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Fallout 3 DLC and Games For Windows Live Woes

Soulskill posted more than 5 years ago | from the isn't-exclusivity-fun dept.

PC Games (Games) 121

oceanclub writes with news that the Operation Anchorage downloadable content for Fallout 3 has been released. Rock, Paper, Shotgun details the extensive difficulties encountered by users of Games for Windows Live while trying to locate and install the new content. This is the first in a series of three DLC releases, and they are exclusive to the PC and Xbox 360. The last, Broken Steel, will allow players to continue within the game once the main story is finished. Unfortunately, Bethesda apparently doesn't plan to patch that ability into the PS3 version.

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Such a mess... (5, Funny)

ActionJesus (803475) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651245)

According to one of the comments in linked article, the manager for Games for windows has been recently fired.

Im glad to see someone taking the fallout for such a mess!

Sorry, Ill go back to my corner now.

Re:Such a mess... (1)

elrous0 (869638) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652573)

Aside from the fallout pun, why is this being modded funny? Informative, yes. But someone losing their job in this economy (and I gathered he was laid off [pcworld.com] , not fired) is not particularly humorous to me.

Re:Such a mess... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26658867)

Well, nothing in the post is funny except for the pun (which isn't funny, either, but this is /., where bad puns substitute for humour). So, to answer your question, aside from the fallout pun, this isn't being modded funny.

How to play Operation: Anchorage without Live (5, Informative)

Aggrajag (716041) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651269)

Make sure that hidden files are shown in Windows Explorer, check the settings! Windows XP: C:\Documents and Settings\\Local Settings\Application Data\Microsoft\Xlive\DLC Vista: C:\Users\\AppData\Local\Microsoft\XLive\DLC Copy the files to: C:\Program Files\Bethesda Softworks\Fallout 3\Data (change the drive letter if necessary) You have to use the launcher to select the mod: click on "DATA FILES" and check the box next to Anchorage.esm.

Re:How to play Operation: Anchorage without Live (2, Informative)

Zumbs (1241138) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654541)

Unless the patch fixed the bug where the launcher would uncheck mods, you may want to have a look at Fallout Mod Manager [chorrol.com] which is a community made mod manager. If you want to check out the community-created mods, you could also check out Fallout 3 nexus [fallout3nexus.com] .

Re:How to play Operation: Anchorage without Live (1)

Aggrajag (716041) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654679)

I've had no problems with the launcher and thanks for the links!

Re:How to play Operation: Anchorage without Live (1)

Repton (60818) | more than 5 years ago | (#26660207)

Also, if you use Fallout Mod Manager to launch the game, you don't need the DVD in the drive :-)

Re:How to play Operation: Anchorage without Live (1)

Wilson_6500 (896824) | more than 5 years ago | (#26657393)

My question is how I'm supposed to purchase it without Live.

Re:How to play Operation: Anchorage without Live (1)

Aggrajag (716041) | more than 5 years ago | (#26659237)

I don't think you can. Too bad as I detest Windows Live but I bought it anyway.

Re:How to play Operation: Anchorage without Live (2, Insightful)

X0563511 (793323) | more than 5 years ago | (#26659727)

Yaarrrr, there be ways, matey.

Bethesda: Fix your shit and dump Windows Live, or customers like me will have to do the dirty deed instead.

Re:How to play Operation: Anchorage without Live (1)

Wilson_6500 (896824) | more than 5 years ago | (#26659887)

That ship sailed days ago. I really would consider actually buying the stupid mini-expansion and giving Bethesda more money--even though I very recently was certain I wouldn't even purchase FO3--if I didn't have to jump through their lousy software hoop.

I bought into EA's worthless content delivery system for the BF2142 expansion. That ended up taking me for the biggest ride of my gaming life. I don't really want to go through that kind of trash again, and I don't like supporting badly-implemented content delivery systems.

Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26651273)

Since it actually states in the manual that the games does END, I won't consider it a spoiler to say that in Fallout 3... Well, alright, for those of you who haven't played it yet:

SPOILER ALERT

\/\/\/\/\/\/

At the end of Fallout 3 your character is literally vaporized, and this patch is going to let you "continue" after you've finished the main quest? That's just patently ridiculous. It sounds like it's just an attempt to appease Oblivion fans who bought the game thinking they could perpetually level up their character forever. What's wrong with a game having an ending in it, particularly if it's a well-composed one?

Re:Umm... (1)

ConanG (699649) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651311)

What I don't understand about all the end-game whining is that the first 2 Fallout games had an ending, too. It should come as no surprise this one ends. Although, I don't agree with you that's it's a well composed ending.

Re:Umm... (2, Informative)

Beyond_GoodandEvil (769135) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652055)

What I don't understand about all the end-game whining is that the first 2 Fallout games had an ending, too.
Actually, the 1st and 2nd fallout game allow you to keep playing after finishing the main quest rolling the credits, etc. They did warn that somethings may behave unexpectedly. However, fallout3 is just a great big voice over, then credits screen, then back to the main menu. Thus the fuss about the end game. HTH

Re:Umm... (1)

gEvil (beta) (945888) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652743)

However, fallout3 is just a great big voice over, then credits screen, then back to the main menu.

Actually, it's a string of 6 or 7 short voiceovers. That's how they can have a thousand different endings (or whatever it is). I've read through a bunch of forums and comments about the ending, and for some reason a lot of people don't seem to get that. I personally thought it was fairly poorly done since each little segment has a musical swell. Doing that once or twice is fine, but after 4 or 5 it gets really old and makes it feel very unnatural. Too many swells negates the effect, IMHO.

Re:Umm... (1)

MWoody (222806) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652979)

Uh, no, they don't. Apparently, you didn't read through enough. They PROMISED that the game would have this, like Fallout 1 and 2 did, so maybe that's where you're getting confused. But when the game actually came out, nope!

Re:Umm... (1)

Fallingcow (213461) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654317)

Fallout 2 had, at minimum, 2 voiceovers for pretty much every town you visited. New Reno definitely had more. So, quick calculation in my head... maybe 25-30 potential bits of voice over for the ending?

Way more than F3's--what, 4 or 5?

Of course, it helps that F1 and F2 had more than 3 towns.

Re:Umm... (1)

gEvil (beta) (945888) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654671)

That's interesting, because the ending I got has some pretty big differences from the 5 other endings I watched on YouTube. If there are 2 or 3 options for each of those 6 or 7 segments (which it certainly appears there are), then it easily gets up to over a thousand endings.

Re:Umm... (1)

Zumbs (1241138) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654491)

Actually, the 1st didn't allow you to keep playing after finishing the main quest ... or, well, if you were quick on the trigger, you might be able to play on for a 1/2 minute.

Re:Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26655751)

also, the ability to play after finishing the game in fallout 2 was added in a patch

Re:Umm... (1)

meringuoid (568297) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652141)

What I don't understand about all the end-game whining is that the first 2 Fallout games had an ending, too. It should come as no surprise this one ends.

IIRC, it was possible to continue after the end of Fallout 2.

Although, I don't agree with you that's it's a well composed ending.

'So, whoever goes in there gets a lethal dose of radiation, eh? Hey, Fawkes, job for you... what do you mean no, you were happy enough to get the GECK out for me... My fucking destiny? RAGE...'

Next play through, I swear, I switch on the incinerators in Fawkes' cell.

Re:Umm... (2, Insightful)

Shihar (153932) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652767)

The problem with Fallout 3's ending was that it was short and stupid.

Close your eyes if you don't want to read a spoilers

The first bit of stupidity is how you die (if you go in). Recognizing that I was about to jump into some heavy duty radiation I dutifully jumped into my rad suit, popped some radaway and rad X, and pumped up on rad resistance. I walked in and watched the old Geiger counter slowly tick up. Awesome. I can stick around here for a good 5 min before anything really bad happens... I hit the button... and the game tells me that I am dead.

WTF.

The other problem is that the story is surprisingly short and narrow. Fallout 3 isn't as "big" as Fallout 1 or 2, but that is ok. The problem is that the story makes it artificially short. In the original Fallout games, the story would lead you to most major locals. You could explore on your own, but you could trust the story to lead you to the highlights. You didn't have to stick around and do all that there was to do, but you knew it was there. In Fallout 3 no such thing happened. The story basically takes you to two towns and a couple of glorified dungeons. If you follow the story you miss out on a massive hunk of content.

The story never gives you much of a chance to breathe and enjoy the world. In the original Fallouts, getting dumped into a town clueless was a pretty common occurrence. You often took breaks from the story because you had to. In Fallout 3, the story is "urgent" and you feel compelled keep up with it. If you do this, you will burn through the thin and shallow story quickly.

Finally, the story sucked. The world wasn't half bad. I personally thought that it felt "emptier" (and not in a good way) than the originals. Characters said less, the world was less complex, the factions more dull, the personalities more transparent, etc. Other than being pretty, the world was shallow. The story made it worse. The story was extremely shallow. You get a taste of what it might be in the opening scenes... but it falls flat on its face.

It is probably unfair to compare, but I know that my response to "winning" the original Fallout was profound. To this day, I still have an emotional response to the song they play as you walk away from the vault with Dogmeat. I can safely say that Fallout was the first game where the ending made me really feel anything and swallow hard a few times. The ending to Fallout 3? Eh. I was annoyed that the game declared me dead despite being basically invulnerable to radiation and annoyed that the game ended with me seeing only a fraction of the world.

I am not trashing on Fallout 3... it is great for what it is. I had a good time and I am glad I played, it is just that Fallout 3 is no Fallout.

Re:Umm... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26651387)

Maybe your character was literally vaporized. Mine chickened out, thank you very much.

And no, it's not ridiculous. What's ridiculous is that there is a radiation filled chamber, there's a guy who is immune to the radiation standing next to you, but he refuses to do the deed. My hope is that the DLC will fix that little problem, thus enabling you to continue on your way without also being a douche.

Re:Umm... (1)

The Moof (859402) | more than 5 years ago | (#26653849)

Just to see what happened, I did it with a ton of rad-aways and rad-x's.
I keeled over with 0 rads in my system at full health.

Re:Umm... (1)

Fallingcow (213461) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654617)

I didn't even try that hard to protect myself, and I was taking on less radiation that I'd get from standing in a puddle.

Add in the ridiculous, "I'm going to kill you and myself to stop you from forcing me to turn on the machine that I was about to turn on!" scene earlier in the game (which jarred me so far out of the story that I never really got back in) and you've got a big steaming pile of fail. If it had 1/2 as much other stuff to do as F1 and F2--especially stuff that felt important--it might not matter, but it doesn't, so it does.

Re:Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26653035)

Personally when I arrived at the chamber where you die of radiation I thought back a couple hours and remembered what I did the last time I encountered fatal radiation between me and my objective: I told Fawkes, my friendly neighborhood radiation-immune super mutant to do it. Inexplicably, he refused. Apparently the third patch corrects this.

Re:Umm... (1)

Yunzil (181064) | more than 5 years ago | (#26658471)

At the end of Fallout 3 your character is literally vaporized,

No (s)he isn't? (S)he's just presumed dead.

Re:Umm... (1)

Pathwalker (103) | more than 5 years ago | (#26658971)

It looked to me like I had melted into a puddle; as if I had been hit by a plasma rifle.

So many possibilities wasted; ghoulification for one.

Play Operation: Anchorage without Live (fixed) (1)

Aggrajag (716041) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651279)

Firefox 3.1 decided to post HTML formatted even if I chose Plain Old Text, so here it goes, again... Make sure that hidden files are shown in Windows Explorer, check the settings! Windows XP: C:\Documents and Settings\\Local Settings\Application Data\Microsoft\Xlive\DLC Vista: C:\Users\\AppData\Local\Microsoft\XLive\DLC Copy the files to: C:\Program Files\Bethesda Softworks\Fallout 3\Data (change the drive letter if necessary) You have to use the launcher to select the mod: click on "DATA FILES" and check the box next to Anchorage.esm.

Re:Play Operation: Anchorage without Live (fixed) (4, Funny)

Aggrajag (716041) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651301)

Fuck

This is the last goddamn time:

Make sure that hidden files are shown in Windows Explorer, check the settings!

Windows XP:

C:\Documents and Settings\\Local Settings\Application Data\Microsoft\Xlive\DLC

Vista:

C:\Users\\AppData\Local\Microsoft\XLive\DLC

Copy the files to:

C:\Program Files\Bethesda Softworks\Fallout 3\Data (change the drive letter if necessary)

You have to use the launcher to select the mod: click on "DATA FILES" and check the box next to Anchorage.esm.

Re:Play Operation: Anchorage without Live (fixed) (1)

IBBoard (1128019) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651379)

So that'd be "do it the sensible and easy way and just do what you did in Oblivion" then? I did wonder whether the Games for Windows Live would actually add anything or whether it'd just cause problems (ditto for Dawn of War 2).

Re:Play Operation: Anchorage without Live (fixed) (1)

anomnomnomymous (1321267) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652153)

There -is- a Preview-option, you know that?

You might consider using it next time you make your fifty informative posts.

Btw, thanks for the information :)

Re:Play Operation: Anchorage without Live (fixed) (1)

Aggrajag (716041) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652251)

Nice, can use the "uid comparison" meme. My uid your uid ;) Seriously though I did do the preview both times.

...And nominated for the Wile E. Coyote Award... (2, Funny)

rts008 (812749) | more than 5 years ago | (#26661291)

Now that's perseverance and dedication to completing the mission!! :-) *absolutely no offense intended*

And yes, I agree that something as simple as posting a comment on /. can be trying on occasion.

Oh yes, and many thanks for the info!

Windows Live vs Steam (0, Offtopic)

thermian (1267986) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651289)

That's what it boils down to. Personally I prefer Steam, although I can apreciate the cost savings and ease of use that would atract games developers to Live.

I've tried both platforms, and right now its clear that slashdot opinion aside, Live has the upper hand in tutorial support and ease of use.

I've decided to go with Steam for my project, but it was by no means an easy choice. In spite of the reflex 'omg microsoft are teh evils!!!111one' reaction, Microsoft make pretty good game development tools.

Anonymous hero (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26651293)

Not-so-long list of countries where F3 addons will be available (and nowhere else EVER):

      * Australia: International English
      * Austria: German
      * Belgium: Dutch, French
      * Canada: English, French
      * Denmark: Danish
      * Finland: Finnish, Swedish
      * France: French
      * Germany: German
      * Hong Kong: Traditional Chinese, English
      * India: International English
      * Ireland: International English
      * Italy: Italian
      * Japan: Japanese
      * Korea: Korean
      * Mexico: Spanish
      * Netherlands: Dutch
      * New Zealand: International English
      * Norway: Norwegian
      * Portugal: Portuguese
      * Singapore: International English
      * Spain: Spanish
      * Sweden: Swedish
      * Switzerland: German, French, Italian
      * Taiwan: Traditional Chinese
      * United Kingdom: International English
      * United States: English

Huh... Rapidshared copy works everywhere...

So tired (4, Insightful)

Thanshin (1188877) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651347)

I'm starting to be a bit tired of all the "games for windows", "rockstar whatever club", "funny happy spend-five-minutes-filling-info superfun club".

It's starting to ressemble the forced trailers in movies, the "don't copy or I kill you" warnings, and all the other crap that only pushes people more and more towards downloading movies and cracking games.

The school of thought based on countering the flaw "people won't like it" with "fuck'em they'll buy anyway" must die, now that "they won't necessarily buy".

Re:So tired (4, Insightful)

GF678 (1453005) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651551)

There will eventually be a point where even the most hardened PC gamer will think: why am I bothering with this crap when all I want to do is play the fucking game? It's not worth the effort when a console provides a much smoother experience.

The sad thing is that PC gaming CAN provide a superior experience - but shit like this isn't helping.

Re:So tired (1)

wild_quinine (998562) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651923)

There will eventually be a point where even the most hardened PC gamer will think: why am I bothering with this crap when all I want to do is play the fucking game? It's not worth the effort when a console provides a much smoother experience.

Not flamebait. This is a perfectly appropriate assessment, if a little hyperbolic. I mean THE most hardened PC gamer will probably never think that. But a lot of hardened gamers that I know do think that.

I would almost include myself in that category, if it weren't for the clear and obvious superiority of the PC platform for FPS, MMOs, RTS, etc. (Put simply, it's a PC version or nothing when it comes to the latest RTS).

But I do play almost exclusively on my console now. I played thirty, maybe forty games in 2008. On the PC that was: World of Goo, Quake Wars, WoW and Fallout 3. Everything else was on my consoles.

Potential flamebait: Only three games I cared about were for the PS3. The rest run better on the 360... Oh dear.

Re:So tired (4, Insightful)

mobby_6kl (668092) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654263)

Unfortunately, trying to be more like the consoles is precicely what causes most of these problems. Games for Windows Live, Rockstar Super Adventure Club, and Steam (which for some reason usually gets a free pass) all attempt to create a more console-ish experience. Fuck that, it doesn't even matter whether they succeed or not. A decent server browser works perfectly fine, somehow I don't think a half-competent developer will have a problem implementing it if Epic could get it right back with UT99.

All the points, achievements and all the other pointless shit can fuck right off. And really, what's with the idea of yet another instant messaging system? PCs have this thing called "multitasking" which allows us to use existing communication channels to talk to friends. But no, apparently that's too hard for some of the drooling retards to understand. And of course the whole DLC thing is another bastardization of an old PC concept, known as Expansion, Add-on, or Bonus Pack. Buy it if it costs something, download the content, run the installer, and BAM! There's the expansion, right next to the original game.

Contrary to how it might seem from this post, I'm not actually foaming at the mouth. Still, I'll probably have to play some Quake Wars to release some steam, as it's actually one of the few recent (if you can call it that) games that gets almost everything right. There's no DRM besides the serial, the game doesn't really need to be "installed" and I think can even be played from a network share. The server browser is very nice and has plenty of useful filters, while the friends system is simple and unobtrusive, and the permanent statistics have no impact on the game besides your virtual dick size. Just the way it should be, unfortunately judging by the sales figures people enjoy grinding XP just too much.

Re:So tired (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26657713)

I have never played Quake Wars, (actually I have not upgraded my PC or even played many new games for years) but id software is a rather incredible company. They are a major, well established developer, one of the pioneers of modern gaming, but seem to have retained some of the culture from the golden age of the 90's and early 00's. When game dev wasn't 'mainstream' and most of the people involved were probably a lot more obsessed about their art (in a good way). The way the entire source code of Quake 1-3 was GPL'd is a good example of this, spawning an active indy community. Compare it with Valve who would never do the same with Half-Life's 10 year code when hell freezes over, Epic, and Ion storm who tarnish the name of once classic titles with dumbed-down, xbox-cripped sequels.

Re:So tired (1)

thepotoo (829391) | more than 5 years ago | (#26658007)

Valve does not own all the source code to the HL1 engine and the Steam engine is too new for them to consider opening it (besides, modding is easy for it).

Some portions of the HL1 engine were opened when ID released the Q2 engine, and the releasing the rest of would make it easier for cheaters to break the Source engine (it being a drop-in replacement for the HL1 engine).

At least, that's my understanding of the situation. I should also point out that Valve is great with mods, giving them prominent advertising positions on Steam. About the only thing Valve does wrong IMHO is DRM, so sorry if I come off like a fanboy.

Re:So tired (1)

Sigma 7 (266129) | more than 5 years ago | (#26659319)

And really, what's with the idea of yet another instant messaging system? PCs have this thing called "multitasking" which allows us to use existing communication channels to talk to friends.

Unless you are playing the game in a window, you generally need to Alt-tab out of the game (causing a small delay in reloading.) Some games aren't playable in a window, especially when they're almost as dark as Doom 3 or Left 4 Dead.

I believe that's why XFire was created...

Re:So tired (1)

Rewind (138843) | more than 5 years ago | (#26661153)

, and Steam (which for some reason usually gets a free pass)

Steam gets a free pass, from me anyway, for being the best bridge between the two sides atm. You have the big wigs who want the game locked down so that no one can pirate it or resell it (despite that being impossible) and users who just want to play the game and not pay more for an inferior version (in comparison to pirates who often pay nothing for the better experience).

Steam still is DRM for the most part, but at least it offers me stuff in return. I don't have to mess with CDs. After a reinstall I just download Steam, login and it is done. It will reinstall and download all my games for me. No mess, no fuss, no calling someone to get my key activated. It is also an easy place to buy from. I might not to get EB or whatever before it closes and I don't want to wait for shipping from somewhere, so I can just download it on Steam and get it right then. I can even have it downloaded already for the release.

Is it perfect? No. We still pay the same price despite not getting a manual or box or anything because b&m would cry bloody murder for one thing. It is still restricted in many ways, but I think it is by far the best solution we have right now. That is why I give them a "free pass".

Re:So tired (1)

Dunbal (464142) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652149)

It's not worth the effort when a console provides a much smoother experience.

      I think that's the whole point. They want you to move to a console.

      Case in point, I just went back to the US earlier this month after an absence of several years. Computer stores that used to have entire back walls full of PC games have reduced to half an aisle, and most of their games are multiple facings of the latest WoW release, or other "guaranteed" sale items. There's no variety anymore, in the PC section. Meantime much more space has been given to the various consoles, each of them having more space than that for PC's.

      There's a very obvious trend here. And that's too bad since not all PC games are brainless shooters. Oh well, hopefully Paradox won't scrub Hearts of Iron III...

Re:So tired (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 5 years ago | (#26653621)

I look at the PC version and determine it's inferior so I won't buy it, I look at the console version and determine it's more expensive than the PC version so I won't buy it. Outcome: I don't buy it at all.

Re:So tired (1)

chrish (4714) | more than 5 years ago | (#26656893)

This is exactly what happened to me about two years ago now. One too many cycle of "I need this beta video driver to play game X, but game Y won't load with it" and "I have two hours to play a game, why am I spending an hour updating my OS, my video drivers, and my game?" Not to mention the various "WTF, this plays smooth on the original XBox, why is my P4/Radeon x1600 system struggling?!" types of hardware upgrade treadmill issues.

On my consoles, I pop the game in and it goes, nothing to it.

Ironically, gaming was the only thing keeping my on XP at home, too; my wife and I are using Mac laptops now instead. So, PC gaming's target audience shrank a bit, and so did the Windows "ecosystem".

Even if you're not ready/willing to drop Windows as your "doing things" OS, there's hardly any reason to play games on it anymore. So much more comfy playing on my couch infront of the 1080p monitor than at my desk.

I've bought several games for Mac OS X, too, but nothing for the PC since BioShock was released.

Re:So tired (1)

DAldredge (2353) | more than 5 years ago | (#26658133)

Wake me up when consoles can due 720p at 60fps then I might listen.

Re:So tired (1)

a.deity (665042) | more than 5 years ago | (#26659607)

Call of Duty 4 on 360 or PS3. Put your shoes on, honey, we're at Grandma's!

Re:So tired (of all this bullshit) (4, Insightful)

wild_quinine (998562) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651639)

I'm starting to be a bit tired of all the "games for windows", "rockstar whatever club", "funny happy spend-five-minutes-filling-info superfun club".

Absolutely. This kind of bullshit, combined with aggressive DRM, is turning the first twenty, thirty, or more minutes of 'gaming' on the PC into an experience equivalent to filing tax returns.

All the top dogs in the industry are barking on about piracy being their biggest problem. Their biggest problem is that if you take the FUN out of an entertainment product, it fails, utterly, in its most crucial objective. The clue is in the word entertainment.

You can remove enjoyment from a product in a number of ways: directly, by making mediocre games or by forcing you to jump through hoops before you can play them... but also indirectly: by acting like such an asshole that nobody can relax long enough to get into your game.

Seriously... if you went out to the local bowling alley, and the guy on the desk said 'You're a fucking thief, and a liar, and we'll be watching you. Here's your shoes and have fun!' ... I would not be having fun at the bowling alley.

Even on the off chance that I didn't leave immediately, I'd spend eight frames thinking 'What a fucking asshole' instead of getting into the bowling.

If you have DRM that makes my purchase into a rental, you don't get my money. That's a given. But there's a bigger problem than that:

I no longer care enough to pirate most of these games. They're the work of assholes.

Re:So tired (of all this bullshit) (1)

myspys (204685) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652157)

Seriously... if you went out to the local bowling alley, and the guy on the desk said 'You're a fucking thief, and a liar, and we'll be watching you. Here's your shoes and have fun!' ... I would not be having fun at the bowling alley.

The guy at the desk also have to tell you to wait 20-30 mins, even though all the lanes are free, because that's how long it takes to fire up a lane.

Re:So tired (of all this bullshit) (4, Insightful)

wild_quinine (998562) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652221)

Seriously... if you went out to the local bowling alley, and the guy on the desk said 'You're a fucking thief, and a liar, and we'll be watching you. Here's your shoes and have fun!' ... I would not be having fun at the bowling alley.

The guy at the desk also have to tell you to wait 20-30 mins, even though all the lanes are free, because that's how long it takes to fire up a lane.

And then he says 'Yeah, we're just rigging security cameras to make sure you don't play more than ten frames, or get any redos, or let a friend share your go... (whispers) or bring their own shoes. We know you're a fucking cheat, and a liar, see. This is for your own good. If we didn't spend millions on our high tech security system, and pass the cost directly on to our customers, whilst simultaneously alienating them, and disenfranchising them from the whole bowling experience... well... if we didn't do that we might go out of business.'

Re:So tired (of all this bullshit) (0, Offtopic)

Bigbutt (65939) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652989)

As an aside, we went bowling with a couple of my wife's friends a month ago. The first time I'd been bowling for quite some time, mostly due to bowling alleys being big smoker havens.

Anyway, it took 3 or 4 tries to get the neeto keen graphics scorekeeper up. It kept blue screening. Once we got playing, all the flashing disco lights kept us from enjoying the game. When the lights bailed (they had to reboot the server again), we got some pretty good bowling in until the lights came back on.

Yea, we won't be going back.

[John]

Re:So tired (of all this bullshit) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26655971)

Sorry, I don't understand this 'bowling'. Can you please frame your analogy in terms of cars? Thanks.

Re:So tired (of all this bullshit) (2, Insightful)

caitsith01 (606117) | more than 5 years ago | (#26659377)

I am a diehard PC gamer, and I wholeheartedly agree.

I now read reviews first and foremost to find out what manner of fucktard-inspired DRM and compulsory tracking/on-line registration is involved. I also return games which contain these things but do not say that they do on the box (e.g. I recently returned Company of Heroes because if it detects an Internet connection it phones home to Relic to let them know you're playing... no, not ok).

I only wish reviewers included specific and exhaustive details of the DRM and on-line 'features' of every game they reviewed. It is more important than whether they give it an 8.0 or an 8.5.

If you haven't already, check out Good Old Games: DRM-free PC classics, re-released with XP and Vista compatibility.

Re:So tired (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26652013)

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA yeah thats insightful seriously though i hope a dog shits in your mouth

Re:So tired (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26652861)

This is why I just get things like this from bit torrent. Sorry, but if its easier and quicker for me to pirate the game (took maybe 5min to dl) and copy the files to the data folder and check the box next to anchorage.esm in the launcher, then your sales model is broken.

Re:So tired (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26654561)

If I ever play the DLC it will be off a pirated copy of Fallout 3. I bought it for the PS3 because I didn't want to spend the $800 or so I would need to get my computer ready to play it. Come to find out they're not releasing the DLC for the Playstation version because of some back room exclusivity deal with Microsoft. I would have gladly bought all 3 downloads but they've made it pretty clear they don't want my money, so I'm not going to give them any more of it.

Re:So tired (1)

Hythlodaeus (411441) | more than 5 years ago | (#26655121)

I hope Bethesda will see using GFWL as the huge mistake it is re: their pocketbook. There are people desperate to give Bethesda money and being turned away. And that's what really matters in the end rather than any "INFORMATION WANTS TO BE FREE!!!!11!!2" BS

Re:So tired (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26659123)

Lol, I actually passed up on it because of the GFWL thing. And I'd been planning to pick up the Collector's edition on release day. Unfortunately my primary gaming system is still win2k, which works fine with 90 percent of the games out there, but due to Windows Live requirements hasn't worked with about 1 in 4 games put out in the last year (and a number of the others, ESP EA Games, are going to the Phone Home style limited install DRM, which I dislike. Even moreso since I found out there are *1 DLL* cracks for it that disable it. I mean *WTF*?)

Regardless there's maybe 5 games left I'm going to get, and from most of what I've seen I'll probably pick up Oblivion just to expand on my Morrowind Experience, and pass over Fallout 3, no matter how cool it is.)

Re:So tired (1)

MaWeiTao (908546) | more than 5 years ago | (#26655309)

I've always been a fairly committed PC gamer. Not that I game extensively, but that was my platform of choice; other than a Nintendo DS and a Sega Master System I had years ago I owned no other console. Then I got a PS3 for Xmas.

Now I have little interest in PC gaming outside of an occasional Flash or small indie game. It's nice to not have to deal with the pain of worrying about performance and stability. One thing that has frustrated me over the last 10 years of PC games has been starting a game and then finding that the vast majority of the time I couldn't run it at full detail. Low settings might make the game very playable, but for me I've always felt like I paid for a defective game. I've paid for a game I can't experience to it's fullest extent. And the thing is that with the demands more recent games have made that a person can really miss out from a graphical standpoint.

I still have to deal with installations and updates on the PS3, which I find somewhat amusing, but in general it's a far more seamless experience. The growing push to more of an Xbox Live sort of model on the PC is another big turn off for me.

The PS3 is my console of choice, but it's really getting the short end of the stick in every way. It keeps losing out on exclusives and now we get this sort of nonsense where developers don't bother with updates they offer for other platforms.

I get the impression that Sony has given up pushing exclusives for the system, either because they can't afford it, they've lost all clout with developers or they've simply stopped caring. What's particularly frustrating is how there are a number of PS3 exclusives available in Japan which publishers are too stupid or risk-averse to introduce in the US.

I got Fallout 3 on the PC last year, but didn't like the game much at all, so I have little interest in these updates anyway.

Re:So tired (1)

mjwx (966435) | more than 5 years ago | (#26661113)

I'm starting to be a bit tired of all the "games for windows", "rockstar whatever club", "funny happy spend-five-minutes-filling-info superfun club".

It's starting to ressemble the forced trailers in movies, the "don't copy or I kill you" warnings, and all the other crap that only pushes people more and more towards downloading movies and cracking games.

The school of thought based on countering the flaw "people won't like it" with "fuck'em they'll buy anyway" must die, now that "they won't necessarily buy".

Microsoft is trying to do the same with Games For Windows Live(GFWL) as they did with XBox Live(XBL), turn it into a subscription service and lock in developers. If they ever come close to locking developers into GFWL you will see the cost of licensing sky-rocket which will of course be passed onto gamers. Beyond this if you want to play games online you'll need to pay an additional subscription to Microsoft for the pleasure of doing so. Right now Microsoft don't have the support lock other systems out of Windows based PC's so they can force GFWL to be mandatory in order to play games (ie, using DRM to prevent access to DirectX dll's). MS is using the old Embrace, Extend, Extinguish plan to get developers by first offering a low cost service to game publishers (Embrace), then producing a few beneficial features (Extend) and finally they will make GFWL mandatory for games on Windows based PC's and jack up the per unit licensing fee's to Xbox level (Extinguish). Fortunately due to Steam, Impulse and dev's that have a clue they cant do this yet.

I think this system will ultimately fail, if it were to succeed it would be the end of gaming on windows as it would become less cost prohibitive to tailor Linux or BSD to run a game and then provide a live CD with the game pre-installed (if this were actually done on any meaningful level it would be the death knell of windows gaming anyway). GFWL was originally a subscription service, but then the industry press (read: paid shills for game publishers) said "go free or go away" so MS went free (for now, everything tells me that this is a trap) whilst all PC gamers wanted was for GWFL to "go away".

Screw the DLC (2, Insightful)

dangitman (862676) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651793)

If they can't be bothered fixing obvious bugs in the original game, why would I want to add further complications and bugs on top of that?

Re:Screw the DLC (3, Interesting)

filekutter (617285) | more than 5 years ago | (#26651849)

I totally agree with you on that... Bethesda sat on their hands while the players spent months finding fixes just so we could play a $50 game. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed it immensely, but I don't get any feeling of snuggly goodness from that company at all. And then to top it off they jump in bed with Microsoft whose GFWL is the most annoying piece of navigating I've ever seen... I give up. Bethesda should have made the first DLC free as an apology for their mangled product release. Though I want to play the add-on there is no way I'll give them any more money.

Well I don't know about you, but others... (1)

Paradigm_Complex (968558) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652059)

Despite such obvious bugs, many people loved the Fallout 3 and would gladly pay for more.

This is like Linux or DRM-free games or non-Internet Explorer browsers, etc - enough people don't care that many companies can go on just fine ignoring those markets.

Re:Screw the DLC (1)

MazzThePianoman (996530) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652349)

I have played the original game on PC several times through with hardly any bugs at all which all were resolved after properly updating my sound and video drivers. *shrug* Even though I do a lot of tinkering and optimizing with my copy of Windows XP I experience relatively very few problems with modern games. On consoles, where the hardware is all the same one can and should expect things to be pretty bug free. On PC, with millions of component and driver combinations things get much more tricky. However with good debugging they should be able to address the problem in time.

Re:Screw the DLC (1)

gad_zuki! (70830) | more than 5 years ago | (#26653707)

The bugs arent driver related. The bugs people complain about have to do with missions getting stuck and critical NPCs falling into the abyss (gaps in the 3d world) and dying. There's no logic in the game to verify that missions move properly or that NPCs stay alive when needed.

I experienced one stuck mission and used a work-around I found on the fallout3 wiki to fix it. I have two missions which are stuck with no fix. I have finished a few missions that were buggy the whole time but by screwing around and guessing I found a way to finish them. That's on top of the seriously bad edge detection. Why are my bullets constantly bouncing off shit when there's clearly enough room to get by?

I understand game design is difficult, but a little more care to make sure that missions are moving would have helped a whole lot. The only patched they released was to fix control-tab and minimization issues, not game logic issues.

Re:Screw the DLC (1)

Zumbs (1241138) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654663)

If you're on PC, a new patch came out on January 13th. You can find it here [bethsoft.com] . It fixes a lot more than alt-tabbing, but I don't think it fixes all the bugs found by the community.

Re:Screw the DLC (1)

dangitman (862676) | more than 5 years ago | (#26660273)

On consoles, where the hardware is all the same one can and should expect things to be pretty bug free.

And yet, the console versions of Fallout 3 were just as bugged as the PC version. As mentioned above, the bugs have nothing to do with drivers or hardware. They are in the game's logic and design. If you've not encountered any of these bugs, then either you haven't noticed them, or not played the game very extensively.

Re:Screw the DLC (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26653255)

Well they did release a patch before the first DLC came out. FWIW I played through the entire game all the way to the end. I experienced one minor bug in the process.

Re:Screw the DLC (1)

caitsith01 (606117) | more than 5 years ago | (#26659425)

Does it actually work on normal PCs yet?

A very significant number of people appear to have crash-to-desktop issues with random parts of the game. AFAIK this still isn't resolved, despite one patch and now this additional content.

I have seen this myself on two different, up to date PCs which run everything else (Oblivion; Far Cry 2; STALKER; etc) completely fine.

Re:Screw the DLC (1)

rts008 (812749) | more than 5 years ago | (#26661599)

While you have a valid point, this seems to follow the Fallout tradition. (this tradition seemed to work for Interplay and Bethesda in the past)

Disclaimer:
I am a rabid FO and FO2 fanboy(yes, I have saved games I am currently playing in WINE on Kubuntu 8.04), but the facts stay the same, regardless of fanboyism.
When FO3 works as well as 1&2 in WINE, I will give it a go. (I had set up an XP SP3 partition just for 3, but then deleted it in favor of 98SE to run my PS1 emulator to play Front Mission 3)

Fuck GFWL. Here's the torrent (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26651821)

DLC Fallout 3 Operation Anchorage

http://www.mininova.org/get/2226613 [mininova.org]

YAY! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26651841)

Downloadable content is now mainstream. That means I'll get to pay for patches to my PC games that I would have gotten for free a few years ago. Thanks, XBOX LIVE!!! I swear if I have to BUY the alternate costumes for Street Fighter 4, I'm going to kill sombody.

Re:YAY! (1)

Khisanth Magus (1090101) | more than 5 years ago | (#26653797)

I'd get your preferred method of killing ready then...

Sleep deprived... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26651871)

No more F3 content please! I haven't slept properly for nearly 4 weeks now!

Planning to pirate my first game in years... (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26652273)

This is not about Windows Live! and not Fallout 3, but still somewhat on topic.

All the games I had for the Amiga 500 were, of course, pirated (I did not even know you could actually BUY games). Then I switched to PC and started to buy my first games (Tie Fighter was the first one, I think).

For years the I played a lot of pirated games and some bought ones (as my money allowed; you could say noone lost anything since I could not afford more than I had already bought).

Then came the time of 10Mbit-Ethernet-LAN Parties and basically everything I had was "for free" but as years went, I started to get less and less copied music, movies, and games. Up to the point where I for over half a decade only had bought and no copied games. I was happy with that but then came DRM.

I bought Mass Effect, even if it caused some pain in my stomach, I also bought Fallout 3, which I felt a bit bad about. Each time I thought "Why am I supporting it". I would have bought GTA 4 quite some time ago... but the DRM and other crap scared me away.

Now, after nearly a decade of "basically no pirating" and some five years of "virtually no pirating at all" I'm back at the point where I really consider just downloading some cracked version of GTA 4.
Great achievement, large publishers. It's a bit like I'm 12 again and sit in front of my Amiga, asking myself why anyone could even think of spending the saved pocket money on games... it's not that I could not find other industries which will gladly take *the amount of cash I have available to spend on fun-stuff*.

I don't even care to pirate to even see a game- (1)

gadlaw (562280) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652621)

Last games I tried on my computer - Civilization which brought with it some sort of DRM that has screwed up my computer since. Sins of a Solar Empire that wouldn't update or register for me, I get through to customer service and they tell me I need to do the Stardock thing, no thanks. Plenty of games I've wanted to buy but DRM and being treated like a criminal - no thanks and screw you guys too.

You're blaming the wrong group here. (1)

Benanov (583592) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654001)

Sins of a Solar Empire doesn't need to be registered to play. Just update. It's also DRM free. The registration/regular updates are the benefit to purchasing.

And if Civilization screwed up your machine, why are you blaming Sins of a Solar Empire / Stardock?

Re:Planning to pirate my first game in years... (3, Interesting)

garylian (870843) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654277)

Wait, so you are just now figuring out that DRM is a hassle, after all these years? What rock were you under?

I remember the days of the Apple II/II+/IIe when the copy protections were often more evil. Remember the code wheels with "Align the 3 symbols and then enter the word into this box" protections? Remember the "Look on page 26, paragraph 3, 8th word, and enter it here" protections? I remember the speed copy protections that games like Wizardry used that got so annoying that I eventually had a hole drilled into the side of my 5 1/4" drives so I could get the speed closer before using the keys for fine adjustments. And yes, you had to have the game in the drive to play...funny how that seems like such a hardship these days!

Game makers have been putting protection onto games since back the early 80's and probably even in the late 70's. Many of them make today's DRM seem easy, and made curbing the 2nd hand market a little easier. Losing the code wheel meant nobody else played that game unless you cut out the protection. A task a lot harder back then than today's simple "oh, I just use Daemon Tools" type workarounds.

As for the price argument, I remember paying I believe 39.99 for Wizardry back in 1982. More than 25yrs later, games generally release at 49.99 on the PC, or about a 50% increase. A paperback book back then cost around 3-4 bucks. Now they cost 7-9 bucks, or about a 125% increase. I don't see folks screaming about paperbacks, and they still sell, even with a nice 2nd hand market that is probably better than for games.

I fully understand that buying games only to find out they suck is a problem. I've downloaded games before, and tried them out. If they are any good, I almost always buy them, especially since they are usually so buggy that gameplay sucks on the pirated version. This, I am convinced, is on purpose. Game developers want people to pay for the full product, so they leave easy to spot bugs in game so that pirates famous "0-day" releases are crap. Notice how fast those patches come out???? But if a game sucks in its basic gameplay, I won't buy it.

I use pirated software as a demo, since demos are generally the absolute flawless section of the game, and often some of the best play. It's a highly polished lure, but I'm tired of being a fish.

Justify it any way you want, but the bottom line is you don't want to pay for your games. Why not be honest about it, instead of building up these straw houses?

Re:Planning to pirate my first game in years... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26655165)

"Game developers want people to pay for the full product, so they leave easy to spot bugs in game so that pirates famous "0-day" releases are crap. Notice how fast those patches come out????"

At least when I pirate stuff, they often come out with working cracks of the patch fairly quickly. So I don't know if those early versions are intentionally buggy, because it has little bearing on the pirates who can usually update as well.

Re:Planning to pirate my first game in years... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26659243)

In regards to paperbacks: Are you sure that's not just because less people are buying them?

Honestly I haven't bought a new book in... 2-3 years? I look at the prices on them and think 'Hey, that's a quarter tank of gas!', or 'Hey, this one's 8 bucks for half the pages of that one! And it's a buck cheaper!'

Plus very few people I know anymore are reading, except for school. Most don't have the time between myspace and whatever other websites they're on.

I'll wait (2, Interesting)

gEvil (beta) (945888) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652689)

I'll wait for them to release all 3 DLC modules on a single disc that I can pick up for 10-20 bucks. I realize it means I won't get to play them for another year, but that also means that the numerous bugs and problems people have been encountering should be ironed out. I thoroughly enjoyed the original game, and I still fire it up every few days to run around and discover new things, but taking a break from it for a while isn't such a bad thing...

Re:I'll wait (1)

Fallingcow (213461) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654731)

I'll pirate it and consider it payment for the time I spent trying to get the game to work on my desktop (never did, and yes the hardware on it is plenty capable; I had to played it on my laptop, first game I've seen in YEARS with problems like that) and fixing broken quests (some of them in the main storyline).

I paid $50 and got a broken, incomplete game. Now a few months later they want more money for a bit more content (lord knows the game needs it)? No. I'll take what I need to until I feel the game is complete, thanks.

Minimal problems with xbox version. (2, Interesting)

Blimey85 (609949) | more than 5 years ago | (#26652899)

I have the Xbox 360 version and on Tuesday I bought the first DLC. I then spent nearly two hours trying to find the stupid thing because what I read online said to go west from the factory when in fact I only needed to go a short distance south. Had I not read that, I would have probably found it on my own in five or ten minutes.

That said, I've been more than happy with both the original game and the expansion. I don't feel that the expansion does the game justice as it's too linear and doesn't quite have the same feel, but I feel like they pull it off because it's a simulation of something else so it still fits. I've had the game lockup a few times and I've gotten stuck three times. The last time I was stuck happened within the expansion and it was when I cut the corner on a walkway and stepped off the beaten path. My character could turn around but could not jump nor move in any direction. I reloaded from my last save and all was fine. I've learned when playing Fallout 3 you need to save early and often and I do just that.

I realize from reading a lot of material concerning the game that there is literally a shitload of bugs in this game but I wonder if that has anything to do with the sheer size of the game. I've never played anything else that allows you so much freedom. Games like HL2 are nice and long but very linear. It has to be easier to test a linear game. In Fallout you have so many options, so many ways you can do things. Do you follow the guidebook and do things in order or do you just wander all over the place? And is there even really an order to it at all? You have so many sidequests and encounters that a huge number of variables need to be considered when testing the game.

Honestly I think the game rocks. It's immensely fun to play and I've logged close to 40 hours in game thus far. Are there bugs and problems? Sure. But don't you find that in nearly every game these days? Can Bethesda really be expected to find every single bug? They worked on this for years. It's massive. At some point they need to turn a profit to stay in business. How many testers and how many hours would it take to test every possible scenario? To do so would be crazy. They test most of it and hope they get all of the major bugs.

Re:Minimal problems with xbox version. (1)

Piata (927858) | more than 5 years ago | (#26653749)

I've played the game on the 360 and PC and the PC version is pretty bad. The game has identical bugs to Oblivion. I use headphones when playing games. For whatever reason, Bethesda writes their games with surround sound and only surround sound in mind. It doesn't detect headphones or a stereo sound system, resulting in silent, almost not existent voices and sound effects unless your cursor is pointing directly at it.

The easiest fix for it? Set Hardware Sound Acceleration to it's lowest level. Bravo Bethesda!

Then there's the VAT's system, that INSTANTLY lags when you initiate it and continues to lag while using it. I have a 2.4Ghz Core 2 Duo, 3GB RAM, GeForce 8600 and I can run the game at max settings in 1680x1050 with little issue. Hit VAT's and the game becomes unresponsive for 2 - 5 seconds.

It boggles my mind how they can optimize something like that for the Xbox 360 but completely fail on the PC. Why even make a PC version if you're just going to do a shoddy port?

And why do I buy it on steam, then have GFW Live installed with the game? GFW Live is a piece of garbage as this article indicates. I mean, you could blame Valve or Microsoft for this, but I really blame Bethesda. If they're going to release their game on Steam, they should at least make an effort to support it through steam and not make it dependent on GFW Live.

/rant.

Re:Minimal problems with xbox version. (0)

Blimey85 (609949) | more than 5 years ago | (#26653903)

This is why I don't bother with PC games anymore. The last game I bought for PC was HL2 and then I picked up the Orange Box for 360 and have never looked back. Sure 360 games have some bugs but I don't have to worry about what hardware I have, are my drivers up to date, do I have the latest patches, and all the other crap that goes along with pc gaming. Plus, I know a year from now my 360 will still play all of the 360 games (unless it breaks of course) whereas with pc gaming, my hardware that I have today may not be able to play the latest and greatest a year from now, at least not with decent looking graphics with a good frame rate. Console gaming is cheaper, less of a hassle, and in some cases, a much better overall experience.

Re:Minimal problems with xbox version. (2, Insightful)

Amasuriel (1176527) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654295)

I would figure on /. of all places people wouldn't be modded up for PC configuration issues; and yes, that is what your issues are.

I play with headphones all the time and have never had sound issues. I use the onboard sound on my 680i motherboard.

VATS never lags at all for me, and I have very similar system specs...an extra gig of RAM and an 8800 instead of a 8600. That being said the 8600 is (no slight intended on the card) a budget model, so maybe you should try NOT running everything on max settings and see if VATS still lags.

Finally, saying they have optimized for the XBOX but not the PC is silly. The XBOX has set hardware and driver. For the PC, what will you optimize for? AMD or Intel CPUs? ATI or Nvidia graphics cards?

Its like the old red herring argument about Macs never having blue screens and driver issues...well I'm sure if MS made a MS PC with certain hardware you couldn't swap out it would run great too.

Re:Minimal problems with xbox version. (1)

BoogeyOfTheMan (1256002) | more than 5 years ago | (#26655233)

I would guess that over half of the bugs are configuration related. I have an almost identical setup as the other guy (2.4ghz C2D, GF 8600GTS, 3 gb ram, Vista Home premium, except I use a 37in tv for a monitor, so its at 1280x720. I somtimes get stutters and framerate drops, but VATS is smooth as silk for me. I also have the exact oposite audio problem. I have a surround sound system hooked up, but whenever I set it to 5.1, it defaults back to 2.0. All my Steam games do this as well. So, similar setup, almost the exact oposite problems. Probably a config error on both of our parts.

I'd like to mention that I was first and foremost a concole gamer. Grew up with Atari and had at least one major system per generation within a month of launch (untill this generation). I also didnt have a pc untill 99, so to me, gaming meant consoles. Sure I watched and sometimes played pc games at friends houses (Doom in the dark with the pc hooked to a 1000watt stereo almost made us wet ourselves numerous times), but I was used to a controller, so kb+m controls felt like trying to write with the wrong hand.

But after I got my own pc and got used to the controls, it felt more natural. Anyways, coming from a console background, the main draw for pc gaminng for me was mods.

I guess I just wanted to point out to all the pc gaming naysayers that its not always a mass exodus to consoles. There are console gamers who are slowly getting used to the pc as a gaming platform as well as pc gamers who are playing more console games.

Sorry if that makes no sense and jumps around.
insuficient coffee + multiple talking points = incoherant babble with multiple spelling errors.

Re:Minimal problems with xbox version. (1)

Pathwalker (103) | more than 5 years ago | (#26659081)

I then spent nearly two hours trying to find the stupid thing...

It seemed pretty straightforward to me:

  • Pick up the radio transmission
  • Mark that quest as active
  • Go to the marked location on the map

Re:Minimal problems with xbox version. (1)

p0tat03 (985078) | more than 5 years ago | (#26659169)

Don't excuse Bethesda for their technical incompetence. There are plenty of open-world games out there that are relatively bug-free (GTA4 comes to mind). I liked Fallout 3 the gameplay, but I hated Fallout 3 the code. Bethesda is by now infamous for shipping some of the shoddiest code in the industry with the best gameplay. Sad.

A lot of these bugs don't smell like lack of QA. They smell like really, really bad design. Rockstar did a game that's just as complex, if not moreso, than Fallout 3, and they've done it almost entirely bug-free.

I don't regret buying the game, but at the same time I'm wary about buying another Bethesda product. When simple crash bugs that the majority of your players run into appear in the gold product YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG.

Re:Minimal problems with xbox version. (2, Insightful)

RyuuzakiTetsuya (195424) | more than 5 years ago | (#26661099)

Can Bethesda really be expected to find every single bug?

Yes. why the fuck am I paying them money for?

Why the hell isn't it on Steam...? (1)

mahsah (1340539) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654701)

Fallout 3 is on Steam, why isn't the DLC on it?

Re:Why the hell isn't it on Steam...? (1)

the white plague (1436257) | more than 5 years ago | (#26654955)

Putting on my tinfoil hat, might the 360 approved sticker require Bethesda to give Live an exclusive lead time on providing the DLC. So retail disks or Steam might be a possibility in 6 months or so.

Sue Bethesda (1, Insightful)

Khyber (864651) | more than 5 years ago | (#26656605)

If I paid for the PS3 version of Fallout 3 only to find out I'm not going to get the same treatment as those who own it on PC or 360, I'd be suing the living shit out of Bethesda for anti-competitive practices and bait-and-switch. Note that the *MICROSOFT* systems get the Broken Steel DLC the *SONY* system will not.

This is BULLSHIT.

Re:Sue Bethesda (1)

Khyber (864651) | more than 5 years ago | (#26659719)

I'm flamebait? How so, moron moderators? If I pay for a game and my system is capable of doing what the same game on others systems can do then by fucking god I'd better get the SAME CONTENT.

This exclusive to Microsoft bullshit needs to STOP.

Glad I didn't buy this overhyped POS (1)

Gizzmonic (412910) | more than 5 years ago | (#26656617)

I don't have a 360, so it would have had to be PS3 or PC for me.

Sounds like they focused mostly on the 360 version to the detriment of the other platforms. I never played the old Fallouts, so no big loss for me!

Re:Glad I didn't buy this overhyped POS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26657069)

I you don't mind turn-based combat (I actually really enjoy the strategy of FO1 and FO2's turn based combat) then I recommend picking the games up.

No real DRM, they can be had on the cheap, and they are truly great games.

Re:Glad I didn't buy this overhyped POS (1)

mjwx (966435) | more than 5 years ago | (#26661141)

Sounds like they focused mostly on the 360 version to the detriment of the other platforms.

Minor correction, the press (paid shills) focused on the Xbox 360 version. The PC version is less problematic then the Xbox version and looks a lot better. The gaming magazines were all paid to do reviews on the Xbox 360 to give people this impression. If you read independent (or even semi-independent) reviews the PC version is the better out of the two (or three if we include the PS3). In addition to this the mouse and keyboard controls are superior to the gamepad controls, so much so that an experienced FPS player has no need to use the semi-turn based combat system (called VATS).

Even if you don't have a decent gaming PC the game plays alright and looks good, my house mate has a 4 yr old gaming PC (Athlon 3800, 1.5 GB RAM, Geforce 7600gs) and it runs fine at 1024x768 with all setting set to low. My gaming box (Athlon X2 6000, 2 GB RAM, Geforce 8800GTS) can handle it at 1600x1050 with all options maxed out without any issues. Although when I upgraded to 4GB of ram I began to get a few crashes during level transitions.

I never played the old Fallouts, so no big loss for me!

Play the old fallouts, they have a sense of humour and game play that just cant be matched Fallout 3, they are truely great games to be played even if you don't enjoy RPG's that much. You can buy them from GOG [gog.com] for US$6 a piece. I had Fallout 2 from 10 years ago but lost it in one of my various house moves, I was going to pirate it but then found GOG. Spent A$16 on the two fallouts and haven't looked back (in fact I'm thinking about Fallout Tactics for another US$6).

Fallout 3 was not a bad game, it had a good combat mechanic, good game play, great immersion and a decent story. The open world was done perfectly, random encounters were sparse (unlike Far Cry 2, which forced you to stop and kill something every 20 seconds like they were catering to some unmedicated ADHD suffering psychotic angst ridden teen reject otherwise known as a Halo fanboy), the post apocalyptic world was very immersive and you could walk around the wasteland for hours just drinking in the scenery without getting bored. The game wasn't bad, where it falls down was living up to the expectations of its title, Fallout 1 was good, Fallout 2 was even better and unfortunately for Bethedsa this was impossible to live up to. For me the biggest thing I missed in Fallout 3 from the earlier fallout series was the humour, it was almost non-existent and often the simple jokes were overdone way too much. That being said I find that it's easier to judge Fallout 3 well when one doesn't consider it to be Fallout.

Full Expansions (1)

Enderandrew (866215) | more than 5 years ago | (#26657081)

Are we going to see full massive expanions, or just these three pieces of DLC? I love Fallout, but I'm thinking of waiting to see if they release a Game of the Year edition like Morrowind and Oblivion.

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