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Android 2.0 — Competition Against the iPhone and the Rest

Soulskill posted about 5 years ago | from the just-stop-the-commercials dept.

Android 347

GMGruman writes "Every few months, it seems, there is a new 'iPhone killer.' Android 2.0, in the guise of the Motorola Droid, is the latest such 'killer.' But what will it really take to beat or match the iPhone (single page), and does Android or any other mobile OS have the right stuff? There's a lot more to the answer than is usually discussed. This article takes a look at the strengths that may allow Droid and Android 2.0 to provide strong competition to devices like the iPhone and the Blackberry, as well as the obstacles it continues to face that could inhibit adoption."

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What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (4, Insightful)

Old97 (1341297) | about 5 years ago | (#29931429)

Really. There will always be some number of viable devices competing. Each will appeal to some group that values its strengths over what the others have to offer. The only way iPhone can fail is to lose to several competitors, not just one. The iPhone isn't the market leader now. So how can one phone or O/S kill the iPhone or anything else?

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (4, Insightful)

pete6677 (681676) | about 5 years ago | (#29931599)

The biggest reason this will not be an iPod killer is that it is made by Motorola, a bloated bureaucratic mess of a company known for poor quality. The Razr was a disaster. How will they compete with more stylish Apple or more nimble LG?

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (5, Insightful)

bored_engineer (951004) | about 5 years ago | (#29931865)

The Razr was a disaster.

Really? The Razr is commonly touted as Motorola's last great success. I knew several people who bought, and were happy with, the Razr, including my wife. I considered one, but decided that I'd rather keep the LG that randomly stops working. (I'm not a big fan of ubiquitous communication.)

To respond to your point more directly, Motorola are not competing by themselves. they're using a form factor that is proven (see Nokia devices for several examples.) Motorola are using an OS that has already seen modest success; an OS sharpened by a company (google) who strive for ubiquity. The Droid also has some components that the iPhone is missing.

As long as their implementation is sound, I see no reason why Verizon, Motorola and Google shouldn't enjoy profits from the Droid. They are entering an established market; each is an experienced competitor; and there are lots of us who have been shut out of the iPhone market because we are Verizon customers. (I've heard complaints, but frankly, I've had nothing but positive experience with the company.) Further, Verizon seems to be marketing this harder than Motorola or Google. I have modest respect for Verizon, and find it difficult to believe that they would allow Motorola to sully their name.

I believe that this phone will enjoy moderate success. It doesn't have the cachet of Apple, but it's entering a market with a good deal of potential. Besides, Motorola is getting hungry: They played a big part in defining the cell phone market, and they nearly died by failing to follow through with their earlier success. Motorola has lots to lose, and I think that they really want to get it right.

All that aside, I figure that it's an open platform. If Motorola really gets it wrong, within 3 months, I'll be able to update it with a more friendly platform. I've already told my wife that she's getting one, and finally, after 7 years with the same phone, I intend to buy a new phone.

Maybe you hate Motorola phones, but I'm really looking forward to the Droid. I hope that it lives up to my expectations.

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (3, Insightful)

aliquis (678370) | about 5 years ago | (#29932561)

The Droid also has some components that the iPhone is missing.

Let's just correct this, though I know it was in the news item to.

It's not "The Droid", it's "Motorola Sholes". The Droid name seem to be something Verizon will put into the names of their Android phones. Also on the HTC Eres if that was the name of that phone.

Also before it was released I was hoping for something special, atleast in the lines of HTCs Sense UI. But now it looks like it's a basic and standard Android 2.0 installation with nothing special in it (not necessary a bad thing.) So if we get some other Android 2.0 phones, which I'm sure we will, they will have all the (software) benefits of the Motorola Sholes.

So that leaves it at the upgraded hardware compared to for instance the HTC phones.

So is this a remarkable new truly unique phone which will kick the iPhones butt? Most likely not. It's just an evolutionary upgrade of the Android phones, which will continue to evolve.

Personally I'd take an Android phone over the iPhone any day no matter what if it can "kill" the iPhone or not. Let's just hope the number of applications and quality catches up (which it may or may not ..), it would be kinda weird to complain on how the iPhone is vendor locked in while it still has more features and software. Open and free doesn't become much better if it actually suck when used.

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931875)

The Razr was a disaster

Really? Then I wonder why it made headlines [npd.com] in 2008 Q3 when the iPhone 3G outsold the RAZR in the US.

How will they compete with more stylish Apple or more nimble LG?

I don't know, maybe make a good phone instead of a shiny one?

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (4, Insightful)

fullgandoo (1188759) | about 5 years ago | (#29931919)

I bought the original Razr when it just came into market. It was a great phone. Beautifully designed, sleek and stylish even by today's standards.

Too bad Motorola had monkeys design the user interface and idiots write the software. Completely fucked up a superbly designed piece of hardware.

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (4, Insightful)

davester666 (731373) | about 5 years ago | (#29932417)

Um, I believe the 'monkeys' you are referring to work for the major carriers in the US. Each of the carriers decided that the phone needed to be customized for their specific customers (maybe they've classified which kind of idiot signs up with them). This of course makes advertising the capabilities of the phone itself difficult (at least in the US) for Motorola, as the UI and even what features the phone had was totally different from carrier to carrier (other than, "You can dial a number on it").

I am sure that (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931951)

IPhone killer doesn't mean IPod killer but you read want you want....
I however don't confuse frosting with function, and while the Iphone IS very stylish, I prefer substance over style and the Iphone was harder to use without looking at it, slower to do the things I really needed it to do and tethered to a crappy phone company with LOUSY coverage. Granted the coverage issue might just be in my area but that is what counts in my book.
I have a fully functioning PDA that does what the Iphone does better fatser and with a longer battery life. All in one devices just seem to fall short in too many areas.

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931605)

This is especially true considering that the iPhone is essentially a single model with multiple revisions, whereas Android is an OS. The Android OS will almost certainly sell more than the iPhone device, but the ramifications aren't nearly as straightforward as comparing one device with more sales than another -- especially from a developer's perspective.

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (5, Insightful)

Admiral Ag (829695) | about 5 years ago | (#29932227)

I disagree.

Both Android and the iPhone OS are ultraportable computing platforms. The iPhone isn't really a phone per se, but a mobile computing device with phone functionality. Apple will even sell you one sans phone if you want it.

Successful competitors to the iPhone will be those that understand that the point is to make a better ultraportable computing platform, not necessarily a better phone. I think Google may be able to do that, but I don't think RIM can, and Microsoft's development team appears to be a circular firing squad.

As usual, competition is only good for end users, so I hope Android does well.

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (1, Funny)

dangitman (862676) | about 5 years ago | (#29931703)

It means a psychopathic serial killer who has a fetish for sucking the ions directly from the heart of a still-functioning iPhone battery, and then has a TV cop drama made about him.

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (1)

Coward Anonymous (110649) | about 5 years ago | (#29931969)

"iPhone killer" means that everyone sees the writing on the wall - namely Apple is poised to dominate the smart phone market (and possibly the handheld gaming market as well as the general mobile electronics market, GPS for example) like it currently dominates the mp3 player market. It hasn't happened yet and may not happen but everyone is betting that it will given current competition, hence the search for the "iPhone killer".

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931979)


[close down (non-us) bracket]
[bracket]

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http:/ mer # /www.c.*.com/
http:/ mer # /www.ch.*.com/gtb?d/
http:/ mer # /c.*e.co.?m/

[close square bracket]
[open up parenthesis]

==>

I'm called AutoIntellgentVirus (non-bio)
I registered and /. my password got lost on the way
How do I get my free mod point?
And what does my code look like in a mirror?

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (5, Funny)

InlawBiker (1124825) | about 5 years ago | (#29932071)

Shhh! It gives journalists something to write about, and the headline is really catchy. Just shut up and consume.

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932181)

I phone is secure. Unfortunately it is the first to the seen so everyone jumped at the opportunity to make apps and such for it. There for It has the biggest program base for avg users. It will take quite a while for the others to catch up.

iPhone Killer (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932201)

An iPhone killer is someone who chains a faggot to the back of a pickup truck and drags him for 2 miles.

Re:What does "iPhone killer" even mean? (1)

gearloos (816828) | about 5 years ago | (#29932503)

Simply said, bullshit

Android 256MB App Storage Limit (0, Troll)

jo42 (227475) | about 5 years ago | (#29931463)

What all the Android fanbois don't know, or tell you, is that Android has a 256 MB [androidandme.com] app storage limit. While Apple limits you to 2 GB for your maximum app size download. Google, just WTF where you thinking?

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (0)

UnknownSoldier (67820) | about 5 years ago | (#29931499)

Over-rated & Non issue.

The iPhone won't let you download apps over 10 Megs over 3G and instead asks for you use WiFi, let me know of _any_ iPhone apps that over 256 Megs.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (5, Informative)

amRadioHed (463061) | about 5 years ago | (#29931553)

The problem he's referring to is that the combined size of all your apps is 256MB on current phones, this isn't an individual app limit.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (2, Insightful)

Ost99 (101831) | about 5 years ago | (#29931767)

It's not a real problem.
Several options exists to install apps to the SD-card.

It's also possible for individual apps (like games) to store everything but the executable on the SD-card.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931651)

It's not a non-issue for anyone who has an interest in installing apps or who has actually used an iPhone--it's not uncommon for people to have 500MB or more of applications installed. I only have about 40 apps, occupying about 330MB, on my iPhone. I consider myself fairly conservative in what I install, and already I can't switch to Android, even assuming all the same apps exist at the same file sizes (which obviously they do not).

The iPhone won't let you download apps over 10 Megs over 3G and instead asks for you use WiFi

What does that have to do with anything? Why would you want to download the giant apps over 3G in the first place? 3G is still ten times slower than the basic Comcast cable modem (don't believe that 3Mbit advertised speed--from any carrier.) It remains to be seen whether Google will place a 3G transfer limit to its app store when and if it ever reaches a size that requires some management decisions.

Any single iPhone app can be up to 2GB in size.

Any single Android app can only be 256MB in size, and if any app uses that allowance, it's the only one you can install on the phone.

let me know of _any_ iPhone apps that over 256 Megs.

Plenty. The TomTom app is over 1.2GB, for starters. Also, read carefully: Android has a 256MB limit for total app storage. Not individual applications, but everything. That's not nearly enough space unless all you install are 1MB widget-apps.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

woobie (101637) | about 5 years ago | (#29931667)

Apps can store data on the SD card.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932079)

Any single Android app can only be 256MB in size, and if any app uses that allowance, it's the only one you can install on the phone.

Bullshit. Maybe if you pulled your head out of Steve Jobs ass, it might improve your reading comprehension.

Also, read carefully: Android has a 256MB limit for total app storage.

No. YOU read carefully:

Android has no such limit. That particular phone has 256MB for total app storage. It is not an Android limit, regardless of how much you might want it to be.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

Nerftoe (74385) | about 5 years ago | (#29931665)

This one [tomtom.com] is over 1 GB.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (2, Informative)

drawfour (791912) | about 5 years ago | (#29931669)

Google Earth is over 10MB (I don't know the size, I just know I had to use wifi instead of 3G). Also, if you get any of the navigation programs like Navigon or TomTom, which contain all of the maps locally, you run into the problem. (People who frequently go into areas with bad 3G coverage may want an app that has map data locally -- otherwise no signal means no navigation.)

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

arb phd slp (1144717) | about 5 years ago | (#29931677)

Proloquo2Go is 235MB. Add some user-generated content (which is what that app is for) and it would go over 256 easily.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (2, Informative)

Mr2001 (90979) | about 5 years ago | (#29932089)

Data, like Proloquo2Go's media files and user-generated content, can go on the SD card. Only the executable needs to be in the phone's internal memory.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

Karlt1 (231423) | about 5 years ago | (#29931699)

The iPhone won't let you download apps over 10 Megs over 3G and instead asks for you use WiFi, let me know of _any_ iPhone apps that over 256 Megs.

256MB is the total size of all apps that are allowed on the phone.

As far as apps that are larger than 256MB, besides the three or four GPS navigation apps that store all of the map data on the phone, Myst is 727MB. I'm sure there are a few others.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932099)

256MB is the total size of all apps that are allowed on the phone.

I keep seeing this repeated, but nobody has presented any proof.

The article presented says that the motorola Droid has 256MB. This does not mean that Android limits you to 256MB. It means that specific phone has 256MB.

If someone told you that a particular Dell laptop had 512MB of RAM, would you assume, and then emphatically state that was because Windows or Linux prevented you from installing more? If not, why do you assert that Android has such a limitation?

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

RudeIota (1131331) | about 5 years ago | (#29931707)

Navigon. 1.2GB

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

SolusSD (680489) | about 5 years ago | (#29932383)

myst, tomtom gps, i'm sure there are tons of others.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (0, Flamebait)

timmarhy (659436) | about 5 years ago | (#29931511)

i think it's very amusing you refer to android fanbois, but fail to make reference to apple fanbois who are 10 times more rabid.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

aristotle-dude (626586) | about 5 years ago | (#29931719)

i think it's very amusing you refer to android fanbois, but fail to make reference to apple fanbois who are 10 times more rabid.

How is your opinion of apple users relevant to the discussion?

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931813)

It's not. He just felt like being a douchebag.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (2, Funny)

timmarhy (659436) | about 5 years ago | (#29932231)

i rest my case.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (2, Informative)

Dominic_Mazzoni (125164) | about 5 years ago | (#29931649)

Applications can store all of their data files and resources on your SD card. Many do already. It's just the executable code that has to be installed locally.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

dangitman (862676) | about 5 years ago | (#29931725)

Applications can store all of their data files and resources on your SD card. Many do already. It's just the executable code that has to be installed locally.

So convenient!

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931663)

What all the Android fanbois don't know, or tell you, is that Android has a 256 MB app storage limit.

No. Please learn to read. That phone has 256MB for app storage. My G1 dev phone as 1.5GB for app storage (because I've only got a 2GB card in it, and I wanted some room for ringtones, etc.)

Google, just WTF where you thinking?

Considering it was Motorola that designed the Droid, why would you think that Google had anything to do with it?

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

mgblst (80109) | about 5 years ago | (#29932435)

You are right. But just because Motorola designed the phone, doesn't mean google had nothing to do with it. I imagine that google would be heavily involved in the technical process, making recommendations, improving the experience, etc. Especially considering this is the first device to have Android 2.0, as well as real GPS navigation.

This is as much a google device as it is Motorola.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931753)

Android is open source. Just remove the limit in the code and reinstall, if you really need more than 256 megs. Problem solved.

ARM with 256MB memory (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931889)

Yeah this machine have 256M of memory. But for this cpu architecture that's fine.
The device will include a microSD with at least 16G to store all your apps. (my low end phone have a 1G...)
Oh and by the way, the same chipset run quake3 smothly...

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (4, Informative)

cliffjumper222 (229876) | about 5 years ago | (#29931891)

This is NOT an Android limit. It is a limit of the flash memory that the manufacturer decides to put in their phones. Moto decided to put just 512MB on their device, probably because that was the biggest size they could stack. Adding more would require a separate chip, like a Samsung MoviNAND (basically an SD card in IC package) that would take up more PCB room. But if they had laid down moviNAND they could have got 2G, 4G, 8G or maybe even more. There will be plenty of multi gigabyte Android devices out there in 2010.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931895)

That's nothing compared to the fact that there isn't any android phone with 3d acceleration. The iPhone/ITouch have OpenGL ES.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (2, Informative)

dagamer34 (1012833) | about 5 years ago | (#29932093)

The hardware is definitely there. The API stack will come later.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (4, Informative)

Mr2001 (90979) | about 5 years ago | (#29932107)

That's nothing compared to the fact that there isn't any android phone with 3d acceleration.

False. The G1 has 3D acceleration and supports OpenGL ES. Here's a video [youtube.com] of a demo program you can download from the Android Market.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

maglor_83 (856254) | about 5 years ago | (#29932065)

From the information in your link, this is not quite true. Android doesn't allow apps to be installed to an SD card. This means that in the Droid, there is a 256MB limit. However, other Android devices have much more ROM, allowing more space for apps.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

hedwards (940851) | about 5 years ago | (#29932095)

I'm curious as to why you think that's such a problem. I'm sure that some people are going to hate the limit on that, however, I doubt that most people will even notice. Even the much hated ITMS only sold a small hand full of songs to the majority of iPod owners being far too few to represent a meaningful lock in.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (2, Informative)

wrench turner (725017) | about 5 years ago | (#29932113)

Android 2.0 (eclair) lets you store apps on the SD card. The Droid is not limited to 256MB app storage.

Re:Android 256MB App Storage Limit (1)

gearloos (816828) | about 5 years ago | (#29932441)

well, first of all dumass, the 32A has that limit, the 32B is actually lower. The amount of available memory is irrelevant as the size of the average app is what, 128k ? lolz Well, I don't even think about it anyway as I have app2sd which now gives me... hmm lets see... 16gb... ok iPhone, try that.

Not iPhone, but others may be at risk. (2, Interesting)

Desert Raven (52125) | about 5 years ago | (#29931467)

I don't think it will be an iPhone killer. At best, it will slow Apple's growth to a significant degree. However, with it's exchange integration, etc, it could take a measurable chunk from Blackberry.

And, as a long-time Palm user, this will likely be the last nail in the coffin for Palm. I'd decided months ago that the replacement for my 700p was not likely to be another Palm, but nothing was really grabbing me. I was resigned to go to a crackberry. Now though, I may end up an early buyer of the Droid.

My wife will almost certainly get one, since she was on the edge of buying a GPS device.

Re:Not iPhone, but others may be at risk. (1)

lewko (195646) | about 5 years ago | (#29931659)

I'm a very long time Palm user, and I have been hanging for the Pre to replace my aging Treo 680.

However, with the speculation that Australia is going to miss out in the near future, I'm tired waiting.

Giving serious consideration to the iPhone and hoping I can learn to live without a keyboard.

Would also be interested in Android, however the hardware choices are overwhelming (Motorola, HTC et al). At least with the Palm or Apple, you are only required to choose from one or two models.

Re:Not iPhone, but others may be at risk. (1)

symbolset (646467) | about 5 years ago | (#29931855)

Would also be interested in Android, however the hardware choices are overwhelming (Motorola, HTC et al). At least with the Palm or Apple, you are only required to choose from one or two models.

Not sure if serious... Um, too much choice is bad? Really? You're going to go with that?

I liked the article. I don't agree with everything, but it was a well researched article with lots of citations. I don't see Android as an iPhone killer, but more of an everything-else killer and a cool tool in its own right. It's also being used for the Nook ebook reader and some other things.

Certainly WiMo is dead. It's killed every pocket computer it ever ran on. The prospect of being required to use that dog practically killed the category. To try and release a new product on it would require some serious amnesia.

Re:Not iPhone, but others may be at risk. (1)

MichaelSmith (789609) | about 5 years ago | (#29931897)

hoping I can learn to live without a keyboard.

I use an openmoko with an on screen keyboard. I don't miss a dedicated keyboard with moving parts. My sons ipod has the same keyboard as the iphone. I find it easy to use and he taps out emails like a pro.

No Single Killer. (4, Interesting)

LurkerXXX (667952) | about 5 years ago | (#29931481)

I hope there's no single 'killer'. Diversity is a good thing, it gives choice and keeps competition driving things forward. It won't be too many years before pretty much all phones are smart phones, and there's a lot of room in the phone market for a lot of vendor's to exist and profit.

So here's to hoping we see a nice market share for iPhones's OS, Android, Maemo, WebOS, and Windows Mobile.

Re:No Single Killer. (0)

hyperz69 (1226464) | about 5 years ago | (#29931559)

I know who the Iphone Killer is... It was the Butler!

Re:No Single Killer. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931787)

The real, silent killer, will be the Chinese cheap copies

Already preordered my Droid (4, Interesting)

CajunArson (465943) | about 5 years ago | (#29931487)

It comes down to carriers, and Verizon Wireless does have excellent coverage. I'm on an expired contract so I could have jumped to AT&T without any penalties, but the Droid has got what I've always wanted: a phone that's open enough to let me hack for fun, while also polished enough that I don't have to hack it just to make the basics work.

The fastest way to fail (1, Insightful)

buchner.johannes (1139593) | about 5 years ago | (#29931491)

is to market yourself as a 'iPhone killer'

Re:The fastest way to fail (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931549)

Agreed. IMHO, Motorola already failed with their iDon't commercial -- especially since they show it 4-5 times per hour. Wouldn't their time be better spent showing off the product rather than badmouthing the competition?

[Disclaimer: I don't have a smartphone, and I don't want one.]

I'm a Mac -- And I'm a PC (1)

tepples (727027) | about 5 years ago | (#29931841)

Wouldn't their time be better spent showing off the product rather than badmouthing the competition?

Look who's talking. As SanDisk and Motorola dis Apple in their "iDon't" ad campaigns, Apple continues to dis Microsoft in the "Get a Mac" series. iDon't Care [youtube.com] examines the badmouthing on both sides.

Re:The fastest way to fail (1)

Homburg (213427) | about 5 years ago | (#29931567)

is to market yourself as a 'iPhone killer'

Which is very specifically what they seem to be doing with the Droid [youtube.com] . A list of more-or-less random things that the iPhone doesn't do, with no real attempt to explain why you might want to do these things, or concrete vision of how the Droid might enhance your life in a way the iPhone doesn't.

Admittedly, it's not as bad as T-Mobile's ad for the MyTouch 3G [youtube.com] (aka the HTC Magic), with its meaningless "100% you" slogan, which appears to add up to, erm, being able to change the wallpaper.

Why does Apple seem to be the only company that has any idea how to market a smartphone?

Re:The fastest way to fail (3, Interesting)

LurkerXXX (667952) | about 5 years ago | (#29931801)

I think the Droid campaign has been brilliant so far, and has stirred up a lot of interest and buzz about the phone.

As a Pre owner, I wish Palm had done something like that instead of using the strange scary-lady ads that didn't do anything for anyone.

My bet is when the Droid is actually launched, you will see those ads showing what it can do that the iPhone can't and why it's cool.

What has me puzzled is why Nokia hasn't got any commercials out for it's N900. It runs a Debian Linux variant, and runs full flash right now, and it's hardware is superior to the Droids in some ways. Why they aren't shouting about it from the rooftops, I don't know.

Re:The fastest way to fail (1)

tepples (727027) | about 5 years ago | (#29931861)

What has me puzzled is why Nokia hasn't got any commercials out for it's N900.

No U.S. carrier partner is probably part of the reason. (That and the fact that U.S. carriers don't give a discount for bringing your own phone.) Or has that changed?

The Iphone is not the Mona Lisa of Tech! (0)

hyperz69 (1226464) | about 5 years ago | (#29931545)

2 Things bothered me

1) It forgets to mention the 1 major thing that gave the Iphone such a major push forward. Marketing! *well image too but takes part of Marketing* It talks briefly how Verizon isn't very Market Savvy *serious... Can you hear me now? No matter how annoying... got you thinking Verizon* which seems like totally BS and made my brain shut off for the rest of the article.

2) This article also overlooks what the Droid and Android 2.0 do, that other smart phones don't do. It skipped over how it innovates and simply compares features that exist. What about Google Navigation? Voice recognition? What about what the Iphone lacks like... a KEYBOARD. The only thing they didn't compare was App stores *seriously if someone says over 100,000 apps again I will strangle you with strangulation.ipa*

Overall the article stank of... HEY Android is gonna fail cause it's not a Iphone *make out with 32 GB 3GS*. It was laced with jabs at how Symbian is Old and Rim is no good on the web. It felt like secret Apple love...

I really hope the Droid is a massive success just so in 2 years we can have a Slashdot article listing everyone who was terribly wrong, this can be number 1.

Re:The Iphone is not the Mona Lisa of Tech! (2, Informative)

dangitman (862676) | about 5 years ago | (#29931759)

Was your post written in English 2.0?

Re:The Iphone is not the Mona Lisa of Tech! (1)

MichaelSmith (789609) | about 5 years ago | (#29931769)

the 1 major thing that gave the Iphone such a major push forward. Marketing! *well image too but takes part of Marketing*

I think there is a little bit of clever code which sells those iphones. When you press and drag your finger on the application launcher the launcher exactly follows the movement of the finger. It does it too fast to measure a delay, and is accurate to the nearest pixel. Its a fantastic UI. It behaves more like a real world object than any UI I have seen anywhere.

Re:The Iphone is not the Mona Lisa of Tech! (1)

honkycat (249849) | about 5 years ago | (#29932443)

I think it's the jiggle. Many of the interface responses are as if you're sliding things around on jello. It's cute, but I think it's also the key to the convincing physicality-- you don't notice little errors in tracking because you expect small deviations from your motion. If the code realizes it made a mistake, it can just smoothly jiggle itself to where it should have been. Definitely clever.

Re:The Iphone is not the Mona Lisa of Tech! (4, Insightful)

onefriedrice (1171917) | about 5 years ago | (#29931869)

1) It forgets to mention the 1 major thing that gave the Iphone such a major push forward. Marketing!

Actually, I'd say the major thing that gave the iPhone such a major push was the fact that it was the best thing at the time. People seem to have forgotten the awful "smart" phones we had before Apple decided to shake things up. The iPhone may or may not still be the best thing around (I don't know), but it seems to me we probably would have no Android today without the fresh competition Apple provided.

So will Android devices overtake the iPhone? Well I sure hope so. It would be pretty sad indeed if Android wasn't able to gain any headway seeing as how it will be on multiple devices and multiple networks and there is only one iPhone on one network. Ultimately, I think Android will be considered a success, but I also think it won't have much impact on Apple.

Re:The Iphone is not the Mona Lisa of Tech! (1)

Microlith (54737) | about 5 years ago | (#29931963)

It is, however, the Mona Lisa of user experience and that is a huge reason it's attracted both people who have never used a smartphone before and those who had been using WinMo and Blackberries.

Android based phones will battle it out with WinMo for space in the non-vendor-specific OS market. RIM will continue to have their loyal holdouts but I suspect both the iPhone and Android will eat into their pie. Nokia will go its own way with Maemo and Symbian.

Also:

1 - Verizon's marketing for the DROID was utter crap. The vast majority of people don't care about "open," in fact I suspect Verizon hates it. People have to be told -why- they should get that phone. Geeks already know that shit. I don't because the N900 is coming and Maemo is more open than (and is an actual Linux distro compared to) Android. Also, CDMA.

2 - Google Navigation is not exclusive to the Droid, between TomTom's app and Google, it could lose that. Also, if the lack of a keyboard was -any- hindrance at all it sure didn't show. Anyone who -wanted- a keyboard would be looking for alternatives anyway.

Android won't fail, but it won't reach anywhere near the popularity of the iPhone. The experience is just too slick for the majority of people, and the rest probably don't care. Or like me, they see something that's slightly better.

Re:The Iphone is not the Mona Lisa of Tech! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932291)

All you physical keyboards fanboys will be oh so disappointed with the future of technology, or oh so swallowing your own words. These guys are making phones with physical keyboards because that's the only way of getting the "tech" crew on their side. That's their marketing. That was Palm's, that was HTC's, and that's Motorola's, so you guys can praise them for listening to you. They are not listening to you, they are just using the keyboards as a device to win you over so you envangelize their products, and someday they'll gradually reduce the number of models with physical keyboards and do the obvious next (in fact the already past) step. And then you'll be "Oh yeah but NOW it makes sense, not back then!". It will be rather amusing.

Horrible Article (4, Insightful)

BlueBoxSW.com (745855) | about 5 years ago | (#29931595)

I hate to say it, but it just made no sense and backed up almost none of the opinions it presented.

You can't kill the iphone by trying to copy it. You have to:

1) Find a way to steal it's best customers in a way it can't keep up with.

2) Wait for it to get big, fat, and lazy.

Just copying the leader may get you investment dollars, but it won't get you market share.

Re:Horrible Article (1)

dbcad7 (771464) | about 5 years ago | (#29931873)

Yes I agree that the article was bad.. Your post was also "as bad", because you have twice in your post said "COPY".. which shows that you have no idea about Android, what it does, it's history, or how it compares.. To inform you a bit, may help you understand what is going on.. First, Android as a platform is taking off.. Where as there was a few months ago.. 1 phone, at 1 carrier, by 1 manufacturer.. there are now multiple carriers and multiple manufacturers.. Sprint has good offerings with affordable plans.. Verizon has excellent offerings at the same plan pricing that AT&T offers, and T Mobile who has been with Android the whole time has also increased what they offer, as well as reducing the plan pricing.. Will the iPhone die ?.. no of course not.. Will people who now have all these choices of manufacturers and carriers buy Android ?.. Absolutely.. Will there be iPhone users who switch to Android ?.. yes there will.. Can Apple maintain a dominance over all this competition ?.. You tell me... Anyone who can not see how big a deal this really is, has probably not even used and Android phone, and have there head in the sand (or other places).. Sit back and watch what happens, as more and more people grudgingly head to the cell phone store to see what all the fuss is about...

Re:Horrible Article (1)

BlueBoxSW.com (745855) | about 5 years ago | (#29932111)

History may prove me wrong, but for now I'll stick with my use of the word "COPY".

Re:Horrible Article (5, Insightful)

Darkness404 (1287218) | about 5 years ago | (#29932067)

And Android (not just Droid, or Verizon, but Android) is doing that. Right now the iPhone is tied into AT&T, if you are on T-Mobile, Sprint or Verizon you can't use the iPhone without some difficulty. Android will eventually be available no matter which phone company you prefer. Then there is the variety of hardware. Someone who doesn't like using a touchscreen for typing won't like the iPhone, yet the G1, Droid and other Android phones have physical keyboards and if you prefer an all touchscreen phone the Magic and Hero phones have that.

The ability not to have to jump ship for the "latest and greatest" might be a huge feature of Android, especially if you are tied into a contract. While some phones will be carrier exclusive without a doubt, Android itself is cross-network. Android's power is not int he G1, Magic, Droid, Hero or any other phone but in the fact it can easily saturate the market better than any other platform currently offered. When even "dumb phones" can run the apps you have written for Android, it is going to reach more of the market than Apple's high-end exclusive offerings and make it easier than "jump through hoops to get it to run without using expensive data plans" problems that JavaME has.

Conway's life (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931709)

If you really want to beat apple come with a hashlife implementation of conways life like golly. Isn't this obvious? Goggle should be paying me to develop Android.

it's the apps, stupid (1)

markov_chain (202465) | about 5 years ago | (#29931771)

This happened before, with Windows. Any platform that doesn't run the enormous legacy app base will have a hard time getting market share.

The situation is now even worse- there is an entity which controls the hardware (AT&T, not Apple!), far different from the free-for-all PC ecosystem.

One problem killing the iPhone... (5, Insightful)

RalphBNumbers (655475) | about 5 years ago | (#29931847)

One problem killing the iPhone, is that most of the iPhone's weaknesses are one policy change away from disappearing.

Enough people want background apps? Well there they are.
Enough people want customizable lock screens? Alright, that's easy enough.
Enough people want shared file storage? There, done.
Enough people want post-hoc approval of apps, like Android? No problem, it'll save Apple time and money to boot.
Enough people want unsigned apps distributed outside the app store? Ok, here you go.
Enough people want Flash, or other browser plugins? Fine, Adobe has been clamoring to put Flash on iPhone since it's inception.
Enough people want root access? Fine, administration is their problem.

Apple keeps those measures of control because they help to protect their platform's image from incompetent or unscrupulous coders, and their negative impact on most users is relatively minor. If that balance ever shifts, either due to more competent coders (supposedly Flash 10.1 is heavily optimized) or more demanding users (with friends whose phones do some or all of the above), the rules can change in an instant.

Re:One problem killing the iPhone... (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932043)

But by changing the rules they allow for the iPhone to become just another smartphone. That coupled with being on a single carrier isn't going to do much for their future.

Re:One problem killing the iPhone... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932135)

Apple keeps those measures of control because they help to protect their platform's image from incompetent or unscrupulous coders, and their negative impact on most users is relatively minor.

Ya you nailed it right, thats why they rejected Google voice app.

Re:One problem killing the iPhone... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932137)

Uh no, apple doesn't let the iphone have flash becuase of $$$$. Thats all.

Article already out of date (2, Interesting)

tomhudson (43916) | about 5 years ago | (#29931849)

FTFA:

And for most of the world, Nokia's Symbian is king

Even Nokia is abandoning Symbian for maemo http://maemo.nokia.com/ [nokia.com]

Maemo brings the power of computers to mobile devices. Designed with the internet at its core, Linux-based Maemo software takes us into a new era of mobile computing.

Maemo is available on the Nokia N900 - a high-performance mobile computer with a powerful processor, large internal storage, and sharp touch-screen display.

Re:Article already out of date (1)

Microlith (54737) | about 5 years ago | (#29931999)

They're only abandoning it in the smartphone area. It'll still be the base OS for their featurephones.

Re:Article already out of date (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932191)

They are not abandoning Symbian on their smartphones, the N900 isn't listed as a smartphone

Re:Article already out of date (3, Interesting)

tomhudson (43916) | about 5 years ago | (#29932313)

  1. They are NOT going to be using Symbian in the future for any phone that will compete with the iPhone.
  2. Feature creep - eventually most phones will be smartphones, because it won't be economically viable to make a non-smartphone, same as motherboards without built-in networking, or laptops without a webcam, or 14" vga computer monitors, or telephone answering machines are all either non-existent or niche products.

Trying to get a "dumb phone" in 5 years will be like trying to get a cell phone that doesn't do anything except make phone calls today. They pretty much all do sms, web surfing, mp3, java games, etc.

The phone is the network (1)

sunderland56 (621843) | about 5 years ago | (#29931893)

There is no true competition in phones. If you want an iPhone you must go AT&T, if you want Android you currently will go T-Mobile, and so on.

Once all phones are available on all networks, you will be able to have a valid feature comparison. Until then, choices will always be a combination of (how great the phone is) + (how much the carrier sucks).

Re:The phone is the network (1)

aristotle-dude (626586) | about 5 years ago | (#29931937)

There is no true competition in phones. If you want an iPhone you must go AT&T, if you want Android you currently will go T-Mobile, and so on.

Seriously, stop being so damn myopic. Look around you and see all of the GSM carriers in other countries that are doing just fine with the iPhone and look at the happy iPhone users in the US not posting on the internet to complain about living in San Francisco on AT&T. The rest of the world gets it, SF sucks for AT&T service.

how to beat the man (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29931923)

the trick here is to realize that pricks, jerks, average citizens, private citizens and d-bags alike see the I in iphone and think, "hey, it's mine. it's better than everyone elses." it gives them all some odd sense of entitlement. beat that and you've beaten apple.

the end.

Well, of course (1)

fm6 (162816) | about 5 years ago | (#29931957)

Every few months, it seems, there is a new 'iPhone killer.'

Well, duh. Every new product generates hype, and to trend-conscious techies, the most obvious hype is that it's the "killer" of whatever product is already trendy. And, as you may have noticed, most new products these days are cell phones.

But have you ever heard of the latest blivet killer actually killing off the blivet? You have not. Market shifts don't happen that way. This "killer" meme is content-free marketing noise.

Totally wrong on "Asian Dominance" (2, Informative)

SuperKendall (25149) | about 5 years ago | (#29931991)

Why is the iPhone not dominant in the land they term "Asia"?

Well actually it is.

In Japan, the iPhone is now #1 in market share for smartphones.

In China, they actually don't sell it at all (which is why they say it doesn't register in "Asia") but they will be shortly as they have partnered with a Chinese company to sell the iPhone. We know there is demand there as there have always been a lot of unlocked iPhones heading into China. And it has one of the better handheld input mechanism for chinese characters I have seen.

What will it really take? Apps Apps Apps (1, Interesting)

icebike (68054) | about 5 years ago | (#29932015)

Look, there is nothing special about the Iphone OS any more.

Neither the hardware or or the OS is the significant factor, as both platforms have achieved rough parity.

The Apple APP store defines the difference these days.

With 90,000 apps (75,000 of which are redundant "Crapps") it has the clear lead in developer mind share, monitization infrastructure, and deployment.

When someone writes a wrapper for these App store Apps that allows them to run on Android, its game over for this particular advantage.

Apple is entrenched and the clear leader. But lets face it, the hardware has no particular advantage any more, and the User Interface is pretty much Windows 3.1 looking with a desk top full of random icons with no organization.

Its not Apples fault. The iPhone OS was never designed with all of those app in mind. If/When Apple re-works the interface, with categorization of apps, (folders if you will) they can maintain the lead.

But Android has the advantage of youth, and none of the baggage of middle age.

Still, its the Apps. Android doesn't need as many apps to make it a complete user tool, because so much is bundled, but they still need more than currently exist.

Its not just the OS and apps (2, Informative)

Tran (721196) | about 5 years ago | (#29932167)

I have an iPod touch and and HTC Magic ( T-Mobuile version - myTOuch).

The real difference is the design of the UI and the functionality of they UI and the smoothness of the UI interaction with the hardware. The Android needs to come with better UI widgets. Maybe there are better ones, but even Google's own apps suffer from lousy design use widgets. Not just lousily implemented functionality, but also look. I have seen way better from Google than what I see in 1.6.

Android 1.6 reminds of the linux distros from a few years ago and to some extent even now. The UI has a noticeable lag in 90% of the circumstances and often does not provide feedback that there may be activity in the app. The on-screen keyboard is too cramped and successful key-hit recognition is way lower than on the Touch/iPhone ( and I actually prefer the on-screen keyboard over a physical keyboard.)
The browser is pretty much useless on the Android as compared to Safari.
I haven't seen an advantage of being able to run multiple applications on the Android. after more than 4 or 5 apps running, it gets even more laggy. The iPod touch has never asked me if I should force quit an app or wait because it takes to long to get to the home screen, when quiting an app ( I always try to quit apps now ( but how to is not always apparent) - otherwise one has to frequently use very popular utilities like Taskman or TasKiller).

In general I like Google and use many of their apps on the net and on the PC. But the Android has left me underwhelmed.

Re:What will it really take? Apps Apps Apps (5, Insightful)

mr_matticus (928346) | about 5 years ago | (#29932413)

Spoken like a review from a windowshopper.

Look, there is nothing special about the Iphone OS any more.

That just isn't true. Android 2.0 is pretty attractive on the surface, but it's still plagued with UI and usability kinks that have yet to be worked out. Multi-touch still isn't quite right, nor is it fluid. Android's interaction on the desktop is much better than most of its competitors, but it still lags behind the iTunes experience. There are plenty of advantages to the iPhone platform, including the iPhone OS.

When someone writes a wrapper for these App store Apps that allows them to run on Android, its game over for this particular advantage.

That's what they said about Linux and Windows in 1996. Easier said than done. We're still waiting.

But lets face it, the hardware has no particular advantage any more

The pile of hardware components was never the advantage to begin with. The devil's in the details. It'd be a trivial effort to out-spec the iPhone's hardware, but that doesn't get you anywhere on its own. Look at the terrible state of video playback at the time on smartphones even with the same muscle as the first generation iPhone.

Whether you love the iPhone or hate it, it's indisputable that it was a kick in the pants for everyone else. Now they're actually trying to make good products, and competitors are addressing their failings and adapting what they can from Apple's lead. That's how it should have worked, even if the iPhone never existed, but it just didn't. Even Windows Mobile, while still painful to use, is at least easier to look at these days.

But Android has the advantage of youth, and none of the baggage of middle age.

Drama much? The iPhone is "middle-aged"? What does that make RIM/Blackberry? A pensioner?

Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932053)

Guys, life is short. Apple iPhone, Google Android...who cares? It is just a telephone. We use them to talk to other people. That is all.

Now, let's spend our time on more useful or pleasurable things, okay?

It was the network, stupid (1)

ndogg (158021) | about 5 years ago | (#29932087)

The G1 would have been more successful if it wasn't tied to T-Mobile.

I knew a lot of people--non-techies by the way--that wanted it, but T-Mobile doesn't cover where we live.

T-Mobile is great if you live in a major city (I think, I've never had them), but rather crappy if you don't.

iPhone Ueber Alles? Not quite yet (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932261)

iPhone will never be dominant as long as it is sold by a single carrier. So if/when apple and VZW ink a deal, the subsidies paid will be much smaller than AT&T pays today. This will essentially double the cost to the consumer of the iPhone.

Be interesting to see what happens to iPhone sales if/when that happens.

iPhone Killer? Why would Google want that? (2, Insightful)

devjj (956776) | about 5 years ago | (#29932349)

MobileSafari uses Google for search results, and there are a lot of mobile searches being generated by iPhone users. Google is eroding marketshare everywhere else. If I'm Apple, I'm not scared of Google. If I'm any manufacturer representing another platform (Nokia, for example), I'm terrified.

confession (1)

gearloos (816828) | about 5 years ago | (#29932425)

I have to admit, I have an iPhone, and I have had a G1, recently lost at an airport... yeah sure, they turned it in, and for the last month, a G2, Mytouch3G tmobile. The Mytouch actually does considerably more than the iphone, and I enjoy using it that much more. I dont give a rats ass what Leo "paid for by apple" Laporte has to sy about it, The Android phone wins, hands down. I can scan business cards right into my address book, google maps, NON DRM (thats enough by itself to switch) music, it plays more video formats, yada yada yada... I like it, nuff said.... Oh, did I forget to mention the microsdhc slot? I can add what I want, memory wise....

Right platform, wrong apps; I'm staying Apple (2, Informative)

dirkdodgers (1642627) | about 5 years ago | (#29932481)

As a hardware and OS platform the Droid is far more appealing than my current iPhone.

But from what I've seen of the user experience so far, it's a no go. I've been spoiled on OS X on the desktop for years, and now on my phone. As much as I want to like the Droid and wish my iPhone had a slideout keyboard, I'm sticking with Apple for the time being.

It's a testament to just how good Apple is at user interface design that Microsoft and Google with all their resources can't hold a candle to it.

The issue isn't the OS -- it's the Hardware (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 5 years ago | (#29932487)

It's ludicrous to think that software only is going to "kill" the iPhone (and the iPod Touch, which I'm including here for reasons that will become obvious.)

My company recently developed a game called Star Rangers. It's a space warfare game, and it makes extensive use of the accelerometer features of the iPhone and iPod Touch. Without that hardware capability, the game simply wouldn't be playable (like a bunch of other successful games and apps exclusive to the iPhone and iPod Touch.)

Quit thinking that any given Android-equipped device is going to beat the iPhone on software merits alone -- you've also got to have hardware features that equal or exceed the current iPhone's (and iPod Touch's) capabilities. Until you have standardized Android-compatible phone hardware that permits you to play games or develop sound/music apps as you can on the iPhone (because of its inherent hardware features giving you physical tilt control), then any other Android-running device is going to play catch-up. It's that simple.

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