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Sony and Nintendo Step Up Anti-Piracy Efforts

Soulskill posted more than 4 years ago | from the escalating-arms-race dept.

Nintendo 147

Edge reports that Sony and Nintendo are both expanding their anti-piracy operations in an effort to reduce piracy rates on the PSP and the DS respectively. Nintendo has hired Neil Boyd, who handled anti-piracy operations for Warner Brothers, to help them demonstrate their "willingness to take action against criminals who are making money out of the infringement of games developers' copyright." Sony has taken a more direct approach, choosing to alter the hardware used in the PSP Go so that things like the Pandora battery can no longer be used to alter the firmware.

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147 comments

Strategy? (1)

Starcom8826 (888459) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270593)

What, Warner Bros. anti-piracy strategy? Suing people?

Re:Strategy? (1)

Fluffeh (1273756) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270739)

What, Warner Bros. anti-piracy strategy? Suing people?

Warner Bros. anti-piracy strategy is suing people. What?

There, fixed it for you.

Re:Strategy? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29271165)

Warner Bros. anti-piracy strategy is suing people. What?

Found out that Warner Bros. anti-piracy strategy is... *wears sunglasses* eating kittens. YEEEAAHHHH!!!

There, all true..

This is fantastic! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29270929)

Just goes to show that using Linux helps prevent piracy. Go F/OSS!

Re:This is fantastic! (0, Flamebait)

iYk6 (1425255) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271041)

Just goes to show that using Linux helps prevent piracy. Go F/OSS!

Actually, the definition of piracy used in the summary is: installing a free, flexible OS onto a computer device. So, installing Linux is now piracy.

Dreamcast hijack thread (1)

Kagura (843695) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273273)

Ahh, the days of Dreamcast. I recently purchased Shenmue 2 EURO for DC. I just have to locate a Dreamcast that can accept boot discs. They removed CD-R readability in later models to combat piracy, but it was far too late.

Dreamcast was a really good system. It was almost same generation as PS2.

And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (4, Informative)

marcansoft (727665) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270601)

No, really. The've shown that they believe that Wii homebrew == Wii piracy (having attacked generic homebrew almost exclusively, not just piracy tools, and considering that they harassed us when we attempted to notify them of a security issue), and yet it's been over 5 months since the latest security-related update. Somehow I don't get the felling that Nintendo is interested in combating Wii piracy very much (it's not like they've done a whole lot to stop modchips either).

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29270663)

Nice Thought.

Hazel Knight
Toronto Drywall Company [youtube.com]

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29270743)

Toronto Drywall Company [youtube.com]

Is this the new rickroll?

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29271839)

Yeah. Here's the original source [youtube.com] of the music and footage in that video.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29270701)

That's because they make so much money on selling systems and accessories. DS profits are primarily software related.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

xtracto (837672) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272483)

That's because they make so much money on selling systems and accessories. DS profits are primarily software related.

Nintendo profits from that, but 3rd party developers profit only from the number of games sold.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

kawabago (551139) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270937)

Why don't they open source the game software and sell subscriptions to the server. That way the more the game is shared the more people will buy subscriptions to the server. Also they can offload development costs partly onto the community. It's a win win situation. The more 'piracy' the better. Oh, too simple. Sorry.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29271101)

It's even simpler now - they take a cut from any game sold on PSN and there is no subscription, this way the more game is sold the more money they get and as for the development - they don't offload its cost partly, they offload it fully.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

Kalriath (849904) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271113)

Sounds very Apple-y

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29271509)

I doubt open source games will work. Why? Have a look at custom maps in Warcraft 3, the normal maps created from the editor and saved from the editor can usually be edited by anyone. That is, someone makes a map they upload it and the person who downloads it can edit the map. This resulted in people modifying the map and making silly changes, such as over powered items etc. Even worse is when people upload these maps without changing the title or description, thus confusing everyone that they are playing the same map even though it has been modified. The problem got so bad that the community had to create tools that made it impossible to edit these maps. The same will happen to open source games. You will have people modifying the games to be easier or just plane silly (like adding in a gun that will kill everyone in one shot).

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

Veyasu (1505999) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271601)

While I do agree that in WC3 this is a problem with some maps (Footman Frenzy). But others like Dota doesn't seem to have this problem at all. But. Opening a WC3 map in the stock editor is quite a bit different than downloading the source, required tools and everything needed to compile a game, editing the source to add a "hack", compiling it, and then getting people to download that bogus version of the game. So your point is moot.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

MrSands (1605441) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273649)

Dota doesn't have that problem because DoTA is protected by the tools that the parent has mentioned. Try opening a DoTA map and see if you can edit it, you can't. And I also disagree, the tools for compiling open source applications tend to also be open source (gcc). A script kiddie with basic knowledge of the programming language use can easily modify the game to include hacked weapons, distribute the game via a torrent, rapidshare, megaupload or other file sharing program. It will be a nightmare.

Not another $60/mo phone bill (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271681)

Why don't they open source the game software and sell subscriptions to the server.

Because then every player would have to buy a $1,440 two-year subscription to mobile Internet access. Not everybody wants another $60/mo phone bill.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (2, Interesting)

tepples (727027) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271749)

I understand "piracy" to refer to infringement of a copyright, patent, or trademark. So:

The've shown that they believe that Wii homebrew == Wii piracy (having attacked generic homebrew almost exclusively, not just piracy tools, and considering that they harassed us when we attempted to notify them of a security issue)

I seem to remember using Google to search for the phrase "homebrew is piracy" and ending up on a page that argues that Nintendo holds one or more patents on the DS Game Card protocol. If this is true, then homebrew devices infringe patents.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (3, Insightful)

marcansoft (727665) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273149)

"Piracy" is copyright infringement only to most people.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29273811)

That's ELSPA's tack in the UK, according to a letter sent by an ELSPA representative to trade magazine MCV.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (4, Insightful)

ookaze (227977) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272133)

No, really. The've shown that they believe that Wii homebrew == Wii piracy (having attacked generic homebrew almost exclusively, not just piracy tools, and considering that they harassed us when we attempted to notify them of a security issue), and yet it's been over 5 months since the latest security-related update. Somehow I don't get the felling that Nintendo is interested in combating Wii piracy very much (it's not like they've done a whole lot to stop modchips either).

So somewhat, you not getting the feeling that Nintendo is interested in combating piracy equates to "They've given up on Wii piracy"? Seriously?
Looks like complete BS to me.
The fact is that the only thing separating the homebrew tools from piracy tools is what the user deem moral or not. The exact same tools used for homebrew are used for piracy.

I use the homebrew tools, and really, if it wasn't for the fact that my play time on a game is not registered in the Wii when I use them, I would always use the homebrew tools to play my games, that I have all ripped, just in case. And you can see how tiny of an argument I have already to not use these tools (but they're still installed).
Once someone starts continuously using the homebrew tools, all hell breaks loose, as they will be more and more tempted to download some games "just to see".
The sole thing preventing me from downloading some games and then play them on the Wii is in my head. If I didn't have enough money or if I played lots of games all the time, I guarantee I would have downloaded lots of games already.

So to me it's no wonder that for Nintendo, Wii homebrew == Wii piracy because that's exactly what it is. You can't scan people's heads to make a difference between pirates and legitimate homebrew users. And I'm sure there are far more pirates than homebrew users.
If Nintendo didn't put region lock in their console, I wouldn't even have considered homebrew. This is one of their mistake. That's the sole thing that pushed me to install homebrew.

Then again, modchipping your console is on another level entirely, and so I understand that they don't get out of their way to stop these people, because the return on investment is far too ridiculous.

Even installing homebrew is not for the faint of heart, and most people don't even understand how all of that work and don't care. I'm even sure that most people installing homebrew on their console don't understand at all what they're doing, which is evidenced by all the video tutorials I've seen people made just to install homebrew.

All of this is far more difficult than buying a flash card for the Nintendo DS.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (2, Insightful)

xtracto (837672) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272529)

The fact is that the only thing separating the homebrew tools from piracy tools is what the user deem moral or not. The exact same tools used for homebrew are used for piracy.

Nope, at least not in the case of the Wii. The main homebrew community has been very cautious (and clear) on separating the war3z-related homebrew from the "original" stuff. For the later you can check wiibrew.org you will find a lot of legitimate homebrew applications and games that do not empower copyright infringement (I agree that emulators are a gray area, specially in the light of the VC)

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (0)

tepples (727027) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273097)

For the later you can check wiibrew.org you will find a lot of legitimate homebrew applications and games that do not empower copyright infringement

Copyright no, trademark yes. There's a falling block game on the Homebrew Browser whose banner uses The Tetris Company's logo without authorization. (Even my own falling block game for FCE Ultra GX [lj65.org] takes care not to use any Tetris trademarks.) To whom should I report this before Tetris does?

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

marcansoft (727665) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273167)

The author would be a good idea. Or just use the talk page on the wiki.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273417)

thats interesting but not really piracy, as you have previously stated you have pretty weird views on what piracy is, to the rest of us its simple:
are you playing wii games, that you did not purchase legitimatly?

patent (if they're even valid) and trademark (if your not passing it of as the original who cares) abuse don't count as piracy, they count as *shock* patent/trademark abuse.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273569)

thats interesting but not really piracy, as you have previously stated you have pretty weird views on what piracy is, to the rest of us its simple:
are you playing wii games, that you did not purchase legitimatly?

I am typing this into a web browser that I did not purchase legitimately. That's because Mozilla Firefox is free software.

patent (if they're even valid)

Tetris is 25 years old; no patent there.

and trademark (if your not passing it of as the original who cares) abuse

Just calling it "Tetris" might be borderline genericide (cf. Xerox copiers and Kleenex tissue), but using the logo points toward abuse.

don't count as piracy, they count as *shock* patent/trademark abuse.

Google turns up thousands of results for the phrase "drug piracy". How would one explain that if the term "piracy" is limited to copyright?

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

geminidomino (614729) | more than 4 years ago | (#29274177)

Google turns up thousands of results for the phrase "drug piracy". How would one explain that if the term "piracy" is limited to copyright?

Because the term "piracy" is not, as GP claimed, limited to copyright. It is, actually, not limited to anything. It's an emotive rhetorical device used to vilify whoever a big megacorp wants vilified, be it copyright infringers or rival pharmaceutical companies.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (2, Interesting)

tepples (727027) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273183)

So to me it's no wonder that for Nintendo, Wii homebrew == Wii piracy because that's exactly what it is.

Nintendo states on warioworld.com that it categorically declines to deal with students, hobbyists, and microISVs: one needs a dedicated office and a track record of published titles. So for which platform should students and hobbyists be building a portfolio to start a company? Most PC monitors are just too small for four people.

Even installing homebrew is not for the faint of heart

Bannerbombing a Wii into the Homebrew Channel installer involves loading files onto an SD card, putting it in the front of your console, and going into the Wii settings. And you probably already "voided the warranty" by owning your console for 13 months.

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273343)

> So for which platform should students and hobbyists be building a portfolio to start a company? Most PC monitors are just too small for four people.

Use the DVI/HDMI port that comes with many PCs now and plug the PC into the TV.

Use many of the Linux/Windows hacks to enable WiiMote access on the PC.

The untrained and the unwary might mistake my mini for my wii.

CRT SDTVs don't have HDMI (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273655)

Use the DVI/HDMI port that comes with many PCs now and plug the PC into the TV.

CRT SDTVs already in homes have no DVI/HDMI input. Should I just point anyone who wants to buy my game to SewellDirect.com, which sells VGA to composite adapters?

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (5, Informative)

psm321 (450181) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273631)

Nintendo states on warioworld.com that it categorically declines to deal with students, hobbyists, and microISVs: one needs a dedicated office and a track record of published titles. So for which platform should students and hobbyists be building a portfolio to start a company? Most PC monitors are just too small for four people.

Xbox 360. Seriously, I don't really like Microsoft, and I don't really like xbox (or playstation for that matter) games in general (i tend to like more playful games, http://www.ukresistance.co.uk/2005/11/blue-sky-in-games-campaign-launched.html [ukresistance.co.uk] )

But, one thing Microsoft is good about with the 360/xbox live is allowing independent content (or at least so I hear). I've seen other people trying out games from the market with lots of interesting gameplay concepts that you would probably not see in a mainstream game

Re:And yet they've given up on Wii piracy (1)

marcansoft (727665) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273299)

The fact is that the only thing separating the homebrew tools from piracy tools is what the user deem moral or not. The exact same tools used for homebrew are used for piracy.

Ha ha no. A homebrew tool is one that takes an executable file and runs it. A piracy tool is an executable file that fucks up half of your system, has a 50% chance of bricking it, then plays pirated disc games or installs pirated VC games. Piracy apps are specific, considerably sleazier, lower quality, and more dangerous than most homebrew. They also tend to violate software licenses left and right. Not to mention that one of the main guys behind them has a habit of ripping off other people's work and releasing it as his own, adding his sponsor's banners and making a profit.

Tools to play copied games aren't "homebrew tools", they're piracy tools. You're confusing "backups" with homebrew. "Backup" tools were developed for and by pirates, and the "backup" argument is a thin screen that they hide behind. I'd say less than 1% of their users truly use the tools for only backing up games. VC piracy utilities have a 0% legitimate use rate, since VC games can already be backed up to an SD card using Nintendo's system menu.

As for modchips, consider this: they are hugely popular and there is a huge industry behind them (they are more popular than softmods), and yet all of them are trivially detectable by software. All Nintendo could do is push out a software update and instantly break every single modchip out there, causing mayhem among the piracy community. One little update. And yet they haven't done so.

Oh please nintendo don't do it! (0)

Thantik (1207112) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270625)

Most of the people who pirate aren't going to buy your stuff anyways, and even if your successful at stopping them (which never lasts very long), you end up looking like an ass to your legitimate customers. Piracy on DS/PSP is probably AMAZINGLY low due to the fact that most of the time you end up having to either go to some mouth-breather import store and spend TONS of cash, or order from a store online and while spending relatively little money, are probably risking having your credit card info stolen.

Please Nintendo...I hate your games but I still cheer for you on the sidelines. Don't make me hate you like I already hate Sony and Microsoft.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29270653)

How is $30 for an r4ds flash cart for my dsi TONS of cash? Thats less than the price of one new game, plus i can keep "backups" of all my games on one card. Cheaper and more convenient, not a tough decision for me.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29270773)

How is $30 for an r4ds flash cart for my dsi TONS of cash?

$30? That's too expensive. You should visit this store [dealextreme.com] *free shipping*

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

geminidomino (614729) | more than 4 years ago | (#29274271)

While I like dealextreme and order from them often, you should point out that said orders with free shipping generally take 4-5 weeks to arrive.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (5, Interesting)

omgarthas (1372603) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270691)

I know like 7 or 8 people (friends, friends of friends, etc) with the Nintendo DS and NONE, I repeat, NONE of them, has a single original game. Why so? Because using downloaded games for NDS is ridiculous easy, that even the girls who don't even know to burn a CD, know copy&paste, and that's pretty much it to play "pirated" games on the NDS...

ps: Here, NDS flash cartridges are even sold at the groceries...

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

Korbeau (913903) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270995)

I know like 7 or 8 people [...] NONE of them, has a single original game. Why so?

Because they come ask you when a new title comes out if you couldn't by any chance put your hands on it? ;)

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

daid303 (843777) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271379)

No they don't. My little brother also has a flash card, he got it himself, he found out how to use it himself. And he is not that handy with computers, he only uses a computer for email, msn and myspace. And when myspace people are pirating games then you better start doing something about it.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

CronoCloud (590650) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271181)

Where is here? Eastern Europe? Southeast Asia? South America?

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

Spad (470073) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271565)

England - hell, I got myself one just so that I can avoid having to carry lots of carts around with me when I go on holiday.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29272765)

I agree with you, the average American is not able to do that, that's why piracy is lower in the US.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

Siener (139990) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271513)

From where I stand it seems that the DS is so insanely popular (almost 110 million units sold to date) exactly because its games are so easy to pirate, not in spite of it.

Its not like the games aren't selling either - close to 450 million DS games sold so far

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

DJProtoss (589443) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272159)

Which makes a lifetime (to date) attach rate of what, just over 4? That is not that much, really.

Attach rates (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273211)

Which makes a lifetime (to date) attach rate of what, just over 4? That is not that much, really.

Nintendo makes a profit on the lowest of attach rates, which is why you haven't seen Nintendo react quite as quickly in updating the DS and Wii lockout as Sony has in updating the PSP lockout.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (5, Interesting)

dunezone (899268) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272273)

I wont say this will kill the DS but, when the Dreamcast was around and after a few people figured out how to run debug mode the Dreamcast began its down fall. It was so easy to pirate a game, all you needed was the Dreamcast boot disk which was found everywhere online, and a BIN file for the game which could be downloaded easily, the worst part was if you were on dial-up or not cause this was 1999/2000 and broadband wasn't readily available.

Hell, eventually they managed to make all pirated game self-loading and because the Dreamcast used a proprietary disk format that could hold more then 750mb, some people managed to remove content from the game to fit it on a regular CD. Thus making the GD-Rom's piracy measure of going past the 750mb useless.

I read a post-mortem article from one of the leads at SEGA after support was dropped. They took a gamble with the Dreamcast and knew they had to reach a certain number of units sold both in games and in systems to be able to compete with the Playstation 2. They never officially blamed piracy but they said it definitely hurt them, especially in the last six months before the PS2 arrived.

In my opinion the arrival of the PS2 didn't kill the Dreamcast, piracy did.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29273297)

How come the arrival of super-easy piracy for the PS2 (Available shortly after V2 arrived on the market, so a matter of months) didn't kill it?

Or the fact that pirating a game for the XBOX (also available mere months after XBOX's existence in the market) meant faster load times and easier game selection?

And how come the Gamecube lagged behind both, despite that "quality" piracy wasn't available until several years after its launch?

Or the PS3 lagging behind, despite no widespread piracy? Or the XBOX 360 surpassing it despite simple-as-a-flash piracy? Or the Wii also surpassing it with also rather simple pirate mods?

Your argument is backwards. Pirateable consoles have always been the winners. Look at the NES, they didn't just make 1,000,000-in-1 carts and do away with the lockout chip, they pirated the ENTIRE SYSTEM!

Dreamcast died because of a lack of marketing and availability. I never even saw one in my entire life, and I own almost all consoles from most all generations. It's the 3D0 of the modern world.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273371)

pppffffttt

Total BS. The downfall of the Dreamcast happened before the unit even shipped.
All of the big studios decided that they weren't going to bother supporting it.
THAT killed the Dreamcast. Whether or not it had easy to use pirating tools
really didn't have anything to do with it.

People with big money to spend didn't want to waste their effort on any more
platforms than they absolutely had to. So Dreamcast got the short end of the
stick as it was seen as an "also ran".

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

gbarules2999 (1440265) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273689)

Bullshit. Look at any video game console - they can be cracked as easily as the Dreamcast ever was. These markets are slowing down gradually, yes, but so is everyone else right now. Piracy is far from the reason for anything's "death."

The Dreamcast died because developers stopped developing for it. Easy as pie.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29272451)

I know like 7 or 8 people (friends, friends of friends, etc) with the Nintendo DS and NONE, I repeat, NONE of them, has a single original game. Why so?

http://www.romulation.net/NDS/ [romulation.net]

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29273063)

I know like 7 or 8 people (friends, friends of friends, etc) with the Nintendo DS and NONE, I repeat, NONE of them, has a single pirated game. Why so? Because buying games for NDS is ridiculous easy, that even the girls who don't even know to burn a CD, know open case insert card in DS, and that's pretty much it to play "original" games on the NDS...

ps: Here, NDS games are even sold at the groceries...

U c wut eye did thar? Seriously, NDS games are cheap ($30 for any non-Squenix game, $5-$10 more for Squenix if you really want them), just go buy them. A good chunk of them are more original then the $60 sequelfests that are on the consoles and are way better in my eyes. I bought my DS the summer after it came out and I own more games for that then my PC or any of my consoles. Why? Cause they're GOOD GAMES. People complain about not having any originality or depth or non-sequels on their consoles and the DS delivers on this and you go and pirate them? I really don't understand you people. I'm sure you'll come back and say something about "No sequels? LOLS lok at ter Pokarmans!" Oh boy! You found one series! I'm glad you know so much about the NDS.

Oh and, yes, even though I just flipped your sentence to look ZOMGTEHAWEZOMZORS, it's entirely true. I've maybe met one person who owns a pirated game. The rest of us know when to give money to good developers.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

RiotingPacifist (1228016) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273665)

I'm not a fan of videogame/software piracy because there are good legitimate alternatives (and no MAFIAA), however my brother and his friends justify it because ds/wii games are not full games ( there are some and to be far to him he has a fair few of them). While he doesn't mind paying £30-£40 for a full xbox360 game, he finds paying £30 for a collection of minigames is too much. pc game piracy is pretty easy too but i believe that the pricing on a ds games is what makes many turn to the dark side.

I disagree with him as imo, if you don't want to pay £30 for a collection of minigames, you should just go on flash websites and not splash out on a DS in the first place.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270817)

They said something about people who make money off pirated games, don't seem very interested in going after P2P and stuff like that.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (2, Insightful)

Toonol (1057698) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271471)

I think piracy on the consoles... the Wii and 360... is pretty much negligible. I'd be shocked if it hurt total software sales by 1%.

However, it's MUCH worse on the handhelds. A flash cart for the DS is something like $7, if you look in the right places (Cough*dealextreme*cough)... and games are generally well under 100 mb, so they're quick and easy to download.

And the PSP... cripes, I don't think ANYBODY uses it like Sony intended. I don't blame or begrudge Nintendo or Sony for tightening them down, so long as they don't adopt strategies that interfere with legitimate purchasers.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (4, Informative)

EdIII (1114411) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271651)

so long as they don't adopt strategies that interfere with legitimate purchasers.

It's far more likely that Superman and Wonder Woman will actually become real, eliminate the Taliban, deliver Osama Bin Laden to the White House steps, and then top it off with a Sex Tape. Ohhh, and the Wonder Twins get caught doing each other in Central Park.

NONE of the console manufacturers have even a measurable amount of respect for Fair Use. NONE. As far as they are concerned, they own the hardware 100% and should be able to 100% control every single one of your actions with their product as if they are in the room holding your hand. That game you bought gets a little too scratched? That cart get dropped in the pool? Well FUCK YOU. Buy another.

I feel you about what they are going through. It's just wishful thinking they are going to try to find a middle ground. They are just as extreme and inflexible as hard core pirates who will never compensate anyone for any intellectual property whatsoever.

It might as well be religious fundamentalism. Your reasonable position has no place here.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271691)

NONE of the console manufacturers have even a measurable amount of respect for Fair Use. NONE.

OpenPandora does. Its Linux-based gaming PDA isn't out yet, but there is video evidence that it's much farther along than the Phantom ever got. And I have a couple more arguments that depend on where one draws the difference between a gaming PC and a console.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29272245)

If they don't even have a console out, then they can hardly be considered a console manufacturer, let alone one with respect to fair use.

In all honesty, I suspect that Pandora will be vapourware.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29274367)

While the production version of the device isn't out yet, according to their web page the development versions were produced and have been sold to end users, which would make it non-vaporware, by definition.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (2, Insightful)

ookaze (227977) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272207)

NONE of the console manufacturers have even a measurable amount of respect for Fair Use. NONE. As far as they are concerned, they own the hardware 100% and should be able to 100% control every single one of your actions with their product as if they are in the room holding your hand. That game you bought gets a little too scratched? That cart get dropped in the pool? Well FUCK YOU. Buy another.

I see what you try to do, but your argument is stupid and wrong anyway.
If what you said was true, they would never allow you to download games you buy online as many times as you want. Erased that online game because you need place on your Wii? You can download it back as many times as you want.
The sole reason that they don't allow that on physical properties is because they fear you would get several legitimate copies when you actually paid for one.
Did you even try getting a new copy? Usually, a cart dropped in the pool will still work once dried up. And usually you can phone them and arrange for you to get back a new copy if you send the malfunctioning copy back to them.
Perhaps not in every country, I don't know.

It's just wishful thinking they are going to try to find a middle ground. They are just as extreme and inflexible as hard core pirates who will never compensate anyone for any intellectual property whatsoever.

It might as well be religious fundamentalism. Your reasonable position has no place here.

You just come off to me as someone trying to put them on the same level as hardcore pirates, thus deeming them unworthy of not being pirated. That's just a straw man to me.

Re:Oh please nintendo don't do it! (1)

Jaysyn (203771) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273753)

I bought my PSP used & bought nearly all of the 20 or so games I own used as well. I think I know the real reason that Sony wants to get rid of the UMD on the PSP Go

GOD DAMN RUSSIANS RUIN IT FOR THE REST OF US !! (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29270641)

Fuckwad pirate scum !!! Pirate and supoprt terrorists !! Out back with all of them. Bullets are too good. Just fucking cut off their heads !!

Re:GOD DAMN RUSSIANS RUIN IT FOR THE REST OF US !! (0, Offtopic)

jaxtherat (1165473) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270769)

In Soviet New Zealand, Caps Lock fires you!

Totally Retarded (3, Interesting)

EdIII (1114411) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270771)

in every way.......

Sony produced the PSP Go for a very specific market, whether they understood it or not. People buying that are not interested in stupid fucking "snackables". Dear God, they make it sound like something a 2nd grader would eat at lunch.

The PSP Go is for people that *already* understand how to take existing UMD's in their collection and convert them and play them on the PSP. The attraction of the Go model is more memory, less power consumption (UMDless), and a smaller form factor, and possibly longer battery life.

Their attempt to cripple the unit so that you cannot play UMD backups, while being blatantly offensive towards supporters of Fair Use, just totally destroyed their *real* market for the product.

I am actually interested in the PSP Go. ONLY IF I CAN PLAY MY UMD BACKUPS. If not, then STFU Sony and you don't get my money.

Total Morons.

P.S - Yes... it can be used for pirated ISOs as well as Fair Use ISOs, but that does not make my point any less valid about their market does it?

Re:Totally Retarded (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29271063)

Really? Sony makes and markets a product for people stealing their games? Oh I forgot, it's not stealing so you must be right.

Re:Totally Retarded (4, Insightful)

EdIII (1114411) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271613)

Oh I forgot, it's not stealing so you must be right.

You did forget. It is not stealing, either way.

If I make a backup copy of a UMD game I purchased, it can never be anything remotely resembling theft. That falls under Fair Use which is not some bullshit argument that "pirates" throw up like a shield. Fair Use is my right, as in, legal entitlement. Of course, Fair Use is really just a legal test for copyright infringement, but the whole point is that I am just protecting rights that I already obtained by financially compensating the copyright holder in return for rights granted to the content.

No copyright holder should ever be able to claim that I don't have the rights to make copy after copy in my home so that I can enjoy their works forever (my lifetime, and those of my heirs that will inherit those rights). The very concept that I should be limited is offensive, bullshit, immoral, and legally retarded.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with making and playing a UMD backup.

Now, as for actually "pirating" the UMD's, that is not theft either. I'm sorry, that so many people out there just cannot get their minds around that. It is not about right and wrong. Promoting those arguments is not supporting piracy either. It is a simple fact that "piracy" is copyright infringement, and that is a matter for civil courts. That is the way it was set up, and it is the way it should be, and that is the way it is now. The act of theft must involve something physical. You cannot steal intellectual property. Not unless, you alter the very fabric of the Universe itself and somehow make the color Purple taste like an Orange. Intellectual Property is a TEMPORARY legal entitlement granted to you by the "State". It is not tangible. How on Earth could I steal that? I can't because it is impossible. The only thing I can do is to perform the act of infringement upon the rights granted to you the State. Nothing more, Nothing less. That does not require the Gestapo busting down doors as if these people are raping children.

Once again, none of those argument means that I support so-called "Piracy". I have stated before, and I will state again, I support compensating the artists, developers, etc. that make the games I enjoy. I own over 40 UMD titles, and ALL of them are neatly kept in their packages on a book-shelf having only been placed in a PSP a single time. I exclusively play my PSP titles via a PSP with a custom operating system and 8 gig memory stick holding the ISO images.

Really? Sony makes and markets a product for people stealing their games?

Yes, really. Absolutely. I said, "whether they knew it or not". "Snackables" is the biggest bullshit I have ever seen. First time customers looking at the PSP Go will realize rather quickly that ALL of the UMD titles at Wall-Mart, Target, etc. CANNOT BE PLAYED. So where the heck do they get their content? Snackables? Mofo Pleeeeease.

When it comes to a choice between a brand new product with ZERO legacy support for hundreds of existing titles, and an existing proven product with support for hundreds of games (and far more user satisfaction with custom homebrew) I think the choice becomes pretty simple.

Now what about existing PSP users? The vast majority have to be already using custom operating systems and UMDless methods of play.

It does not matter where you approach this. Sony created a product that has a primary appeal to the people that already play UMD backups, pirated or not.

So yes.... Sony made a PSP uniquely targeted to the so-called Pirates. I agree, they did not probably intend to do that at all. Given the complete sociopathic retards that run the joint (rootkit), I absolutely believe they have such a complete disconnect with their customers that they really really thought the PSN network and snackables would be enough.

Like I said, Totally Retarded.

Re:Totally Retarded (2, Interesting)

blahplusplus (757119) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271687)

"If I make a backup copy of a UMD game I purchased, it can never be anything remotely resembling theft.... .... Of course we could make the argument that since we bought the original liscenses to old games we don't have to pay for them again when they become available (i.e. once you buy a liscense it can't be revoked).

The fair use case you mention is an excellent example of hypocrisy of the industry itself when it comes to old games they re-release but to whom the customer already owns the license to access it. Ironically enough "piracy" is justified in this case if we are to take the "license" seriously (I already bought the license to play x game x years ago, you re-release it, I still have the license, etc).

Re:Totally Retarded (1)

AndersOSU (873247) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272633)

whether you like it or not, unless they're releasing the exact same game, with the exact same content, you aren't legally entitled to a copy because you bought a license to a previous version.

In the real world, consider the dictionary. Just because you bought a copy of Webster's dictionary 10 years ago doesn't mean you have the right to download a copy of this years version - even if 99.99% of the content is identical. You do have a right to make copies of your old dictionary for your own personal use. (also consider textbook editions, which, by and large, is a scam, but a legally protected one.)

Re:Totally Retarded (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29273221)

But the dictionary is still readable years in the future. That might no be the case of games, music and movies. This planed obsolence is not a problem for books. Until the law is adjusted for this i will format shift anyway i dam well please.

Re:Totally Retarded (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29273009)

I'm all for Fair use...but you can't just pick and choose which laws to obey based on how YOU feel about them. That means that someone else might think that a law against robbery is infringing on their right to your money, or their right to "pursuit of happiness". What I am talking about is the DMCA which says that you cannot circumvent any copy-protection. So you have a fair use right to make backups, so long as they are not copy-protected.

I don't agree with that the copy-protection portion, just pointing out the danger of picking and choicing which laws you agree with.

Re:Totally Retarded (1)

drsmithy (35869) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273399)

Fair Use is my right, as in, legal entitlement.

Fair use is not your "right", it is something you can do without fear of prosecution.

Re:Totally Retarded (0)

brkello (642429) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273555)

Not that I disagree with your major points about fair use, the whole "this is not theft" is garbage. Yeah, we all know it is copyright infringement. It is still breaking the law and theft is just easier to say. Yeah, you aren't depriving the company of something, WE ALL KNOW THIS. But you are using something you didn't pay for and it is just easy to call that stealing or theft. Even if it is different in your mind, to a lot of people it isn't. It is still illegal so who cares what it is called other than people who want to justify breaking the law. "I mean, it's not stealing! Get off my back! wah wah"

Re:Totally Retarded (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29273867)

If you're not using the correct words, you're using the wrong words.

Re:Totally Retarded (1)

geminidomino (614729) | more than 4 years ago | (#29274433)

Yeah, we all know it is copyright infringement. It is still breaking the law and theft is just easier to say. Yeah, you aren't depriving the company of something, WE ALL KNOW THIS. But you are using something you didn't pay for and it is just easy to call that stealing or theft.

It's easier to say "you're a moron and you should die in a fire" than it is to say "while your position may be misguided, the underlying philosophy may still hold some validity."

That doesn't make it correct.

Re:Totally Retarded (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29274553)

JFYI - "Fair use" is just a defense in court, it's not your right and you are not entitled to it. Regardless - PSP does not play "backups" unless modified in violation of DMCA so your idea it only interests "backup" players as yourself is just as crazy as your belief it is designed to play some "snackables". It's designed for freaking electronic distribution, if you ever went to PSN you had seen there are no "snackables", there are however the same games they used to sell on UMD or CD-ROM for PlayStation. Small games Sony is trying to push are for every PSP model and they are competing with iPhone crappy $1 games.

And this is golden: "Now what about existing PSP users? The vast majority have to be already using custom operating systems and UMDless methods of play." no shit? What data did you use to backup this statement? Rectal-Digital Market Analysis Bureau Report?

Re:Totally Retarded (1)

mattr99_uk (1195893) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271653)

I am actually interested in the PSP Go. ONLY IF I CAN PLAY MY UMD BACKUPS.

I think this would be a great feature (I could play my existing UMD games that I've already paid for) but this will never happen.

What incentive does Sony have to do this? They will see this as I way for people to play pirate copies of games. Preventing this also gives them a way of re-selling games to people who already have UMD versions.

Combine this with what looks like an awkward console to play (the buttons seem too close to the bottom) and you have something I have no interest in buying.

Not their only bonehead move (2, Interesting)

Mark_in_Brazil (537925) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272789)

If, instead of putting the "SELECT" and "START" buttons in the little round spot in the mirror-image position of where the thumbstick is on the Go, they had put in another thumbstick and put those two buttons somewhere else, they would have made ports of shooters and other PS2 and PS3 games to the PSP a lot easier. Backward compatibility with old PSP games would be trivial - the old games don't "know" about the second thumbstick, so they'd automatically ignore it.

I like my PSP quite a bit. It has served me well on long flights and on bus trips between Rio and Sao Paulo. I've watched movies and TV eps on it, and I've enjoyed some of the games, especially some of the shooters like the Syphon Filter games, which I think do the best job of working around the problem of having only one joystick, but it would be nicer if all the shooters could have the same controls, which would be the case if there were two thumbsticks plus the direction and "shape" buttons. Y'know... like EVERY console controller. And as I said, it would make ports of console games that much easier, which could greatly expand the number of games available for the PSP.

It's a huge pain in the ass to switch between different shooters on the PSP, because I end up confusing the control schemes between different games. Since the controls are only that different from game to game because the games use different workarounds for the single-joystick problem, the solution is obvious... to everyone but the geniuses at Sony.

The PSP hardware has gone through three updates in the last few years, and the most obvious change to strengthen the platform has not been part of any of them. Instead, they've focused on making it smaller and lighter, which I don't want at all. In fact, I have a case and leave the PSP in it at all times because the whole thing feels sturdier in my hands. One of the reasons I chose the PSP over the DS was because the DS felt flimsy and easy-to-break to me. So of course, when Sony updated their hardware three times, it was to make it lighter and smaller, but not to, y'know, do the one thing that would really improve the platform as a whole.

I will give them credit for the video out that they added on the 2000, though. That's the one feature of the newer models I really wish I had. Battery life is a decent one, but I just bought an extra battery (with a larger capacity than the original Sony one) and make sure both are charged before I leave on a trip. I also use the power cord when I can (in airports or bus stations, at home, etc.). I've never had to quit playing because of lack of battery power.

simple (0)

ILuvRamen (1026668) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270853)

Hire me, geeze, Those big corporate morons have no idea what they're doing. There are at least a dozen different ways to make cartridge based games self destruct their data if they're opened. You can't get the ROM off it if a system wipes it any time oxygen is sensed inside the cartridge which has a vacuum in it. Good luck getting the data off it! There, that one's for free :P

Re:simple (2, Informative)

walshy007 (906710) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271019)

There are at least a dozen different ways to make cartridge based games self destruct their data if they're opened. You can't get the ROM off it if a system wipes it any time oxygen is sensed inside the cartridge which has a vacuum in it.

sure you can, I can dump my legitimate games onto cf card using my actual ds.. you do realize that for the cartridge to be usable the system has to be able to read the data... right?

dumping does not involve removing cartridge chips these days (ok.. well... arcade games sometimes) it either involves putting the cartridge into an original system that's running a dumper program, or making something yourself that has a cartridge port that can read it.

Re:simple (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271701)

I can dump my legitimate games onto cf card using my actual ds

I know what you're talking about: Rudolph's dumper. But do makers of DS copiers even make the CF card adapters anymore? I thought all the manufacturers had moved on to SLOT-1 solutions.

it either involves putting the cartridge into an original system that's running a dumper program, or making something yourself that has a cartridge port that can read it.

Any ideas on how to build an NES copier?

Re:simple (1)

petermgreen (876956) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272011)

Any ideas on how to build an NES copier?
http://www.tripoint.org/kevtris/Projects/copynes/ [tripoint.org]

Afaict the trickiest bit with copying nes carts is actually identifying them. nes carts (unlike gameboy carts) use a huge range of mapper chips and don't have any header information to say which mapper is in use. So if you are trying to dump a cart that hasn't been dumped before you may well have to open it up to find out what mapper is in there.

If you want to actually copy the cart rather than just make an image for use on emulators you will also need to either clone the mapper chip or find a donor cart with the same mapper chip to host your copy.

There is also the security chip issue but afaict clones of that are readilly availible nowadays.

The five mappers you meet in NES-land (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273493)

CopyNES: $125, plus the price of a working NES and a PC from the Windows 98 era (you'll need a parallel port for the CopyNES and a USB port to get your files onto a USB stick). Unless you have a lot of games that aren't coming to VC any time soon, it's cheaper just to buy games on VC for $5 each.

Afaict the trickiest bit with copying nes carts is actually identifying them. nes carts (unlike gameboy carts) use a huge range of mapper chips

If one restricts oneself to NES games (72 pin), there are only a handful of common NES mappers: NROM/CNROM/GNROM, UNROM, BNROM/AOROM, MMC1, or MMC3. Even most of the unlicensed games are clones of CNROM (Panesian), GNROM (Color Dreams), UNROM (Camerica), or MMC3 (Tengen). That's few enough for a dumper to take less than one second to try each mapper's handshake and see how the cart responds.

If you want to actually copy the cart rather than just make an image for use on emulators you will also need to either clone the mapper chip or find a donor cart with the same mapper chip to host your copy.

Plenty of mappers have been cloned already: PowerPak. For something more permanent, RetroZone has reproduction boards designed for NROM/CNROM/GNROM, UNROM, BNROM/AOROM, and MMC1 games.

Re:simple (1)

walshy007 (906710) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272563)

I know what you're talking about: Rudolph's dumper.

I used an original gameboy advance media player, with modified firmware, and I had not heard of rudolf's dumper until you mentioned it then, I had a tool around 2005'ish that could dump ds firmware, ds slot sram, and ds slot rom, very handy multi-functional tool, featured a debugger also. Cannot for the life of me remember the name of it but if I can remember I will post in a reply.

Any ideas on how to build an NES copier?

best bet to follow petermgreen's advice, my main experience is snes where we don't have memory mappers, just silly co-processors in cartridges :)

Sony removed the battery to stop Pandora? (2, Insightful)

YesIAmAScript (886271) | more than 4 years ago | (#29270857)

Come on, fixing the Pandora problem was as easy as changing the firmware that listened to the battery.

It is an enormous stretch to think that the PSP Go! doesn't have a removable battery because of the Pandora battery. Wouldn't you think it would be more because non-removable batteries are in vogue in high-line devices like the iPod Touch and Zune HD, both of which the PSP Go! competes with?

Re:Sony removed the battery to stop Pandora? (1)

rhook (943951) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271645)

Or they removed the removable battery so they can charge you a service fee when you need a new one.

Re:Sony removed the battery to stop Pandora? (1)

chrb (1083577) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271929)

Indeed. An ipod touch battery replacement from Apple is £66.13 in the UK (equiv. US$107). That's probably higher than the profit margin on a brand new device. And the great thing about it, is that the cost is totally hidden from the initial purchase - the majority of people have no idea that batteries degrade over time, and won't even think about Total Cost of Ownership.

Sigh (1)

sonicmerlin (1505111) | more than 4 years ago | (#29271043)

I understand where they're coming from, but I feel the need to point out there are studies suggesting people who pirate the most (music) also buy the most (music). I imagine this applies to video game software as well.

I mean seriously, imagine how many games there are you just want to try out to see if it's worth sinking $50-$60 on during a harsh recession.

I've used a Supercard with my DS to try out games I thought would be great and found out just weren't that interesting. On the other hand the supercard has given me the opportunity to try out a bunch of much more "fringe" (in my mind) games that I without a doubt wouldn't buy without having the chance to try first, like "Cooking Mama".

While trying out a game and finding out I like it doesn't necessarily lead to me buying it, it keeps me engaged with the video game market. This means I don't get "burned out" (an issue I had during the Gamecube/PS2 era) or become uninterested and thus keep buying games regularly.

Their real anti-piracy strategy... (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29271053)

A new fleet of ships of the line, bristling with cannons and hung with sails.

Let's see how those pirates handle a few hundred pounds of cannonballs coming at them!

Also, they're sending in the Plumbers to clean things up.

4 love (0, Offtopic)

mixedlove (1629103) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272233)

Interracial relationships . . . Why is that phrase used to describe unions between men and women of different ethnicities? Would you like to experience interracial romance? Go to ******** mixedmingle.com ********

Tecmo Super Bowl still rocks! (1)

misfit815 (875442) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272465)

My enjoyment of our Wii doubled when I installed the Homebrew Channel, and I always bring it up when people ask us if we like the system. It's funny that they are in a constant fight to stop stuff that contributes so much to the value of what they're selling to us.

Re:Tecmo Super Bowl still rocks! (1)

Actually, I do RTFA (1058596) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273847)

It's funny that they are in a constant fight to stop stuff that contributes so much to the value of what they're selling to us.

It's only because you misunderstand what Nintendo is selling. They're giving you subsidized hardware, and selling the rights to you as a consumer to big companies.

The only reason they care if you own a DS/Wii is because you then buy games; they lose money on the actual system. So obviously they only want the system to be used for games they get a cut of. And obviously, in their mind, homebrew is as evil as piracy. Because it's not the violation of copyright X Y or Z that hurts their profits, it's not buying X Y or Z.

Re:Tecmo Super Bowl still rocks! (1)

geminidomino (614729) | more than 4 years ago | (#29274555)

The only reason they care if you own a DS/Wii is because you then buy games; they lose money on the actual system.

That's been shown to not be the case many times. Nintendo does not take a loss on the Wii systems.

Their strategy goes the wrong way... (3, Insightful)

Ranma-sensei (800217) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272581)

...because Sony and Nintendo will just be annoying us homebrew users. Indiscriminately criminalising your customers will not make the "bad guys" go away - they'll just multiply!

The real problem is that the industry - and that's not just Sony and Big N - still keeps ignoring is pricing. Maybe you gotta stop labeling crap the same as diamonds. (and yeah, I know Third Parties don't get a say in this!)

I think a general drop in prices is called for - and maybe the dropping of the belief that "Visuals are Everything".

Piracy vs cost of redesign (1)

grapeape (137008) | more than 4 years ago | (#29272977)

One has to wonder if the the money wasted on redesigns and protection schemes doesn't actually exceed the revenue that would have resulted if piracy wasn't possible. Every pirate I know fills one profile...cheap bastards that wouldn't buy anything to start with. Nearly all the friends I have that pirate speak about "homebrew" but do no development themselves and their idea of homebrew is emulation so they can pirate other stuff.

However, the current software model is a dead end. Many people are just not willing to spend $30-$40 on a portable game. IMHO thats why even with inferior controls the Iphone is starting to cut into sales on the DS and PSP. There are many games now that are 1/4th the price on the iphone and doing quite well. When you have a choice of Peggle for $30 on the DS or $1.99 on the iphone it doesnt exactly give the traditional gamer warm and fuzzies. If handheld games were an impulse purchase many of the piracy issues would drop drastically.

I don't need you either. (1)

b4dc0d3r (1268512) | more than 4 years ago | (#29273099)

I bought a PS2 with the intent of purchasing $20 games. If I can't find them (out of print or not sold here or whatever), I'll just download them. I intend to give them my money, but if they make it impossible to do that I won't do it.

Of course, that probably means I'll stop buying console stuff and move back to computers. I feel better about giving hardware mfrs my money anyway, even though PC gaming is a constant upgrade treadmill.

Ever higher game prices are only shooting yourself in the foot.

Re:I don't need you either. (1)

acohen1 (1454445) | more than 4 years ago | (#29274857)

I just saw this "old news" article on Kotaku http://kotaku.com/5346805/old-news-97-sony-forces-nintendo-game-prices-down [kotaku.com] It really puts things in perspective how expensive games used to be before pressed discs on the psx. Recall these prices have no adjustment for inflation, and we are now bitching about 59.99 games when 12 years ago they were just coming down from $70 !

innocuous title (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29273187)

MONOPOLIES???
You guys are so freaking stupid it hurts. Hurts. Morons.

Re:innocuous title (1)

Shikaku (1129753) | more than 4 years ago | (#29274017)

Make a game console and sell it then.

Locking you in (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29273253)

I hate to be bit of an Ogre. If Sony stopped over charging and developing hardware locking you in to region fixed DVDs players, none of this nonesense would happen. It was Sony who developed CD's to try and get rid of Vinyl in the late 80's, however I can prove that My Vinyl kicks arse playing on my Lin Sondek LP 12 or Rega turntable. Do not trust Sony/BMG/RIAA they want things all they're own way and nobody else's opinion counts. Now if you have a spare windows machine, you should download Alcohol 120% which they have tried to ban on countless times because it totally strips DRM. These fuckers need to be taught a lesson, like bankers who have ripped off good willed people worldwide. Yes it all started with Enron. I am so fucking pissed off right now and this is why I am posting anonymously. I just want to say that I have an enourmous amount of affection for slashdot and users, I truly do love your comments :)
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