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Mininova Starts Filtering Torrents

timothy posted more than 5 years ago | from the afterthought-beforetrial dept.

The Courts 267

Dreen writes with this snippet from TorrentFreak: "Just a few days before their court appearance, Mininova, the largest BitTorrent site on the Internet, has started to filter content. The site is using a third-party content recognition system that will detect and remove torrent files that link to copyright-infringing files."

cancel ×

267 comments

Lol. (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874229)

Let us know how that works out for you.

Coming up next (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874231)

Mininova collapses. How Mininova went from being the largest BitTorrent site to being the smallest.

Re:Coming up next (5, Funny)

Jah-Wren Ryel (80510) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874395)

Mininova collapses.

Mini-blackhole?

Re:Coming up next (5, Funny)

Scott Kevill (1080991) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874401)

Mininova collapses. How Mininova went from being the largest BitTorrent site to being the smallest.

Like a Suprnova collapsing, but with a smaller burst of radiation beforehand.

Re:Coming up next (1)

mister_playboy (1474163) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874739)

They don't host their own tracker, so they weren't really putting anything on the line before anyway. This isn't surprising to me.

Re:Coming up next (1)

jollyreaper (513215) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874763)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxtBG6FfSSw&NR=1

Remember when that other site got taken down, supernova I think? Yeah, it got taken down and nobody could find torrents anywhere else on the interweb after that.

In other news, traffic suddenly spikes at a new site, moninova. Hrmmm.

Re:Coming up next (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27875155)

Note your parent's spelling of Supernova. He's referencing the same site you're referencing..

Why Bother (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874233)

They're still going to end up in court.

Re:Why Bother (5, Interesting)

Animaether (411575) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874313)

Yes they are - but now they can more-or-less show 'good faith' to the judge.

Currently mininova - knowing full well the reason why people use their site - simply go by the strict laws.. if a copyright holder / representative tells them they're hosting particular copyrighted content, they'll take it down.

Of course it will be back up there 5 minutes later. This is pissing the Dutch interest groups off who are trying to slap the mininova people around a bit with other laws / more loose interpretations.

But now they can say "ahh, but look.. we installed a filter.. it's not our fault that them sneaky pirates find ways around those filters.. it would be *impossible* for us to manually go over each and every upload!".. then hope to exit the court grinning while their main page continues to display top 10 lists of every popular category with scarce 'legal' torrents (I think the Windows 7 Release Candidate was the only one when I checked yesterday and yes, I know there's nothing illegal about a torrent file itself.. splitting hairs over technical details is what they'll be doing in court).

Re:Why Bother (4, Insightful)

LordSnooty (853791) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874407)

yeah, cos it worked for TPB didn't it...

Re:Why Bother (5, Insightful)

Macthorpe (960048) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874641)

There's a difference between the Mininova defense and the TPB defense:

Mininova: "These are copyrighted, yes, but we do our best to remove content when flagged and we've even installed a filter to remove it automatically. It's not our fault if people still try and get around that."

TPB: "These are copyrighted, yes, but we don't fucking care. Ahahaha, losers."

I'm sure you can pick up the subtleties...

Re:Why Bother (2, Insightful)

noundi (1044080) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874799)

There's a difference between the Mininova defense and the TPB defense:

Why is this modded +5 insightful!? The trials take/took place in different countries, which naturally don't hold the same laws. That is the only difference that matters as equal crimes will be treated differently in different countries.

-1, self centred.

Re:Why Bother (5, Insightful)

KillerBob (217953) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875137)

No, he's right. The behaviour of the sites in question has a huge impact on the outcome... Mininova is at least attempting to appear as though they're cooperating with copyright holders. TPB, by contrast, has a long history of replying to C&D letters by telling them things like "This is Sweden, you've got no jurisdiction, silly American coroporation, so fuck off" and then posting said takedown notice on their site so that everybody can read their ridicule.

There's a slight difference. And the copyright laws aren't really *that* different in Sweden when compared to the Netherlands.

Re:Why Bother (1)

noundi (1044080) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875293)

No, he's right. The behaviour of the sites in question has a huge impact on the outcome...

Oh is he now? I would very much like to see what you're basing this "fact" on. Most likely your only references are other American trials, but prove me wrong and I'll stand corrected.

There's a slight difference. And the copyright laws aren't really *that* different in Sweden when compared to the Netherlands.

If you had any idea what you were talking about you'd know that the question is not about breaking or not breaking copyright laws, the question is about assisting in breaking copyright laws. This doesn't exist everywhere, Sweden included, I would know as I'm a Swede.

I'll admit I don't know much about Dutch law, but what I do know is that it resembles Swedish law more than American law as both countries are very social democratic. I don't intend to flamebait but seriously, the world doesn't spin around the US. Read, learn, understand, then speak. I hate to make this about the US but you and your ignorant assumptions drive people into it. Stereotyping is bad, statistics are facts.

Re:Why Bother (4, Informative)

Animaether (411575) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875405)

Correct - usually these sites are targeted under a "facilitating [whatever]" type thing;

"Hij benadrukt daarbij dat er, volgens hem, niets grijs is aan illegale torrentsites en trackers. 'Zij faciliteren de inbreuk en de torrents zijn ook een onmisbaar bestanddeel van de inbreuk. Dat is onrechtmatig, en een strafbaar feit,'" - citing Tim Kuik, BREIN (kinda like the riaa and mpaa and whatnot rolled into one).

To translate..
"He stresses that, according to him, torrentsites and trackers do not operate in a gray area. 'They facilitate the infringements and the torrents are a necessary part of the infringement. That is unlawful and a criminal act,'"

So regardless of whether mininova hosts the data, or even hosts the torrent files, if BREIN so wishes, they can sue under Dutch law.. and they are suing (court case upcoming). Whether the judge will agree with BREIN is another matter - but realistically, he would, and the arguments would be more about what damages are to be awarded.

Re:Why Bother (1)

noundi (1044080) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875645)

I can sue you for anything under any law no matter the alleged "crime", that's fundamental. The problem is Sweden. Our shit-in-the-pants nation is so scared of international friction that nobody expected any other initial outcome for the TBP trials. The sentence however has been appealed and will most likely be tried in the Swedish surpreme court as well. Whatever "standard" this trial set is definetly going challenged. Still EU is not US. Just because it passed in Sweden it doesn't make it any EU "standard" by default, and if the judge would consider this as an important factor he's wrong and should be prosecuted. Dutch law is dutch law and Swedish law is swedish law. A criminal in Sweden is not a criminal in Holland until he's trialed and sentenced in Holland. Period.

Re:Why Bother (2, Insightful)

RulerOf (975607) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875199)

The trials take/took place in different countries, which naturally don't hold the same laws.

He was pointing out the differences in the defense put forth by each, not the difference in the laws of the country in which the trial took place.

His point stands, I think. A big "Fuck you guys" is gonna get you on the shitlist of pretty much any judge, court, or (probably) jury.

Re:Why Bother (4, Informative)

Jah-Wren Ryel (80510) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874409)

I think the Windows 7 Release Candidate was the only one

I'm too lazy to double-check, but I would be mightily surprised if MS had consented to unregulated 3rd party distribution of any version of windows. Just because MS lets people freely download it from their own servers, and possibly those of a handful of designated 3rd parties, doesn't mean they've given permission for just anyone to distribute it.

Re:Why Bother (1, Redundant)

Animaether (411575) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874593)

quite possibly so

But at least you -can- download that legally without restrictions from the copyright holder itself; unlike the other results.

that's all I meant, really, but you're absolutely right that Microsoft probably hasn't authorized alternative distribution channels /nokarma

Re:Why Bother (1)

Talderas (1212466) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875047)

I would be mightily surprised if MS had consented to unregulated 3rd party distribution of any version of windows. Just because MS lets people freely download it from their own servers, and possibly those of a handful of designated 3rd parties, doesn't mean they've given permission for just anyone to distribute it.

Most likely, especially since you still have a product key for the version of Windows 7 that you download. I'm making some assumptions here, but I'm guessing that you aren't issued a product key when you download Windows 7 via a torrent or an authorized 3rd party distributor. This would mean that Microsoft could technically go after torrent seeders as unauthorized distributors committing copyright infringement.

Re:Why Bother (2, Interesting)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874611)

Currently mininova - knowing full well the reason why people use their site - simply go by the strict laws.. if a copyright holder / representative tells them they're hosting particular copyrighted content, they'll take it down.

Well I'm curious what the law is in wherever-it-is-that-Mininova is filtered?

In the US, responding to takedown notices is all that's required, and there is no obligation ("good faith" or otherwise) to do more. My understanding is that the problem with TPB was that they didn't respond to takedown notices (can anyone confirm?)

Furthermore, installing filtering software may run the risk of them being more liable, as they surely give up any claim of being a "common carrier".

I would be extremely worried if Mininova were found guilty for not actively filtering, even when they responded to takedown notices. Consider, how would one hypothetically run a legal bittorrent search engine (because there are at least a few legal bittorrents out there)? Would a bittorrent search engine be illegal simply because they fail to remove the link to copyrighted information even without a takedown notice? How does that make them any different to Google (not to mention ISPs and other hosts that make host actual copyrighted material, and not merely links to them)?

Re:Why Bother (5, Informative)

hahiss (696716) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874661)

Oh, there was a TBP *response* to takedown notices, just not, you know, the one that was hoped for:

http://thepiratebay.org/legal [thepiratebay.org]

Re:Why Bother (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27875409)

Wow, all those companies talking about DMCA. I like TPB response:

As you may or may not be aware, Sweden is not a state in the United States
of America. Sweden is a country in northern Europe.
Unless you figured it out by now, US law does not apply here.

Re:Why Bother (1, Informative)

bluesatin (1350681) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874693)

Bear in mind that the takedown requests are based on the "Online Copyright Infringement Liability Limitation Act (OCILLA)" and is a law in the United States and should therefore have no legal basis in another country.

Re:Why Bother (1)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874775)

Oops, I mean "Well I'm curious what the law is in wherever-it-is-that-Mininova is hosted" of course.

Good thing I got in when I did! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874247)

I like mininova and I'd hate to have to go somewhere else.

Luckily I've torrents for gigs upon gigs of TV shows so I think I have about a years worth of stuff to download so that'll give me enough time to find another.

It makes them useless (3, Interesting)

g253 (855070) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874263)

I saw the headline, and just immediately deleted my bookmark. I hardly ever used it anyway, but that makes them completely irrelevant to me.

Re:It makes them useless (5, Informative)

patro (104336) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874351)

Well, I downloaded the latest Lost torrent from it yesterday without any problem (sorry, I can't wait until they decide to air it here in Europe), so the filter is apparently not very good.

Re:It makes them useless (4, Informative)

lilo_booter (649045) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874519)

FTA: Mininova co-founder Niek told TorrentFreak that the system will be tested for 12 weeks with only a few titles.

Re:It makes them useless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874659)

Get your tv shows direct from http://eztv.it/ [eztv.it]

Re:It makes them useless (2, Informative)

spike1 (675478) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874681)

Where in europe?
The latest Lost episode is on sky one this weekend. It's only a 3 day wait.
(not that I don't agree, I downloaded it too) :)

Re:It makes them useless (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874397)

Really? They were the only torrenting place I ever frequented. Piratebay had too much junk, and I'd been burned one too many times to put up with it. isoHunt has a lower signal-to-noise ratio.

Mininova almost always got me what I wanted, when I wanted it. The few exceptions are movies that I guess no one else cares about any more and some really old books that no one has bothered to scan in.

Re:It makes them useless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874421)

Since I discovered BTjunkie several years ago, I rarely need to go anywhere else.

Big Yawn (5, Insightful)

Willeh (768540) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874283)

Sounds like they don't want any hits anymore. Meanwhile, alternatives like the Piratebay, isohunt & torrentreator are likely beefing up their infrastructure to accomodate the increase in traffic. There has been speculation on dutch tech sites that they only did this to appease the dutch copyright vigilantes, so they are making a half-assed effort to filter some stuff out. Let's face it, a torrent site without any "illegal" (under dutch law, downloading music & movies is LEGAL!) content is about as useful as a 3-legged, dead dog. With a nasty case of fleas.

Re:Big Yawn (5, Funny)

Shadow of Eternity (795165) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874293)

Biological weapon for a trebuchet.

Re:Big Yawn (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874363)

under dutch law, downloading music & movies is LEGAL!

[citation needed]

Re:Big Yawn (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27875087)

ah yes, now it seems one can get mod points just from parroting [citation needed] without having to contribute anything themselves, brilliant!

Re:Big Yawn (5, Informative)

bami (1376931) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875151)

citation [wikisource.org]

I know it's a wiki, but it's a carbon copy of the real lawbook, it's just the only page I could find that allows me to directly link to the article.

Let me translate something for you:

"Als inbreuk op het auteursrecht op een werk van letterkunde, wetenschap of kunst wordt niet beschouwd de verveelvoudiging welke beperkt blijft tot enkele exemplaren en welke uitsluitend dient tot eigen oefening, studie of gebruik van de natuurlijke persoon die zonder direct of indirect commercieel oogmerk de verveelvoudiging vervaardigt of tot het verveelvoudigen uitsluitend ten behoeve van zichzelf opdracht geeft."

Which you can translate loosly to:

"It is not considered copyright infringement if a copy is made solely for the purpose of own practice or study without direct or indirect commerical gain, and when the copy is only meant for himself".

If you want to read it yourself, here is a shoddy google translation: here [google.com]

In short, under Dutch law, it's legal to make copy's of copyrighted works (be it a movie, music or a piece of text), only if it's for yourself and does not give you a commercial gain. This rule was originally built to support people making back-up copies for them selves, but applies to the internet too. What you CAN'T do is upload copyrighted files (uploading = distribution), and this whole legal blurb doesn't apply to applications (uploading or downloading of software is both illegal).

Your turn.

Re:Big Yawn (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27875283)

under dutch law, downloading music & movies is LEGAL!

[citation needed]

THIS!!! IS!!! SLASHDOT!!!

*kicks parent poster into the goatse.cx hole*

Re:Big Yawn (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27875453)

The dutch law:
http://wetten.overheid.nl/BWBR0001886/geldigheidsdatum_08-05-2009#HoofdstukVI_Artikel45k

In short, making a backup copy of music is not illegal, even when the original is not yours. Taping a radio show for example is not illegal.

Letting others copy (uploading) on the other hand, is illegal unless you have permission to broadcast.

Re:Big Yawn (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874423)

Mininova can not technically be an alternative to a Bittorrent tracker (like TPB etc.), since Mininova is not a tracker - it's just an indexed repository for .torrent files.

Re:Big Yawn (1)

Overfiend1976 (979710) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874607)

Let's face it, a torrent site without any "illegal" (under dutch law, downloading music & movies is LEGAL!) content is about as useful as a 3-legged, dead dog. With a nasty case of fleas.

Yeah, let's hear it for defeating the purpose.

Re:Big Yawn (5, Informative)

CRCulver (715279) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874667)

Let's face it, a torrent site without any "illegal" (under dutch law, downloading music & movies is LEGAL!) content is about as useful as a 3-legged, dead dog. With a nasty case of fleas.

Downloading is in fact legal in many jurisdictions. But the problematic thing with Bittorrent is that it makes you an uploader as well, and that decidedly isn't legal in many jurisdictions.

Re:Big Yawn (1)

jabithew (1340853) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874955)

Unless you turn off the uploading...

In the mean time I note that Mininova still has in excess of 200 seeds and leaches active on the Fallout 3 DLC released a few days ago. So that's some good anti-piracy filter.

Re:Big Yawn (2, Funny)

isaac338 (705434) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875025)

What in the hell's a "leach"?

Re:Big Yawn (1)

mister_playboy (1474163) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875067)

Grammar nazi fodder?

Re:Big Yawn (1)

isaac338 (705434) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875111)

Touche.

Re:Big Yawn (1)

BJH (11355) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875121)

Spelling Nazi, sir - get your jackbooted thugs right!

Re:Big Yawn (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874729)

Obviously, you've never heard of legal material that can be downloaded through torrents like independent movies, large software distributions and such. But it's typical for people to think that everybody else is no better than them of course.

Re:Big Yawn (1)

lapinmalin (1400199) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874771)

I think the torrent model is pretty much updated anyway. I guess the future is rather more on sites like cacaotv.com that rely on some sort on p2p darknet to provide the movies to users

Given the reach of 'IP' law (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27875037)

those sites aren't much of an alternative. People are better off trying an anonymous network like I2P. [i2p2.de] Supposedly it can only handle song files in a realistic amount of time (at this point) but that is still significant to file sharers.

Re:Given the reach of 'IP' law (1)

spanky the monk (1499161) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875643)

not needed quite yet. Bittorrent is still good: we just need to index torrents (and maybe have trackers) on tor hidden servers. The actual p2p-ing can still be done on the open internetz.

Alternative? (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874303)

I use Mininova often, primarily to find torrents for two TV shows I watch regularly.

So the question is - what are the alternatives?

Re:Alternative? (2)

AlmondMan (1163229) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874333)

tvtorrents.com I've personally never used mininova for anything. There never seemed to be anything that I wanted on there, so in my mind it was always just some runty site with no content.

Re:Alternative? (1)

jonnythan (79727) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875447)

Site requires invitations.

Re:Alternative? (1)

bemymonkey (1244086) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874349)

Isohunt, Isohunt, Isohunt...

Re:Alternative? (4, Informative)

Archon-X (264195) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874357)

Depends which category you fall into.

Personally, I use NNTP.
There are a few ways you can go here.
I use www.bitnabber.com - for the monthly fee, I get the NNTP service, but also access to the download library - verified Music/Movie/TV/Games/Anime downloads, with full info (source, quality, reviews,etc) - makes browsing for a movie to download a breeze. Also supports streaming on downloading (try doing that on a torrent..)

The other way is to get yourself a cheaper NNTP account: usenetserver.com / giganews.com are the best.
From there, you can trawl NZB sites to get the NZBs for what you want to download.
There are some good ones out there, the best being newzbin.com - but it's invite only, hence why I went w/ the top option.

Re:Alternative? (2, Informative)

Inda (580031) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874859)

I haven't checked out usenetserver for a while but giganews is an all you can eat service. Great if you watch 2 movies a day but it's way over the top for casual users.

Astraweb has a pay per download service that suits me better. $25 for 120gb lasts me ages. When the GBP/$ exchange rate was good, this worked out the cheapest option for me. Today I pay about 70p for a DVDR. Today it takes about 35 mins from start to finish to download. 3 years ago, on my very old PC, it would sometimes take longer to extract the RARs than to download the whole DVDR.

binsearch (fantasic free service guys!), vcquality + a couple of greasemonkey scripts I wrote, makes finding stuff a breeze. NZB's are two-a-penny anyway.

Re:Alternative? (1)

vlm (69642) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874911)

Check out easynews before you commit to a NNTP provider.

Re:Alternative? (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874923)

At the moment astraweb has a $11 / month deal on which will give you unlimited downloads, 20 connections and ssl.
They have EU servers as well, I'm not sure if giganews has that.
http://www.news.astraweb.com/specials/kleverig-11.html [astraweb.com]

Re:Alternative? (1)

Inda (580031) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874991)

SSL is a must these days. Astraweb, on my package, give me unlimited connections. 30 is about the right ammount for me. YMMV.

18.5mbit down on my 20mbit cable modem. CPU + memory issues keep the speed down. Joining hundreds of parts is stressful on the electronics. :)

As an uncle post said, check the alternatives. Some are more suitable than others.

Re:Alternative? (1)

maxume (22995) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874891)

Astraweb lets a person test the NNTP waters for $10, with no additional fees (That $10 only buys 25 GB of transfer, so the low commitment makes for a (relatively) high rate).

Re:Alternative? (2, Interesting)

value_added (719364) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874917)

Personally, I use NNTP.

The first rule of USENET is ... oh, nevermind.

I use www.bitnabber.com

For yucks, I visited the site. Cute and friendly so I guess it would appeal to novice users. That said, the following caught my eye:

What can I download?

Using BitNabber's technology, it's possible to download anything you can imagine! Bitnabber updates in real time with the latest NZB files, allowing you to grab the latest in movies, music, tv shows, and software!

Reading the above I'm reminded of the way in which Napster (?) advertised themselves before being sued for contributory copyright infringement and went out business.

Then, there's the new and disturbing trend by state attorneys general to get together and browbeat content providers. Craig's List is the latest to draw their attention (turns out their Erotic Services section is too popular), but usenet providers have already been hit. A large number of groups that were alleged to contain child pornography are no longer accessible. Extending the successes of their Do It Or We'll Take You To Court approach to the alt.binaries.mp3 groups, for example, would seem a no brainer.

Glad you like bitnabber. Enjoy it while it lasts.

Re:Alternative? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874373)

I've been using the 'alternatives' for a long time now, namely thepiratebay and Demonoid. Far better in my opinion.

Re:Alternative? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874541)

For TV shows I don't understand why anyone wastes time torrenting - use Usenet. Your ISP probably already provides a news feed, just set up SABNZBD [sabnzbd.org] with MyTVNZB [foechoer.be] and TV shows will be downloaded automatically as soon as they're available and you don't have to waste your bandwidth seeding unneccesarily.

Re:Alternative? (2, Informative)

bluesatin (1350681) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874723)

Your ISP probably already provides a news feed [..]

Really?

How many ISPs actually have a feed set up, let alone anything more than just text.

I only know of a single ISP that provides a news server in the UK, that Virgin Media but I don't know anyone that trusts it.

Re:Alternative? (1)

robably (1044462) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875091)

I've used the Virgin news server for downloading binaries for about two years now - it's the reason I'm with Virgin - what do you mean about not trusting it?

Re:Alternative? (1)

bluesatin (1350681) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875159)

Well if Virgin own the server, I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard for them to log everything you download, that is if I'm not misunderstanding how these things work.

Re:Alternative? (1)

Archon-X (264195) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875201)

Virgin has nothing to do with it.
It comes in via Highwinds Media.

Re:Alternative? (1)

robably (1044462) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875223)

You think they're storing up evidence against me for two years, and that they're going to take me to court some day for using a service they provide? If there is illegal content there, it is Virgin who are making it available - they'd have to take themselves to court as well.

(In Virgin's case they don't own the server, they contract it out to a third party who provides the feed. I doubt it makes any difference to how easily they can inspect the logs, though.)

Re:Alternative? (1)

bluesatin (1350681) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875271)

Well I wouldn't put it past them that they would log all the data, and as soon as anyone requested it they would probably hand it over to them without a question.

I don't know if they still are involved with Phorm, but logging your downloads doesn't seem past their moral boundaries.

I should probably take my tin foil hat off.

Re:Alternative? (1)

junglee_iitk (651040) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874691)

http://www.torrentz.com/ [torrentz.com]

Search engine for search engines :) Plus you get the tracker list for free :) (So even if TPB goes down, your torrent will run.)

Re:Alternative? (2, Informative)

Krneki (1192201) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874879)

http://thepiratebay.org/tv
http://eztv.it/

You own me a beer.

aha (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874307)

so that's why my tvrss links ain't working no more

Isn't that a bit like... (3, Insightful)

bhunachchicken (834243) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874327)

... hiding the body after you've been accused of murder, hoping that you'll then not be convicted?

Re:Isn't that a bit like... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874343)

I suppose that depends on whether or not the judge and jury watched you hide the body.

Re:Isn't that a bit like... (4, Funny)

phalse phace (454635) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874569)

Maybe they can download the video of him hiding the body from Mininova???

Re:Isn't that a bit like... (4, Insightful)

Razalhague (1497249) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874451)

It's more like attempting to give CPR to the guy you just shot in the head.

Re:Isn't that a bit like... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874793)

... hiding the body after you've been accused of murder, hoping that you'll then not be convicted?

Maybe we could ask Mr. Reiser?

torrents via Shareaza. (1)

crhylove (205956) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874467)

That's why I keep IMPORTANT torrents alive on Shareaza. And I keep my outgoing encryption on in Deluge.

thats gash (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874551)

Extreme gash infact yet
another blow to filesharing, they were good for the odd thing here and there. I suppose the question is who is going to take their place.

Any bids ???

Victory! (5, Insightful)

Xelios (822510) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874683)

And it only took the RIAA + friends what? 4 years to kill Mininova? It must be frustrating to know there are literally hundreds of other torrent sites, all of which will be happy to take the 'refugees' from this minor inconvenience.

In any event being able to bully torrent sites into submission through legal means isn't what I'm worried about. I'm much more worried about them coercing ISP's into their little self-regulation schemes, as if it's somehow an ISP's responsibility to protect Sony BMG's copyrights. It strikes me as being just as misguided as expecting the people who maintain our roads to be responsible for people smuggling drugs across the border. Sorry guys, if you want to cling to the old IP system in the information age you should be prepared to do all the hard work yourself. If you don't like it I'm sure we can come up with some new, fairer systems to try.

Or, you know, just bribe politicians until you get your way. I guess that works too...

It's kinda funny... (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874697)

http://www.mininova.org/tor/2569928

This is one of their "featured torrents". It's called "How to bypass mininovas copyright filter". I'm mildly amuzed.

Featured torrents: (5, Interesting)

skzo (1058906) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874735)

I went to mininova just now, and on the front page I found:
Featured torrents:
"How to bypass mininovas copyright filter"

I've browsed through a lot of the comments (2, Informative)

L4t3r4lu5 (1216702) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874747)

I would guestimate that 3/4 of the OP comments which don't agree with this course of action are people who are actively using Mininova to search for copyrighted material, against the terms of the applicable license. Apparently BitTorrent is predominantly used for copyright infringement.

Well done for proving the RIAA / MPAA right, boys. You're a true help to the cause.

Re:I've browsed through a lot of the comments (5, Insightful)

mdwh2 (535323) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874823)

If I say that Google shouldn't have to actively search out and filter content (which they don't, nor do they have to by US law), does that mean Google is predominantly used for copyright infringement? I don't think so.

Your argument is a straw man anyway. I don't think anyone would deny that bittorrent is mainly used for copyright infringement, but the issues are whether search engines should be liable. Also consider that even though something is copyright infringement by law doesn't mean it is unethical - e.g., someone downloading something they already bought in another format, or a BBC licence payer in the UK downloading BBC produced content, and another example would be using it as a form of timeshifting, downloading a show you just missed on TV you pay for. Consider, in the UK it's copyright infringement to copy a CD you've bought onto your own mp3 player. So it would be accurate to say that "MP3 players are used almost entirely for copyright infringement" - however that's not really a fair statement, and doesn't mean people are downloading things they haven't paid for.

Re:I've browsed through a lot of the comments (1)

mr_matticus (928346) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875265)

also consider that even though something is copyright infringement by law doesn't mean it is unethical

That something may be called ethical doesn't make it permissible, nor does it mean that another perspective on that same issue is unethical. Your response to the straw man begs the question and implies a binary where none exists.

Property law isn't entirely about ethics--in fact very little law is. Instead, it's simply about balancing competing interests. Ethical conduct is the domain of criminal law and certain areas of administrative law. Most transactions aren't questions of ethics, and any ethical justification you might rationalize about copyright infringement is mooted by the ethical violations conducted in the unlawful taking. As they say, two wrongs don't make a right.

Quirks in the law do need to be resolved, but it doesn't entitle a person to flaunt it simply because they feel like it. They were never entitled to possession of any of it, except in exchange for their legally binding commitment to abide by the terms under which it was provided. It does absolutely no good for anyone actually working on practical resolutions to have the efforts constantly undermined by a certain subset of the population. Don't like, don't buy, do without has always been the rule--until greed and false entitlement took over.

It's bad enough dealing with the recording industry on good days, but when they see the brazen disregard from the vocal minority, it not only ruins the sensible majority, but also stirs up a fresh round of crazy from the industry giants. The RIAA and the belligerent loonies can point fingers at each other for the rest of eternity, but they're both wrong and nothing resembling an appropriate personal use framework will ever come to pass until the gimme-gimme generation quits stealing (and pretending it's noble) and the recording industry stops having a shit-fit (and pretending they're not the ones killing themselves) long enough to get something done.

The rhetoric of "revolutionary reform" is nothing more than a pretense for selfish destruction. Actual reformers keep having years of hard lobbying and legal work torn apart by both sets of wankers, and the cold truth is that both groups are reviled and equally idiotic. This community just happens to be too one-sided to see it, lost in rants on how they don't have anyone on their side and don't have any lobbying power and so they MUST act out like petulant children, because they DESERVE to enjoy entertainment they never had any intention of paying for, because anyone who's ever dared to sell rights-limited copies earns TOO MUCH. They don't, on either count, and the reason they consistently lose is by destroying the work of allies thanks to ignorance, sensationalist trolling, and astroturfing.

It's really quite tiring. It's just a different version of the 15 year-old brat complaining that the car she's being offered to replace her Toyota is a $40,000 Lexus instead of the $77,000 E-Class she demanded.

Re:I've browsed through a lot of the comments (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27875617)

So how exactly is downloading an album without paying different to simply not buying it, from the copyright holder's point of view?

You may find this [nynerd.com] helpful, as you seem to be somewhat confused about what theft is.

Sony v. Universal & Selection Bias (2, Interesting)

langelgjm (860756) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874857)

Apparently BitTorrent is predominantly used for copyright infringement. Well done for proving the RIAA / MPAA right, boys. You're a true help to the cause.

According to the logic of Sony v. Universal, as long as the technology has substantial non-infringing uses, the creators won't be held liable for contributory infringement. That's under US law, of course.

Also, there's this thing called selection bias. [wikipedia.org] Or don't you think people who primarily use Mininova to download infringing material would be more likely to comment on an article that says Mininova is filtering infringing material?

Sheesh.

Re:I've browsed through a lot of the comments (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27875469)

Apparently BitTorrent is predominantly used for copyright infringement.

Well dur! I didn't think this point was ever really in question, at least on slashdot. You'll be asserting that illegal downloads are the same as lost revenue and that copywrite infringment is theft if you don't watch out. Keep up, this meetings been going on without you.

Are there any torrents left? (3, Insightful)

worip (1463581) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874797)

After Mininova implements this fully, how much content will be left?
I guess the open source stuff will still be there, and any software that is in the public domain. How about those e-books that are nowhere else to be found, except on torrents?

Re:Are there any torrents left? (2, Funny)

Lord Lode (1290856) | more than 5 years ago | (#27874861)

I think it's good to have a legal torrent site that hasn't the risk of being closed down associated with it.

No great loss... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27874975)

I stopped going anywhere near Mininova a long time ago. For two reasons -- 1. it is often full of fakes, and if you report them, the total jerks that run Mininova just block your IP address. And 2. It's absolutely full of torrents from private sites, which totally defeats the point of file sharing.

There's 100s of other sites, most of them better. Mininova will not be missed by many, nor for long.

Emule And Bit Torrent (0, Offtopic)

Sam36 (1065410) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875049)

Follows, I have been using emule for many years now but I have noticed that more and more I am having to use bit torrent to get the stuff that I am looking for. How ever, bit torrent really seems to suck. So many torrents loose all of their seeds and then can never be downloaded. It is very hard to share files on bit torrent since you have to collect the the files together, then make a torrent file and figure out what tracker to send it to. Why can't it just be like emule where you just dump everything into one folder (or heck just share C:\). And constantly I am seeing these trackers get shut down. Why does bit torrent seem to suck so much for me? Are there better tracker sites that I just don't know about?

China torrent site (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27875075)

Ww are all waiting for a torrent site in china.

Mininova goes Supernova (3, Insightful)

hesaigo999ca (786966) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875407)

That will prove to be 99.9% of their traffic, and revenue...
well it was fun while it lasted, now on to the next one!
(crouches down as if on a hunt) .....have you seen any ISOs around here lately?

HOW do they do it? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#27875441)

It seems if they filter by text (like the title contains "batman" or whatever) then this would be extremely effective.

I'm trying to figure out how it would -not- be effective. I'm a moron... please explain. Seems torrent clients would need to be redesigned to use like some kind of encryption for the actual filename or ... ?

I'm not concerned with Mini, but the potential for all the other torrent sites to follow suit. Maybe I'm just being paranoid.

Freenet? (1)

EllisDees (268037) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875443)

Does anyone have any idea how difficult it would be to set up a tracker within freenet? Is there already a project anywhere trying to do this?

HOW? (2, Interesting)

silver007 (1479955) | more than 5 years ago | (#27875531)

Seems like this would be very easy to do. A text filter looking at the torrent names. I'm trying to figure out how this would -not- be effective... and if the host site didn't do this, why would the court not demand it? Seems like such an easy solution, until someone redesigns the actual torrent clients for encrypted filenames or something. I'm not worried about Mini specifically, but what if all sites were required to do this? Just hypothetically...
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