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Apple Pulls C64 Emulator From the App Store

kdawson posted about 5 years ago | from the brief-shining-moment dept.

Cellphones 580

Rob Hearn sends in a piece up at PocketGamer.co.uk on why Apple suddenly pulled Manomio's C64 emulator soon after finally approving it. (El Reg has coverage too.) "It was a glorious few moments for retro gamers when Manomio's C64 emulator was finally approved by Apple and released to the eager, nostalgic iPhone public. Then, calamity! It was gone again. Apparently some wily users figured out how to access the Commodore 64 BASIC system that was originally packaged with the emulator — something that Apple wasn't too happy with, given the nature of the interpreter's code. By setting the keyboard to 'always on,' launching a game and restarting BASIC, players got into the 'empty shell' of their C64 emulator."

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And then what? (4, Insightful)

Jason daHaus (1419459) | about 5 years ago | (#29353641)

Seriously? What? What can you do from a C64 shell on an iPhone?

Re:And then what? (5, Informative)

Anonymous Cowar (1608865) | about 5 years ago | (#29353669)

it probably duplicates core functionality in the loosest sense of the term. I.E. turns it into a "computer" that people can then "use" to "get stuff done". Then BAM! duplicate functionality.

Re:And then what? (2)

ananamouse (943446) | about 5 years ago | (#29353805)

Decades ago (literally) I trained my C64 to perform all the contour mapping algorithims in Davis, "Statistics and Data Analysis in Geology." I also had it doing log analysis computations and plots. I have an old copy of GEOS somewhere, I wonder if that would run on the emulator?

Re:And then what? (3, Informative)

fyrie (604735) | about 5 years ago | (#29354039)

GEOS runs on most C64 emus so I'd have to guess yes. However, you can only execute the disk images that are available in the appstore. LAME.

Re:And then what? (1)

Beardo the Bearded (321478) | about 5 years ago | (#29354319)

Not on the iPhone.

I know why this happened (5, Funny)

TiggertheMad (556308) | about 5 years ago | (#29353953)

They are still bitter that C64 games were better than Apple ][e games back in the day...

Re:I know why this happened (1)

mcgrew (92797) | about 5 years ago | (#29354177)

I don't know, I had a GREAT pirated Pac-Man game for the IIe, it was identical to the ones you put quarters in. The HHGTG pretty well sucked afaiwc, because I never could get on the Vogon ship. But iirc that was out for the C-64 and about every other computer at the time as well.

Same thing we do every night Pinky (4, Funny)

wiredog (43288) | about 5 years ago | (#29353719)

Try to take over the world.

Re:Same thing we do every night Pinky (2, Funny)

infolation (840436) | about 5 years ago | (#29354147)

by running C64 Skype

Re:And then what? (4, Informative)

babyrat (314371) | about 5 years ago | (#29353745)

I believe at least one of the problems is that with access to the basic interpreter could be used to start illegally obtained games.

Re:And then what? (4, Informative)

jcr (53032) | about 5 years ago | (#29353891)

No, they banned it because they prohibit any language interpreters. What anyone wants to do with those interpreters is beside the point.

-jcr

Re:And then what? (1)

mini me (132455) | about 5 years ago | (#29354055)

They have not banned this Brainfuck interpreter. http://itunes.com/apps/brainfudge [itunes.com] Hurray for App Store inconsistencies.

Re:And then what? (2, Funny)

jandrese (485) | about 5 years ago | (#29354193)

They probably just have a ban on useful interpreters.

Re:And then what? (5, Funny)

Mechanik (104328) | about 5 years ago | (#29353823)

Seriously? What? What can you do from a C64 shell on an iPhone?

The same thing everyone used to do with the C64 out in front of Radio Shack back in the day...

10 PRINT "PENIS!!!!!!"
20 GOTO 10

Re:And then what? (4, Informative)

oldspewey (1303305) | about 5 years ago | (#29353973)

That was Sears. Radio Shack was where you programmed the TRS-80 in the endless penis loop.

Re:And then what? (5, Funny)

Lemmy Caution (8378) | about 5 years ago | (#29353979)

Among a certain crowd, that program passes the Turing test.

Re:And then what? (0)

multipartmixed (163409) | about 5 years ago | (#29354227)

PENIS!

Re:And then what? (1)

PenisLands (930247) | about 5 years ago | (#29354237)

Heh heh! PENIS!

Re:And then what? (1)

texwtf (558874) | about 5 years ago | (#29353825)

LOAD "$", 8
DIR

Actually have access to the filesystem, how dare we!

Just a guess.

You don't understand (5, Insightful)

jpmorgan (517966) | about 5 years ago | (#29353855)

Spur an interest in programmable platforms and maybe get people interested in being more than just a passive consumer of whatever crap Apple wants to shovel at them through iTunes.

Re:You don't understand (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29353893)

I'd have given that +1 Cynical Bastard, but it wasn't in the list, so I did +1 Interesting instead.

Re:You don't understand (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354023)

Oh... so posting as AC (by ticking the "Post Anonymously" box) removes moderations, but without the warning you get if you don't tick the box? ("If you continue to post this comment, all moderations done to this discussion will be undone!")

Re:And then what? (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29353877)

The point is you arent allowed to have any sort of dynamic, interpreted code at all. No java, no .net runtime, no assembly interpreter, no scripts, no nothing.

You see, it opens the door for people to write their own C64 basic phones and run them on the iPhone, without - gasp - Steve Jobs approving, or getting paid! I could write my own "lemonade stand" game, and distribute it, OUTSIDE OF APPLES OFFICIAL CHANNELS?

THE APPALLING HORROR OF AN OPEN PLATFORM!

BTW, you can do a whole lot from a c64 shell when you're clever.. You're obviously too young to know.

Re:And then what? (1)

Jason daHaus (1419459) | about 5 years ago | (#29353943)

Well - I'm 29 - so C64 was something I played games on when I was 8 or so. I didn't start tinkering with programming until a few years after that.

Re:And then what? (2, Informative)

stasike (1063564) | about 5 years ago | (#29353957)


10 PRINT "What is your name?"
20 INPUT A$
30 PRINT "Hello " A$

You see? You can use it to write programs.
Very dangerous! They can *not* let that happen.

Re:And then what? (3, Funny)

Stele (9443) | about 5 years ago | (#29354183)

But that might lead to someone experimenting with

30 PRINT "Hello " A$$

And that spells a naughty word. Can't have that!!

Re:And then what? (3, Funny)

93 Escort Wagon (326346) | about 5 years ago | (#29353961)

Seriously? What? What can you do from a C64 shell on an iPhone?

If you'd ever watched Macgyver, you wouldn't ask that question.

Re:And then what? (1)

Chelloveck (14643) | about 5 years ago | (#29354261)

Bah. Even McGyver fans wouldn't be able to do anything with that. At the very least they'd need a roll of duct tape or a paper clip as well.

Re:And then what? (3, Insightful)

hansamurai (907719) | about 5 years ago | (#29354111)

You could write an app store for the C64, featuring C64 only games, but then Apple wouldn't get the cut.

Re:And then what? (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354225)

Well, if you want to see what a C64 is capable of, come to
the Vintage Computer Festival this weekend:

http://www.vintage.org/2009/east/

There will be several C64s on exhibit, available for hands on
experimentation.

BASIC Copyright issues? (3, Interesting)

cirby (2599) | about 5 years ago | (#29354345)

Commodore's BASIC was licensed from Microsoft with a one-time fee. If I were Apple, I wouldn't let Microsoft BASIC anywhere NEAR this emulator until I got a signed legal document from Microsoft saying that the license covered all derivatives of the Commodore device, or that Apple had a free and clear right to use it.

Runstop / Restore (1)

fyrie (604735) | about 5 years ago | (#29353645)

I hope they get it sorted out, but frankly the poor quality selection of games for it has taken some of the shine off the app, especially without basic.

frosty piss (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29353647)

frost piss

RUN (1)

tverbeek (457094) | about 5 years ago | (#29353709)

10 PRINT "HELLO, WORLD!"
20 GOTO 10



i'm adding this text to get past the anti-caps filter

Re:RUN (5, Funny)

ArbitraryDescriptor (1257752) | about 5 years ago | (#29353787)

10 PRINT "HELLO, WORLD!"

Banned: Duplicates text display functionality.

Obligatory (0, Redundant)

_PimpDaddy7_ (415866) | about 5 years ago | (#29353711)

I felt a great disturbance in the Force...as if millions of
voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced. I fear
something terrible has happened.

The n900 cometh... (5, Interesting)

Kirin Fenrir (1001780) | about 5 years ago | (#29353725)

For technophiles, the iPhone is dead. The n900, with it's Debian-based-OS and open platform, is our new lord and savior. http://maemo.nokia.com/n900/ [nokia.com]

Re:The n900 cometh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354005)

For technophiles, the iPhone is dead. The n900, with it's Debian-based-OS and open platform, is our new lord and savior.

http://maemo.nokia.com/n900/ [nokia.com]

For $650 USD, it sure as hell better be...

Re:The n900 cometh... (5, Insightful)

ShadowRangerRIT (1301549) | about 5 years ago | (#29354173)

Unlike the iPhone though, that's the whole cost. The iPhone's "real" price is buried in the mandatory contract. Outside of the U.S., you don't have a phone bundled with the plan, but the plan itself is cheaper. So yes, it costs $650 (or equivalent local currency), but the plan only runs $20-40/month, not $60-70/month. Over two years, you will have paid quite a bit more for the iPhone. And if you choose not to upgrade after two years, the savings over the iPhone accrue even faster.

Re:The n900 cometh... (-1, Troll)

Kenja (541830) | about 5 years ago | (#29354121)

I assume you speak of the successor to my n810? I do enjoy having a full Linux system on my PDA, runs the apps I want etc. HOWEVER! Its is NOT a phone. Which the iPhone is. It does couple well with other Nokia products, including cell phones, but outside of VOIP you'll not be making any calls from it.

Re:The n900 cometh... (4, Informative)

Hognoxious (631665) | about 5 years ago | (#29354205)

I assume you speak of the successor to my n810? ... you'll not be making any calls from it.

I assume you can't follow a link. The N900 is indeed a phone, quad band to boot.

Re:The n900 cometh... (0, Troll)

Kenja (541830) | about 5 years ago | (#29354235)

Indeed, the new model has a phone app shoe-horned in. Only time will tell if it is any good as a phone. However I was speaking of the existing platform, which is phoneless.

Re:The n900 cometh... (2, Informative)

Hognoxious (631665) | about 5 years ago | (#29354363)

the new model has a phone app shoe-horned in

An app? Just software, no hardware? As for claiming it was shoe-horned in, how do you know - were you part of the design team?

However I was speaking of the existing platform

No you weren't, you used the future tense.

Re:The n900 cometh... (2, Informative)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | about 5 years ago | (#29354209)

The N810 wasn't, the N900 is [nokia.com] .

Re:The n900 cometh... (3, Informative)

JustinOpinion (1246824) | about 5 years ago | (#29354251)

I assume you speak of the successor to my n810? I do enjoy having a full Linux system on my PDA, runs the apps I want etc. HOWEVER! Its is NOT a phone.

FYI, the N900 is a smartphone (an upcoming smartphone, mind you). It is designed much like the N800/N810, and runs Maemo (and can be used as an Internet tablet), but it is also a full-featured cell-phone. More information: official site [nokia.com] , Wikipedia [wikipedia.org] , Slashdot story [slashdot.org] and follow-up [slashdot.org] .

Re:The n900 cometh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354267)

The n900 is a phone, can make gsm calls, requires a sim chip. Even says so on the box.

Re:The n900 cometh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354279)

I assume you speak of the successor to my n810? I do enjoy having a full Linux system on my PDA, runs the apps I want etc. HOWEVER! Its is NOT a phone. Which the iPhone is. It does couple well with other Nokia products, including cell phones, but outside of VOIP you'll not be making any calls from it.

Read the specs: N900 is also a phone.

Re:The n900 cometh... (1)

graft (556969) | about 5 years ago | (#29354285)

Unlike its predecessors, the N900 IS a phone.

Yes it is! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354297)

From the specs:
        * Quad-band GSM EDGE 850/900/1800/1900
        * WCDMA 900/1700/2100 MHz

Re:The n900 cometh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354329)

The n900 IS a phone, though. Check the link.

Re:The n900 cometh... (2, Interesting)

hansamurai (907719) | about 5 years ago | (#29354135)

Or the Android platform, it's definitely getting interesting with the Sprint offering coming next month and a whole slew of phones hitting Europe and the US.

Ready to worship (1)

Qubit (100461) | about 5 years ago | (#29354197)

So how open is the n900 going to be?

The Pre is nifty, but a large chunk of the OS and all of the base applications are proprietary Palm stuff. So it's pretty darn close, but we're just not quite there yet.

Is there any chance of having the base install for the n900 be completely FOSS? I wish I had the time to hack on phones and write this stuff myself, but (like a lot of other people) I keep on finding my schedule too busy to get started.

It's 2009 and I can buy a laptop that runs a FOSS OS and FOSS applications pretty much perfectly. When can we have the same for a phone?

Because...... (2, Funny)

Danathar (267989) | about 5 years ago | (#29353733)

Having the C64 Basic interpreter as a programming environment on the iphone would strategically hurt Apple in horrible way....

Riiiiight

Re:Because...... (2, Funny)

0xdeadbeef (28836) | about 5 years ago | (#29353869)

You have no idea. Someone could have hand-written a BASIC program that could download a BASIC virus off the Internet that could spread to other phones running BASIC and it would have taken down the AT&T network!

Re:Because...... (1)

bdenton42 (1313735) | about 5 years ago | (#29353977)

They're probably more worried about someone using peek and poke in unintended ways.

Re:Because...... (5, Insightful)

Danathar (267989) | about 5 years ago | (#29354169)

Um...the coding of C64 software was ALL ABOUT using peek and poke in unintended ways!

Re:Because...... (1)

Entropius (188861) | about 5 years ago | (#29353985)

It's down half the time anyway; how would we notice?

Re:Because...... (1)

Danathar (267989) | about 5 years ago | (#29354155)

Don't need a virus, just a badly written BASIC program with nested goto and gosub lines...

What a dumbass (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29353737)

With all this publicity about his app he has to go and fuck it up. He could have made thousands.

Re:What a dumbass (4, Insightful)

Renderer of Evil (604742) | about 5 years ago | (#29354317)

Yeah, I agree. The developer is a grade-A moron. Initially, the App was rejected because of this and after lots of back and forth Apple approved it with a condition of removing the BASIC interpreter. Developer thought it would be cute to hide, and make it available as an easter egg. Guess that plan backfired.

Without a doubt, they needlessly burned a lot of money because of lost potential sales. Apple might even return the favor by dragging its feet and not approving the app for weeks or months.

C64 BASIC too powerful to be safe (5, Insightful)

bzzfzz (1542813) | about 5 years ago | (#29353749)

I would have laughed if you told me, back in the day, that future device makers would go to great lengths to lock out C64 BASIC so that users could use it to build applications that were so powerful that important third parties would be afraid. I know it's Turing-complete, but still.

I have never been much of a believer in Stallman's dystopian visions but I'm getting closer to believing them.

Re:C64 BASIC too powerful to be safe (2, Interesting)

chriso11 (254041) | about 5 years ago | (#29353933)

Maybe they are coming out with a Apple ][ emulator, and it represents too much competition...

Re:C64 BASIC too powerful to be safe (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354117)

Why? The C64 was light years ahead of anything Apple did in those days. This is just apple pissing off devs and users of the platform. Even MS wouldn't pull this crap.

Re:C64 BASIC too powerful to be safe (5, Insightful)

jpmorgan (517966) | about 5 years ago | (#29354037)

The computing world never turned into quite the dystopia that some feared, because the vertical integrators were mostly killed. Now, in the past I couldn't really care what Apple did because they were always a niche platform. But some disclosure: I hate the iPhone, I want it to die, or at least lose its dominant position. If the future of mobile computing is dominated by a company like Apple, then it's a bleak future. Say what you will about Microsoft's domination of the desktop, but they were never draconian like this.

In the past being a Windows dev was compared to serfdom. If that's true, then what's being an iPhone developer like?

New Speed Record (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29353765)

So that means that the record for "fastest hack using a C64" was just set, right?

I'll call Guinness....

Jesus Apple..... (1)

Immostlyharmless (1311531) | about 5 years ago | (#29353779)

Get over it, really....

Id be tempted at this point to just release the sucker in the wild and post up links to any and all places anyone who might even *slightly* want a c64 emulator for the iPhone might be, after restoring the BASIC functionality as it was in the c64. Just to spite em.....

Re:Jesus Apple..... (1)

FireFury03 (653718) | about 5 years ago | (#29354259)

Id be tempted at this point to just release the sucker in the wild and post up links to any and all places anyone who might even *slightly* want a c64 emulator for the iPhone might be, after restoring the BASIC functionality as it was in the c64. Just to spite em.....

How are you going to do that when you can only install apps from the official app store (unless you root your phone)?

Imagine a future.... (5, Interesting)

Danathar (267989) | about 5 years ago | (#29353791)

Where the C64 emulator becomes THE preferred programming environment on the iphone as Apple neglects to understand the nature of the threat...causing a renisannce in C64 programming; catapulting a once dead platform from the grave back into stardom...

Long live line numbers! (1, Redundant)

Danathar (267989) | about 5 years ago | (#29354133)

10 Print "I love Line numbers!"
20 Goto 10

Re:Imagine a future.... (2, Funny)

Jay L (74152) | about 5 years ago | (#29354335)

catapulting a once dead platform from the grave back into stardom

Stereo SIDPlayer:iTunes killer!

Apple tries REALLY hard... (5, Insightful)

IllForgetMyNickSoonA (748496) | about 5 years ago | (#29353801)

As it seems, Apple tries REALLY hard to surpass Microsoft on the list of the most hated IT companies. This stunt they just pulled with the C64 emulator is pure idiocy!

Re:Apple tries REALLY hard... (5, Insightful)

Ohio Calvinist (895750) | about 5 years ago | (#29354103)

The issue is that if they allow this application, they'll have a harder time justifying denying other applications using interpreted languages. That seems like a non-story to me. Everyone has known from the beginning that that was the case, and that the reason was that if they allowed it, there would be no way of controlling it.

However what I do think is interesting is that they'd allow any emulator at all. Particularly one whose games all depend upon an interpreted language. I'm primarily surprised because of the possibility that someone might be able to get unauthorized apps to run under it, not to mention any liability (real or assumed) a plantiff might try to claim if the emulator ran their code illegally and that Apple rubber stamped it knowing the possibility. Emulators have always been in that sort of gray-area. Apple is more than just the device manufacturer, all apps through the app-store have them functioning as a distributor.

Re:Apple tries REALLY hard... (1)

jpmorgan (517966) | about 5 years ago | (#29354253)

I don't know, Apple hasn't really cared [iphonefirmware.com] about consistent enforcement of App Store rules in the past.

When Apple made that 1984 commercial... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354263)

... the giant head on the screen was their estimate of what Steve Jobs would look like in 2010 and the "woman" throwing the hammer is actually Linus Torvalds.

Apple is worse than Microsoft (5, Insightful)

etymxris (121288) | about 5 years ago | (#29353811)

When it comes to proprietary lock-in. Styling and hype is much more exciting than philosophical and economical arguments for having an open platform. I encourage anyone with appreciation of these issues to boycott closed platforms like the iPhone, consoles, and set top cable boxes.

Re:Apple is worse than Microsoft (1)

d3ac0n (715594) | about 5 years ago | (#29354129)

No problem.

I have no set-top boxes.

I own no consoles.

I have a Palm Pre with WebOS, the revolutionary linux based open operating system.

You DO know that we have a REAL Homebrew community, with new apps being released every day that Palm has NO control over, right? As of this writing the homebrew app count is at 197 apps and growing. (Including My Tether, which I am using to connect to the internet with via my Pre and write this post.)

Dump your iShackle. Free your Phone with the Palm Pre.

Re:Apple is worse than Microsoft (1)

clang_jangle (975789) | about 5 years ago | (#29354151)

That's largely true, but it isn't because Apple is more evil than MS -- it's because MS is less competent and more lazy than Apple.
And I've owned Macs since 1987, but this iPhone behavior is pretty dreadful. Glad I don't have one...

Re:Apple is worse than Microsoft (3, Insightful)

jpmorgan (517966) | about 5 years ago | (#29354307)

I don't know about that... with notable counterexamples (remember 'DOS isn't done until Lotus won't run?' and Netscape), Microsoft has generally been pretty hands off, encouraging people to develop whatever they want. It's somewhat ironic, but Windows Mobile is arguably the most open platform of all. It has no restrictions or policies, no centralized distribution channel, and it doesn't restrict your access to the hardware. My next phone will probably be Android, but even that doesn't give you root.

then what? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29353821)

Load"*",8,1

Just Silliness (4, Insightful)

Pitr (33016) | about 5 years ago | (#29353887)

I submit that anyone that conceivable _could_ do any damage of any significant nature through the BASIC interpreter on a C64 emulator on an iPhone has almost certainly already jail broken their phone and are already doing much wackier things. Further, if they haven't, then this provides further incentive to jailbreak.

Add to that the PR nightmare of constantly pulling the same app repeatedly, and it should make both users and developers feel increasingly gun shy about the app store.

Re:Just Silliness (4, Insightful)

99BottlesOfBeerInMyF (813746) | about 5 years ago | (#29354191)

I submit that anyone that conceivable _could_ do any damage of any significant nature through the BASIC interpreter on a C64 emulator on an iPhone has almost certainly already jail broken their phone and are already doing much wackier things.

Apple doesn't care if you jailbreak your own phone. That poses no risk. They care if you write arbitrary code that can be used to hack phones that aren't jailbroken. Thus, no applications that execute arbitrary code from other sources. It's the rule they made and developers have to stick to, even if in this case it is unlikely to be too serious.

The reasons for this are twofold:

First, they don't want people running an interpreter and installing apps on top of it, because one new app that runs on top, which Apple does not have an opportunity to test, could violate Apple's agreement with AT&T or break out of the sandbox and install malware. At that point Apple has to disable a whole swath of programs to stop one noncompliant or malicious program.

Second, Apple doesn't want any runtimes becoming critical components of the iPhone. They don't want Java or .Net or a DOS emulator with intellectual property out of Apple's control to become a Gatekeeper for any significant number of applications on the IPhone. Apple wants to be the only gatekeeper and it's up to the buyer to decide if that is a good thing, a bad thing, or a mix of both.

Re:Just Silliness (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354301)

You are missing the point. The SDK agreement said no interpreters, if you allow one you have a set a precedent and have to allow any and all through, and these may not be so harmless.

Brainfuck (1)

Lord Lode (1290856) | about 5 years ago | (#29353897)

Damn so it's forbidden to release any app that can actually some Turing complete code? I guess a Brainfuck app for the iPhone is out of the question too then!

Re:Brainfuck (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354101)

I think you accidentally a word.

Re:Brainfuck (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354217)

I guess a Brainfuck app for the iPhone is out of the question too then!

You forget that Apple is very inconsistent [slashdot.org] .

Ugh ... vendor lock-in, iFail, etc. (1)

LS1 Brains (1054672) | about 5 years ago | (#29353935)

I suppose this is being marketed on some guise of consumer protection, but for anyone who reads /. it can only be yet another instance of "Apple wants us to buy into the iPhone? Seriously?"

As more devices become available, I believe that Android will look all that more attractive, if for no other reason than freedom. I can't fathom developing any application when one of the design criteria is "don't develop any feature Apple might get upset about."

This is what makes corporations EVIL (1)

Skapare (16644) | about 5 years ago | (#29353945)

... by releasing crippleware.

Intentional or oversight? (1)

evil_aar0n (1001515) | about 5 years ago | (#29353981)

If this was intentional, I can imagine Apple would be none too happy. Might even yank the developer's credentials. If it's an oversight, I'm surprised it got by testers.

Exactly why I don't buy Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29353999)

Support free/open source! This shows why I wouldn't buy a cell phone like the iphone. It's not my-phone, it's Steve's phone. the i is = Steve. Yeah, it's cool and such, but the costs of ownership (you pay Apple to restrict your property!) just isn't worth it.

Looks like... (4, Funny)

zr-rifle (677585) | about 5 years ago | (#29354021)

...they learned how to jailbreak their Commodore 64 too...

Legalize and Encourage Jail Breaking (1)

ad454 (325846) | about 5 years ago | (#29354045)

More and more companies are looking to Apple as an example on how to lock down their platforms. Expect other companies (Microsoft, Amazon, Google, etc.) to start doing the same type of lockdown with their devices/OS. So, unless you plan on living in a cave the rest of your life counting your toes, boycotting flagship tech companies is not practical. The only real solution is to legalize and strengthen fair use, so that jail breaking and other DRM circumvention is completely legal and encouraged.

Once you jailbreak an iPhone and iPod Touch, it becomes an awesome portable Unix device. I have jailbroken nearly a dozen iPhones/iPodTouches for friends and family, and tell everyone to do the same.

I am still very disappointed that Google did not release their Google Voice app onto the Cydia, Icy, and other alternative app stores.

The US and other governments should also declare Apple's App Store to be an illegal monopoly for their platform and force Apple to allow other app stores to work without jailbreaking/hacking their devices.

Re:Legalize and Encourage Jail Breaking (1)

DragonWriter (970822) | about 5 years ago | (#29354189)

I am still very disappointed that Google did not release their Google Voice app onto the Cydia, Icy, and other alternative app stores.

Since they instead put the missing features which would be covered by a special app into the mobile web interface (they were always in the "regular" web interface) to Google Voice so you don't need an app at all, I don't see why anyone would be disappointed.

Re:Legalize and Encourage Jail Breaking (1)

Joe Tie. (567096) | about 5 years ago | (#29354283)

Half a year ago I'd have agreed. I'm just tired of it now though. The novelty of jailbreaking has worn off, and now I'm just getting weary of all the hastles which go with it. The api changes, waiting for cracks for every new upgrade, having to check to make sure the jailbreaking method is stable for each release, every update meaning some apps will stop working for a while and may or may never get the functionality back. It's getting monotonous.

Re:Legalize and Encourage Jail Breaking (3, Insightful)

99BottlesOfBeerInMyF (813746) | about 5 years ago | (#29354325)

More and more companies are looking to Apple as an example on how to lock down their platforms.

True. Hopefully some others will come up with a better model that provides the advantages of the iPhone's lock-in without the disadvantages.

The only real solution is to legalize and strengthen fair use, so that jail breaking and other DRM circumvention is completely legal and encouraged.

That actually won't matter much. The real solution is to deal with the antitrust issues in adjacent markets so we can have properly operating competition and someone can make a better solution without having to kowtow to AT&T and the MPAA and RIAA and several other criminal gatekeepers.

The US and other governments should also declare Apple's App Store to be an illegal monopoly for their platform...

That's not how antitrust law should or does work. The iPhone is only one (admittedly high profile) player in a very large and diverse marketplace. Apple has done nothing to undermine any market in their technical decisions for the iPhone (although some of their partners have). In terms of antitrust law, in fact, Apple is one of the victims being forced to make choices that get them fewer sales because of illegal actions by their partners.

If people don't like iPhones being locked down, they can effectively vote with their wallets and buy any number of other phones both for use on AT&T's network or another. Apple has, in no way leveraged any monopoly influence in any market in what they're doing with the ecosystem for apps on the iPhone.

Apple ph33rs (1)

idontgno (624372) | about 5 years ago | (#29354047)

the power of POKE [ready64.org] .

And rightly, too. It's iPhone red pill.

The Point? (4, Funny)

Ritz_Just_Ritz (883997) | about 5 years ago | (#29354091)

"By setting the keyboard to 'always on', launching a game and restarting BASIC, players got into the 'empty shell' of their C64 emulator."
---

Next thing you know they'll block my app that allows users to connect a cassette tape drive. The nerve....

Apple Hates Geeks (5, Insightful)

popo (107611) | about 5 years ago | (#29354207)

No seriously. Apple hates geeks. This isn't flamebait, btw.

Apple loves the image-conscious, visual-creative crowd that accepts the functionality they're given, wrapped up in beautifully designed packages.

But ultimately Apple's corporate strategy can be summed up in one word: Control. They want to control where you buy your music, what you do with your devices, and how you interact with other users. All of this 'control' of course is driven by profit motives.

But geeks ultimately represent a loss of control. Geeks love to tinker... They love to expand functionality. They're innovators. And worst of all from Apple's perspective: They create options.

Options are the enemy of a carefully structured system which drives users towards Apple's sacred points-of-purchase.

Options are the opposite of 'control'.

For all of Apple's "Think Different" public image, the reality is that Apple encourages nothing of the sort: "Think Alike" is the mission. And they prove it at every turn.

Apple fanboys will probably mod this flamebait. It isn't. I have multiple computers and phones, and own an iPhone and a Mac. But I'm constantly being made aware that my PC represents a nearly infinite amount of options in every usage category -- where Apple railroads me into a pre-approved (albeit always compatible) solution.

Choice (1)

Yaos (804128) | about 5 years ago | (#29354219)

They took it down because it could give users of the application choice, Apple is all about not giving the user choice.

Nonstory (4, Insightful)

MBCook (132727) | about 5 years ago | (#29354257)

This is a non-story. They weren't allowed to sell the app because it had BASIC. They snuck BASIC in, and Apple pulled it since they weren't allowed to sell it.

This is not news.

We don't need the "Apple should allow..." discussion. We had that 2 days ago when this was approved. And the last app that did something. And two before. And the next one.

This isn't a story. "Apple does exactly what it said it would." Call CNN.

Naughty Naughty (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29354289)

Naughty naughty Apple children, you have been misbehaving and Mommy and Daddy are going to have to take your shiny new toy away until you learn to behave. We are very disappointed and this is why you can't have nice things.

Now run along, and don't think we don't know you have been reading those reviews of Android-based phones - we found the magazines under your bed. No you can't have an HTC Hero.

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