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Facebook Scrambles To Contain ToS Fallout

kdawson posted more than 5 years ago | from the all-your-content dept.

Social Networks 409

Ian Lamont writes "Anger over Facebook's ToS update has forced the company to scramble. Yesterday, a spokesman released a statement that said Facebook has never 'claimed ownership of material that users upload,' and is trying to be more open to users about how their data is being handled. Mark Zuckerberg has also weighed in, stating 'we wouldn't share your information in a way you wouldn't want.' Facebook members are skeptical, however — protests have sprung up on blogs, message boards, and a new Facebook group called 'People Against the new Terms of Service' that has added more than 10,000 members today."

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Oh, that's all right then (5, Funny)

Scutter (18425) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898101)

As long as they promised, there's nothing to worry about, right?

Re:Oh, that's all right then (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898125)

sure pal

Re:Oh, that's all right then (5, Funny)

DanWS6 (1248650) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898165)

Yeah, I for one would trust Mark Zuckerberg completely.



I couldn't even type that with a straight face. lol.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898665)

There's two kinds of people in this world: People who have been fucked over by Mark Zuckerberg and people who will be fucked over by Mark Zuckerberg. More like 1.5, since he takes douchebag viagra and will gladly fuck you over again.

True story -- I saw him at a bar about a year ago, in the men's room of all places. (No, this story doesn't involve eating shit). He was acting like a douchebag, cock of the walk and all, taking a piss and talking on his phone. I punched him in the back of the head as I was leaving. He dropped his blackberry in the fucking urinal, but I didn't stick around to see his reaction.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (5, Insightful)

Bieeanda (961632) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898195)

Absolutely, especially after they proved themselves during the Beacon fiasco. Proved that they can't be trusted not to stab with one hand while they stroke with another, that is.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898223)

I get the sarcasm. Let us not forget who bought them not so long ago..... They want to own everything else, why not YOU!

Re:Oh, that's all right then (4, Insightful)

0100010001010011 (652467) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898229)

I'm going to protest Best Buy by going in and buying stuff! That'll show them!

When are people going to learn to 'protest' facebook by not using facebook?

Re:Oh, that's all right then (5, Insightful)

at_slashdot (674436) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898399)

The problem is that people already use Facebook and they are invested in it (they have friends, pictures, etc) and this is a change in TOS that you can't refuse, if you just leave Facebook the TOS says (from what I understand) that they have control over your info... so what use to leave now?

Re:Oh, that's all right then (5, Insightful)

chaoticgeek (874438) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898465)

Actually it was easy for me... I found all the people I actually cared about on the site. Which happened to be all my friends because I did not add everyone under the sun. Told them how to get in touch with me, then proceeded to delete everything I had uploaded in the first place. Started removing all information about me, which was not much because I was never very fond of putting up all my info on there anyways. Then closed the account. So they can have my schools email and that I play guitar and like anime but that is about it. Sure they may have backups but screw it I'll live. And I don't mind not having facebook anymore either.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (4, Insightful)

Giometrix (932993) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898509)

"...Sure they may have backups but screw it I'll live"

More than just backups. When you "delete" something your just setting a Is_Deleted flag on their database. As far as facebook is concerned, your information is just as easily available as if you were an active member.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (5, Interesting)

malkir (1031750) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898541)

Exactly true - at the beginning of 2008 I got fed up with the site and deleted my account.

Peer pressure and boredom brought be back 3 months later and I remade an account with the same information - to my suprise my ENTIRE account was restored, I mean EVERYTHING. Every picture, every comment, every message, every tagged photo... everything you do on Facebook is stored away for good.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (4, Interesting)

Shadow of Eternity (795165) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898739)

It's worse if they decide for some reason, which they will never tell you, to ban you. Your account will still be open and active and no amount of arguing with their support staff will convince them otherwise.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (4, Interesting)

novakyu (636495) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898583)

More than just backups. When you "delete" something your just setting a Is_Deleted flag on their database. As far as facebook is concerned, your information is just as easily available as if you were an active member.

What if you simply change it, say, to something bogus?

They might have some kind of version control system, but a version control system is really a kind of backup with a particular purpose.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (1)

chaoticgeek (874438) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898697)

True, but I just deleted all the info so it looks like a brand new facebook account with my name and my email, which is an email I hardly use. Not to mention I did state that all they will have is a list of bands I liked that has not been updated for quite some time, a list of some general hobbies, like 'computers' for instance, and the email. I never really liked putting a bunch of info out on a site that so many people could access. Not my style I guess. So I guess they can bombard my school email account with offers for computer junk, anime conventions and Nirvana tour dates but I doubt I'll answer to any of them.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898401)

There's a problem: there is no serious competitor (yet) and network effects make switching to a different social network difficult. The real fix is to use some sort of open / distributed social networking system (so it is more like e-mail/Jabber), but I do not know of any real solution in that area. A large part of the problem is that Facebook handles networks (groups based on school/company/location) as part of its privacy controls and it is hard to replicate that.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (4, Insightful)

0100010001010011 (652467) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898591)

Boycotts aren't supposed to be easy. Neither is any other passive protest. Ghandi didn't go "oh well shit, this is hard, you win".

If you really want Facebook to pay attention, start letter writing campaigns to their advertisers. Start boycotting their advertisers

The biggest problem == no exit strategy (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898597)

Facebook's privacy controls (configuration settings) are brain-dead easy to create elsewhere, in fact they are manifestly not sophisticated.

The problem is that Facebook doesn't provide a way for you pack your sh!t and go. I.e. to instantly reconstruct your network elsewhere, your data, your photos, etc. (possibly with placeholders for friends in your network who've not yet migrated). They *could* make this data portable but clearly they have negative incentive to do so. I think Gmail is the same; do they provide a way to export your email so that you can upload it to some other provider? Yeah, I didn't think so.

Re:The biggest problem == no exit strategy (5, Informative)

mixmatch (957776) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898723)

I think Gmail is the same; do they provide a way to export your email so that you can upload it to some other provider? Yeah, I didn't think so.

You mean like by using IMAP or POP [google.com] ?

Re:The biggest problem == no exit strategy (2, Informative)

lethargic8 (1179029) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898757)

maybe not but google does let you download your email via imap, thereby exporting all of your data stored in gmail.

Goobook? Bookle? (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898511)

Stand by for Google's new product: Goobook. Would you believe it's called Bookle? No? Well, ok, maybe not - but this *is* a real business opportunity for somebody that has more than a theoretical familiarity with ethical business practices to make Facebook's future a little less certain (no, not you, MSN - I said *ETHICAL* business practices).

Re:Oh, that's all right then (2, Informative)

HartDev (1155203) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898547)

Yeah...In my Economic History class, when talking about the Boston Tea Party it says that "American have learned a new and powerful economic tool...the boycott" Come to think of it now a days, we are so un-disciplined that boycott is not only un-likely....but completely impossible in the majority of minds out there. And if someone is rather strong will or minded, they are still talking to people instead of screens.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (4, Funny)

Warll (1211492) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898681)

The Boston Tea Party wasn't a boycott, it was blatant destruction of property.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (2, Interesting)

HartDev (1155203) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898815)

Going off what the book was talking about, but yeah it was destruction of property that furthered a revolution.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (4, Funny)

steelfood (895457) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898625)

I move to create a Boycott Facebook group on facebook.

I'd go start one up right now, but I don't have a facebook account, seeing as I'm boycotting it.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (5, Insightful)

squidinkcalligraphy (558677) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898703)

This sums up all that's wrong about facebook 'protest' groups and 'causes'. You join a cause, then get a warm and fuzzy feeling that you've actually done something. YOU HAVE NOT DONE ANYTHING APART FROM CLICKING THE MOUSE! It's even more useless than email petitions. Want to make a difference? Write a letter to your politician, go to a protest, start a boycott, strike, blockade, start a campaign group, talk to people in the street, stand on a soapbox, fuck some shit up. But it's gonna take a hell of a lot more effort than joining a facebook group.

Re:Oh, that's all right then (4, Funny)

Ihmhi (1206036) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898617)

Reuters reports that Facebook executives were seen at a press conference pinky swearing, and gave the additional statement of "No takesie-backsies."

Facebook Scrambles To Contain Necrotic Dog Penis (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898105)

ATTENTION SHOPPERS: PAY NO ATTENTION TO THE NECROTIC DOG PENIS. I REPEAT, PAY NO ATTENTION TO THE NECROTIC DOG PENIS CURRENTLY LOOMING OUTSIDE LOT 4. CONTINUE SHOPPING BUT PLEASE ENSURE YOU LEAVE VIA AN ALTERNATIVE EXIT AS WE ARE NO LONGER ABLE TO GUARANTEE YOUR SAFETY IN LOT 4, DUE TO THE NECROTIC DOG PENIS. FOR YOUR INFORMATION, LOTS 1, 2, 3, 5 AND 6 ARE CURRENTLY FREE OF BAYING NECROTIC DOG PENIS. PAY NO ATTENTION TO THE NECROTIC DOG PENIS. THANK YOU.

Serves you right (5, Insightful)

Gothmolly (148874) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898129)

Its enormously popular, and (to some) provides a lot of value... and its free. What did you THINK they were going to do with the info you have up there ? It's a massive social engineering/data mining study, and you're taking part in it.

Good thing I'm safe (5, Funny)

JeanBaptiste (537955) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898271)

I only use myspace, gmail + other google services, LinkedIn, and twitter. They certainly don't fit your description, so I'm good.

Re:Serves you right (1)

RecoveredMarketroid (569802) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898307)

Its enormously popular, and (to some) provides a lot of value... and its free. What did you THINK they were going to do with the info you have up there ? It's a massive social engineering/data mining study, and you're taking part in it.

I'm not sure that it's as well thought out as you might believe...

Re:Serves you right (1)

ZanzibarZero (1478583) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898485)

Although I agree with you, the whole point of Facebook's security features are to limit WHO can see your personal information. Some people may not necessarily have put info up if they thought the whole WWW could access it... No longer having control over how your info is filtered from the general public can make you vulnerable to stalkers, which is a serious concern for some people. So I can understand the reaction - to an extent.

Re:Serves you right (5, Insightful)

Jim Robinson Jr. (853390) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898531)

Agreed. Someone went to a lot of effort, and spends a huge stack of cash every month to keep FB operating and providing those free services. Very little in life is truly free... and this is no different.

They provide us with an entertaining and occasionally useful service without any cash changing hands, but that doesn't mean there isn't a cost involved.

Don't like that they can re-use your "private" data? Don't post it. Want to post it? Regardless of whether your talking about Facebook, some other social site, or even just old-fashioned web pages, as soon as you post it... it's publicly available and there is nothing you can really do to prevent it.

My advice to FB users (that includes me) is to use the same common sense you should be using everywhere: don't post something your mother couldn't read. It's corny, but that perspective could keep a lot of people out of trouble.

If you really want something private, don't use a public social site to post it. There are plenty of web hosting companies to choose from, and for just a few dollars every month you can have space for a web page and stored files. Just find a secured template... and remember that nothing is ever - EVER - truly secure if it is publicly accessible.

Cheers, and happy Facebooking!

Jim

Re:Serves you right (1)

Kral_Blbec (1201285) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898751)

I honestly couldnt care less what facebook or google does with the data about myself that I've given them. I havnt given anymore about myself away than I might in a 10 minute chat with a stranger in school. Its who I am, if you know me you already know most of it. If you dont know my, why are you looking? If your trying to stalk me, be my guest and say hi to my little friend while you're at it (Everyone should have a concealed pistol permit IMO). If you're trying to do some form of identity theft, I dont have anything to steal.

Re:Serves you right (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898721)

And... it's a COOKBOOK!!!

People Against the new Terms of Service (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898135)

All, of course, agreed to the new Terms of Service. So they can't be too against them.

And begat the Fed Trade Commission complaint... (5, Informative)

strredwolf (532) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898137)

Facebook Privacy Change Sparks Federal Complaint [yahoo.com]

For those who don't like long reads: Promises aren't enough. EPIC wants it reversed, and is filling a Federal Trade Commission complaint.

Re:And begat the Fed Trade Commission complaint... (4, Funny)

Ihmhi (1206036) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898629)

Here's hoping for an EPIC win.

Re:And begat the Fed Trade Commission complaint... (4, Insightful)

steelfood (895457) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898777)

What most people don't seem to realize is that their original TOS wasn't too hot to begin with as it were. It's not so much that the conditions under their TOS are unusual, but more that it offers no consideration for the kind of data that the TOS covers.

If Youtube claims an automatic all-use license for content uploaded onto their servers, it's not that big a deal, as all it has are videos. If Flickr did the same, it's a little worse, but still not that big a deal as all they really have are pictures and some comments.

But Facebook contains a huge amount of personal information--and they are as anal in keeping information as a wiki--some of which may be protected by privacy laws. Even if AOL said they keep all logs of all conversations that go through AIM and can use it for whatever purpose they like, there isn't nearly as much personally identifiable information as there is on Facebook, and that and more was effectively what Facebook's original TOS entailed. Such a TOS on their part is irresponsible at best, and criminal at worst.

pants? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898141)

Excuse me but why is this tagged with "pants"?

Re:pants? (3, Informative)

Bill Dimm (463823) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898345)

pants = British for rubbish [urbandictionary.com]

Re:pants? (2, Informative)

NoobixCube (1133473) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898613)

Pants, adj. "Of poor quality". eg "Idle is pants"

Re:pants? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898375)

see adjective [wiktionary.org]

Re:pants? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898699)

Read the entire summary again, this time more slowly. Especially towards the end.

People Against the New TOS (1)

iminplaya (723125) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898147)

Pffft! How 'bout people for using an alternative to facebook? I doubt they have a monopoly on this business.

Re:People Against the New TOS (1)

russlar (1122455) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898217)

Have you been to MySpace lately?

Re:People Against the New TOS (1)

iminplaya (723125) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898513)

How could I? I don't know where you are.

Re:People Against the New TOS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898567)

No, I'm afraid of the aneurysm's and seizures that I suffer when I view those pages.

This is why (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898155)

This is why I refuse to sign-up to Facebook, not to mention all those apps, and Facebook themselves, selling your personal details.

Then there's the servers in the US where the department of Homeland Security could go through my personal details on a whim.

Maybe this will make people work out the problems with Facebook. Probably not.

Re:This is why (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898563)

and Facebook themselves, selling your personal details.

Source?

Re:This is why (1)

uniquegeek (981813) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898571)

I use it to market myself. Post cool & scientific things in your feeds, talk about geeky things in your status, and all of a sudden you look a lot smarter than you really are

If you specifically use it with networking in mind, it's really useful.

Re:This is why (1)

_merlin (160982) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898711)

So your plan is something like:

  1. Don't register on Facebook and Slashdot
  2. Post anonymously
  3. ???
  4. Profit!
    1. Once I work out step 3 I'll be raking in the millions that you think are coming to you!

Facebook has had an evil ToS for awhile (1)

vsage3 (718267) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898159)

I regret ever putting any information about myself on that website. Even though I deleted some of my old stuff (like e-mail), Facebook still holds the data hostage. Anyway, I found this funny:

and a new Facebook group called 'People Against the new Terms of Service' that has added more than 10,000 members today."

God that is the laziest form of protest ever. Yeah let's join a group on the service we are protesting to show how much we disagree with this new policy! If you take such exception, stop using the damned service.

Re:Facebook has had an evil ToS for awhile (5, Funny)

TuaAmin13 (1359435) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898209)

Don't forget, it's not unified protest either. There'll be a dozen groups "protesting" the same thing because someone didn't think about using the search feature.

If you don't believe me, look for groups against duplicate groups.

Re:Facebook has had an evil ToS for awhile (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898371)

I like to think of them as "Protester Beowulf Clusters."

Re:Facebook has had an evil ToS for awhile (1)

Kral_Blbec (1201285) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898705)

How many of them are marked as official?

Re:Facebook has had an evil ToS for awhile (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898745)

There's duplicate groups of Groups against duplicate groups

Re:Facebook has had an evil ToS for awhile (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898731)

If you take such exception, stop using the damned service.

Well that's one avenue, although I would think it would be advantageous to strike up a dialogue first. It never hurts though to ask for something (and actually, if you really think about it, this isn't really a protest, its asking for things to go back to they were, or to be changed to respect people's right to their material.)

Another line of thought, say you have an issue with your neighbors dog destroying your landscaping repeatedly. You wouldn't try taking them to court them until you've exhausted other methods first, like asking that they keep their dog out of your yard. You always want to try to settle things outside of court. It's similar with facebook. People aren't necessarily going to leave it without trying to get things changed first.

It's too hard to complain (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898181)

Companies don't really care about blogs, message boards, and protest facebook groups. They only care about the number of subscribers they have.

The question is: Will *you* use the most effective form of protest or will you continue to use the company's products and whine about it?

An echo chamber... (4, Insightful)

ihatewinXP (638000) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898185)

Dont we have this discussion about once a year?

I remember the exact same thing going down with Flikr, Myspace, Youtube... Of course I dont agree with the wording and implications of the new TOS but can anyone point me to an example where any of these sites have commandeered content and used it nefariously? Microsoft maybe once?

Re:An echo chamber... (2, Interesting)

gurps_npc (621217) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898277)

Tons of unethical companies do it all the time. Have you heard of spyware? That is basically what they do. They use the same TOS statements to get away with this kind of thing.

When you are not a criminal, you don't need criminal tools. We don't let the super of a building keep bump keys, even if it is convenient for him. Instead he has to request and receive a copy of each resident's key if they allow it.

The online community has to learn that NO, you can't just do what you want. If you want a contract to be valid, then the other guy has to agree to it. The worse your contract, the fewer people will agree. If you worsen the TOS, then some of your people will leave you.

Re:An echo chamber... (3, Insightful)

Ihmhi (1206036) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898651)

The online community has to learn that NO, you can't just do what you want. If you want a contract to be valid, then the other guy has to agree to it. The worse your contract, the fewer people will agree. If you worsen the TOS, then some of your people will leave you.

The problem is that they effectively said even if you leave, they're going to do it anyway. That's like your landlord still charging you rent after you've already been moved out for a few month - and he amended the lease without your explicit permission.

This is nothing new (4, Interesting)

alvinrod (889928) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898191)

This isn't anything new. I used to use facebook somewhat and posted a few things to it until I caught wind of their TOS. They essential claimed at least partial ownership of anything posted to their site at the time and I didn't feel as though it was a fair shake. I essentially stopped using it at that point.

My account is still active and every few months I check it and add anyone that I'd care to have contact information for. Essentially it's a glorified rolodex for me, with the added bonus that other people can find me. Personally, if I wanted to talk with someone I'd rather call them up and have a cup of coffee or a meal instead of sending little messages back and forth. Technology is a fairly big part of my life. I work with it, play with it, and use it for research. I don't really feel it should be a big part of my social life, however.

Maybe I'm just a luddite in that regard, but I prefer face to face meetings over anything else that we've developed over the last hundred years.

Re:This is nothing new (1)

rhinokitty (962485) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898353)

No, no--totally right! I had a friend send me a Facebook request and I swear we would have never actually hung out if I actually used Facebook.

I sent him an email explaining my concerns about using Facebook and we actually ended up going out for a beer. It was great and I really enjoy facetime with someone as opposed to having a mechanistic, tit-for-tat, "I can friend you if you can get me a job" type relationship.

What about the last 1000 years? (1)

JeanBaptiste (537955) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898405)

I try to use carrier pigeons, smoke signals, semaphore flag towers, and the telegraph whenever possible.

I bet few here know that the famous RFC 1149 [faqs.org] has actually been implemented [cnet.com] .

I'm working on a writeup for a semaphore based system. Still not sure how to handle bad routes due to German invasions.

Re:This is nothing new (1)

Techman83 (949264) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898523)

I second that, I am in the same boat. I spend my professional life sitting in front of a screen, now whilst I do have personal projects I work on at home, my entire social life is about getting out of the house and hanging with my friends. Personally I'd rather have a few close friends then 1000 people "I know". For those that I can't visit in person, I still spend time on the phone to them.

Re:This is nothing new (3, Insightful)

Zwicky (702757) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898627)

I'm probably going to sound like a complete prig here but anyway...

I don't have, nor have I ever had, a Facebook account. However I have regularly seen a friend's account when I've been at his place and as we grew up together I'd say it is representative of what I would have to endure.

I have found that all the people who find and friend (or whatever is the trendy not-really-a-verb term they use) him are those I - and often he also - only ever knew in passing.

Believe it or not I'm actually quite a friendly person and get on with pretty much anyone who cares to sit down and talk to me. (I recently went alone on a two week vacation where this trait was borne out but that's another story). The thing is, these people often didn't want to know me back then and for some reason they now get it into their heads that being chummy online and sending piddling messages around is somehow OK.

To be frank I have no interest in 're-'hooking up with these people. I don't find them very interesting to be honest. Their statuses all echo the current 'joke' that is being flushed around the tubes and what they are doing doesn't actually interest me at bit.

The thing I find really amusing is that the protest group is using the very tool they are protesting against to stage the protest! This is precisely what I would expect from the people I've seen on there.

The fact is that there are many people out there who do not seriously consider what happens to their data. Just as with real life: that I know people who do not shred bank statements is one example; they just throw in the trash all sorts of identifying data without a second thought. They just don't care, even after being informed of the potential dangers.

Similarly folks signing up to Facebook don't generally want to let an inconvenience like statements in the terms and conditions keep them from their oh-so-important online life. I suspect it is this mentality that is behind those members who joined the protest group. They don't care enough to just walk away. Sure, it seems that superficially they may be having an effect, but I'd venture a guess that Facebook are merely doing damage control. They will still try and get away with as many of the contentious statements as they still can because they know that their users are reluctant to leave. That stacks the cards in their favor.

(I do want to point out that obviously not everyone who has an account is an idiot - my friend for one is certainly not, nor I would say are my ex-colleagues who also had accounts - but it does tend to attract a certain shall we say, demographic.)

People Against the new Terms of Service (5, Informative)

Lank (19922) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898193)

Here's a link to this group:
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=77069107432 [facebook.com]

Re:People Against the new Terms of Service (3, Insightful)

tompaulco (629533) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898237)

I'm torn. I would never join Facebook, but now I want to so I can be part of this group. Is there also a group for people who will never join Facebook?

Any publicity... (1)

LSD-OBS (183415) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898253)

Seems like a nice ploy, what with all them angry, uppity nettards jumping to action in a flurry of group joins, posting and pageloads!

Guess they've been taking notes from livejournal [cracked.com] .

Just delete it (1)

jarrettwold2002 (601633) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898269)

I really didn't care enough to keep it. If there is going to be some huge deal with the TOS and claims to anything I post. Eh I just deleted the account. Far simpler than waging war against some company.

Vote with your feet.

Re:Just delete it (2, Insightful)

saigo11 (1479715) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898391)

You can never actually delete it; just deactivate it. That basically means all your info is still stored on their servers.

Re:Just delete it (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898695)

Wrong. http://www.facebook.com/help/contact.php?show_form=delete_account [facebook.com]

Your account will be deleted within a few days and they'll follow up with an email asking if you don't mind sharing why you've decided to delete it.

I've done it (last year sometime); I recommend you do, too.

Re:Just delete it (2, Interesting)

AnEducatedNegro (1372687) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898795)

as someone pointed out on another forum, facebook has a huge problem with cascading deletes. if you delete your account and facebook were to delete all records in all the tables of you, they would take a major performance hit. the only way to delete yourself is to remove all comments, wall posts, and pictures then erase your account

Re:Just delete it (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898677)

so like you read the bit where even if you deactivate your account, they still say they own shit you posted, right?

"This morning, I reported on Facebook's new terms of service, which appears to assert permanent rights to any content that users create or upload, even after they delete it from the site. "

too late.... (1)

gandhi_2 (1108023) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898305)

...i've already committed digital seppuku. I'm done with these companies. How do you start as a cool project by some college CS dudes and end up as such douche bags?

Re:too late.... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898357)

Simple. You hire a bunch of lawyers that you expect are going to look out for you, but in the process they write some new language that pisses off all of your customers. Same thing happened with Fark a while back, hopefully Zuckerberg will take a clue from Drew and realize the people really DO have a point.

how have you committed digital seppuku? (5, Informative)

JeanBaptiste (537955) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898469)

You posted a comment on slashdot, with your homepage set to techiehelplist.com, which a whois shows is registered to a Jamie B*****n with complete address in a state south of Idaho. It took less time to find that out than it took to type this comment. (If it's _not_ you, it's a pretty good start).

I don't know how to commit digital seppuku myself, but I think you're doing it wrong ;-P

(all in fun)

Re:how have you committed digital seppuku? (2, Interesting)

gandhi_2 (1108023) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898585)

Yep, I am fully aware that you can find my information. I'm from Utah, I rather like lesbian porn, I am pretty good at that stab-a-knife-blade-between-fingers game, and I once got my nose broken playing a game of ultimate frisbee.

You make a good point, but I think you misunderstand mine (although I prolly didn't explain it well). My problem is that facebook thinks they own all your content and information. They can take pictures that YOU have in your gallery, and use them at any time, in any way they want to. All the meta data about you, they will use however they want. That's where I get off the bus.

And it's techhelplist.com, recognize. (:

Re:how have you committed digital seppuku? (5, Interesting)

gandhi_2 (1108023) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898631)

I did it with this [facebook.com] .

What's funny is the delete form now says:

Deleting due to change in Terms of Service

Are you deleting because you are concerned about Facebook's Terms of Service?

This was a mistake that we have now corrected. You own the information you put on Facebook and you control what happens to it. We are sorry for the confusion.

- The Facebook Team

Protest/Petition/ZoMg! groups on Facebook (2, Interesting)

magsol (1406749) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898379)

and a new Facebook group called 'People Against the new Terms of Service' that has added more than 10,000 members today."

There are enough "People Against [X]" (the New Layout; Christianity; Atheism; BlueBell Ice Cream; Rational Thought; etc etc) groups on Facebook to occupy someone for a lifetime. And every time one pops up and I am peppered with invitations from my friends to it or one of its dozens of identical groups with different spelling/grammatical errors in the name, I always have to laugh, because I'm pretty sure the people at Facebook react to the groups the same way I do.

What's the point? Do these groups really accomplish anything?

Re:Protest/Petition/ZoMg! groups on Facebook (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898517)

Sometimes. A potato chip manufacturer (crisps in some countries) ran a competition in Australia: create a Facebook group with three words in the group name referencing the manufacturer, and have the most members in that group, and you'll win $AU10,000. The group that won was one that had the explicit aim of donating the funds to the Victorian bushfire [wikipedia.org] appeal.

Which is arguably the exception, not the norm, so I think it supports your argument rather than refutes it.

Re:Protest/Petition/ZoMg! groups on Facebook (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898719)

Take your crisps and get the hell out of here!

Must be about the CIA (1)

molrak (541582) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898417)

This must be so the CIA can legally keep the info it gathers on everyone through facebook.

I pulled all of my photos off (3, Interesting)

sdo1 (213835) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898425)

I yanked my photos off and I won't be putting up any more. Facebook is a reasonable place to stay in touch with friends as long as you have your privacy settings locked down, but other than that... forget it. Their backpedaling is just ridiculous. Want to make a statement? Then change the policy. Or give at least an opt-out for "No, I do not wish to grant Facebook any rights to my copyrighted materials". They can say "well, that's not really what we mean" all they want. The policy is pretty clear... post a photo or video on Facebook and they claim they can do whatever they want with it now and forever.

This is a pretty reasonable review of the various policies of social media sites. http://amandafrench.net/2009/02/16/facebook-terms-of-service-compared/ [amandafrench.net]

I'll continue to post my images to flickr (lower resolution of course)... but certainly not to Facebook any longer.

-S

Re:I pulled all of my photos off (3, Insightful)

MagusSlurpy (592575) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898765)

I yanked my photos off and I won't be putting up any more.

Unfortunately. . .

"You hereby grant Facebook an irrevocable, perpetual, non-exclusive, transferable, fully paid, worldwide license (with the right to sublicense) to (a) use, copy, publish, stream, store, edit, frame, translate, excerpt, adapt, create derivative works and distribute (through multiple tiers), any User Content you (i) Post on or in connection with the Facebook Service or the promotion thereof subject only to your privacy settings or (ii) enable a user to Post, including by offering a Share Link on your website. . .

Too bad that Facebook claims it already owns your photos, now. You yanked them too late, and they're gonna sell them to the Weekly World News, and we'll all learn about how you met Bat Boy at some tranny bar in Hoboken while plotting your time-travel assassination of JFK.

Re:I pulled all of my photos off (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898771)

You'll need two profiles to host that ego! *rimshot*

I think most people understand privacy (1)

theredshoes (1308621) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898433)

It is just a website. If it is something that you wouldn't share with the public on that type of site, you probably should not be using it for your "real" private conversations or things that happen to you that you would not want anyone to know. Like someone said, you can do that in person over coffee or a meal or in the privacy of your own home. When you have friends in California or another state, it is a convenient communication source.

It is just a friend site for most people. I don't see what the big deal is really about Facebook having information on my status update about how I am doing my dishes or errands, going to a play or out with friends. I certainly would not post anything on that site that an employer would look up and think was inappropriate. I doubt anyone would talk about anything remotely private on Facebook or MySpace, I think those are best left to talking about in person or over the phone or through email. Most people have lives really.

Re:I think most people understand privacy (1)

theredshoes (1308621) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898483)

Also I guess I have been lucky enough not to do anything I would be ashamed of to be made public. Reasonable people understand context and when people are playing around with their buddies. When they publish the pics of me and Michael Phelps toking the reefer together, then I will really have to worry! :)

Really? Does this include the "most people" who (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898527)

would give up their passwords for a chocolate bar? Most people have no flipping clue about privacy and hence they post images of themselves with sawed-off shotguns and are surprised when they are subsequently arrested on federal weapons charges.

Most people don't have a clue about privacy; they have even less of a clue about online privacy.

Just seeing what the anti-Prop-8 people have done out here in California (creating a mash-up with Google maps and the Prop-8 donor database) is enough to create pause in the type of information that one makes public. The question isn't whether anything you've written in your facebook profile could now be construed negatively, it's whether it could ever be construed in a non-helpful light. Either you're really boring or you lack imagination.

In general, though, anyone who thinks that Facebook owes them privacy is sadly mistaken and about to get mugged by life many times over in the decades coming.

Language (1)

Mhrmnhrm (263196) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898437)

God forbid anybody write their ToS in regular, everyday, guy-on-the-street English (or the local language of choice). If it weren't for all the legalese written by lawyers, for lawyers, that only a third lawyer could understand, this sort of crap wouldn't happen. Instead, you end up with pages and pages of babble that most people don't understand, and therefore won't bother to read. IANAL, but couldn't that be grounds to have the whole thing thrown out on the notion of "How can I competently agree to something if I don't have a law degree to understand the blasted thing?"

id Softwares screws people too now... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898587)

After 9 years running a Quake III: Arena game server i have to see now that they changed the master server to rank game servers randomly.

meh (1)

CobaltBlueDW (899284) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898607)

People don't care that facebook has their information when they sign-up and are using it, but if they were to theoretically remove their account, and their personal info wasn't removed OMG HAXZ!

If Facebook hasn't mis-used your information while you are using it, why would they mis-use it when you aren't?!

If it were in some way suspicious that they didn't automatically delete information, maybe there would be reason for concern. I just don't see that there is. A large portion of the information a person shares with Facebook is linked with other peoples personal information, so removing all of it could be problematic.

There is also precedence for this. WoW no longer deletes personal content. Many many websites with registration features don't even HAVE an un-register feature.

a rare situation (1)

binaryseraph (955557) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898643)

This is such an unusual situation where a companies TOS is causing such an uproar. I think it is a strong sign of the times and the evolution of the internet user. Were people to start reading (and being outraged at) software TOS, I wonder if the response would be the same. Further I can only hope that the power of the user causes a change to the Facebook TOS(though, I doubt it will).

Deactivating your Facebook... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898645)

Attempting to deactivate your Facebook gives you a very interesting message:

Deactivating due to change in Terms of Service

Are you deactivating because you are concerned about Facebook's Terms of Service?

This was a mistake that we have now corrected. You own the information you put on Facebook and you control what happens to it. We are sorry for the confusion.

- The Facebook Team

Sadly, if you check the ToS, nothing has really changed. Just seems they are afraid people will be leaving en masse due to this.

Protest Facebook by using Facebook! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898649)

Maybe protesting facebook by using facebook can be applied to other things.

PETA can start protesting by joining a slaughterhouse.

62,000+ (2, Informative)

absent_speaker (905145) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898679)

Wow, already past 62,000

CNN Used My Facebook Info (5, Interesting)

maj0rm0j0 (1480589) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898735)

I'm thinking this is the biggest reason for the ToS change. Rick Sanchez is on CNN every weekday between 3-4PM. Those of you that have seen his show knows that he takes questions from people on Facebook, Twitter and MySpace. I posted a question on Rick Sanchez's facebook page and was watching the show and *BAM* there is my full name, picture, and question live and full screen on CNN. The question was answered by the 3rd most powerful congressman in America. I never received any notice that they were going to post it and I've been trying for days to get a copy of the episode for my own collection. Rick won't reply to my messages and I haven't been able to get a copy going the suggested route by CNN through a company that handles purchasing episodes for them. They won't reply either... Go figure.

Re:CNN Used My Facebook Info (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898781)

Stalker...

Killed it for me (1)

DarkNinja75 (990459) | more than 5 years ago | (#26898791)

I deleted my Facebook account over this. I gave 24 hour notice to the people on my friends list and that was it.

I'm sure Facebook doesn't care (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#26898805)

What are people going to do, stop using Facebook? You and I informed users, maybe, but if Facebook only catered to people without the critical thinking skills to even care about a TOS let alone what it says, they'd lose, what, maybe 5% of their userbase? Fact is that this "fallout" doesn't even come CLOSE to the radar of the typical Facebook user. This is essentially a non-controversy.
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