is just assuming _everybody_ does and that _clearly_ nobody is paying attention. Screw a bug report, obviously everyone can see this issue and it's just been ignored.

Get over yourself. The KDE devs are the most responsive people I've ever dealt with including companies that are paid 5 figures a month for enterprise class support, but they cannot respond if they are not notified. They do not have huge farms of systems sporting every possible combination of hardware and software. They rely on proper reporting and triaging.

Re:Fixed it for you (1)

simcop2387 (703011) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622439)

except that the three computers i've got kde4 on don't appear to do that, at all. there's something different about your setup (my guess would be something with fonts).

Re:Fixed it for you (3, Informative)

wytcld (179112) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622473)

This may not be an obvious flaw. Text not fitting in a widget can happen if the user's font settings are outside the default range. So unless this is a case were the widget is in trouble on a virgin install - where there are no settings inherited from a prior KDE instance - or on a system were the user never altered any of the default settings - then how are the developers supposed to have seen the problem as "obvious"? What may be more obvious is that if you allow the user to tune his system some proportion of users will get theirs tuned so stuff like this appears.

Re:Fixed it for you (5, Insightful)

Evanisincontrol (830057) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622475)

There shouldn't be bug report for this category of obvious flaws. If you had one look on the desktop you would have seen it.

Fallacy. If we had one look at the OP's desktop then we would have seen it. Unfortunately, the users who test KDE cannot possibly test every permutation of hardware that exists that supports KDE. It's simply impossible. However, I'm willing to bet that the machines they did test on did not exhibit this problem. Hence, they never knew a problem existed.

You and your cabal are what's wrong with KDE development. You.

He asked only that the OP tell him where the bug report was, nothing else, and then he would help fix it. Instead, you criticized him, implying that all KDE developers should magically know about every bug before the users find it, regardless of the users' hardware.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not a KDE zealot. Actually, I'm a much bigger fan of GNOME for completely separate reasons. However, going around arguing that KDE developers are a "cabal" and implying that they should have some superhuman (unpaid) testing team is ridiculous.

Re:Fixed it for you (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622573)

I use Kde 4.1.x from Kubuntu, I am right now seeing the date line very clearly, nothing is cut off.

So apparently the bug isn't very obvious and might have to do with his specific settings.

Think about it this way: Writing the bug report would take about as much time as bitching about it on slashdot, the difference being that writing a bug report might actually get it fixed.

Re:Fixed it for you (1)

HappySmileMan (1088123) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622647)

There shouldn't be bug report for this category of obvious flaws. If you had one look on the desktop you would have seen it.

I'm looking at it right now and don't see it, my clock looks fine, so clearly it's not affecting everyone and it's not obvious just by looking at the desktop.

How would you expect a developer to fix a bug if he's never even seen it, and instead of trying to help you just insult them.

Re:Fixed it for you (4, Informative)

Karellen (104380) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622713)

I'm not a developer, and I'm running KDE 4.2 RC. I have a clock on my panel showing the date and time. I do not see this bug.

From How to report bugs effectively [greenend.org.uk] :

Give the programmer some credit for basic intelligence: if the program really didn't work at all, they would probably have noticed. Since they haven't noticed, it must be working for them. Therefore, either you are doing something differently from them, or your environment is different from theirs.

The whole thing is worth reading, really.

Now, go file a damn bug, with a screenshot, and help make KDE rock!

Re:Fixed it for you (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622869)

If it's a bug, it needs a bug report. Otherwise, it won't get fixed.

Perhaps nobody else has seen this bug (I haven't). In that case, how are the KDE developers supposed to know that it doesn't work on your system, unless you file a bug report.

Even if it does affect everything, it still needs a bug report, so it can be bought to the attention of someone who is able to fix it.

This isn't anything specific to open-source software. If anything, it's even more true in closed source software. It's just that bug trackers for closed source software aren't made available to the public, so you can't see it happening.

Whining about it on Slashdot isn't going to get it fixed.

Re:Fixed it for you (1)

Dorsai65 (804760) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622449)

It won't matter by the time the rest of the assorted bigger "gotcha!"s, bugs, whoopsies, errors, and general binary buggery get fixed.

Tried KDE4, found it unusable because of massive incompatibilities with 3.5-based apps (and lack of 4.x upgrades).

Tried KDE4.1, found it barely usable, but still lacking enough of the functionality of 3.5 that I switched back.

As far as I'm concerned, KDE4 is a lot of glitz with damn little to back it up. If/when KDE3.x goes away, I'll likely switch to Gnome.

Re:Fixed it for you (1)

jank1887 (815982) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622721)

wow. if you substituted Vista, SP1, and 3.5 for KDE4, KDE4.1, and XP respectively in that rant, it sounds exactly like almost every Windows rant I've been hearing for way too long now. Just thought I'd point out the humor.

Re:Fixed it for you (1)

Dorsai65 (804760) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622967)

Yup, there is a certain sense of deja vu, isn't there? :-)

Don't get me wrong - if KDE4 hadn't broken so severely and radically from 3.5, they'd likely have had a winner. The eye candy and all that IS nice; just not worth the missing/broken/works-inside-out functionality, IMHO. Me, I think they probably should have made the KDE4 golly-wog stuff as options IN ADDITION TO the functionality of 3.5 - i.e. new lib(s) that 4-specific apps could call, while maintaining compatibility with older 3.5 favorites.

But hey, what do I know -- I'm just an end-user :-)

Re:Fixed it for you (3, Interesting)

mweather (1089505) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622223)

Today's Daily KDE4 WTF: My clock has two lines. The first line is the time, in military time -- 08:31. This works fine. The second line is the date: Tue, 27 Jan. It might be 27 January, but I can't tell, because the T and half the u in Tue, and most of the n in Jan, are cut off.

That's nothing. What will really make you scratch your head is when you try and fix it by changing the font, and only the time's font changes, not the date.

Re:Fixed it for you (0, Troll)

Fujisawa Sensei (207127) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622865)

Portability was one of the goals of KDE4, and it is encouraging to see it works.

Now if only the other parts of it would stop sucking...

How about making it stop sucking before making it portable?

If you want an example as to why you should prioritize this way, look at the popularity of NetBSD.

Today's Daily KDE4 WTF: My clock has two lines. The first line is the time, in military time -- 08:31. This works fine. The second line is the date: Tue, 27 Jan. It might be 27 January, but I can't tell, because the T and half the u in Tue, and most of the n in Jan, are cut off.

Then there's the Gnomification / castration of configuration options.

Re:Fixed it for you (3, Insightful)

stuntpope (19736) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621817)

Pretty much any software can be described as much-criticized, especially when it's popular and then undergoes a rewrite or significant changes. Hear the cries of "it doesn't do x, it used to do x like so" for [Gnome|KDE|MS Office|Vista|Python|Finder|fill in blank]. Regardless of whether many people are happy with the changes, you'll find a group that is very vocal in its discontent.

On the other hand, not all software can be described as popular, which KDE certainly is (in the OSS world).

Doesn't hold a candle to Ninnle! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621635)

The new KDE 4.2 is just a cheaply done ripoff of the far superior NinWM from Ninnle Labs.

Re:Doesn't hold a candle to Ninnle! (1)

rirugrat (255768) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622311)

Silence, you ninny!

KDE on Windows (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621689)

I never really used KDE before but will give it a try on my windows Gaming Partition :)

The screenshots look great btw.

Difficult work being done well but... (2, Insightful)

philipmather (864521) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621719)

...the article doesn't make it as clear as KDE's website that this "is experimental state" (sic).

Given KDE's recent experiences people should be more careful about opening themselves or others to accusations of punting Alpha quality software as Beta or Beta as production.

Apparently even Kate doesn't work? I'm not knocking their work as this is a very important bridge for moving people from Windows to *N!X or at least moving Open Source software from *N!X to Windows and clearly something that takes great care, planning and skill in execution. However we don't want people's first expirience of Open Source to be buggy unresponsive software with empty error message boxes!

Re:Difficult work being done well but... (2, Insightful)

zach_the_lizard (1317619) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621761)

People's first experiences with OSS is likely to be with Firefox, not KDE (or its children) on Windows. I think Firefox shows that OSS can be professional, keeping up very well with its closed source rivals.

Re:Difficult work being done well but... (1)

philipmather (864521) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621919)

Very, very true but I can see the scenario of a *EO looking over a Sys Admin's shoulder and saying "How did you customize that desktop like that" and someone replying "Oh, it's KDE. You can try that on Windows these days" and it ending with the *EO thinking Linux/KDE is a pile-o-crap because he can't even use the Kate editor smoothly.

Just need to be careful is all I'm saying, we don't want to start acquiring the "Buggy, Alpha quality software" slur again. We've come along way since there was even a possibility of that being leveled as a truth.

Why? (3, Interesting)

Ngarrang (1023425) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621721)

No, really, why? Windows already runs poorly with its default windowing interface. Why would I want to use up even more memory for a second windowing interface? No application is worth this layer of added complexity.

Re:Why? (1)

GuldKalle (1065310) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621769)

kill explorer.exe?

Re:Why? (2, Interesting)

epr (826666) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621805)

Huh? Can't speak for Vista, but XP normally feels a lot more responsive than my default (GNOME) window manager. But then again, the last time I tried KDE 4.X it ended in disaster and agony, so you might be on to something.

That's Odd because my experience is the opposite (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621967)

My desktop replacement/gaming laptop dual boots into XP MCE and Gnome Ubuntu 8.10 and it is defintely more responsive on Gnome. the XP is a recent rebuild with minimal apps to keep it faster for the couple of games I'm currently playing.

Hell, I ran a Live Disk on a Vista laptop a friend of mine has yesterday and it was speedy fast there after the initial boot up.

Re:That's Odd because my experience is the opposit (1)

Fallingcow (213461) | more than 5 years ago | (#26623065)

Without compositing, X can still look and feel slow (even if it's not). Those artifacts when you drag a window just scream "processor and/or video card is so overloaded it can't draw a proper 2d screen element", even if that's not the case.

May not be the parent poster's problem, but it's the first thing that comes to mind.

Re:Why? (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621825)

You aren't using a second windowing interface at all. You just use the applications unless you choose to use Plasma.

I am running the same RC just fine on my Windows partition. The only application I really miss is KMail.

Re:Why? (5, Informative)

squoozer (730327) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622139)

I suspect the reason you might want to do this is so that you can use Linux tools on a Windows base platform. Kate, for example, is rather a nice editor (although I tend to use Notepad++ under Windows). Don't forget as well that KDE almost certainly has more development than the Windows desktop - although this can be a mixed blessing in my experience due to random breakage.

As others have suggested just kill explorer.exe to free your machine from the default Windows desktop.

Re:Why? (2, Interesting)

je ne sais quoi (987177) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622789)

I used to run the kde 3.5 code on Mac OS X sometimes from raccoon fink's blog [racoonfink.com] . I did this because I liked using the fish protocol in konqueror, it made secure file transfer really easy. OS X has that nice X11 app that does everything an X11 WM does. I don't run it any more though because fuse and sshfs [google.com] pretty much made this unnecessary.

<rant>P.S. Not to mention that somebody at kde decided that konqueror should be a web browser and not a file manager. I'll never understand this... from my perspective they had some software that was a very mediocre web browser but what was in my opinion, the best file manager in existence and they threw out the file manager. For one thing, those two functions should never be in the same software, you can thank Microsoft and leveraging its monopoly for that particular monstrosity, but something is obviously wrong with the kde development process if they're making decisions like this. It's no wonder that kde4 turned out so badly.*grumble grumble*</rant>

Re:Why? (1)

value_added (719364) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622897)

As others have suggested just kill explorer.exe to free your machine from the default Windows desktop.

Not familiar with running KDE on Windows, but the "choice" of Windows shell is set in the registry (the default being "explorer.exe"). Killing off the process may work, but generally the approach used by the various shell-replacements (Litestep, etc.) is to reset the registry key instead. Explorer has a nasty tendency to restart itself for inexplicable, just as related programs/features have a tendency to require explorer be running.

Re:Why? (3, Insightful)

Cyberax (705495) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622399)

For example, to run KOffice on Windows. Or Amarok2.

Also, given that QT is soon going to be LGPL - I feel very interested in contributing to KDE and using parts of KDE in my proprietary programs.

Re:Why? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622451)

No, really, why? Windows already runs poorly with its default windowing interface.

Stop talking shit.

Re:Why? (1)

sam0737 (648914) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622533)

I didn't RTFA or tried it out. But does it replace the explorer.exe? If it does, may be it's could replace the one shipped in Vista.

The next step? EU might force the Redmond OS to allow selection of Windows manager at first boot.

Interesting Reasons, but... (0)

Ngarrang (1023425) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622597)

Okay, the responses to inquiry have given some intriguing reasons. But, if I kill explorer.exe to just run KDE, then I can only run KDE apps. Are there enough KDE apps available to replace the Windows GUI full-time? If so, this becomes a very weird hybrid of Microsoft's kernal and FOSS that Microsoft never pondered...or feared.

But, then I would have to ask, why run Windows at all if you are going to be running all of these Linux apps? Wouldn't you get better performance and security by just using Linux as the base OS? And then use WINE for one or two Windows apps you just gotta have? Or VMplayer it?

Editors: Can we remove the first troll comment (-1, Flamebait)

mrphoton (1349555) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621881)

Is there any way to remove the first troll comment on this thread. I know that it has been marked troll, but it is _so_ offensives that I think we should not have in on here.

Re:Editors: Can we remove the first troll comment (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622053)

Is there any way to remove the first troll comment on this thread. I know that it has been marked troll, but it is _so_ offensives that I think we should not have in on here.

I actually find your comment more offensive than the lame troll post. Should we remove your post to appease my moral outrage?

Re:Editors: Can we remove the first troll comment (1)

Dorsai65 (804760) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622147)

Better still, I'd think the admins could tie the comment to a user/IP and just permanently ban said troll. I'm pretty sure I saw the same garbage yesterday morning, too.

Re:Editors: Can we remove the first troll comment (5, Informative)

ObsessiveMathsFreak (773371) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622237)

If you find it offensive, then don't read it. I can tell you from experience that their have been far, far more offensive troll posts on Slashdot and that ALL of them have been modded to -1 in seconds. The system works, and I see no reason to change it in order to placate you or anyone else in the offense brigade.

You, and people like you, who think that material you personally object to should be destroyed or removed, are the single biggest problem in the western world today. Here we have a system that appropriately and expediently deals with troll posts, and yet you are still not happy. You want the material "purged". You find issue with its very existence, and moreover, insist that the rest of the world cater to your whims.

Do you know the difference between you and a fundamentalist mullah complaining about "immodest dress" or "images" for or of women? There is none. You're the same person, just with different hang ups. And the rest of us should not have to give up our freedoms to satisfy your scruples.

Re:Editors: Can we remove the first troll comment (1)

mpl (1424037) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622719)

Godwin's law?

it's an upside down kingdom (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621899)

hold on to your butts, it may be righting itself. no celebration scheduled yet. still no 'openness' regarding the fake 'cloud' spraying, & inf. about the whereabouts of the real clouds. better days ahead.

Um... (1)

kurbchekt (890891) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621915)

Yay?

the real question is... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621917)

Will they port KDE *3.5* to windows? Everybody I know has written off KDE 4 as a failed experiment. But we love KDE 3.5, and having it natively on Windows would be nice.

Captcha: registry

Re:the real question is... (1)

Talavis (906015) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622067)

Won't happen since, as far as I know, the Windows version of Qt3 is not released under GPL.

Re:the real question is... (2, Funny)

mpl (1424037) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622857)

Linus, is it you?

When a GNOME developer says KDE rocks, I'm elated (4, Interesting)

bogaboga (793279) | more than 5 years ago | (#26621931)

I am quite elated at the fact that this [livejournal.com] GNOME developer says KDE 4.2 rocks [livejournal.com] . Now, if the two teams could combine resources to churn out an awesome desktop environment (preferably KDE based), that would make the Linux ecosystem even more relevant in today's environment.

Re:When a GNOME developer says KDE rocks, I'm elat (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26621977)

I am quite elated at the fact that this GNOME developer says KDE 4.2 rocks . Now, if the two teams could combine resources to churn out an awesome desktop environment (preferably Gtk based), that would make the Linux ecosystem even more relevant in today's environment.

Fixed!

Re:When a GNOME developer says KDE rocks, I'm elat (3, Informative)

MindlessAutomata (1282944) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622109)

They wouldn't, because GNOME and KDE have two different design philosophies. Anyway, this argument is kind of similar to the "why waste time making so many distros?" one you see a lot.

Re:When a GNOME developer says KDE rocks, I'm elat (1)

wytcld (179112) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622655)

The only design philosophy that should matter is pragmatism. The desktop environment that allows the user to take the best ideas, no matter where they come from, or what their philosophical base, and combine them easily to create a successful environment for the user's own work is what all of the projects should work towards.

And they are. Xfce for instance can integrate quite a bit of stuff originating from both KDE and Gnome. So parts are already fairly interchangeable between environments (at least if you've got the required support libraries). They should become more so.

Re:When a GNOME developer says KDE rocks, I'm elat (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622239)

For what it's worth (posting AC and all), I agree.
KDE4 has a lot of rough edges that prevent people from seeing the greatness of it.
I really think KDE has a stellar future.

Re:When a GNOME developer says KDE rocks, I'm elat (1)

mhall119 (1035984) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622613)

If KDE 4.2 is already an awesome desktop environment, and you want an awesome desktop environment based on KDE, why are you advocating integrating Gnome?

If compatibility is your concern, than the FreeDesktop.org projects are already taking care of that, without having to consolidate DEs. If competing widget toolkits is your concern, well, to bad, that's not going to change anytime soon, and its not really a big problem anyway.

Gnome is already moving common components out of the Gnome libraries and into gtk, so that running a GTK app under KDE won't require all the gnome libs. I don't know if a similar project is underway on the KDE side, since the KDE devs don't have any control over the development of QT, but I suppose they could do something like it.

Re:When a GNOME developer says KDE rocks, I'm elat (3, Informative)

je ne sais quoi (987177) | more than 5 years ago | (#26623059)

Now, if the two teams could combine resources to churn out an awesome desktop environment (preferably KDE based), that would make the Linux ecosystem even more relevant in today's environment.

I apologize ahead of time for my language but speaking as someone who doesn't run kde as their wm (e17 for me), all I have to say to this is:

FUCK NO!

From my perspective, if I want to run any application that has to do with kde, and there's a lot of great ones, I have to wait for all the damn dcopservers, kio_slaves, kdeinits, etc. to load and it's a royal pain in the ass. The kde environment is bloated and irritating for anyone who doesn't want to run the kde wm. The gtk and gnome apps have no such irritations. Think about what you're saying, you'd turn kde precisely into what we all hate about windows, a monopoly. A huge bloated mess where somebody up on high says, thou shalt do it this way and no other and the rest of us have to live with it. Frankly, I'm waiting with baited breath for more mainstream qt4 apps to come out that aren't tied to kde. VLC has already done that and it's such an improvement over the wxwidgets interface.

EU (5, Funny)

CSHARP123 (904951) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622169)

Next step for EU to dictate MS to stop integrating Windowing interface with the OS and provide a way for users to choose which Windowing they are going to use. WOW. This is going to be great.

Re:EU (1)

geonik (1003109) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622645)

The EU might even require that all desktop environments are used using all possible theme variations CONCURRENTLY. That way the user will get to freely choose the "OK" button of his liking on a case-by-case basis.

Plasma on ReactOS (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622273)

I wonder if Plasma runs on ReactOS.

(Though I would rather see XFCE ported).

I use this to run Amarok on Windows (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26622459)

I have to say it works quite well for me apart from a few glitches playing shoutcast streams. It's at an early stage but if they keep going at this rate then I can get rid of Linux and go back to Windows.

If I can run all my Linux programs on Windows and also use all my hardware on Windows then I guess it makes more sense for me to use Windows.

Re:I use this to run Amarok on Windows (1)

th173 (464208) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622723)

I used a plain WinXP with the kde4win packets. Even there I never came beyond the splashscreen. Maybe it has something to do with the drivers for the soundcard. So I miss amarok when I am stuck with Windows.

Etherape (1)

myspace-cn (1094627) | more than 5 years ago | (#26622767)

There's one app I want to see ported to windows.

Etherape

I thought maybe today was the day. But nope, it GNOME 2.. in the requirements, not KDE 4.2.

The workarounds continue.

All around win (1)

aero6dof (415422) | more than 5 years ago | (#26623083)

So I can get the stability of windows with the a compatibility an open-source desktop... hey why don't I load it on expensive Apple hardware and go for an all around win!?

Honestly, it's a little difficult to see the point it seems like you'd getting the worst of two worlds with KDE on windows....

Can you run windows apps from the KDE environment? (1)

socketwiz (792252) | more than 5 years ago | (#26623091)

I'm curious...if one were to launch KDE in windows, then somehow kill the explorer leaving KDE as the windowing system, could one then launch both KDE and native windows applications in this environment? That would be an interesting setup.

KDE on WINDOWS! (5, Funny)

kellyb9 (954229) | more than 5 years ago | (#26623191)

Isn't that a little bit like testing out a corvette in a driveway?
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