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Developing World's Parasites, Diseases Enter US

kdawson posted more than 4 years ago | from the different-kind-of-worm dept.

Medicine 337

reporter alerts us to a story up at the Wall Street Journal on the increasing prevalance in the US of formerly rare, 3rd-world diseases such as toxocariasis, chagas, and cysticercosis. Health-care legislation pending in the House calls for a full report to Congress about the threat from this cluster of diseases, termed "neglected infections of poverty." "Parasitic infections and other diseases usually associated with the developing world are cropping up with alarming frequency among US poor, especially in states along the US-Mexico border, the rural South, and in Appalachia, according to researchers. Government and private researchers are just beginning to assess the toll of the infections, which are a significant cause of heart disease, seizures and congenital birth defects among black and Hispanic populations. ... 'These are diseases that we know are ten-fold more important than swine flu,' said [one] leading researcher in this field. 'They're on no one's radar.' ... These diseases share a common thread. 'People who live in the suburbs are at very low risk,' Dr. Hotez said. But for the 37 million people in the US who live below the poverty line, he said, 'There is real suffering.'" Update: 08/23 16:55 GMT by KD : The submitter pointed out that the usual "Related" link to the original submission was missing on this story. We are testing a new version of the story editor and this was probably caused by a bug; reported. Here's the original.

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Evil Hollywood plot (3, Funny)

oldhack (1037484) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159303)

to jack up the rating for House MD. Pathetic, really.

The US isn't all first world. (3, Insightful)

girlintraining (1395911) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159311)

People are surprised by this? Our inner cities are rotting. Our economy is in shambles. People are living squallor and poverty on an unprecidented scale in this country. We're a breeding ground now for all manners of disease, both social and medical.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (5, Insightful)

timeOday (582209) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159479)

Well, half the voters don't even believe in public health. If the carriers of an epidemic are deemed unworthy of health care, the free market solution is to wait until everybody gets it, then treat those with money. Ultimately that costs vastly more than stamping it out in the first place, but at least nobody gets healthcare they didn't deserve, and isn't that the most important thing?

Re:The US isn't all first world. (0)

Darkness404 (1287218) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159573)

Lack of government healthcare != able to get help. It simply means that things are more expensive for those without healthcare in the short term if they need it. In general there are a lot of "reactionary" people here in the US who will go to the doctor for -anything-, heck, wasn't it just a few years ago where because of the prevalence of people going to the doctors for every little thing was going to create more drug resistant illnesses? In general, if it makes someone sick with obvious symptoms, they are going to get help here in the US. Its just the common reaction, not sure about in other countries (the US is the only country I've lived in for an extended period of time, though I have traveled to many different countries) but in the USA, a lot of people go to the doctor or even the emergency room for every thing.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159671)

Lack of government healthcare != able to get help. It simply means that things are more expensive for those without healthcare in the short term if they need it.

No money = unable to get help if no government healthcare.

It's really that simple.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (5, Insightful)

s4m7 (519684) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159777)

Lack of government healthcare != able to get help.

Right. We all remember Bush's answer to the healthcare crisis: let them go to the emergency room. ER care is significantly more expensive than proper preventive and general practice care.

It simply means that things are more expensive for those without healthcare in the short term if they need it.

Right. 62% of all personal bankruptcies in the U.S. in 2007 were caused by health problems and 78% of those filers had insurance. Citation [businessweek.com] That doesn't just make things more expensive for those with healthcare, it makes them more expensive for policy holders, anyone who wants a loan, small businesses, investors, and stockholders. And it's not just over the short term, it has an overall detrimental effect on our nation's economic well being which continues to mount.

In general there are a lot of "reactionary" people here in the US who will go to the doctor for -anything-, heck, wasn't it just a few years ago where because of the prevalence of people geoing to the doctors for every little thing was going to create more drug resista lnt illnesses?

it's not people going to the doctors that causes drug resistance, it's the repeated treatment of the same bacterial infections with a broad spectrum of antibiotics. This has a lot to do with tort liability, a subject I'm not as well versed on as I would like to be. I do think that tort reform should be a part of any comprehensive medical reform, but I think that we have to be careful.

In general, if it makes someone sick with obvious symptoms, they are going to get help here in the US. Its just the common reaction, not sure about in other countries (the US is the only country I've lived in for an extended period of time, though I have traveled to many different countries) but in the USA, a lot of people go to the doctor or even the emergency room for every thing.

"in general" is a stretch in this case. Lots of conditions can't be taken care of in an emergent care setting. This may be true for broken limbs, allergic reactions, and like conditions, but it doesn't address the situation with regard to chronic conditions, diabetes, cancer, and so on. This is the situation that most urgently needs to be addressed. If there was a law like the 1986 "patient dumping" law that applied to chronic care as well as ERs it would cost the medical industry billions. as is they are only required to "stabilize." and then they can ask for your insurance card and or show you the door.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (2, Interesting)

stdarg (456557) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160079)

Right. 62% of all personal bankruptcies in the U.S. in 2007 were caused by health problems and 78% of those filers had insurance. Citation [businessweek.com] That doesn't just make things more expensive for those with healthcare, it makes them more expensive for policy holders, anyone who wants a loan, small businesses, investors, and stockholders. And it's not just over the short term, it has an overall detrimental effect on our nation's economic well being which continues to mount.

Health care is too expensive, no question. We're not going to fix it with preventive medicine (source 1 [abcnews.com] source 2 [politifact.com] , may be related I didn't check). Spreading out the cost sounds great until you realize that a lot of people don't have insurance because they can't afford it, and won't be paying their full share if they go for a public option either, so the same people who are paying more now will be paying more then too. If you want to make health care more affordable to have to do things to reduce the cost directly. Then more people would get insurance anyway because it would be cheaper.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (4, Insightful)

Goldberg's Pants (139800) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160181)

If preventive medicine is more expensive than the failed system you currently have in place, then why is more spent per capita on healthcare in the US than any other western country, while your system continues to be ranked as one of the worst in the world, falling far behind those who do engage in preventive medicine.

Living embodiment of less for more.

There is an old adage. "An ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure."

Your observations of how public healthcare works are deeply, and I do mean DEEPLY flawed.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1, Insightful)

jasno (124830) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160287)

Well, for starters I'd imagine we pay more because we CAN pay more. We pay more, and this creates big companies that develop drugs that get sold for less to the rest of the world - at least it sure feels like it. I'd be happy to see someone contradict that.

We also pay more because many of our diseases are products of our lavish lifestyle - a lifestyle other countries are just now adopting. I'd expect healthcare costs to skyrocket worldwide as diabetes, heart disease and cancer climb to US rates.

Also, does anyone know what the long-term prospects are for the typical European medical system? Aren't they expecting to have solvency issues similar to medicare?

You know, above all else, one thing that seems to be lost in the noise is that we already have a government health care system. If we can't fix medicare/medicaid we don't have a chance of building a sustainable, effective general health plan. I voted for and support Obama, but his decisions on health care have left me baffled. He could have started small and been successful but he bit off more than he could chew. It hurt his reputation and it's hurting our nation.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (4, Insightful)

CodeBuster (516420) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160141)

I do think that tort reform should be a part of any comprehensive medical reform, but I think that we have to be careful.

Which will never happen as long as the Democrats are in power. The attorneys, through their firms and state bar associations, are collectively among the largest donors to the Democratic National Committee, Democrat elected officials (i.e. Congressmen and Senators) and Democratic presidential candidates (like our current President Obama). There are two groups that you can bet the farm that Democrats won't cross: lawyers and unions (in that order). No attorney that I know of has ever supported laws which limit their ability to go to court and sue for lots of money (its like freedom of speech to them). The attorneys will fight tort reform tooth and nail and I would be shocked if Obama signs any bill, or at least any bill that actually has teeth, which puts a national cap on damages awarded at lawyerpoint.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159915)

In general, if it makes someone sick with obvious symptoms, they are going to get help here in the US.

Yes, and by that point they've very likely been spreading it for weeks.

"Oh, you can go to the emergency room" is not a replacement for proper preventative care, and the latter is a whole lot cheaper too.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

Hurricane78 (562437) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159929)

Well, I might sound evil, but don't hate the messenger:
It actually is quite possible, in terms of natural selection, that in the long run, this would mean a more successful nation. Because only those who are successful, would survive.
The first problem is, that money is not exactly what should be our scale to measure success and worth to survive. We can do better than that.
And the second point is, that it would of course be even *more* successful, to pull them *all* up. But is that possible?
The only thing that certainly is not doing a nation any good, is the current state.

My personal opinion is, that this is intentional, because 1. our government is not *that* dumb, and 2. look at who profits from this most. As I said: Personal opinion.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29160177)

sounds good

email me
coralamp@yahoo.com.au [mailto]

Re:The US isn't all first world. (4, Insightful)

couchslug (175151) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159597)

"People are living squallor and poverty on an unprecedented scale in this country."

Bullshit. We are not near the poverty levels of the Great Depression, and the impact of poverty is greatly mitigated nowadays.

Our bitter refusal to control our borders ensures the human carriers of "Third World" diseases are free to circulate.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159717)

"People are living squallor and poverty on an unprecedented scale in this country."

Bullshit. We are not near the poverty levels of the Great Depression, and the impact of poverty is greatly mitigated nowadays.

Our bitter refusal to control our borders ensures the human carriers of "Third World" diseases are free to circulate.

Yup. Kick out the illegal invaders and those poverty stats change quite drastically.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

bigattichouse (527527) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159919)

Pensacola, Florida (specifically Santa Maria de Galve, pre Pensacola) was founded on a bunch of rich people in Tlaxcala (forgive my spelling) mexico rounding up all the poor people and shipping them off to another country... They also discovered they then had no one around to dig the proverbial ditch.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (2, Insightful)

girlintraining (1395911) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159761)

Bullshit. We are not near the poverty levels of the Great Depression, and the impact of poverty is greatly mitigated nowadays.

History disagrees with your assessment; We're circling the drain. Sequence of events [wikipedia.org] in the Great Depression:

1. Debt liquidation and distress selling
2. Contraction of the money supply as bank loans are paid off
3. A fall in the level of asset prices
4. A still greater fall in the net worths of business, precipitating bankruptcies
5. A fall in profits
6. A reduction in output, in trade and in employment.
7. Pessimism and loss of confidence
8. Hoarding of money
9. A fall in nominal interest rates and a rise in deflation adjusted interest rates.

Let's compare that with now --

1. Debt liquidation and distress selling
July 2007: loss of confidence by investors in the value of securitized mortgages causes liquidity crisis. (Housing Bubble goes pop)

2. Contraction of the money supply as bank loans are paid off
In January 2008, a tax rebate is introduced as part of a "stimulus package" intended to stimulate consumer spending. But several months later, all economic indicators say that the average consumer used the majority of their tax rebate to pay off debt.

3. A fall in the level of asset prices
Housing bubble has now popped. In September 2008, stock markets around the world crash. The subprime mortgage market drags several banks to their death and liquid assets all but disappear from the market. Retail outlets start to go out of business, even with deep cuts in pricing.

4. A still greater fall in the net worths of business, precipitating bankruptcies
Early in 2009, a series of goverment-funded bailouts are issued to financial and automotive firms. Many businesses close up.

5. A fall in profits
Pretty sure we've passed this point.

6. A reduction in output, in trade and in employment.
National unemployment currently hovers at 9.7%, the highest ever recorded.

7. Pessimism and loss of confidence
Check!

8. Hoarding of money
9. A fall in nominal interest rates and a rise in deflation adjusted interest rates.

This is the last step in the fall of our economy, and so far the interest rate hasn't deflated -- but everything else on this timeline has been met.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (0, Flamebait)

maxume (22995) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159863)

You are shadowboxing, none of those things say anything about squalor or poverty (especially if you want it to be depression era poverty, and not food-stamps poverty).

Re:The US isn't all first world. (4, Informative)

timmarhy (659436) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159911)

while you are reasonably correct on the causes of the great depression, you fail hard.

1. is over already

2. paying off loans isn't what causes contraction of money supply.

3. if you want to single out houses as the only asset, then yes.

4. yes, there's no getting away from the fact companies have taken a hammering

5. most places have had a fall in profits, there are some standouts though. gold producers are one of them.

6. here is your big fail. jobless rate in 1933 was 24.9% http://www.bls.gov/opub/cwc/cm20030124ar03p1.htm [bls.gov]

7. here is your biggest problem - doomers like yourself who are still claiming the sky is falling when their are CLEARLY signs of recovery worldwide.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (3, Insightful)

girlintraining (1395911) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160011)

here is your biggest problem - doomers like yourself who are still claiming the sky is falling when their are CLEARLY signs of recovery worldwide.

I'm not all doom and gloom... Forty years ago we had a middle class. We don't anymore. We have rich people, and we have poor people... Just like the countries we've been shipping our jobs out to. One of the things that made America what it was is a strong middle class. That's vaporized now under the heat of globalization, and this is something that's come about because of the current economic crisis. Yeah, the economy as a whole may recover, but our quality of life will never be the same. For many people -- there will be no recovery.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (4, Insightful)

Jeff DeMaagd (2015) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160087)

I think the collapse of the US middle class is in large part the fault of the middle class itself. In a world of increasing sophistication, most people ignored it and didn't adapt to it, and they didn't instill into their children the importance of education. The idea that one can live very comfortably simply being unskilled labor was a foolish one that idea only worked for a generation or two. The economic hegemony of the US post WWII helped feed that idea, but part of that hegemony was sustained by malicious policies against other countries.

Maybe globalization made that middle class collapse happen faster, but an unsustainable situation like that wasn't going to stay that way forever. Closing borders to trade usually hasn't worked out well either, all that does is incite reciprocal action.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

sjames (1099) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160207)

College has gone from something only the wealthy attend to being quite common. The BA and BS are rapidly becoming what the GED once was.

It doesn't seem to have helped. Unskilled labor was never an option for middle class. Skilled blue collar work was quite commonly middle class.

The U.S. has seen a steady growth in GDP per capita. In spite of that, the middle class is disappearing.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

jasno (124830) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160317)

The BA and BS are rapidly becoming what the GED once was.

Are you high?

I'd love to see some stats. I live in California and most of the people I meet qualify as middle-class. I'm middle-class. My family is almost all middle-class.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

Zemran (3101) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160131)

"8. Hoarding of money"

The price of gold per ounce has gone right up from $700 to $950 (approx) because people are hoarding money instead of investing in the stock market.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

memnock (466995) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159847)

how is the poverty mitigated?

by having tons of cheap, food that lacks real nutritive value, and that contributes to the growing obesity problem of the country? or by the tons of debt that people use to buy things they do and don't need, but can't afford either way, such as houses or big tvs?

if poverty was mitigated, obtaining healthcare wouldn't be a problem for low-income or out of work people. yet, i hear about people with full-time employment who can't afford their health plans.

poverty is one of the factors to affect children early in the education system. [jrank.org]

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

memnock (466995) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159881)

meant to add this link so you could see the extent, or lack thereof, of poverty throughout the country.
http://proximityone.com/ctyincome.htm [proximityone.com]

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

drizek (1481461) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159943)

He said unprecedented scale, not unprecedented degree.

Your response would be much more constructive if you address his point.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

Runaway1956 (1322357) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160201)

"We are not near the poverty levels of the Great Depression,"

Nothing says the we have seen the worst of our current recession. Nothing says we won't see the desperation of the '30's again. The only thing that happened in the '30's that isn't likely to happen again, is the dust bowl. On the other hand, family farms are barely hanging in there because they can't compete with factory farms. If a few of those conglomerations go belly up, we could be in serious trouble. How much of our population are we willing to see die of starvation?

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

Saija (1114681) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159673)

Glad to see some sane moderators who changed your "Troll" to "Insightful" score

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

Hurricane78 (562437) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159853)

The USA really has giant contrast, that most people seem to forget about all too often. I mean there is Manhattan, there is some farm in the worst backwater hole, there is the nearly empty part, rotting of Detroit, there is Alaska which is mainly just forests, There are cities which still look like the hurricane that went trough them two years ago just happened yesterday, etc, etc. And most of it seems to be not shiny at all. It's really sad sometimes, to see the nation rotting away. And I'm not even from the same continent! Reminds me of the Russian backwaters and rusting military too.

I hope that something great emerges out of it... Because that is usually the case with humans...

Re:The US isn't all first world. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159985)

Do this and we'll rise to new levels of prosperity and progress -

1. Destroy all forms of organized religion and defrock all priests.
2. Close all prisons; exile all convicted felons to a distant, isolated islands.
3. Allow only 5 years of employment in the academic and civil service sectors.
4. Enforce term limits on all elected offices - one term only.
5. Sterilize welfare recipients.
6. Legalize and regulate all vices.
7. Deny corporations the same legal rights as citizens.
8. Ban political parties.
9. Nationalize the legal profession; no private lawyers.
10. Force all trading partners to adopt worker and environmental protections.
11. All native born residents will attend primary, secondary, and higher level education at no cost. Humanities will be taught only at the primary and secondary levels.
12. Disallow borrowing for speculation.

Fail and the next dark ages starts in our lifetime.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (1)

Runaway1956 (1322357) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160183)

Nothing to worry about, really. This is just Mother Nature's way of enforcing population control. If we think it's bad here, just wait for Mother to get serious in China. The earth's carrying capacity of humankind is being severely tested, so we can expect more of this sort of thing.

(turn on sarcasm here) Health care? Why fight the inevitable? Only the rich are truly fit to survive anyway.

Re:The US isn't all first world. (4, Informative)

Brian_Ellenberger (308720) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160365)

People are surprised by this? Our inner cities are rotting. Our economy is in shambles. People are living squallor and poverty on an unprecidented scale in this country. We're a breeding ground now for all manners of disease, both social and medical.

And worst of all, there is a massive wave of over exaggeration plaguing the country! I cannot believe this was marked as 5 insightful. Poverty and squallor on unprecidented scale? Have you heard of the Great Depression? What facts and figures are you quoting? According to the US census at http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/poverty/poverty07/pov07fig03.pdf [census.gov] the poverty percentage has been at between 10 and 15 percent since the mid 60s. In 1959 it was 23%, so nearly a quarter of the population was in poverty!

We're a breeding ground now for all manners of disease, both social and medical? Start with the medical. Based on what science? Tens of thousands dying of cholera is a sign of breeding disease. Random cases of strange medical ailments because people in 3rd world countries immigrated to the US is not. What is your solution, stop all immigration? As for social disease, since the founding of the country people have been complaining about various "social diseases" plaguing the US. Heck, the crazy temperance movement managed to get all alcohol banned as a cure for the various social diseases resulting from drinking.

As for the decline of America, I've been hearing it all my life. First is was the Japanese, how they were much smarter and so much harder working than Americans, blah, blah, blah. Now it is the Chinese.

And no, I hate to disappoint you but we aren't going to be the Roman Empire because I don't see any barbarians who are going to come and raze our cities. We do not decline so much as everyone else is catching up to us. And the only reason there is catching up is because almost everyone else was demolished 60 years ago during WWII. There is no fundamental reason that the US should be the sole military, economic, and political power for the rest of human history. If we were a bunch of evil jerks, the US could try and use its power to keep everyone else down. But we don't and good for us for that.

Close the borders (5, Insightful)

BadAnalogyGuy (945258) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159355)

Every time I turn around the US government is finding new and innovative ideas in fomenting anti-immigrant sentiment. Scratch that. The US government is using the same old tried and true methods of fomenting anti-immigrant sentiment. They steal jobs. They bring crime. They bring disease. It's the same old song and dance.

In a world of modern transportation, it is essentially impossible to screen every person who crosses into our country for diseases. The solution isn't more border patrols on the Tex-Mex border, it's better healthcare for those who can't afford it. If the at-risk groups are the border towns and poverty-stricken, it makes sense to help them rather than try to cut off the flow of immigrants.

I used to fly internationally all the time, but with the growing anti-immigrant policies of the US, I find myself having a worse and worse time traveling even though I am a US citizen. The TSA and Immigration Control have made flying a mode of travel that is completely unattractive.

Re:Close the borders (1, Troll)

toppavak (943659) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159427)

Really? I travel internationally at least once a year and this is news to me. Aside from putting my shoes through the x-ray (oh boo-hoo you have to spend 30 seconds taking off your shoes) and the exact same 30 seconds it takes at the immigration counter (ok, the lines can be annoying though) I've never run into anything that makes "flying a mode of travel that is completely unattractive" especially since its still a lot faster, quite affordable and not entirely uncomfortable (Its been my experience that its mostly US Air and AA that have drastically lowered the quantity and quality of service they offer, which is why I simply don't use them anymore, its not like they're any cheaper). Oh, but don't let that stop you from bitching and moaning about how travel by air hasn't changed significantly (except in the quality of the free snacks you get on domestic flights) in the past 15 years or so that I can recall international travel.

Re:Close the borders (1)

Ritchie70 (860516) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159921)

I agree, travel has actually gotten better in some ways since 9/11.

I have never traveled internationally, but the domestic security folks are a lot more competent than they were before the TSA. And they're more accustomed to people who set off the alarm.

My wife has some joints that were replaced, so she can keep "trying again" with the metal detector forever, she's going to beep.

On our honeymoon (in 2000) the security guards at O'Hare Airport couldn't even successfully communicate what they wanted her to do. We flew to Hawaii this year, and they have the glass booth for her to wait in, and it's all professional and handled quickly. By the time I had my shoes back on and the laptops back in the bags, she was walking over to meet me.

Re:Close the borders (1)

Zemran (3101) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160217)

It is annoying because most of it is theatre. I do agree that security has improved a bit but I not see why you had to take your laptop out and put it in a different tray to be x-rayed, are they saying that the x-ray machine cannot see through the laptop case? Why is it that I can put a bottle full of liquid in my hold luggage but I cannot carry a drink of water onto the plane? No one has successfully blown up a plane with a drink of water but there have been plenty of bombs in the hold. Even when you talk about the problems your wife has, you are talking about metal scanners (gun scanners), when was the last time you were scanned for explosives? It is mainly theatre and that is annoying.

Re:Close the borders (2, Insightful)

TheGreenNuke (1612943) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159445)

The solution isn't more border patrols on the Tex-Mex border, it's better healthcare for those who can't afford it.

But if they still can't afford what difference will it make if it's better? While I understand what you mean, your actual words help point out the true underlying cause, the cost of healthcare has risen out of control.

Re:Close the borders (1)

Tablizer (95088) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159595)

Every time I turn around the US government is finding new and innovative ideas in fomenting anti-immigrant sentiment.

The government? This is a case where the private sector is more efficient at a task: Rush Limbo and his snake-tongued buddies.
     

Re:Close the borders (-1, Troll)

techno-vampire (666512) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160301)

Rush Limbo and his snake-tongued buddies.

I see: it's wrong for him to call people names but it's OK for you to call him names. Hypocrite!

Note to the moderators. Just because you don't agree with me doesn't mean that I'm a troll, or this is flamebait. However, if that's what floats your boat, feel free to mod me down. My karma won't even notice.

Re:Close the borders (-1, Troll)

couchslug (175151) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159619)

"If the at-risk groups are the border towns and poverty-stricken, it makes sense to help them rather than try to cut off the flow of immigrants."

Fuck the immigrants. This is MY country, not theirs. Let them fix their own failed states south of the border.

Re:Close the borders (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159715)

Fucking the immigrants is a way to spread diseases, not to mention causing more of the immigrants.

Besides, that "Fix it yourself" attitude is one of those things that is just short-sighted, and easily contradicted by the concept that the world isn't just a bunch of isolated islands.

Re:Close the borders (5, Insightful)

andymadigan (792996) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159873)

Unfortunately the "We'll fix it" attitude leads to invading other countries (Iraq). Further, you can't have a welfare state AND have uncontrolled immigration. So, you have a choice. Have a small government, no government services other than defense and lots of immigrants (that describes the U.S. pretty well for the first hundred or so years). Or, you can have roads, social security, medicare, welfare, public schools, etc. but little or no immigration.

Can we help people in other countries? Sure. Federal money (< 1% of our budget) does go to works in other countries. However, if they decide to come here illegally, the most we can provide them with is helpful transportation at gunpoint back to their own country.

Re:Close the borders (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29160013)

I wasn't aware the invasion of Iraq had anything to do with health concerns, but then, I guess that's why GWB was so concerned about biological weapons.

Yeah, good intentions...or just exploitation of them? You be the judge!

Re:Close the borders (2, Interesting)

andymadigan (792996) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160055)

Who said it had to do with health? I thought we were talking about failed or autocratic states. That does some times lead to health problems among citizens.

GWB invaded Iraq for revenge and oil. However, it was a "bad" government, and that was an underlying cause.

Re:Close the borders (2, Insightful)

Macrat (638047) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159839)

Fuck the immigrants. This is MY country, not theirs. Let them fix their own failed states south of the border.

Especially when they aren't "immigrants"

Re:Close the borders (1)

oldhack (1037484) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159955)

We already did, for buncha bananas no less.

Re:Close the borders (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29160021)

I think today is the first time I have read slashdot comments and been utterly disgusted by a large amount of the non-troll posts. I never realised how racist slashdot really was.

Re:Close the borders (2)

Virak (897071) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160147)

So, how does it feel to be completely lacking empathy or any sort of care for your fellow humans?

Re:Close the borders (1)

mysidia (191772) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160209)

"help them rather than try to cut off the flow of immigrants."

This flies in the face of basic security principles. Any firewall admin should be able to tell you how ugly that sounds.. don't even try to cut off illegal traffic at your borders, without making sure they don't pose a threat???

Perhaps banks should stop worrying about alarm systems and trying to cut off the flow of bank robbers, instead, they should give out some free money, so they can help people not pose a risk to the bank.

I think of it as like an IT department trying to stop computer worms and secure the network, by getting all the computer users free windows antivirus software to install on personal laptops they plug in at work. Rather than dealing with the real issue... things migrating into the corporate network, without IT so much as looking at them, much less closely assessing whether what they are bringing in poses a risk.

In fact, the flow of more immigrants increases the number of "poverty-stricken", because they arrive in that state. But many of these are illegal immigrants, and the flow is difficult to control.

Thus the cost of helping them out will continue to grow, as it's a continuously expanding group. Moreover, helping them out encourages more of them to cross the border.

Much like a bank offering free money to would-be burglars as an incentive not to break in, will lead to more crime.

Re:Close the borders (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159629)

Yeah, we gotta pass new and innovative laws to prevent those goddamn wetback mosquitoes from coming in the US and spreading dengue, and don't get me started on those fucking beaner kissing bugs spreading Chagas! Border fence? Border ELECTRIC fence: 1,969-mile bug zapper!

Scaremongering: yes, anti-immigrant: no (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159641)

You're right that it's scaremongering, but you're wrong on the reason.

This is more scaremongering from the left over healthcare. They're now trying to persuade us that if we don't blow trillions of dollars on national healthcare, the US will turn into a third-world cesspool.

Which is hilarious, because we've all seen what happens when the government tries to "help" people. We all saw what happened with Katrina. Until the government finally backed down and let private charities in to help, it was an unmitigated disaster. We're still experiencing what happened when the government stepped in and tried to regulate home loans: a destroyed economy.

So if personal experience and facts don't work, the left is now reverting to "we're all going to die of parasites" - which is, as the article points out, ludicrous.

Re:Scaremongering: yes, anti-immigrant: no (1)

Entropius (188861) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159951)

If we have a government that -- in the most general case -- fucks things up whenever it tries to help people, then we have a far bigger problem on our hands than whatever problem we're trying to solve at the moment.

Re:Close the borders (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159813)

Every time I turn around the US government is finding new and innovative ideas in fomenting anti-immigrant sentiment.

Illegals aren't immigrants.

They are border hopping invaders that need to be shot like any other foreign aggressor.

Re:Close the borders (2, Insightful)

mysidia (191772) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160063)

They are also diseases that are common among immigrants, and that follow them in.

They may be old arguments, but that doesn't detract from their indisputable accuracy.

Particularly with these diseases which were previously unique to areas that immigrants come from. It is eminently clear where the disease is being sourced from.

The diseases are not ones that can be effectively treated by healthcare, there is no cure/effective treatment known to most of these diseases, the prognosis is not good, if you should catch one, your life will almost certainly be cut short, even if you have the best health care money can buy, the parasites cause permanent scars.

In most cases, the better good of society would be better achieved by quarantining people found to have these diseases.

Providing health care services to everyone who can't afford them does not fix these diseases. Ultimately research would be required into a cure -- the free market and large profits that can be made, are ultimately, the incentives for this research to get conducted.

However, it indeed would be beneficial to the public for screening for these diseases to be mandatory and required for employment and travel within the US.

At least it would encourage people who unknowingly have the disease to get checked, and attempt whatever (unfortunately damaging) treatments are available, to help get a handle on the epidemic.

Re:Close the borders (2, Insightful)

mysidia (191772) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160117)

In a world of modern transportation, it is essentially impossible to screen every person who crosses into our country for diseases.

Sure, it's possible, but requires further inconveniencing people who wish to cross, and reducing the throughput (the rate at which people are legally allowed to cross borders). And might have a negative impact on tourists, if it took them several days waiting in line to get screened and admitted.

It is also more expensive (the most likely reason it's not actually done) and requires more paperwork to keep track of screening results and prove who's been properly screened to allow them to pass security.

With regards to US immigrants who are likely to have this disease "Modern" transportation means the automobile, which has been around since oh 1900, probably using a 15-year-old old clunker they loaned out at a junkyard for a few hundred $100.

There have not been any significant transportation enhancements in recent decades that justify lax border controls, or letting people in with proper health screening.

Instead it is the number and frequency of people wishing to cross borders.

Look for the cause. (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159369)

Probably Michelle Obama's fault. I saw her squatting one out down at the water hole.

MUCH MORE IS COMING (-1, Troll)

WindBourne (631190) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159379)

Dems, and even more so, neo-con, have chosen to not just look the other way, but actively encouraged ILLEGAL ALIENS, which is where this coming from. Totally insane. Most of the west spent the 50's and 60's and 70's eradicating a number of disease from our shores. Now, America, and increasingly other western nations will see the ravages and economic implications from this because of bad leadership.

Re:MUCH MORE IS COMING (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159443)

Yep. Just ask the French. There are some Muslim neighborhoods that the French police won't even enter. The Europeans are being bred out of their own lands by the remnants of the Ottoman horde. And in the US, the south especially, Latino racial superiority is rampant. Our latest SCOTUS justice subscribes to Latin supremacist ideology. La Raza is the hispanic version of the KKK. We turn a blind eye as they flow across the border to wipe the asses of rich angst-filled white folks' kids, then they pop out a baby citizenship anchor and teach their children about reclaiming their stolen land from the white devils.

Re:MUCH MORE IS COMING (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159517)

I'm a "conservative", but you know, I've never like the "conservative" position on immigration. Immigrants are people - and typically pretty motivated, hard-working people with dignity and rights like everyone else. Who are we to say "you're not allowed in my country"? A bunch of racists?

Perhaps if we didn't spend half as much effort stigmatizing them or threatening to deport them, they'd be better-positioned to seek treatment.

Re:MUCH MORE IS COMING (4, Insightful)

MichaelSmith (789609) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159545)

If it was easier to enter the country legally fewer people would do it illegally. Then it might be easier to apply health checks on the way in.

Re:MUCH MORE IS COMING (1)

mysidia (191772) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160371)

If it was harder to enter the country illegally, more people might follow the legal path.

Technology and better barriers ought to be able to help there. 24 hour wide-angle CCTV surveillance of the borders should help. Remote operated FLIR guns could be utilized to get exact positions on intruders.

It would also help if certain presently illegal drugs were regulated and made legal to own and make/sell by certain US companies to adults in limited amounts for on-site-only consumption.

Wiping out the drug smuggling business would leave border patrols able to devote more resources to other issues.

Seeing as so many of their resources are actually spent on stopping smugglers.

The US satisfying eliminating smugglers' profit would eliminate a major incentive for illegal border crossings.

And the regulated US companies profits would be taxable, to boot, plus they could be forced to pay for their customers' eventual rehabilitation needs.

And for the first time in those "products'" history: provide clear warning labels, and a level of quality meeting regulatory standards: reduced deaths due to homemade "fillers" and other impurities, by regulating what fillers get used, and by limiting allowed purity.

(But they should only do this for substances that are being produced or likely to be producable in Mexico in quantity)

I love that I was modded down by idiots (-1, Flamebait)

WindBourne (631190) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159917)

At the least, you 2 should acknowledge that illegals HAVE been crossing the borders with diseases. A MAJOR part of controlling the borders was to prevent entry by those carrying diseases. In the past, when somebody applied, if they did not pass physicals, then they were not allowed on the boat. Once they got here, if we found out that they were sick, we either treated them, or isolated them. Either way, a major part of our controlling diseases was by controlling the ppl coming for either visits or for residency. Likewise, until reagan, we worked hard to stop illegals (who come from just about EVERY nation). Since then, W was a total disaster WRT to illegals. He weakened ICE until 2006. After neo-cons lost big, then and only then, did they start to do something. Dems have always said that they love illegals and will likely grant amnesty to all (total BS). EU has kept the right idea, while we have gone insane. It is OK to immigrate, BUT, you want it controlled and you do not want disease being brought in. We absolutely need to control our borders. Heck, even CANADA is gripping that they are getting overwhelmed with illegals.

Natural Selection (2, Insightful)

Sponge Bath (413667) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159397)

You want globalization? Well here it comes. You don't want globalization? Well here it comes anyways. Attention citizens of the cosmos: be prepared for a brutal culling of the herd. Nothing personal, it's just the mechanics of the universe.

Re:Natural Selection (4, Insightful)

sjames (1099) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160241)

Attention social evolutionists: poor people in the U.S. have guns and little to lose. When they have nothing to lose, the bullets will fly.

Re:Natural Selection (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29160351)

Note from the field: I haven't seen anything as such yet.

If only Madagascar... (4, Funny)

gardyloo (512791) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159467)

...had shut off all seaports and airports sooner.

Vibrance! (1)

Baldrson (78598) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159497)

I, for one, welcome our new parasite overlords! Parasite Rex gives unto us that ultimate in human values: vibrance - yea a veritable cornucopia of ecological foment that is by the body of an AIDS patient.

SHUT DOWN EVERYTHING (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159515)

It's not too late! Close the borders! Shut the airports! Hope to god it doesn't go lethal!

It's the flu! (4, Funny)

russlar (1122455) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159531)

It's that new flu strain I keep hearing about, the H1B flu!

Re:It's the flu! (2, Funny)

Tablizer (95088) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159579)

It's that new flu strain I keep hearing about, the H1B flu!

It's real: I got hit so bad, I had to take a year off.
     

Uncontrolled immigration (1, Flamebait)

amightywind (691887) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159559)

Uncontrolled immigration is the obvious problem. Encouraging illegals with free government services adds to it. Keep the disease ridden out and the problem goes away.

Talk like an infected pirate day (3, Funny)

Tablizer (95088) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159615)

Aiy captain, I be gotten scurvy!

This isn't funny (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159631)

My college roommate has been working with Mexican families here in South Carolina for the past two years.

He was diagnosed with drug-resistant TB back in June.

Re:This isn't funny (1)

BadAnalogyGuy (945258) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159759)

It wouldn't be a problem if the US weren't so allergic to the TB vaccine.

Thank God for HMOs (4, Insightful)

MartinSchou (1360093) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159633)

Well, at least there are no government bureaucrats standing between the sick people and the doctors who could detect and treat these diseases.

USA, USA, USA!

Or something ... it is quite disappointing to see the world's richest country with what is at times the best health care in the world unable to keep simple infections and parasites from affecting a large portion of its population.

Re:Thank God for HMOs (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29160039)

You seem to think a national health service is some kind of magic bullet, as citizen of a country with such a organization, i can say that it's not guaranteed to work the way it's supposed to...

Re:Thank God for HMOs (1)

Rakshasa Taisab (244699) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160265)

MartinSchou is a person from a country with a dysfunctional health care sector. He just met a new friend, Mr. Anonymous Coward. Mr. Anonymous Coward is also from a country with a dysfunctional health care sector.

Re:Thank God for HMOs (1)

Zemran (3101) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160291)

And does this country you live in forbid you taking out private health insurance or is it really a matter of you have more choice than an American? Do you think that health insurance always works the way it is supposed to?

By your use of the term "national health" it sounds like the UK and I have listened to a lot of the debate in the US where they have made it sound like people in the UK are forced to use the National Health Service when this is not the case. There are many private health options and so it really is better than the US.

http://www.bupa.co.uk/ [bupa.co.uk] is just one of the options for the British, there is also the NHS....

Re:Thank God for HMOs (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29160043)

it is quite disappointing to see the world's richest country with what is at times the best health care in the world unwilling to keep simple infections and parasites from affecting a large portion of its population.

Fixed that for you.

Re:Thank God for HMOs (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29160089)

Large? The article specifies very small numbers of infected. Honestly if I weren't so lazy, (from being infected with parasites no doubt), I would find data for these types of infections over the last few decades.

The over-reaction to this article is amazing. :)

HELLO, Where has everyone been for 200+ years? (4, Insightful)

cenc (1310167) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159637)

I am sorry. Invasive species and diseases have been entering the U.S. since the first pilgrims got off the boat with their pock infested blankets. The U.S. has always turned a blind eye to the poor dying of them, until they spread to the middle class and rich. Now congress thinks this is an emergency?

I think author of this article needs to spend sometime getting to know their American history book. The only thing that has changed is there is now more poor. How about treating that disease?

Re:HELLO, Where has everyone been for 200+ years? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159739)

First off, it's closer to 400+ years. The Virginia Colony was founded in 1607.

since the first pilgrims got off the boat with their pock infested blankets

The Pilgrims arrived in 1620, and settled on the ruins of a Native American village - a village left in ruins because the inhabitants had been wiped out by disease. Namely, smallpox. And, yes, it could have come from traders trading pox-infested blankets to the natives.

So it predates the Pilgrims, and can be traced back to the first explorers to ever reach the "new" world.

Re:HELLO, Where has everyone been for 200+ years? (1)

TheGreenNuke (1612943) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159825)

So the 200+ was inaccurate how? By my awe inspiring knowledge of math, 400+ years is merely a subset of 200+ years and no thus need to correct him.

On no one's radar? (1)

davidwr (791652) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159643)

Well, they are on someone's radar, and now they are on a lot of people's radar.

Of course, if you really wanted to get attention, you would find some way of saying how good these diseases were, then all the cable-tv talking heads would mock you and your fake-evil plan to spread the news about these diseases would succeed in a way that would make Barbara Streisand proud.

Developing World's Parasites, Diseases Enter US (1)

shreshtha (1609099) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159745)

"...Diseases Enter US" what *Enter* means??? Does this mean that when US got status of developed it was free from all diseases and fully refined Ingot??? I think it is birth place of many more serious diseases.

Re:Developing World's Parasites, Diseases Enter US (1)

pommiekiwifruit (570416) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159809)

For example the 1918 "Spanish" flu is thought to have come from the USA.

Rich (2, Interesting)

mindbrane (1548037) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159757)

Remember the end of 'War of the Worlds'? IIRC, at least in the old film, the narrator speaks of God in His wisdom populating our little blue planet with microbes that defeat an invading alien horde that we with all our military might and technology can't stand against. If, of the 5 (Pollution) Horsemen of the Apocalypse, pestilence should be the big winner then the irony of it all playing off the end of the 'War of the Worlds' will be a sauce so rich and thick in irony as to be perfectly suited to Pestilence's feast.

Certainly globalization plays a part, but, perhaps, more importantly, we're poking big holes in the biomass. Threatened species adapt and the little microbes whose hosts were, in some cases, shuffling around the globe, and, in others, driving to extinction have to adapt. Adaption may entail making the leap to a new species and, along with our livestock, we're the most like landing spot.

The first test of an intelligent species is ensuring its survival. We now adequately know the limitations of our biosphere, we know its interconnectedness, and yet, we can't act rationally. There are now 6 billion of us, if you accept that there will be 9 billion then I hold that there will be 12 billion before we have international laws in place to stop us from destroying ourselves. 12 billion is just my loose estimate based on current numbers and the projected growth in the face of our current plight. Given our natures are a blend, of greed, lust, fear and shame tempered by altruism, and, further given our current and projected circumstances I think our best chance is runaway economic growth spinning off R&D that might mitigate against our most pressing problems. If we've any safety to look forward to it's ironically in numbers because the talent necessary to solve the problems we face doesn't seem to stem directly from industrialization or advanced infrastructure, rather, it's the small percentage who can manage and extend our knowledge base.

Which is why we screen at the border (1)

emarkp (67813) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159805)

This is one reason why having an actual immigration policy and enforcing it. Most countries in the world do this, but for some reason the US doesn't.

At least we don't have Soclaiist Medicine! (0, Troll)

David Gerard (12369) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159899)

President Barack Obama has asked Americans not to believe "rumors" that his health reform initiatives will lead to a government-run health care system, push Medicare recipients to die rather than run up their bill or lead to widespread euthanasia of the Republican "base." [today.com]

"Let me start by dispelling the outlandish rumors that reform will promote euthanasia, or cut Medicaid, or bring about a government takeover," said Mr Obama. "That's simply not true. Furthermore, our proposed tests would still rule Sarah Palin as being human and actually alive, despite the evidence from the brain machines."

Sarah Palin has spoken in horror of the centralised "death boards" she says Obama wishes to introduce, instead of the ones that individual hospitals run now to send people home to die when their money runs out. "Scientists like Stephen Hawking would have been killed off by the National Health Service," she said, "if they'd grown up in Eng-er-land!"

Peter Ferrara from Fox News refused to buy Mr Obama's claims. "The Obama health plan is based on evidence -- but evidence leads to science, and science leads to Darwinian evolution being applied to you and yours! He'll raise health costs, make freedom of choice illegal, ration health care and build a machine feeding illegal aliens in luxury on the corpses of aborted Republican babies, sacrificed in a gay Muslim Kenyan ceremony. You can buy my book on it at heartland.org for just $19.99. Call now! Operators standing by!"

Re:At least we don't have Soclaiist Medicine! (1)

Entropius (188861) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159971)

I think I saw that story on Fox News last night.

Who cares? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159907)

Do you really think the few hundred politicians who's election to the office is financed by the richest 5% really care about loosing the poorest bottom of the society?
Do you really think that the wealthiest think that the poor bastards even deserve to live?
War, hurricanes, new diseases hitting that segment of the overpopulated, under employed masses are really seen by them a godsend to quietly get rid of them by "natural ways".
Do you really think, the USA, the home of the wealthiest upper crust will ever create universal health care?
What good would do that for the top 5%?

Re:Who cares? (1)

izomiac (815208) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160253)

Why wouldn't the wealthy care about the poor? It's not like sociopathy is correlated with wealth, beyond that caused by being stigmatized by much of the other 95% of the population. Just look at the current setup... Our legislators tend to be wealthy, as are those who donate to their campaigns. Even so, those making >$100K are paying around three fourths of the taxes (top 50% pay 97%). Most government programs, OTOH, benefit the poor quite a bit more than they benefit the rich since the rich have other means of acquiring what they need.

So, simply by looking at past and current actions, the rich seem to care quite a bit about the poor. You can keep your cynicism by attributing that to needing cheap labor for mundane jobs, but I think it's more that one doesn't tend to care much about others until one's own needs are met. I won't say that the government doesn't have a pro-wealth bias, but overall it seems setup to protect the poor, otherwise you'd see the poor paying a lot more in taxes or mandatory service, and getting a lot less for their money/efforts.

No shit, Sherlock! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159987)

"Parasitic infections and other diseases usually associated with the developing world are cropping up with alarming frequency among US poor, especially in states along the US-Mexico border..." Which isn't surprising given our government allows every illegal motherfucker free run of the country.

This is a National Security problem (0, Flamebait)

ub3r n3u7r4l1st (1388939) | more than 4 years ago | (#29159991)

Consider this, unknown diseases spreading in big cities in the U.S. , and people refuse to seek treatment because they have no insurance and cannot afford any health care at all.

Who said U.S. has the best health-care system? Our system is very similar to that of ..................... China's.

Re:This is a National Security problem (1)

night_flyer (453866) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160077)

maybe if they would do something about illegal immigration, this wouldnt be an issue...

Re:This is a National Security problem (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29160309)

There's a reason countries with universal health care access tend to avoid third world diseases and it's not due to immigration, illegal or otherwise. Guess again.

What really concerns me (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29159993)

I think something should be said about how little we've really done in terms of medical science. We've vaccinated a lot of conditions out of existence, but what have we cured (fixed after infection/affliction) in the past 50 years or so? If we have a trillion dollars to blow up Arabs we should have a trillion to cure diseases.

US exports GM foods to 3w countries (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29160097)

In other news, US company Monsanto exports barely tested genetically modified food and seeds to third world countries.

neglected infections of poverty (1)

Nom du Keyboard (633989) | more than 4 years ago | (#29160303)

neglected infections of poverty

How pathetically Politically Correct can we possibly be?

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