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AVG Update Breaks iTunes

kdawson posted more than 4 years ago | from the one-man's-virus-is-another-man's-music dept.

Security 185

nate_in_ME writes "After getting a positive from the AVG virus detector while playing music on iTunes just a few minutes ago, I did a bit of research. It appears that AVG has recently pushed an update to the virus definitions that flags every iPod/iTunes related file as being infected with the 'Small.BOG' trojan. Interestingly enough, AVG does not have any information on this particular virus in their virus encyclopedia. Discussion on the Apple forum is up to 4 pages and climbing. One user there had an interesting thought: 'Maybe Palm has some shares in AVG...MUAHAAAA!!' (on page 3)."

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185 comments

AVG is doing its job (4, Funny)

Norsefire (1494323) | more than 4 years ago | (#28822959)

Bad music is a virus.

It spreads like wildfire and everyone has it.

Re:AVG is doing its job (4, Funny)

Enderandrew (866215) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823157)

My wife has New Kids on the Block CDs still. I'm terrified I'll catch something from her.

Re:AVG is doing its job (5, Funny)

davester666 (731373) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823183)

No, you're safe. I know from personal experience...I haven't caught anything from her yet.

Re:AVG is doing its job (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823535)

are you fucking her in the pussy or in the ass? Cause she's got some nasty anal warts...

Re:AVG is doing its job (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823701)

You haven't caught anything from her yet... meaning the New Kids CD or her (from carnal relations)?

Re:AVG is doing its job (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823745)

best your wife/girlfriend related reply ever.

Re:AVG is doing its job (2, Funny)

Midnight Thunder (17205) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823953)

No, you're safe. I know from personal experience...I haven't caught anything from her yet.

I take it your sudden taste in Celine Dion is unrelated?

Re:AVG is doing its job (1)

Ilgaz (86384) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823723)

If you listen to current top 40, New Kids On The Block may sound somehow good to you. Trust me, tune into some top 40 radio/site, have patience for 1 hour and put that NKOB CD.

As I mention that, never run goodly coded MS-DOS antiviruses like F-Prot, TBAV under FreeDOS for nostalgic purposes. I don't remember any false positive of F-Prot for example. Remember the frequency of the users database updates. Like... Never? The stuff they were looking for weren't some lame Visual Studio gigantic code to. They were amazingly written ASM code which does amazing tricks to hide themselves thanks to the direct access of hardware. Now, a daily updated AV with millions of dollars in hand can easily detect part of World's number 1 music player as a trojan and we all say "Oh well, they fixed it..."

Not well, really...

Re:AVG is doing its job (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823467)

But I thought they abandoned DRM?

Re:AVG is doing its job (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823681)

Ahaha-wait a sec, what music do you listen to? I guarantee some good artists who write genre are on iTunes.

Conspiracy! (5, Interesting)

girlintraining (1395911) | more than 4 years ago | (#28822983)

It's a conspiracy! Or... maybe it's just that the definition for the virus in question was rushed out the door without adequate testing. How many new viruses are reported each week again? They probably don't "beta test" their definitions, and just do it in a lab. Oops. The lab machines didn't have iTunes.

Re:Conspiracy! (1, Troll)

FourthAge (1377519) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823039)

A/V company in "mistake" shock, Film at 11. There have been many instances of false positives from antivirus software.

Although in this case, it's not a false positive. iTunes really is a virus, along with all Apple products. I don't think I'm infected. But I love Apple products and must buy more of them. Mmm, that iPhone certainly looks like a great deal. Oh yeah, I'd certainly sell my soul to buy one of those. And the new MacBook, gotta have it. Powered by BSD you know, bit like Linux except not free, in fact quite expensive. Get a Mac, get a Mac, get a Mac.

iPhone (0, Offtopic)

Enderandrew (866215) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823191)

I really don't like Apple as a company, but I broke down and got an iPhone. I have a love/hate relationship with it. I love the concept of the App Store, but browsing it is a pain. I can see popular apps at the top, but I can't do a power search, or browse by user ratings. I can't put contacts into groups. I can't edit my address book or calendar from iTunes. Syncing with Outlook is broken. Synching with Yahoo is broken. I had to create a new Gmail account, dump my contacts into that, edit them in Gmail, and sync them back, and then certain fields like birthdays wouldn't transfer over.

I can't transfer files or documents to my phone because the damned thing is so locked down for "security" reasons (ie, we're concerned you might pirate apps, even though jailbreaking is easy). The calendar app is a joke, as with the contacts portion. As a smart-phone platform, the iPhone is pretty shoddy.

As a music/gaming/internet device, the iPhone is pretty slick. Safari is fast and simple, though on a small screen, they should have a full-screen mode. They finally wised up and added a landscape keyboard (ages after Google was showing it in Android dev kits and phones), except most places in the OS, and most apps won't allow you to use it. You can't change the small smattering of SMS tones. They didn't add multimedia messaging until the 3.0 release of the software. They just finally added voice memos.

You can't place apps in categories, or theme the dashboard. Overall, I keep hearing how Apple's UI is the best in the world and they just do everything right. I enjoy my iPhone, don't get me wrong. But this UI leaves a lot to be desired.

Re:iPhone (0, Offtopic)

Darkness404 (1287218) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823299)

or browse by user ratings

Those are broken though. You either have a bunch of 5 star ratings so the app is rated like 5 stars... except for the fact that the newest update pretty much broke the app (see the lolcats app for an example) or a bunch of 1 and 2 star ratings but an update made the app amazing.

Re:iPhone (1)

Enderandrew (866215) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823313)

Fair enough, but rating should be weighted in a meaningful way.

A new app with 1 person rating it 1 or 5 stars shouldn't count as much as 1,000 ratings of 4 stars.

Re:iPhone (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823405)

Just get the palm pre, it fixes all the bad things of the iphone while keeping all the good things.

Re:iPhone (0, Offtopic)

Enderandrew (866215) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823497)

I really wanted an Android phone, but T-Mobile isn't in Omaha.

The Palm Pre was next on my list. I went to Best Buy last month, and they said they wouldn't get any more shipments until August. The initial shipment also had hardware problems apparently.

And while Web OS looks interesting, there aren't nearly as many apps available.

That's why I ended up with the iPhone.

Re:Conspiracy! (2, Funny)

dov_0 (1438253) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823587)

AVG breaking something? Shock horror! It's normally Symantec that does that...

Re:Conspiracy! (1)

Ihmhi (1206036) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823569)

I wonder if lab machines are just like, fresh Windows/OSX installs or if they have real-world-use programs that many people have, like AIM, iTunes, etc.

Had This Problem Myself (5, Informative)

Jucius Maximus (229128) | more than 4 years ago | (#28822989)

It does not appear to flag "every" file related to iTunes, it is just the iTunesMiniPlayer.dll.

The workaround is to disable the real-time scanner.

However their latest update had fixed it, and my real-time scanner is running again without problem.

Re:Had This Problem Myself (1)

nate_in_ME (1281156) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823017)

I'd heard mixed reports on this one...with iTunes running already, I was only getting the error in itunesregistry.dll. However, when I shut down and restarted iTunes, I had about 200 warnings in a matter of seconds...

Re:Had This Problem Myself (1)

Ilgaz (86384) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823747)

It would be understandable if the file in question was equivalent Windows version of USBMux which is basically iPod driver as far as I understand.

It has everything to be suspected by a heuristics scan. First of all, it got recently updated (that Palm thing), must be encyripted, added into startup, must have interesting system calls dealing with the DRM enabled device etc.

The file you mention sounds like ordinary DLL. For a second, I was actually happy that AVG finally has some real heuristics to have false suspicions :)

Re:Had This Problem Myself (4, Insightful)

Sponge Bath (413667) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823069)

"The workaround is to disable the real-time scanner."

Or switch to a better AV product. For a while I was satisfied with AVG, but gave up after other false positive problems with it. Avira does a better job (check out http://www.av-comparatives.org/ [av-comparatives.org]) and still has a free version.

Re:Had This Problem Myself (1)

olsmeister (1488789) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823121)

Avira is good, and is the software that I use on one of my machines. However, it does have an annoying nag screen showing an advertisement that pops up everytime it does a definition update. I never had that with AVG Free.

Re:Had This Problem Myself (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823209)

Set the permissions to disallow your account to run avnotify.exe, and the problem goes away.

Re:Had This Problem Myself (2, Informative)

halffull (720484) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823865)

I recently switched away from AVG as well, but I tried Avast instead. No nag screens anywhere, and it's easy to get a very light install without any extras. No performance issues that I've noticed.

Re:Had This Problem Myself (2, Interesting)

Billhead (842510) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823317)

I tried Avira on two computers two months ago, and on one it was constantly trying to access the floppy drive, and that seems to be a known problem.

I'm not going to bother installing it on my other computers to see if it works, I'm going with NOD32.

Re:Had This Problem Myself (3, Informative)

kklein (900361) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823359)

Or switch to a better AV product.

I loved AVG for a long time, but since 8, it has been a resource hog and has added a bunch of crap I don't want and keeps asking me if I'd like to pay and keeps throwing up false positives.

I just got rid of it the other day.

Re:Had This Problem Myself (1)

Todrael (601100) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823137)

Interestingly, Windows 7 asked me to upload this file along with a couple others for further analysis by Microsoft. Perhaps Windows Defender flagged it as well.

slashdoters are fucking faggots (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823045)

they take in the dirty dirty ass. right up the 'ole stink chute, the corn crib, mud valley, gut bucket, etc.

translation: they like gay butt sex in the asshole.

This is a problem with AV in general. (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823053)

I work at a AV vendor (not one of the big ones), and false positives are a big problem. Essentially there are two issues. First, how severe is the threat? You might skimp on your validation process in order to get something out sooner. Second (and much harder to resolve), there is effectively an infinite amount of software out there; on top of that, there may also be many different versions (iTunes 6, 7, 8, point releases, etc). You try to do the best you can, but shit happens because you can only test against so much software.

Haha, good (5, Insightful)

ArchieBunker (132337) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823055)

iTunes is about as useful as malware. If someone would only write a simple drag and drop app for the ipod touch that didn't require jailbreaking....

Seriously does anyone else have issues with how convoluted it really is to add mp3 files to an ipod touch? Add a folder to your library, wait while itunes chugs and makes a COPY of each file before syncing. Hit sync a few times and agree to all your old settings being overwritten (when all it really does is update). A $10 mp3 player allows me to right click and say "Send to..." Fuck you apple.

Re:Haha, good (4, Funny)

Sponge Bath (413667) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823099)

"iTunes is about as useful as malware."

The ghost of Steve Jobs rattles his chains at you. (oooooohhhh...)
Yes, he is dead. Apple built an animatronic replica to placate shareholders.

Re:Haha, good (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823251)

Actually, I find myself inordinately pleased by the thought of Steve Jobs' liver rattling its chains at me.

Re:Haha, good (1)

Midnight Thunder (17205) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823965)

Yes, he is dead. Apple built an animatronic replica to placate shareholders.

Wow, I thought Jonathan Ive had done a good job with Eve, but designing a life like Steve Jobs is amazing. How good a job did engineering do with the RDF?

Re:Haha, good (3, Informative)

_merlin (160982) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823113)

I have too much music for simple drag and drop to be useful. I like iTunes' smart playlists, which effectively give me a query language into my music library. If you do just want to drag and drop, tell iTunes that you want to manage the music on your iPod manually. You'll still have to use iTunes, but you'll be able to drag stuff on and off the device.

Re:Haha, good (1)

edsousa (1201831) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823195)

Check Winamp, or Amarok, or foobar2000. All good media players with smart playlists and capable to synchronize with MP3 players.

Re:Haha, good (1)

_merlin (160982) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823591)

I didn't say anything bad about any other music players. They could be great for all I know. I was simply pointing out that managing a music player's contents manually doesn't scale well with large music libraries.

Re:Haha, good (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823199)

If you do just want to drag and drop, tell iTunes that you want to manage the music on your iPod manually. You'll still have to use iTunes, but you'll be able to drag stuff on and off the device.

Oh, so that's all I need to do to be able to copy music off of an iPod? Well, that's intuitive, huh?

Except, of course, that DOESN'T ACTUALLY WORK THAT WAY.

All that does is make a special playlist that iTunes copies to the iPod. You still have to copy music into iTunes, then add it to that special playlist, then sync the iPod and make yet another copy.

And, of course, since you're now doing it manually, you lose all your other playlists, meaning all your music is in one giant unsearchable lump. Making that feature COMPLETELY WORTHLESS.

Re:Haha, good (1)

_merlin (160982) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823659)

Have you actually used iTunes? You don't need a "special playlist" if you're manually managing your music. The music doesn't become unsearchable on the iPod, either - you still get Genre/Artist/Album grouping. You can create a playlist and tell iTunes to sync only that playlist, but if you do this, the "special playlist" is your own creation. If you don't want to copy the music into iTunes, turn off "Keep iTunes Music folder organized" and "Copy files to iTunes Music folder when adding to library" - then iTunes will just keep references to the music files wherever you stored them. As to making "another copy" on the iPod, you'll always have "another copy" on your music player, no matter how you get it there. I'd be happy to hear some valid criticisms of iTunes, but you haven't given any yet. Hang on, I'll think of a few myself: the iTunes store links you can't turn off, the stupid non-standard scroll bars, the"Genius" misfeature, no longer licensing the device plugin API, etc. There are plenty of real issues to bitch about with iTunes, but the /. trolls always seem to make up their own imaginary ones.

Re:Haha, good (1, Insightful)

univalue (1563403) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823905)

but why does itunes need to be running in the background when not in use. I call that malware. There are three processes by default on system startup. Yes I know how to remove them and did. That why I do not use itunes.

Re:Haha, good (4, Informative)

dhovis (303725) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823201)

Add a folder to your library, wait while itunes chugs and makes a COPY of each file before syncing.

In iTunes Preferences: Go to "Advanced". Uncheck "Copy files to iTunes Music folder when adding to library". iTunes will leave your files where they are and just index them.

Personally I like the way iTunes organizes my music and keeps the actual files out of my way, but YMMV.

Re:Haha, good (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823219)

You can disable the copying you know. Its an option called "keep my itunes library organised" or something like that. As for the send to part, well that's not really viable for people with huge music libraries, or people who want playlists for thier music. Not to mention the apps etc for the touch. If you really want drag and drop then don't get an iPod touch as all the features that make it an ipod touch would be useless without itunes (unless you want to create all the playlist and config files etc manually of course).

Re:Haha, good (1)

Darkness404 (1287218) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823983)

then don't get an iPod touch as all the features that make it an ipod touch would be useless without itunes

Owning a touch and really hating booting into Windows to sync with it, what I want is. A) about 6 gigs of space (I don't have a huge music library) B) Wi-Fi and a usable browser C) a decent enough e-mail client D) games E) Costs no more than $225. Right now the iPod touch is about the only thing that can give me all of those. I had a GP2x that I used for a while that gave me everything but Wi-Fi but it had questionable build quality (it never broke but it felt very fragile), chewed through batteries like there was no tomorrow (seriously, I got about 6 hours of use with a set of batteries playing music). If the iPod Touch let you use emulators I would almost forgive the other faults but the games are seriously lacking on the iPhone. I'm thinking about getting a Pandora if they ever end up shipping.

Re:Haha, good (1)

goonerw (99408) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823321)

Add a folder to your library, wait while itunes chugs and makes a COPY of each file before syncing.

You must be using a different iTunes to the rest of us. I've been using it for over 5 years and it's never done that for me. There is an option for it to "Copy files to iTunes Music folder when adding to library" but that's unchecked by default.

Re:Haha, good (1)

RickRussellTX (755670) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823399)

wait while itunes chugs and makes a COPY of each file before syncing.

It's a checkbox in the Advanced preferences. And you can see why they start with it turned on -- people who don't understand the filesystem would get *seriously* confused when they deleted some Blankety-Blank folder that they didn't remember creating in their My Documents folder and suddenly music disappeared from iTunes. Plus, it's easier to keep metadata (covers, for example) in the same location as the music, since otherwise you couldn't rely on having write access.

Re:Haha, good (2, Insightful)

kklein (900361) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823721)

Seriously does anyone else have issues with how convoluted it really is to add mp3 files to an ipod touch?

Not me. Plug in to charge, unplug when you are leaving the house. Everything is already synced. That's convoluted?

Add a folder to your library, wait while itunes chugs and makes a COPY of each file before syncing.

As other posters have pointed out, you don't have to have it set up that way. If you want to have your music strewn all over your hard drive in random places that are hard to keep track of and hard to back up, Apple will oblidge.

I'm sorry that you don't know how to use the software, but I'm glad that all my music is in one folder.

Hit sync a few times and agree to all your old settings being overwritten (when all it really does is update).

This is the one I can't figure out. The only time I hit "sync" is when I've told the program not to sync automatically, or if I've changed some playlists or something while it is plugged in and already synced. I don't think I've ever had to hit it "a few times," and I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about with the "all your old settings will be overwritten" message. Are you sure you're not hitting "Restore?"

Again... I would like to humbly suggest that you do not know how to use the software.

A $10 mp3 player allows me to right click and say "Send to..."

Okay, that's cool. I don't see how that helps with podcast subscriptions, playlists, and certain subsets of the library syncing to one device and others going to others, or how that helps you keep star ratings synced so that Party Shuffle preferentially selects songs you like better, or basically how that would be better than having a single, highly-customizable program handle all that for you, but if you want to do it that way, why didn't you just buy one of those FongTech "Super-Maxi CyberSong Glory" MP3 players that are all the rage these days, instead of the pokey little iPod Touch?

Re:Haha, good (1)

Paul Carver (4555) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823789)

Seriously does anyone else have issues with how convoluted it really is to add mp3 files to an ipod touch? Add a folder to your library, wait while itunes chugs and makes a COPY of each file before syncing. Hit sync a few times and agree to all your old settings being overwritten (when all it really does is update).

PEBKAC

Whether iTunes copies files or not is a user configurable setting. Personally I want iTunes to manage it's copy of my library without touching the original files. In my case the original files (ripped with EAC and LAME) are a backup on separate physical disc from my iTunes library.

My smart playlist "Recent Additions" contains everything with a "Date Added" property within the last 30 days and is automatically synced to my iPhone. So I don't even need to have my iPhone connected when I add stuff to my iTunes library and they'll still get loaded onto my iPhone whenever I happen to connect it.

So your issues with how convoluted it is are purely based out of your own ignorance. For me it's two steps: 1) drag file to iTunes. 2) Plug in iPhone cable.

Re:Haha, good (0, Flamebait)

TRRosen (720617) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823801)

Here's a thought learn how to use your software.

iTunes is making copies because you told it to in the preferences.

if iTunes is to complex for you sell your computer and buy an acubus.

Re:Haha, good (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823973)

Funny, when I went through the pop-up adverts for AVG's pay products that their "free" product offers, I thought the same thing of AVG. (Right before I switched to Avast)

Re:Haha, good (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823975)

I'm not sure if I quite agree with you, but the sentiment is on the money. I recently was made an offer I couldn't refuse to buy an ipod touch, and its quite a cool device. Not quite as good as the old Creative Zen I had before, as it has no radio, but the ability to play games and read ebooks is nice. The big drawback is the need to use itunes on windows to do anything. I had got used to plugging the old zen into any of the pcs at home any drag and drop what ever onto it. Now, itunes or nothing. Do mac users have any idea how crap itunes really is, or do they all just find something better? I'm a bit spoiled with my Ubuntu laptop, as there any number of great media players available, but nothing that'll see my ipod. I had forgotten what a bunch of control freaks they are at Apple not having used a Mac for 15 years or so.

Why the heck is this news? (4, Insightful)

arcade (16638) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823063)

Seriously.

Anti virus software has been breaking stuff for more than a decade. There will always be false positives, and there will always be stuff that hasn't been tested, thought about, and so forth.

Of course, now, after this incident, they'll add a unittest to make sure that this exact thing doesn't happen again, and maybe add some for other music services. But hey - this is NOT something that should be thought of as wrong, foolish or whatever. These things *happen*.

Anti-virus software has signatures, heuristics, and so forth. It'll be wrong from time to time. It's actually just business as usual.

So, why is this news?

Re:Why the heck is this news? (5, Interesting)

nate_in_ME (1281156) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823119)

If you read through the discussion on the Apple forums, you will probably be(I know I was) surprised at how many people uninstalled iTunes out of fear of it being infected. Of course, there were just as many that uninstalled AVG in order to keep their iTunes work.

So, while those of us here may know all about how common false positives, etc. are with AV software, reading through the now 20+ pages on Apple's site shows that the majority of iTunes users don't have the knowledge that we do.

Re:Why the heck is this news? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823957)

shows that the majority of iTunes users don't have the knowledge that we do.

I'm more than half convinced that the majority of iTunes users are too stupid to use a computer. But that's just my opinion.

Re:Why the heck is this news? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823227)

If false positives aren't news, how will you know whether the alerts you get are from real viruses or false positives?

For example, take contaminated food. It happens regularly, but it still makes the news, just like murders and car accidents. At least in the case of false positives and contaminated food, the news double as a public announcement.

Re:Why the heck is this news? (1)

B3ryllium (571199) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823575)

It's news because it horribly breaks iTunes, and (last I heard) causes re-installation to fail.

Of course, that's only if you believe iTunes isn't horribly broken to start with ;-)

Nothing to do with shares (1, Interesting)

TrippTDF (513419) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823065)

causing a minor annoyance to users wouldn't do anything for Palm, so why would they bother? It's probably some poor detection on the part of AVG.

Re:Nothing to do with shares (1)

56 (527333) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823799)

Oh, so that WOULDN'T be effective, then? Gee whiz! ps, I'm pretty sure the 'palm shares' remark was sarcastic.

No Surprise (3, Funny)

TheRealMindChild (743925) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823097)

AVG does not have any information on this particular virus in their virus encyclopedia

That is the case for ~99% of the viruses in their "encyclopedia".

A false positive is front page news? (1)

Enderandrew (866215) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823151)

Anti-virus programs have false positives all the time over stupid shit.

1 - Inherently, an anti-virus can only scan against a database of known problems. New problems won't be detected.
2 - It has been demonstrated that it is VERY easy to spoof detection.
3 - AVG did far worse recently when the firewall portion of their full internet security suite installed drivers for each network connection you had. Said drivers would cause Windows to BSOD. The only solution was to uninstall AVG. I assume that would be a bigger story than a false positive.

If you're really worried about security, don't run with admin rights, run with a resident program that detects possible changes and stops them before they happen, or better yet, run Linux.

Re:A false positive is front page news? (-1, Flamebait)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823387)

1 - Inherently, an anti-virus can only scan against a database of known problems. New problems won't be detected.

Tell that to Mac users back in the System 6 and 7 days, who had access to a free antivirus program which detected suspicious behavior.

2 - It has been demonstrated that it is VERY easy to spoof detection.

What do you mean? Link?

3 - AVG did far worse recently when the firewall portion of their full internet security suite installed drivers for each network connection you had. Said drivers would cause Windows to BSOD. The only solution was to uninstall AVG. I assume that would be a bigger story than a false positive.

Nah, nobody runs that shit.

If you're really worried about security, don't run with admin rights,

This is a stupid thing to say, and you are stupid for having said it. Lots of software still requires that you be administrator.

run with a resident program that detects possible changes and stops them before they happen,

Way to contradict your point #1.

or better yet, run Linux.

I have about reached my limit of frustration with Linux, because I use a laptop. It worked great on my desktop system, which I am selling. I hope that in a few more years Xorg is unfucked to the point where it can handle dynamic changes, and that the nvidia and ATI drivers are altered to match. Rebooting (well, restarting X anyway... but I need to log out!) to heat up an external display connected to my laptop is pathetic and there is no excuse for it. Also I have an HP and they use Microsoft's tool for ACPI and such, causing [deliberate?] incompatibilities which play hell with Linux users.

I hear you that the long-term solution is to leave Windows, but for most users the available [free] solution is to run Avira or Avast!.

Re:A false positive is front page news? (1)

Pheonix28 (1362095) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823445)

If you're really worried about security, don't run with admin rights,

This is a stupid thing to say, and you are stupid for having said it. Lots of software still requires that you be administrator.

and then everything you said was thrown out the window like it was never there.

Re:A false positive is front page news? (1)

Enderandrew (866215) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823473)

Tell that to Mac users back in the System 6 and 7 days, who had access to a free antivirus program which detected suspicious behavior.

This is different from an anti-virus scanner.

What do you mean? Link?

Are you incapable of using Google? Heck, many virus scans can be fooled simply by padding an executable so it doesn't match a hash.

Nah, nobody runs that shit.

AVG must be out of business if no one runs their commercial product.

Way to contradict your point #1.

I'm discussing two different types of apps. Please attempt to follow the discussion.

I have about reached my limit of frustration with Linux, because I use a laptop.

My wife uses Linux exclusively on her laptop. She has done so on her past couple of laptops over the years with ATI and Nvidia graphics.

I've never needed to reboot to activate a second display. I'm really not familiar with the problems you're describing.

Literally, I've found that tons of hardware "just works" better with Linux than Windows. I don't download or hunt down drivers. Most printers I plug in are just detected and work. Heck, in Vista you can't even get drivers for most older printers.

What distro were you running?

Try this LiveCD, and tell me if you run into any problems.

http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE:/Medias/images/iso/KDE4-UNSTABLE-Live.x86_64-1.2.98-Build1.1.iso [opensuse.org]

Re:A false positive is front page news? (1)

karnal (22275) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823617)

I'm sure the grandparent is gonna really want to try your link when it says UNSTABLE right in the filename. ;)

Re:A false positive is front page news? (1)

El Capitaine (973850) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823619)

Heh...I agree that OpenSUSE is a great distro...I just find it funny that your link contains the word "UNSTABLE" in all caps =D

Re:A false positive is front page news? (1)

Enderandrew (866215) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823665)

It is a weekly snapshot build. That doesn't mean that it is actually really unstable. I run weekly snapshots of KDE 4.3, OpenOffice, Firefox, wine, etc. from openSUSE repositories.

Re:A false positive is front page news? (1)

Wildclaw (15718) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823655)

This is a stupid thing to say, and you are stupid for having said it. Lots of software still requires that you be administrator.

In that case you have four choices.

1. You explictly trust it and run that specific application in admin mode.
2. You run it in a virtual machine.
3. You run it in a sandbox (I like sandboxie).
4. You don't run it and use something else.

In fact, I would go so far as to say that this applies to even non-admin mode. All applications should be run in a virtual machine or sandboxed unless they are explicitly trusted. These are things that any modern operating system should be able to handle (not that any do by default, except possibly some rare linux/bsd variant).

why is AVG still a major player? (4, Informative)

13th seer (33836) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823153)

AVG turned to fucking donkey shit after 7.5. it blows my mind people still use it. the company treats their end users like idiots, their software behaves like the malware it claims to rid your system of, and eats up a shitton of resources to boot

yet it still seems to be one of the most popular free scanners, if not the most. I don't get it

it's hard to find a decent free antivirus that doesn't nag or suck these days. iirc Avira had nag screens, and a ridiculous amount of false positives. the least crap one I've used seems to be avast!. it seems to detect a decent amount of viruses, keeps out of the way, and and doesn't eat up a lot of resources

Re:why is AVG still a major player? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823207)

agreed comrade, avast! all the way. i uninstalled AVG and have never used it again since after is obliterated my old XP machine's ability to boot by deleting a critical Windows file. thankfully i had a bunch of livecds to recover files and fix the problems...

Re:why is AVG still a major player? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823561)

and, of course, has its own share of false positives;
http://www.google.com/search?q= [google.com]"avast+false+positive"

Grisoft doesn't treat me like anything because I use the free version - I understand that with that I get limited support, if any.

AVG hasn't ever been 'in my way', and certainly not like any of the malware I read about (inserting themselves into pages, turning your machine into a spam bot, making it impossible to reach websites, etc.) -- 'd really love to see a clarification on that statement.

And as for resources - it's currently using 10MB memory, which is 280MB less than the FireFox I type this in. I think I'll live even if I agree 10MB seems rather high. CPU use.. well, Task Manager is at the top with 3%, ThunderBird hovers between 1 and 2, and occasionally Explorer seems to do its thing. All the AVG*.exe processes are firmly stuck at zero. Again. clarification?

Re:why is AVG still a major player? (2, Informative)

nulldaemon (926551) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823923)

AVG hasn't ever been 'in my way', and certainly not like any of the malware I read about (inserting themselves into pages, turning your machine into a spam bot, making it impossible to reach websites, etc.) -- 'd really love to see a clarification on that statement.

A while back AVG pushed out a poorly designed malware scanner that would scan search results before you clicked on them; AVG would basically visit each link that showed up in your search results. AVG traffic soon outstripped real traffic about 10 times, and there was a very strong backlash from popular websites (Slashdot, Whirlpool) who accused AVG of a massive DOS attack, as well as urged their members to choose a different virus product. Quite a few people seem to be still holding this one mistake against AVG, even though it has little relevance today...

McAffee/Norton Syndrome (4, Insightful)

Solr_Flare (844465) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823729)

It's part of the natural life cycle of anti-virus software. Anti-virus software gets really good -> geeks and techies jump on the bandwagon -> they spread this to their non-techie friends -> AV software gets bloated/crappy over time -> geeks abandon it slowly over time -> regular consumers continue to use it forever until a geek comes along to force them to use the current hotness.

Re:why is AVG still a major player? (1)

ScrewMaster (602015) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823963)

yet it still seems to be one of the most popular free scanners, if not the most. I don't get it

I think you answered your own question.

Wise choice? (1)

Hurricane78 (562437) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823205)

Maybe it rightfully flags DRM files. Maybe they also include a rootkit. At least it would make sense to me, if their heuristic would detect sneaky encrypted files looking like normal music files.

Avastly superior antivirus... (3, Interesting)

kms_one (1272174) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823235)

My antivirus is Avastly superior to AVG, but I don't use iTunes anyway. Sansa ftw.

Re:Avastly superior antivirus... (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823329)

I don't use Windows so I don't get viruses, and I don't listen to music, because I don't like to pay the RIAA.

See, I can write completely pointless, smug, and unhelpful posts too.

freeballer (0, Redundant)

freeballer (1160851) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823255)

kinda stupid to compare palm cracking of itunes and this false positive, used to be virus scanners found false positives in x:\windows praise jebus now it just mucks up your itunes.. That being said, can't it not be defined as as an exception anyways? lol Not saying this wasn't a dumb mistake just saying its not newsworthy, inprobable, or easily fixed...

Re:freeballer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823377)

what the fuck did you just write? Lay off the freebase kemo sabe

And that is why... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823261)

I use Avast Anti-virus.

Oh, and I am a PC. :)

Re:And that is why... (1)

jayemcee (605967) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823339)

Avast is great, never any issues or any real nags. I did just get a suggestion to visit a blog page where the CEO chatters a bit but they seem to be in good shape at the moment...

Viruses ? Antiviruses ?... (1, Funny)

koolfy (1213316) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823285)

... Do they still exist ?

I'm sorry, I've been using Linux for 5 years now, so I'm a little bit ahead of your world...
Just tell me when you get to the package manager revolution, or at least the trustful and reliable software era.

*no offense.*

Slashdot Journalistic Ethics (1, Informative)

mysidia (191772) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823303)

From the summary: One user there had an interesting thought: 'Maybe Palm has some shares in AVG...MUAHAAAA!!'

It's nearly culpable negligence (IMO, lack of due care) to repeat a statement like that one, which has no basis in reality, and could significantly tarnish AVG's reputation.

Please see this quote:

"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." --Robert J. Hanlon

Re:Slashdot Journalistic Ethics (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823523)

How's the weather down there? Gosh, you look like an ant from here!

Sincerely,
The joke

Re:Slashdot Journalistic Ethics (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823633)

When has that ever stopped kdawson from posting?

Re:Slashdot Journalistic Ethics (0, Flamebait)

MrMista_B (891430) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823931)

Y'know, AVG doesn't have a good reputation /to/ tarnish. The only people who use them are the ignorant or willfully stupid. Which, admittedly, is a lot.

Well what the hell do you want? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823343)

most commercial "Anti-Virus" software works by intentionally breaking your computer in the stupid hope that it will also catch some viruses. Sometimes it breaks your computer in a way you may notice, usually it just makes the system unusably slow. Boo-hoo. Go use a solution that isn't fundamentally flawed.

Oh right, There are none. All anti-virus products suck ass.

Trust Issues? (2, Informative)

TheFatherMind (1605731) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823621)

I took it upon myself to drop them (AVG) a quick note telling them that I was hard pressed to pay/trust my welfare to a company that did not know what its own viruses were. And then I discovered that they really did not want to talk to or hear from me. It took me almost 10 minutes to find a form I could actually successfully type something into (Try it yourself!). And to do so I had to choose some very odd options from the dropdowns as they had NOTHING related to simply giving them feedback or "Other". It is a shame as I have been doing rather well with their free version.

AVG Free breaks Win7 RC1 (1)

ProfanityHead (198878) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823703)

AVG Free breaks Win7 RC1 on 2 of my machines that run it. Locks up explorer constantly even doing simple shell things like opening a toolbar I have created on the taskbar. After 3 weeks I couldn't take it anymore and now am testing Avast free.

Re:AVG Free breaks Win7 RC1 (1)

Ash-Fox (726320) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823985)

Last I checked, AVG doesn't officially support any win7 build to begin with.

Yet another reason to not use proprietary garbage (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823717)

You always get screwed. Always. So in this case AVG decided they don't like Apple so they decided to screw users of Apple software as a punishment. You read about this sort of thing at least every month.

Re:Yet another reason to not use proprietary garba (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28823755)

It's probably incompetence, not maliciousness.

Even if it were, you think open source is immune from this kind of thing? ABP vs NoScript?

This identifies a weakness in AV techniques (1)

erroneus (253617) | more than 4 years ago | (#28823859)

The problem of misidentification will continue to grow as the number of unique malware items are identified. It is getting to the point that software publishers need to start submitting information about their official published versions to AV projects to avoid misidentification. Such information would include size, checksum + md5sum + sha1sum or something along those lines. In this way operating system files and commonly used software could avoid misidentification I think.

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