Beta
×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

Wikileaks Pages Added To Australian Internet Blacklist

timothy posted more than 5 years ago | from the paging-dr-streisand-dr-streisand dept.

Censorship 437

cpudney writes "The Sydney Morning Herald reports that the Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA) has added several Wikileaks pages to its controversial blacklist. The blacklisted pages contain Denmark's list of banned websites. Simply linking to addresses in ACMA's blacklist attracts an $11,000 per-day fine as the hosts of the popular Australian broadband forum, Whirlpool, discovered last week when they published a forum post that linked to an anti-abortion web-site recently added to ACMA's blacklist. The blacklist is secret, immune to FOI requests and forms the basis of the Australian government's proposed mandatory ISP-level Internet censorship legislation. Wikileaks' response to notification of the blacklisting states: 'The first rule of censorship is that you cannot talk about censorship.'" So Australians aren't allowed to see what it is that the Danes aren't allowed to see?

Sorry! There are no comments related to the filter you selected.

Oh great, there goes slashdot (5, Funny)

hedwards (940851) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224311)

Any Australians fined yet for coming here?

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (4, Informative)

Daengbo (523424) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224381)

The fine article also states that Thailand's blocklist [wikileaks.org] has been leaked. I thought you'd want to read it for yourself in addition to the Denmark one.

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224611)

FYI, you say : "in addition to the Danish one."
instead of: "in addition to the Denmark one."

Regards
A Danish guy

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224963)

mmm...danishes...

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (5, Informative)

TapeCutter (624760) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224417)

Aussie here, it has always been my contention that Conroy was in charge of the project to drag it out and make sure it DIDN'T happen, I think they are about to sign the death certificate...

Relevent info in amoungst the links...


"The Greens and Opposition also oppose the scheme, meaning any legislation to implement it will be blocked. The Opposition has obtained legal advice that "legislation of some sort will almost certainly be required", but others have said it may be possible to implement the scheme without legislation. Speaking at a telecommunications conference last week, Senator Conroy urged Australians to have faith in MPs to pass the right legislation."

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (3, Insightful)

Mysticalfruit (533341) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224637)

Maybe you can answer a couple of questions...

1. Have they blocked SSH access out of the country? It's hard to block a tunneled connection...
2. Have they blocked TOR access?

Maybe I'm just being naive but firewalling off an entire country (noted exception: China) seems really impractical.

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (1)

TapeCutter (624760) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224755)

The last political prisoner I saw in this country was David Hicks, maybe I'm not looking hard enough for total parinoia to set in?

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (2, Informative)

SJ2000 (1128057) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224785)

They haven't actually blocked anything, big difference having a firewall setup actively filtering content and putting something on some list saying it's 'bad'.

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (3, Insightful)

goombah99 (560566) | more than 5 years ago | (#27225025)

Maybe you can answer a couple of questions...

1. Have they blocked SSH access out of the country? It's hard to block a tunneled connection...
2. Have they blocked TOR access?

Maybe I'm just being naive but firewalling off an entire country (noted exception: China) seems really impractical.

No they just banned the sites hosting the proxies and sites listing the location of proxies.

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (1)

kwandar (733439) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224721)

Doesn't Australia have a constitutional document guaranteeing freedom of speech?

If this were happening in Canada, I'd start publishing every link I could on every website I could, and ask (no, beg) for trial date, and with a jury.

I think we have some daft politicians in the Conservative Party here, but looking at Australia ... maybe we aren't as bad off as I though? Yet .....

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (5, Informative)

novakreo (598689) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224791)

Doesn't Australia have a constitutional document guaranteeing freedom of speech?

No.

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (5, Informative)

SJ2000 (1128057) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224877)

Quoting myself here:
"[...]many of Australia's rights are "implied" in the constitution and exist merely through the High Court's "creative" interpretations. Such as the implied right for Political speech in Australian Captial Television Pty Ltd v. Commonwealth (1992) which was also extended in 1994 in Theophanous v. The Herald And Weekly Times. Australia also took an active role in 1948 when drafting the United Nations Declaration of Human Rights in 1948.
Unfortunately, many attempts to introduce entrenched Human Rights into the constitution such Lionel Murphy in 1973 and 1985 with the Federal attorney-general have failed before they even reached the stage of a referendum."

http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=436328&cid=22244392 [slashdot.org]

Ironically it may turn out that my comment towards the end was a bit too quick to judge.

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (1)

DoofusOfDeath (636671) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224889)

If this were happening in Canada, I'd start publishing every link I could on every website I could, and ask (no, beg) for trial date, and with a jury.

Sorry friend, I think your boat has already sailed. [wnd.com]

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224925)

We have no constitutional rights to free speech. We do have implied protected political speech, but that's not in the constitution. In practice, however, we have free speech. In fact, I can say things like s^@$[CARRIER LOST]

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (1)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224727)

"The Greens and Opposition also oppose the scheme, meaning any legislation to implement it will be blocked."

That's reassuring to hear - and on a related note, I presume that this is due to Australia using proportional representation?

I'm in the UK, where the Government is also making moves of various kind of censorship of Internet and criminalising possession of private material - even if both other parties were to oppose a measure, the Government can just force whatever they like through, as their thirty-something per cent voting share gives them greater than 50% of seats in Parliament.

(The usual argument against PR is that it makes it harder for Governments to do things - my response is that that's a good thing.)

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224811)

Not quite. Basically, who holds government is decided by the political party in control of the lower house of parliament, the House of Representatives. In the upper house, the Senate, the Opposition (the coalition of the Liberal and National parties, that's practically acted like they're one and the same party for so long most just call them the Liberals or the coalition now) and minor parties currently hold more seats than the government, allowing them to block legislation.

Re:Oh great, there goes slashdot (4, Informative)

mrsurb (1484303) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224965)

The Australian Senate (which is where such legislation would be blocked) is semi-proportional - and Senators sit for six years (twice the length as in the House of Representatives). Which means that a party has to win elections fairly comfortably two years in a row in order to be able to push through whatever they want. And as our last (Howard) government found out, being able to push through whatever (Workchoices) they want can end in a political backlash. Australian voters don't like either party having too much power, many actually vote for third parties in the Senate precisely as a control on the system. A previously successful third party (the Australian Democrats) had an unofficial slogan, "Keeping the bastards honest."

This is terrible (1)

Chrisq (894406) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224337)

We need to find a document showing who is responsible, then put it up on wikileaks where everyone can see ..... Oh.

Happiness is Mandatory! (5, Insightful)

Leafheart (1120885) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224343)

From TFS:

Simply linking to addresses in ACMA's blacklist attracts an $11,000 per-day fine (snip) The blacklist is secret, immune to FOI requests and forms the basis of the Australian (snip)

So you receive a letter on your mailbox saying that you were fined in AUD $11,000 , for linking to a site that you didn't know you could link, and if you knew that you couldn't link to it you would be even more penalized because that information is not for your security level?

Has someone on the Aussie's Government been playing Paranoia recently?

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (5, Funny)

Chris Mattern (191822) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224361)

Has someone on the Aussie's Government been playing Paranoia recently?

What is your security clearance, citizen?

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (5, Funny)

faloi (738831) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224423)

I'm afraid if you're not ultraviolet, you can't ask that question. Can you tell me if the chainsaw looks like it's going fast enough, look closer.

I loved that game.

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224367)

fantastic google and the search engines are stuffed then

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (1)

DoofusOfDeath (636671) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224397)

So you receive a letter on your mailbox saying that you were fined in AUD $11,000 , for linking to a site that you didn't know you could link, and if you knew that you couldn't link to it you would be even more penalized because that information is not for your security level?

Doesn't the Australian court system offer its citizens some kind of protection against this?

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224455)

Nope, they're immediately detained on some manner of prison island, no questions asked.

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (4, Funny)

DoofusOfDeath (636671) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224525)

Nope, they're immediately detained on some manner of prison island, no questions asked.

Yeah, but it's also filled with lots of women with Australian accents. Please excuse me while I go find some felony to commit...

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (0, Redundant)

geordie_loz (624942) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224777)

Nope, they're immediately detained on some manner of prison island, no questions asked.

Isn't that what we brits used australia for in the first place?

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (1)

bhtooefr (649901) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224833)

*whoosh*

(Or is that just explaining the joke?)

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (5, Funny)

Shakrai (717556) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224993)

Isn't that what we brits used australia for in the first place?

And you used America to get rid of your puritans ;) Seems pretty ironic that your convicted criminals were more loyal to the Empire than your religious zealots.

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (4, Insightful)

mcvos (645701) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224625)

Simply linking to addresses in ACMA's blacklist attracts an $11,000 per-day fine (snip) The blacklist is secret, immune to FOI requests and forms the basis of the Australian (snip)

So you receive a letter on your mailbox saying that you were fined in AUD $11,000 , for linking to a site that you didn't know you could link, and if you knew that you couldn't link to it you would be even more penalized because that information is not for your security level?

This is truly bizarre. Sounds like it's a law that's designed to be accidentally broken.

I don't think it'll stand up in any court. It's just wrong on too many levels.

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (5, Informative)

psyron (1175659) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224639)

The link in question was to an anti-abortion page containing some pictures of aborted babies. Apparently a member of the forum decided to test the filter by posting a link to the page and then submitting a complaint to the ACMA asking for such a link to be banned, for the purpose of seeing what would happen.

Lo and behold someone at the ACMA must of looked at the page, seen the pictures (I'm sure you can find much worse in any medical journal mind you) and decided that linking to the page was now illegal. So they sent a notice to the forum's hosting provider (bypassing the forum all together) informing them to take the link down within 24 hours or risk being fined $11K per day. The host then contacted the forum admin who obviously didn't want to put this on his provider took down the link.

I initially thought nothing would come of this ridiculous filter idea because it was just so plain stupid and so many people, including most ISPs, are against it. But I'm not so sure anymore.

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (2, Funny)

Shikaku (1129753) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224775)

Dear god someone link them to 4chan. Or GNAA. Or Kids in the Sandbox. Or 2 girls 1 cup. Or Efuckt. Or Goatse.

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (3, Insightful)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224841)

The link in question was to an anti-abortion page

For someone who hasn't been following this too closely - were they still pretending that this was about blocking child pr0n (in which case, this shows the claim up to be false), or did they drop that pretence?

(Even if it was about blocking child images, laws about automatic fines for linking are very worrying - linking to such images can be dealt with specific laws, and it should be up to a court to decide if the image constituted an illegal image; it shouldn't be a case that linking to something on a (secret) list is automatically illegal, no matter what the content.)

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (2)

alexhs (877055) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224699)

They're preparing to replace Web2.0 by Web3.0, a.k.a TV2.0 .

Big Corp. know what's good for you and won't be bothered.

If you're not Big Corp. you had nothing to link here in the first place. You just deserve that fine, collateral damage or not.

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (1)

jank1887 (815982) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224713)

report for termination.

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (1)

Lord Ender (156273) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224715)

And what's with the FOI thing? Does Australia have a Freedom of Information Act, or did the submitter just forget that .au is not the same country as .us?

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (2, Informative)

ReadErr (25815) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224909)

Lots of countries have "freedom of information" laws. They might have different names, but the idea is the same.

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (1)

Vectronic (1221470) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224933)

Yes.

Re:Happiness is Mandatory! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224865)

Quick Google, put a link in the ACMA blacklist on every page!

That's Kafkaesque (5, Insightful)

KiloByte (825081) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224345)

Eh, what?? A $11k fine for breaking a secret law? How are you supposed to stay clear of it if you can't read the list of things you can't do?

Re:That's Kafkaesque (5, Funny)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224421)

Don't worry. No right thinking citizen would ever do anything that is on the list. What more do you need to know?

Re:That's Kafkaesque (4, Funny)

oodaloop (1229816) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224467)

I know, it's like these people read Kafka for ideas on how to F things up.

OT, but I once had a friend in the Marine Corps who had his clearance suspended due to an investigation into his supposed leaking of classified information (for which he was eventually cleared). The investigation contained Secret information, so they couldn't show him the charges that were pressed against him. We had some good laughs about Kafka, especially once it was all over.

Re:That's Kafkaesque (1)

nurb432 (527695) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224583)

Shh, its a secret what they are doing.

Re:That's Kafkaesque (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224897)

On a completely unrelated note, the new ruler of Australia has changed his name to "Mao".

And it sucks more for Australians (4, Interesting)

BadAnalogyGuy (945258) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224349)

At least in Denmark, you can drive a little ways and get your Internet uncensored.

For those unlucky souls in Australia who can't access their favorite aberrent websites don't really have any good recourse.

Re:And it sucks more for Australians (5, Funny)

Chrisq (894406) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224457)

At least in Denmark, you can drive a little ways and get your Internet uncensored.

For those unlucky souls in Australia who can't access their favorite aberrent websites don't really have any good recourse.

Wifi outside the US embasy?

Well done! (2, Insightful)

the_germ (146623) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224355)

So you can't see what pages are on the list, but if you happen to link to one you pay $11,000 per day...

Welcome to BDA - Banana Dictatorship of Australia!

Australia going fascist?! (1, Interesting)

denis-The-menace (471988) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224357)

Looks like Australia is going fascist *instead* of the USA.

Dick Cheney must be drooling at this.
This is probably one of the things he always wanted.

Re:Australia going fascist?! (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224723)

Don't worry. USA will get there in their own time.

Re:Australia going fascist?! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224737)

Most of the Anglosphere where English is still the primary language, seems to be. Great Britain, check by CCTV. United States, check. Australia, check. Fortunately Canada and NZ have yet to succumb.

The F word is not helpful (4, Interesting)

Nicolas MONNET (4727) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224845)

This has nothing to do with fascism. The problem with fascism wasn't censorship. Censorship is bad, fascism included censorship as a matter of course, but it's not what was particularly bad about fascism. Soviet Russia wasn't fascist. It was bad too, just not in the same way.
Today the United States are much closer to fascism than Australia, yet they enjoy incomparable freedom of speech.
Militarization of the economy, dubious appeals to patriotism, booming prison population, the collusion between corporate interests and government, that's fascist-ish.
Censorship, that's what you find in China, which is not nearly as bad as the US in the areas I just listed (but by no means any better overall, don't get me wrong.)

No Internet For You (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224389)

Why don't we just block Australia from the internet altogether until they learn to use it properly?

Re:No Internet For You (4, Funny)

phyrz (669413) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224409)

but but but.. urrgh... fair enough.

Good luck with that... (4, Insightful)

pla (258480) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224419)

The blacklist is secret

These guys just don't "get" it still, do they?

Step 1) Run a simple web spider that checks availability but never actually pulls content, from within Australia.
Step 2) Run the same spider in any non-censoring country.
Step 3) Compare the two lists.

Simple as that. Nothing more than a few hundred megs of shotgun-requests, and you can map the portions of the web that look dark but shouldn't.

Re:Good luck with that... (4, Insightful)

BESTouff (531293) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224703)

Step 1) Run a simple web spider that checks availability but never actually pulls content, from within Australia.
Step 2) Run the same spider in any non-censoring country.
Step 3) Compare the two lists.

You'd better be quick. The amount of non-censoring countries is drying very fast.

Re:Good luck with that... (4, Funny)

Lord Ender (156273) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224735)

Yeah, that's a great idea. All you have to do to get a copy of the blacklist is check every URL on the entire internet twice. I'll get my iPhone started on that!

Re:Good luck with that... (3, Interesting)

pla (258480) | more than 5 years ago | (#27225035)

All you have to do to get a copy of the blacklist is check every URL on the entire internet twice.

Given the choice between dealing with government bureaucracy or using a technical end-run around the same, I'll take the technical approach every time. At least it will deterministically give the desired results.

And as I mentioned, you don't need to get the whole page, just check the headers. This task would also parallelize perfectly... A few dozen people splitting the task between them could probably do it in under an hour. You could further optimize it by only checking the list of possible positives in the noncensoring-country phase.

But by all means, feel free to complain to the politicians, and see which of us gets an answer first... And which of us trusts the answer we get (if any).


Personally, I think this would make an interesting exercise for a potential link aggregation site... Run the same experiment daily from various known-censoring countries, and post them to the FP so everyone can instantly see the day's new "Big Brother disapproves of this" content. Sort of an automated Streisand effect.

Re:Good luck with that... (1)

u38cg (607297) | more than 5 years ago | (#27225073)

Not that hard. A typical spidering server only runs at about 600kB/s or so. A distributed effort in real time would not be infeasible.

Re:Good luck with that... (1)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224891)

Indeed. ISTR people doing this for China, but I'd be curious to see this sort of thing for western democracies, e.g., to see what the UK's firewall is really blocking (we all heard about Wikipedia, which they backed down on, but we only found out about that because the proxying caused a problem with accessing, and it affected a major website - how many less popular sites are having legal text inadvertently blocked, with no one knowing because all they get is a fake 404?)

Re:Good luck with that... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27225037)

The blacklist is secret
Step 1) Run a simple web spider that checks availability but never actually pulls content, from within Australia.
Step 2) Run the same spider in any non-censoring country.
Step 3) Compare the two lists.

Step 4) Profit!?!

I'm sorry, I must be new here... (4, Insightful)

wandazulu (265281) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224427)

...but when did Australia become the poster boy for blatant censorship and policies akin to fascism? I lived there for awhile back in the early 90s and it seemed like such a laid-back, friendly place where pretty much anything goes so long as it doesn't hurt anyone.

The irony of all this is I remember getting a "talking to" by a fellow in a bar who held up McCarthyism as one of America's saddest moments because it directly attacked free speech and free thought of individuals in the name of the "commie boogyman". With news like this coming out of Australia, I'm wondering if I'm going to see him again on TV in some show trial, being accused of thoughtcrime.

Actually, no, I won't, because unlike the McCarthy hearings, the ones in Australia would probably be censored.

Re:I'm sorry, I must be new here... (4, Insightful)

Em Emalb (452530) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224479)

It's as if countries in the "western" world these days are in a race to see who can remove citizen rights the fastest.

I really don't understand it. Have we really fallen so far so fast?

As always, it's just a matter of following the money and/or who has the most to gain from these measures. Find that, then you can combat it.

Re:I'm sorry, I must be new here... (5, Insightful)

Shakrai (717556) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224613)

I really don't understand it. Have we really fallen so far so fast?

This isn't a popular opinion but I think it's a natural consequence of people turning to Government for all manner of problems that Government wasn't originally intended to deal with. In the words of Thomas Jefferson: "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have"

Re:I'm sorry, I must be new here... (2, Insightful)

rpresser (610529) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224853)

It is a direct correlate to the financial meltdown: it is a political meltdown. The political class has become too powerful, too insular, too overconfident, and too stupid. And just like the financial crisis, this is a worldwide phenonmenon, ranging from the Taliban to the Australians to the Danes. There is no escape.

But if there is hope, it lies in the proles.

Re:I'm sorry, I must be new here... (1)

Blue Stone (582566) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224629)

I don't know a great deal about Australia or its political system, but isn't the prevailing view that the Australian people *are* laid back and pretty decent people, but their politicians are a bunch of scumbag fucknuts? (I know ... that last part could apply anywhere.)

I saw a documentary about small scale (I think, local) Australian politics several years ago - fly-on-the-wall style - and the stuff they got up to was remarkable: lying, back-stabbing little bastards - you wouldn't dream of buying a second-hand car from any of them.

Re:I'm sorry, I must be new here... (1)

Lord Ender (156273) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224757)

You know that guy who owns Fox News? Australian.

Media is the most powerful branch of government.

Re:I'm sorry, I must be new here... (2, Insightful)

Shakrai (717556) | more than 5 years ago | (#27225089)

Media is the most powerful branch of government.

Only because a bunch of "progressives" got the bright idea that we needed more "democracy". The Founding Fathers rightly feared the power of the mob and took steps to mitigate how much damage it could do. If you want to limit the influence of the media let's start by repealing the 17th amendment and flogging those that want to get rid of the electoral college.

The progressive criminalisation of conservatism (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224433)

It's funny how many views that used to be considered within the realm of "opinions that humans were legitimately entitled to have" have progressively been moved to the category of "illegitimate opinions which must be repressed and punished". Typically by progressive governments and pressure groups.

Re:The progressive criminalisation of conservatism (3, Insightful)

benjfowler (239527) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224767)

I think you'll find that people with the most problems with freedom of expression are the right-wing (and extremely conservative) Catholics like Stephen Conroy and Nicola Roxon. The people doing the oppressing here are the conservatives and their enablers, not the small-l liberals.

It's all child pornography. (2, Insightful)

tjstork (137384) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224441)

The vast majority of the list looks like kiddie porn sites or links to kiddie porn sights. You know, teenagers and younger being exploited.

Frankly, the Danes and the Australians are doing the "liberal" thing in trying to block these sites. If they block everyone, they reason, the sites will go out of business and the exploitation will stop. That's admirable.

But... since I'm an American.... I would rather let the people go to these sites, determine who is getting their jollies off looking at this stuff, and then let's round up all these sick f--- people and kill them.

Re:It's all child pornography. (4, Insightful)

Shakrai (717556) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224527)

If they block everyone, they reason, the sites will go out of business and the exploitation will stop. That's admirable.

And if we outlaw drugs, people still stop using them and drug abuse will stop. That's admirable.

But... since I'm an American.... I would rather let the people go to these sites, determine who is getting their jollies off looking at this stuff, and then let's round up all these sick f--- people and kill them.

That thought has occurred to me as well. Why block these sites when you could presumably get warrants to see who is going to them and actually investigate the people breaking the law instead of trying to impose a censorship scheme that will never work anyway?

Re:It's all child pornography. (5, Insightful)

__int64 (811345) | more than 5 years ago | (#27225041)

Because it's not actually about stopping childporn, it's about imposing censorship. Whether childporn is weeded out is irrelevant, and these filters don't actually have be effective at stopping childporn to be effective at making people complacent.

Re:It's all child pornography. (2)

denis-The-menace (471988) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224571)

With laws like this the pedos will realize that they need to move on to something more secure than open HTTP.

This way the kids and politicians alike will not be able to see the stuff; just like it was before the Internet took off. Politicians will then be able to back to the way they used to handle this problem: http://www.dilbert.com/fast/2009-03-15/ [dilbert.com] (focus on the last pane)

Re:It's all child pornography. (1)

davegravy (1019182) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224597)

If they block everyone, they reason, the sites will go out of business and the exploitation will stop. That's admirable.

Admirable? If they nuke the entire country the exploitation will also stop. Such policies often have unintended consequences that must be considered.

Re:It's all child pornography. (5, Insightful)

flaming error (1041742) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224739)

> The vast majority of the list looks like kiddie porn sites
Please post ACMA's blacklist so we can verify.

Re:It's all child pornography. (1, Insightful)

sd.fhasldff (833645) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224803)

Frankly, the Danes and the Australians are doing the "liberal" thing in trying to block these sites.

This must be the American "liberalism is just another word for communism" version of the word "liberal".

Re:It's all child pornography. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224869)

1. If they block everyone
2. the sites will go out of business
3. and the exploitation will stop.

Comments:

1. Blocking would reduce the number of people who can very easily access material. One would however assume that kiddy porn sharers are marginally more sophisticated in their surfing than the average user and is hence less affected. Actually, scratch that, any conceivable channel that is already used to provide obfuscation/security would obviously be completely unaffected.

I am however sure that the vast number of people who randomly get a desire for kiddy porn and Google 'Kiddy porn pictures videos' from their home computer would be crushingly discouraged by the message that the material has been blocked.

2. Sites don't charge money and hence cannot "go out of business". Actually, the fewer users, the lower the costs of running will be.

3. People have been abusing kids since the dawn of time. It's highly unlikely that the act of making it slightly harder to visit a collection of websites will change this in any way.

Re:It's all child pornography. (2, Interesting)

ketilwaa (1095727) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224903)

Y'know, even if people are serving prison sentences, or in serious therapy, there is still the matter of the kids in those pictures and movies. The idea that users are investigated for using the sites, doesn't even begin to solve the problem of those kids being violated.

I'm an American too, but I say: come up with some better ideas. Starting with doing away with the taboos about sex in general might be a step in the right decision. The American idea that violence is pretty much OK, but sex is not to be talked about, and naked bodies should be considered racy or disturbing is such a perversion. A natural relationship towards sex could start with breaking down the structural homophobia that is still widely accepted.

Re:It's all child pornography. (2, Insightful)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224945)

By "all", you mean "all cases except where it's something else instead, such as an anti-abortion site".

This is a usage of "all" I was not previously aware of.

(But yes, I agree with your last paragraph; it's unclear what the intent of censorship is, and the problem is when the scope widens beyond that of abusive non-consensual material.)

Actually... (5, Interesting)

acehole (174372) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224491)

The anti-abortion website was purposely reported to ACMA (the gov dept looking after the censorship) to test the waters in reporting websites.

All it took was one email.

How dare you link to things we won't tell you (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224495)

So you're not allowed to know what's on the banned list, but if you link to anything on the banned list they fine you?

They should blacklist Slashdot. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224549)

That way we won't have those idiots posting their stupidity anymore.

Western Countries: Pot calling the kettle black (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224573)

Your no better than china, your no better than iran. Stop invading other countries and start having fixing your own problems.

dear all australians: (5, Insightful)

circletimessquare (444983) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224575)

welcome to what it feels like being an american during the bush administration. pariah, object of scorn and derision. you do realize what a joke this makes your country look like right?

1. sites blocked not for pornography, but ideological reasons
2. harsh punitive financial punishments just for linking
3. secret lists you, as a common citizen, don't have the right to see

i now think of australia the way i do iran and china in terms of freedom of expression. you better clean this disgrace up, you blokes can't let this continue, it is an embarassment

Catholics (4, Interesting)

benjfowler (239527) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224645)

By far the nastiest and most insidious threat to democracy in Australia is the Catholic far Right. Their home has traditionally been the "right" of the ALP, although some Catholic militants, like Tony Abbott have gone joined the opposition conservative parties.

In years past, they've played mostly a spoiling role in Australia politics. As fascists, they know only how to destroy, not build, so they formed a right-wing fringe political party (the Democratic Labour Party, which in Whitlam's immortal words, was neither democratic, nor liberal, nor a party) kept the ALP out of government for 25 years and the country stagnated for decades under a conservative government. After B. A. Santamaria died and after the fall of Communism, they went back to infiltrating mainstream political parties.

These days, their strongholds are right-wing unions (the SDA , of which I was a member -- if I had known my union dues were being siphoned off by Phalangists and militant anti-abortionists, I would've quit instantly...), and the right wings of the ALP and Liberal parties.

Democracy and rational debate has always been anathema for these fascists. Their malign and destructive influence has been out there for all to see, although there has been very few political forces organised enough to challenge them head on.

If there's a vicious anti-democratic force in Australian politics, chances are, militant right-wing Catholics are behind it.

Slope (3, Insightful)

olddotter (638430) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224663)

Hopefully this will not come to be in Australia or not be up held upon legal review. Two things I find are disturbing:

1) You will be held accounting for violating the law, but you can't see the law to know how to avoid violating it.

2) All of western democracies have shown a sharp turn towards the police state in the last decade. Something they all used to stand up against and accuse non-democracies of being evil for the same polocies.
   

This makes me angry and sad (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224695)

I am watching my country turn into a fascist police state before my eyes.

Government Knows What's Best For You. Shutup, do your shitty little job, pay your taxes, and be thankful we haven't shipped you off to gitmo yet. Sit back and enjoy the pre-approved content and advertising.

I honestly don't know what to do anymore. These fuckwits are ruining the planet and there's nobody to stop them.

If you stand up against them, you're a child pornographer or a terrorist. Not that that even matters anyway, since they have billions and billions of dollars with which you can never compete, and an army that makes the idea of uprising or revolt laughable, especially given the fact that most of the population is not armed.

200 years ago, some american dudes got pissed at the way the Brits were doing things. Good for them, they just moved to another country and started over.

What the fuck can we do? That option is off the table. We can move to a different country, but all countries are heading in the same direction pretty much. We are stuck here under an oppressive government with no hope for improvement, no possibility of living somewhere that truly values freedom.

If the bill gets voted down this time, it's only a matter of horse trading or another election cycle until some other knows-whats-best-for-you little bitch comes in and puts it up for another vote. Eventually, it will get through.

I'm looking for options. I want to know what we can do to crush these corrupt fucking assholes before they destroy us all.

We are stuck here (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224951)

"We are stuck here"
I hear the Moon and Mars are currently unoccupied (by humans).
Then there is the 'build your own floating country' idea that goes around ever few years.
Freedom is yours, choice is not an option.

No problem... (3, Informative)

expat.iain (1337021) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224717)

It's simple enough to proxy through SSH [suominen.com] and have access once again and (short of blocking SSH traffic) the Though Police can do very little.

Iain.

Re:No problem... (1)

rpresser (610529) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224907)

It's equally simple enough to block ssh and remove access again. Like spandex, the Internet is a privilege, not a right.

Re:No problem... (1)

Locklin (1074657) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224983)

Great. That works for the 1% of people with the necessary knowledge and skills, or people with the motives and money to pay someone to do it (criminals). What about the other 21,510,000 non-criminal, non-/. reading Australians?

Fud, Fud, Fud (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224743)

If you look in the original Whirlpool thread where someone posted their submitted complaint about Wikileaks site (As a test to see if they would block it) the response they posted is an automated reply to all online ACMA complaints. http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1158941&p=44#r873 [whirlpool.net.au]
This whole thing is fud.

Re:Fud, Fud, Fud (3, Informative)

the_germ (146623) | more than 5 years ago | (#27225047)

Maybe you should read the whole post you linked to...

It's not FUD, sadly...

CP! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224839)

CP CP CP CP CP CP CP!

Surprised? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27224923)

I've love know exactly who it is that's surprised by this. Most likely it's the Chris Hanson Dateline NBC To Catch a Predator watching, soccer mom crowd.

Where is the (1)

barncha (1432683) | more than 5 years ago | (#27224989)

Link?

netnuterality (3, Insightful)

drknowster (946686) | more than 5 years ago | (#27225053)

do we realy need these people around claiming to represent a consensus ? we have the technology,but we gotta do it "before" they have thier way with it .The best bumper sticker seen yet"politicians and diapers should be changed often ,and for the same reasons."
Load More Comments
Slashdot Login

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?