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The Gathering Storm Discussion

Soulskill posted more than 4 years ago | from the read-and-find-out dept.

Books 186

Just over two years ago, fans of the Wheel of Time fantasy book series mourned the death of writer James Oliver Rigney Jr. — a.k.a. Robert Jordan. After much deliberation by Jordan's wife (who also edits the series), author Brandon Sanderson was chosen to finish the series. Sanderson familiarized himself with Jordan's notes and said that they would require three more books, which he hopes to release with about a year between them. On October 27th, the first new Wheel of Time book since Jordan's death was released, titled The Gathering Storm. Early reviews for the book seem quite positive, so here's a place to discuss it. Be warned: comments may contain spoilers.

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First Posthumous comment (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927051)

First Posthumous comment

Amazon and B&N readers give it good reviews. (3, Insightful)

Sri Ramkrishna (1856) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927055)

I've been reading the reviews from readers on Barnes and Noble and Amazon and it's been uniformly positive. That's quite an achievement to pass it on to another author and still be able to capture the flavor of the series.

Re:Amazon and B&N readers give it good reviews (-1, Troll)

impaledsunset (1337701) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927089)

You and all slashdotters suck cock anyway.

Re:Amazon and B&N readers give it good reviews (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927135)

He could have passed it on to Piers Anthony or Brian Herbert and it would have been better than the dross he'd been putting into print. Seriously, does anyone think he ever intended to end the series?

Re:Amazon and B&N readers give it good reviews (5, Informative)

neverpsyked (578012) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927457)

I picked up the book yesterday afternoon, and finished it just before midnight. (Yes, I actually do retain what I read. No, I don't skip anything.)

The characters are all the same people, but Sanderson's versions seem more chatty, and slightly "larger" than Jordan's... I know that's not clear, but somehow Sanderson's intervention has resulted in more detailed character development.

The book is non-stop action. Jordan's last 3 books were *almost* boring - the plot pace had slowed to a crawl. Not true in this book: if anything, it feels like falling down a water slide. Numerous plot elements are wrapped up in just this first book. A lot of those burning questions about who's dead and who's alive are answered. Unlike Jordan's previous volumes, I could actually see this one as a movie (is that good or bad?).

I enjoyed it thoroughly. It was worth the money and the time (though my 6 hours are a pittance compared to the days some of you will spend reading it). I'm already loaning it out to other Jordan fans to read.

Re:Amazon and B&N readers give it good reviews (2, Funny)

NEDHead (1651195) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927999)

Are they available from CliffNotes?

Re:Amazon and B&N readers give it good reviews (1)

DerekLyons (302214) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928191)

This isn't surprising, or even useful. The folks who ordered the book and have written reviews in the 48 odd hours since they would have released are predisposed to like it.
 
Not to mention they're likely punch drunk from having stayed up two nights running in order to finish this doorstop.

Don't wanna (-1, Troll)

macraig (621737) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927081)

I don't wanna discuss it, since I haven't read it.

First freakin' post, BTW... my first ever on /.

Re:Don't wanna (0, Offtopic)

dschmit1 (1353767) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927101)

Burned. Bummer.

Re:Don't wanna (0, Offtopic)

macraig (621737) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927181)

Hey, it showed no other posts as I typed, so what wuz I supposed to think? Stupid Slashdot UI!

Re:Don't wanna (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927239)

Because no one else is _ever_ typing a comment at the exact same time you are. And there's certainly _no_ chance they could be ready to hit the "post" button just about the time you're ready to hit the "comment" button.

Re:Don't wanna (0, Offtopic)

macraig (621737) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927275)

No, there's really not!

Re:Don't wanna (1)

aicrules (819392) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927121)

Your mistake was trying to add reasoning and thought into your frist psot.

Re:Don't wanna (1)

Moderatbastard (808662) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927979)

True that. One, it'll most likely slow you down so that you'll fail it. Secondly, even if you do produce a relevant worthwhile FP, you'll get modded redundant anyway.

Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (-1, Troll)

BadAnalogyGuy (945258) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927083)

I'm not saying that Robert Jordan is one of the standard Sci-fi/Fantasy authors who simply couldn't write a good story to save their lives. It's just that the vast majority of this genre is little better than unillustrated comic books, and most of the readership is too unversed in other forms of literature to provide an objective opinion about a book's quality.

When people hold up Bradbury over Vonnegut or Niven over Murakami, you know that they aren't reading anything but pulp.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927145)

snob

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

ajs (35943) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927893)

Dang. Here, I crafted a long-winded reply with lots of examples, and you manage to sum it up in one word. Well done, sir.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (3, Insightful)

eviloverlordx (99809) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927173)

That's awfully presumptuous. Unless you can objectively compare a Vonnegut story to a Niven story, it's all just a matter of (somewhat) informed opinion. I like Lucifer's Hammer more than Moby Dick. Is it better or even as good? Hard to say.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (4, Funny)

JerryLove (1158461) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927221)

When people hold up Bradbury over Vonnegut or Niven over Murakami, you know that they aren't reading anything but pulp.

Actually, I know they are reading Bradbury, Connegut, Niven and Mudakami.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

Grimbleton (1034446) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928081)

Exactly. Pulp. :D

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (4, Insightful)

Aladrin (926209) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927241)

Right. Because reading a book for enjoyment is nothing. You should read them for 'culture' or some other highfalutin crap.

If someone enjoys Bradbury more than Vonnegut, then they do. It's that simple. They are free to say so, even.

I actually like Vonnegut, but that isn't the point. I read different books for different reasons.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (-1, Flamebait)

BadAnalogyGuy (945258) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927293)

Hey, someone's reading Dan Brown's stuff.

Someone's also eating shit out of a cup. I prefer to try keeping an objective view of the available consumables and the people who consume them.

Maybe that makes me a snob.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927755)

As literate as you are, I'm surprised you don't know the difference between objective and "When people hold up Bradbury over Vonnegut or Niven over Murakami, you know that they aren't reading anything but pulp."

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927407)

man that is giving Bradbury serious short shrift. His books speak of death, autumn, and the cycle of life like no one else.

Try reading October Country, you can smell and feel the crisp autumn air...

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (0)

mcgrew (92797) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927569)

OK, I don't much care for Bradbury's writings (maybe I should read him again now that I'm more geezerly) and do like Vonnegut, but Niven is a good writer with a great imagination. I hadn't heard of Murakami before, so I looked him up on wikipedia. I don't see how a non-native English speaker could be a better writer IN ENGLISH than an accomplished, talented guy like Niven.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

BadAnalogyGuy (945258) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927603)

I don't see how a non-native English speaker could be a better writer IN ENGLISH than an accomplished, talented guy like Niven.

Nabokov didn't speak English as his first language, yet he is head and shoulders better than most native speaking authors.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

YouWantFriesWithThat (1123591) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927627)

I don't see how a non-native English speaker could be a better writer IN ENGLISH...

Umberto Eco. full stop.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

Attila Dimedici (1036002) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927815)

Umberto Eco is a terrible author if you read his stuff for anything other than to study the complicated ways that English can be used. The vast majority of people who buy books by Umberto Eco do so to prove how "high brow" they are.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

YouWantFriesWithThat (1123591) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927973)

The vast majority of people who buy books by Umberto Eco do so to prove how "high brow" they are.

the vast majority of assumptions are incorrect, but if you are right that's their loss. i love Foucault's Pendulum and the Name of the Rose.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

Attila Dimedici (1036002) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928001)

the vast majority of assumptions are incorrect, but if you are right that's their loss. i love Foucault's Pendulum and the Name of the Rose.

I'm sorry.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

YouWantFriesWithThat (1123591) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928067)

aren't the vast differences in experiences and opinions that we can glean out of life delightful?

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

nidarus (240160) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927713)

I don't see how a non-native English speaker could be a better writer IN ENGLISH than an accomplished, talented guy like Niven.

He isn't. He writes in Japanese.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927579)

i was an english literature major and i think Vonnegut sucks. so my anecdote trumps yours (appeal to authority)

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

kalirion (728907) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927615)

I enjoy a Kit Kat bar more than caviar. OH NOES, THAT MAKES ME HOPELESS!!!

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (0, Troll)

BadAnalogyGuy (945258) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927673)

I'm not trying to be judgmental, actually. If you like Kit Kat better than caviar, bully for you.

The world needs ditch diggers too.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

ericrost (1049312) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928133)

Yes, but the world doesn't really need pompous, caviar swilling, judgmental assholes to much, now does it?

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29928183)

Give yourself a break.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (4, Interesting)

ajs (35943) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927867)

I'm not saying that Robert Jordan is one of the standard Sci-fi/Fantasy authors who simply couldn't write a good story to save their lives.

This is true of all genres. That you limited your analysis to SF/Fantasy shows that you have an axe to grind.

It's just that the vast majority of this genre is little better than unillustrated comic books,

You've now isolated a medium and displayed yet another bias which is absurd.

and most of the readership is too unversed in other forms of literature to provide an objective opinion about a book's quality.

Also true for every genre.

When people hold up Bradbury over Vonnegut or Niven over Murakami, you know that they aren't reading anything but pulp.

I'm not sure that I see what you're driving at. Are you suggesting that Vonnegut, for example, is a pulp author, or are you suggesting that people who cite Vonnegut also read pulp (whatever that is)?

I've read some excellent sharecropper SF. I've read some truly horrendous socio/political fiction. I have yet to run into a genre without an excellent author (though I'll admit that I haven't read a modern romance author worth slogging through). Sure, there are Mercedes Lackeys [wikipedia.org] and Peter Davids [wikipedia.org] out there (both of whom I've read and enjoyed in the same way that I enjoy ice cream, which can be very hard to make well), but when I read Ian M. Banks [wikipedia.org] or Jonathan Letham [wikipedia.org] I get something very different out of the experience. There is a craftsmanship of story that really has nothing to do with genre (as evidenced by the fact that I selected two authors whose SF and non-SF works are well respected).

Any given genre, however, is not only about authorship. Vernor Vinge [wikipedia.org] is a good author, but he's certainly not the best I've read. His novels are deeply insightful when it comes to the future of humankind and technology, though. It's exceedingly rare that those two qualities come together in one author, and so I'm willing to give a good amount of ground. This is also why I enjoy Neil Stephenson's [wikipedia.org] work, who can be brilliant at times, but isn't exactly what I'd call a god of characterization.

To sum up, your statements about the genres of science fiction and fantasy evidence either a profound lack of exposure to either or such a deeply jaded palate that I can't imagine you being able to read more than one or two books a decade that you enjoy.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

IICV (652597) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928287)

It's just that the vast majority of this genre is little better than unillustrated comic books

What.

Go read the Sandman series and see if you can still say that again. Go read Transmetropolitan and see if your statement still makes sense. Go read Watchmen and see if you still have that opinion.

Just because you have read shitty comics does not mean that all comics are shitty.

Re:Most Sci-fi/Fantasy is teen-lit fare (1)

obarthelemy (160321) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928291)

For some reason, Bradbury stuff has always resonated strongly with me. Maybe because I got into it at the right age (12-ish), maybe because, much later, I'm still very indifferent to style, focusing instead on ideas and evocative power. Probably because I'm an escapist and much prefer wildly irrealistic / slightly poetic stuff to too much realism.

I also love K. Dick, which for some reason is much more appreciated here in France than he is in the US. He certainly does NOT write well, but the ideas and stories are interesting.

Anyway, I don't think Bradbury is pulp, and I'd like to see you explain why you say it is.

Some thoughts on the series (5, Insightful)

chrisG23 (812077) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927117)

I first started reading the books when I was a senior in high school, I thought the series was amazing at first, especially after the first book, and then the next two or three. Then after that it started to drag. Alot. Nothing significant was happening. Or seemingly random significant things were happening to stir up the plot. I gave up halfway through book 6 or 7 out of boredom and a sense of futility.

High school was a long time ago, and since then I've broadened my reading interests, read more genres, literature, poetry, more diverse offerings in the "Fantasy" genre, and I took a stab at reading the Wheel of Time again. Read the first book.

It sucked. Hard. All the way through.

Just my opinion, I'm not right or wrong but thats how I feel about it. If you enjoy these books thats great, different strokes for different folks, but this is a big non-story to me, except about milking a cow thats been on life support for dehydration for years and years.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927199)

I'd still say the first three books were great. 4-8 were deadly, and where most people gave up. 9 was great, 10 was complete WTF boredom, and 11 was a page-turner if I ever read one - for one thing, the story in 9 and 11 was actually GOING somewhere again.

So yeah. Read 1-3. Internet summaries for 4-8. Read 9. Survive 10... somehow. Read 11.

12? Wait and see. :)

Very helpful, thanks (1)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928343)

I was thinking about reading some of these again, but the sheer number of volumes was really daunting. It's nice to have a guide to how to move through and enjoy them...

Heck, if I managed to read all the way through Harry Turtledove's "Homeward Bound", I'm sure I can take whatever level of tedium book 10 of this series throws at me.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (3, Interesting)

Samalie (1016193) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927229)

I too started WoT in high school (actually, it might have been my last year of Jr. High)

And while I'll agree that reading them now is just not the same...on the same token, the majority of the books are not bad...just average.

The new book...I'm about 2/3 of the way through it, and Sanderson has done a good job at capturing the flavor of the books. And there is definite movement to the end (Book 14 I believe? Expected November 2011)

I accept that the books now suck for you...but they're not really bad books. Jordan milked the series for all its worth without a doubt, and a couple of the books were almost painful to read, and I swear to god if I have to read about the character's opinions about blades of grass again I might resurrect Jordan just to kill him again, but still, its decent fantasy.

Now if ony George R. R. Martin could get out a book faster than 1 every 6 years, I'd be happier. Fucking 4 1/2 years since Feast of Crows and still no next book in sight.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

Adolf Hipster (1486687) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927261)

I was at a reading Martin gave of the first chapter of the next book. That was like 3 years ago. At least there will be a Game of Thrones tv series, that hopefully won't suck

Re:Some thoughts on the series (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927383)

Every couple of months Amazon asks me if I still want my pre-order of the next Thrones book.

I see where he went wrong doing half a book and expecting the other half to come along quietly, but the 6 years thing has more to do with him writing more Wildcards stuff, and editing anthologies.

At least if he was spending his time working on the Thrones HBO series I might find it easier to take.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927389)

Now if ony George R. R. Martin could get out a book faster than 1 every 6 years, I'd be happier. Fucking 4 1/2 years since Feast of Crows and still no next book in sight.

Yeah, well...that kind of thing should at least shut up the people who whine that GRRM is milking the series. Dude would be releasing a lot more often if that were true. I just worry that if the HBO series is successful, the child actors are going to grow up faster than he can finish the last books.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

Red Flayer (890720) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927585)

I just worry that if the HBO series is successful, the child actors are going to grow up faster than he can finish the last books.

Dude, this is George RR Martin. He foresaw and headed off this problem by killing all the characters.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

jimbobborg (128330) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927451)

Seriously. The next book is already written, WTH is taking so long to publish it? And now a TV series? Finish the books! You can milk the merchandising later. Sheesh!

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

darkvizier (703808) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927477)

I'm just starting on the first couple chapters. It seems good to me so far. Some sections of the prologue were kind of random but that's nothing new. Partly it's that it's been a long time since I've read the previous book, and partly I expect things to be tied in more as the book progresses.

I read Elantris and was really impressed, so I have high expectations for Brandon Sanderson's work on this series. He knows how to build the proper amount of tension to keep you turning the pages, and he knows when to wrap things up. I think he has a good chance of revitalizing it and making it once again a series worth recommending.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

Grimbleton (1034446) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928135)

Adjusting skirts and tugging braids. While glaring.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1, Offtopic)

Abcd1234 (188840) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927291)

Just my opinion, I'm not right or wrong but thats how I feel about it. If you enjoy these books thats great, different strokes for different folks, but this is a big non-story to me

Well, isn't it nice of you, then, to take some precious time out of your day to comment on this non-story...

Re:Some thoughts on the series (2, Funny)

Aladrin (926209) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927337)

I recently re-read the series. Well, that's not accurate. I read 1-3, then half of 4 before switching to a series of summaries online. The summaries quit at 8, so I skim-read 9-11. (Reading when it was entertaining, skimming when it wasn't.)

I was amazed at how much I had forgotten... But I was even more amazed at how much was packed into book 1 compared to Books 4-11. I think they could easily have compressed 4-11 into 3 books, and maybe 2.

Jordan said those books 'wrote themselves' and it's pretty obvious the difference between him writing the book and the book writing itself.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (3, Informative)

herring0 (1286926) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927929)

I started reading the series as a freshman in high school shortly after the third book came out. I was so impressed that I took the time to write Jordan and managed to carry on a good bit of letter writing back and forth for about a year.

Oddly enough (and I think it REALLY shows) at the time Jordan himself said he expected that he had enough 'story' for about seven books all told. I don't know what changed, or if he just lost his way, but I can say I was irritated that most of the books around 4 and later had at best half a book's worth of material in it.

I'll finish the series as I am usually running out of things to read anyhow but I didn't even realize that this latest book had come out.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

nomadic (141991) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927445)

I liked WoT better when it was called Dune.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

Etherized (1038092) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927499)

From my perspective, WoT is no better or worse than the average fluff fantasy fare, and while that genre hasn't evolved much in the last 15 years my own standards have. Had WoT stopped at 3 books, I would have been satisfied with it as a largely unremarkable but mostly competent series.

Instead, the series now certainly is remarkable, albeit more for its astounding length than for its actual quality. I imagine that it rivals or exceeds the volume of everything Tolkien ever published about Middle Earth, making the Lord of the Rings trilogy look like a short story in comparison. What about the WoT universe demands such a thorough treatment?

Personally, I became bored with the entire fluff fantasy genre before the series was completed, so I suppose I'll never really know.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

shutdown -p now (807394) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927725)

I first started reading the books when I was a senior in high school, I thought the series was amazing at first, especially after the first book, and then the next two or three. Then after that it started to drag. Alot. Nothing significant was happening. Or seemingly random significant things were happening to stir up the plot. I gave up halfway through book 6 or 7 out of boredom and a sense of futility.

Had the same feeling, though I've noticed the clear foot-dragging tendency in the first book already, and got bored to hell and left on the third one.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

COMON$ (806135) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927751)

Ya I just read the first book this past year, (family member got it for me for Christmas). I have been putting off reading them for years. After finishing the first book I felt a bit robbed, I still havent felt up to reading the second book although is going to be more about getting back to the world rather that the storyline. In my opinion the Terry Goodkind books are far more entertaining although they got quite monotonous at least things happened in them rather than the...the trip took 6 days...on day one...over and over and over...

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

Dragonslicer (991472) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928285)

In my opinion the Terry Goodkind books are far more entertaining although they got quite monotonous at least things happened in them rather than the...the trip took 6 days...on day one...over and over and over...

I think this is why I won't bother reading Wheel of Time. After four or five Terry Goodkind books, I felt like I was in Groundhog Day. "Main character gets a new wife then saves the world" isn't quite as exciting the fifth time around. From what I've heard and read online, Wheel of Time is pretty much the same, except with twice as many books.

Of course, I have an entire shelf of Terry Pratchett books, so my opinions may be atypical.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

Tyr_7BE (461429) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927767)

I'd have to agree. It was great when I was younger, but since then my tastes have expanded somewhat.

I got into it about the same time, maybe junior high. I was pretty much riveted until the end of book 7 or 8. Then it got *really old* *really fast*. However, I was so smitten with the series back when I was a teen that I made a solemn promise to myself that I would finish the series, no matter what. And here we are, with me approaching 30, and damnit I am still determined to finish this, one way or another. I read book 11 (is that the latest? I don't even care) recently and somehow managed to plod through it. I'll finish the series, but only out of pure determination.

Re:Some thoughts on the series (1)

DerekLyons (302214) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928229)

There's a reason why, along with Duke Nukem, this series is considered iconic - but in neither case is it complimentary.

News Flash: (0, Troll)

ljhiller (40044) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927161)

New WoT book released; nobody notices for 3 days.

Re:News Flash: (1)

nangus (1026732) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927299)

New WoT book released; nobody notices for 3 days.

The reason that no one noticed was, because fanatics of the series where not expecting even the announcement that there is another book incoming for another 2-3 years.

Re:News Flash: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927483)

The reason that no one noticed was, because fanatics of the series where not expecting even the announcement that there is another book incoming for another 2-3 years.

No, the real reason nobody commented was that the real fans were too busy reading...

Re:News Flash: (2, Informative)

Again (1351325) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927505)

New WoT book released; nobody notices for 3 days.

Actually we were all at home reading the book. I almost skipped work so that I could sit at home and read but I refrained. And yes, it was awesome. I am now on my reread already.

worth picking up? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927185)

I finally gave up in digust around the first hundred pages of Winter's Heart. I think the annoying, ridiculously weird Perrin/Faile relationship was the last straw.

Is it worth picking up again, just to see the conclusion? I can make it through three more books if Stuff Actually Happens.

Re:worth picking up? (1)

coolsnowmen (695297) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927335)

Tor started releasing the prologs before the book came out by that time, so I think the extra long prologs (100pgs) for books 9/10/11 were intentionally supposed to be mini-background stories that could be read independent of the main-character story arcs. It was something wet the pallets or perspective readers and appease die hard fans with something to read until the next book came out. Ask me if the book is good in about a month, I read slowly unlike a lot of people I know, and I just bought the book last night (signed!)

Re:worth picking up? (1)

Again (1351325) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927589)

I finally gave up in digust around the first hundred pages of Winter's Heart. I think the annoying, ridiculously weird Perrin/Faile relationship was the last straw.

So you missed the end of Winter's Heart?! Wow. Go back and read the end if nothing else.

Is it worth picking up again, just to see the conclusion? I can make it through three more books if Stuff Actually Happens.

I say yes, but then I liked Crossroads of Twilight.

Re:worth picking up? (1)

kalirion (728907) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927711)

So you missed the end of Winter's Heart?! Wow. Go back and read the end if nothing else.

Yeah, the end was awesome, but it should have been at least 3 chapters instead of just one. You're basically shown the opening moves of a bunch of fights, and then taken straight to the conclusion. Would've been nice to see what actually happened in at least a few of those...

Jordan was a hack (0, Troll)

Adolf Hipster (1486687) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927187)

Seriously. This series was terrible.

Spolier Alert. (5, Funny)

TheWizardTim (599546) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927231)

IT'S A COOKBOOK!

my thoughts (4, Insightful)

bornyesterday (888994) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927339)

To get ready for the release, I reread the series last month. Like most people who were fans of the series I had been disappointed with the slowing pace and complexity of the story in the later books. What I realized last month was that a lot of that slowness was because of the time between the releases of the books. As the series got longer and longer, I was less likely to reread the entire series before a new book came out. But reading it all at once definitely helps everything work much better. It's not that "nothing" happens in those later books, it's that so much smaller stuff happens, that it's nearly impossible to keep it all in your mind. After rereading the series, I was incredibly excited about TGS.

So I went out and bought it Tuesday after work. I finished it on Wednesday. Sanderson does a great job of channeling the early Jordan. I don't know how much of the text was directly written by Jordan, but in the book several storylines are moved forward and a few of them are actually resolved. (Yes! Really!) The book does primarily focus on Rand, over Mat and Perrin, which was a complaint about several of the later books, but I think anyone who had gotten tired of Rand's attitude and behavior will like how the book ends. Egwene and the split of the White Tower is the other primary storyline that is dealt with, and I think that part of the story is perhaps some of the best since the first 3-4 books. There is still a ridiculous amount of stuff going on that isn't explained (yet), but it all feels like it's building in a way that will resolve itself that will be very exciting to read. With Knife of Dreams, you could definitely tell that Jordan was trying to pick up speed with his story, which makes sense, as he had already been diagnosed with amyloidosis and was trying to get as much finished as he could. And that increasing pace definitely is continued in TGS. There are still points where it slows down, but it's mostly done in short scenes with the other characters, which gives the appearance of that same tension and plot speed.

And there are a couple of very, very big shockers. I definitely can't wait for the next two books.

Re:my thoughts (1)

Again (1351325) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927523)

And there are a couple of very, very big shockers. I definitely can't wait for the next two books.

Oh yeah. I am still reeling.

Re:my thoughts (1)

clem (5683) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928309)

Spoiler Alert: skirts smoothed, prophesy quoted, various factions discuss their innate superiority to other factions.

I didn't even realize this book was coming out. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927381)

Seriously, walked into Wal-Mart, saw it. Will check for lower prices before I buy a copy though. Not like I haven't been able to buy most of the rest of the series on remainder. Even in dollar stores. So no hurry.

I did think it was interesting that they said "Oh, there's just one book left" which I was skeptical about being accurate, and what do you know...one book, three volumes.

But I'm still waiting on the next book in ASOIAF. So I''ll probably pick this one up.

Eventually.

Re:I didn't even realize this book was coming out. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927647)

Oh how interesting. What did you have for breakfast then?

My Opinion (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927411)

This book is a triumph. Bought it on the first day, read it all day long. Very immersive and quite similar to Jordan's writing style...only problem is that some peoples' mannerisms changed (ie, the word 'ain't' suddenly popped into existence.)
Regardless, I recommend buying it if you have not done so already.

PS: Kinda SPOILER here...

Rand gets out of his emo whiny thing.

Re:My Opinion (1)

Again (1351325) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927565)

Rand gets out of his emo whiny thing.

And dips into serious narcissism that is no longer just self-destructive, is everyone around him destructive.

And Nynaeve continues the awesomeness that she started in KoD.

Sanderson is a very good writer (2, Interesting)

JoshuaZ (1134087) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927413)

Sanderson wrote the Mistborn trilogy which is the best fantasy series I've read in a long time. The characters and setting were very well developed. He used an extremely original system of magic that was well-thought out. He also gave a lot of thought to how the magic system would impact society. All very well done. I'm almost a bit worried that we have this great new guy and he needs to waste him time finishing Robert Jordan's magnum opus. Sanderson probably has far more original thoughts floating in his head. I want to read more of those, not see him finishing up Wheel of Time.

book-a-minute summaries (5, Funny)

Noke (8971) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927433)

The Eye of the World (Book 1):

Rand al'Thor
        Tam is my father.

(Nothing happens. Then, nothing happens. Then, unexpectedly, nothing happens. Everything is FRAUGHT with PORTENT.)

Moiraine
        Everybody come with me.

Everybody
        No. Well, ok.

(They travel a LOT. Something happens that isn't explained. Something happens that doesn't make sense. Something happens.)

Rand al'Thor
        Tam is my father.

THE (predictable, cliched, dumb) END

The Great Hunt (Book 2):
Rand al'Thor

        I want to do something. But doing this something is probably what the Aes Sedai want me to do, so I will do something else. But doing that something else may be what they want me to do, because they think I think they want me to do the first thing, so I'll decide to do this other thing instead. So I'll just do the first thing, since I want to do it anyway. Screw them.

(Repeat seven hundred times.)

THE END

The Dragon Reborn (Book 3):
Rand al'Thor
        Being the Dragon Reborn stinks. I'm out of here.

(Moiraine and the gang CHASE him. But even though they are on HORSES, and he is WALKING, they never CATCH UP. This is supposed to be MYSTERIOUS but is really just a plot CONVENIENCE for Robert JORDAN.)

Perrin
        I hate wolves.

(Mat and others show up out of NOWHERE. This is supposed to be MYSTERIOUS but is really just a plot CONVENIENCE for Robert JORDAN.)

Rand al'Thor
        I am the Dragon Reborn. (kills the EVIL SUPREME BAD GUY)

Robert Jordan
        Fooled you! That wasn't really the EVIL SUPREME BAD GUY! Now I can write forty more books!

THE END

The Shadow Rising (Book 4):

(Everybody HATES Rand, so he BEATS them until they OBEY.)

Rand
        I have conquered all sorts of stuff, because I rule.

(Gibbers to self. Five hundred pages pass.)

THE END

The Fires of Heaven (Book 5):

Rand
        I found an artifact which gives me limitless power. I think I shall brick it up behind a wall.

(A female character SNIFFS and thinks about her NECKLINE.)

THE END

Lord of Chaos (Book 6):

Rand
        I have a secret plan, but I won't tell you about it.

THE END

A Crown of Swords (Book 7):

Rand
        Now my secret plan shall be unleashed! Here it is. Are you ready? Are you sure you're ready? I'm going to make it look like I'm attacking this guy. But THEN I will attack some OTHER guy.

(He DOES, and it ALMOST WORKS.)

THE END

The Path of Daggers (Book 8):

Mazrim Taim
        I am evil, yaargh! Fear me!

Spooky Voice of Lews Therin
        Rand, kill Taim.

Rand
        Being powerful sucks. I will brood.

THE END

Winter's Heart (Book 9):

Perrin
        I was going to rescue my wife, but that will have to wait for the next book.

Mat
        I was going to escape with my friends, but that will have to wait for the next book.

Egwene
        I was going to attack Tar Valon, but that will have to wait for the next book.

THE END

Crossroads of Twilight (Book 10):
(Rand BROODS and DREAMS about his THREE WOMEN.)

Minor Characters
        There is a large use of the One Power over there. (repeat indefinitely)

Perrin
        I was going to save my wife, but that will have to wait for the next book.

Egwene
        I was going to attack Tar Valon, but I won't finish it until the next book.

Mat
        I might flirt with Tuon in the next book.

THE END

New Spring (Book 11):

Reader
        I was going to wait for the next book, but that will have to wait for the next book.

THE END

Re:book-a-minute summaries (1)

gitoffmylawn! (1639005) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927797)

LOL, I never read any of these books, but I thought this post was funny.

Re:book-a-minute summaries (4, Informative)

Abcd1234 (188840) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927817)

Hilarious! But the least you could do is cite the original source [rinkworks.com] . Well, unless your goal was uncredited plagiarism, in which case, bravo, mission accomplished!

Re:book-a-minute summaries (3, Interesting)

Noke (8971) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928013)

Thanks for finding that. I had these summaries transcribed in an old email and couldn't remember the original source other than it was called 'book-a-minute summaries'.

Re:book-a-minute summaries (0)

15Bit (940730) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928027)

Yup, that just about sums it all up

Not Surprising (0, Flamebait)

GrubLord (1662041) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927469)

Of course it's going to be a damn good Wheel of Time book: the new author is a great deal better than Robert Jordan ever was. It's almost a shame he's wasting his talent on continuing this series, though... it's going to cause me physical pain to have to read through any more of Jordan's repetitive, derivative crap just to get to the new book.

Spoilers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927479)

Snape kills Dumbledore.
Soylent Green is people.
Bruce Willis was dead the whole time.
.
.
.
Captcha word: Writers
What?

Re:Spoilers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927573)

Vader is Luke's father.

Re:Spoilers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927619)

More spoilers
Moby Dick is the name of the sled.
The butler killed Roger Ackroyd.
Han Solo is really Luke Skywalker's father.
Scarlett decided she doesn't like Rhett after all, and opened up a dress shop in Chicago.
The crew of the ship manage to patch the leak in the nick of time, and Titanic sails on-- everybody is saved.

Harry Potter doesn't have any magical powers after all-- he was faking it all along. The twist is, everybody at Hogwarts was faking it.

Spoiler Alert? (0)

drunkenkatori (85423) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927493)

How can you have spoilers for a Wheel of Time book? What with all the hair/skirt/whatever fiddling, height comparisons, and other stock text larding up the books plus the lack of plot, how could you not know what is going to happen?

Re:Spoiler Alert? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927849)

How can you have spoilers for a Wheel of Time book? What with all the hair/skirt/whatever fiddling, height comparisons, and other stock text larding up the books plus the lack of plot, how could you not know what is going to happen?

Hint: Brrrrrrrraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnnnsssssssssss

Don't dip your pen in the company ink. (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Psychopath (18031) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927567)

Jordan's wife (who also edits the series)

And that right there is the problem with roughly half of the books in this series; weak editing. No one appeared to be keeping Jordan in control and preventing him from spinning off more and more subplots that did little or nothing to move the story forward. Literally thousands of pages where major plot elements were barely even touched upon. I don't presume to understand how the relationship works when you're married to your editor, but it must have some kind of impact on how criticism is applied and conveyed.

I still really enjoy the series as an overall work. I'll definitely read the new one when it's available in an ebook format. I just wish Jordan had had a good editor so he could have finished his masterpiece himself.

Re:Don't dip your pen in the company ink. (1, Interesting)

darkvizier (703808) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927749)

I think a lot of people are in the same boat. I know I am... I love the universe and the intricacies of the plot, but some serious editing work is needed. What I would like to see once the story is finished is say... books 7-11 summarized into two books and re-released. I doubt it will happen though.

Re:Don't dip your pen in the company ink. (1, Interesting)

codegen (103601) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927887)

The back notes of the first book originally stated it was the first book in a series of 6-8 books. If he had kept to that schedule, it would have been a great series. However some of the middle books of the series are nothing but filler. I remember reading one and afterwords felt that I wanted not only my money back but the time I spent reading it.

Re:Don't dip your pen in the company ink. (0)

ericrost (1049312) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928333)

And this is the major problem with the series really, idiot fans who will read whatever pages he wiped his ass with regardless of their content or quality... listen to yourself, its horribly edited, rambling, but I'll DEFINITELY read it. They know they can put out crap and you somehow feel you've put too much into it to turn back. Sounds like a great reason to write 30 more books to me.

I'll wait (1)

Relden (1030180) | more than 4 years ago | (#29927687)

I'll read it, but I'll wait until all three (or however many it ends up being) books are published. I'm getting tired of fantasy authors who are constantly deferring their series, splitting the next book into one or two or three, missing deadlines, etc. etc. Yeah, I mean you too George R.R. Martin. Get of the film set for Game of Thrones show and finish the damn book! I wonder if the publishers get the authors to do this deliberately to try and maintain attention on a series that takes decades to complete.

Bad History (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927741)

This happened to several series I followed as a young man.

Asimov's Foundation Series
Didn't get past the first few chapters of Brin's book. Thought he was putting too much of himself into it. Never gave the other authors a chance.

Herbert's Dune Chronicles
Initial excitement turned to confusion when 6 prequels were written. I read the first and ignored the rest. My expectations were low for the 2 finale books. But even then I was terribly disappointed. Now that the series has more than double in size I'm of the opinion that this is being done for dollars rather than literary value.

THE ONLY RULE TO FOLLOW when finishing another author's series:

Work for continuity with what was established before and keep your own ideas out of it.

I'll wager (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29927871)

Sanderson familiarized himself with Jordan's notes

I'll wager that wasn't all he familiarized himself with. Once the initial grief is over widow's are horny as hell. Fact.

Have faith in Brandon Sanderson (4, Insightful)

mephistus (217351) | more than 4 years ago | (#29928003)

When Brandon Sanderson was tapped as the man to finish this series of books, I picked up Mistborn to see what I could expect from his writing style. After I read Mistborn, I was hooked on his writing style and have since read the rest of his Mistborn series, as well as Elantris, and Warbreaker. I haven't read his young adult fiction, but it's apparently been well received. The thing that I like about Sanderson as opposed to Jordan are that a) he isn't afraid to kill a main character, especially if they're likable, b) his pacing of the book makes reading a challenge so that you don't read it too fast, as opposed to dragging through 15 pages of braid pulling and disapproving looks. However, their similarities are that Mr. Sanderson does as good of a job of character development as Robert Jordan, and Sanderson's development of political and interpersonal intrigue is usually a little better and more to the point than Jordan's.

I think that Harriet did an excellent job choosing Brandon Sanderson to finish her husband's work. It's true that Mr. Jordan became a victim of his success earlier in the series, trying to keep so many threads going at the same time, never daring to kill more than the occasional character, and perhaps trying too hard to develop additional character stories at the expense of the initial handful of major characters. However I look forward to reading this book, and hopefully the final two books. I think that if what I've read of Brandon Sanderson's other work is indicative of how he'll treat the remainder of Robert Jordan's storyline, then it will be a great read.

TACO (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29928085)

Conduct3d Tat MIT

NOT a Wheel of Time book (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#29928379)

I don't exactly know what this book is. Fanfic, maybe? Authorized fanfic? Whatever. But despite the "official sanction," it can't be a Wheel of Time book. REAL Wheel of Time fans should just boycot it. All it does is encourage some other asshat to rape the franchise again, and again, and again. The true Author died. Get over it. Wheel of Time is over. Now all you will be able to have is a series of fakes, written by someone who apparently prefers leeching off a dead guy's creativity to exhibiting any of his own. What a farking affront to the fine profession of wordcraft.

/FYI - I'm not even a fan of the WoT books. I gave it a shot, but never really connected with the characters or the style. I'm still offended by the rape of the Author's legacy, though.

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