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Moblin 2.0 Released, Intel's Linux For Netbooks

Soulskill posted more than 5 years ago | from the new-and-shiny dept.

Intel 142

eldavojohn writes "Yesterday, Moblin, the joint OS project between Novell and Intel, was released as V2.0 Beta for netbooks with the image available for download. We've talked about Moblin before, but Computer World has an article speculating this is Intel's direct affront to Microsoft's Windows 7 by pointing out that Moblin is designed to optimally use Intel's Atom Processor and smaller screens so popular with netbooks. Windows 7's netbook competition doesn't stop there, as GoodOS's gOS3 Gadgets and Canonical's Ubuntu Netbook Remix are being designed to also take advantage of Intel's Atom, especially from a UI perspective. Ars has a look at Moblin's rich new UI as well. Back in April, Intel said it would support Windows 7 on the Atom later this year, and Intel also says Windows 7 is a good choice for Intel's netbooks, so it doesn't look like they're intentionally burning any bridges between them and Redmond."

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142 comments

Meh. (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027047)

I'm waiting for them to release GLADOS for Netbooks.

Re:Meh. (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027087)

Wolfram is saying he is going to be installing Alpha as an operating system on netbooks, since it can solve all problems.

Re:Meh. (1)

ByOhTek (1181381) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027397)

Personally, I'm waiting for Like-Like on my two-wheel transportation device.

I'm just worried it'll eat my shield.

Re:Meh. (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027593)

My preecioooous! (5, Funny)

Yvan256 (722131) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027051)

Oh wait, Moblin, not Goblin.

Carry on.

Re:My preecioooous! (2, Informative)

2.7182 (819680) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027311)

Gollum was not a technically not goblin in the sense meant by Tolkien. He was some sort of proto-hobbit that had been warped by the ring. "Goblin" is a term used by Tolkien to mean orc. Although to be fair, wiki says

"A goblin is an imaginary evil, crabby, and mischievous creature described as a grotesquely disfigured or gnome-like phantom, that may range in height from that of a dwarf to that of a human. "

Re:My preecioooous! (1)

Hognoxious (631665) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027579)

A horse is a quadruped with hooves yadda yadda yadda, but that doesn't mean any quadruped with hooves yadda yadda yadda is a horse.

Re:My preecioooous! (5, Funny)

neiras (723124) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027667)

"...an imaginary evil, crabby, and mischievous creature described as a grotesquely disfigured or gnome-like phantom..."

What is it with you KDE fanbois and your personal attacks? We likes our desktop clean, simple, and brown.

We also likes fisshesss, yes we does.

Re:My preecioooous! (1)

HermMunster (972336) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028135)

Haha, then use KDE and paint your monitor brown.

Re:My preecioooous! (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030005)

I belive there is a GUI tickbox for that in kde4

Re:My preecioooous! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28030219)

That's actually just Ubuntu. Gnome's colors are blue and tan/grey.

Re:My preecioooous! (0)

ByOhTek (1181381) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027335)

That's Gollum, not goblin!

Re:My preecioooous! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027387)

Lol status: Loled

Re:My preecioooous! (1)

diskofish (1037768) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027583)

Tagged rhymeswithgoblin.

Re:My preecioooous! (1)

sys.stdout.write (1551563) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030579)

It definitely needs a new name. "Eunuchs or UNIX. Either way, there is no sex involved."

Duh. (3, Insightful)

Jurily (900488) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027077)

that Moblin is designed to optimally use Intel's Atom Processor and smaller screens so popular with netbooks.

I for one, welcome our new optimized-for-the-fucking-device-they-sell-it-with overlords.

Re:Duh. (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028225)

I my self have learned to tell if I am using a quality OS by whether it installs a video editor (whether you want it or not) and has a dedicated system process watch over it and put it back in case you delete it.

Some Linux OS's come with video editors, but unfortunately an admin can still uninstall it. I say Linux has a way to go before being ready for the general user. ;)

Re:Duh. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028257)

what you say is irrelevant.

moving on..

Re:Duh. (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028387)

Actually it is quite relevant. It's a comment on the fact that winXP resists being slimmed down, while never the less being MS's best system for the types of devices we are talking about. Which is to say, XP is not optimized for netbooks. Thus the post is relevant both to the GP and to the topic in general.

Only it was expressed as a joke that went over your head.

Re:Duh. (2, Informative)

Jurily (900488) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029195)

winXP resists being slimmed down

Meanwhile, there's GeeXboX [geexbox.org] , a whopping 20 Mb livecd, fully functional as a media center.

Background (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027125)

Background is goatse [goatse.fr] .

Windows Vista.

Re:Background (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028285)

No, the Windows Vista background is a picture of Hitler.

Re:Background (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028653)

That's Windows 7. It's better than Vista.

Re:Background (3, Funny)

Molochi (555357) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028857)

I thought that was Windows 7.

When I hit Ctr-Alt-Del his eyes just flash.

Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (5, Insightful)

Digital Pizza (855175) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027159)

How about a summary that describes the new Moblin release (what the post is ostensibly about), rather than focusing on the competition against Win7? How about being FOR something (Moblin in this case), rather than always being against Microsoft?

I'm no fan of Microsoft, but seriously, the one-note, constant Microsoft bashing on this site is getting old.

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (4, Informative)

MBCook (132727) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027225)

Yep. I didn't upvote this in the FireHose because it seemed to be just a collection of "Intel makes something".

Ars Technica [arstechnica.com] has a descriptive hands-on preview. Much more useful.

cooperation between Intel and linux?!? (4, Informative)

je ne sais quoi (987177) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027739)

Thanks for the link. I found this comment very interesting:

Intel recently turned over control of the project to the Linux Foundation with the aim of making it even more open to other contributors. The long-term goal is to turn Moblin into the nexus of mobile Linux development and make it the de facto standard Linux platform for portable devices.

So, it's more than just that Intel is releasing this. It's Intel, working with the Linux Foundation in an attempt to create a new standard. Isn't this pretty much the ideal case for we've been asking for in open source? A propietary hardware manufacturer working with an open source consortium to create and release open source software. I'll view this collaboration as successful if we start seeing netbooks for sale from major OEMs with this OS installed.

Oh, and some other random stuff I saw that I liked:
-standard X11 window server and can run most linux apps
-the clutter organizational scheme looks intriguing but I'd have to use it for awhile before I could tell you if I liked it or not.
-It's using the gecko HTML rendering engine. What's interesting here is it is not using webkit.
-Lastly, I'd like to see something on how well the wireless network device works and changing networks. The article was a bit short on this aspect. Has anybody used it? How is it?

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028785)

Yep. I didn't upvote this in the FireHose because it seemed to be just a collection of "Intel makes something".

Ars Technica [arstechnica.com] has a descriptive hands-on preview. Much more useful.

So you're +5 informative when you regurgitate what the parent said and provide a link that's in the summary? The summary says:

Ars has a look at Moblin's rich new UI [arstechnica.com] as well.

Which is the same damn link you "just found." Do any moderators read the summary even?

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027375)

I'm no fan of Microsoft, but seriously, the one-note, constant Microsoft bashing on this site is getting old.

It's easy to spot MS shills. Most of the time they say something like that.
"I'm no fan of MS, but.." or
"I'll play the devil's advocate.." or
"I hate MS as much as the next guy, but.."

-N.S.Sherlock

I hate Linux as much as the next guy (not really) (2, Funny)

ClosedSource (238333) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027543)

"It's easy to spot MS shills."

Of course there are no Linux shills because everyone else here is totally objective and has no particular interest in promoting Linux.

Re:I hate Linux as much as the next guy (not reall (3, Funny)

Hognoxious (631665) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027631)

Shills are paid. Linux is free and also free!

The word you're looking for is "zealots".

Re:I hate Linux as much as the next guy (not reall (1)

HermMunster (972336) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028509)

I was going to point that out but you caught it. These are guys that feel jilted by something and they will fight to the death to protect Microsoft, for whatever reason.

Re:I hate Linux as much as the next guy (not reall (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028313)

Just because I bash Micro$haft and Windoze doesn't mean I use a POS like Linux. I'd use something useless like Minix 3 any day over Linux. Secondly, shills are people paid by a company to make sales pitches. Everyone knows that no one uses Linux so how would anyone have money to pay for shills?

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (1)

Rycross (836649) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030211)

Right, except you really have no proof of shilling, and stating this is just a intellectually dishonest/lazy way of throwing aside someone's argument without addressing their points.

In fact, nearly every claim of shilling is intellectually dishonest. Either put up some evidence or shut up.

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28030469)

Sup, shill. How was Ballmer's cock last night?

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (1)

Rycross (836649) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030845)

Thanks for proving my point.

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027563)

bash ms all day. long time slashdot lurker here. I hadn't heard about moblin until I read this article (and subsequently the ars technica article w/ screens), so it served its purpose for me.

As the Unedited Submitter ... (5, Informative)

eldavojohn (898314) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027625)

How about a summary that describes the new Moblin release (what the post is ostensibly about), rather than focusing on the competition against Win7? How about being FOR something (Moblin in this case), rather than always being against Microsoft?

I'm no fan of Microsoft, but seriously, the one-note, constant Microsoft bashing on this site is getting old.

Well, it's edited pretty much how it's submitted so I'll take full responsibility for this one.

I guess I'm confused though. I didn't seem to think my summary was pro or anti Microsoft--merely focusing on what else is out there besides Windows 7 for netbooks and pointing out that Intel may have an unfair advantage in this department. If anything, I was hoping for discourse containing thoughtful comments about Intel's upper hand in pointing Novell in the correct direction for optimally using the chips/chipset/gpu in these hardware devices surrounding the Atom process.

When I looked for other stories to reference this one to [google.com] , I found 10 or more talking about Windows 7 on the netbook and one talking about Moblin (the on linked in the story). I'm sorry for not continuing the trend of talking about Windows 7 and am disappointed you think my submission was a veiled attempt to attack Microsoft. I am anti-Microsoft but I try to keep that relegated to my posts down here instead of in the summary.

Specifically what did I write that was offensive to you? I also found the title of the Computerworld article to be speculation but the actual text to have level headed statements from Intel (something I tried to reflect in the summary). I guess I failed and I apologize for making Slashdot seem so biased ... we really do need to shake that image at least a little bit to be taken seriously.

Re:As the Unedited Submitter ... (2, Informative)

kthejoker (931838) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029237)

I see it less as antagonistic, and more of "Why even mention Microsoft at all?" The summary comes across as an analysis of Moblin as compared to Windows 7 (and a larger overview of how Windows 7 fits in to the future of netbook OSes) instead of just saying,

"Hey, look, Intel released a new OS for netbooks. Take a look."

Which would've been much more to the point.

Re:As the Unedited Submitter ... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28030521)

So when I mentioned gOS3 and Ubuntu Netbook Remix, that was offensive to them because I was comparing Moblin to them ... ? You have not convinced me of anything at all.

One more thing:

"Hey, look, Intel released a new OS for netbooks. Take a look."

Oh that doesn't sound like a Slashvertisement? Someone got modded highly for criticizing the story is just "intel makes something" [slashdot.org] which is not a story.

Re:As the Unedited Submitter ... (1)

silent_artichoke (973182) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030261)

If anything, I was hoping for discourse containing thoughtful comments...

This is where things went poopy for ya.

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (1)

ImaLamer (260199) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027719)

You must be new here... it's been old for years.

Not even that I'm a fan, but it does get old. If BillG cured cancer tomorrow they'd say he started it.

But really, competition is what this is all about - and Windows 7 is looking pretty decent. Linux needs to compete with that next, why not start getting ahead of it before release time comes around?

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027833)

No, it doesn't get old. Accusing people of being new becuase they don't agree with you gets old : P

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft ksh. (4, Insightful)

Tetsujin (103070) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027905)

How about a summary that describes the new Moblin release (what the post is ostensibly about), rather than focusing on the competition against Win7? How about being FOR something (Moblin in this case), rather than always being against Microsoft?

I'm no fan of Microsoft, but seriously, the one-note, constant Microsoft bashing on this site is getting old.

OK, what "Microsoft bashing"?

These products (Moblin, Windows 7, etc.) are in competition with one another in the netbook market. If Moblin achieves some level of success in the netbook market, that reduces the number of netbooks sold with Windows 7. So, the summary states (quite correctly) that this system is a threat to Windows in the netbook market. Any well-packaged system optimized for the platform would be. It's just a fact.

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft ksh. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028589)

OK, what "Microsoft bashing"?

Duh, the part where something Non-Microsoft might do well.

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027917)

microsoft is the enemy. get over yourself.

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (1)

HermMunster (972336) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028371)

It's a result of the fact that that is where it is focused and the fact that we want to see competition everywhere.

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28029531)

I am a conservative. Microsoft bashing is enough for me. I leave Apple bashing to newcomers.

Re:Another typical Slashdot microsoft bash. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28030825)

No, it is mellifluous, polyphonic and always new. It is the sound of awakening.

It's a secret to everybody. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027259)

+50 Rupees (v2.0)

Very promising (5, Interesting)

javacowboy (222023) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027297)

I looked at the screenshots, and this looks really cool. They've put a lot of thought into the GUI, which is not only designed for netbooks and small screens, but touch screens as well.

Moblin is also totally open source, meaning that they won't charge for it and they'll get contributions from the larger open source community.

Unless Microsoft has some secret feature in Windows 7 designed for netbooks that nobody's heard of, then Linux could reclaim the lead in netbook OS's. If somebody ports Moblin to ARM, then Microsoft is in even bigger trouble.

Re:Very promising (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027481)

30 seconds of googling and you have your answer [jkontherun.com]

as for arm? don't count your chickens just yet. linux had a wide base of netbooks in the beginning and it faltered. was the fault that of the netbooks that are still being sold now with winxp or of linux? use a little brain power here and you'll come to a conclusion.

my prediction is that arm comes out gang busters and dies quickly into a niche market grave. how many technologies have you've seen with this kind of traction that end up going no where due to lack of software support? if you can't think of many than you must be new to the game.

Re:Very promising (2, Interesting)

mhall119 (1035984) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028833)

as for arm? don't count your chickens just yet. linux had a wide base of netbooks in the beginning and it faltered. was the fault that of the netbooks that are still being sold now with winxp or of linux? use a little brain power here and you'll come to a conclusion.

Linux still holds a greater share of the netbook market than it does the traditional desktop market. The fact that even after Windows was available on these netbooks they couldn't secure the same market share tells me that people find Linux more suitable on netbooks than they do on desktops, or windows less so (or both).

my prediction is that arm comes out gang busters and dies quickly into a niche market grave. how many technologies have you've seen with this kind of traction that end up going no where due to lack of software support?

ARM will be a niche market as long as Linux is a niche market. However, if Linux becomes a significant player in netbooks, then so can ARM, because all the same software support will exist.

Re:Very promising (3, Interesting)

ducomputergeek (595742) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028091)

It's clear they did put a lot of effort in designing the UI. We've got a couple netbooks around the office and I'm tempted to try it out. But from another review, the reviewer noted that it's not packaged with binary drivers. So if you are stuck with certain Wifi cards it may suffer the same pain in the ass that linux generally does: having to track down a damned driver.

That being said, using it with a netbook preloaded with Mobilin where all the hardware is designed to work with linux from the get go....it's worth considering.

Re:Very promising (1)

erroneus (253617) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029071)

Fortunately netbooks have a slightly less varied range of hardware choices... slightly. What would be very cool of them to do is recruit various enthusiasts who are already tweaking Linux on their own netbooks to tweak moblin loads for specific models. Then you can just grab the image for whatever netbook you have. Sure, there are lots of them out there now... but the major ones could certainly be done -- say like my little ASUS 900a and my Dell Mini9 with EDGE/GPRS card..?

Re:Very promising (2, Informative)

crush (19364) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029961)

It's an interesting point you make.
Currently it's worth avoiding netbooks that have the following hardware:

1. Intel GMA500 aka Poulsbo graphics chipsets. There is no FOSS driver for these. That's because there's a PowerVR core in them. The Fedora Project's Adam Williamson seems [fedoraproject.org] to have found some partial drivers hidden away in a quiet little Ubuntu repository where they were dumped by the Intel team. But success seems partial. So for now avoid anything with GMA500.

2. Broadcom wireless. Again avoid these Broadcom 4322 like the fscking plague. Dan Williams (again a Red Hat / Fedora person) has a fairly scathing [gnome.org] take on them based on his experiences of trying to get suspend/resume and wireless to work consistently.

3. Elantech touchpads. Bastien Nocera (what is it with all those Red Hat people, don't they like closed-source binary drivers?) may have had some success at wringing some code out of Ubuntu and Intel people [hadess.net] to share with the rest of us, but it still seems uncertain.

4. CPU. The Intel Z-series draw less power [linuxdevices.com] than the N-series apparently.

5. RAM expansion. Lots of the netbooks have a single, soldered slot. So if you like being stuck with 1GB of RAM while you try to run OpenOffice.org-3 then go ahead, have fun.

So, the bottom line is that the Dell Mini 10v might be OK as regards the graphics (it's GMA950) which in turn means that it doesn't do HDMI and has an unfortunately lower vertical resolution than the Mini10v, but the wireless sucks and the touchpad probably sucks, the RAM is fixed too low.

Looking at the HP Mini 1000s its difficult to tell what wireless they use. Graphics are GMA950 [hp.com] unlike the older HP2133 which used Chrome9 graphics chipsets for which VIA has failed to release FOSS drivers.

Seems like a lot of the netbook producers (even those such as Intel, Dell and Ubuntu that pay lipservice to "Open Source") are having a hard time being honest and straightforward with us.

Re:Very promising (1)

gknoy (899301) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030079)

So if you are stuck with certain Wifi cards it may suffer the same pain in the ass that linux generally does: having to track down a damned driver.

With backing from Intel, I'd be surprised if we didn't see an open source driver (or even a binary closed-source one?) that was available "out of the box" for the Centrino chipset's wireless hardware. Since so many vendors are likely to use such a bundled package, that covers a lot of the spectrum already -- just like if the intel graphics driver is available. (It is, right? I forget, as I don't have one.)

Re:Very promising (2, Interesting)

crush (19364) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030339)

FOSS drivers are only available for GMA945, GMA950 chipsets in current notebooks. Anything with the GMA500 may or may not work with some hard-to-get-ahold-of proprietary blobs. See my post abopve. It sucks. Intel have made a good name for themselves in the past with Freeing their drivers but this GMA500 thing is muddying the market and causing uncertainty. In the past I would have felt happy that choosing Intel was going to mean FOSS drivers but now I'd think twice before recommending them or purchasing them.

Re:Very promising (1)

timeOday (582209) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028319)

But I guess Moblin isn't related to OLPC Sugar at all? It's a shame OLPC already went down this road and, I guess, failed. But maybe Intel will have more luck.

Re:Very promising (1)

nine-times (778537) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028819)

I guess it depends on what you mean by "failed". There were some cool/interesting things about OLPC, but they couldn't get the price down as low as they wanted, and from what I hear they had various political issues (including Microsoft trying to get Windows onto them). That's not to say they had no effect, or that some of what they developed won't make it into other things.

Re:Very promising (1)

timeOday (582209) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030229)

I wouldn't consider OLPC overall a failure, but apparently they droped the custom Linux (Sugar) for Windows, if so then Sugar didn't succeed in that market.

How, exactly (1)

93 Escort Wagon (326346) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027301)

Do you "take advantage of Intel's Atom ... from a UI perspective"? (and don't confuse "User Interface" with display technology)

Re:How, exactly (2, Insightful)

cant_get_a_good_nick (172131) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027753)

The same way 'NetBurst' was to make your Internet surfing faster....

I still remember when Dilbert was 'Optimized for Intel', basically added a useless java app to slow the page for anyone on a slower CPU. I lost some respect for Adams on that one, though i'm not sure how much he was consulted.

Re:How, exactly (4, Interesting)

Yvan256 (722131) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028273)

Bypass all of the useless Web 2.0 Flash/Java/AJAX pushed by their marketing department:

www.dilbert.com/fast/

Seriously, if there's one website that should know better than to listen to their marketing department, it's Dilbert.com

Download speed (2, Informative)

Yvan256 (722131) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027435)

Or shall I say download slowness:

2.8 of 666 MB (3.8 KB/sec) 2 days, 1 hour remaining.

Not to mention that they mention a VMWare image on a page, link to the download page and no VMWare image can be found there.

Re:Download speed (1)

ryanvm (247662) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028083)

No kidding - and I can't find any mirrors either.

Re:Download speed (1)

Yvan256 (722131) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028181)

About 40 minutes later: 2.8 of 666 MB (0.8 KB/sec) 9 days, 11 hours remaining.

Seriously, that's what torrents are for.

Re:Download speed (3, Funny)

kohaku (797652) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028713)

666 MB (0.8 KB/sec) 9 days, 11 hours remaining.

You sure you want to download that?

Re:Download speed (1)

isama (1537121) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029147)

Well... There are satanists who hate the us :P

Re:Download speed (4, Informative)

ryanvm (247662) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028183)

Re:Download speed (1)

Yvan256 (722131) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028207)

And they have a plan.

Re:Download speed (1)

Yvan256 (722131) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028251)

Thanks.

Mirrors! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028505)

http://mirrors1.kernel.org/moblin/releases/test/beta//images/
http://mirrors2.kernel.org/moblin/releases/test/beta//images/

Re:Download speed (1)

mdm-adph (1030332) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029311)

Aye, the download had a very slow speed for me, too -- I had to use DownThemAll for Firefox (very cool extension) to get it in a reasonable amount of time (about an hour).

What does the processor... (2, Insightful)

jeffliott (1558799) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027585)

...have to do with the interface really? My understanding is that most netbook builds tweak disk and UI related functions which hardly have any relevance to the processor. The summary implies that these non-Moblin builds have optimizations/customizations that improve the function with the Intel Atom processor, but I'm guessing this is not yet true. Naturally, the customized UIs have been an awesome improvement for the netbooks, but that would be true regardless of Intel's Atom Processor.

Re:What does the processor... (1)

Molochi (555357) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029227)

Maybe they don't want hordes of cheap, 5 year old centrino notebooks with Moblin flooding Ebay? Say, that's not a bad idea...

New Moblin (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027595)

Maybe this version can get the Triforce of Wisdom from that pesky Zelda before that brat Link interferes. All hail Lord Ganon!

fancy UI's are a gimmick (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28027655)

I've been using a netbook for a while now and have tried ubuntu's Remix, but I don't use it anymore. Just prefer the good 'ol default desktop I guess.

Re:fancy UI's are a gimmick (1)

Just Some Guy (3352) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027927)

I think you installed the wrong one. Netbook Remix is almost the exact opposite of a fancy UI, instead opting for a few large application icons and easy navigation.

Re:fancy UI's are a gimmick (1)

Gothmolly (148874) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029299)

Let me guess, your Mac Quadra running OS8 can outperform it, while doing a simple file copy/paste ?

The Year (1)

oldhack (1037484) | more than 5 years ago | (#28027743)

This will be the year of Linux netbook. We'll take whatever we can get.

One reason why Linux isn't taking off: (1)

itsdapead (734413) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028037)

Back in April, Intel said it would support Windows 7 on the Atom later this year, and Intel also says Windows 7 is a good choice for Intel's netbooks, so it doesn't look like they're intentionally burning any bridges between them and Redmond."

Unfortunately, nobody ever sold a new idea by sitting on the fence. Until a computer manufacturer starts pro-actively pushing Linux on their hardware as (rightly or wrongly) better than Windows, Linux will not take off.

As long as the line is "do you want Windows or Linux on that, Sir", and the seller gets paid whichever way, Windows will be the easiest sell to the typical punter and before you know it it will be "Linux? Oh, there's not much demand for that, we'd have to do a special order". That's basically what has been happening to netbooks ever since XP was re-released for them.

Apple manages to persuade people to switch to OS X by selling cool hardware which only comes with OS X and continually telling punters that OSX is better than Windows. Even since the switch to Windows-compatable hardware, they've kept Boot Camp/Parallels/VMWare positioned as an optional "if you really must" add-on (reassuringly expensive when you factor in the cost of a full copy of Windows) - you won't catch them offering a straight choice between Windows and OS/X on your new Mac.

Meanwhile - looking at the screenshots - can someone tell Intel that it is traditional for an icon to have some reasonably obvious thematic link with what it does? The only remotely intelligible one is the "Music" one - but that seems to mean all media rather than music.

It's the apps. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028453)

The Linux world is fractured, meaning that a single binary will only work on a small fraction of all Linux distros. Windows is binary compatible across its desktops. OS X is binary compatible across its desktops. Without a unified market,

Re:It's the apps. (2, Informative)

itsdapead (734413) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030801)

The Linux world is fractured, meaning that a single binary will only work on a small fraction of all Linux distros.

But with Linux, the distro usually comes with comes with all the applications you can eat, either on disc or in the online repositories. This is the preferred way for non-techies to get their apps (whereas no true slashdotter would install a binary package when they could roll their own tarball instead).

Punters need to be told this, not "oh, er, well we do Windows as well if you like".

Because most of the popular applications are Free, the application publisher doesn't have to support every distro and architecture - that can be sorted out downstream.

If someone was serious about investing in shifting Linux boxen, it is perfectly feasible for them to add their own application repository to fill any gaps or omissions in the distro repository (something that would be unthinkable with closed source). Asus started to do this with the EEEPC, but didn't exactly throw their heart and soul into into it once they started offering XP.

I completely agree that Linux could do with a unified installer for the exceptions to this rule, and make things easier for people who did want to sell non-free software. There are things like Autopackage - but I haven't used it enough to know whether its good. Its not as if this sort of thing has to support more that the top 3 or 4 "click'n'drool" distros.

Re:One reason why Linux isn't taking off: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28029593)

As long as the line is "do you want Windows or Linux on that, Sir", and the seller gets paid whichever way, Windows will be the easiest sell [...]

That's unfortunately not quite the way it is. The seller is often paid to sell Windows. Dell's Ideastorm is filled with cases like this [force.com] , and you'll find more of the same story for other manufacturers that supposedly ship with Linux pre-installed.

lpia = x86 basically (1)

Gothmolly (148874) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028309)

Since x86 code runs on lpia, what is there to claim that they "support" ?

oh no! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028449)

m-m-m-m-MOBLINS! [wikia.com]

Weird (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28028593)

Weird.

Here you are, cheering for a company that just got massive fines from the EU. Strange bedfellows.

I hope your new overloads serve you well. But do not count on it. Lessons learned from the other monopoly you so fiercely oppose?

Devil's children have the devil's luck.

netbook opportunity squandered (3, Informative)

bcrowell (177657) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028825)

When the eee PC came out, Linux had a big opportunity. Unfortunately, Asus completely blew the details of the implementation. They picked a sucky distro, and they did a lousy job on quality control and integration. My wife uses linux on the desktop, and when she saw the eee at Target for $280 she asked me to get her one for her birthday. The model they were selling at Target was out of date and not very good, so I ordered a fancier model on amazon for $400. It came with its wifi misconfigured, and Asus tech support told me they couldn't fix it, and I'd have to return it. This was a few months ago. Yesterday I was making a trip to Fry's, so my wife suggested I just buy one while I was there. Well, Fry's is now selling the eee only with Windows, and Amazon's site also doesn't have the linux version available. AFAICT retailers were just getting too many returns of the linux ones. You can pretty much tell what was going on based on the amazon reviews. Some, like mine, were being shipped misconfigured. In other cases, you had people buying the linux version and not understanding that it wasn't windows. And in still other cases, people were buying them with linux and then trying to install a (presumably illegal) copy of Windows, and failing. (None of this is new, either. All this stuff happened in the past with the Great Quality linux boxes they used to sell at Fry's. The hardware was in fact great quality, but Fry's was getting too many returns, so they stopped carrying them.)

I think the basic problem here is that it's expensive and difficult to do a good job integrating hardware and software for a consumer computer. That's the kind of thing Apple is famous for doing well. Apple puts a lot of money and effort into it, and they charge for it when you buy a mac. I just don't see how anyone is going to do anything like that in the netbook market, which is an ultra-low-margin market. It would have been especially difficult for East Asian manufacturers like Asus and Great Quality, which have a language barrier to deal with. (At one point, Great Quality was shipping their machines with a linux distro that didn't even have an English-language web site.)

Meanwhile, MS can afford to do what it takes to maintain dominance in all sectors of the market. MS doesn't even have to do a good job on netbooks. They just have to avoid doing such a horrible job that it becomes painfully obvious to people who have never used anything but Windows before. It's possible that ARM-based netbooks will change the equation, but I wouldn't be surprised if MS jumps in and starts competing vigorously on ARM, simply to maintain their monopoly.

Re:netbook opportunity squandered (1)

Gothmolly (148874) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029257)

ARM doesn't matter. When the chipset, screen and SSD chew more power than the CPU, the CPU is the least of your worries.

Re:netbook opportunity squandered (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030517)

how come this [alwaysinnovating.com] offers

an amazing 10 to 15 hours of battery life for less than 2 pounds.

?
powertop shows a differences of just 3watts between low brighness display and blacked out,
*plus smaller displays use less power anyway (could somebody explain why you cant just use an array of white LEDs to backlight your screen though, its the backlight that uses the power right?)
*the are low power usage wireless chips, but i thought the main reason wireless drains power is because it has to wake up the CPU (on lower power CPUs this is a non-issue)
*graphics chips (where choice of chip can save a great deal) and drivers could turn the card off when the screen is blanked
*HDD usage which can be solved in software (soft-fsyncs, etc)

The tech is there for lower power usage netbooks, when the price of the other low-power components (OLED, wireless "on-a-chip", etc) drops ARM will matter.

Re:netbook opportunity squandered (1)

bcrowell (177657) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030749)

ARM doesn't matter. When the chipset, screen and SSD chew more power than the CPU, the CPU is the least of your worries.

I guess I didn't make that point very clearly. The thing is that Windows is basically an Intel-only OS. Windows CE does support other CPU families, including ARM, but if you want to run full-fledged Windows, with all the usual Windows apps, Intel is really your only option. There's been a lot of speculation that the next wave of netbooks will use ARM rather than Intel, and that would presumably make it much more difficult for MS to compete. However, I'm willing to bet that MS will compete vigorously on ARM if ARM becomes popular for netbooks. Even if it costs them a lot of money, they still want to keep their monopoly from evaporating because the hardware market evolves in a new direction.

Re:netbook opportunity squandered (1)

Dega704 (1454673) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029719)

I agree. The linux versions sold on the Eee pc and aspire one felt cheap and thrown together compared to the distros they were based on. Netbooks shipping with Moblin or Ubuntu Netbook Remix would have much more success against Windows 7. Especially since Microsoft practically gave away XP home as a knee-jerk reaction to the new linux threat. I also think that most of the returns weren't just because they didn't have windows but because they were expecting a full-featured laptop that was small and cheap. It's all about how they market the devices. Users don't complain that their phone doesn't run windows.

Re:netbook opportunity squandered (1)

bcrowell (177657) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030869)

I also think that most of the returns weren't just because they didn't have windows but because they were expecting a full-featured laptop that was small and cheap.

That's possible, although I don't think I saw that sentiment expressed very much in the amazon reviews. The thing is, if people are disappointed in the keyboard and screen (which is reasonable, since they do kind of suck), you would think they would return linux netbooks and windows netbooks at equal rates. That wouldn't explain why retailers no longer seem to be selling the linux version.

Actually another possible explanation for why retailers are no longer selling them with linux is simply that that's what customers want. Early on, linux was the only OS available on the eee. However, once Asus started selling it with the choice of windows and linux, it kind of makes sense that users would buy the two versions more or less in proportion to their established popularity on the desktop. If the population of people who are used to windows is 50x bigger than the population who are used to linux, then it's probably logical to expect that 98% of people, given the choice, would buy the eee with windows. If that's what's been happening, then it totally makes sense that retailers would stop stocking the version that wasn't selling worth beans.

Spelling error. It's Molblin. (1)

Culture20 (968837) | more than 5 years ago | (#28028915)

Apparently Intel didn't play the first two Zelda games. It's Molblin, dammit!

Torrent (1)

wilsoniya (902930) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029015)

Can't say if this is the real deal, but you can download, install it in a VM and verify before the image on the moblin site finishes.

Download [linux23.com]

I smell something big brewing....... (3, Insightful)

Dega704 (1454673) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029565)

At least a couple times a week I see a new article by some journalist rambling on about how linux will never take off and we will all pay homage to Microsoft for the rest of our lives, but just look at the efforts being put into linux by some of the biggest players. IBM, Intel, Dell, and HP just off the top of my head. It seems to me like they all very much want it to thrive. And why wouldn't they? Their fates have been defined by Microsoft for two decades now. I can only imagine how enticing linux must seem to them. An OS they can mold into whatever they need it to be without having to pay licensing fees to anyone. Don't get me wrong, I'm no anti-Microsoft zealot and I think windows is here to stay, but the mono-culture hit it's peak with XP. The biggest thing holding linux back from being a major contender is figuring out how to ween users off of windows, and Moblin is just the latest experiment on how it can be done. The next couple of years will be very interesting.

You call this a release? (1)

msslc3 (846991) | more than 5 years ago | (#28029771)

This isn't a "2.0 release." It's just a beta. Who cares about betas? Unless it's Gmail, of course.

Getting stronger (1)

Artem Tashkinov (764309) | more than 5 years ago | (#28030391)

It's really great that Intel has become not only an OSS advocate but a vivid developer, supporter and promoter.

X.org development, open source drivers for its GPUs, miscellaneous kernel patches ... Microsoft must be getting nervous.

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