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Aion Open Beta Starts September 6th

Soulskill posted more than 4 years ago | from the gives-you-wings dept.

Games 147

NCSoft announced today that the open beta for upcoming fantasy MMO Aion will begin on September 6th, extending through to the 13th. The client is available now. The game launches on September 22nd in the US, with a two-day head-start given to players who pre-order. NCSoft has also said they'll be showing off Aion in more detail at the Penny Arcade Expo, expanding on the information they provided at Gamescom (video).

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147 comments

Rootkits for everyone! (5, Informative)

regular_gonzalez (926606) | more than 4 years ago | (#29228635)

A word of warning - Aion uses GameGuard [wikipedia.org] which for all intents and purposes, is a rootkit. The article is a bit outdated w/ regards to incompatibility issues with other apps, as the Steam incompatibility was fixed a month or two ago iirc. Either way, it's a terrible and invasive bit of software that I won't allow anywhere near my PC.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29228805)

I used to play another small korean mmorpg, Priston Tale [wikipedia.org]. It used GameGuard. The GameGuard server would go down all of the time, making the game inaccessible. The parent is 100% correct, GG is crap.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (1)

Kagura (843695) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231579)

The GameGuard server would go down all of the time, making the game inaccessible.

The MMORPG server would go down all the time, making the game inaccessible. I'll never play an MMORPG!

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 4 years ago | (#29234111)

His statement doesn't seem hypothetical to me. Apparently it's tied to a second server in addition to the MMO server and that second server has horrible availability.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29228873)

Aion 1.5 (the version that will be in the open beta and used for release) does not have GameGuard. Unless they decide to put it back in before release, that is.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (1)

democomputer (1562465) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229339)

Aion 1.5 (the version that will be in the open beta and used for release) does not have GameGuard. Unless they decide to put it back in before release, that is.

I'll mod you up if you can give a source for this

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (2, Funny)

Lonewolf666 (259450) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230463)

I'll mod you up if you can give a source for this

Now that you have a comment in this thread, you can't moderate it anymore.
FAIL.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29232061)

Quote from Aion Customer Support:

"Your feelings on GameGuard are justified and known to the North American and European teams. As it stands now GameGuard does provide a certain level of protection. If and when we find a better hack/cheat/bot prevention system we will use it. GameGuard will be improved or removed before launch."

Source:

http://www.aionsource.com/forum/aion-discussion/33125-important-news-gms.html

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (1)

Pyrion (525584) | more than 4 years ago | (#29232879)

Looks like you need to learn to read. There's nothing in there that says they're absolutely going to remove it before release. Read it carefully: if they find something better than GameGuard, they're going to switch to that, but in the mean time, they're sticking with GameGuard.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29230491)

According to this [aionfly.com] that's not quite true:

GameGuard will be improved or removed before launch.

Sounds to me like it's still going to be in the software for the beta and that it will still be in the launch product if they deem it to be "improved" enough.

Personally, I'm not installing it. The wikipedia article reads like a laundry list of how to compromise your machine with one little installation. I wonder, however, how many nerds who come here and rail against "idiots" they know who install malware from "stupid" sources like free screensavers will happily install this piece of craptastic malware for the chance to play a video game.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29231645)

The open beta does have GameGuard. I know this since I downloaded and installed the OBT client and it sure has GG.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (1)

Impy the Impiuos Imp (442658) | more than 4 years ago | (#29232655)

Well, on the one hand, one does want a cheat-prevention program to be hard to uninstall, otherwise what's the point? It's like outlawing guns and being shocked -- shocked! -- that the crooks didn't cough them up.

The best bet for the future is to develop data mining techniques to analyze player responses to deduce who is probably using a bot or a cheat program, then do a direct analysis from there (e.g. a fast Turing test, for example.) That way it's all server-side.

It'll still be a running battle with the cheat hack developers, but at least it won't rely so heavily on such intrusive software.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (1)

cfalcon (779563) | more than 4 years ago | (#29233427)

No, don't be absurd. There's NO REASON for it to be hard to uninstall. A game that requires an anti-cheat will refuse to let you play without it. If you were to claim that it should be hard to SPOOF I would agree. But if I uninstall Aion and Gameguard doesn't go away, I'll never buy anything from NCSoft again. If it runs when Aion isn't running, then I'll uninstall it for sure.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (4, Informative)

Datamonstar (845886) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229021)

Yep. it's another ADMINISTRATOR account that silently gets added to your system. Once I figured out what it was I disregarded it, but I was still pretty pissed.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (3, Interesting)

Skuld-Chan (302449) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231949)

Best/easiest way to disable gameguard? Load it on 64 bit windows. Patchguard won't let it patch the kernel, so while it loads - it can't do anything against cheating. So if you are a hacker or botter - get Windows X64 and have at it.

No doubt about it - it is a rootkit. On 32 bit machine I've watched it read window titles, intercept I/O - stuff like that. One of the ways around gameguard on 32 bit machine is to build a rootkit that sits below it.

Re:Rootkits for everyone! (1)

AP31R0N (723649) | more than 4 years ago | (#29235215)

Can someone explain to me why this is so bad?

While playing in the closed beta i had no problems with it.

How is this different than/same as punk buster? Are there systems to prevent cheating in MRPGs that don't involve some program watching the code on the client side?

Fileplanet Subscribers Only (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29228655)

It looks like the open beta will only be available to Fileplanet Subscribers (about $5/month)...
There may be more beta keys available from other websites, but currently Fileplanet is claiming to have exclusivity on the beta.

So, I'm not really sure in what way this is "open", it sounds like it will be exactly the same as all the other Aion beta events with a limited number of keys for select (lucky) players.
Maybe, someone with more info can prove me wrong.

Re:Fileplanet Subscribers Only (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29228695)

Closed Beta is where they have a smaller group that they have selected to work on the game. Open Beta is where they open it up to the public and just let in anyone who gets a key.

Re:Fileplanet Subscribers Only (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29228717)

Sadly, even though I preordered the game, I wasn't lucky enough to receive a key. I sent them an e-mail about it seeing if there's anything I can do to get one but I'm sure i'll probably get a "sorry limited number" excuse.

Re:Fileplanet Subscribers Only (1)

blackraven14250 (902843) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229223)

It's also for anyone who preordered. We were all stuck playing 1.0, they had better let us in on some 1.5 action before the beginning of headstart. Thre's alot of changes to the game between the 2 versions.

I don't care (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29231153)

The game has a death penalty. Screw that.

Trolls don't give me an adrenalin rush. They just annoy me. The allure of the game is a sense of progress from the grind. The treat of having that taken away from some bored 16 year old punk does not make the game interesting...it makes it stupid.

Call me a care bear all you want. The appeal of a game isn't how much of a jerk I can be, nor how vulnerable I am to other jerks.

To quote a brilliant man, Andrew Ryan, "Is a man not entitled to the sweat of his own brow?"

Re:I don't care (1)

toolie (22684) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231767)

You think a penalty that is removed by spending a few coins at the healer is a real death penalty?

Wow.

Re:I don't care (2, Funny)

Impy the Impiuos Imp (442658) | more than 4 years ago | (#29232737)

Champions Online has a 5-star system. You die, you lose all your stars. They start building up the longer you fight and stay alive. The more you have, the more goose your powers get. Something like that.

Anyway, back in the day, we didn't have no steenking slap on the wrist death penalties. No, your character died and you lost three levels of XP and had to go rescue your body within 30 minutes or it vaporized with all your stuff, and you liked it! >:-(

That it was impossible for your now-naked group to fight its way back into the dungeon to the body area was part of the challenge! So you went and got a high level guy to wade in there and /drag your corpses out and hope he didn't /drag 'em deeper to the king's throne room.

And if worse came to worse, your magnificent, tarnished two-hander, the first upgrade from rusty, and looted from a zombie in the desert, was gone. And you liked it!

Re:I don't care (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29234233)

Anyway, back in the day, we didn't have no steenking slap on the wrist death penalties. No, your character died and you lost three levels of XP and had to go rescue your body within 30 minutes or it vaporized with all your stuff, and you liked it! >:-(

Vanguard still has this (well, not quite 3 levels, and you keep soulbound items). It makes death more meaningful. It also means that making an exit when needed is as much a part of your strategy as anything else.

Re:Fileplanet Subscribers Only (1)

Fozzyuw (950608) | more than 4 years ago | (#29232073)

I pre-ordered Aion from Gamestop a while back and they gave you a Beta key. I've been beta-ing in for like a month now. It's not hard to get into this beta.

Since then, I've canceled my pre-order and put the $5 in on the WoW Cataclysm, which was listed with a release date of 11/2010. Which, of course, means nothing but a rough idea of when we might expect the new WoW xpac. It seems about right to me as well... except for the 2 months they'll likely push it back come Oct. 2010. =)

Aion wasn't bad and anyone with enough time on their hands who enjoy fantasy MMO's should give it a look... if they don't mind the GameGuard Rootkit. I already installed the beta when I found out about it, but I canceled the preorder because I won't purchase a game with a ToS that states it's GameGuard can delete files off MY computer if it doesn't like it. Terrible, terrible.

Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29228659)

Do we really need another shallow MMO with pretty graphics? The game looks like yet another Korean-Grind MMORPG. It even looks to follow the "The game begins at level 10", then grind to whatever level specializations come into play.

Re:Who cares? (3, Informative)

Tridus (79566) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229009)

Yeah, pretty much. I wasn't impressed and cancelled my order. Blizzard doesn't have much to worry about here. It gets really good when you get into the forced PvP part. Once people learned that, every single person in my WoW guild who had been interested decided not to bother.

It seems that being ganked isn't exactly a feature people look for in games.

Re:Who cares? (1, Interesting)

dnaumov (453672) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229331)

Yeah, pretty much. I wasn't impressed and cancelled my order. Blizzard doesn't have much to worry about here. It gets really good when you get into the forced PvP part. Once people learned that, every single person in my WoW guild who had been interested decided not to bother.

It seems that being ganked isn't exactly a feature people look for in games.

It does get really good when you get into the forced PvP part, none of that casual carebear blueshield / pveonly server bullshit in this game. I was impressed, kept my Aion preorder and cancelled my WOW subscription. Different strokes for different folks.

Re:Who cares? (1)

Opportunist (166417) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230209)

If that's your thing, more power to you. I'm all for different flavors in games (hell, I know I'd want a game where groups are more than just 'raid only', i.e. where you will start playing with other players instead of against them before you hit levelcap). Just as much as my likes are not really mainstream, so ain't yours, I'm afraid. What's to be seen is if there are enough people like you to keep the game running.

I know I won't be there, sorry. Yeah, call me carebear, but my idea of fun isn't found in the frustration of being permaganked by people who have more time to play than I do and thus reach levelcap so early that there's nothing left for them to do but bash low level chars.

Re:Who cares? (1)

Tridus (79566) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230449)

The whole point of different server types is that you can play on yours, I can play on mine, and we're both happy. That means more customers.

Since Aion wants to force me to endure that bullshit, I'm taking my money elsewhere. The only real way you can oppose such a server split is if your goal is to get people who don't want to be ganked forced into it, so you can gank them.

Re:Who cares? (2, Interesting)

Ogive17 (691899) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231239)

PvE mmorpg servers seem to be missing a huge element of the game. Like most people, I hate getting killed... especially to a much higher level or when I was involved in some other task. But I can't imagine playing an online game with hundreds/thousands of other people without getting to "interact" with them. I'm on a very low pop PvP server.. so low population that there's practically no PvP going on except at meeting stones and of course the battle grounds. It's boring.. I can't remember the last time someone tried to gank me. Part of the thrill is killing someone who got the jump on you.

Sure pvp isn't for everyone, if you want protection travel in small groups. These games aren't designed for solo play.

Re:Who cares? (1)

Impy the Impiuos Imp (442658) | more than 4 years ago | (#29232803)

Forced PvP isn't the only Fail.

> Warriors are masters of close combat. They are about grit,
> power, and sheer strength. They use their great physical
> strength and prowess to pound the enemy and provide cover for allies .

Jesus Christ! Another game where warriors are crap-damage pseudo-controllers instead of, oh, I don't know, an actual warrior.

Re:Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29230615)

"none of that casual carebear blueshield / pveonly server bullshit in this game"

What the hell are you talking about? How do people who don't want to live in fear get in your way? Is it that it bums you out that you can't just run up behind a newbie and burn them down in one shot while laughing about it? Or what? I seriously do not understand.

Re:Who cares? (0, Flamebait)

jimmyfrank (1106681) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230189)

Haha, oh noez, forced PvP. I thought that's why people played these games, wtf is the point of the game if you can't pwn people. Back to raiding for you lol.

Re:Who cares? (1)

Tridus (79566) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230483)

Nope. PvE focused MMOs have always been more popular then PvP focused ones. Ganking is why forum whiners play the game, but that's a minority.

Ganking in particular is never popular for the people on the receieving end. Only instead of bitching about it on Slashdot, they just quit the game entirely and go spend their money on something else.

Re:Who cares? (1)

jimmyfrank (1106681) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231269)

Yeah, most people whine and call it ganking, probably because they've been on the other end of a good beat down and it crushes their ego. 8 man RvR battles that lasted 10-15 mins were the bomb.

Re:Who cares? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29233157)

Nope. PvE focused MMOs have always been more popular then PvP focused ones. Ganking is why forum whiners play the game, but that's a minority.

Wow, you sound like someone who rolled on a PvP server by accident, and got killed while he was trying to gather murlock penises (or whatever it is WoW players do).

You want to fight mobs with brainless 'AI', or do the same raid, the same way, week after week, and consider that an accomplishment? Sounds like a waste of time and money. Fortunately, not everyone thinks like you, and not every game has been dumbed down to the level that Blizzard carebears would prefer.

Honestly, if you can't handle WoW's PvP (which is a complete joke), do yourself a favor and never leave. I can just picture you in L2, or DF, or UO wetting your pants and crying as the mean, mean, 'gankers' (since anyone who could kill you is a 12 year old forum troll who's probably hacking, right? I mean you raid in WoW, you must be a top-tier MMO player) kill you over and over.

Have fun in WoW. Be sure to tell some good chuck norris jokes in your next raid... they're always hilarious!

Re:Who cares? (2, Insightful)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230513)

What's the point of pwning people in MMOs when that usually amounts to "my level is higher than yours, I win"? It's not a demonstration of skill, it's just a demonstration of how long you have played before that battle.

Re:Who cares? (1)

dnaumov (453672) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230845)

What's the point of pwning people in MMOs when that usually amounts to "my level is higher than yours, I win"? It's not a demonstration of skill, it's just a demonstration of how long you have played before that battle.

I am confused. When talking about PvP, why even bring pre-levelcap PvP into the discussion? It's irrelevant.

Re:Who cares? (1)

geminidomino (614729) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231939)

I am confused. When talking about PvP, why even bring pre-levelcap PvP into the discussion? It's irrelevant.

Because pre-levelcap PvP is where ganking happens, which is what the subthread is about.

Re:Who cares? (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 4 years ago | (#29233083)

You don't get to decide "I'm not at the level cap, I don't want to engage in PvP" because it's enough that the other guy decides to attack you.

Re:Who cares? (1)

Snoboo (993873) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230337)

There is basically nothing left of my WoW guild. Just one player is still raiding. Most quit the game because of boredom and quite a few are interested in AION. WoW might not contain a "forced PvP" part, but it contains a "forced raid" part - either raid or you have almost nothing left to do.

Re:Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29232975)

Once people learned that, every single person in my WoW guild who had been interested decided not to bother.

Good. The fewer WoW tourists [wordpress.com], to complain and moan about how it isn't a 100% copy of WoW, the better. That sort of person helped to drag down WAR by badmouthing it incessantly when they realised they would have to (*gasp*) fight other players (!!!)

Aion is a PvP game. Don't go into it thinking that you'll just quest and raid. It sounds like it's not for you -- but that doesn't make it a bad game.

Re:Who cares? (1)

Opportunist (166417) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230183)

I hardly agree with a summary of a game that doesn't even take two lines, but this is pretty apt.

I was in Aion Beta, "won" it as a TR player. To say the least, it was a bit of a letdown. As hacked together as TR was, that game had a better chance to succeed in countries that aren't big into what's commonly refered to as "Asia grinders". TR was one, sorta, but at least it was a little different from the usual "stand there and hit a few buttons" gameplay.

Where's the download for Mac? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29228671)

Where's the download for Mac?

Re:Where's the download for Mac? (2, Informative)

toolie (22684) | more than 4 years ago | (#29233375)

Looks like you'll have to stand in line with the other 5 people wanting the Mac download.

Re:Where's the download for Mac? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29234729)

Why would you assume there is one?

Interjection (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29228673)

I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're referring to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I've recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX.

Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called "Linux", and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project.

There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine's resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called "Linux" distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux.

Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (4, Interesting)

Tei (520358) | more than 4 years ago | (#29228733)

This is a RvR game. To avoid the problems with PoTBS:

Don't join AION, if you can't handle ganking. Ganking in Darkfall could be much more fair than in AION, the "resistences" of a high level may make imposible to kill a players that is a few levels higher than you.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29228745)

With the update to 1.5 ganking on lower level maps becomes increasingly difficult due to enemy race positions being shown on the map for everyone of the opposite race. There are also two separate maps which can carry a player to level 50 which do not allow other races on them (maps have somewhat reduced experience given per mob ~ .5%).

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (1)

blackraven14250 (902843) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229249)

Plus after a certain number of ganks you can't rez in enemy territory at a tiki, then you can't even come back through a portal if you survive that long. They seriously did alot about the ganking problem.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (2, Interesting)

abigsmurf (919188) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229437)

All the talk of ganking really put me off this game. PVP is fine but being constantly oneshotted by people you stand no chance against isn't. Yes you can ask high levels to help go around and kill gankers but they'll take a while to arrive and they're not always available.

I was really looking forward to this until I read impressions from people playing on Korean servers that say ganking is almost out of control and the recent penalties have done little to stop it.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (3, Insightful)

Dr. Eggman (932300) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229581)

I never understood why MMOs didn't implement some sort of PvP honor system that takes into account the difference between levels and awards or takes away from a players honorabilty, like a morality meter in some rpgs. A more honorable character gets certain, small bonuses to a stat like luck or maybe just allows them higher standing with some faction. Ganking is still possible, but a minor deterrent could at least reduce the instances of repeated ganking. Sure, you'd have to track who started a fight to make sure some sort of reverse-ganking doesn't happen, but it can't be that hard.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (2, Insightful)

SpartacusJones (848951) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229821)

Back in the early days of WoW, you could get a dishonorable kill for killing non-combatant NPCs. I'd also like to see the same happen for ganking much lower level characters. It's one thing for an 80 to kill a 70 (which really doesn't have much of a chance either), but for an 80 to kill a 20 and camp the body is really ridiculous. That should be considered dishonorable and the 80 should get some sort of reputation penalty for it.

Blizzard apparently thought otherwise though because they removed the entire concept of a dishonorable kill from the game.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (2, Insightful)

Jim_Maryland (718224) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230425)

for an 80 to kill a 20 and camp the body is really ridiculous.

Completely agree with you on that. I have no problem though with an 80 running through a low area once (example: Mid-Summer Festival quest/achievements) but staying there and repeatedly camping is crazy. Kill the low level once, then move on to whatever you have to do in the area.

That should be considered dishonorable and the 80 should get some sort of reputation penalty for it.

Wouldn't be completely opposed to this, but lets face it, don't most people already have an 80 or know an 80 that can come help them? Even just shouting in the local chat channel will draw other 80s to come solve a problem like this. Unless the reputation is associated with something the level 80 needs, I don't think most would worry about losing a bit (especially if they are already willing to camp someone so much lower than them).

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (2, Informative)

gone9teen (958480) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231499)

The one thing that people do not seem to know about Aion is that you can be ganked but there is 10+ channels to select to quest in. It's an option that quite a few don't know about until you get to near 15+. If you can't find an NPC you need in one channel? You switch channels and hope that it's there. If you are getting ganked in one channel you can switch channels and they would have to figure out which channel you were in to follow and each time you switch it takes time.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (1)

Tridus (79566) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230521)

When you do that, the gankers whine on the forums endlessly about how the game is too "carebear" now, and other such nonsense.

Lots of developers listen to their forum whiners and thus don't want to do anything to stop it. In something like WoW, you can just join a PvE server and the problem basically doesn't exist. Unsurprisingly, the PvE servers are more popular then the PvP ones where ganking does exist (not that the pro-ganking forum whiners would ever want to acknowledge such a thing).

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (1)

dnaumov (453672) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230865)

Unsurprisingly, the PvE servers are more popular then the PvP ones where ganking does exist

Proof or retraction. This claim couldn't be farther from the truth.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29233339)

May seem anecdotal but every time I've logged in and changed realm (because I play multiple realms) and bothered to look at the realm listings, the pvp realms always had much lower traffic/population than the PVE/RP realms.

I also see a lot of posts on forums where people say they're much happier on the pve realms where they can still do arena and battlegrounds for pvp and not get ganked.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (1)

changedx (1338273) | more than 4 years ago | (#29234571)

Using the Warcraftrealms census on level 10-80 characters on US and EU realms:

PVE server population = 3.16 million
PVP server population = 2.21 million

PVE-RP server population = 709k
PVP-RP server population = 256k

http://www.warcraftrealms.com/census.php [warcraftrealms.com]

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230569)

Or maybe just area level caps, if you go into an area that's for lower level characters you get dropped to their level automatically for the duration of your stay.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29230767)

You don't even have to keep track of who started the fight, if the lower level character (as more than five levels down, or gray or whatever the convention is) takes a swing or casts, the honor should be neutral. One shots of n00bs should have a significant demerit, (or chasing him down as he's trying to flee) but spanking a group of lowbies who are harassing you would be just fine.

in my perfect world, at least.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (1)

_Sprocket_ (42527) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231181)

I never understood why MMOs didn't implement some sort of PvP honor system that takes into account the difference between levels and awards or takes away from a players honorabilty, like a morality meter in some rpgs.

This is an old debate WoW. This sort of system is only a deterrent if the losses are harder than the gains. That is, gaining honor is slower than losing honor for attacking a lowbie. And then you'll have griefers gaming the "morality meter" to screw with folks' hard-earned honor points.

As SpartacusJones noted, WoW's honor points system was very different when it was first introduced. Honor wasn't a currency but a sort of meter. Honor was difficult to come by and very quick to lose when you attacked and killed a "civilian" NPC in a town. And nothing would break up a worldpvp raiding party faster than someone accidentally aggroing a civilian - eveyone in the raid lost honor for that kill.

Re:Gameplay beyond level 20: Unfair ganking. (1)

Skuld-Chan (302449) | more than 4 years ago | (#29232009)

WoW used to do this. You'd lose honor for killing low level players and npc's. Not sure why they changed this. WoW these days is - help me if you are around, if not - better switch characters while someone camps your corpse.

Lineage 2 has a system in place to prevent people from killing low level players. You lose karma, and if you lose enough (3-4 dishonorable kills - I forget...) people can take your hard earned epics when you die and guards from cities will attack you.

Sourceforge (-1, Troll)

synthesizerpatel (1210598) | more than 4 years ago | (#29228781)

Remember back when you could actually download things from active projects? It's a god damn easter egg hunt to actually download something these days. You suck sourceforge.

Played the Closed Beta (2, Interesting)

ShakaUVM (157947) | more than 4 years ago | (#29228839)

I played the closed beta. It's not terribly impressive. People have been excited about the graphics, but they're kind of outdated... maybe top of the line stuff for 2004 or so. There are a few impressive areas in the game, though.

Gameplay and questing is not terribly fun. If you've ever done a Kill 30 Wasps or Gather 10 Herbs quest, you've done them all, and AION has a lot of this kind of stuff. I guess there's a story or whatever to read, and IIRC some quests have different options, but by and large I was completely bored while leveling up my character.

While I would like someone to knock WoW off its high horse (because the game really isn't designed as well as they think it is), I doubt AION is going to be it.

Re:Played the Closed Beta (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29229059)

Oh come on, who could get bored with that?

"Only you [and all the players around you] can save our village! Travel to the far-away mystical land of Boringtoss [run along that road for 5 minutes]. Then kill 1,000,000 [identical] Orcish Barbarian Wizards [special attack: sap your will to live]. Gather the Borestone that each of them carries [for no apparent reason]. Bring me back the Borestones and I will give you one gold piece and ten experience points [so if you do this a few hundred times, you'll go up a level, yay]. Now remeber to play for at least 10 hours a day, or your friends will level faster than you, and then you'll be left behind with no friends."

It's almost like these things are part of a conspiracy to make us learn to love our actual real-life jobs

Re:Played the Closed Beta (1)

Opportunist (166417) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230145)

Search YouTube for some old Tabula Rasa (pre 2005) demos and be surprised how much alike it looks. I'm almost tempted to say they recycled some of the old graphic they didn't use for TR to make Aion now.

Re:Played the Closed Beta (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29230165)

I guess there's a story or whatever to read, and IIRC some quests have different options, but by and large I was completely bored while leveling up my character.

Bwuh?

Is it just me, or are you saying "I randomly clicked buttons until I got quests and leveled up, and it was really boring"?

Guess what else is boring if you skip all the text? Just about every single RPG ever.

Re:Played the Closed Beta (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29233621)

People have been excited about the graphics, but they're kind of outdated... maybe top of the line stuff for 2004 or so.

Really? So Aion is just on par with EverQuest 2? City of Heroes and WoW were also released in 2004, is it only marginally better than those?

Maybe try playing with something better than EGA. Aion has amazing graphics and a beautiful game world... no serious reviewer has complained about those, so something tells me you're just a troll.

$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (1)

rodrigoandrade (713371) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229205)

Really, I was really excited about Aion, but all that excitement vanished once I learnt from the official web site the game cost $50 PLUS monthly fees. Sorry, nowadays I just don't spend that much time gaming to justify paying monthly fees, no matter how awesome the game is (otherwise I'd be another WoW addict).

The sad part is that NCSoft will likely abandon the incredible F2P Atlantica Online in favor of Aion.

Back to Perfect World, I guess, the best MMORPG I've ever played, period.

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29229871)

The sad part is that NCSoft will likely abandon the incredible F2P Atlantica Online in favor of Aion.

Altantica Online is from NDOORS, not NCSoft. I guess all Asian companies look alike to you, you racist.

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (1)

Ultra64 (318705) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229961)

"Back to Perfect World, I guess, the best MMORPG I've ever played, period."

That's not really saying much if you are excluding all the pay for play games.

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (2, Interesting)

Yosho (135835) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230079)

Really, I was really excited about Aion, but all that excitement vanished once I learnt from the official web site the game cost $50 PLUS monthly fees. Sorry, nowadays I just don't spend that much time gaming to justify paying monthly fees, no matter how awesome the game is (otherwise I'd be another WoW addict).

If you look at it in terms of entertainment per hour per dollar spent, MMORPGs are actually quite cheap. Let's say you play WoW quite casually -- you occasionally hop on for just a little bit during the weekdays and then put in a few solid hours on the weekend. Maybe 5 hours per week, total. The Battle Chest (original + BC expansion) will cost you $40, then $13 per month. You don't need the WotLK expansion right away; if you're only playing a few hours a week, the original + BC will last you for quite a while. After six months, that'll be a total of about $118 for 120 hours of entertainment, so less than a dollar per hour.

Compare that to going to see a movie, where you can expect to spend $8 - $10 for maybe an hour and a half or two hours of entertainment. Also compare it to buying non-online games, where a new game will cost you maybe $50 and last for maybe 20 hours (it varies, of course, since different games have wildly different lengths -- that's a rough estimate). You could also compare it to spending an evening barhopping, and going anywhere good will cost you way more per hour than that...

So, MMORPGs with a monthly fee are really a pretty cheap form of entertainment compared to many alternatives. The best part, though, is that the presence of a monthly fee keeps away kids who can't convince their parents to pay for their subscriptions! It doesn't keep all the kids away, of course, but it definitely makes a difference. Heck, I'd be willing to pay $20 a month for a WoW-quality game that only allowed you to play if you were over 21 and had a full-time job...

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230623)

You make the assumption that the hours in an MMO are entertaining.

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (2, Insightful)

Yosho (135835) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231113)

If you don't consider MMOs entertaining, why would you even want to play a free one?

Heck, why would you have clicked on this article?

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 4 years ago | (#29232707)

MMOs apparently start out entertaining for many before turning into more of an obsession than entertainment. I can't really speak for them because I get bored pretty quickly. No idea if an MMO could be designed in a way that would make me care but I do believe so.

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (4, Informative)

space_jake (687452) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230683)

If you want a mature-ish WoW experience. Join a mature guild and turn off all of the public channels.

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (1)

Draek (916851) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231191)

If you look at it in terms of entertainment per hour per dollar spent, MMORPGs are actually quite cheap.

But still nowhere as cheap as offline gaming, online FPSs, or free online RPGs.

The best part, though, is that the presence of a monthly fee keeps away kids who can't convince their parents to pay for their subscriptions! It doesn't keep all the kids away, of course, but it definitely makes a difference.

Does it? all I've seen about WoW suggests that the community is filled with stat-whores who won't give you the time of the day if you can't do $X of DPS and have at least an $Y level armor, and that a 'casual' gamer has no chance of *ever* finding a good party (defining 'good' as 'can speak proper english and is willing to help newbies with their shortcomings instead of writing "gtfo nub"') withotu joining a mature, respectable guild. In other words, exactly the same as most free MMOs.

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29235205)

But still nowhere as cheap as offline gaming, online FPSs

Only if those are free -- as the previous poster pointed out, in fact, your typical offline games will end up costing you more than a monthly MMORPG.

or free online RPGs

Well no shit. Thanks for letting us know, Captain Obvious. You've really added a lot to this discussion.

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (1)

Tensor (102132) | more than 4 years ago | (#29232013)

<quote>Heck, I'd be willing to pay $20 a month for a WoW-quality game that only allowed you to play if you were over 21 and had a full-time job...</quote>

That would be awesome... an adult-filled MMORPG (not necesarily adult-themed) ... where you play with people that have a life and can't be 20hrs a day online leveling... and can actually type a full sentence.

Sweet...

Re:$50 + Pay 2 Play = No thanks! (1)

illumin8 (148082) | more than 4 years ago | (#29233251)

The sad part is that NCSoft will likely abandon the incredible F2P Atlantica Online in favor of Aion.

You're wrong. NCSoft doesn't have anything to do with Atlantica Online. Atlantica Online is run by a company called Ndoors [ndoors.com].

School! (1)

AtomG (1501811) | more than 4 years ago | (#29229899)

Just in time for school! Looks like another year mediocre performance for me!

Re:School! (1)

leonardofelin (1211778) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231005)

Don't worry. Games aren't addictive. I play games since I was 12 (31 now) and NEVER got addicted.

Re:School! (1)

An ominous Cow art (320322) | more than 4 years ago | (#29234343)

Don't worry. Games aren't addictive. I play games since I was 12 (31 now) and NEVER got addicted.

I hope you've taken the occasional break to sleep, eat, etc.? :-)

Answer to competitor's launch ? (1)

Atreide (16473) | more than 4 years ago | (#29230973)

At the same time (the 5th I believe) Cryptic Studio is expected to launch Champions Online.
That MMO is a competitor to NCSoft City of Heroes.

By the way Cryptic developped and delivered City of Heroes to NCSoft a few years ago, then sold it to NCSoft.
Then Cryptic went on Champions.

Is it intriguing that NCSoft starts its new MMO at same time as Champions the competitor of its product CoH ?

If this is just calculated, then it may proove Aion is too young and not complete at launch time.

Re:Answer to competitor's launch ? (1)

toolie (22684) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231983)

If this is just calculated, then it may proove Aion is too young and not complete at launch time.

You are aware that Aion has been released for almost a year in Asian markets and that the West version is starting at 1.5, right?

Meh, Ill pass... (1)

Kaldor (1382363) | more than 4 years ago | (#29231389)

Played the beta.... Another Korean grindfest MMO. NC Soft's track record is not that great. Their greatest achievements: CoH/V and Guildwars. Decent, but not great. Too many fails to mention. Go look at Wikipedia for a full list. Alot of people claim it has the best graphics of any MMO. AoC had great/best graphics of any MMO Ive seen, but was fail overall. Flying in PvP is lame. Adds another dimension for people to abuse as I can guarantee there are going to be bugs. Those that played DAOC can remember all the bugs water brought on in NF. Ganking lowbies is retarded. Only hastens the death of a server and game even if they are penalized. Leveling that is basically get 20 of object X and bring it to NPC Y to level, and then rinse and repeat that 500 time, equals grind. No MMO is perfect. Christ I beta tested "The Realm" way back in the day. Ive played almost every pay to play every major MMO out there from UO, EQ, DAOC, WoW, Lotro, AoC, And WAR. Im currently playing WAR, but will be quitting when my sub is up. Ive seen Aion, its not for me. I downloaded and reinstalled DAOC last night and am waiting for the new super cluster server to be created. Time to get back to the land of where casters are dangerous but killable and tanks get respect.

Spellcheck, anyone? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29231685)

When is Semptember?

Spellcheck isn't that hard to do.

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