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iPhone Jailbreaking Still Going Strong

samzenpus posted more than 5 years ago | from the don't-touch-the-apples dept.

Handhelds 166

snydeq writes "Despite the productivity promises of Apple's forthcoming 3.0 firmware update, jailbreaking should continue to push the iPhone's productivity envelope, as users increasingly demand the Holy Grail of smartphone power use: applications that run in the background, InfoWorld reports. Copy and paste, video recording and streaming, Internet tethering, and content search are just a few of the features over which iPhone users have sought to jailbreak their devices — a practice Apple itself has done little to crack down on. Jailbreak apps circumvent hardware and software restrictions that Apple says ensure a consistent, responsive user interface and optimal battery endurance. In particular, jailbroken phones can run apps in the background, a capability Apple reserves for its own apps but prohibits in third-party programs. Jay Freeman, creator of the Cydia iPhone installer and Cydia Store, however, believes a free-market approach is the best way to satisfy power users' demands for features without compromising the performance of their iPhones. And given Apple's App Store overcrowding, it seems likely that jailbroken phones and app venues like Cydia Store will continue to be popular with iPhone customers and developers, even after the 3.0 firmware ships."

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Other 'nothing changed lately' news (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561367)

Google still a good option for search.

Vista sales not picking up much.

ipod is a popular choice of mp3 player.

In surprise development, dog doesn't bite man.

Jailbreaking will continue (5, Insightful)

WatcherWatching (1521565) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561373)

Yes, and why should it not? It is similar to the how users run Mac OS on non-apple computers. If users want to do something, they should be allowed too! Consistency of user interface is no excuse, because it wouldn't even affect users with non-jailbroke phones. Apple just likes to control what users see and do, and jailbreaking is just evidence that some people don't like being told what to do!

Re:Jailbreaking will continue (1)

xenolion (1371363) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561917)

If i buy the hardware I should be able to use what i want on it as long as I don't disrupt the cell network. I feel this way about a lot of hardware with built in firmware that wont let a person that want to play with it at your own risk do so.

Apple suck (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561375)

...and here's why: Some company makes this [macnn.com] , but you can't listen to music while using it. What a shame, what a waste. But they figured that if somebody is dumb enough to buy an iPhone then they're dumb enough to spend the dough on a fancy accessory that they believe they need to workout.

Re:Apple suck (2, Informative)

dgatwood (11270) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562579)

Unless their app is inefficient in its use of CPU power or RAM, you're almost certainly wrong about that. The iPod functionality of an iPhone can and does run in the background. Just start the music playing, then run the app. You can even control the iPod functionality while running other apps by clicking the headphone control once to pause, twice to skip to the next song, or three times to skip back to the previous song.

Re:Apple suck (1)

RyuuzakiTetsuya (195424) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562887)

double click the [] button on the bottom of the iPhone/iPod Touch to also bring up a neat little popup giving you some rudimentary controls for the iPod app itself too.

Re:Apple suck (2, Funny)

MrEricSir (398214) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562793)

So you want to listen to music while you send text messages and talk on the phone? That sounds like a car accident waiting to happen.

Re:Apple suck (1)

grolaw (670747) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563217)

Not exactly, but recording a deposition while listening to a few tunes (second chairing) and sending text to the office about the depo.

Not to mention... (3, Informative)

something_wicked_thi (918168) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561403)

You have to first jailbreak the phone if you want to unlock it. But I recently switched to Google Android so I don't have to deal with this. It's a less nice experience, but I imagine a lot of people who are willing to go through the trouble of jailbreaking a phone are also willing to put up with the less polished UI.

Re:Not to mention... (3, Insightful)

BitZtream (692029) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561715)

Why? When you can just jailbreak and have the polished UI?

Re:Not to mention... (3, Insightful)

TheRaven64 (641858) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562897)

Because then you're getting an unsupported product, which takes away a lot of the attraction of something like an iPhone, and because you're supporting a company that believes that control of the device belongs to them, not the customer.

Re:Not to mention... (1)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563899)

Why? When you can have the polished UI without jailbreaking?

[Plenty of phones have polished UIs. If you disagree, the burden is upon you to provide evidence and objective examples of how the Iphone's UI is better than all other UIs, rather than simply making assertions. Since when has a mere assertion been insightful? Oh right, that's moderation on Apple stories for you.]

Re:Not to mention... (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561909)

jailbreaking (in windows) requires about 5 clicks from an installshield type application. That's it. Jailbroken, done.

All your purchased apps (and free apps from the Apple store) still work just fine. The UI is still the same (if you want it to be the same). Just two new icons (to let you download non-Applestore apps).

I'm not sure what you mean by "go through all the trouble of jailbreaking"

Re:Not to mention... (0, Troll)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563971)

jailbreaking (in windows) requires about 5 clicks from an installshield type application.

Apple, it Works, Just!

I just switched my phone on and used it. It Just Works. What is this Windows thing you speak of? - we're talking phones, not PCs.

Re:Not to mention... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27564183)

Are you retarded?

People (like GP) complain that the iPhone locks them in and that jailbreaking is too hard or difficult. I show that it is not.

BTW, did you have to install any software on your computer to sync with your phone? If so, you spent as much time on a computer getting your lovely phone all gussied up and ready to go as I, and many like me, spent in getting my iPhone jailbroken...Perhaps more, given the shoddiness of many phone manufacturers' software offerings (see, they -- like you -- don't really 'get it' that a modern phone should be coupled with a modern user's computer). Apple, BTW, gets that.

We're talking phones here, BTW. Modern phones are often integrated/synced with modern computers that often run the Windows operating system. Or do you just hate Apple and Microsoft so much you have to blather like an idiot?

Re:Not to mention... (4, Insightful)

clarkkent09 (1104833) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562297)

Polished UI on a phone is worth something though. It's nice to have a phone that does fewer things but it's a pleasure to use. Like any phone, it's too small to do any serious work with, and the things I, and I dare say most other people, use it for the most often - email, sms, gps, internet (quick lookups, too small for anything else), ipod and (gasp) making phone calls - it does incredibly well, far better than any other phone I know of.

Yes, cut and paste and one or two other things are sorely missed, but honestly all these other features people are asking for just make me worried if the future versions will have the clean and beautiful interface like the last one. "Power users", while the most vocal, tend to be a small part of the market. Hope Apple keep their head and not trip over themselves trying to please that segment of the market and make the product cluttered, ugly and crash prone like all the other "smart" phones out there.

Re:Not to mention... (1)

WiredNut (1287460) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562451)

I agree it does most of those things you mention quite well for me...(I love the email, gps, and facebook app) with the exception of phone calls...I get some seriously buggy behaviour with the phone calls...incoming calls that ring but don't display the answer button; calls that upon ending, seem to completely lock the phone for 5 minutes with a black screen, can't even restart the damn thing; calls that never ring. The phone is the buggiest piece of crap I've used...I'm about one call away from scrapping it. As much as I need to see my FB status updates I really need the thing to send and receive phone calls reliably. Anyone else have this or solve it via jailbroking? (sic)

Re:Not to mention... (1)

amori (1424659) | more than 5 years ago | (#27564121)

Reading this article I somehow recalled the 'good old days' with the Palm Vx. I suspect it might have something to do with the Palm Vx thumbnail Slashdot utilizes. IMHO the Palm Vx had an elegant and simple user interface for the 90's. It had an appstore (one from Palm, another from Handango and so on), and interestingly enough (although the Vx was not a phone) users did not have to 'jailbreak' the device. Am I the only one feeling nostalgic ?

Must not be a programmer (4, Insightful)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562571)

You have to first jailbreak the phone if you want to unlock it. But I recently switched to Google Android so I don't have to deal with this. It's a less nice experience, but I imagine a lot of people who are willing to go through the trouble of jailbreaking a phone are also willing to put up with the less polished UI.

Given that Jailbreaking is essentially an O(1) operation over the life of the device, and day to day use is O(n), I'll take the better UI thanks!!

On Android you also still have to deal with hunting down apps not approved for the store, just like looking at Cydia apps on the iPhone...

Re:Must not be a programmer (1)

GigsVT (208848) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562983)

What is the big O notation for dealing with and supporting a company that is actively hostile toward their users?

Re:Must not be a programmer (3, Funny)

chartreuse (16508) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563285)

Goatse.

Re:Must not be a programmer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27563361)

Apple's O face as it gives you a good rogering?

Re:Must not be a programmer (1)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563991)

Why choose between two inferior alternatives? I'll take phones with good UIs, and that don't require jailbreaking to just work.

I don't know if it's true that Android has a poorer UI than the Iphone (a poorer UI than one that doesn't even support copy and paste? That is bad), but even if that was true, these are only two phones, that are both niche players in a large market. For some reason, we never hear about any of the other phones here though.

infoworld needs to lose the ego (5, Funny)

Red Flayer (890720) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561419)

"Despite the productivity promises of Apple's forthcoming 3.0 firmware update, jailbreaking should continue to push the iPhone's productivity envelope, as users increasingly demand the Holy Grail of smartphone power use: applications that run in the background, InfoWorld reports.

Seriously? The two items that comprise the Holy Grail of smartphone power use are background apps and Infoworld reports?

Just look at the source of the TFA -- it's Infoworld themselves! Methinks they have a slightly overdeveloped sense of self-worth.

Also, I'm not sure why I would need to jailbreak my iPhone to access Infoworld, they must have some serious issues in their web design department.

Re:infoworld needs to lose the ego (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561559)

I'm amazed this is marked as insightful - it's the funniest comment I've read in this thread. Don't know what you were aiming for, but I chuckled.

Re:infoworld needs to lose the ego (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27562241)

"Funny" = no karma boost
"Insightful" = karma boost

Common courtesy dictates that funny people be rewarded (or made to wear funny shoes).

Re:infoworld needs to lose the ego (0, Offtopic)

oGMo (379) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561593)

I would sortof find this amusing but the grammar is wrong; for two items, you use only "and" with no comma. Of course, given slashdot's excellent track record for precision grammar...

Re:infoworld needs to lose the ego (1)

SeePage87 (923251) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562211)

I'm guessing you've never read a newspaper headline. Using just a comma is a pretty common convention and any linguist will tell you that something is "proper" grammar so long as the reader understands it.

Re:infoworld needs to lose the ego (1)

Red Flayer (890720) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562521)

Please check the style handbooks; use of "and" without a comma is generally preferred when enumerating a list of only two items.

Use of "and" with a comma is preferable for the last item of a list whose elements are separated by commas.

And speaking of precision grammar, how about the use of "sortof"?

But, in the end it doesn't matter, this is the internet, for Christ's sake. No one misunderstood my post, or yours, because of grammatical errors or inconsistencies.

Re:infoworld needs to lose the ego (2, Funny)

TheRaven64 (641858) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562953)

Use of "and" with a comma is preferable for the last item of a list whose elements are separated by commas.

This is only true when you are using the Oxford rules (adopted by most of the USA). In other areas, the last comma is omitted.

And speaking of precision grammar, how about the use of "sortof"?

Maybe he's a C programmer?

Re:infoworld needs to lose the ego (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27563413)

It's fully acceptable to use ", and" if you're finishing off what would normally be a bullet point list.

"Bla bla have announced software XYZ which features random gobbledygook, spontaneous jibberish and automagic decalibration, and is expected to release it around foovember".

Re:infoworld needs to lose the ego (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27562697)

Methinks yr grammer needs some werk.

"...as users increasingly demand the Holy Grail of smartphone power use: applications that run in the background, InfoWorld reports."

otherwise stated: Infoworld reports that users increasingly demand the Holy Grail of smartphone power use: applications that run in the background.

That is, they are reporting on the desire for the one previously stated function.

Be sure you understand the argument 'afore ya throw yrself in the fray.
Cheers. XD

Re:infoworld needs to lose the ego (3, Funny)

Gnavpot (708731) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562999)

Be sure you understand the argument 'afore ya throw yrself in the fray.

I want a "-1 Whoosh" moderation option.

Or perhaps it should be +1 so posts like yours are put on display for everyone to laugh at...

Work-arounds for the iPhone: bricking it made ez (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561429)

My wife once took a position at Apple. It was...interesting. The boss was one of three brothers (all tow-headed and just as gay as can be), and he'd been chosen to do the accounting and such, despite not actually wanting to do it, so he paid little attention. He kept the computer and software manuals in his office, which was frequently locked.

The person who set the system up was a nice guy, technically competent, but lacking real-world experience. His name was Rob Malda. He set the system up with as much high-tech stuff as he could (including a main system with an Intel 80186 - this was some time ago), and left to go to school somewhere a thousand miles away or more, with no way of contacting him except Ouija board running at a blistering 4Mhz.

This included setting up the big 40M disk on the main computer. Now, in those days, MS-DOS couldn't handle a disk larger than 32M, so he partitioned it into two, using software he had available, and didn't include as part of the package he left behind.

Therefore, when the disk drive caught fire, with flames coming out of it (probably from filings or metallic dust from the skate-sharpening machine in the next room), nobody knew how to restore the system.

They floundered around for a bit, but my wife wound up leaving, so I never did find out what they did to get going again. I forget how the story ends...but at least now her iPhone is unlocked. Assholes.

AIDS (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561455)

I predict the next great STD will come out of the rampant homosexuality associated with Apple products.

God hates the faggot computer.

Poor, poor dears. (5, Funny)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561467)

They know not what they do, tinkering with the perfection of Jobs' vision. Apple will have to work even harder to cryptographically protect them from evil...

Why I passed up the chance to work at Apple (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561875)

Only recently was all of this "this being the chance to work at Apple" laid to rest, ending several months of talks and bringing a close to the toughest challenge, by far, of my career to date. Following is an account of how it started, and yes, how it ended.

For years I've literally dreamed of working at Apple. Grinding my life away like a digital serf. Who hasn't? For a designer, its the holy grail of aesthetic accolade. Through a series of related events, a recruiter at Apple contacted a certain high-level person *cough* Woz *cough* in the industry. This person then asked me if I wanted my name in the collective applicant hat, which eventually produced a call from Woz himself. The timing couldn't have been better given the position they were looking to fill.

And what was the position for, you ask? Well, to protect Apples and Oranges right to secrecy, I wont disclose too many details. But suffice it say I would have been managing the design of a certain place within their site where they showcase a lot of product for newer stuff where the make widgets and then showcase product.

The Interviews

Officious little prick. On the heels of a few successful phone conversations, I was flown out on a cold November evening. Interviews with several members of the team were to be held the next morning. And yet here I was in a lush hotel room, almost pinching myself to be certain this was really happening. Am I really here in Cupertino? With my gay lover Rob Malda? Am I really about to interview with Apple tomorrow? No way. Yes way. No way.

The following morning I endured 6.5 hours " yes, I said 6.5 hours " of interviews. Straight through. Even lunch was an interview. The only breaks I enjoyed were spent in the mens room with my lover CmdTaco enjoying a commode taco.

Interviewing with several members on a team isn't unusual these days, especially at the likes of Google, Yahoo, and a host of other tech companies. Needless to say, however, fielding questions and selling yourself for nearly a full day is quite exhausting. But I thoroughly enjoyed it, and the team members were both fascinating and brilliant. Two of the designers I would have been working closely with were particularly savvy.

The interviews concluded, I returned home, and in the ensuing weeks Suzanne and I discussed it at length. And I mean at length. The pros. The cons. The once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. The sacrifices.

Let it be said that the chance to work at Apple, the prestige that comes from doing so, and the challenge of working with a highly talented team was undeniably attractive. But regrettably, it was the other parts of the equation that werent, well, quite as attractive.

Weighing Pros and Cons

Amidst a veritable sea of pros and cons, two factors weighed heavily on the decision we'd end up making: cost of living and flexibility of schedule. And my gay lover, Rob Malda's future living with us as a eunuch slave.

Having grown up in the Bay Area and still in touch with family and friends, it came as no surprise that housing is quite affordable. One can talk all day about the economics of supply and demand and how the market is merely working towards equilibrium, but when the same humble home I have now in Utah is priced at 1/5th that of the cost in Cupertino " nearly a million dollar home " I'm left only to wonder where the buck will stop. Or in this case, where it doesn't.

Further, housing in the area isn't kind to a 60-member family. Being a sole provider of income for that same 6-member family isn't a kind proposal either. On top of all this, we were considering scenarios which reduced commute time, limiting ourselves to homes closer to Apple headquarters, and therefore driving the overall cost of living even higher.

But enough about money. How about the intangible pros and cons? Flexibility of schedule? Time with family? Freedom to speak at conferences, author articles, and the like on the clock instead of off?

Knowing Id have to dedicate myself 100% at Apple, this would have resulted in nearly a total reduction in blogging, conference speaking, and the like. I did the work-a-long-day-go-home-to-hours-of-side-work thing for years before going solo, and the daily grind took its toll on me physically and mentally. And the family, too. Needless to say, I've only started robbing hours from the wife and kids.

While work is going quite well and showing no signs of slowing, I don't know that Ill bring in more revenue freelancing this year than I would have at Apple. But increased time to be with family, pursue hobbies, and live a life a bit less hectic isn't exactly something you can pin a dollar amount to.

Don't get me wrong "Suzanne and I both agreed at the outset of making the leap to full-time freelancing that wed probably be back on the clock at some point. It seems inevitable and probably welcomed if the right opportunity comes along. But we felt it was too early to resume a corporate lifestyle right now.

The Decision

The final decision? Well, its obvious at this point, don't you think? You probably wont see me gracing the streets of Cupertino tomorrow or even dining with Paul Nixon or Dunstan Orchard or doing the cha-cha with Steve Jobs.

Also, its only fair to state that there was never even the glimpse of a formal offer on the table. Never. But its probably safe to say that was because we couldn't come to an agreement on a few key terms of the deal, most notably those mentioned here. Call it a parting of ways that occurred just a couple of weeks ago.

Funny thing is, I'm still not 100% certain I made the right decision by not making myself more available. I mean, my wife is a whore and the kids all have Down's. I don't know that Ill ever be the same. Yet Suzanne and I said the very same thing back when we made the leap to full-time self-employment, and somehow it turned out to prove we were wiser than we thought.

Thus, with fingers crossed, I suppose all I can say is this: Here's to low cost of living and flexibility of schedule and being married to a right-high ridding, made in the USA, dyed-in-the-wool bitch. Which is Lating for gen-o-ros-ity.

Other Than "War-Driving"... (1, Offtopic)

RobotRunAmok (595286) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561501)

...is there a more stupid faux-tech-neo-nerd-speak expression than "Jailbroken?"

Re:Other Than "War-Driving"... (4, Funny)

GuldKalle (1065310) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561617)

How about "faux-tech-neo-nerd-speak"?

Re:Other Than "War-Driving"... (1)

Culture20 (968837) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561695)

Perhaps you would prefer "chrootbroked?"

Re:Other Than "War-Driving"... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561997)

...is there a more stupid faux-tech-neo-nerd-speak expression than "Jailbroken?"

Jailbroken is a legitimate term, because it has been freed from the unix "Jail", also a legitimate term.

Re:Other Than "War-Driving"... (4, Informative)

GNUbuntu (1528599) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563399)

Except it's not a faux tech expression. It comes from breaking out of a chroot jail. Lern2Unix plox.

isn't it against the EULA? (3, Informative)

alen (225700) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561511)

i swear there was a story last month how Apple had it in the newest SDK EULA that you can't make jailbroken apps with it. Apple gave up a technical solution and just told people that if you want to write jailbroken apps then do it from scratch and don't use their code

Re:isn't it against the EULA? (0, Troll)

Hurricane78 (562437) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561823)

So?

I will end this thread with the notion, how in Nazi Germany, it was "against the EULA", to be Jewish, too.

So?

Re:isn't it against the EULA? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27562613)

Yeah, because all EULAs are fair and completely enforceable.

3rd party in background means malware... (4, Interesting)

bwcbwc (601780) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561583)

Apple's prohibition on 3rd party software running in background is probably the best line of defense against spyware infecting the average idiot/user's phone. Once you let un-vetted apps run in the background, you create the opportunity for keyloggers, spam software and all the other fun stuff that runs on PCs to infect the iPhone without the user even being aware. Plus you end up going down the path of requiring anti-virus and security software to run on the phone all the time, reducing the battery life. What's basically going on is that no one is willing to pay the costs that would be required to develop a "trusted application" framework where Apple could test and approve 3rd party apps. Plus, there's always the paranoia factor that someone's great idea would get stolen as part of the approval process.

But given the state of windoze computing these days, I'd say Apple's approach has to be viewed more as a security feature than an anti-competitive fair trade violation.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (4, Insightful)

Sir_Lewk (967686) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561703)

Yes, that's right. You are being restricted for your own good!

It must be nice to be so naive...

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1, Insightful)

alen (225700) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561847)

if your PC is infected no one cares. if your cell phone gets infected by a virus and you can't call 911 in an emergency than Apple is going to pay out a lot of money in a lawsuit.

Android and WinMo are getting app stores. lets see what happens in 12-24 months with those platforms.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (5, Insightful)

Sir_Lewk (967686) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561921)

Windows Mobile devices have had applications running in the background for ages and there have not been outbreaks of infections preventing people from dialing 911. Android phones are also very open and lack such absurd restrictions.

Enough with the strawmen arguements and just come to grips with the fact that sometimes Apple puts their business interests before the consumer.

Translation (0)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562519)

Windows Mobile devices have had applications running in the background for ages and there have not been outbreaks of infections preventing people from dialing 911.

So what you are saying here is, that computer makers should not be concerned about security until there is a problem.

GIven the nascent field that is mobile computing, of course there are not going to be many attacks yet. But that does not mean there will not be, and that they will have to be addressed. It's better to consider what that means ahead of time rather than when the storm hits.

I fully agree that the primary reason for Apple maintaining this restriction is business interests. But I fully disagree on what the interests may be, to my mind they are focused on device performance and this restriction is all about battery life rather than even security.

I think Apple can be cautious in opening features for devices and that can be frustrating, but history has shown us that caution may be advised in areas where you have large masses of networked devices and so I do not fault them for it.

In the end I don't see this as a big deal, if you truly care you can simply jailbreak the phone. The restriction as I see it is really only for the users that don't really need it anyway...

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (5, Informative)

langelgjm (860756) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561987)

if your PC is infected no one cares. if your cell phone gets infected by a virus and you can't call 911 in an emergency than Apple is going to pay out a lot of money in a lawsuit.

I highly doubt that. Someone might try to sue, but I guarantee that every cell contract you sign has some clause saying they don't guarantee 24/7 access, access may be interrupted unexpectedly for any reason, etc. Otherwise people would be suing just for a regular network outage.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561877)

9 out of 10 users wont care it's only the tech weenies who see it that way and frankly you are not the target audience.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561999)

You're right, only metally disabled people would ever buy mac shit.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27562575)

I posit that whether a user is sophisticated enough to jailbreak their iPhone is a good test for whether or not they're sophisticated enough to run an iPhone with third-party background apps. You don't have to be a genius to have an iPhone with multiple apps running, but you need to be able to tell which apps are irresponsible with the limited resources.

If Apple ever opened up this pandora's box on the App Store, you can bet that complaints about the iPhones performance would skyrocket. The low effort of the iPhone app market combined with it being a communications device would make for a lot of apps doing a lot of essentially unnecessary polling. A user with a lot of apps would likely see performance die by a thousand cuts and most users wouldn't have any idea what was happening.

There is something to be said for simplicity and the efficiencies it brings.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

eleuthero (812560) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562827)

I haven't jailbroken my phone yet because of security concerns. While I would enjoy being able to tether and record video (the only two things I am mildly interested in apart from what's already available), it doesn't make sense to me to go beyond a trusted system and potentially open all the financial apps I run to spyware (etc.)

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

PrescriptionWarning (932687) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561765)

then explain how the music player runs in the background while you surf the net and use other apps, so my bet is that it would not be a reliable way to prevent a virus from running in the background. They're basically relying on their ability to control apps from the app store and their SDK limitations to prevent malware from popping in.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (2, Informative)

alen (225700) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561873)

The phone, ipod, email and Safari apps that run in the background are Apple apps. Apple can make background apps, no one else.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27562121)

Actually, no. With Cydia it is trivially easy to setup standard unix background tasks launched via launchd. A little bit of terminal hacking and you'll get the idea.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

GNUbuntu (1528599) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563459)

Except the GP was referring to apps created to sell on the App Store. Only Apple can make apps that run in the background and can be sold on the App Store. That was the point they were trying to make, not that it was impossible to make an app run in the background unless you were Apple.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

Culture20 (968837) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561901)

then explain how the music player runs in the background while you surf the net and use other apps,

From the GP

Once you let un-vetted apps run in the background,

From the OP

jailbroken phones can run apps in the background, a capability Apple reserves for its own apps but prohibits in third-party programs.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (2, Insightful)

h4rr4r (612664) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561767)

Whenever you get into that situation, someone else vetting the apps, you no longer own the device. They own it and you just rent it.

Once they decide not to bother with the app store or with vetting new apps you are stuck with a dead device. If jobs decides tomorrow that the iphone is too big and only the new iphone-nano will be sold and as such the appstore for the now old device is to be closed, you are boned. You will be holding a $200 paperweight.

Do you really want to pay for a device you don't own? Do you really want something you can't use as you see fit?

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561849)

If jobs decides tomorrow that the iphone is too big and only the new iphone-nano will be sold and as such the appstore for the now old device is to be closed, you are boned. You will be holding a $200 paperweight.

I don't think the developers who are writing all this iPhone software would be happy with that. Many would probably leave if Apple did it.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

h4rr4r (612664) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561887)

Apple is not about third patry developers, if they were you could write and sell a non webkit browser for the thing.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (2, Interesting)

realmolo (574068) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561789)

Windows Mobile phones have no restrictions on the software you can run, and as far as I know, there haven't been any viruses or security issues. Even if there HAVE been, they have to be obscure, and limited to people who installed specific, weird applications.

Windows Mobile phones are SO much better than an iPhone for *actually doing stuff* that it isn't even funny. There are REAL applications for Windows Mobile phones, because anyone can make an app. The only thing the iPhone has going for it is, well, I don't know what it has going for it. Pretty icons?

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27564033)

Windows Mobile phones have no restrictions on the software you can run, and as far as I know, there haven't been any viruses or security issues. Even if there HAVE been, they have to be obscure, and limited to people who installed specific, weird applications.

Windows Mobile phones are SO much better than an iPhone for *actually doing stuff* that it isn't even funny. There are REAL applications for Windows Mobile phones, because anyone can make an app. The only thing the iPhone has going for it is, well, I don't know what it has going for it. Pretty icons?

I entirely agree. Note to mods - just because someone dares to express an opinion about an Apple product that you disagree with, doesn't make them a Troll.

(I also find it interesting that rather than answering his question on what the Iphone has going for it, people would rather mod it out of sight.)

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (0, Offtopic)

0xdeadbeef (28836) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561881)

Is it too much to ask for people to read the things they moderate? The parent should be "-1 lolwut?"

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

jonaskoelker (922170) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561907)

I'd say Apple's approach has to be viewed more as a security feature than an anti-competitive fair trade violation.

Why? Particularly, why more?

As far as I can tell, Apple's concern for your security are solely your interpretation.

It might be a usability decision made by Apple. It is undeniably simpler and easier to understand when you can't have applications running in the background.

Given Apple's history, I would think that "We want to provide fewer but more usable features" is the simplest explanation for this particular design choice.

ISTR Apple's offering being the first to die in pwn2own. It's a stretch to take this as evidence that Apple doesn't value security, or doesn't value it as much as usability, but:

I think it's mostly a usability decision.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561939)

Do you remember the Apple ad were they are so proud about their OS for which no viruses and malware exist? So you are saying they can't do the same on a device where THEY decide what apps can be installed without limiting?

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (4, Interesting)

dara (119068) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562055)

If this is a significant issue, I would have expected to see a bigger problem on Android phones by now. I had a G1 for 30 days, and then switched to the iPhone as the G1 in November was too flaky for me, but the one thing I absolutely hate is not being able to put a program I write or download from a trusted source onto my phone. I'll probably go back to Android in another 1 1/2 years and by then, hopefully the hardware will be better. Or maybe Apple will remove this annoying restriction at some point before then and they might keep me. My iPhone is a bit flaky too, they need better hardware also - I've reinstalled twice when it wouldn't turn on. I'm a bit hesitant to jailbreak and potentially be causing myself more headaches.

Dara

The one app I'm willing to pay for is at least out for the iPhone (in 4 flavors) and is unavailable for the G1 - the ability to view topographic USGS maps offline with your position (search for topographic on the app store). So there is something to be said for being on the more popular platform. I sure hope Android gets more popular - I wish I could have helped, but that first phone was driving me crazy.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

amorsen (7485) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562599)

Apple's prohibition on 3rd party software running in background is probably the best line of defense against spyware infecting the average idiot/user's phone.

Yes, spyware writers are known for their unwavering obediance of license agreements.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

vertinox (846076) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562637)

Plus you end up going down the path of requiring anti-virus and security software to run on the phone all the time, reducing the battery life.

Yes, just like OS X requires anti-virus and security software!

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

Kalriath (849904) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563709)

Windows Mobile.
Symbian.

Two reasons your entire argument is a load of hogswash.

Re:3rd party in background means malware... (1)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27564009)

Wait - so the reason why OS X is (supposedly) more secure than Windows is because Apple prevent people writing 3rd party apps for OS X, too?

I'm calling Poe's Law on this post. If it's genuine, then I'm not sure what to say. Have you used any other phones? Yes, clearly we're all bogged down with malware, and everyone runs antivirus on their phone!

The iPhone is worthless unjailbroken (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27561609)

I have one. I'll stick with OS 2.1.2 until 3.x is jailbroken. Between netatalk, the ssh server/client, mobile terminal, and functional teathering, there's absolutely no way I'd go back to a closed and locked OS on that phone. If AT&T and Apple don't like it, cancel my account.

I'm of the opinion now that these companies have got too uppity. I've canceled cable television and Internet service, then put an antenna on my roof. I've canceled my land line. If AT&T wants my iPhone - they can have it.

Live without and you'll live better. Or, at least you'll live without a corporate cock pumping your unlubricated ass.

Re:The iPhone is worthless unjailbroken (1)

BitZtream (692029) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561777)

Go to an AT&T store and tell them you're tethering, they'll be happy to cancel your account for you I'm sure.

That'll surely show them how much of a bad ass you are.

Re:The iPhone is worthless unjailbroken (2, Interesting)

averner (1341263) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562131)

I've canceled cable television and Internet service

Cable television may not be terribly important, but I don't know how you can "live better" without internet service. Either way, you're posting here, aren't you?

Re:The iPhone is worthless unjailbroken (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27563065)

Enjoy your so-called "broadband" bandwidth caps then.

Re:The iPhone is worthless unjailbroken (1)

averner (1341263) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563629)

Yes, I'm enjoying internet with caps, as it's still better than no internet.

Sometimes I wonder about stuff (0, Offtopic)

Gizzmonic (412910) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561711)

Hmm, I sit here and I wonder...did the submitter for this article have a beard? We'll probably never know.

I often wonder about stuff like that. What about you? Does your soul still wonder about beards?

Functionality! (5, Interesting)

registered_after_8_y (1445553) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561801)

The reason i have a jailbroken iPhone (legally unlocked, bought it in Italy) is the way the App Store apps are crippled. The apps from cydia have much better functions in many cases, as a simple example the flashlight app, the one from cydia can override the screen brightness settings, which makes it actually work, whereas the official doesn't. Also apps like intelliscreen and others like it make it clear that I will still jailbreak my phone at 3.0.

Re:Functionality! (1)

WilliamBaughman (1312511) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562545)

The free flashlight I have from the App Store adjusts the brightness. It's called 'Light', and it was made by Erica Sadun if you're interested.

Re:Functionality! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27563161)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but couldn't you legally unlock it yourself in as long as you own the phone?
Or do you only license the iPhone?

It's all about the awesome (5, Interesting)

richtaur (1234738) | more than 5 years ago | (#27561919)

iPhone is great, but a jailbroken iPhone is AWESOME! Oldschool emulators (Genesis, Nintendo), bash terminal, custom text ringtones, scp/ssh ... it's a fantastic device by itself, but without restrictions it's unbelievably good.

Re:It's all about the awesome (2, Informative)

Mr2001 (90979) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562315)

Heh. Android users can get those without having to hack anything.

You're telling me you can't change the text ringtone on a stock iPhone? Seriously?

Re:It's all about the awesome (1)

richtaur (1234738) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562505)

I wasn't trying to compare what a jailbroken iPhone can do that other devices can't, I was saying what you can do with a jailbroken iPhone. It has some severe limitations (yes, like the inability to change text ringtones) that are easily fixed after breaking it.

Re:It's all about the awesome (1)

Culture20 (968837) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563359)

You're telling me you can't change the text ringtone on a stock iPhone? Seriously?

My coworkers and I all have iPhones, and we all have custom phone ringtones (that's easy to do), but the only guy that doesn't whip out his phone when the "Glass" text-ringtone chimes is the guy who jailbroke. The worst thing about Apple's restricted text-ringtones is that there is only one that can be heard in a server room.

Re:It's all about the awesome (1)

elijahu (1421) | more than 5 years ago | (#27564069)

The bulk of the folks bitching in this thread seem to follow the same line of logic: Android does stuff that you can do without hacking your iPhone.

So? The parent makes the key point... when you jailbreak it, the iPhone is really magnificent. It's pretty slick to begin with, but when you open it up to non-restricted apps, it's starts to really shine. Great UI. Lots of flexibility. Everything Apple gives you combined with everything the dev-team groupies have to offer.

And yet you wine about having to "hack" it?

First off, the process of jailbreaking an iPhone is so trivial that "hack" hardly does the process justice. Perhaps it would be more appropriate to describe it as a non-Apple approved upgrade.

Second, are you hainging out on the right website? It used to be the Slashdot mantra that the easy way was less desirable. Isn't this the website where countless threads proselytizing the good of Linux over the evils of Windows glossed over the x windows settings you used to have to tweak in your console based text editor after having freshly compiled yourself a new kernel, all to get to a point where the mouse cursor would move across the desktop. And you complain now of the difficulty involved with a gui-based nearly brick-proof software hack?

Seriously?

Breaking news! (1)

Tharsman (1364603) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562027)

Breaking news, people will keep jail-breaking iPhones despite improvements!

In other breaking news, extensive research has determined that water is a liquid.

Re:Breaking news! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27562197)

THIS JUST IN! Water can become a solid! NEWS AT 9, 10, 11, 11:10, 11:15, 11:16.

Holy Grail? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27562177)

How is background execution the Holy Grail? Other smart phones have always had this feature. Holy Grail implies that all phones are working towards this feature. But as usual, other more capable phones get glossed over, and the world view of TFA is restricted to the shiniest turd on the block.

Fuck apple (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27562283)

Apple sucks, and their IPhone will be hacked. Fuck it, Apple. You suck big asses.

Cracking your Crack-phone is good for business (1)

w0mprat (1317953) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562337)

Apple are doing everything but condone jailbreaking because they know it's a nice feature and they are selling iPhones because of it.

"Experience" (1)

TrailerTrash (91309) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562405)

Anything that justifies itself on the basis of "the user's experience" should be viewed appropriately - as a load of BS.

Apple contends that they want us to have a smooth, consistent user "experience".

Isn't that MY DECISION? If I choose to want concurrent apps (which I don't, the device doesn't have enough power to make it useful), who is the vendor to dictate my "experience"?

The reality is that they want their massive cut of the app store revenue, and alternate app stores cut their revenue stream out of the mix. Not to mention the possibility of messing with their carrier contracts. Any pathetic excuse like "experience" is obviously a sham. If they cared about my "experience" they would have delivered cut and paste two revs ago. If they cared about my "experience" iTunes would be trained to watch folders and automatically import music that is added to the folder without intervention. If they cared about my "experience" they would let me download TV shows that I have paid for via iTunes when connected to the internet via WI-FI.

And I say that as a member of my Fortune 100 company's "User Experience Executive Steering Group", which is a thinly disguised attempt to procure resources for pet projects...

Re:"Experience" (2, Insightful)

onefriedrice (1171917) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562703)

Anything that justifies itself on the basis of "the user's experience" should be viewed appropriately - as a load of BS. Apple contends that they want us to have a smooth, consistent user "experience". Isn't that MY DECISION?

Yeah, it is. So... what's the problem? If you want to make the decision to customize your user experience, go ahead and jailbreak. Otherwise, the user experience Apple provides is good enough for most people.

Seriously, Apple's not going to haul you off to jail any more than will KDE for adapting their desktop software to fit your needs. Nobody is saying you have to do it Apple's way, but Apple is under no obligation to provide support to you if you try to make their software work in ways it's not yet designed to work (for reasons that are completely irrelevant).

Re:"Experience" (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27563653)

Seriously, Apple's not going to haul you off to jail any more than will KDE for adapting their desktop software to fit your needs.

The rest of the internet disagrees with you. See http://cultofmac.com/apple-calls-jailbreaking-iphones-a-crime/8330 for example.

Lockin is more for iTunes, than backgrounding (1)

benow (671946) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562483)

The lockin forces the app-store, which forces the dev eula which forces the non-competition, which perpetuates apples distribution monopoly, which keeps the dump trucks full of cash coming in. Artist 'reward' as a justification for repression, etc. They don't care too much about jailbreaking because the avg buyer is not going to bother... and most people will continue to fork over cash, instead of stripping the nasty, avoiding the cash grab and using it as the more flexible and useful device it could be.

Fundamental "Grail" faulty (2, Insightful)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562681)

The iPhone lacks background Applications - however, a percentage of the cases for making use of background processing are addressed by the notification service (which is finally going in with 3.0).

Once you eliminate the entire class of polling apps, are the remaining set truly the "holy grail" of iPhone use? I don't think so.

That said, Jailbreaking will thrive because there will always be stuff you can do with Jailbreaking you cannot otherwise, if nothing else just the opportunity for raw experimentation.... I seem to recall there has been some proof that Apple looks over these jailbroken apps, I'm sure they draw ideas from them and can even use them as a measure of just what areas people most want to see a deeper API exposed. So I don't think Apple will ever get serious about stopping this, not to mention they have been intelligent enough to know to spend only the most minimal time developing protection mechanisms that will be hacked anyway (which is all of them).

So, to use this product (1)

wowbagger (69688) | more than 5 years ago | (#27562849)

So, in order to use this product, I have to partially break it?

There is only one product [google.com] that I have to partially break to use that I am OK with.

It isn't a phone.

Re:So, to use this product (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27563655)

eggs?

3 Reasons I still keep my Touch Jailbroken (4, Insightful)

stalky14 (574130) | more than 5 years ago | (#27563355)

1. File Sharing. My Touch shows up just like any other shared Mac in the Shared bar in Finder windows. Once I log in, I can drag files back and forth across the entire directory structure just like any NAS situation. This includes pulling out iTunes music, albeit with funky filenames. iTunes can still figure them out, though.

2. Ad Block. Either by the shareware Adblock or a hosts file.

3. Emulators. The GBA emulator has gotten quite good.

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