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Iran Has Put a Satellite Into Orbit

timothy posted more than 5 years ago | from the up-in-the-air-junior-birdman dept.

Space 923

Dekortage writes "'Dear Iranian nation, your children have placed the first indigenous satellite into orbit,' announced Iran's President Ahmadinejad yesterday. The satellite, named Omid ('hope'), was launched to coincide with the 30th anniversary of the Islamic revolution. Video shown on Iranian television shows a Safir-2 rocket rising into the sky, as a follow-up to a test firing last August."

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Dear Iranian nation (2, Insightful)

James_Duncan8181 (588316) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708523)

If this is true and the satellite reached escape velocity you have just demonstrated that Iran can drop a warhead on any city worldwide.

Super happy fun times to come, good job on easing tensions.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (5, Insightful)

tritonman (998572) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708555)

I think there's probably a big difference between making a rocket which can reach escape velocity and being able to target a specific location thousands of miles away.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708605)

2 buttons

Time to Duke Noooookem (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708693)

before Israel gets all the fun and does it first

Re:Dear Iranian nation (5, Insightful)

ScrewMaster (602015) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708695)

I think there's probably a big difference between making a rocket which can reach escape velocity and being able to target a specific location thousands of miles away.

There is. In reality, this is more akin to Sputnik than an ICBM.

Nevertheless, we and the Soviets started like this, and it didn't take many years before both we and they had intercontinental capability in weapons delivery. Furthermore, the Iranians (and everyone else interested in near-space) have the advantage of knowing what can be accomplished. We and the Russians did not, and spent a lot of time and money figuring that out.

They also don't have to come up with anything akin to a Saturn V or Energia heavy-lift booster to become a real threat, if they want to be. Why they'd want to be on the U.S. and Soviet target list is beyond me though. Being a nuclear power today (even a nuclear superpower) is risky business, no matter how you slice it.

Honestly, I'm not really all that worried about this: a cruise missile is a lot cheaper to develop and deploy than an ICBM, and damn near as deadly.

Respect (2, Interesting)

krischik (781389) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709103)

Why they'd want to be on the U.S. and Soviet target list is beyond me though. Being a nuclear power today (even a nuclear superpower) is risky business, no matter how you slice it.

Respect. The USA does not treat countries without nukes with the same kind of respect as they do otherwise.

Over the years and especially after two Presidents with the name of "Bush" I have changed my point of view drasticly.

Those who warned about the "American Imperialism" had been right all along and if I became head of state somewhere I would terminate the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty right away.

Martin

Re:Respect (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26709207)

But Iran isn't a country with nukes; Iran is a US-hostile country with orbital capability and a nuclear development program, but no functioning nukes. US strategic policy is pretty deterministic in this case: "let the Israelis bomb the bejesus of them."

Re:Dear Iranian nation (4, Funny)

nobodylocalhost (1343981) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709105)

ZOMG Iranians have reached space age, we must re-assert our technical superiority by building seven invincible mechas, and we shall call them GUNDAMS! *back drop music*

Re:Dear Iranian nation (2, Insightful)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708737)

I think there's probably a big difference between making a rocket which can reach escape velocity and launch a satellite into orbit and being able to target a specific location thousands of miles away.

No, not really.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (3, Insightful)

James_Duncan8181 (588316) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708779)

"I think there's probably a big difference between making a rocket which can reach escape velocity and being able to target a specific location thousands of miles away."

Are you suggesting that the autopilot is the difficult part here? Apollo 11 ran on an insanely sucky chip, and I don't think that Iranian mathematicians are magically incompetent. Thrusters are thrusters, wing surfaces are wing surfaces. It's not a very difficult engineering problem.

Racist Piece Of Garbage (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708579)

Number of wars started by Iran in the past couple hundred years: 0

Number of wars started by Israel...

Hopefully this advancement will help protect Iran from future acts of Israeli terrorism.

Re:Racist Piece Of Garbage (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708847)

does "wars started" also account for their sphere of influence like your good friends humus and hazyebala?

you are a racist piece of garbage indeed.

Re:Racist Piece Of Garbage (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708953)

Don't forget the other terrorist groups Tzatziki and Tabbouleh.

Re:Racist Piece Of Garbage (5, Insightful)

hort_wort (1401963) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708903)

I can see where this AC is coming from. Iran seems to be doing a good job these last few years, but people still give them a bad rap. This isn't the first headline I've seen with something positive about Iran. If anyone actually bothers reading a bio, you'll see that Ahmadinejad has been doing a really nice job compared to his predecessors. For example, he reestablished relations with the US after 30 years of the silent treatment. That sounds like a step in the right direction to me.

I just hope the intelligent, calm, undiscriminating folk on slashdot can give Iran a chance. Both of them.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708617)

FYI: Canada has nuclear power stations AND has launched satellites. Are you scared now? We have just demonstrated that we can drop nuclear beer and back-bacon on any city worldwide.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (1)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708699)

Oooh! Can you guys send some over here, please? I'm kinda hungry!

Re:Dear Iranian nation (4, Funny)

armer (533337) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708703)

Well first off every Canadian knows that there is no way we are going to irradiate our beer. And for sure there is no way in H E double hockey sticks that we are going to irradiate it and then strap it onto a rocket and shoot it out of the country. Don't even get me started on the bacon... mmmmmm bacon....

Re:Dear Iranian nation (5, Interesting)

Shakrai (717556) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708799)

FYI: Canada has nuclear power stations AND has launched satellites. Are you scared now?

Canada is a responsible member of the international community that hasn't made threats to wipe neighbors off the map, allowed criminals within it's own population to overrun foreign embassies and supplied terrorist groups with financial support/weapons.

If Iran wants to be treated like a grown up member of the international community perhaps they could borrow a few lessons from our neighbors to the North? Besides which, ice hockey is way cooler than soccer anyway.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708927)

HA, good luck getting them to eat pork & drink booze!

Re:Dear Iranian nation (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708841)

FYI: Canada has nuclear power stations AND has launched satellites. Are you scared now? We have just demonstrated that we can drop nuclear beer and back-bacon on any city worldwide.

Actually, Canada has NOT launched satellites.

While there are many Canadian satellites in orbit, they have all been launched using the facilities of other nations, primarily the USA.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (4, Interesting)

Theaetetus (590071) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708729)

If this is true and the satellite reached escape velocity you have just demonstrated that Iran can drop a warhead on any city worldwide.

Super happy fun times to come, good job on easing tensions.

Iraq: No ICBMs, no nukes, invaded and President executed after a mock trial.
Korea: Nukes, ICBMs (not worldwide range, but can hit California), currently negotiating in multilateral talks.

I think this move by Iran actually may ease tensions.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (5, Insightful)

Eevee (535658) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708997)

Iraq: No ICBMs, no nukes, invaded and President executed after a mock trial.

Korea: Nukes, ICBMs (not worldwide range, but can hit California), currently negotiating in multilateral talks.

Iraq: Invaded another country, didn't have powerful friends.

North Korea: Hasn't invaded another country since the 1950s, has powerful friends in Russia and China, and has enough conventional artillary already positioned to flatten Seoul within an hour.

Nukes aren't the only reason for the current situation.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (1)

icebrain (944107) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709125)

I think this move by Iran actually may ease tensions.

One defense analyst pointed out that nations generally become a little more careful and less brash once they get nuclear capability. You're much less likely to stick your neck out and get involved in something that might force you into using your new capability if you know that the same force will likely be unleashed upon you.

An analyst was once asked what Saddam would have done differently in 1990 if he had nukes; the answer was "well, he wouldn't have invaded Kuwait".

Re:Dear Iranian nation (1)

Trailer Trash (60756) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709191)

Um, Saddam wasn't a "president", he was a dictator. There were a few sham "elections" where he won 99% of the vote, but not voting for him meant torture.

ZOMG BE AFRAID! (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708767)

Whatever you do, don't you DARE go to sleep at night feeling unafraid! That just wouldn't me American of you!

FEAR the terr'ists!
FEAR peanutbutter!
FEAR powdered milk!
FEAR barrack obama's muslim faith!
FEAR a friggin arabic TV satellite...

Once someone accepts that iran/usa/china/$dickwad/uganda could get anything small enough to fit on the back of a pickup truck to pretty much anywhere in the world if they -really- put their mind too it, it's a lot easier to not give a shit about this sort of thing.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (2, Insightful)

Kokuyo (549451) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708769)

Hey, I don't feel too good about the US, or any other state, for that matter, having this capability, but AFAIK I've never possessed the impertinence to tell you guys you couldn't have that technology.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (1)

MightyYar (622222) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708933)

possessed the impertinence

Or the ability.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (1)

icebrain (944107) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708773)

Orbit != escape velocity. It's quite a different ballgame, actually; escape velocity is what you need to never come back to earth, as if you're going to Mars or something.

Demonstrating orbital capability is sufficient to show that Iran has the physical "oomph" to send warheads anywhere. Landing anywhere close to the target, and getting a working warhead (much less a decently-reliable one that will work on a missile), are going to be much harder.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (1)

johnny cashed (590023) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708775)

Hint: If your warhead reaches escape velocity, you've bombed someone not on earth.

Why is everyone so worried that Iran will deliver a nuke via ICBM? Really? What if they could deliver ten nukes? At which point should I be worried about another country joining the nuclear club? When they can enrich uranium? When they have a bomb? When they develop rocket technology to a degree with which they can target other countries? When they have several hundred warheads on as many rockets? Really, when should I be concerned, because it seems that ship left port decades ago. Like when then US and the Soviets did it. Now, when can we discard our childish things and become men?

Re:Dear Iranian nation (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708811)

does iran realy want to drop bombs on you american pig dogs. Hardly has anyone ever thought that maybe they just want a decent level of tech. But the americans the one with the rockets that can land in my backyard (and the americans always have shown how much they can be trusted) tell iran your tech cannot exceed that of a stick you can use to poke around in the dirt a little bit but if you wave that stick we will bomb you because we feel threatened. well if the americans and there alis weren't constantly attacking and destroying other peoples countries why would they feel threatened. its like the bully at school that beats you up and takes your lunch money to intimidate you not to tell anyone you are being bullied except in this case the bully is the pricipal of the school.

....With a Return Address (4, Insightful)

BBCWatcher (900486) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708835)

I have never heard of a ballistic missile that could not be tracked back to its point of origin. That means if Iran ever launches a missile as a weapon it'll be her last.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (1)

PinkyDead (862370) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708911)

The more a nation like Iran embraces technology and science, the more difficult it is to reconcile that with crazy religious ideas. People are asked to accept the advanced scientific learning provided by reason, while at the same time suspend that reason when thinking about their ideology.

That can only be a good thing - in the long term.

Iran has also been very much maligned externally - which they have done little to mitigate. But their actions provide little evidence of the truth of their sabre rattling - and to suggest that there is a reason to fear them is unfounded.

All Man Equal (0, Troll)

krischik (781389) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708919)

Well aren't all man equal?

If so then all men have the right to defend them self using the same type of weapons.

So unless you are from a country without nuclear weapons and intercontinental missiles you have no right to talk.

Re:Dear Iranian nation (1)

CrimsonAvenger (580665) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709017)

If this is true and the satellite reached escape velocity you have just demonstrated that Iran can drop a warhead on any city worldwide.

Escape speed ("velocity" is only relevant in that the direction vector cannot be pointed at the ground) is irrelevant to the ability to drop a warhead anywhere.

When firing a warhead at a target on Earth, one requires something less than orbital speed, which means rather less then sqrt(0.5) * (escape speed).

Citation Needed? (4, Interesting)

tb3 (313150) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708561)

I dunno, but I'd like to see some third party confirmation before I believe that Iran has a satellite in orbit. Launching a satellite and putting it in orbit is a tricky thing to do; only a few countries have managed it, and none the size or technology level of Iran, IIRC.

Honestly, look at this list [wikipedia.org] . One of these things in not like the others.

Re:Citation Needed? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708589)

Agreed. For all we know this ship landed alongside the one piloted by Sam Waterston, Dr. Kiley and O.J.!

On the other hand if it was successful here's hoping someone creates Lake Iran.

Re:Citation Needed? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708619)

I dunno, but I'd like to see some third party confirmation before I believe that Iran has a satellite in orbit. Launching a satellite and putting it in orbit is a tricky thing to do; only a few countries have managed it, and none the size or technology level of Iran, IIRC.

It was a tricky thing to do in the 1960s. Today, it is routine, especially if you have billions of petro-dollars to throw at the problem, and don't care about the welfare of your people.

The mathematics & physics has been published for decades, and is available off-the-shelf in any university bookstore.

Re:Citation Needed? (5, Insightful)

BenihanaX (1405543) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708717)

If it's as simple as all that, why is there a list equally as long, of countries that were unsuccessful? I think calling it routine is naive.

Re:Citation Needed? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26709047)

If it's as simple as all that, why is there a list equally as long, of countries that were unsuccessful? I think calling it routine is naive.

Many countries don't care enough to spend 50 billion dollars on the problem. Iran does.

Look at all the civilians competing for the X-prize [wikipedia.org] .

More importantly, why would a country develop a domestic launch capability? A few reasons:

1. National prestige.
2. To put satellites in orbit.
3. To build rockets powerful enough to drop bombs anywhere in the world.

For #2, there are many commercial services that already exist.

Given the many public statements of the Iranian government, most people suspect #3 is the reason.

Your stereotypes? (2, Insightful)

hotsauce (514237) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708659)

Or maybe your stereotypes are wrong? What one thing is not like the others? I don't see why India can launch a satellite in 1980, but Iran cannot 30 years later.

Re:Citation Needed? - Confirmed (5, Informative)

Somegeek (624100) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708747)

from cnn:

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/meast/02/03/iran.satellite/index.html [cnn.com]

"The United States has confirmed that Iran launched a low-earth orbit satellite on Monday night, two U.S. officials told CNN's Barbara Starr. "

Re:Citation Needed? - Confirmed (1)

tb3 (313150) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708917)

Ah, cool. Thanks for that. I didn't see any references like that when I was reading about it.

Re:Citation Needed? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708829)

Honestly, look at this list [wikipedia.org] . One of these things in not like the others.

It seems to me that two of those things are not like the others. Let's see: Large economy, large population, enough international commerce to warrant peaceful applications of home-grown technology... That leaves Israel and Iran as the two states that are driven pretty much entirely by quasi-religious territorial pride. And I think we all know how that ends up.

Re:Citation Needed? (4, Insightful)

Samschnooks (1415697) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708851)

Have you seen Rick Steve's Iran yet? He walked up to a bunch of women as asked them what they were studying in university. All of them said Chemistry. A conservative Muslim country and they're sending they're women to university to study science - at no cost to these women!

Here in the States, we spend our resources on making sure that everyone can get TV reception and we spend money on lawsuits so that "Intelligent Design" can be taught in science class. In developing countries, science, engineering and medicine are a kid's dream career. Here, it's being famous for some reason - usually for getting drunk and doing outrageous things.

Iran isn't the only country doing this.

Re:Citation Needed? (1)

tb3 (313150) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709051)

I'm not arguing that. I know they have a decent education system and a strong R & D setup. I just thought it was a rather big step from medium range missiles to putting something in orbit.

So? (1, Insightful)

should_be_linear (779431) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708587)

I don't recall Iran invaded any other country in recent history so I don't feel frightened by their satellites or missiles, nuclear or not. And before anyone starts hysterical comments on what this or that Iranian politician said (on USA, Israel, ...) , lets not forget what other politicians said and did to Iran (including supporting Saddam's attempt to invading Iran, open military threats by Bush, Obama, Sarko, ...).

well i recall it (4, Insightful)

unity100 (970058) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708637)

iran doesnt invade any country actively, but they invade them through the religious terorrist organizations they fund. hezbollah, hamas, ibda-c, numerous groups trying to invade pakistan, afghanistan are just a few.

much more annoying and dangerous.

Re:well i recall it (5, Insightful)

Kokuyo (549451) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708819)

Ah, much like the US funded the Afghan war against Russia... One wonders where all those terrorists got their ideas from...

Re:well i recall it (1, Troll)

should_be_linear (779431) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708821)

Are hezbollah and hamas really terrorist organizations? I certainly wouldn't compare them to, say, Al Qaeda. They are fighting against foreign (Israely) army in their own country (Palestine). Whats wrong with that?

Other terrorist organizations (2, Insightful)

hotsauce (514237) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709161)

They also constantly invade their neighbors with other religious terrorist organizations they fund: settlers, Mossad and IDF.

Oh, wait, that's Israel, and they have a huge lobby here. Nevermind, strike that.

Re:So? (2, Interesting)

Dunbal (464142) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708807)

Well if you consider that embassies are technically the territory of the country they represent, then Iran HAS invaded a country in recent history...

Re:So? (1)

johnny cashed (590023) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708959)

Curious definition of invaded you have.

Re:So? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26709141)

Only for intentionally misleading definitions of the word "invasion", considering that the ownership of the embassy land is voluntarily transferred by the host nation.

"With god's help" (2, Funny)

Crumplecorn (904797) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708603)

The real achievement here may be that religion was instrumental in space flight.

Re:"With god's help" (5, Insightful)

should_be_linear (779431) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708633)

Well, space is there, and we're going to climb it, and the moon and the planets are there, and new hopes for knowledge and peace are there. And, therefore, as we set sail we ask God's blessing on the most hazardous and dangerous and greatest adventure on which man has ever embarked.

Thank you.

John F. Kennedy - September 12, 1962

Re:"With god's help" (3, Insightful)

Crumplecorn (904797) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708711)

I was hoping that someone would bring up an example like this, so that I could point out that America asks for blessings from their deity on their endeavours, whereas others choose to credit the deity with part or all of the achievement.

Re:"With god's help" (2, Insightful)

should_be_linear (779431) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708883)

I was hoping someone will go over both statements word-for-word until irrefutable prove of our "civilization" moral superiority is found.

Re:"With god's help" (0, Flamebait)

Hal_Porter (817932) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709159)

Well, space is there, and we're going to climb it, and the moon and the planets are there, and new hopes for knowledge and peace are there. And, therefore, as we set sail we ask God's blessing on the most hazardous and dangerous and greatest adventure on which man has ever embarked.

Thank you.

John F. Kennedy - September 12, 1962

Yeah and JFK kept denying the holocaust too. Oh, wait he didn't because he wasn't a crazy antisemitic nutjob. Unlike Ahmacrazyguy.

Re:"With god's help" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708661)

The real achievement here may be that religion was instrumental in space flight.

Why, is it that chanting sounds better in a capsule?

Re:"With god's help" (1)

viking099 (70446) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708921)

Up, up we go, with nothing but a wing and a prayer!
And solid rocket boosters
And trajectory data
And rocket engineers
And computer scientists

Omid (2, Insightful)

JamJam (785046) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708645)

The satellite, named Omid ("hope")

Omid for peace.

Take them at face value. (3, Insightful)

tjstork (137384) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708651)

I'd take Iran at face value for everything they say. They are going to get a nuclear capability. They are going to get a delivery system. They are going to act to expand their values world wide. Israel is only the beginning.

We should not be surprised with this. The Western nations have been at odds with Islamic nations for 1500 years, and with Persia for nearly 3000. That Persia now Iran is acting up again is hardly a surprise. One might surmise that in the grand scheme of things, this is just a conflict between ideologies and peoples and no one side is right, but the thing is, since most of us are westerners, we would prefer that our side prevail.

To that end, I suppose that those who would argue that strategic missile defense cannot be built, or that militarization of space should be avoided, or that Iran is not a threat, need to rethink that. And similarly, those that would advocate war with Iran, might need to rethink that as well. This now a game where tens of millions of people might get killed, not just thousands.

Re:Take them at face value. (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708755)

If you Western types want to have a World War 3 so soon, count us out. We may not honor-kill and we may have high technology, but we are a Middle-Eastern civilization and we see no reason to side with a group of so-called "friends" who spend their media time calling us Nazis over ancient "friends" who turned against us in fundamentalism 30 years ago. We'll just protect ourselves like we always have.

Sincerely,
The Jews

Re:Take them at face value. (1)

Shakrai (717556) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709151)

We'll just protect ourselves like we always have.

Sincerely, The Jews

Good luck with that.

Sincerely,
The Babylonians/Persians/Macedonians/Romans and Ottomans

(Did I miss any? And before I get modded troll, I'm only jesting, my people have been conquered a few times too ;)

Re:Take them at face value. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708781)

as long as it is their tons of millions that get killed i dont believe is an issue.

They may try something...but in the end we will wipe them off the planet. They will meet Ala. This is not the crusades. We dont want their land. We are willing to pay for oil.

But if they mess with the USA...they will in the end get buried by nukes.

Troll (4, Informative)

hotsauce (514237) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708853)

"Acting up"? *Sigh* Why do I respond to trolls?

Go read a bit of modern Iranian history [wikipedia.org] , before you fall back on stereotypes of Islam-vs-the-rest-of-the-world. If it hadn't been for our meddling (oh, overthrowing governments, oil grabs etc--none of this is controversial), Iran would not be in confrontation with us today. Twenty years after the revolution, they tried peace overtures, but Bush decided instead to dub them an "Axis of Evil" (wow, thank god our era of world-as-cartoon presidents is over). I can't understand your claim of Iran expanding its values into Israel.

We have no right to overthrow other people's governments, and even less right to act surprised when they get pissed over it. And speaking of Israel: when they behave all might is right, others are going to try to acquire might to counter that.

Re:Troll (-1, Troll)

Shakrai (717556) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709187)

Twenty years after the revolution, they tried peace overtures

By funding Hezbollah? Interesting peace overture.

And speaking of Israel: when they behave all might is right, others are going to try to acquire might to counter that.

Good luck with that. Even the Iranians aren't crazy enough to provoke a nuclear war with Israel.

Re:Take them at face value. (4, Informative)

Theaetetus (590071) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708875)

To that end, I suppose that those who would argue that strategic missile defense cannot be built, or that militarization of space should be avoided, or that Iran is not a threat, need to rethink that.

Strategic missile defense is a waste of money and effort, equivalent to airport metal detectors. They're security theater - if successful, they may prevent an attack from that vector, but their real value lies in making the citizens feel safer and deterring attempts along that one vector.

Problem is, there are so many other vectors that are easier - millions if not billions of shipping containers enter the US each year entirely uninspected. Why mess with a launch and guidance system able to withstand launch and reentry stresses when you could just build a Fat Man and put it in the back of a van?
Want a scarier idea? Say we do start inspecting all the shipping containers to enter the country... where would we do it? Probably dockside in major coastal cities, so even if we do happen to check the right container, a simple deadman switch would still make for a successful attack.

Defense is not the solution, and security theater is just a waste.

Re:Take them at face value. (1, Insightful)

ErikZ (55491) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708999)

The idea that the US had a working Missile Defense System helped bring Soviet Russia down.

It doesn't matter if it physically works or not. If the people who want to attack you with missiles believe it works, then they're not going to attack you with missiles.

Hey, look. The missile defense just prevented a missile attack.

Re:Take them at face value. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708891)

This now a game where tens of millions of people might get killed, not just thousands.

 
You're talking hypothetically....Might get killed VS actually got killed.....Maybe you will be one of the possible millions and your 14 year old daughter can give a speech to 2000 grown men about how great you were. Hell you better have her write one tonight just to be safe for our impending possible doom.
 
I say this with the highest degree of disrespect.
  Go Fuck Yourself

Re:Take them at face value. (4, Insightful)

Yvanhoe (564877) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709031)

Dear Sir,

I understand your request for mobilization, I understand that the Western world is in great peril. Please be assured of my everlasting support to your cause against these 1500 years (or 3000 years or something...) old enemies. I would be glad to help but I am currently too busy digging some trenches to protect me from our neighbors. See, my nation is fighting since 1000 years (or 2000 or whatever) against the Germanic people. Our feud is so old that I think reconciliation may prove impossible. All we can do is arm for war.

Please be assured of my deepest sympathy
A French guy.

Re:Take them at face value. (2, Insightful)

Shakrai (717556) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709219)

Our feud is so old that I think reconciliation may prove impossible

The GP didn't say reconciliation is impossible. The GP said that the Western world has a history of clashing with the Islamic/Middle Eastern World. I see nothing in human history to suggest that this will change soon -- if anything it's going to get worse as the competition for limited resources heats up.

Mind you, it won't start with bullets -- it will start with economics.

Re:Take them at face value. (1, Insightful)

Shakrai (717556) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709055)

The Western nations have been at odds with Islamic nations for 1500 years, and with Persia for nearly 3000. That Persia now Iran is acting up again is hardly a surprise. One might surmise that in the grand scheme of things, this is just a conflict between ideologies and peoples and no one side is right, but the thing is, since most of us are westerners, we would prefer that our side prevail.

Well, for what it's worth we've prevailed more often than not. Persian aggression was what united the Greek city-states and arguably lead to the birth of Western civilization. Even when western civilization has been on the decline we've generally managed to hold [wikipedia.org] the line [wikipedia.org] . Every time they've had a chance to beat Western civilization they've failed.

To that end, I suppose that those who would argue that strategic missile defense cannot be built, or that militarization of space should be avoided, or that Iran is not a threat, need to rethink that.

If Iran demonstrates a workable launch system then it would seem to me to be the height of irresponsibility not to build a missile defense system. They aren't there yet and they still have to develop a miniaturized nuclear weapon (no small feat) but I hope that people are looking at missile defense differently now.

And similarly, those that would advocate war with Iran, might need to rethink that as well

I don't think people would be advocating war with Iran if Iran was a responsible member of the international community. They could demonstrate this by ending their support of terrorist organizations and toning down the anti-Israeli rhetoric. I doubt they are inclined to do this so we'll see what the next move on the chessboard winds up being.....

Re:Take them at face value. (1)

ScrewMaster (602015) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709129)

This now a game where tens of millions of people might get killed, not just thousands.

Well, one might argue that the Cold War with the Soviet Union was a much greater threat, and it was. There's a qualitative difference though: Russia's leaders may be totalitarians (evil enough from a Western perspective), but they understood the concept of mutual annihilation. Can the same be said for Iran? I don't know enough about them to have an opinion.

One military maxim says that if you want to avoid a war, you eliminate the enemy's ability to wage it. That means that, from a practical perspective, there will never be a better time than now to deal with Iran by means of force.

pretty impressive (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708657)

But the real test will be if the Iranians can launch a successor capable of flinging a shoe at an American satellite.

Re:pretty impressive (5, Funny)

Dunbal (464142) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708723)

What do you mean? This satellite is a shoe... and it's expected to de-orbit over Texas in the near future.

Congratulations (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708681)

The mark of a civilised mind would be to celebrate this achievement. Those gripped by tribal paranoia, searching for ways to disparage the Iranians should take a good look at themselves (I'm mainly looking at you now Americans). Relax, I've played football with some Iranian guys seen for myself in the shower, their dicks are not significantly bigger than the average Western male.

Re:Congratulations (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708797)

"their dicks are not significantly bigger than the average Western male."

Have lots of experience with other men's dicks, eh?

Re:Congratulations (0, Troll)

zulater (635326) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708801)

So you like the Iranian cock then?

Re:Congratulations (1)

ErikZ (55491) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709107)

A civilized mind would also understand the meaning of "Conscription".

Unless you're playing football with the leaders of Iran, the personalities and attitudes of their subjects just don't matter that much.

It was faked. (1)

Samschnooks (1415697) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708715)

Iran has faked missile launches before [bbc.co.uk]

We also need to embargo movie special effects software and computers!

Really? I knew it! Those god damn American liars.. (1)

denzacar (181829) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709109)

... always trying to frame honest Iranian folk, just so they could find a casus belli so they could get their grubby little hands on their sweet, sweet oil.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/meast/02/03/iran.satellite/index.html [cnn.com]

The United States has confirmed that Iran launched a low-earth orbit satellite on Monday night, two U.S. officials told CNN's Barbara Starr. There were no indications of any weapons activity on the two-stage rocket, although the rocket is capable of launching long-range weapons, the officials said.

 

 
Do I need to point out that I am being sarcastic, or is someone just going to slap me with a flame/troll combo?

Need verification. (1)

RandoX (828285) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708727)

Isn't this the same group that got caught releasing doctored photos when one of their missile launchers failed to fire? Maybe they cut the video feed right before the satellite exploded.

CNN citing U.S. officials good enough? (2, Informative)

denzacar (181829) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709149)

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/meast/02/03/iran.satellite/index.html [cnn.com] [cnn.com]

The United States has confirmed that Iran launched a low-earth orbit satellite on Monday night, two U.S. officials told CNN's Barbara Starr.
There were no indications of any weapons activity on the two-stage rocket, although the rocket is capable of launching long-range weapons, the officials said.

not interesting (1)

Lord Ender (156273) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708757)

Satellite technology isn't interesting from a political standpoint. It's launcher technology that is interesting, because that's the tricky part in making ICBMs.

Re:not interesting (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708957)

Considering that you can deliver a ~1kt warhead from off of a satellite platform...

Wake up call (2, Insightful)

squoozer (730327) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708791)

The next 50 years or so are going to be a serious wake up call to the west and the US in particular I think. We have enjoyed a technological advantage over the rest of the world for a good while now but it is being eroded at a fantastic rate. That advantage has allowed us to push the rest of the world and I fear that will come back to haunt us. Back when the west was first launching things into space the knowledge, skill and equipment needed to build such machines was exceedingly difficult to come by. It's still not easy to launch a payload into space but the equipment required to build a launch vehicle is no longer hard to come by and the knowledge and skill can be fairly easily "bought".

Wake up from what? (1)

johnny cashed (590023) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708877)

That the US and the "west" isn't so special? That smart humans exist in other parts of the world? Yes, let us wake up indeed.

Re:Wake up from what? (1)

Beyond_GoodandEvil (769135) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709049)

That the US and the "west" isn't so special?
No, that it is time for the West to deploy Gundams, only then will the Western powers be able to reinstitute the Pax Americana.

Re:Wake up from what? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26709217)

Tsss,
Only Zeon had a big Mobile Suit contigent at the beginning of the One year War:p.

(and mobile suits sucks as all mecha against conventionnal MBT)

Re:Wake up from what? (1, Insightful)

RobotRunAmok (595286) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709139)

That the US and the "west" isn't so special? That smart humans exist in other parts of the world? Yes, let us wake up indeed.

You can forgive us forgetting that nations that subscribe to Sharia law and treat women and opposing points of view the way Iran does might be medieval in other aspects of their "civilization" as well.

I wouldn't have wanted to see Saladin, Richard III, or Oliver Cromwell get nuclear capability. Similarly, I don't want to see Ahmadinejad with it.

Oh crap (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708861)

Iran now has the ability to nuke anywhere in the world.

We pressured them, tough luck (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26708863)

If this is indeed the case it was to be expected after they way they've been treated. I mean; they signed the treaty which grants the signing party to perform nuclear research and development as long as its not going to be used for war purposes. The world watched it happening and even cheered them back then for doing so. Then, many years later, Iran actually started on the path to develop nucleair power and all of a sudden the signed treaty wasn't worth a dime anymore and they had to be monitored, stopped, belittled, etc. Ofcourse; some of this bullshit came from the former president of the US, someone who I consider to be a war criminal, but even so; the rest of the world once again stood there and watched.

Sidenote: and its not as if Iran solely started doing nuclear research for what they state to be research into new ways of energy gathering. For people reading the news they could have seen Iranian delegations all over the world looking into other and different ways to maintain and generate energy. You've had these people in Germany, looking into a small farmers village which managed to recycle all the doodoo's left by the animals. All that shit (phun intended) is gathered in a central "stove" after which the warmth is transported to surrounding buildings. We've seen delegates in Holland (which gave a small upstir) looking into the likes of wind energy. You've seen delegates informing and debating some of the recent accidents with windmills, etc, etc. There are dozens of clear cases where its obvious that Iran is looking into these things. And here, the arrogant West, struddles along ignoring all the facts and goes "no, you can't do that (researching nuclear power).".

So well, duuh. Isn't it sorta obvious that they'll be putting effort into other kinds of researches as well? Especially at this time where they can start putting some pressure onto the rest of the world. Do note that I'm not saying that I like it, but I sure can understand where this is coming from and why. Well, maybe not fully but the overall picture sure seems clear to me.

Best "remedy" for this (possible) "problem" is IMO to start treating these guys seriously for a change instead of labeling them as the "axe of all evil" no matter what they do. Its the only way to get things to settle down a little. You may not agree with them, but there are more (diplomatic) ways of showing that than by force or showing muscles. In fact; diplomacy is bound to give a much longer lasting effect. Just look at the middle east.. Clinton's diplomacy (at least 8 years back) managed to create a somewhat stable situation years after the moment. It only had to be maintained to last, but you-know-who didn't think that was a priority and as such we're in the same shit again. So... I'd say the time for diplomacy has come again.

Uhhh... (-1, Troll)

MisterMikeyG (1454529) | more than 5 years ago | (#26708945)

Iran is an assbackwards third world country. The only thing they've launched is a silly story

Satellite named Hope? (1)

hansamurai (907719) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709033)

And here I thought that US had a monopoly on Hope.

Thanks Jimmy (0, Troll)

m0s3m8n (1335861) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709059)

A toast to Jimmy Carter on a job well done. Go ahead, mod me down - sigh -

YUO FAIL IT.. (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26709115)

Congratulations! (1)

Eli Gottlieb (917758) | more than 5 years ago | (#26709165)

Good for you guys on launching your first satellite. It marks your entry into an elite club of nations that coincidentally also consists of most of your enemies. Perhaps we could solve some of these diplomatic situations with a good, old-fashioned trade in technology?

Dear Iranians? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26709175)

They're not dear to me!

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