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1251 comments

Depressing, but not uncommon (5, Insightful)

RogueyWon (735973) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938045)

As Thompson sees it, any reasonable employer would pounce on an applicant with her academic credentials, which include a 2.7 grade-point average and a solid attendance record. But Monroe's career-services department has put forth insufficient effort to help her secure employment, she claims.

"They're supposed to say, 'I got this student, her attendance is good, her GPA is all right -- can you interview this person?' They're not doing that," she said.

Words fail me (briefly).

The best thing to come out of this story is that Ms. Thompson has sent out a nice big red-flag warning to any potential employers not to touch her with a barge pole. After all, if she does this, you can pretty much guarantee she'll sue her employer the moment she gets passed over for a promotion (after all, she shows up for work most days and her last project wasn't a total disaster).

"It doesn't make any sense: They went to school for four years, and then they come out working at McDonald's and Payless. That's not what they planned."

It might not be what they planned, but it is the reality of the job market. The huge expansion in higher education, along with widespread dumbing down of course material and grade inflation, has created a market where many apparently middling graduates just aren't going to have a chance at getting a job that genuinely requires graduate skills. A lot of students who 20 years ago would have been considered middling (but would have gone on to get graduate-level jobs) are now clustered around the top of the class.

At the same time, the self-esteem and all-must-have-prizes philosophies that now pervade much of education have convinced everybody that they deserve to walk right into their dream job, just because they've done nothing more than show up for class and turn in assignments most of the time. The entitlement mentality is right out on show in this story. I do a fair bit of recruitment for my employer and I see plenty more applicants who seem to feel the same way. They don't get very far.

There is an unfortunate side to this. A lot of teens and their parents are still duped into believing that a degree will still lead to a guaranteed "good" job. There's plenty of material out there to counter-act this view and show that in many (possibly even now a majority) of cases, it's a waste of time and money. Unfortunately, this usually gets dismissed as right wing ranting (which I will no doubt get accused of in the replies to this post). The other unfortunate side is that some employers with vacancies that could be filled by a bright high-school graduate seem to feel the need to advertise for a graduate just to "keep up with the Jonses", though I've noticed a slight reversal of this trend recently.

I'd advise Ms. Thompson that with her achievements and attitude, she needs to lower her expectations. She mentions McDonalds sneeringly, but the fact is that they have a general corporate policy of promoting most of their talent internally. If she is as capable as she thinks she is and went to work there with the intention of proving herself (and the attitude to match), she could have a perfectly reasonable career. The same is true of any number of other employers that she probably considers below her social status. Of course, she won't.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (5, Interesting)

Nursie (632944) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938097)

"just because they've done nothing more than show up for class and turn in assignments most of the time."

That was what I did.

But then I have natural wit and charm, a willingness to admit I slacked off at university, plus I did computer science. Little miss entitlement got a "Bachelor of Business Administration" in "IT". What the hell does that even mean?

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (5, Insightful)

antifoidulus (807088) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938235)

That she expects to earn a large amount of money by being immediately put into a "management" position and paid vast sums of money solely due to the fact that she is such a wonderful person and "deserves" to be a manager with a large salary.

God, the sense of entitlement in the US is making me sick...

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (0, Troll)

RCL (891376) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938419)

God, the sense of entitlement in the US is making me sick...

It's even more frequent in socialist-minded Europe (Russia included), where more than half of population have higher education (because it's mostly free, especially in post-communist countries). Then everyone expects to get an "advanced" job and despises menial labour or "low-level" technical jobs (like say, a car technician).

It all results in high unemployment ("advanced" jobs are rare by definition) for European "aborigines", while uneducated (but willing to work everywhere) migrants fill the labour market gap.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (5, Insightful)

Eivind (15695) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938481)

Uhm, did you try comparing that map of yours to the actual terrain ?

Yeah, unemployment is up here, in that part of europe with the highest education (Scandinavia), why we're at above 2% now, which is a lot more than the comfortable 0.8% we used to enjoy prior to the current crisis.

How high is your unemployment again ?

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938331)

It means she will make vastly more money than you, work half the time and have twice as much paid vacation.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (3, Informative)

Nursie (632944) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938351)

It means she will make vastly more money than you, work half the time and have twice as much paid vacation.

I doubt that very much I'm British, she's American.

I already get five weeks paid leave and work 37 hour weeks. From what I understand of the US I'd probably be fired for not being present enough. Here, I just go promoted.

America - you're doing it wrong.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (1, Offtopic)

Kierthos (225954) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938471)

I'm American, I only work about 38 hours a week (okay, strike that.... I'm at work for 38 hours a week, but I have barely had three hours of work a day for the last several weeks), and I have about five weeks of vacation time built up.

Am I doing it wrong too?

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (2, Interesting)

Nursie (632944) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938515)

No, you seem to be doing it right. I'd be slightly worried if the work was dropping off too much though. And what do you mean by "built up"?

I'm sure it's not everyone, but I do get the impression that in much of the US there is much more of a long hours culture, and much less paid leave. That said, I've been working 11 hour days for the last three weeks or so because something needs to be finished. I have no objection to putting in the extra work when it's needed, just not routinely.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (1)

hattig (47930) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938383)

Not when prospective employers Google her name and find all this stuff out about her.

"Bachelor of Business Administration" in "IT" ... what's that then? A six month part-time course for people who are looking to move from IT support roles (the blokes in The IT Crowd) into IT management roles (the useless woman manager in The IT Crowd)? I.e., something you do five years into your IT support job.

It's certainly not a 3 year degree course, it's way way too specialised. It's not "Business Administration". It's not "IT" (whatever that actually is as a study term). It's "IT Business Administration". Most companies don't need secretaries for the IT directors and managers any more...

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938377)

No, it means she didn't even learn how to suck up or act properly.
She's been taught to think she knows how to manage (business administration) geeks (IT), and here we all are already laughing at her.
Good grief - I worked at McD's while I was still at university, and it was a powerful incentive to understand the world and that I had to get off my own fat arse to get anywhere better.
Oh yeah - it was a good education in making my own food too, and brewing coffee - a skill that was finally extremely useful when I did enter the corporate world. Maybe an honours IT grad *shouldn't* be making his boss coffee, but doing it right when the need arose raised my visibility instantly.

Miss Thompson - take a fucking number - get a goddam clue, go out and get a REAL job, like serving customers, helping people. You now pour scorn on those secretary chicks that didn't go to uni, but they've got incomes, and boyfriends, and nice clothes, and you just got your own bag of poor-little-me.

Somebody call the waaahmbulance - we got a bad case of memememe needs rehabilitation. Poor little poppet - suck my dick.
2.7 doesn't qualify you for anything EXCEPT MacDonald's these days.

I've no idea either (1)

TheLink (130905) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938417)

Maybe it means she should start her own business? :)

She might as well, since she just made herself even more unemployable.

Who'd want to hire you, if you get a 2.7 and then sue your college because you haven't managed to get a job after 3 months?

If the college mistakenly gave her a 2.7 when she should have got something better, but refused to fix it, then sure sue.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938149)

Nail.

Head.

You hit it on the.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (1)

DamonHD (794830) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938223)

I admit that at that time of my life I might have sneered at the McD roles, but I wouldn't have sued and I wouldn't have felt entitled, and I was already running my own company on seed capital and 18 hours a day...

Rgds

Damon

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (1)

master5o1 (1068594) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938229)

I got up to the "It might not be what they planned..." bit which reminded me that nothing ever goes to plan. But then again, that just shows that plans do and must change (or have fluidity in the plan).

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (5, Insightful)

Kokuyo (549451) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938259)

Not that I'm American, but when and how DO you get to your dream job?

In this country, you can do an apprenticeship in just about anything. So I went into IT. I was good in school (top five of the class) and I showed above average skills in whatever I was doing.

I'm at my third job now. Let's skip how good or bad that one is and just get to what's interesting to me at the moment: Looking for a job. Personally, I'm a guy who is honest about what he can and can not do. I somehow convinced myself that good jobs cannot be had through lying because hey, if you had to lie to get it, can you expect an honest work environment? Either they overstated their requirements and you CAN do the job (but then what else are they going to expect from you that is not part of the job?) OR they were serious, you CAN'T do the job and what then?

For all three jobs, I've been working for sub-standard wage (meaning my salary was somewhere between 50% and 75% of what my work was worth), did unpaid overtime and was generally reachable at all times. I did not have the means to get certification and the companies had no interest in me having them.

So now I'm hearing "Well, for someone in IT, you did remarkably little certification". Or what about "Ah, so you wouldn't call yourself a geniusHmm..."?

Fact remains that doing honest and hard work brings you NOTHING. You must be a quack, a liar and just basically leech everything out of the company that you possibly can. Then you go to the next and rinse and repeat. It's what the managers do and it's what is expected of you. Being a carpenter is starting to sound bloody perfect just about now.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (1)

EbeneezerSquid (1446685) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938395)

Unfortunately, Certification is the only way the IT world has of "proving" that a given employee can do the job. A growing number of employers will pay for or reimburse the cost of taking them in the US.

At least certification is a more reliable indicator of actual job knowledge than a degree, these days.

Fact remains that doing honest and hard work brings you NOTHING.

I wouldn't say nothing. But, unfortunately, you still need to be able to play office politics, or you will end up with someone else taking the credit for all your hard work: And, unfortunately again, IT-types tend to be less good at politics at than the type of person who gets a degree in "Business Administration" in IT.

You cannot be both a geek and successful without leaving your comfort zone, sadly.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938509)

Not that I'm American, but when and how DO you get to your dream job?

In this country, you can do an apprenticeship in just about anything. So I went into IT. I was good in school (top five of the class) and I showed above average skills in whatever I was doing.

I'm at my third job now. Let's skip how good or bad that one is and just get to what's interesting to me at the moment: Looking for a job. Personally, I'm a guy who is honest about what he can and can not do. I somehow convinced myself that good jobs cannot be had through lying because hey, if you had to lie to get it, can you expect an honest work environment? Either they overstated their requirements and you CAN do the job (but then what else are they going to expect from you that is not part of the job?) OR they were serious, you CAN'T do the job and what then?

For all three jobs, I've been working for sub-standard wage (meaning my salary was somewhere between 50% and 75% of what my work was worth), did unpaid overtime and was generally reachable at all times. I did not have the means to get certification and the companies had no interest in me having them.

So now I'm hearing "Well, for someone in IT, you did remarkably little certification". Or what about "Ah, so you wouldn't call yourself a geniusHmm..."?

Fact remains that doing honest and hard work brings you NOTHING. You must be a quack, a liar and just basically leech everything out of the company that you possibly can. Then you go to the next and rinse and repeat. It's what the managers do and it's what is expected of you. Being a carpenter is starting to sound bloody perfect just about now.

Sounds very much like you worked for EDS!

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (1, Informative)

z0mb13e (1492637) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938513)

I did an Engineering degree in 'Multimedia Communication' worked bloody hard, got a first that was then 'moderated' to a 2:1 due to restrictions on the number of firsts the university could give out, and have ended up in pretty much the same situation, getting seriously underpaid for what I do, I'm not earning much more now then when I graduated. I have also worked for a number of employers who didn't believe in the value of on-going certification and have the same problem with prospective employers now questioning my ability due to lack of recent certification (which I am now addressing very slowly as it takes so much time & money).

I also find that employment agencies don't have a clue what an engineering degree actually means. I get lumped in with those who graduated with Bachelors degrees in computer science. I sometimes want to scream 'I can design fucking microchips you idiot', but I don't. If someone failed a year in our course they could 'drop out' and into the Computer Science Bachelors degree course as they would almost certainly have enough credit from the work they did pass, to count as a year on a lesser degree. So I agree that the sheer volume of graduates these days has watered down the value of any degree.

A couple of years ago it took me 9 months to find a job. I was honest about what I could and couldn't do, though I explained that I can learn most things as I have a solid grounding in software dev, infrastructure support, design, dev team management etc etc. I wasn't able to get a similar position so had to take a few steps down the ladder to a support role. It seems that you have to lie about your ability to keep moving up the ladder. However I wouldn't sue over not getting a job. But then this is in the UK and some of us still believe that we are responsible (to some degree) for our own circumstances.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (5, Funny)

pjt33 (739471) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938295)

Notice that this story is in the Entertainment section? You're supposed to point and laugh.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (4, Insightful)

ObsessiveMathsFreak (773371) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938307)

A lot of teens and their parents are still duped into believing that a degree will still lead to a guaranteed "good" job.

The big problem here is that society at large has come to view universities and higher education in general as advanced vocational training. The trouble is, the universities themselves have no such delusion.

In short, it is impossible for universities to provide vocational training for professions. There are too many jobs, too many ways of doing them, and too many changes in practices in every single profession for any one institution to have a ghost of chance of keeping up with all of them.

Now, there is some element of "job training" in higher education, but only in an academic sense. You can be taught about binary trees and methods to search them in a university course, but there simply isn't time to train you in how to use the IDE, language and indeed operating system that you will be asked to implement those searches by your employer. And computer science courses are in fact VERY vocational as courses go. Most engineering course will only be able to teach you how to use a bandsaw and AutoCAD. Small use when you have to use the latest tabletop wonder from Hansvedt.

At the end of the day, final training for a job must be done by employers. Unfortunately, many skimp on this and complain that Universities aren't doing their job. HR departments demand experience not because they believe it will provide quality, but because the company does not want to go to the bother of expense of actually passing on skills. Yes, Graduates do come out of universities will few "real world" skills. But this has always been the case. What has changed is a fickle employment culture in which companies hire and fire at will and thus cannot risk training someone only to see them run off at a moments notice for a higher paid position.

There's plenty of material out there to counter-act this view and show that in many (possibly even now a majority) of cases, it's a waste of time and money.

I wouldn't go quite so far. It is true that certain courses can be difficult to get a job out of, but it's also true that not taking any course can make it very difficult to get a well paid, and indeed fulfilling job. A university course should be chosen for two reasons; Interest in the subject, and the prospect of a vocation. Both are important. If people choose wisely and put in the effort, their time spent in university will be far from a waste of time and money, and indeed will be time well spent and very well rewarded. Fours years of good education will allow you to hold your own in your chosen field, and prepare you for a changing world and workplace. This is not guaranteed, but the odds are certainly in your favour.

Anyone want to mod parent up? (1)

plasmacutter (901737) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938423)

I'm growing more and more tired of one-sided comments about the "entitlement generation".

The point this poster makes is particularly salient: the applicants are not the only ones who feel "entitled"

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (4, Interesting)

something_wicked_thi (918168) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938359)

There is an unfortunate side to this. A lot of teens and their parents are still duped into believing that a degree will still lead to a guaranteed "good" job. There's plenty of material out there to counter-act this view and show that in many (possibly even now a majority) of cases, it's a waste of time and money. Unfortunately, this usually gets dismissed as right wing ranting

Don't be silly. Right wing ranting? I'm as left wing as they come, barring communists, and I think that makes perfect sense. Get a degree in something useful if you want a job. It's really as simple as that.

That said, I do take issue with the "2.7 GPA" part of this. GPAs are overrated. Anyone who interviews with me (I do interviews, I don't own the place) is going to get no brownie points for "perfect attendance", but I don't give a damn what her GPA is. If she can answer my questions well, she'll get a job. If she can't, she won't.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (1)

Canazza (1428553) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938429)

I just have to laugh at people like this.
I went to University, studying for a Computing Degree. I dropped out after 2nd year.
I didn't get a degree. All I came out with was Student Debts.

3 years later I'm earning Graduate Wages, and i'm about to jump on the property ladder, having started working in a call center, learning on my own time, on my own terms, things that I was interested in and becoming Good at them, getting a better job with slightly better wages, but living in a shithole, learning on the job and getting better again, before landing my current job, which isn't a million miles away from my original 'ideal' job.

It's called Effort, if you don't put it in you get jack shit out. If you don't grab oppertunities you don't win.
I'm 24, most of my friends finished their Degree's last year, only one of them is in a job relating to their degree and is only earning £1,000 more than I am (that's a 5 year degree for you), the other is going back for another degree and yet another is still mooching off his parents.

If I hadn't dropped out of University when I did, I'd have hit the recession square in the face and never got a job. As it stands, I entered the workforce when people were still looking for rookies to train up and was damn lucky for it in hindsight.

I think I've rambled off the point a bit. The woman in the article is a twit if she thinks that getting a degree = job, when the opposite is equally possible. (!degree = job, or degree = !job)

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (1)

Canazza (1428553) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938451)

Oh, did I mention I also get to play Counter-strike at Lunchtime? Nothing builds teamwork like sneaking up behind your boss and knifing him when he's distracted.

Re:Depressing, but not uncommon (2, Insightful)

damburger (981828) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938455)

An inflated sense of entitlement isn't something you can blame on schools, especially not using conservative mythology about how 'libruls' run eduction.

A sense of entitlement is stoked by advertising. Because you're worth it etc. Its stoked by the old 'American dream' lie - that just by putting in hard work you can make it (and thus by extension, anyone who struggles has noone else to blame, making the US a brutally unsympathetic society).

This girl was sold a lie; that she could join the rich and powerful, if only she played along with their game (and voted for millionaires to have tax cuts, of course). She is now being hit with a harsh dose of reality, and seems to think a simple court case will make that reality go away. It will not.

Teaching fail (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938057)

All that education, and nobody teached her that the only person that is responsible for getting her employed is herself. Fits the usual American pattern of blaming everyone else for every problem faced in life and spamming lawsuits in every possible situation.

Re:Teaching fail (-1, Troll)

CountBrass (590228) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938159)

And obviously nobody TAUGHT you English.

Re:Teaching fail (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938267)

I'm studying English and History. If the young lady from the article thinks she is unemployable...

That will teach them (5, Insightful)

justcauseisjustthat (1150803) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938059)

That will teach them for advertising that they help everyone find a job :-)

Universities are HEAVILY involved in fraud. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938219)

It won't teach them anything. Universities are HEAVILY involved in fraud. If you don't like this example, find another.

They raise prices far faster than inflation, just like the doctors and drug companies. They are against society in many ways, in my opinion, not part of society.

Re:Universities are NOT heavily involved in fraud. (2, Informative)

HappyHead (11389) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938493)

Part of the reason they have to raise their prices faster than inflation is because the government-supplied part of their funding is steadily being withdrawn, and the money has to come from somewhere. It's pretty simple math, really:

Cost = Facilities + (# of Students * # of courses per student) + research budget
Income = Gov. Grants + Tuition + Donations + Industry Grants

If you reduce the income, then something from the cost has to go down.
If you reduce the research budget, then Industry Grants will also dry up, further reducing the Income, so that's not going to work.
If you reduce the facilities, you don't have places to put the students.
If you reduce the students or courses, you lose Tuition, and Income goes down further.
That means that you _must_ keep the Income balanced with the Cost. Politicians however look at it and say "Bah! Nobody needs nunna that thar book lernin'! Ah'll jus take their budget ta pay fer mah fishin' industry project this month." So the Cost has not changed, but the Income has gone down.
And then more and more students enrol, increasing cost out of proportion to the respective increase in Income due to more tuition being paid. (Guess what? Your degree costs the University more than you paid in Tuition!)
The _ONLY_ way that the rising spiral of costs can be dealt with is to either increase tuition (which reduces the number of students as well, thus reducing the costs and bringing it closer to balance) or to find some other source of income. In the current economy, how much money do you donate to your local university? Not very much I'd wager.

Re:That will teach them (2, Insightful)

Aladrin (926209) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938369)

I'm guessing everyone going 'omg she's stupid!' has never heard a college/uni promise to find you a job after you graduate. Of course, I heard the promise and knew it for what it was: Nothing. But I did briefly wonder at the time if there was any recourse after spending 10's of thousands of dollars and having them break their promise.

In fact, I didn't find a job for a year and a half after I graduated. My 'degree' didn't help me get the job -at all-. It ended up being knowledge that I had before I even went to college that got me the job.

I hope she wins.

oh sit down and stfu (3, Interesting)

novastar123 (540269) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938071)

I can understand her anger at not being able to find a job,
and yeah, pretty much all collages help graduates find jobs, but FFS, she should have picked a better major.
I'm a geek, and I wont even go into a computer sciences or information tech, field, there are 10 times as many
applicants than their are job openings in that field. 10 years ago, anyone with an IT or Comp Sci degree would
get hired on the spot, these days, you might as well have a liberal arts degree.

Re:oh sit down and stfu (5, Funny)

Alarindris (1253418) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938125)

pretty much all collages help graduates find jobs

Are you serious? Shit! I knew I should have listened to my mom when she told me to save all of my artwork from elementary school.

Re:oh sit down and stfu (1)

e2d2 (115622) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938157)

If I was a current student studying Comp Sci I'd go for a phd and become a true scientist, not some code flunky. But that's just me, a jaded burnt out programmer who is managed by people that can barely wipe their ass, let alone talk knowledgeably about computer science.

Think about it college geeks, do you really want to answer to a guy that put a shit ton of gel in his hair, pops his collar, and thinks the height of computer science is gaming modern search engines for better SEO?

Re:oh sit down and stfu (1)

hattig (47930) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938427)

Any decent university course is done with an academic aim, where they can pick the best of the bunch for higher academic study (PhDs in return for cheap lab work, lecturing, and supervising). Any decent university will tell you the undergraduate courses are an annoyance to the real aim of the university - research and buying property. However if it is a decent, recognised, university, that name on your degree is worth a lot.

The problem in business is lack of technical grades for promotion in many companies, meaning the best technical people have to go into management to get more money, thus eventually losing their skills as their hairstyle gets pointier. Sadly most people barely manage to think, so when you get a technical expert you really want to keep them, and reward them.

Re:oh sit down and stfu (1)

Nursie (632944) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938171)

"I'm a geek, and I wont even go into a computer sciences or information tech, field, there are 10 times as many
applicants than their are job openings in that field."

Umm, no, there's a shortage of good people. At least here in the UK. Not that we're recruiting right now, but last time we were it took months to find a decent C programmer. And there's always a premium and a shortage of Database folks.

Sure, there are a lot of folks in IT. There are also a lot of folks in web design. But trying to find a decent coder for fast, efficient, well designed distributed and parallel systems is hard.

As in all things in life, there are opportunities if you're good, and if you look in the right places.

Re:oh sit down and stfu (0)

gmack (197796) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938261)

I'm curious how you even know you have found a good C programmer to begin with.

What do you look for?

Re:oh sit down and stfu (4, Insightful)

jimicus (737525) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938313)

I'm curious how you even know you have found a good C programmer to begin with.

What do you look for?

Nobody knows.

Seriously.

That's the biggest thing that department managers the world over don't want to admit. Nobody has yet found a reliable way to interview people that will consistently result in hiring people you can work with that meet all your requirements.

Oh sure, companies ask technical questions, try and build a rapport and all that. Some even make the interview process last a full day with in-depth technical, HR, stress interviews. But there is always some little thing you don't think to check for in the interview process. If you're lucky, that little thing never matters. If you're unlucky - well, anyone who's been out of college more than a couple of years knows exactly what happens.

Re:oh sit down and stfu (1)

Nursie (632944) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938323)

You ask questions about resources, about parallelism, efficient data structures, platform related difficulties etc.

It's not even necessary that they get the "right" answers, especially when talking about data structures, just that it sparks off a discussion and you can tell whether they're trying to pull the wool over your eyes or not.

I'll admit it's more difficult at a graduate level, where you're trying to assess someone's potential to become a good resource-usage tracking obsessive :)

Re:oh sit down and stfu (1)

damburger (981828) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938535)

Its a myth, there is no shortage of good people in the UK. There is a shortage of good people who will work for half what they are worth, put in long hours, and take whatever shit their MBA twat of a boss chooses to throw at them. The IT industry just constantly bugs the government to train more IT people, just so they can lower the cost of them.

This is why I got out. I have skills in both C and databases, but couldn't find a decent job. Often, it was because rather than looking for someone with skills in C they looked for someone with X years of experience in the specific IDE they used at their company, or rather than looking for someone with database skills they wanted someone who had been working on some shit like Filemaker for 10 years.

Other times though, it was the hilarious pay packages offered. It made more sense to get an easier, almost equally paid job and code my own projects in my greater amount of spare time.

The Entitlement Generation. (4, Insightful)

CountBrass (590228) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938077)

It's obvious that as the entitlement generation grows up we'll see more of this: "I should get a job even though I'm mediocre at what I do and if I don't then I should be able to sue someone".

Let's hope she gets laughed out of court.

Re:The Entitlement Generation. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938475)

Let's hope she gets laughed out of court.

Doubt it, the US legal system has been designed to encourage lawsuits. Every lawsuit, no matter how trivial or idiotic, represents more business for government and more money passing through the hands of those who control government.

Sitting at the top of the pyramid looking down, the more people relying on government the better (i.e. running to government at the slightest hint of a problem). The US government didn't achieve exponential growth over the past century (in both power and revenue) by refusing to cater to parasites.

thou shalt get a degree (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938079)

Obviously this woman doesn't have a case, but it's still not that hard to sympathise with people who are being pushed into higher education on the back of all the "you must have a degree to get a good job" and "knowledge-based economy" bullshit that's put about these days. Most of these folks would be better off learning an honest trade.

What's a C student at Monroe College? (3, Insightful)

orzetto (545509) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938085)

Can anyone explain what is a C in the US in the percentile range? Is this synonymous with miserable failure? What about the reputation of Monroe College?

Is she an average or plain-awful student?

Re:What's a C student at Monroe College? (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938105)

For UK folks, it's equivalent to a low 2:2, and approaches a third.

Re:What's a C student at Monroe College? (4, Informative)

CountBrass (590228) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938155)

Someone who attends an honours course and is awarded an ordinary degree: i.e. you didn't fail spectacularly and you showed up to lectures so we'll give you a piece of paper.

Re:What's a C student at Monroe College? (4, Informative)

xlsior (524145) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938187)

Can anyone explain what is a C in the US in the percentile range? Is this synonymous with miserable failure? What about the reputation of Monroe College?

A 'c' encompasses a range of scores - the GPA (Grade Point Average) is more telling.

The highest GPA you can get (with 100% marks on everything) is 4.0.
The national average GPA for college graduates is 3.2 (according to a quick google search)
She got a 2.7, which while not horribly bad, definitely puts her below average.

Never heard of Monroe college.

Re:What's a C student at Monroe College? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938381)

"Never heard of Monroe college." I had not heard of this institution either. It does have a webpage, but millions of people have those.

2.7 IS below average. I goofed off and maintained a 3.7 GPA, I drank too much beer and smoked too much marijuana to push myself that extra little bit for a 4.0.

I imagine her programming skills are as follows:
(negro)void(negro)

She is a Douchebagette!

Re:What's a C student at Monroe College? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938243)

A grade of "C" is supposed to be some measure of "average" or "average effort". The grade system here is typically A (top students), B (good students), C (average students), D (struggling students), and F (the rest). When I was in school, there were 2 scales commonly used, but I've heard of others. The first gave a 10% range for each grade, so an A was a 90% or better, B: 80%-89%, C: 70%, D: 60%, and anything below a 60% was failing. The more aggressive range I had was A: 93%-100%, B: 85%-92%, C: 77%-84%, D: 70%-76%, and anything below a 70% was failing.

I also had one (evil) course where it was graded "on the curve" -- everybody got their score, and the resulting grade was divided out statistically -- anybody who scored 2 standard deviations higher than the average score received an A, 1 standard deviation higher received a B, 1 standard deviation lower got a D, and 2 standard deviations lower received an F. Everybody else got a C.

In general, a C student is nothing to brag about. If you're not getting B's and A's, you're not doing very well.

Re:What's a C student at Monroe College? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938301)

Or you didn't take cake classes instead wanting to challenge yourself.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it. If only because my grades range from a bucket full of As and Bs but a sprinkling of Ds and Fs that...crushed my GPA.

Interestingly, most of those terrible grades came in my first year at University. Once I buckled down I was able to sustain decent grades that were still dragged down by my starter year. Stupid high school mindset and underestimation of higher education. If I could do it all over again, I would.

Re:What's a C student at Monroe College? (1)

arethuza (737069) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938533)

That's interesting - I always wondered how the GPA thing worked. On the course I did in the UK (a Scots University so a undergraduate honours degree is 4 years) the class of your final degree was only based on your performance in the last two years of the course - 25% from the third year and 75% from the final year (of which the final year project was a substantial component). This worked out pretty well for me as I barely managed to scrape through the first two years but then did extremely well in the final two years (the range from my lowest (first year) to highest (third year) maths exam results was over 90%!).

Epic fail (5, Interesting)

Tx (96709) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938087)

I really hope this chick loses the case, and gets saddled with a bunch of court costs to add to her student loans, that way nobody will ever try anything so stupid again. Three month job-hunt? In this economy? College education is no guarantee of a job, and if you can't sell yourself, you're going to be unemployed for a lot longer than that. Your college can't convince employers to give you a job, they can provide some contacts and resources to help you, but that's it.

Re:Epic fail (4, Insightful)

quadrox (1174915) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938317)

To be fair, while it is tempting to put the blame squarely on her shoulders, it is probably not her own fault that she grew up with such a sense of entitlement.

Her family/school are likely very much to blame though, for not teaching her how the world works.

Re:Epic fail (5, Funny)

the_womble (580291) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938431)

....it is probably not her own fault that she grew up with such a sense of entitlement.

Her family/school are likely very much to blame though, for not teaching her how the world works.

She should sue them.

Sorry... she won't have to pay a dime... (2, Informative)

denzacar (181829) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938375)

From TFA:

Thompson says she has not hired an attorney to represent her because she cannot afford one.
When she filed her complaint, she also filed a "poor person order," which exempts her from filing fees associated with the lawsuit.

I also don't understand (4, Interesting)

Sycraft-fu (314770) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938523)

This idea that some (many?) students have that a degree is all they should need to be the ideal candidate. Ummmm, no, not so much. You ought to be smart enough to notice that what you are being taught is highly theoretical in nature. Universities aren't tech schools, they aren't teaching you specific skills needed for specific jobs, they are institutions of higher education and research. They deal heavily in the theoretical. This is quite noticeable if you pay any attention in class at all.

Thus, you should take something away from this: The university isn't giving me all I need to be an ideal job candidate. Practical experience is something you need to go and get on your own. My recommendation, especially for IT, is to get a job on campus doing just that. Now I'm a little biased, I work professionally doing IT on campus so we hire students. However, it is a good way to get some extra money and a great way to get some practical experience. All in all, it seems to work out ok for our students. They seem to go on to get jobs. Heck one guy got his bachelors in computer engineering, went on to another school and got his masters, then decided "Know what? I don't really want to be an engineer, I want to do support," and went to work as a support guy. While they appreciated the masters degree, they cared more about his time spent as a support guy.

For tech stuff I recommend university jobs since there seem to be plenty of them, and they have no problem hiring students, of course. A student position must, by definition, be filled by a student of the university. Universities also like student positions since they are cheap. However there's other places you can look at, or internships, or perhaps even just working on projects on your own time. Whatever, the point is to try and get some real, practical experience, not just a good theoretical education.

Also it really annoys me the idea that some graduates have that they should get a "high level" position. Ummmm, no. You have little experience, that is the definition of entry level. The idea that you'd start out in a higher level job is rather silly. After all, if a BS did that, then the majority of people would be starting out in high level jobs, making them not high level. If you are a new graduate, well then accept the fact that you are at the "entry level" of the work force. Goes double if this is your first job period.

Welcome to a harsh world (5, Interesting)

pehrs (690959) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938099)

Somehow, many students have the illusion that a degree will bring them to the top automagically. It doesn't work that way. Getting a degree is a good step forward... If they work hard in the university and actually learn. Then they will have to start 3 (or 5) years later in the job market, meaning they will lack many important skills no university teaches and therefor earn less. Even if they learn quickly it takes years to catch up (both in attractiveness on the job market and salary) with those that got into the same field without an university education.

This is true in most fields (including Engineering), but especially true in business administration and management.

The true value of the university education comes after a few years, because many companies have internal rules about giving priority to educated workers. Often there is a hard celing on how far you can get without a master, and it's not unusual for people to go back and get a MBA not only because they need the skills, but also because they need the diploma to continue their career. Some companies even pays for those MBA's to their management.

Re:Welcome to a harsh world (4, Insightful)

Spad (470073) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938251)

It doesn't help that, in my case at least, I was told by pretty much everyone from highschool teachers, through careers advisors and university staff that "a Degree will bring me to the top automagically" - I wasn't exactly convinced, but when everyone's telling you that it's easy to buy into the hype.

Then you leave university and end up in the real world where you either a) Realise it was all a load of bollocks and get on with your life or b) Get all bitter about it as this woman appears to have done.

Re:Welcome to a harsh world (2, Insightful)

Nursie (632944) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938285)

A degree gets you in the door.

Or at least it does if you do a degree related to a particular profession. There was a time when a degree, any degree, would have put you several rungs up the career ladder but that doesn't seem to be the case now. Especially as the career "ladder" itself is more like an assault course, where the best chance of advancement is usually to move jobs every few years.

Re:Welcome to a harsh world (1)

kc2keo (694222) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938275)

[quote]
Somehow, many students have the illusion that a degree will bring them to the top automagically. It doesn't work that way. Getting a degree is a good step forward... If they work hard in the university and actually learn. Then they will have to start 3 (or 5) years later in the job market, meaning they will lack many important skills no university teaches and therefor earn less. Even if they learn quickly it takes years to catch up (both in attractiveness on the job market and salary) with those that got into the same field without an university education.

This is true in most fields (including Engineering), but especially true in business administration and management.

The true value of the university education comes after a few years, because many companies have internal rules about giving priority to educated workers. Often there is a hard celing on how far you can get without a master, and it's not unusual for people to go back and get a MBA not only because they need the skills, but also because they need the diploma to continue their career. Some companies even pays for those MBA's to their management.
[/quote]

I agree...

I'm 23 and attending a 2 year associates college while working fulltime, and sometimes attending class fulltime with no job. I have also gone to a 4 year college in upstate NY (depressing) but never finished. I intend to finish my 2 year associates degree. Since I've built up my resume while at school I know that I stand a better chance at getting a career. However, I'm well aware that it is no guarantee. I would certainly not sue either as it only makes you look real bad in the face of future employers and others who may matter. This chick reminds me of some people I've seen attending college who think a job is guaranteed after graduation. The way the colleges speak to you during orientation and tours it seems as though jobs are guaranteed. They speak of all those statistics of people who didn't go to college and work vs college graduates who work and how quickly they find the jobs they want. Yes, a college degree is great to have but without the motive to seek out jobs yourself your pretty much on your own.

Re:Welcome to a harsh world (1)

Loomismeister (1589505) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938279)

Um sorry but engineers that graduate with a degree aren't playing catch-up with engineers that jump right in after high school.

wtf....yea...fail (1)

MoFoQ (584566) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938103)

I think this belongs on the fail blog [failblog.org] dot ORG.

and yes...there's plenty of room for the ol' kneepads zinger (and the fact that it's still not too late to deploy 'em).

Cost of degree (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938111)

If i'd shelled out $40,000 for a degree and found out its pretty much worthless in terms of getting a job i'd be pretty pissed too.

Funny stuff (5, Funny)

e2d2 (115622) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938121)

This is funny because just the other day I was talking with my mother, a director of hiring at a large telco, and she was talking about how the young people she brings in feel entitled.

I told her I agreed, then asked if I could borrow $25. When she said no I wrote the local paper exposing the BULLSHIT THAT THIS IS!

Re:Funny stuff (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938311)

I told her I agreed, then told her I DESERVED $25.

FTFY. Man, you were ROBBED.

can i get a refund?? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938153)

I have been jobless for at least 1.5 months now, can I get at least 50% refund?

It's all about who you know.. (5, Insightful)

hopopee (859193) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938163)

if you don't have any previous work history in a field. I'll freely admit I got both of my IT jobs by referrals from friends and acquaintances already working in the companies.

University/College studies are as much about networking as they are about learning. I spent most of my years in University in our student relaxing room playing boardgames and arguing with fellow students and faculty members. Now people who graduated years before me and have achieved higher positions in companies know me or are my friends and have a good understanding on how I fit in teams/groups. And since we mostly argued about our studies at hand they know that even though my grades weren't top notch I knew my stuff.

Of course this doesn't work at all if you're an asshole. You have to stand out somehow, but red flagging yourself for good by suing your school for your own failures is about the worst thing you could possibly do.

Re:It's all about who you know.. (4, Insightful)

kafka47 (801886) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938269)

This reminds me of a good quote : "It's not who you know... it's who knows you".

Re:It's all about who you know.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938281)

if you don't have any previous work history in a field. I'll freely admit I got both of my IT jobs by referrals from friends and acquaintances already working in the companies.

University/College studies are as much about networking as they are about learning.

Nepotism: The showing of favoritism for relatives or friends based upon that relationship, rather than on an objective evaluation of ability or suitability.

Don't delude your self into thinking everybody else gets their jobs that way too.

Re:It's all about who you know.. (1)

hopopee (859193) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938333)

Of course not. But it helps to get your foot in for the first references for real world. It's not nepotism, because I wasn't getting hired because I knew those who hired me, as I didn't. I still had to show my grades and I still had to learn the prerequisite skills for the job and convince the HR people of my competence. The edge I got for these jobs against rivals who had no real work references either was I had many people vouching for me. This evens the odds helluva lot. Typically good employees vouch for good employees they can stand to be around, right?

hmmm (2, Insightful)

GarretSidzaka (1417217) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938165)

ive seen this time and time again. how many people do we know that have some kinda bachelors, and DON'T use it?? or maybe work but have a job in another unrelated field. I think that colleges overstate their utility in some respects. Not to overgeneralize this, but they are in the business of selling degrees to most.

Deflation (1)

HetMes (1074585) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938179)

I guess the most newsworthy part of this story is that apparently - I'm non-US - the US education system has been deflating for some time now, and in this economic situation, the results are finally beginning to show. This girl is definitely not alone, I expect. So, where do you go from here?

Being an Expert Schadenfreude Connaisseur, I do feel somewhat relieved seeing this development, as I intend to continue my career in the US, after I finish my Master here in the Netherlands.

The end of the U.S. (1)

Lord Lode (1290856) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938183)

This is going to be the end of the U.S.: lawyers can sue EVERYTHING, and NOTHING is going to be able to survive, resulting in a chaotic prehistoric civilization.

Motivation? (4, Insightful)

Capt James McCarthy (860294) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938211)

If she's so motivated to sue someone because "she doesn't get what she wants," why doesn't she use her business degree and start her own business. Find a niche and go with it. It will be more rewarding. The downside, based upon her attitude, is that the only person she could blame then is herself. Unless she sues the customers of the world for not buying her product/service.

Re:Motivation? (2, Funny)

El_Muerte_TDS (592157) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938287)

why doesn't she use her business degree and start her own business. Find a niche and go with it. It will be more rewarding.

I think she's actually trying to do that. But I'm not sure how profitable a business around suing your past educators will be.

Re:Motivation? (3, Funny)

maxwell demon (590494) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938353)

If she's so motivated to sue someone because "she doesn't get what she wants," why doesn't she use her business degree and start her own business. Find a niche and go with it. It will be more rewarding. The downside, based upon her attitude, is that the only person she could blame then is herself. Unless she sues the customers of the world for not buying her product/service.

Maybe she should apply for a job at the RIAA.

Re:Motivation? (4, Funny)

jimicus (737525) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938407)

Unless she sues the customers of the world for not buying her product/service.

I believe SCO have already patented that idea.

Re:Motivation? (1)

plasmacutter (901737) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938413)

The downside, based upon her attitude, is that the only person she could blame then is herself. Unless she sues the customers of the world for not buying her product/service.

hey, it works for a few other businesses. Tennenbaum can attest to it!

Re:Motivation? (2, Insightful)

twakar (128390) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938457)

Unless she sues the customers of the world for not buying her product/service

shhh... The RIAA doesn't like competition

Gotta say it... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938217)

Of course she's a nigger.

Aww, so sad... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938289)

... now where did I leave my tiny violin?

How To Sue People For Profit 101 (4, Funny)

jamesh (87723) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938297)

Maybe next time they'll think before running a subject called "How to sue people for profit"

TFA (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938349)

Technically, she's suing the career placement office for not fulfilling their duties as promised. I'm sure the contract with them says that they can't guarantee job placement, but according to the student, they're not even giving it a piss-poor effort.

Advertising and expectations (4, Insightful)

catsidhe (454589) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938397)

If advertising didn't work, there wouldn't be so much of it.

Universities in .au, probably elsewhere as well, have been selling themselves increasingly for their job training and less for the concept of a liberal education for decades now.

Only a few go to university now to be simply educated, most are going to uni To Get A Job: it is an almost compulsory step between high school and any professional job. And most technical jobs. I wonder sometimes when more universities will go into more trade training, trying to steal business from technical schools. (As opposed to places like RMIT and Swinburn going the other way: technical colleges who became universities.)

And so, when university is sold as something which will get you a job, these expectations are built. Reasonably or not. (In my opinion, not.) But the trend is there, nonetheless.

A University education has gone from something needed for certain jobs, to something needed for certain classes of work, to a sine-qua-non of employment in entire sections of the workforce. And the universities have been competing with each other to advertise how good they are at giving an education which improves the student's chances of getting a job â" a good job, a desirable job â" advertising which might give the impression that such a job is practically guaranteed: that you go to this uni or that one not because of the education you get, but because of the job you are all but promised to walk into when you graduate. (Before you graduate, even, with graduate placements and the like.)

Personally, I think the uni sector would be better off selling the quality of the education itself, rather than expectations of the utilitarian results.

But I only work for a university, and as professional staff at that, so there is no hope that my opinion carries the slightest weight whatsoever.

It Would Be Funny, If Only It Weren't True. (4, Insightful)

Pantero Blanco (792776) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938437)

She suggested that Monroe's Office of Career Advancement shows preferential treatment to students with excellent grades. "They favor more toward students that got a 4.0. They help them more out with the job placement," she said.

You had a 2.7 GPA, with a "bachelor of business administration degree in information technology", and a "solid attendance record".

Okay, Trina, you've probably never heard this before, but I'll be frank. Those people with 4.0 GPAs are all probably much smarter than you are. If you had, say, a 3.5 GPA (and perhaps a more serious degree), that might not be the case. It makes sense for people to give them preferential treatment when it comes to employment in jobs that require intelligence and skills specific to their fields.

Considering that you're so lacking in integrity and responsibility that you decided to sue the school because you couldn't find an employer, I'll go out on a limb and say that those people are --in all honesty-- better than you. Had you not responded with such a childish action, I might hesitate to say that. Alas, that is not the case.

If you're unhappy with this, too bad. You can try harder, but now that you've made an ass out of yourself on national news, I don't think you'll convince anyone otherwise.

Now, try not to go get pregnant a dozen times.

CIS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#28938443)

Gads, a worthless degree that wants the school to promote an average person in a horrible economy. Amazing who many Americans expect a free ride.

Why take her statements at face value? (3, Insightful)

93 Escort Wagon (326346) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938449)

A lot of people seem to think this is about her sense of entitlement - I'm not so sure. I suspect this is more about her moral character, or lack thereof. While I realize there is a lawyer boogeyman conservatives like to drag out whenever an apparently frivolous lawsuit makes the news, there are definitely a few people whose first thoughts immediately jump to lawsuits and "how much can I get?" at even the slightest hint of perceived wrong (which, in this case, I guess does boil down to a sense of entitlement after all). We can blame the lawyers, and I often do; but for each case like this there's also a willing client who's only thought is one regarding money.

She even screwed up her excuse (3, Insightful)

hyades1 (1149581) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938477)

"...As Thompson sees it, any reasonable employer would pounce on an applicant with her academic credentials, which include a 2.7 grade-point average and a solid attendance record..."

She's got it backwards. Aquarium algae can get a 2.0 GPA with a little training. If all the poor, dumb little chit can manage is a 2.7, then she'd be better off claiming she skipped two thirds of her classes and spent the whole last term drunk. At least that way, an employer might think she had brains and a commitment to doing the job right.

If you don't get the interviews ... (1)

petes_PoV (912422) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938487)

... it's your CV that's poor. If you don't get the job offers, it's you who#s the problem.

This individual has "peppered" companies with letters, CVs and only had 2 replies. That kinda tells you something about either her applications, or the job market, or the companies she's applying to. Now I don't know what "Business Administration" is - but it sounds like low-level clerical work, compared with "Business Mamagement" which is high-level clerical work :-) Maybe she's confused about exactly how qualified she actually is.

Nothings new (2, Insightful)

mythz (857024) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938501)

You are generally unemployable coming out of any University. A University teaches you the theory of the subject matter and how to learn. Its up to you to take those learning skills and master its practical application in the real world.

It's only them do you become employable/useful in a commercial environment. Otherwise you don't stand a chance of getting a job over other students who do (unless of course you took a minor in bull-sh*ting).

Careers - Pedantic Patenting Co. (1)

An anonymous Frank (559486) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938505)

Are you educated, do you feel like you've done your part, do you feel entitled, especially if you're holding a piece of paper, even if the contents of that document suffer the lack of genius?

Perhaps you're the perfect candidate for our exciting, yet trolling team, ..., just like you, we feel we should be properly compensated for other people's excellence, because we've got patents, just like the other cool kids on the block.

In fact, don't bother applying for a position with us, you shouldn't have to expend any effort at all, I'm sure your uni will send us your FB link along with a praising recommendation letter.

Yours truly,
PPC.

Good luck ever finding a job now (1)

MORB (793798) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938529)

Future prospective employers are now likely to throw out her application when they google her name and find out she's a whiny bitch with an inflated sense of entitlement who can't handle the stress of not finding a job within three months of graduating.

Good work there.

I guess she'll end up suing the entire internet for this article and any reference to it to be removed.

skaldicpoet9 (1)

skaldicpoet9 (1243208) | more than 4 years ago | (#28938541)

It is a sad, but true story folks.

Sure she is pompous and arrogant in her assumptions, however, the general American public is bombarded with the notion that going to college will somehow guarantee you success in the job marketplace. Reading a few of the comments here I see that not just this woman, or myself, have been the victim of the proliferation of this notion.

I think that our education system really needs to be reevaluated. It seems to me that High School has become increasingly marginalized in today's society and instead the focus is placed on, "what do you want to major in when you graduate?" This mentality is completely counter-productive when it comes to aspiring workers in a new market.

I was led to believe that without a degree, any skills I may have would be unnoticed or ignored due to a lack of a "proper education". With a little time in college under my belt, I see how erroneous that line of thinking is. After having gained a slight amount of experience in the matter I believe that proper skills in a particular field should be valued first and foremost, rather then aspiring to obtain some mystical certificate that will somehow enable you to have the skills necessary to succeed.

College should be supplementary, an institution to equip students with practical skills for potential employment in the future. Unfortunately, in my experience, college is nothing of the sort. I would say college is more of a place that is suited for learning the fundamentals of a particular area, rather then actually having practical, applicable skills that can be used in that given area.

Obviously college is only worth what you put into but I feel that if there were an actual system in place that actively trained students to deal with various workplace occurrences, potential employers would be more apt to hire someone straight out of college then they currently are. As it stands, the best course of action for any student is to study hard and to document your work for later inclusion in a portfolio, so as to illustrate a practical understanding and implementation of your knowledge.
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