Beta
×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

Canadian Politicians Reverse Course On DMCA

kdawson posted more than 5 years ago | from the sudden-outbreak-and-so-forth dept.

The Internet 95

An anonymous reader writes "Michael Geist reports that the two Canadian Ministers responsible for copyright seem to have reversed course on copyright and now appear to oppose a Canadian DMCA. At a government event this week, Industry Minister Tony Clement spoke of how things have changed and of the need for consultation, while Canadian Heritage Minister James Moore emphasized the great potential of the Internet and how older politicians often don't get it."

Sorry! There are no comments related to the filter you selected.

Conservatives doing the right thing? (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28449111)

The Conservative Party of Canada isn't kowtowing to american business interests?

What?
I think my brain just had a core dump.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1, Flamebait)

Reed Solomon (897367) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449179)

Well its about time the Conservatives got on the right side of this. The Liberals are whores to the American media companies. The Conservatives SHOULD have been rational about this but they got in bed with the same people who will TURN ON THEM EVERY ELECTION. The Media companies are ultimately Liberal stooges. Still, it remains to be seen if this is simply lip service or if this is something else.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (4, Interesting)

rakslice (90330) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449513)

Political fortunes are low, and so the risky somewhat-anti-populist business has to be shelved. But the media companies still have money, and so after the next election, when once again the contributors' favours are to be repaid, they'll be pulled back off the shelf no matter who wins. Just you wait.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (5, Informative)

thirty-seven (568076) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452347)

But the media companies still have money, and so after the next election, when once again the contributors' favours are to be repaid, they'll be pulled back off the shelf no matter who wins. Just you wait.

Do you know about the restrictions on campaign contributions [elections.ca] in Canada at the federal level?

Any individual who is a Canadian citizen or permanent resident of Canada may make these contributions:

  • up to $1,000 in total in any calendar year to a particular registered party
  • up to $1,000 in total in any calendar year to the registered associations, nomination contestants and candidates of a particular registered party
  • up to $1,000 in total to a candidate for a particular election who does not represent a registered political party
  • up to $1,000 in total to the contestants in a particular leadership contest
  • [405(1)]

The Act provides for maximum contribution limits of $1,000, subject to an inflation adjustment on April 1 of each year. On January 1, 2007, the contribution limits were adjusted by the April 1, 2006, inflation factor and therefore established at $1,100.

So if you want to "buy off" a party or candidate, you can give only $1,100 to the political party and $1,100, in total, distributed among the candidates to whom you want to donate for that party. A "leadership contest" is held, at most, every few years within a party to choose a party leader.

The following are ineligible contributions, either monetary or non-monetary:

  • contributions from individuals who are not Canadian citizens or permanent residents as defined in subsection 2(1) of the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act
  • contributions from corporations
  • contributions from trade unions
  • contributions from unincorporated associations
  • contributions in excess of the contribution limits set out in the Act

I added the emphasis in this quotation. So I'm not sure what "favours" the media companies, with all their money, can use to get repaid. I'm sure that bribery can and does happen on occasion, but the amount that the parties spend in elections is also monitored and reported, so I'm not sure how such "favours" could swing an election enough to need to be repaid. Federal politics in Canada aren't like in the US, where some forms of bribery are legal and common.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (2, Interesting)

Piata (927858) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452989)

Mod this guy up. This is one of the best things about Canada's political system. It may not stop bribes, but it does make it a lot harder for big business to get away with it.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

Chirs (87576) | more than 5 years ago | (#28460161)

I seem to remember some cases where corporations got gave "bonuses" to their employees, which they then turned around and donated to political parties.

Majority vs Minority rule (3, Insightful)

Fractal Dice (696349) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452939)

A pleasant side effect of Canada fractured, regionalized politics and it's inability to elect a majority government any more is that as soon as someone tries to cash in a political favor, it's ammunition the opposition parties (plural!) can use to threaten an election and alter the balance of power. There's an actual incentive to call out the ruling party on unpopular special-interest gimmies! And since parties receive a few pennies a year of funding for every vote they get, every voter matters.

Canada consistently gets better, more innovative, progressive and balanced policies during minority governments despite how much they all whine that they can't get anything done without a majority.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

Jurily (900488) | more than 5 years ago | (#28450177)

Well its about time the Conservatives got on the right side of this. The Liberals are whores to the American media companies. The Conservatives SHOULD have been rational about this but they got in bed with the same people who will TURN ON THEM EVERY ELECTION. The Media companies are ultimately Liberal stooges. Still, it remains to be seen if this is simply lip service or if this is something else.

You mean you have two big parties which are not equally bad? Canada can't be that wierd.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

broken_chaos (1188549) | more than 5 years ago | (#28450295)

We have more than two big parties. The Conservatives and Liberals are simply the most likely to be able to form a government.

And actually in general the Liberals are better than the Conversatives if you have left-leaning views. It's a case of them being different, with 'bad' often ending up as a relative term.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

Reed Solomon (897367) | more than 5 years ago | (#28451309)

Vote for the Liberals and you get what you have in the USA, Obama appointing every single judge from the RIAA. So, until the Liberals outright say "no" to a DMCA type law, whatever they bring in will be far worse.

whoever modded my post flamebait has a bug up their butt for the Liberal party.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

schon (31600) | more than 5 years ago | (#28456755)

Vote for the Liberals and you get what you have in the USA, Obama appointing every single judge from the RIAA.

Umm, sorry what? How in the world will voting for the Liberals give the US president the ability to appoint Canadian judges?

And even if it was possible, how the hell would he appoint Americans to the Canadian Judiciary?

And why would he do that when he hasn't done it in the USA? (You know, where he actually *does* have the power to do that.)

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

Reed Solomon (897367) | more than 5 years ago | (#28457055)

I only used that as an example of what Obama is doing in the USA. The Liberals are the same type of corrupt

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (3, Insightful)

twidarkling (1537077) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452657)

Keep in mind, "left-leaning" is also a relative term. From what I can tell, our Conservatives are about as left as Obama, and maybe a bit further. Now that the Reform party's gone, there furthest-right party is arguably as left as the "Leftist" President.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28464967)

You know, I hate this left and right crap when talking politics. What do those labels really tell us? They're abstract, completely disassociated from what they attempt to label, and split our politics into 2.5 different camps: leftist, rightist, and centrist?

Call it what it is.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

Capt.DrumkenBum (1173011) | more than 5 years ago | (#28456159)

"The Conservatives and Liberals are simply the most likely to be able to form a government."

For the love of God don't let them. If you think this are screwed now just elect a majority government.
Minority governments are good for Canada.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28453227)

Mod parent up. I'm Canadian and what he says is fact, not flamebait. The Liberals have given in to nearly everything American business wants. The Conservatives are the only party that seems to be interested in preserving Canadian jobs at the moment.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

ArtDent (83554) | more than 5 years ago | (#28453777)

"The Liberals are whores to the American media companies. The Conservatives SHOULD have been rational about this but they got in bed with the same people who will TURN ON THEM EVERY ELECTION. The Media companies are ultimately Liberal stooges."

Huh? The American media ignores Canada pretty much all the time. Occasionally they'll do a story on waiting lists and why socialized medicine is such a horrible idea. The private Canadian media largely supported the Conservatives in the last election. Both national newspapers, The Globe and Mail and The National Post, endorsed Mr. Harper. And who can forget CTV's last-minute hatchet job on Mr. Dion, which was ruled a violation of industry ethical standards by the CBSC and earned Mike Duffy an appointment as a Conservative senator?

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1, Interesting)

DirtyCanuck (1529753) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449391)

Canadians need an election AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.

We need to exercise democracy and first get the conservative nut wings out of government. These guys are an embarrassment to anybody with any sort of real education in Canada. That is step one, only then we can work on other parties such as the liberals (who have been going to the dark side as of late).

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

Reed Solomon (897367) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449627)

As of late????? The Liberals are worse. If the CRIA asks them to jump, they escape the earths gravity.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

CokeBear (16811) | more than 5 years ago | (#28454833)

Actually, the Liberals seems to be coming around on tech issues. They just last week released a statement in support of 'net neutrality.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

Opportunist (166417) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449635)

Unless Canadians are way smarter than the people in my country, elections don't change jack. Your politicians, as well as mine, are a shame to anyone with an eduction that goes beyond "count to 100", but appearantly there ain't too many people who managed to get such an education.

People are more easily cowed, scared and conned into following a "strong leader" that promises easy solutions for nontrivial problems. Sure, the solutions don't work, but fortunately he doesn't even implement what he promises. Then he promises the same mumbo jumbo for the next elections and gets reelected.

Do you really think an election can solve that problem?

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (3, Insightful)

DirtyCanuck (1529753) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449821)

The Prime Minister is apologizing for some hack in Alberta who recently made these comments.

Premier says apology punishment enough after Alberta MLA's comments

"In his blog, Elniski offered advice to junior high school girls. He suggested that a girl wear a smile when entering a room, and that men don't want to hear about that "treated equal" stuff."

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/edmonton/story/2009/06/23/edmonton-elniski-stelmach.html?ref=rss [www.cbc.ca]

In response my flamebait is a result of people up on politics who are OUTRAGED over the conservative government. THEY NEED TO GO.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28451347)

He suggested that a girl wear a smile when entering a room, and that men don't want to hear about that "treated equal" stuff.".

Why shouldn't a girl wear a smile? And its true, men are sick of the "treated equal" stuff and don't want to hear it. It's not particularly fetching and women are essentially equal in every possible way in North America.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28452025)

Indeed. People who still insist on equality don't get the fact that being treated equal means NOT BEING TREATED SPECIAL. And do you KNOW what happens to women when they aren't treated special? They get upset. Because, wow, get this, they were raised differently, with more focus on emotional expression, than a boy would have been! A boy is told "suck it up and be a man" ("it" referring to any bad feelings arising from physical or emotional trauma). That's why men don't complain. Women are simply not encouraged to behave this way as they mature, so they don't behave this way as adults. So ladies, when you get treated equal and it sucks, SUCK IT UP, everyone has to. Or, we're perfectly willing to coddle and shield you and treat you special, if you just agree to be nice and content with that deal. Pick one.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28457409)

He suggested that a girl wear a smile when entering a room, and that men don't want to hear about that "treated equal" stuff.".

Why shouldn't a girl wear a smile?

Depends on whether she wears it exclusively.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

SilverEyes (822768) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452241)

The Prime Minister is apologizing for some hack in Alberta who recently made these comments.

Premier says apology punishment enough after Alberta MLA's comments

"In his blog,

The Prime Minister (Stephen Harper) and the Premier of Alberta (Ed Stelmach) are two different people.

I think the second part of his comment was offensive. Although I agree with the other poster, shouldn't people smile :P ?

Disclaimer: I'm from Alberta. I'm not too impressed with Stelmach, and Harper's been ok but I have a pretty blase feeling from him. We need someone more dynamic running Canada (this, coming from a Conservative).

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

twidarkling (1537077) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452727)

Also Albertan, and yes, I think Stelmach was a bad choice. He's basically treading water. He's almost acting like a placeholder. Someone just to kill time between the dynasties of "King Ralph" and whoever comes next, and he's afraid to do anything that'll make their job difficult. Harper, eh, he's doing a fine enough job. Nothing I really disagree with, nothing I'm wildly enthusiastic about (other than the lower GST, that was nice).

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

Myrv (305480) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452929)

Actually the lower GST was a stupid idea whose only purpose was to buy off votes. It only really benefits the rich. If Harper had truly wanted to lower the tax burden in a meaningful way he would have reduced income taxes. This would have helped lower and middle income families much more than the GST cut did for the same cost in tax revenue. Unfortunately cutting the GST sounds so much better in sound bites during an election.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

twidarkling (1537077) | more than 5 years ago | (#28456599)

Have you actually looked at a tax form? There's 50 bajillion different credits and deductions you can get if you're lower/middle class. I haven't paid any income tax in 4 years. And we all know the rich find loopholes to lower their tax burden as well. If we closed up more of those loopholes, then I'd be fine with doing away with income tax (it's a relatively recent invention anyways). But considering no one's actually made significant (or really, insignificant) tax cuts, I'll fucking take them where I can get them, since my city council doesn't even know the meaning of the term "single digit tax increase," let alone "cut taxes."

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

Myrv (305480) | more than 5 years ago | (#28462705)

Yes I've looked at a tax form.

It's exactly because of these bagillion tax loop holes that the GST shouldn't have been cut. It's much harder to avoid paying the GST meaning the rich (or anyone for that matter) can't get out of it. As such it provides a much more stable income stream to the government (on the order of $5 billion per percentage point) which is fairly recession proof (something that would have been nice given the current economy).

Now having said that, I never claimed I don't like the tax cuts. I just said I would have prefered to see a reduction in income tax rates instead of the GST. And note I said reduction, I'm not calling for the elimination of income either (which while being a nice thought really isn't practical). No, I would prefered to see a raise in the personal exemption limit and/or a reduction in the lower bracket tax rates. Proportionally this helps the low to middle class much more than the rich and this is where the tax relief needs to be given.

Now, if you don't pay any income taxes, as you claim to, then you're either really rich and exploiting the system, running a personal business and claiming a lot of deductions, or you're really really poor (as in less than $10,000 taxable income). If you're rich I don't care. If you're really poor a GST cut really isn't going to save you a whole lot as the majority of your spending will be GST exempt already. If you run a business, then cuts in business taxes is probably a better deal than GST as well.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

compro01 (777531) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452645)

If you think a conservative is going to get voted out in Alberta, you ought to lay off whatever you're on.

Also, MLAs (Members of the Legislative Assembly) and premiers are the provincial government, which in Alberta's case has been the provincial "progressive" conservative party since 1971. MPs (Members of Parliament) and the prime minister are the federal governent.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

BluenoseJake (944685) | more than 5 years ago | (#28456425)

I've had enough of elections, thank you very much, I have participated in 3 in the last 4 years, and that is sufficient.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28451441)

My guess is that it is an indication of how badly America has fallen over the last 8 years. Sad. Really sad.

Re:Conservatives doing the right thing? (1)

parlancex (1322105) | more than 5 years ago | (#28453281)

I'd like to believe that and get genuinely excited about my country's democratic system, but I think it's more likely that someone with opposing interests probably just gave them a bigger bribe (campaign contribution, whatever you want to call it) and upped the ante. I suppose we should be thankful because this time it aligned with our interests?

^_^ (1, Offtopic)

master5o1 (1068594) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449117)

I like it when this sort of thing happens.

Re:^_^ (1)

Reed Solomon (897367) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449191)

thinking about it more, perhaps this is a preemptive strike on a potential pirate party as seen gaining traction in the EU.

Re:^_^ (2, Insightful)

Dunbal (464142) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449361)

One sorry TWO delegates is hardly "traction"

Re:^_^ (2, Informative)

Reed Solomon (897367) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449625)

It is when they're helping you push your car out of a snow rut.

Re:^_^ (2, Funny)

SilverEyes (822768) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452255)

It's June. It hasn't been snowing in Calgary for three weeks.

Re:^_^ (2, Funny)

Quantos (1327889) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452299)

Wait another week, I'm taking my parka out of storage soon...

Re:^_^ (3, Informative)

Citizen of Earth (569446) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449839)

One sorry TWO delegates is hardly "traction"

They're the two *cabinet ministers* who have been behind this farce. I can't imagine what would change their minds. My solitary vow never to vote for the Conservatives specifically because of draconian copyright changes surely wasn't enough. Perhaps other voters hold the same position while the Conservatives are sagging in the polls and the Liberals could topple the minority Conservative government at any time.

Re:^_^ (2, Informative)

Dexx (34621) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452349)

Maybe it was the Standing Senate Committee on Transport and Communications meeting that Geist was speaking with?
Transcript Link [parl.gc.ca]

Re:^_^ (1)

Quantos (1327889) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452439)

I can't imagine what would change their minds.

I threatened to send the negatives to the newspapers :)

Re:^_^ (1)

twidarkling (1537077) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452755)

Keep in mind, if an election was forced, whoever was seen to have forced it would be completely destroyed. Polls show that something on the order of 70% of Canadians are against another election any time soon.

Re:^_^ (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28454793)

My solitary vow never to vote for the Conservatives specifically because of draconian copyright changes surely wasn't enough.

You should not vote for the Liberal party, either. They proposed bill C-60, which, in ways, was significantly more draconian than bill C-61. Fortunately, this bill didn't make the second reading because of the dissolving of the parliament in November, 2005. Most hardcore "Liberals" who are against a horrid copyright bill seem to forget this fact.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_C-60 [wikipedia.org] - my source document

Re:^_^ (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28458483)

I'm going to take full credit. I wrote several letters to my boy James regarding this issue, and then voted for the NDP in the last election (since at the time they were the only party publicly against the DMCA). James really wants my vote next time, obviously.

Re:^_^ (1)

julesh (229690) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449903)

Offtopic: the underline on your subject line makes it look like a happy cat. That's kind-of cool. :)

Re:^_^ (1)

master5o1 (1068594) | more than 5 years ago | (#28450681)

^_^

Hosers! (0, Troll)

Hognoxious (631665) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449123)

DMCA or DMC eh?

Re:Hosers! (1)

Maury Markowitz (452832) | more than 5 years ago | (#28451753)

Run, DMC, run!

Please read this message abou dogs! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28449135)

Dogs are nice and they are very super animals. They are not related to cats. I like fish and birds for large meals that look like fun animals for the dogs which are not at all like cats because mommy says Canada is far away where they do not have dogs only STUPID STUPIFD FDTUPOINEJF CATS!!!@!@!@#! I do not like snekes that have no lags or trils thukj y PO iuu iuuiiuiuiuiu on ass fucker slashdot fodsdpoioh&8778&*&*111981!((*@*(

Of course older politicans don't get it. (3, Insightful)

bertoelcon (1557907) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449177)

Its a world that has changed more growing ever recently, its not hard to blame them for not catching up on everything. Technology is multiplying its growth rapidly.

However It would be a good idea to keep up on the events that can influence their own reelections and how they are perceived by the public.

As I understand it (I am American and in Texas, far from Canada) Canada has some really bad setup of restrictions on media already since most of it is imported from the US, as well as some tax on blank media since it COULD be used for illegal copies and such, and I would assume there is more BS like that.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (5, Funny)

skreeech (221390) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449281)

Our TV/Radio has some rules about a certain amount of Canadian content. Example, we see and hear Canadian bands in disproportionate amounts - which would be ok if not for nickleback being Canadian.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (5, Funny)

Opportunist (166417) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449605)

Hey, it could be worse, Celine Dion could still be in fashion. Or Shatner could decide to make another CD.

Said with a smile...or at least a smirk! (1)

rts008 (812749) | more than 5 years ago | (#28451003)

Or Shatner could decide to make another CD.

You sick, twisted bastard!

I don't know whether to run away screaming hysterically, or to salute your twistedness!

I think I'll just settle for another beer...eh?!

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (1)

ceoyoyo (59147) | more than 5 years ago | (#28451185)

Americans hear Canadian bands in disproportionate amounts too.

What we get that's different here is Canadian films in disproportionate amounts.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28451993)

Have you noticed the proliferation of "sci-fi" TV shows that look like they cost about $50 per episode to make? It is probrably Canadian.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (1)

blind biker (1066130) | more than 5 years ago | (#28453089)

Our TV/Radio has some rules about a certain amount of Canadian content.

Does that mean that you get to watch this gem [imdb.com] often?

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28454727)

Are you kidding? There are probably half a dozen movies put out every year that are as bad or worse than that one, and that only exist because of huge subsidies to Canadian movie producers. There are occasional gems, but probably 80%+ of it is crap. It's so bad that half of what they presented in the show "Made In Canada" [imdb.com] , a parody of the Canadian film/tv industry, is probably based on reality.

It's a great show [wikipedia.org] , by the way. Kind of like what would happen if you did a version of "The Office", but set it in the movie industry (and "Made in Canada" pre-dates "The Office", so it isn't just a rip-off). I think my favorite part is that the fake production company ("Pyramid Productions") is an obvious parody of Alliance-Atlantis, which was the parent company of the actual company that made "Made In Canada". Alliance Atlantis was responsible for *a*lot* of B-grade movies. It's like "Made in Canada" was an inside documentary of why so many of those awful things got made :-)

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28450761)

The "tax" (actually a tariff) on blank audio media is there to keep the CRIA from suing anyone that downloads music. We have "fair use" because they lobbied for that tariff, which does straight to them.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (1)

multisync (218450) | more than 5 years ago | (#28451899)

The "tax" (actually a tariff) on blank audio media is there to keep the CRIA from suing anyone that downloads music. We have "fair use" because they lobbied for that tariff, which does straight to them.

Of course, there should *not* be a specific tax that "entitles" Canadians to "fair use," or "fair dealing" as it is called in Canada. The whole point of fair dealing is that it is a reasonable exception to the unnatural monopoly granted to copyright holders. There should be no compensation to copyright holders because I choose to listen to the CD I purchased on my mp3 player while I run. I am not distributing their CD, just changing the device I am listening to it on.

The other reason I think they should "axe the tax" is that I simply can not accept that people are actually downloading music (probably in mp3 format), converting them to wav files (or whatever) then burning them to CDs. In fact, I take it back, anyone actually doing that deserves to be fined 21 cents per CD for having too much time on their hands.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (1)

snowraver1 (1052510) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452715)

The other reason I think they should "axe the tax" is that I simply can not accept that people are actually downloading music (probably in mp3 format), converting them to wav files (or whatever) then burning them to CDs. In fact, I take it back, anyone actually doing that deserves to be fined 21 cents per CD for having too much time on their hands.

Anyone that has a non-mp3 enabled cd player in their car would disagree. Also the conversion process is done on-the-fly now anyways, and has been so for probably 10 years now.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (1)

multisync (218450) | more than 5 years ago | (#28453855)

Anyone that has a non-mp3 enabled cd player in their car would disagree

I've found mixed results playing home-made CDs as well as CD-Rs of mp3 files, but that is a valid point. When I purchased a vehicle earlier this year, I ensured the stereo had an 1/8" mini jack so I wouldn't have to carry around little plastic discs.

The justification I always hear for the tax is based on the assumption that people are using blank CD-Rs to permanently store music they have downloaded without paying for, and I have a hard time accepting that a significant number of blanks sold are used for that purpose.

It's becoming less of an issue for me, as I rarely use that medium any more. My concern is the same justification will be used to impose a similar tax on hard drives, SD cards and even music players themselves in the future.

The key point is refuting this idea that there should be strings attached to fair dealing. Compensating copyright holders for revenue lost to people downloading songs without paying for them is a completely separate issue, and worthy of discussion. Compensating copyright holders for activities that fall under fair dealing makes as much sense as compensating McDonald's because I had my Big Mac "to go" instead of eating it in their restaurant.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28454299)

And not everyone downloads mp3 (read: lossy compressed) audio, either. Some people download FLAC or APE (or similar) lossless compressed audio, decompress it and burn it to CD - voila, nearly perfect quality.

Some such people find the tariff reasonable in this context and have built large libraries of music on CD-Rs... for a lot less than would have to be paid if purchasing the pre-recorded discs at retail.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (1)

multisync (218450) | more than 5 years ago | (#28456179)

Some such people find the tariff reasonable in this context and have built large libraries of music on CD-Rs... for a lot less than would have to be paid if purchasing the pre-recorded discs at retail.

The fact that you feel justified in amassing a large library of contraband because you paid a 21 cent tax on the blank media you use to store your ill-gotten goods is irrelevant. That is not the purpose of the levy. Its actual purpose is to compensate copyright holders for fair dealing by citizens who purchased the music they are copying.

In 2004 the Canadian Recording Industry Association sued five ISPs, seeking the names of 29 individuals they claimed were guilty of file sharing. Note, this was seven years after the Private Copying Levy was introduced in the 1997 Canadian Copyright Act. The fact that the CRIA lost that case is the reason you are able to download music to your heart's content, not the levy.

Copyright holders should not be compensated for Canadians' fair dealing, and you should pay for your damn music collection.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (1)

tixxit (1107127) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452737)

as well as some tax on blank media since it COULD be used for illegal copies and such, and I would assume there is more BS like that.

Yeah, we pay ~$0.20 per CD in tax. However, we don't have courts awarding record companies $2m from a single citizen who shared 24 songs. Not sure which BS I would rather subscribe to.

Re:Of course older politicans don't get it. (1)

atomic777 (860023) | more than 5 years ago | (#28454139)

As I understand it (I am American and in Texas, far from Canada) Canada has some really bad setup of restrictions on media already since most of it is imported from the US

This is "bad" depending on your perspective. Bad for American media companies that want free access to the Canadian market, good for nationalist Canadians that fear cultural assimilation from the behemoth to the south. One could argue that we would not have such a vibrant music scene producing bands like Arcade Fire (ironically the lead singer is an American from Texas!) if not for these protectionist measures.

While our current conservative government in many ways is just an offshoot of the republican party, even they will not dare be perceived by the public as a government that is selling the country out to the US and will back off any legislation that stirs up such sentiment. Democracy is not dead in Canada just yet!

They didn't necessarily reverse course. (5, Insightful)

Ragingguppy (464321) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449193)

We have to look at this in the context of whats going on in the Canadian parliament. They are a minority government and they don't want to necessarily do anything stupid that would alienate half the population. So they have decided to not go forward with that legislation. They may decide to go ahead anyways. Right now they are consulting not with the public but with so called most successful CEO's in industry. Which means that they are just going tow the party line and not do anything all that innovative. So put your faith in the snakes that are the Canadian politicians. They are bigger liars then George W Bush.

Behind the scenes (1)

phorm (591458) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449417)

I also wonder what's going on behind the scenes. It seems that a lot of things are going through internationally as "treaties", as has been mentioned in many US-centric articles. Perhaps there's no need for such legislation if it's already been pushed through as "confidential" treaty clauses...

Re:They didn't necessarily reverse course. (3, Insightful)

Nerdfest (867930) | more than 5 years ago | (#28450999)

It may have something to do with all of the people that wrote to their MP's. There are also other good signs, such as a huge display of condemnation regarding a bill giving police the power to get ISP subscriber information without a warrant (this was on the CBC site [www.cbc.ca] , check the comments). People seem surprisingle informed and politicians may be taking note. Of course, I could be blindly optimistic.

Re:They didn't necessarily reverse course. (1)

parlancex (1322105) | more than 5 years ago | (#28453443)

They'll push it ahead in next year's budget like they did last year with all the controversial legislation they wanted to railroad through our "democratic" parliament. The opposition parties will make a big song and dance again and threaten to take down the government with another vote of non-confidence, the conservatives will label them as the scary monsters that don't respect Canadian democracy again, and then Stephen will ask the governor general to suspend parliament again until the opposition's alliance loses momentum and they have enough time to spread a campaign of misinformation to ensure that they would at least win a minority government again if an election was called in the vote.

Bounced Checks (3, Funny)

UndyingShadow (867720) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449229)

Sounds like some checks bounced.

Re:Bounced Checks (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28450161)

That, or an election may be on the horizon.

Re:Bounced Checks (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28450517)

Which is a shame, as it should be 'checks and balances' not 'bounced checks'.

title and such is flawed (1)

CHRONOSS2008 (1226498) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449411)

doesn't actually say anywhere either of those two mentioned that they are AGAINST a canuck DMCA and what about that other nazi law they want to bring in that privacy patriot act crap to canada

Translation (4, Insightful)

whisper_jeff (680366) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449415)

Translation: We didn't expect this strong an outpouring of opposition and we know we already only have a minority government so we're just going to lay low a bit and not piss people off. Sound good?

And, yes - it does sound good. Stop messing things up! Stop selling our country out! More importantly, stop selling our country out to foreign media corporations!

Re:Translation (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28449971)

And ... stop stealing the Indian land!

(J. Cuddy)

Re:Translation (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28451233)

And ... stop stealing the Indian land!

  (J. Cuddy)

It was the British that were in India, not the Canucks. And the land issue with aboriginal Canadians is quite a bit more complex than your trite comment.

Re:Translation (1)

marcosdumay (620877) | more than 5 years ago | (#28451603)

"we already only have a minority government so we're just going to lay low a bit and not piss people off"

It is nice to see democracy working the way it should. Normaly they'd just bribe other parties until they get a majority, and then piss people off.

Re:Translation (1)

SuiteSisterMary (123932) | more than 5 years ago | (#28482409)

I'm still exceedingly pissed that they managed to get the Canadian media outlets to go along with their line that, in our Westminster-style parliamentary system, attempting to form a coalition government was, some how, a usurpation of they system.

Could this mean ACTA negotiations are failing? (2, Insightful)

erroneus (253617) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449539)

We all generally know what ACTA is and who is largely behind it. It seems increasingly, we see more stories of government bodies moving away from enhanced copyright assault techniques targeting individual users, abusers and consumers. ACTA is still "secret" so we may never hear about what is going on in the negotiations, but could these laws and failures to enact laws be a sign of what may not happen? This could be significant, after all [sarcasm] ACTA is a matter of national security [/sarcasm].

Re:Could this mean ACTA negotiations are failing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28450159)

Probably more like, "We'll trade our dirty oil for your dirty copyright legislation. Nothing comes for free."

Re:Could this mean ACTA negotiations are failing? (1)

Nikker (749551) | more than 5 years ago | (#28451663)

Actually Canada has more oil than every one [wikipedia.org] except Saudi Arabia. We also provide US with their lumber as well they get a good stake in our fresh water, so fucking us for our rights are just a bonus.

Re:Could this mean ACTA negotiations are failing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28450267)

Many shit you can relate to ACTA is being implemented. Like in France. Although blocked by court. So these might only be minor setbacks in a larger scale. One won battle does not mean you won the war!

Welcome to slavery (0, Flamebait)

gnupun (752725) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449785)

DMCA prevents copyrighted material being ripped off by other leeches. Imagine spending years writing hundreds of web pages and then working to make your website a success -- ad money is rolling in. Then some leech, tempted by your profits, spends less than one week, using the curl tool to download your site and recreate it. The profits of the original site start to rapidly dwindle and go towards the leeches, and more leeches join the fray.

DMCA can be used to quickly shut down this leech sites. After a while, few people will be interested in investing years of their lives to supporting leeches or the indifferent consumers who don't care about anyone except getting their product for free or cheap.

Re:Welcome to slavery (4, Insightful)

julesh (229690) | more than 5 years ago | (#28449929)

DMCA can be used to quickly shut down this leech sites

The alternative, in countries that don't have a statutary notification scheme, is a court order. These are relatively easy to get, the only disadvantage being they cost money upfront that you may not be able to get back if you can't trace the identity of the leech. While this is a disadvantage, I am of the opinion that "no punishment without judicial oversight" is a good maxim for how stuff like this should work. DMCA notification is too easy to abuse.

Re:Welcome to slavery (1)

Kjella (173770) | more than 4 years ago | (#28464259)

On the other hand, how many hit-n-run sites have there been that really are DMCA violations? I'd say very many, and a key characteristic of these sites is that leave no (valid) contact information - the general idea is to upload it, point people to it and have as many as possible download before it disappears. I doubt you hear about how warez dump #4563456 was taken down.

Trying to stop information that's already out on the internet is pretty much mission impossible to begin with, but if there is to be any realistic chance there needs to a process for taking it down that is almost as easy as putting it up. Otherwise people can just throw up a new mirror every few weeks, making the court order pretty much worthless because you never catch up.

I agree there should probably be a better counterclaim process though, and perhaps some protection for consumers from ISPs that just want to nuke/delete any "problem" users. The most important part is in any case the ISP immunity when they follow this process. That way, ISPs don't need to self-censor - or rather, censor you - out of fear of liability.

Re:Welcome to slavery (0, Troll)

Iori Branford (1546617) | more than 5 years ago | (#28450185)

Hurrr, durrrr, my new work looking EXACTLY like someone else's successful and long-established work sure won't shit up my reputation or anything.

Re:Welcome to slavery (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28450969)

I would think that spending years on a website without having some bit of dynamic scripting/community around to /make/ the site ad revenue non-trivial. Those are things that a script/mirror can't duplicate.

Re:Welcome to slavery (1)

NotBornYesterday (1093817) | more than 5 years ago | (#28451089)

Your analogy assumes that a) The site makes good revenue from ads, which is not exactly a common experience for most websites, and b) The leech is hosted in a country that gives a damn about the DMCA.

Re:Welcome to slavery (1)

daid303 (843777) | more than 5 years ago | (#28451187)

To bad nothing stops the leech from sending a DMCA to YOUR site! Increasing there own profits even more.

Re:Welcome to slavery (2, Insightful)

Maury Markowitz (452832) | more than 5 years ago | (#28451819)

DCMA is a four-letter word, and that does seem to effect a lot of people's thinking. There are definitely some very good provisions in the package. Others, not so good.

I think everyone agrees that the takedown system is a winner, for everyone involved. ISP's have been a bit easy to scare into believing the takedowns and not bothering to check if they're for real, but it seems that they're calming down now. I would be perfectly happy to see a similar provision in Canadian law.

On the other hand, there's the reverse-engineering issue. This is clearly a very bad idea, and from what I can see, unenforceable. Had this section been left out, I think everyone would consider DCMA as generally positive, but instead it generates massive hate. Sad really.

Maury

Re:Welcome to slavery (1)

twidarkling (1537077) | more than 5 years ago | (#28452853)

Um... I don't think I've ever seen anyone agree the takedown system is a good thing. ISPs don't bother to check if they're for real, and neither do sites like YouTube check for fair use/dealing, or anything else. A DMCA takedown order is a blank cheque to fucking up anyone, because once it's taken down, it's damned near impossible to get it put back up.

Re:Welcome to slavery (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 5 years ago | (#28454357)

Ah, a world where everyone is just Maury, and the media companies. Pretty depressing. The word "everyone" does not mean what you think it means. Let me rephrase and explain what I believe happened here.

You and a group of media company owners think DMCA takedowns are a good idea, but you also suspect the majority disagrees. Fortunately, in your world vision, "everyone" does not include all those icky masses, so it comes out in Maury-speech as:

I think everyone agrees that the takedown system is a winner, for everyone involved.

or maybe you were just joking. Either option is believable.

Election (1)

DarthVain (724186) | more than 5 years ago | (#28454369)

A) Trying to avoid an election

or

B) Trying to cozy up to voters before an election.

and

C) If they win the election they will try and ram the stuff through again.

Check for New Comments
Slashdot Login

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?