×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

Snow Leopard Drops Palm OS Sync

timothy posted more than 4 years ago | from the exclusivity-demands-it dept.

Cellphones 290

adeelarshad82 writes "It's been just a little over a month since Apple blocked iTunes sync with Palm Pre, and now Apple takes that strategy one step further by blocking Snow Leopard sync with Palm-OS powered smartphones. Even though Palm has officially retired Palm OS and is now focusing hard on its next-generation WebOS in the Palm Pre, the company is still selling Palm OS-powered smartphones; two current models are the Treo Pro on Sprint and the Centro."

cancel ×
This is a preview of your comment

No Comment Title Entered

Anonymous Coward 1 minute ago

No Comment Entered

290 comments

Stay classy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224377)

Stay classy, Apple.

Re:Stay classy (0, Troll)

gcnaddict (841664) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224423)

Nothing like anticompetitiveness to turn me off.

It's sad, too. I was considering getting a Pre to use with my MacBook while running Snow Leopard, but now I'll just put Windows 7 onto my MacBook instead of Snow Leopard.

Re:Stay classy (4, Insightful)

Slur (61510) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224513)

Support for legacy technologies gets dropped all the time. It sucks, but it opens up new opportunities for enterprising developers. Besides, Palm themselves stopped making Palm Desktop for the Mac ages ago.

Obviously there is lingering demand. So, in due course there will be an open source solution to sync from the Mac OS to the Palm OS. After all, it's not rocket science.

So there you go. Competitiveness is restored.

Re:Stay classy (4, Interesting)

Darkness404 (1287218) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224669)

Sure, but there is a difference between legacy as in hardware, legacy that requires lots of code and legacy that is relatively small. My guess is Palm OS sync isn't that big of a program, nor does it need constant updating. So either A) Release it as a downloadable update, B) Or include it as an option when installing. Taking it out though, that just screams anticompeditive.

Re:Stay classy (3, Insightful)

icebike (68054) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224753)

Legacy?

This sync method was the foundation for a lot of devices beyond palm. The fact that Palm is moving on is not germane.

Its just code, code that has already been extensively debugged, widely deployed and is still in use by many people for many devices.

This isn't about legacy.

Its about that child running Apple, and his petty tantrums.

Re:Stay classy (2, Insightful)

arminw (717974) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225167)

....Its about that child running Apple, and his petty tantrums.....

Why should Apple not be allowed to have its walled garden? Only those who pay Apple are allowed to enter. They are not like Microsoft, where for the longest time there was no alternative to Windows. If you do not like Apple products, nobody forces you to buy them. Vote with your wallet and stop complaining.

Re:Stay classy (4, Insightful)

Planesdragon (210349) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225235)

Why should Apple not be allowed to have its walled garden?

Because they'll lose customers.

And customers are always, ALWAYS allowed to complain.

Re:Stay classy (1, Insightful)

arminw (717974) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225309)

...And customers are always, ALWAYS allowed to complain...

Complaining customers are OK if they are really your customers. In the case of a Palm, they're somebody else's customers and they they should be allowed to complain as long and as loud as they wish to and be ignored.

Re:Stay classy (4, Insightful)

don depresor (1152631) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225467)

So if they buy a copy of snow leopard, they're apple's customers, but if they also have a Palm, they automatically stop being apple's customers ?

Nice logic there smart boy.

Re:Stay classy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29225479)

If I have a Mac on which to run Snow Leopard I'm an Apple customer. It doesn't matter whether I have a Palm Pre or an iPhone.

I've already decided that I will won't be getting an iPhone because of Apple's policies on the app store. If Apple keeps pulling shit like this, I'll stop having a Mac pretty soon. (It's time to upgrade the laptop anyway. I'd don't have a problem expressing opinions with my wallet.) I think we'll probably have to stop buying Macs at work, too. We wouldn't want our office policies to affect which smart phones our employees choose.

Re:Stay classy (2, Insightful)

TiberiusMonkey (1603977) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225327)

If Palm want their devices to work with OSX then they are perfectly capable to write their own software, in fact they did and then discontinued it, so don't give me any of that rubbish. In fact, there is absolutely no reason for them to be leaching off iTunes either, other phone makers seem perfectly capable of writing their own sync software that uses the iTunes library, but for some reason Palm feels they don't have to do that and they have to make the Pre fake as an iPod. And Snow Leopard IS about legacy.

Re:Stay classy (2, Informative)

PopeRatzo (965947) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225127)

Support for legacy technologies gets dropped all the time.

Who decides what technology has become "legacy"? Apparently, Apple believes that all technologies that they don't sell you themselves is "legacy technology".

You have to really have Apple's dick in your mouth to defend this type of behavior from a corporation that has benefited so much from customer loyalty. At some point, one has to realize that Apple does not have one's best interest in mind, no matter how cool it makes one feel to display their nameplate.

Re:Stay classy (-1, Flamebait)

Capt.DrumkenBum (1173011) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224561)

I'll just put Windows 7 onto my MacBook instead of Snow Leopard.

There is a special place in Hell for people that put that abomination on good computers.

Re:Stay classy (1, Insightful)

sexconker (1179573) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224611)

Is there a special place in hell for morons like you who just bash MS?

Windows 7 is a very good operating system by all sensible accounts.

Re:Stay classy (0, Troll)

node 3 (115640) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224643)

Is there a special place in hell for morons like you who just bash MS?

Windows 7 is a very good operating system by all sensible accounts.

"Better than Vista" is not a very high bar.

Re:Stay classy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224671)

Right. Which is why he said, "by all sensible accounts" and not, "better than Vista".

Re:Stay classy (2, Insightful)

node 3 (115640) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225413)

Except the only universal praise ("all sensible accounts") is that it's better than Vista.

Compared to XP, it's not so clear a winner.

Re:Stay classy (2, Insightful)

Aranykai (1053846) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224771)

Personally, it streamlines most of my home computing tasks quite nicely over XP or Vista. Its faster, more responsive and has a couple nice features that both vista and XP lack.

I don't see myself putting it on my netbook, work computer or server any time soon, but it seems to be a step in the right direction for personal use.

Re:Stay classy (1, Flamebait)

Capt.DrumkenBum (1173011) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224791)

As it happens I have been running Win7 since shortly after RC1 came out, and I stand by my opinion that it is an abomination.

Re:Stay classy (1)

KylePflug (898555) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224899)

One wonders why you have been running it with such apparent fervor (it's not out yet, nobody's making you...).

Re:Stay classy (1)

shutdown -p now (807394) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224989)

Win7 RTM is out for MSDN and TechNet subscribers (which, of course, means that ISO images have long since been leaked to TPB and elsewhere).

Re:Stay classy (1)

KylePflug (898555) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225069)

I'm fully aware of that. I didn't say that it's in beta, I just pointed out that it's very definitively at the "you have to care to get it" stage. It certainly didn't come preinstalled on his Dell.

Re:Stay classy (1)

Unoriginal_Nickname (1248894) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225155)

Some people need something to feel superior about. Vegans and people who really care whether a program is open source are just two sides of the same coin.

Re:Stay classy (1)

aztracker1 (702135) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225091)

The point is, if it's "an abomination" why run it at all, over say XP, or Vista... if it is clearly better than the other windows versions, and you need windows, then calling it "an abomination" is rather short sighted.

Re:Stay classy (1, Interesting)

TiberiusMonkey (1603977) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225393)

Is there a special place in hell for morons like you who just bash MS?

Windows 7 is a very good operating system by all sensible accounts.

Probably, there is probably also a special place in hell for companies that abuse monopolies and feel they are above the law.

Re:Stay classy (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224783)

There is also a special place in Hell for people who traffic in unnecessary hyperbole.

Re:Stay classy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224961)

Pull up a seat.

Re:Stay classy (2, Insightful)

TheGreenNuke (1612943) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224893)

I'll just put Windows 7 onto my MacBook instead of Snow Leopard.

There is a special place in Hell for people that put that abomination on good computers.

Thats why he's putting it on a MacBook and not a good computer....

Re:Stay classy (1)

arminw (717974) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225249)

....There is a special place in Hell ...

So far, I have mostly heard good things about Windows 7 and I will likely buy a copy to put on a VM on my Mac alongside with Windows XP. I have also tried VISTA, but compared to XP it is slow even on my Mac Pro With 2 GB of RAM allocated solely to the VM.

Re:Stay classy (5, Informative)

jo_ham (604554) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224641)

If Palm want a way to sync on OS X they should write the software themselves. Oh wait, they did and discontinued it.

Re:Stay classy (2, Insightful)

CMonk (20789) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225049)

The only one that didn't want Palm products to succeed was Palm. Horrible products. Support EOL for all their products were the day they shipped. Rarely got any sort of bug fixes, never any additional features. Palm Desktop for Mac is still a PowerPC only application (runs on intel via rosetta). Why bother trying to support something the vendor has no interest in supporting? I'll never make the mistake of buying another Palm product (I've had 2, Palm Pro and Palm T5). I've never heard anyone say a good thing about their Treo so I never went there. I don't expect anything will change with the Pre. I also don't understand the Pre hype, it's not bringing anything new to the table.

Re:Stay classy (1, Insightful)

PopeRatzo (965947) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225073)

When you expect the brand of computer you use to convey status upon you, this is the price you have to be willing to pay.

And Windows 7 works great on my Macbook Pro.

Re:Stay classy (1)

jac89 (979421) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225291)

I have been running Windows 7 on my MacBook and I hardly boot into OSX anymore. The HFS drivers coming in snow leopard will be welcome even though it is read only (supposedly to prevent the mac partition from being messed up by viruses.

Re:Stay classy (1)

jcr (53032) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224955)

In your view, what kind of obligation does Apple have to support other vendors' products, after the other vendor has made it clear that said product is on the way out?

-jcr

First Post! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224393)

From Palm! Oh Yeah

Trollbait (5, Informative)

Microlith (54737) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224417)

s/blocking/dropping support for/

Nothing, IIRC, is stopping Palm from doing the heavy lifting required to support their devices in OS X except Palm.

Re:Trollbait (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224523)

tell that to the linux bitches.

Re:Trollbait (4, Informative)

Trepidity (597) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224585)

Yeah, the article even points out that Apple dropped support for syncing with PowerPC Macs, so it's not like Apple is only dropping support for competitors; they're just weeding out anything non-recent. The argument seems to be that somehow dropping PPC support is acceptable, because they've been discontinued, but PalmOS is still an OS on phones currently sold, so couldn't be explained by the same "it's just being dropped because it's old and dead" logic. But Palm itself basically declared Palm OS dead [cnet.com] before Apple dropped support.

You could argue it's a bit premature, but it doesn't take an anticompetitive explanation for that: Apple has a long history of dropping support for stuff that was becoming obsolete in a way that many commentators considered a bit premature, starting with their decision to drop floppy support.

Re:Trollbait (2, Insightful)

Darkness404 (1287218) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224779)

The difference though was, the floppy disk was hardware, as far as I know (and http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/8300945231/m/968001001931 [arstechnica.com] seems to say so) that there is still floppy disk support for OS X. It costs money to include a floppy disk, it does not cost any money, and probably almost no money in support, to continue supporting an un-changing platform that is "dead". Taking it out A) most likely has no space gains B) inconveniences users and C) is pointless. It cost money to continue shipping floppy disks, it does not cost any more money to keep syncing with Palm devices.

Re:Trollbait (1)

Hungus (585181) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224933)

A great deal of Snow Leopard was rewritten (including I believe the last legacy core of finder finally). APIs get depreciated and the cruft gets thrown away. More than likely PalmOS synching used some of the cruft and or APIs that were no longer needed otherwise. PLus there have been 3rd party apps to synch for quite some time, they will just be more used now.

Re:Trollbait (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29225149)

Don't Forget: SNOW LEOPARD IS WAY SMALLER !!
They had to lose something.
Good riddance palm devices, I always hated you.

Re:Trollbait (4, Interesting)

MMC Monster (602931) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224959)

It cost money to continue shipping floppy disks, it does not cost any more money to keep syncing with Palm devices.

Of course it costs money to keep syncing with deprecated hardware. Apple will have to support this software bridge for the lifetime of Snow Leopard (2 years? 4? more?). Cutting out essentially deprecated software will make the OS easier (and cheaper) for Apple to support in the long run.

That being said, I have no doubt that the upper management at Apple was all smiles when the announcement was made that PalmOS Sync was being dropped.

Re:Trollbait (0)

Obfuscant (592200) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224845)

The argument seems to be that somehow dropping PPC support is acceptable, because they've been discontinued,

Tell that to my boss, who just bought a new Mac to replace his old one. Can't just connect the two and let the magic update happen, he's got to update every damn thing by hand. His old one is a PPC, new one whatever the hell it is they are selling these days.

And the "magic update" process complains not that the old system is PPC, but that it doesn't run OS X, which is a lie.

Gotta love them macs.

Re:Trollbait (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224927)

Timothy - the only /. editor who trolls more than the users...

Re:Trollbait (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29225453)

That's the thing I'm wondering about - is this 'dropping the ability for other devices to plug into the iSync framework' or is this merely 'dropping the bundled Palm support for iSync'

Curious, a quick google to http://support.apple.com/kb/HT2824 shows that vastly more devices than Palm are supported by iSync 'outof-the-box'. Judging by http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/09/08/24/apple_drops_palm_os_hotsync_conduit_from_snow_leopard.html it looks like Apple, for whatever reason, didn't bother forward-porting their iSync-for-Palm conduit.

Judging by the popularity of Missing Sync, I'm guessing the iSync framework isn't as feature-filled as some would desire.

Platform Politics (1, Troll)

improfane (855034) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224455)

I'm really not happy with this interplatform bitching.

There should be laws against this kind of thing: the recent Google Talk blocking by Apple and this is an example of trying to maintain a monoply in my opinion.

We all have a go at Microsoft for lock-in but why does Apple get away with it?

Re:Platform Politics (2, Insightful)

quanticle (843097) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224503)

Apple doesn't have a 90%+ share of the operating systems market and, therefore, cannot drive competitors out of business through sheer price/compatibility pressure alone. The DoJ went after Microsoft because its monopoly over the operating systems market allowed it to distort the market in web browsers to its own advantage. That was illegal. Now, unless you can show that Apple's market power is sufficient to distort the market in PDAs/smartphones, then Apple hasn't done anything illegal.

Re:Platform Politics (1)

sexconker (1179573) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224639)

What about MP3 players?
The iPod and iTunes don't exactly play nice with other software or hardware.

Re:Platform Politics (4, Insightful)

jo_ham (604554) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224677)

Nothing stopping Palm releasing software to allow syncing on OS X. They just chose to discontinue it and instead rely on Apple to provide it.

Then went and pissed off Apple with the whole "I'm an iPod really" private USB vendor code spoofing thing.

Doesn't surprise me that Apple are hardly going to concern themselves with syncing with PalmOS - an OS that Palm itself is dead, out of goodwill for Palm.

Re:Platform Politics (1)

gabebear (251933) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224935)

I think Apple started bundling a sync conduit for PalmOS in 10.3... I don't know exactly why Apple isn't shipping this conduit now, but they aren't blocking anything... has anyone actually tried installing Palm's Palm Desktop on Snow Leopard? http://kb.palm.com/wps/portal/kb/common/article/33219_en.html [palm.com] . It would be hillarious if this was actually a move to FIX PalmOS syncing... I don't have an old Palm or I'd try it.

From what I've heard, the built-in Palm syncing always sucked(which is why there were third party solutions).

Re:Platform Politics (1)

RyuuzakiTetsuya (195424) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225111)

From what I understand the Palm sync stuff was largely PPC. When they dropped the PPC support from OSX, they had to drop anything that relied on it as well, including the Palm sync capability. It's not interoperability between mobile and desktop platforms that drove apple to drop Palm sync, it's interoperability between desktop CPU platforms.

Re:Platform Politics (2, Insightful)

indiechild (541156) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225209)

Agreed on the Google Talk thing, but this Palm OS Sync isn't an example of anti-competitiveness, it's just dropping support for something that is long past its use-by-date anyway.

And Apple doesn't get away with things -- there's been a lot more bitching about Apple than Microsoft lately. People are even defending MS against the FSF.

Discontinued support != blocking (1)

improfane (855034) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225431)

I've read the article. It's definitely a different case to Google Talk.

I think one of the reasons they did this WAS because the Palm is now discontinued, they deliberately crippled functionality to maintain the purity of iTunes/iPod. They do not want other companies exploiting their software out of their control.

Palm used essentially an undocumented hack to trick iTunes into thinking it was an iPhone. This should go on the dirty code frontpage [slashdot.org] article. It saved Palm from having to write their own software and it allowed them to claim iTunes compatibility.

Even worse is probably that knowing how to pretend to be an iPhone proves that they may have been digging into the internals of the iPhone filesystem which they probably want to keep secret.

I still no hardware developer should prevent me from the software I use with my hardware though. Apple wants a monoply over its hardware and software and that's understandable from a business POV.

The summary is a little misleading...They didn't block, they just removed the carpet from under their feet, knowing full well it would cause an incompatibility.

Palm dropped support (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224467)

Palm dropped support for this YEARS ago. You can hardly blaim apple for not taking over support of a product that the manufacturer declared dead.

Re:Palm dropped support (5, Informative)

Shawn Parr (712602) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224645)

Mod parent up.

Palm hasn't updated Hotsync for the Mac in at least a decade. If it in fact worked under Leopard it was a miracle, as I doubt anyone from Palm even gave it a glance.

Mac Palm users almost all typically ended up getting Mark/Space Missing Sync for Palm OS. I was a late adopter for that, and I did it in 2005. At the time I was helping people with support on Palm OS devices, and the answer to any Mac sync problems was to dump hotsync and get Missing Sync.

To claim that Apple dropped support is pretty ridiculous, and just inflammatory. What next, an article on how Apple refuses to support running 10.6 on a Mac II from the late 80's?

Re:Palm dropped support (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224697)

I agree 100%. The problem with ranting about something like this that makes *no sense* is that when a truly appropriate (or at least informed) complaint comes around, no one is going to care or notice. If you just want to bitch in random iflammatory one line summaries, then go post comments on CNN, FoxNews, MSNBC, or some other vehicle where they are already good at this.

Re:Palm dropped support (1, Insightful)

jamstar7 (694492) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224733)

Palm Pre is a relatively new phone. It uses the Palm webOS, not PalmOS. Apple dropped sync support for it through Itunes. Just coincidently, Apple also sells a smart phone.

Re:Palm dropped support (4, Insightful)

Renderer of Evil (604742) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224925)

Palm Pre is a relatively new phone. It uses the Palm webOS, not PalmOS. Apple dropped sync support for it through Itunes. Just coincidently, Apple also sells a smart phone.

iTunes never supported the Palm Pre. Check your facts.

Re:Palm dropped support (5, Insightful)

KylePflug (898555) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224931)

Apple didn't "drop" sync support for it through iTunes. Palm tried to sneak support in by spoofing an iPod vendor ID, which Apple undid. Nothing about iTunes gives competitors the right to use it as a selling point for their phones.

I think it's pretty shitty of Apple to refuse to play nice, but it's not like Palm didn't have it coming when they tried to pass off a pasted-on hack as some kind of official feature.

Re:Palm dropped support (2, Insightful)

jo_ham (604554) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225215)

What this article is talking about though, is PalmOS.

This has nothing at all to do with the Palm Pre, which Apple didn't "drop support for" - they never supported it in the first place.

This is about the ability to sync PalmOS based phones, which Apple provided a conduit for since about 10.3 or something, that they are finally dropping support for. 10 years after Palm itself dropped support for it on the Mac incidentally.

I am certain that spoofing Apple's USB vendor ID with the Palm Pre certainly meant that Apple can cease caring whether or not dropping support for PalmOS sync (when Palm itself doesn't provide a way to sync on OS X) will annoy Palm.

Re:Palm dropped support (1)

Kedavra (810694) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225537)

I've used Palm devices since 1999, and Palm has always treated Macintosh like the unwanted stepchild.

Palm has retired the OS (4, Insightful)

InlawBiker (1124825) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224471)

So why would Apple spend time developing a feature for it? Especially since all 3 of the people still using Palm OS devices can purchase an app that does the same thing. Looks to me like the press is making a mountain from a molehill.

Re:Palm has retired the OS (1)

Black Cardinal (19996) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224557)

If only 3 people are still using Palm OS devices, then they must all be in my work group. Several of us still use Treo smartphones. Just because new devices use a different OS is no reason to ditch a perfectly good device if it fits your needs well. I like my Treo 755p very much.
My Treo was an easy way to keep my address book and calendar on my Mac synced with my Exchange data at work. This definitely would impact me if I upgraded to Snow Leopard.

Re:Palm has retired the OS (1)

node 3 (115640) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224757)

This definitely would impact me if I upgraded to Snow Leopard.

Except you don't seem to be the type that's in any rush to upgrade to current technology.

The problem sort of solves itself.

Re:Palm has retired the OS (1)

Black Cardinal (19996) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224979)

Except you don't seem to be the type that's in any rush to upgrade to current technology.

It's not wise to extrapolate from a single data point. Just because I like one device the way it is doesn't mean I don't like to update other tech gadgets. It depends on the risks and benefits.

I was considering upgrading to Snow Leopard this weekend, but decided to wait until I return from a trip I'm taking next week. I don't want to spend my last night at home frantically trying to restore a Leopard backup to my MacBook Pro if something went wrong with the upgrade. Now I'll probably wait even longer, to see if this issue is resolved.

Ugh (1, Insightful)

schmidt349 (690948) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224519)

Before anyone gets down on me, let me say I am a big-time Apple junkie. I have an iPhone, an iMac, a Macbook, hell, even an Apple TV. I code in Perl and Objective-C.

That said, this is totally unconscionable. Apple has an obligation to its users not to break things that used to work for no good reason, and suddenly killing Palm sync support with no good reason other than a big Nelson Muntz "ha-ha" is kind of a red flag.

Anyone who had a serious Palm jones already used The Missing Sync anyhow, but this is seriously irresponsible.

Re:Ugh (5, Insightful)

ColdWetDog (752185) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224623)

Anyone who had a serious Palm jones already used The Missing Sync anyhow, but this is seriously irresponsible.

So Apple should keep working on a niche market that is already well served by a third party? Why? Should Apple keep parallel and serial ports alive? Should I be upset that 10.6 doesn't work with my 1998 Winprinter? Where does it stop?

So, all 2000 users of Palm PDAs / Treos can either 1) stay at 10.5 - which isn't such a bad OS or 2) Go buy Missing Sync (which, I imagine, since Palm synching in OS 10.5 and earlier was pretty rudimentary 1990 of said users probably already have).

Re:Ugh (1)

schmidt349 (690948) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224705)

That's fair enough, I guess I was just pining for the good old days with my 12" Powerbook dualbooting OS 9 and X and my Visor Edge... from the article I got the impression that Apple had just nuked iSync support, but it's possible it was a casualty of the 32/64-bit transition (or maybe the Palm-specific code had been running in Rosetta all this time anyway).

Re:Ugh (3, Insightful)

Aranykai (1053846) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224833)

Its not a niche market, its every single palm phone except the absolute most recent one. Every single palm sold before June 6th, 2009 is affected.

Re:Ugh (2, Insightful)

jo_ham (604554) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225245)

So, where is Palm's software to fill in now that Apple are discontinuing support for the PalmOS that Palm has declared dead (but still sells phones with it on)?

Oh right, they discontinued the sync software years ago.

Re:Ugh (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29225371)

It is if your an Apple user. People buying US $600 dollar phones every 6 months don't care about things like this, things that used to work but suddenly don't. So why should Apple bother, it's not like they have a huge application base as it is or much in the way of support, besides the preppy drones they hire at their stores who "support you" with a smile.

They didn't even have to really "maintain it" they just had to leave it in! Everyone bitches at Microsoft all the time well you know what at least on my Windows 7 box (which incidentally took up 40gigs one day after the base and a few key apps were installed) can run every app under the Sun created after the dawn of the computer including everything Microsoft has once supported.

Okay we'll ignore some drivers and lower level things but between the base level library support, emulation, and virtualization there just is not much any computer can run my M$ Windows can't. O yeah except Mac cause they're idiots and missed the virtualization boat with idiotic software/hardware lockins.

You truely get what you pay for in the most ironic ways these days.

Re:Ugh (4, Informative)

diamondsw (685967) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225441)

Which is a niche. Treo sales have been in steady decline ever since the 700p, and that was 2-3 years ago. Contrary to the summary, the Treo Pro does not run Palm OS - it's Windows Mobile.

Users can still use the far superior Missing Sync, and Palm could always update Hotsync. This is a non-issue.

Re:Ugh (1)

photomonkey (987563) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224913)

Actually, I'm a Treo and Mac user. I have a 755p that is actually a great phone for me. It worked fine in Tiger, but a recent upgrade to Leopard broke the universe. I haven't played with the Mark/Space software yet, but I can say that Mac's support for Treos was weak at best, and nonexistent in recent years.

I'm not planning on upgrading to Snow Leopard any time in the very near future, but when I do, I suppose I'll get the Missing Sync software.

I would totally buy an iPhone as an alternative, but I will not do business with AT&T. So hopefully their exclusivity period ends before I buy a new phone and get locked in with another contract.

Re:Ugh (1)

TheGreenNuke (1612943) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224973)

Why can't we hold Apple to the same standard as M$? Everyone expects full legacy support for their 15 year-old 8-bit code to work in Vista or Win7 64-bit and yell and scream if they can't do it with having to do a rewrite. Frankly, I'd prefer it is M$ did drop the support for the legacy garbage that my company keeps around and force them to develop some decent functioning apps. Just had to point out the double standard though.

Re:Ugh (2, Interesting)

Spaseboy (185521) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225465)

10.6 probably DOES work with your 1998 Winprinter if you have a parallel to USB adapter. Thank you, Gutenprint.

Re:Ugh (2, Insightful)

jo_ham (604554) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224713)

Why does it have an obligation to ensure third party products function across OS releases? A third party product, by the way, that doesn't have native sync software because Palm discontinued it. Palm has also said that PalmOS is dead.

They have announced their intention. If Palm want to do something about it, they can release some software to make it all work again.

Re:Ugh (1)

node 3 (115640) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224865)

Before anyone gets down on me, let me say I am a big-time Apple junkie. I have an iPhone, an iMac, a Macbook, hell, even an Apple TV. I code in Perl and Objective-C.

And I thought, "I know I'm going to get downmodded for this, but..." was a silly way to start a post.

That said, this is totally unconscionable. Apple has an obligation to its users not to break things that used to work for no good reason, and suddenly killing Palm sync support with no good reason other than a big Nelson Muntz "ha-ha" is kind of a red flag.

They aren't breaking anything. Palm syncing still works in Leopard just as it always has. And, you know what else doesn't work with Snow Leopard? All non-Intel Macs.

Even Palm is ending support for Palm OS. But you expect Apple to keep supporting it?

Anyone who had a serious Palm jones already used The Missing Sync anyhow, but this is seriously irresponsible.

Oh, ffs. This "irresponsible, unconscionable" act isn't even going to affect anyone? What terms do you have left for things that do matter?

OS X 10.6 "Douche Cat" (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224545)

seems appropriate, this name was proposed by my Power PC Tower which is also left out of all the fun.

but I just saved 30 bucks!

Missing Sync for Palm, anyone? (5, Insightful)

donovansmith (570177) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224607)

Palm Desktop stopped functioning years ago, so Apple finally dropping support for it is not a bad thing at all. I'm sure Missing Sync for Palm OS will be continue to function or be updated to function in Snow Leopard. I know I had to use it with my Centro since the decrepit Palm Desktop didn't work for it. Windows Mobile and BlackBerry devices also rely on third-party software to sync in Mac OS X. Apple dropping support on their side is a non-issue.

Apple is so... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224629)

ugh.

They block people from using their services and buying music, thus people will go download it else, possibly for free.

They reject apps for the iphone and ipod on grounds that it mimics functions, even if it does more than just that, and even when it does the mimicked functions better.

They install some sort of anti-virus engine thingy with their latest OS coming out, even though they continue to make claims that Macs do not get viruses.

This, is why I am a PC.
"Life without walls..." - XP

Re:Apple is so... (1)

arminw (717974) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225437)

....They block people from using their services ....

However, there are plenty of other people's services and devices which you are free to buy and enjoy. Apparently though, enough people are using their services and products, that their profits are higher than any other computer maker during this recession. Buy some Apple stock if you can still afford it because it will go up.

Free Software FTW (2, Insightful)

HRbnjR (12398) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224653)

Just install Free Software and GNU/Linux and forget about all these stupid games! Take control of your computing with an platform created by the people, for the people. Use something which is designed to enable you, rather than restrict you - locking you in and exploiting you for cash.

Re:Free Software FTW (2, Insightful)

KylePflug (898555) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225051)

Enables you to:
- Feel self righteous
- Spend most of your time configuring bullshit

Restricts you from:
- Running anything supported by any work environment ever
- Most niche computing scenarios (tablets? accessibility? professional production software?)
- "Those stupid games"
- "Those stupid industry-standard productivity suites"
- Owning a computer that your family, friends, roommates can use
- Interacting responsibly with the modern realities of digital entertainment (as in, legitimately purchasing media and games)

Look, I've had systems based on everything from Red Hat in high school to Sabayon and Ubuntu in college. I own two MacBooks, I've built countless PCs running everything from ME to W7. I love Linux for what it is, but what it isn't is perfectly clear. It isn't "designed to enable" you to do jack shit unless you are a developer, have tons of free time, or are a total ideologue. Nothing has ever been more convenient under Linux than it is under appropriate consumer software.

I want free software to succeed and thrive, but what that requires is that people stop this vapid pulpit bullshit every time a consumer OS does something less-than-perfect. You know what regular people think of Linux people as? A slightly nerdier version of that guy in the camo pants with the beard and a "THE END IS NEAR" sign outside the office. Nobody cares until you have something useful.

Re:Free Software FTW (1)

iron-kurton (891451) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225541)

Just wanted to point out that feeling self-righteous is not limited only to Linux users. And that the end really is near.

First the floppy, then serial, now the palm? (5, Funny)

That's Unpossible! (722232) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224655)

Jesus, Jobs, have you no heart? First you killed off the floppy disk drive. Then you wiped out serial ports in favor of USB. Now you're blowing out syncing technology that barely anyone uses any more in order to streamline your OS... shame, shame on you.

Sorry, I'm having a real hard time getting worked up over this, or even seeing a nefarious scheme behind it.

Centro doesn't sync now anyways. (1)

nolifetillpleather (975338) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224665)

I have a Centro. It doesn't sync on Leopard either. Go google around. You'll find a bunch of "Buy MissingSync for Palm" forum replies. Apple even makes an SDK thinger for making iSync plugins. I tried to use it to make something for my Centro go. I'm not expert at mobile phone syncing protocols, but I'm pretty sure Palm (or ACCESS?) is retarded.

Licensing (1)

gabebear (251933) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224695)

I wonder if Apple was licensing the software that allowed PalmOS syncing... possibly from Palm...

it's stupid, petty, and tacky for Apple (0, Flamebait)

alizard (107678) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224703)

to punish all of a company's users for the "crime" of making it possible for its customers to buy Apple's digital music products.

Luckily, as a Linux user, I need not worry about it, jpilot or kpilot are plug-and-play on Palm OS products.

I just lost my own Palm PDA after years of satisfactory performance. Since I mainly use it for e-books and mp3s, I was considering buying an iPod Touch to replace it for these purposes.

I think I'll look up a discounted price on another Palm PDA instead.

For Palm users who made the mistake of buying Apple, here's a tutorial on installing Linux apps on OSX [simplehelp.net] .

As for digital tracks themselves, I recommend buying them from a company that has not reinvented itself as a "cooler" version of Microsoft.

Re:it's stupid, petty, and tacky for Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224877)

Please, please for the love of god stop trying to take the high and mighty route that Apple should be happy with netting $.03c of of every $.99c song purchase and be happy with it. iTunes exists to sell iPods, period. Apple doesn't give a rats ass about getting more competitors hardware syncing with the iTunes Store in order to increase their sales. They barely break even on the iTunes Store as it is. Supporting those purchases isn't exactly free (people to answer phones and email costs money) and something like 75% of the sale already goes straight to the record company. While their bandwidth costs have to be negligible considering peering agreements, it still isn't free. Neither is electricity and data center space.

With the bullshit palm is pulling by pretending they are an ipod, they are lucky Apple isn't really stomping on them. What happens when a Pre identifies itself as an ipod with a specific firmware version, Apple updates the "ipods" firmware to make it compatible with the new itunes that was released (hypothetical, here) and somehow corrupts the files on the drive because \IPOD_CONTROL isn't being used for what it thinks it is? Palm is absolutely in the wrong by pulling this kind of shit, and the first thing their users are going to do is to call into apple complaining their "ipod" wont sync with itunes any more. Support phone calls cost money, friends. Palm is not only taking away ipod sales from this, but they are also causing increased support costs to Apple. The exact same thing that happened when Psystar started releasing clones, and their customers called into Apple for support for non-apple hardware.

P.S. As others have stated, Palm dropped support for this kind of syncing themselves ages ago. Are you really surprised Apple is no longer supporting a third party product that the third party themselves won't support any more? Get real.

Sensationalist headline (5, Insightful)

dn15 (735502) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224717)

Nothing is being blocked. Apple is simply discontinuing their own support for Palm devices. Palm itself stopped officially supporting Macs years ago. There's nothing preventing users from running third-party software to sync.

*yawn* (1)

Draconix (653959) | more than 4 years ago | (#29224741)

Apple drops support for legacy stuff from time to time. This might be a retaliatory move, but it's more likely they just don't want to waste the time and money on something a tiny fraction of their userbase needs, especially when it's something a third party (or Palm, you know, the makers of the OS in question) could write a sync app for.

Oh Noes! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224863)

What shall I do?!?! Those devious crooks at Apple stopped making computers with my much required serial interface. Now they are ceasing support for my beloved Palm? I am so furious that they are not supporting devices from 1996. The horror!

Sincerely,
A. Troglodyte

Well... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29224895)

Apple have never supported Palm OS syncing in Mac OS X. All they provided was a conduit for Palm Desktop to access iCal/Address Book. There has never been an Apple Mail.app sync plugin. It needed Palm Desktop to work.

Palm Desktop is still a PPC app, it's also not a very good PPC app, there have been basically no updates to it since it was Claris Organiser (aside from Palm OS Syncing). Last time I used it was on my previous mac with tiger. It wasn't very good then.

I've not used the missing sync myself as I moved away from Palm OS when I switched to an Intel Mac, but from reviews and word of mouth I hear it is a better solution. From my understanding it makes no use of the conduits Apple was providing, so I see no reason for them to be kept.

Besides, if people are that annoyed they'll hack it back in. Then if you care you can use that. I don't see what all the fuss is about...

Whats the drop rate on that? (1)

PaganRitual (551879) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225199)

I've killed like about 1500 Snow Leopards now and I'll I've got is an arse load of Tiger Meat, a metric fuck-ton of Sharp Claws and some useless blue cloak pattern that gives Frost Resistance. Lucky bastard.

Not such a big deal anymore (1)

jht (5006) | more than 4 years ago | (#29225429)

Just about all the PalmOS users still out there use Missing Sync anyways. It's the only Intel-native sync to begin with, since Palm themselves never bothered releasing an Intel version of their Desktop for Mac.

If Palm doesn't care enough to support it, why should Apple? There's not exactly a lot of PalmOS left out in the market nowadays - the Pre is the only Palm-branded phone that sells at all and even it's a virtual pimple on the body of iPhones and Blackberries.

(Blackberries that, by the way, are about to have their own native Intel-compatible Mac sync released)

Load More Comments
Slashdot Account

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?

Don't worry, we never post anything without your permission.

Submission Text Formatting Tips

We support a small subset of HTML, namely these tags:

  • b
  • i
  • p
  • br
  • a
  • ol
  • ul
  • li
  • dl
  • dt
  • dd
  • em
  • strong
  • tt
  • blockquote
  • div
  • quote
  • ecode

"ecode" can be used for code snippets, for example:

<ecode>    while(1) { do_something(); } </ecode>
Sign up for Slashdot Newsletters
Create a Slashdot Account

Loading...