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SpringSource Acquires Hyperic, Possibly Set to Target Microsoft and IBM

ScuttleMonkey posted more than 5 years ago | from the new-era-of-open-source dept.

130

Many sources are reporting that SpringSource has acquired Hyperic, creating a company that could go after IBM and Microsoft. SpringSource has long dreamed of being able to offer a complete open source solution that accelerates the entire build, run, manage Java application lifecycle, and Hyperic offers the last piece of the puzzle. "Regardless, the SpringSource/Hyperic combination creates a clear and present danger to IBM and Microsoft, two companies that have largely stood alone in the ability to build, run, and manage applications. It's also a significant boon to companies looking to open source to save money and improve productivity. Is it a sign of good things to come from not only SpringSource, but also open source, generally? Time will tell, but I suspect we're on the cusp of an aggressive and ambitious new phase in open-source competition."

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watch out Redmond (4, Funny)

justindarc (1046048) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820157)

expecting chair storms

Re:watch out Redmond (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820509)

Very funny, mod parent up, A+++, would laugh again.

Umm... (4, Insightful)

qw0ntum (831414) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820179)

Microsoft and IBM have lots of competitors (Oracle comes readily to mind). What makes this different, besides the fact I've never heard of either of these companies? A blogger I've also never heard of who wants hits?

Re:Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820229)

Having never heard of these companies, it's probably not worth RTFA.
But if I don't RTFA I won't know if it's worth RTFA.

What should I do?

Re:Umm... (5, Funny)

Volante3192 (953645) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820359)

Schrodinger's Article.

Re:Umm... (1)

quickOnTheUptake (1450889) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820409)

Or Meno's [wikipedia.org] article.

Re:Umm... (1)

Clandestine_Blaze (1019274) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821771)

Schrodinger's Article.

Where every article is both a dupe and an original until you RTFA.

Re:Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820401)

Having never heard of these companies, it's probably not worth RTFA.
But if I don't RTFA I won't know if it's worth RTFA.

What should I do?

Jusd post as if knowledgeable about the whole thing.

"Actually, Oracle probably have the most to fear from this. They're already running scared of SpringSource's new Albric DB and when you couple that with Hyperic's strengths in quantic programming... well, let's just say things could get pretty interesting. Jebediah Croak is a very shrewd bussinesman."

Someone will be outraged enough to correct you in enough detail to decide whether to RFA, and if nobody does then at least you'll get modded +5 interesting as a consolation.

Re:Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820539)

hehe, the same old usenet trick still works.

Re:Umm... (-1, Flamebait)

Red Flayer (890720) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820373)

What makes this different, besides the fact I've never heard of either of these companies?

Translation: Someone please RTFA, follow the links, and report back with an executive summary.

Sheesh. You've been around long enough to know that you don't need to ask that type of question, someone else will say something stupid after not RTFA'ing, and some UID in the newest hundred thousand will respond back with a synopsis, eager to get karma for the informative post.

You're a little late, but there's still time for you to weave your pupa, then emerge from chrysalis to full-fledged cynical slashdotter who doesn't deign to ask, nor answer, such simple questions, instead understanding that if you are patient, the answers will appear.

Re:Umm... (1)

qw0ntum (831414) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820449)

I read the full article, jackass. Sorry to ruin your /. stereotype.

Novel idea: asking a question to harness the collective knowledge of /. to put an article in context. I'm not familiar with either of these companies and as far as I can tell this merger is nothing more than hype. Maybe I'm missing something and someone will correct me. That's the point of the question.

Re:Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820527)

Here's a press conference that explains everything.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLsDvGlIDh0 [youtube.com]

Re:Umm... (1)

Red Flayer (890720) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820619)

I read the full article, jackass. Sorry to ruin your /. stereotype.

Ah, I see your sarcasm detector is broken.

Lighten up, Nancy. Being pissed off, paranoid, and miserable is a terrible way to go through life.

I'd say it's highly unlikely you read the links from TFA, though, am I correct?

FWIW, reading the links from the blog post cleared up a little bit of who the companies are, what they do, and what parts of the MS and IBM offerings they'll be competing with (frameworks).

Also, one more note... though you have disappointed me by not fulfilling a stereotype in one way, that's perfectly OK, as you fulfilled it in others (unable to detect sarcasm and/or hypersensitivity to it, hypersensitivity to criticism -- both are solid components of the slashdotter stereotype).

Re:Umm... (2)

qw0ntum (831414) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820711)

Touche, you win this round. That's what finals will do to you. :)

Re:Umm... (1)

tomhudson (43916) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820719)

Does "slow news day" ring a bell? How about "slashvertisement"?

  1. CNet copies some press release, maybe adding a few lines
  2. Slashdot picks it up
  3. PROFIT!

I doubt that either IBM or Microsoft are going to be shaking in their booties about suddenly not being able to develop using spring (Apache 2 license) or java (gpl license). The hype sounds like a rerun the Borland-Inprise-Borland-WeDontKnowWhoTheFuckAreWeToday.butWeWillManageYourApplicationLifecycle hype. It doesn't mean anyone has to change anything any time this decade - and probably the next.

Re:Umm... (5, Informative)

youngdev (1238812) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820447)

Are you kidding? SpringSource is _THE_ standard IoC container for the Java Language. Their ideas have influenced a wide ranging array of Java-based products including hibernate (http://hibernate.org), google guice (http://code.google.com/p/google-guice/), apache tomcat (http://tomcat.apache.org), just to name a few. Just because you aren't familiar with these technologies does not mean this is not a pretty big deal. Aside from that, the spring source company has successfully built a profitable company around their open source technologies while still providing the source freely to the community. Their influence can hardly be understated even if you have never used on their technologies directly. http://www.springsource.com/customers [springsource.com]

Re:Umm... (1)

qw0ntum (831414) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820499)

Cool, thanks for filling me in. That was an honest question. Do you really think this merger is a "clear and present danger" to Microsoft and IBM (another honest question, o cynics of /.)?

Re:Umm... (1)

julesh (229690) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821359)

Cool, thanks for filling me in. That was an honest question. Do you really think this merger is a "clear and present danger" to Microsoft and IBM (another honest question, o cynics of /.)?

No. Spring Framework is a clear and present danger to Sun's J2EE standards, because it provides a lot of the same benefits (particularly if combined with a good ORM librar -- e.g. Hibernate, which it integrates with particularly well) with substantially lower overhead. To the extent that IBM's business model is based on J2EE (which is only slightly) Spring is a threat, but IBM have a finger in almost all Java pies; if Spring developers prefer Tomcat to a heavy application server like Websphere, IBM still provides just about everything else, from some of the best hardware to run it on down to the most popular IDE to build it with, which is also designed to integrate nicely with Spring's framework. They also provide top quality training and support for all of these facilities. For those developers who would otherwise stick with websphere, Hyperic might provide a little encouragement to switch to a lighter platform, but mainly I suspect it's just good news for those of us who've always been living without websphere's management features.

Nothing SpringSource does is in direct competition with any of Microsoft's products in this line. Spring have a .NET port of their framework, which adds to rather than competes with MS's products. MS don't have a product that competes with Hyperic, as far as I can see, so this merger changes nothing with regards to MS's position.

Re:Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27821657)

Probably not an immediate danger, but SS goal is to compete for the server-side pie in the same manner as Oracle, IBM and Microsoft. Their latest SpringSource tc Server together with this acquisiton puts them a little close to offering a complete package for development and deploy. A think they are getting closer to Jboss than to those 3 I mentioned.

Re:Umm... (2, Informative)

tomhudson (43916) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820627)

Considering that Spring is under the Apache 2.0 license [wikipedia.org] , and Java is now GPL'd, it's not like they hold the exclusive "keys to the kingdom." There's more to life and computers than Java.

Blasphemy (2, Funny)

jason.sweet (1272826) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821597)

There's more to life and computers than Java.

Let us pray so that this evil will be striken from our eyes:

Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of pointers, I will fear no leaks: For GC art with me...

Re:Umm... (1)

Burkin (1534829) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820815)

So IBM is going to quake in its boots over something that they can pick up and freely use in their own Java stack (since its Apache 2.0) basically putting Spring out of business? Wow that sounds like a solid winner there! Secondly, why should Microsoft care when the greatest share of developers for its platform are using either C/C++ or C#?

Re:Umm... (1)

youngdev (1238812) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820981)

I'm not saying that SpringSource is the IBM/MS Killer. I was just trying to give context to a company that was being written off as a non-player. If the Sun/Oracle merge has taught us anything, it should be that the technology landscape can change in almost an instant and any move by any company should be watched and analyzed for its potential impact on your product/technology.

Re:Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27821687)

It is a non player. If I'm inviting players to my Tech game Spring source won't even be brought up. In the Draft of technology companies, its best chance is to make it as an unsigned free agent. I can't understate its impact to my Java development.

Re:Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820973)

Your employer wouldn't be SpringSource by any chance?

And your lawn isn't real grass but that fake grass from the '70s? What was it called again? Oh yaeh: Astroturf.

Re:Umm... (1)

youngdev (1238812) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821515)

no. I work for a bank. But I have had the pleasure of dealing with some of the spring source Engineers in conferences and what not and I have always admired the company. I have thought many times about sending them my resume. Maybe I should. Melbourne Florida is simply gorgeous most of the year.

Re:Umm... (4, Funny)

afabbro (33948) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821247)

They are also the market leader for maximizing synergy in cross-platform, dynamic object-oriented open source mindshare solutions.

Re:Umm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27821609)

poof.

Re:Umm... (1)

lbalbalba (526209) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820597)

Who are SpringSource and Hyperic, indeed...

Re:Umm... (1)

Anarke_Incarnate (733529) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821785)

Hyperic makes a really good java based app/server/network monitoring and management tool. Their stuff is really good. However, as their offering is "FOSS" but crippled, I have looked more towards Pandora FMS. They make Nagios look like........nagios, for complexity.

It's All Hookers and Blow (1)

mpapet (761907) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820217)

I don't mean anything bad by SpringSource, but those of us in the trenches that have had their pre-purchase findings ignored in favor of some dog-awful monstrosity of an application understand that they probably don't have much of a chance unless they score better 'incentives' than an IBM or Microsoft rep. Along with some very flexible morals, it takes deeep pockets.

Re:It's All Hookers and Blow (1)

ushering05401 (1086795) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820273)

You don't mean anything bad by SpringSource, but I do. I am guessing their devs are mortified right now - and there is no undoing an appearance on /.

Slight exageration (1)

mapsjanhere (1130359) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820249)

From the summary, it sounds like the company would try to acquire Microsoft and IBM next. Only later it becomes clear that going after refers to their product offerings. Good luck with that, not that they need it with their obviously superior quality.

Two questions (4, Insightful)

chill (34294) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820253)

1. Who the hell is SpringSource?
2. Who the hell is Hyberic?

Regardless, the SpringSource/Hyperic combination creates a clear and present danger to IBM and Microsoft...

Unless SpringSource or Hyperic has a few billion dollars in the bank that I'm blissfully unaware of, or their own nuclear arsenal, I don't believe this blogger is using the phrase "clear and present danger" in a manner consistent with reality.

Re:Two questions (1)

Lord Ender (156273) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820523)

Oh, he used them quite well. His use of them got him front page slashdot, and all the thousands of ad impressions that come with that.

Re:Two questions (1)

chill (34294) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820571)

AdBlock be praised!

Still... he did a nice job of whoring. Now only if there was some way for Slashdot to have people with some sort of control over the acceptance of articles. The newspapers have a system. I believe they call them "editors", though I have heard less flattering terms being used.

Re:Two questions (4, Funny)

14erCleaner (745600) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820593)

Who the hell is Hyberic?

It's spelled Hyperic. You're probably confusing it with hyperbolic, like this press release.

Re:Two questions (1)

Wowlapalooza (1339989) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821553)

Or, maybe hyperbaric, as in, oxygen at high pressure, because whoever wrote that press release sounds a little loopy...

Re:Two questions (1)

AbbyNormal (216235) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820647)

It is buried in reality, at least in the bank accounts of SpringSource.

1.) IBM/Oracle/Microsoft have cash and are itching to buy companies.

2.) Announce new Open Source panacea that will "beat IBM/Microsoft/etc".

3.) Step back and wait for the buyout offers to begin.

4.) Profit.

Re:Two questions (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27821323)

SpringSource makes Spring framework, an open source container that helped people get rid of J2EE 4. Eventually, Sun came up J2EE 5 that incorporated much of these ideas. But Spring remained popular. What Spring framework did not do was the full load balancing dance of J2EE with its "light weight" (relatively speaking - this is Java) approach. SpringSource recently came up with an app server - dmServer: sort of an alternative to a J2EE approach. Now they acquired a load monitoring software.

So, they are really competing with Glassfish, JBoss and other J2EE contenders; not Microsoft.

If you did not hear about Spring till now, you probably never cared much about Java. And you can blissfully continue to ignore this new development. It does not change anything for you.

Thanks For The Advertising +1, Helpful (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820267)

"long dreamed of being able to offer a complete open source solution that accelerates the entire build, run, manage Java application lifecycle, and Hyperic offers the last piece of the puzzle."

Let me succinctly summarize their product: VAPORWARE

Yours In Communism,
Kilgore Trout [youtube.com]

Bring down Microsoft and IBM? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820279)

Yes, some Java startup is going to bring down Microsoft and IBM. And pigs will fly out my ass. Give me a fucking break.

....And pigs will fly out my ass..... (2, Funny)

mevets (322601) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821055)

Is that a swine flu reference?

News isn't really news, news at 11. (2, Insightful)

Anenome (1250374) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820285)

*The TV glows to life in a moment; it's News at 11*

  In other news, journalist makes laughable prediction that two companies you've never heard of can threaten two of the largest companies in existence. Media-watchers cynically called this a blogger stunt to boost website hits, noting that sites such as Slashdot "drive a lot of hits" which, combined with Google Adsense, turns into cash for news site, Cnet.com, which hosted the article. Comments, Linda?

  News organizations cynically driving consumers to their web pages with fake news, how low can you go?

  (laughing) You tell 'em.

  For more information on this and other top stories visit our website!

Re:News isn't really news, news at 11. (1)

Anenome (1250374) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820363)

*The TV glows to life in a moment; it's News at 11*

John: In other news, journalist makes laughable prediction that two companies you've never heard of can threaten two of the largest companies in existence. Media-watchers cynically called this a blogger stunt to boost website hits, noting that sites such as Slashdot "drive a lot of hits" which, combined with Google Adsense, turns into cash for news site, Cnet.com, which hosted the article. Comments, Linda?

Linda: News organizations cynically driving consumers to their web pages with fake news, how low can you go?

John: (laughing) You tell 'em.

Linda: For more information on this and other top stories visit our website!

You naysayers just don't get it (4, Funny)

Daffy Duck (17350) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820295)

Didn't you read the summary? These guys have long dreamed of being able to offer a solution. Plus they're totally unknown underdogs. That means they're just one montage away from coming out on top. Yay!

Re:You naysayers just don't get it (2, Funny)

cant_get_a_good_nick (172131) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820685)

Can the montage have the girls from baywatch running? They had the best montages...

Re:You naysayers just don't get it (1)

Blakey Rat (99501) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821383)

I've managed to obtain footage of their celebration after this acquisition:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fua0g13djo [youtube.com]

Re:You naysayers just don't get it (1)

dkleinsc (563838) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821429)

Here I was thinking this article was along the lines of:
1. Take two random companies that conceivably could produce something useful if they merged.
2. Buy them using VC.
3. Merge them.
4. Start a PR campaign about how the merged company could threaten IBM and MS.
5. Sell out the merged companies to whichever giant makes the bigger offer. Obviously wait until the offers are more than you paid in step 2.
6. Profit!

UGH what happened to this site? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820311)

Slashdot 2.0 sucks balls. I'm adding this shit to my hosts file, I have had enough. This site used to be the greatest. But they messed with a great thing, and now it's dead to me. I'm taking Slashdot out on a boat and shooting it in the head. So long, everyone.

Re:UGH what happened to this site? (2, Funny)

Daffy Duck (17350) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821223)

So long, Anonymous Coward. We'd miss you if we knew who you were.

Riiiiight. (5, Insightful)

whisper_jeff (680366) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820333)

Two companies you've never heard of merge to create a unified company you won't remember in a week and present no danger what-so-ever to Microsoft nor IBM. I mean, seriously. Let's be real here.

Compete OSS first (1, Insightful)

ultrabot (200914) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820347)

I'd like to see how well they compete with open source solutions first (Django, Rails), before getting excited about conquering the whole industry.

It seem they are still dragging that Albatross "Java" in their nets, hopefully it can do a few more tricks,

Re:Compete OSS first (5, Informative)

DuckDodgers (541817) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820469)

Spring is already open source. It's a very widely used Java web application framework - possibly the king of that particular hill. That's why it's used in hundreds of companies, as the article states.

I'm also sure it's pretty fast in terms of performance.

The proprietary piece here is Hyperic, not Spring.

But you and the other post-writers are right, it's still a long way from being noteworthy to IBM or Microsoft. Too many big companies insist on proprietary software from big name vendors, regardless of the technical or financial merits of cheaper competition (open source or otherwise).

Re:Compete OSS first (2, Informative)

glwtta (532858) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821241)

It's a very widely used Java web application framework

Uh, that's not exactly right - Spring is primarily an IoC container and AOP framework, and a whole bunch of (mostly unrelated) frameworks built on top of those. SpringMVC/WebFlow is one of those components, probably one of the less successful ones at that, as it's not obviously better than its competitors (not necessarily worse, just not better - most modern MVC web frameworks are nigh-identical at this point).

Re:Compete OSS first (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820889)

Spring seems to competing just fine in the job market:

http://www.indeed.com/jobtrends?q=java+spring,+ruby+rails,+django+&l=

Rails and Django are fun toys, but sometimes real work needs to get done.

Re:Compete OSS first (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27821145)

Wait, you're complaining about Java being an albatross and then trot out Rails? WTH, Ruby has been the business world joke/flash in a pan, not Java. In addition Spring is pretty much THE reference for Inversion of Control and, as a previous poster noted, wields massive influence across many other Java projects. These are some of the smartest Computer Scientists and software developers (two, discrete things) in the world.

But, don't worry, you seem to know much better. Ruby on Rails 4Life!

Re:Compete OSS first (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27821301)

These are some of the smartest Computer Scientists and software developers (two, discrete things) in the world.

ROFL! Yeah, the smartest computer scientists and best software developers in the world work on Java web applications...

Re:Compete OSS first (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27821537)

These are some of the smartest Computer Scientists and software developers (two, discrete things) in the world.

ROFL! Yeah, the smartest computer scientists and best software developers in the world work on Java web applications...

They do.

A java app/management framework (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820383)

I'm not knocking their products, but until they get their stuff Common Criteria, FIPS, and ICSA certified, not many large companies will be darkening their door.

They have quite an uphill battle, and are trying to compete against well entrenched competition with products that have been out for decades.

I wish them luck, and I think they will find a niche in some shops, but the article is overhyping them -- they are not going to be able to go to bat against the big guys anytime soon.

Re:A java app/management framework (1)

julesh (229690) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821911)

I'm not knocking their products, but until they get their stuff Common Criteria, FIPS, and ICSA certified, not many large companies will be darkening their door.

Can I ask... which products do you think need certification, under which standards?

Spring Framework isn't a free-standing application, so I don't see how it _could_ be certified under either Common Criteria or ICSA's certification procedure. For example, CC certification is primarily aimed at isolating the "security functional requirements" of the software and ensuring that they are maintained. It's hard to see how a generic framework that can be used during the implementation of almost any conceivable system has any security functional requirements. It's also hard to see how to ensure they are maintained, as Spring doesn't provide public-facing code but instead utilities to be used by the user-provided public-facing code, which would necessarily be present for any testing. If it implemented any FIPS standards they could presumably be certified, but I believe to the extent it uses such standards it relies on underlying Java and/or application server implementations of them. Hyperic isn't a public-facing application, so I don't see the relevance of security certification... it shouldn't be a security critical application in any case.

I'm not a java developer but... (1)

Xabraxas (654195) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820427)

...even I know that SpringSource is behind the Spring Framework which is one of the most popular Java Enterprise Frameworks in use today. It's not like they aren't already in the market. This aquisition just allows SpringSource to have an end to end solution. Most of the comments so far are completely devoid of any knowledge on the subject whatsoever. A quick read through the article and a google search for SpringSource would be enough to enlighten people why this is important. Unfortunately that is too much to ask from most slashdotters.

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (3, Interesting)

rjstanford (69735) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820481)

Funny, I am a Java developer (and one who works on fairly new web framework code, to boot). I know about Spring, although I don't use it. I had no idea that SpringSource was the company pushing it. I have a hard time imagining that Hyperic's offering was the one thing stopping major enterprises from using them, also...

A quick read through the article and a google search for SpringSource would be enough to enlighten people why this is important. Unfortunately that is too much to ask from most slashdotters.

Wasn't that supposed to be the entire point of the summary?

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (1)

Xabraxas (654195) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820607)

Funny, I am a Java developer (and one who works on fairly new web framework code, to boot). I know about Spring, although I don't use it. I had no idea that SpringSource was the company pushing it. I have a hard time imagining that Hyperic's offering was the one thing stopping major enterprises from using them, also...

There is nothing stoping major enterprises from using the Spring Framework. They already are. Hyperic has had a relationship with SpringSource for a while now. This just allows them to control and support everything from end to end.

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (1)

syousef (465911) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820569)

A quick read through the article and a google search for SpringSource would be enough to enlighten people why this is important.

I think that's the point. I use Spring at work so I know what it is, but I don't have to tell people to google IBM or Microsoft. Is this a good thing? Does it offer more choice to a developer? Perhaps. Suggesting that they're some major threat is more than a little over the top. I won't be giving that blogger my page views.

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (1)

Xabraxas (654195) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820769)

Suggesting that they're some major threat is more than a little over the top.

No it isn't. They are already one of the most common, if not the most common, java enterprise frameworks in use today.

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (1)

H0p313ss (811249) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820961)

Suggesting that they're some major threat is more than a little over the top.

No it isn't. They are already one of the most common, if not the most common, java enterprise frameworks in use today.

Commonly used != profitable threat

e.g. Ubuntu

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (1)

Xabraxas (654195) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821039)

Commonly used != profitable threat

e.g. Ubuntu

Ubuntu is used on less than 1% of desktops. The spring framework is used in something like 50% of enterprises that use a java application framework. Your analogy is not even remotely useful.

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (1)

Burkin (1534829) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821037)

No it isn't. They are already one of the most common, if not the most common, java enterprise frameworks in use today.

Astroturf much?

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (1)

Xabraxas (654195) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821093)

Astroturf much?

No but I can read. You should try it sometime, it's a skill that can go a long way. I don't even develop java applications nevermind have anything to do with SpringSource. If you don't believe me about how prevalent Spring is then just look up some Java job listings.

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (1)

Burkin (1534829) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821219)

Considering how defensive you get over this company in the 5 posts you've made in this thread I doubt it.

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (1)

pwfffff (1517213) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821427)

There IS a point at which unbridled paranoia is unhealthy.

Re:I'm not a java developer but... (2, Informative)

Xabraxas (654195) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821643)

Considering how defensive you get over this company in the 5 posts you've made in this thread I doubt it.

I'm not getting defensive about SpringSource. I just hate when all the comments are by people making definitive statements about things they know jack about. The attitude "I never heard of it so it must be nothing" is just retarded. One comment even called it vaporware! This stuff is already out there. SpringSource just bought a component already used by them so they could control the whole end-to-end solution. Other clueless commenters are interpreting the summary to mean that SpringSource is going to wipe out IBM and Microsoft. This is about the application framework market not MS or IBM as a whole. It doesn't take a whole lot of reading to figure that out.

An honest question... (1)

shummer_mc (903125) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821485)

I have a java project, which basically exposes web-services (jax-ws) and it's built on java 1.5+ standard. I considered Spring when I was starting the project a couple years ago. However, I thought that they didn't offer much (for me) with regards to web services and I thought that the point of Spring was to get away from EJBs, which as of java 1.5 are vastly simpler and lighter weight.

So, I've basically been under the impression that Spring would die either as java dies, or as java integrates much of its functionality. What do they bring to the table? I'd honestly like to know.

To me, this is a dying company struggling to stay relevant - but I could certainly be wrong.

Re:An honest question... (1)

julesh (229690) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821535)

I have a java project, which basically exposes web-services (jax-ws) and it's built on java 1.5+ standard. I considered Spring when I was starting the project a couple years ago. However, I thought that they didn't offer much (for me) with regards to web services and I thought that the point of Spring was to get away from EJBs, which as of java 1.5 are vastly simpler and lighter weight.

So, I've basically been under the impression that Spring would die either as java dies, or as java integrates much of its functionality. What do they bring to the table? I'd honestly like to know.

A question for you: are you doing automated unit (isolated, rather than end-to-end) testing of your project? Spring's main advantage (for me, at least) is that helps me minimize the dependencies between my components by handling the dirty work of plugging them all together in the real application so that I can use easily mocked interfaces between them rather than directly-coded hard dependencies. This makes unit testing much easier. If you're not doing this kind of testing, I'd imagine Spring isn't for you. Of course, as an ever-increasing proportion of developers are doing it, Spring is becoming more relevant.

The real cost isn't developing Java, it's runtime (1)

Catalina588 (1151475) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820455)

The really significant costs to enterprises, who do half their development in Java (source: Aberdeen Group market research), is not in Java development. There are plenty of developers. No, the costs are in Java execution. Java's garbage collection hiccups, for example, make it difficult to meet response time SLA's as volumes scale.

Azul Systems is a company that specializes in accelerating Java workloads on Sun, IBM, and X86 machines. I see Azul as being at least as important to a "complete" Java solution as SpringSource and Hypernic..

Re:The real cost isn't developing Java, it's runti (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820651)

i call bullshit.

the largest cost for any java project i've seen has been fixing defects and adding enhancements. and if you're a consultant, the large number of manager leeches piggy backing off developers billable hours.

the vast majority of sites are fine on one box. and there's a large group of sites that are fine with 2-4 boxes with a sticky session loadbalancer to provide scalability before you get to sites that get a return on investment from something li azul.

only a very very small subset of applications require the scalability provided by azul or even clustering beyond maybe session replication / shared cache.

Re:The real cost isn't developing Java, it's runti (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820937)

No, *I* call bullshit.

A website that has no traffic doesn't care. Case in point - yours, I expect.

Websites which succeed are often victims of their own success. There is a point where companies can't buy *boxes* fast enough to cope with demand. At that point, your idea that no-one needs more than 2-4 boxes looks a little weak. At that point you need a scalability solution yesterday.

This might seem "niche" until you realize that no one makes money selling solutions to websites that don't have any traffic.

Re:The real cost isn't developing Java, it's runti (1)

julesh (229690) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821605)

This might seem "niche" until you realize that no one makes money selling solutions to websites that don't have any traffic.

Not true in the slightest. For every site that needs 20 boxes, there are probably 2,000 that work just fine on a single box. The market in small site applications is _much_ larger than the market for big, resource intensive sites.

Blah (0, Troll)

Tarlus (1000874) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820489)

Looked interesting till I read 'Java'.

Re:Blah (1)

fredrik70 (161208) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821305)

no worries you can use it with dot net [springframework.net] too! ;-)

Honestly though, spring is cool stuff, try it out.

Re:Blah (2, Insightful)

julesh (229690) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821469)

Looked interesting till I read 'Java'.

So, clearly, having decided that this wasn't a story you were interested in, you ignored it, didn't read any further, and didn't post in the comments thread.

Or at least, that's what most of the rest of us would have done. Why do you feel the need to complain when /. posts a story on a topic you don't care about?

NO. NOT NOW. NOT EVER! I'M COMING FOR ALL OF YOU! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820493)

Rails, Django, Joomla, PHP, Java.

COBOL, PL/1, RPG.

Same shi7, different generation. These are the languages for the lightweights; however, history has proven, they will be in strong demand long after the ASSEMBLER, FORTAN, C, C++ and PERL guys have been eclipsed by something New --though not in the USA and not at $100/hr (like the COBOL boys enjoyed)...(something about nearly 35% of a Billion people wanting to feed themselves by learning to program on the Interweb, LOL). SpringSource/Hyberbic --sounds pretty foreign to me... Thank you Vincent Cerf and RMS!

WTF... (-1, Troll)

Arimus (198136) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820505)

Has got into slashdot these days... this article is little more than a slashvertisment for vapourware.

How on earth can two companies which very few people, if any, outside their existing employee/customer base have heard of threaten two of the world's large corporations?

Seriously wondering whether /. belongs on my adblock list now :(

Spring is popular in Java-land... (1)

tcopeland (32225) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820557)

...but how much revenue does SpringSource actually get out of it? If it's like a bunch of other open source tools, there's a very small percentage of customers that make the leap from "user" to "paying user".

Re:Spring is popular in Java-land... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27821045)

Spring brings in revenue a few ways:

* Enterprise support
* Training, certifications, conferences, etc.
* Partnership program (a rather expensive one)
* Some consulting services

Personally, I think they are just trying to tread water until they become large enough, when they sell off to the likes of Oracle or IBM.

Re:Spring is popular in Java-land... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27821249)

Yeah because companies don't pay for support right? Listen if Johnny in the basement wants to download and check out the tool or use it in his personal project do you think that is the type of person they are going to ever get any revenue from? Companies like support and safety in knowing that if something goes wrong they have someone to blame that can fix the problem. I can only see an added upside to a user who can actually try the product in its entirety before he may or may not decide to buy it.

Wrong spelling... (4, Funny)

Jah-Wren Ryel (80510) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820649)

It sounds like Spring Source has really acquired lots of Hyperbole.

Wow - serious hperbol (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27820669)

Thinking of the endless very public psats between JBoss and SpringSource over the years it is oddly fascinating to watch SpringSource gradually becoming the vendor it always claimed to hate.

From an enterprise Java perspective SpringSource has always truck me as being the worst possible kind of company. They use open source as a veneer to obscure the fact that almost everything they do locks you to their framework and implementation. The thing that made them famous is basically a dependency injection framework - nice enough (though horribly XML heavy) but hardly earth shattering and has been done better since by Google's Guice to pick but one example. With JavaEE 6 offering a standard DI framework based on Guice and JBoss Seam they're looking for another trick. They've got a badged fork of Tomcat which they're trying to pass of as a lightweight application server (hint - its still just a f*cking servlet container) and with this move they can now offer production monitoring software to offer a complete soloution. Doubtless Oracle, JBoss and Microsoft are shaking in their boots.

Re:Wow - serious hperbol (1)

Bjrn (4836) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820949)

Seam does appear to be much nicer than Spring, with state management och avoidance of XML configuration, etc. But what does Guice bring to the table?

Servlet Engine or full J2EE Application Server ? (1)

lbalbalba (526209) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820807)

What I haven't been able to make out of either of the company's website's, is whether they offer 'only' a servlet engine like Tomcat, or a full J2EE Application Server ? It seems to me like they would need at least a full J2EE Application Server like Geronimo to make any sort of threat ?

Re:Servlet Engine or full J2EE Application Server (1)

julesh (229690) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821637)

What I haven't been able to make out of either of the company's website's, is whether they offer 'only' a servlet engine like Tomcat, or a full J2EE Application Server ? It seems to me like they would need at least a full J2EE Application Server like Geronimo to make any sort of threat ?

Neither. SpringSource's main product is Spring Framework, which is a library designed to assist with Java enterprise programming and coexists with either a servlet engine or an app server (but is designed to reduce the need for a full app server in cases that are borderline to needing one). Hyperic's product is a server monitoring framework which, like Spring, can work equally well with either. Neither produces an actual server, whether for servlets or an application server.

Sounds like (1)

Idiomatick (976696) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820867)

Shill~~~~ S H I L L

Companies nobody has heard of aren't competition for IBM/MS. This isn't revolutionary. Sounds like a company head or a shill.

Hyperic (3, Informative)

Zarquil (187770) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820933)

Hyperic is a GPLed monitoring solution sorta akin to Nagios. I use it to give me my monitoring for my Linux & Windows servers, but also it runs queries against our data vendor's database to ensure that the database is responsive.

I inherited it, which was the first time I ran across it, but after using it I'm a big convert. I recommend taking a serious look at it.

As to the takeover, well, I doubt it'll affect me one way or the other.

Re:Hyperic (1)

mrjohnson (538567) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821799)

Meh. Slow, annoying to configure and navigate. Slow.

What the flipping fuck is Hyperic? (2, Insightful)

glwtta (532858) | more than 5 years ago | (#27820983)

Really, how hard is it to throw in a "monitoring app" somewhere along with all the hyperbole, so people can actually tell if they give a damn?

Yeah, yeah, this is (- A billion, Redundant), but where's the sorely needed (-1, Terrible summary)?

Is it just me... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27821081)

... or has anyone else noticed a huge increase in the anti-IBM sentiment on Slashdot? I know the company is not generally popular, but it seems like every other day there is essentially an advertisement for something or other that is supposed to take IBM down.

Is IBM the new Microsoft (who themselves were the the IBM)?

Yay for Java apps becoming even more over-engineer (0)

melted (227442) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821229)

Yay for Java apps becoming even more over-engineered than they already are. What really cracks me up is that Spring is presented as a "lightweight" solution, or indeed a solution that solves significant problems. I will take a hand-coded factory over an XML configuration file, so I can step right into it in the debugger without any problems. I will pass around a context object to avoid using AOP and be able to debug my apps. Some parts of Spring are nice, but people seem to use the worst ones. And as a result, you're condemning yourself to JAR hell, since Spring pulls in a dozen JARs, some versions of which might not match with the ones you use in your app. People just cross their fingers and hope it will work. :-)

The problem is that a lot of the Java devs I've met don't think they can let out a fart without using Spring, IoC and AOP and as a result they drastically overengineer the simplest programs and make them hard to maintain and debug.

From the website: "Redefining how Companies ... (1)

Qbertino (265505) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821585)

... build, run and manage business applications". ...

I'm sorry I didn't read any further. And I was to fast in closing the tabs to copy/paste the URLs. Go look yourself if you're really interested.

Forgot the "bol" ? (0, Redundant)

jhouserizer (616566) | more than 5 years ago | (#27821849)

Hyperic => Hyperbolic
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