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Apple Forced To Clean Up Its Fine Print

Soulskill posted more than 4 years ago | from the by-reading-this-you-bequeath-me-all-your-possessions dept.

Businesses 127

Barence writes "Apple has been forced to tidy up its online terms and conditions, at the behest of the UK's Office of Fair Trading. The company has redrafted its Ts & Cs so that it now accepts liability for faulty or misdescribed goods sold from its website or the iTunes store. Apple must also ensure that its conditions are 'drafted in plain or intelligible language' and that they 'do not potentially allow changes to be made to products and prices after an agreement is made.'"

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127 comments

Good news... (5, Insightful)

click2005 (921437) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252612)

do not potentially allow changes to be made to products and prices after an agreement is made.

As I've said numerous times, this is why EULAs are unenforcable in the UK. It does not stop Apple from adding a feature or function in the future and requiring the user to agree to new T&Cs. It also means they cant force an upgrade with new T&Cs without giving the buyer the option of a refund.

Re:Good news... (4, Interesting)

Renraku (518261) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252802)

Exactly as should happen here in America. If I recall there was a cell phone company that pushed a firmware update to a line of phones that removed its Bluetooth data capability and GPS functionality. Well, not really removed, locked is more like it. Locked until you decided to pay a few dollars a month to unlock them..they got taken to court but nothing ever came of it because it was said that a judgment favoring the plaintiff would remove incentive for companies to keep their products up to date technologically. Huh?

Re:Good news... (1)

sonamchauhan (587356) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253260)

Thanks for that.

Do you remember which company, and what phones?

Re:Good news... (2, Informative)

jonbryce (703250) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253492)

Verizon? Blackberry?

I don't live in the US, so I'm not sure if that is the one the grandparent poster has in mind.

Re:Good news... (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30253874)

As a Verizon Wireless Blackberry Curve owner, I assume he's talking about this pile of crap. Verizon had a class action suit brought against them because they locked out GPS functionality to only work with their utter crap GPS service. This means you can't use it for ANYTHING, even non-navigation related things. So the suit is brought against them, what do they do? The assholes unlock it to work with just BlackBerry Maps (another crap application.) Yet they decide to fully unlock GPS on the other Blackberrys? I just want to know the logic behind this, to get people to buy a new phone (which makes them LESS money ironically)? Yeah, good luck with that Verizon, all you're doing is driving me away, in 2 months when my plan runs out it's time to go to ATT, land of the non-crippled, superior Blackberry. I urge everyone else to do so as well.

Re:Good news... (1)

Dun Malg (230075) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254862)

The logic behind it is that it's your hardware, but their software. Verizon has always considered the functionality of its phones to be wholly and completely theirs to modify and restrict as suits their fancy. It's part of the reason why Verizon has far and away the best coverage, but hasn't completely eviscerated the competition. AT&T coverage may be mediocre, but I can buy a Canadian Google G2 on eBay, hack the OS six ways from sunday, plug in my SIM card, and it works.

Re:Good news... (1)

besalope (1186101) | more than 4 years ago | (#30255044)

I have a Verizon Samsung Omnia (Windows Mobile). Thanks to sites like PPCGeeks and XDA-developers 'locked' features like this crap on the Blackberries is overwritten with custom roms and firmware that's available from dedicated individuals who are sick of this style of business model. Verizon does occasionally unlock some of features though, our GPS was unlocked for free in a firmware update. But as for tethering.. there have been Windows Mobile apps for YEARS that can tether via USB or Bluetooth and it just appears as regular phone data.

Re:Good news... (1)

trum4n (982031) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254044)

Verizon Wireless, Motorola V3* RAZR. I was a victim of this bullshit. You can't even charge the phone from USB with out the VERIZON driver for it. Even an off brand or original Moto charger that dosent say Verizon wireless on it will give you an "Unauthorized Charger." *walks in the direction of sprint*

Re:Good news.Christmas sale,free shipping discount (-1, Offtopic)

Johnson1985 (1688668) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253998)

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Re:Good news.Christmas sale,free shipping discount (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30254056)

Advertising?? What an asshole.

psystar should move to the uk and likely be able t (1)

Joe The Dragon (967727) | more than 4 years ago | (#30255122)

psystar should move to the uk and likely be able to do what they are doing for a lot more law on there side.

oh, that (5, Funny)

overcaffein8d (1101951) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252616)

you mean, the iTunes clause:

You also agree that you will not use these products for any purposes prohibited by United States law, including, without limitation, the development, design, manufacture or production of nuclear, missiles, or chemical or biological weapons.

??

Re:oh, that (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30252666)

Finally, the bad guys aren't allowed to add Rickrolling to their WMDs. We can sleep in peace.

Re:oh, that (1)

RockoTDF (1042780) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252774)

Looks like I need to unsubscribe from that DIY ICBM podcast. And the host was so witty and charming....

Re:oh, that (0, Troll)

mysidia (191772) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253004)

I think you can be free and clear with iTunes on a technicality, as long as the missiles aren't equipped as a weapon and you don't actually intend to launch them.

Re:oh, that (1)

Evil Shabazz (937088) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253040)

Looks like I need to unsubscribe from that DIY ICBM podcast. And the host was so witty and charming....

Achmedinejad is on ham radio, too.

Re:oh, that (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30253460)

I think you'll find that ham isn't Halal.

Re:oh, that (2, Informative)

Mr. DOS (1276020) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252816)

Y'know, the Microsoft JVM EULA (or maybe it was the Windows 98 EULA?) had a clause almost identical to that for years before iTunes was even a concept. It bugs me every time I hear someone call it the "iTunes clause"...

      --- Mr. DOS

Re:oh, that (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30252878)

Y'know, the Microsoft JVM EULA (or maybe it was the Windows 98 EULA?) had a clause almost identical to that for years before iTunes was even a concept. It bugs me every time I hear someone call it the "iTunes clause"...

So you're saying we have evidence that Apple copy stuff from Microsoft.

Re:oh, that (1)

Urza9814 (883915) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252900)

Well at least with the JVM it's rather possible that it could be used in such a way.

Re:oh, that (2, Funny)

mysidia (191772) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253304)

That's because a JVM is not something that you just dump something on. It's not a big truck. It's a series of tubes. And if you don't understand, those tubes can be filled, and if they are filled, when you put your program in, it gets in line, and it's going to be delayed by anyone that puts into the tube enormous emounts of information, enormous amounts of information.

And then, if it gets too congested, your JVM explodes, taking the entire internet with it!

Re:oh, that (1)

FooAtWFU (699187) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252910)

The one I always recall seeing was for some Sun sample Java code, for the "clock" applet. This code not to be used in blah blah blah or the design, construction, or maintenance of any nuclear facility.

Re:oh, that (4, Informative)

ls671 (1122017) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252990)

Different thing, the clause is wider and it is telling you not to use the software for very mission critical applications:

* This software is not designed or intended for use in on-line control of
  * aircraft, air traffic, aircraft navigation or aircraft communications; or in
  * the design, construction, operation or maintenance of any nuclear
  * facilit. Licensee represents and warrants that it will not use or
  * redistribute the Software for such purposes.

http://java.sun.com/applets/jdk/1.4/demo/applets/Clock/Clock.java [sun.com]

no, it's just about the money (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30254400)

As someone who's spent a couple of decades developing systems for

on-line control of aircraft, air traffic, aircraft navigation or aircraft communications; or in the design, construction, operation or maintenance of any nuclear facilit.

I can tell you from first-hand experience that that clause is *NOT* telling you not to use the software in those applications -- what it *IS* telling you is that they want you to negotiate a custom license (for a custom fee, of course) for the right to use the software in those applications.

Re:oh, that (1)

risinganger (586395) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253348)

I tell you what, as much as I like Java as a programming language, I'd fill my underwear in record time if I ever discovered it was used in any nuclear facility.

Re:oh, that (1)

noidentity (188756) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253850)

I tell you what, as much as I like Java as a programming language, I'd fill my underwear in record time if I ever discovered it was used in any nuclear facility.

This implies the time it took would be less than the times of other occasions, I take it?

Re:oh, that (1)

jo42 (227475) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254204)

You'd fill the Grand Canyon in record time if you saw what was and is being used in nuclear facilities...

Re:oh, that (1)

mysidia (191772) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253286)

As if the people who manufacture biological weapon delivery system contrary to US law will care about a EULA clause in the JVM they run their software on.

Re:oh, that (1)

digitig (1056110) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253614)

It isn't meant to stop them using it for those purposes. It's there to cover Microsoft's and Apple's asses -- they don't get sued if the biological weapon hits the wrong target.

Re:oh, that (1)

Pastis (145655) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253222)

So if you play music while you conceiving a kid, and your son becomes a soldier (chemical and biological weapon), do you get into trouble ?

Re:oh, that (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30253430)

No, because when he becomes a soldier that will constitute misuse of his hardware, and the contract will be void.

Re:oh, that (1)

Hurricane78 (562437) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253800)

Well, I guess since the Steve Jobs reality distortion bubble is a chemical and biological weapon, because it changes the chemistry and biology of the brains of the affected, you could sue them for anti-competitive behavior (hindering the development of competing reality distortion bubbles), to get that clause removed. ^^

Re:oh, that (1)

daveime (1253762) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254780)

How many times ? Unless the iBoom missile hardware is made by Apple, you can not install Mac OSX on it ! It says so in the EULA !

Re:oh, that (1)

Dun Malg (230075) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254884)

Eh. That's not special to Apple. It's standard software industry boilerplate. Remember the Win XP install agreement that says you can't use XP to control nuclear reactors? SAme shit.

Apple never misdescribes (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30252622)

it is just that the usee misunderstands

Re:Apple never misdescribes (1)

Concerned Onlooker (473481) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252880)

"it is just that the usee misunderstands"

Actually, I think Apple is the usee and the purchaser of said products would be the user. :-)

Re:Apple never misdescribes (1)

mjwx (966435) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253426)

Actually, I think Apple is the user and the purchaser of said products would be the used. :-)

TFTFY :-P

CrApple!!!! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30252628)

YeeeeaaAAAAAAH!!!!

But do they... (-1, Troll)

NecroPuppy (222648) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252664)

Allow you to be a smoker and still get your iCrap serviced under warranty?

Re:But do they... (0, Flamebait)

Ethanol-fueled (1125189) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252684)

As long as you only smoke cocks, per Apple's policy.

Re:But do they... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30252708)

but it's important to note, they're not called "cocks" at the Apple store.

They're called "iWangs."

Re:But do they... (1)

Concerned Onlooker (473481) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252886)

And you wonder why Apple users start to get an attitude? It's because we've been suffering dolt-ish comments like this for so long.

Re:But do they... (1, Funny)

copponex (13876) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253060)

And you wonder why Apple users start to get an attitude? It's because we've been suffering dolt-ish comments like this for so long.

I thought it was because you were broke...

Re:But do they... (1)

PopeRatzo (965947) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253972)

And you wonder why Apple users start to get an attitude?

I thought it was because they just hated the way Adam Lambert is being treated so unfairly by the celebrity media.

Re:But do they... (-1, Flamebait)

Miseph (979059) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253078)

If you didn't have such shitty attitude's I assure you that you wouldn't be assailed with so many negative comments like that one.

Chicken, egg, first?

Re:But do they... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30254268)

We can't help it if the average Apple user likes to take a fist up his ass. Facts are facts fucko.

Are you going to run home now and cry to your daddy?

Re:But do they... (0, Flamebait)

Dogtanian (588974) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254356)

And you wonder why Apple users start to get an attitude? It's because we've been suffering dolt-ish comments like this for so long.

Love the way your whining reeks of seeing yourself as a member of a persecuted minority group instead of someone who bought a damn computer made by a particular company. The attitude of over-important, self-consciously "minority" tosspots like you is as much a part of perpetuating the "dolt-ish comments", regardless of who started them.

Re:But do they... (3, Insightful)

Duradin (1261418) | more than 4 years ago | (#30252808)

One blog. Two cases. Everything links back to the one blog. I think we've just promoted another molehill up to mountain status.

Re:But do they... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30252922)

only if you smoke dicks. otherwise they'd have no marketshare.

Re:But do they... (1)

risinganger (586395) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253360)

Allow you to be a smoker and still get your iCrap serviced under warranty?

Here's Apple, trying to save everybody from lung cancer and all I see are complaints!

If you won't think of the children then Apple have to!

Re:But do they... (1)

itsdapead (734413) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253544)

Allow you to be a smoker and still get your iCrap serviced under warranty?

Probably not if the cause of the fault is that it is gunked up with foul-smelling tar. Go read the fine print in every warranty under the sun about not covering neglect or misuse.

Has anybody asked Dell, HP, Sony etc. what they would do in these circumstances? Thought not.

Re:But do they... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30253792)

that was not Apple's claim at all.
They're trying to claim that they don't have to work on them because nicotine is listed as a hazardous substance -- as is there aren't many other toxic substances bound up in the device already.

do try to keep up

Laaaaa (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30252800)

And that's why I am a PC. :)

Fuck Corporations! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30252824)

Fuck them!

How about replacing lost downloads? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30252892)

I used to use iTunes but I had a an iMac die after two years, bad hard drive, and I lost most of the movies I had bought. I have a new iMac and I set up a mirror drive but I no longer use iTunes. Also when I synced up my iPod Touch to the new machine it deleted all my personal photos off the Touch. The security is so draconian they even delete your personal content. It's a nice idea but the security and lack of culpability on Apple's part makes it unusable. I got the Touch mostly for movies and that was what I lost when the computer died. I don't feel like re-buying my movies after less than a year so as far as I'm concerned the Touch is bricked. It's sad because they are a great little movie player but the draconian security makes them utterly worthless. What they want you to do is buy "Mobile Me" which wasn't even released when my machine died. The real problem with Apple hardware/software is they expect you to do everything "their" way. If you follow their exact proceedure and use their back up systems the way they want you to use them it kind of works but any variation and you're screwed. I describe Apple products like a Club Med vacation, very regimented to the point of no longer being fun to use. With apple products you have one way to do everything their way where as traditionally you have multiple ways to organize yourself with Windows products. Sadly that's going away with Windows as well. Right after I got my first Vista machine I had to call a software vendor because the "Pref" files were missing. It turns out the folder containing them is now hidden by default. With Vista all the useful stuff is disabled by default and all the useless stuff is turned off. Even photo thumbnails is turned off by default. If they really want to make Apple play fair force them to honor sales so lost content can be recovered without forcing people to buy "Mobile Me" or a mirror drive just to cover your ass if your Mac dies, which it will. They work fine right up until they start to fall apart. It started with the Super Drive going out then I kept finding new dead pixels nearly every day then suddenly the machine was dead and any iTunes content not on the Touch was gone. Also can you stop deleting my personal content! I liked my old Palm Zaire where I could drag in most any content from movies to music and photos and it never once deleted my personal files. If you want to fight piracy don't piss off the customers that want to buy content! That would be the most important step. Also I should be able to rip any DVD to my iPod Touch. Hell I'll pay the $1 download fee just to have movies from my collection on the Touch. I like the copy of "Up" just bought. For $30 I have a DVD version, a Blu-Ray and I can load it on my Touch. That's the way to sell a movie! For $10 more I get every version and I'm happy. Paying $20 for each copy they can bite me!

Misdescribed Goods (5, Funny)

Donkey_Hotey (1433053) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253020)

iTunes lists rap stars as recording artists . Would that fall under the "faulty or misdescribed goods" part?

Re:Misdescribed Goods (3, Funny)

dgatwood (11270) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254202)

iTunes lists rap stars as recording artists . Would that fall under the "faulty or misdescribed goods" part?

iTunes also lists rap in their music section. Would that fall under the "faulty or misdescribed goods" part?

Re:Misdescribed Goods (1)

daveime (1253762) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254808)

The "candidates for an early death by driveby shooting or long prison sentence for drug dealing and 'whippin ma ho'" section was too wide to fit on the iPhone display.

Including fitness for a particular purpose (5, Insightful)

dirkdodgers (1642627) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253030)

I've always loved the absurdity of these phrases. Apple disclaims all implied warranties including the implied warranties that their products are what they claim to be and are suitable for the purpose they are advertised for.

In other words, as far as Apple is concerned, if you open your new Macbook Pro box and find a boat anchor instead of a laptop, tough luck.

Re:Including fitness for a particular purpose (4, Insightful)

daveime (1253762) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254826)

Finding a boat anchor would be a bonus. Boat anchors tend to be attached to boats, which have GPS that works.

Does such a fabled place truly exist? (4, Funny)

Snufu (1049644) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253112)

must also ensure that its conditions are 'drafted in plain or intelligible language'

Surely this is a land without lawyers. Where is this 'United Kingdom' and how soon may we journey to its fair shores?

Re:Does such a fabled place truly exist? (4, Funny)

rishistar (662278) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253480)

The United Kingdom is the place wherein lies England, the home of the one and only plain an intelligible language that we all love and know - English. Some languages are non-plain using fancy characters but *all* other languages are unintelligible - ironically none more so than one from another part of the United Kingdom - Welsh.

Re:Does such a fabled place truly exist? (1)

daveime (1253762) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254860)

Hmm, let's see ...

"London" English - "Excuse me Sir, have you seen my Chicken Sandwich"

"Scouse" English - "Hey la, wess me Shicken Butty"

Yup, completely plain an intelligible language, provided you live in a 10 mile radius of Big Ben.

Re:Does such a fabled place truly exist? (5, Funny)

badzilla (50355) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253510)

A Brit friend was visiting the USA and phoned the operator (could have been the internal operator at his large company) to ask which international dialling prefix he should use to call home. A short silence then... "United Kingdom? Is that an amusement park?"

You missed the keyword (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30253590)

drafted in plain or intelligible language'

Grok buy song. Song play music. Grok happy. Grek buy song. Song broken. Grek sad. Apple not care. Grek angry.

Re:Does such a fabled place truly exist? (1)

Hurricane78 (562437) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253824)

What they didn’t mention: “drafted in plain or intelligible NEWSPEAK language” ^^

Re:Does such a fabled place truly exist? (1)

PopeRatzo (965947) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254002)

Surely this is a land without lawyers. Where is this 'United Kingdom' and how soon may we journey to its fair shores?

It's not so much that it's without lawyers. It's just been around long enough to have figured out that it's not good for a society to put corporations in charge of absolutely everything.

Unfortunately, it's younger cousin across the atlantic has not made this discovery yet, but I have high hopes.

Re:Does such a fabled place truly exist? (0, Troll)

fast turtle (1118037) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254514)

Actually, there needs to be an Antitrust suit against the "House of Lords" for anticompetitive behaviour since they disallow any competition with their rule.

Apple and the UK (1)

DrScotsman (857078) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253166)

Is it me or do Apple get in trouble in the UK a lot? I think there's about 4 Apple adverts that have been deemed false advertising by ASA, and now this? Have they really not bothered to hire any UK lawyers?

Anyway this is a bit of a moot point. Terms in a contract that contradict the Distance Selling Regulations or the Sale of Goods act are obviously null (especially so if Apple included the line "This does not affect your statutory rights" or similar), and The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 will almost certainly nullify any term like "Apple reserves the right to change these terms and conditions at any time." I'm happy about this story but am confused as Apple definitely won't be the only well known company in the UK to do things like these (Microsoft?)

Re:Apple and the UK (1)

risinganger (586395) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253376)

Is it me or do Apple get in trouble in the UK a lot? I think there's about 4 Apple adverts that have been deemed false advertising by ASA, and now this? Have they really not bothered to hire any UK lawyers?

Would you though? Game Theory would suggest (to me anyway) that any loss possible in the UK is nothing compared to the possible losses in the US. I'd hire nothing but US lawyers too.

Illegal conditions in your EULA in the UK? get your knuckles rapped and correct it - end of story.
Sell a product in the US? prepare for endless lawsuits varying in their stupidity.

Re:Apple and the UK (3, Funny)

mjwx (966435) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253420)

Apple definitely won't be the only well known company in the UK to do things like these (Microsoft?)

Cant say about the UK but in AU we have similar laws, bank and telco ad's get pulled all the time. Often they come back with ridiculous amounts of fine print displayed in 3 seconds to comply with advertising standards.

With Apple, they deliberately misrepresent their goods so of course these kinds of things happen, MS don't release an ad that often and always get it checked (if not done by) a local ad agency who will ensure its compliance. Occasionally they do get ad's pulled though, the "get the Facts(R)*+" campaign for example.

* - Facts(R) is a registered trademark of Microsoft(TM) and may not represent any actual facts.
+ - May contain traces of nut egg or seed.

Re:Apple and the UK (1)

rishistar (662278) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253494)

They were complained about adverts for the iPhone - it was ironic that with such a great product they had to stoop to such misrepresentation.

Still, I'd rather have those lies back if they replaced the Windows 7 adverts they have here - I'm hoping for a version of Duck Hunt featuring all the annoying guys in the ads to hit the market in time for Christmas.

Re:Apple and the UK (4, Informative)

itsdapead (734413) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253658)

Is it me or do Apple get in trouble in the UK a lot?

More a case of whenever Apple get in trouble it tends to be over-reported. Ads get pulled all the time. Also, its largely driven by how many "members of the public" complain.

Have they really not bothered to hire any UK lawyers?

The ASA [asa.org.uk] is an independent industry regulator enforcing a "code of conduct" so the law doesn't necessarily come in to it.

However, no, I don't think Apple really understands the way advertising works in the UK: a prestige brand like Apple is supposed to give us 40 seconds of entertainment with a "pack shot" at the end. If you make specific claims about the product, people will check (if a cosmetics firm says "8 out of 10 women in our survey said they felt younger looking" then they better have those stats). Knocking the competitor's product really isn't cricket and is fairly rare. I notice that although Apple initially made UK versions of the "I'm a Mac" ads (with a British comedy duo) that didn't last long.

On the other hand, Apple also think that a British keyboard is an American keyboard with the # key replaced by a £ sign. Twits.

Re:Apple and the UK (1)

zebs (105927) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254456)

I notice that although Apple initially made UK versions of the "I'm a Mac" ads (with a British comedy duo) that didn't last long.

Because the duo were also in a comedy show (Peep Show) where the "I'm a Mac" guy was a complete tosser that no-one liked.

Windows XP Professional license agreement (1, Interesting)

DNS-and-BIND (461968) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253330)

"In no event shall Microsoft be liable for any damages whatsoever, even in the event of fault (including negligence)."
-- Windows XP Professional license agreement

Re:Windows XP Professional license agreement (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30253410)

And that's why linux isn't ready for the corporate deskt... oh

Re:Windows XP Professional license agreement (4, Insightful)

EsbenMoseHansen (731150) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253452)

"In no event shall Microsoft be liable for any damages whatsoever, even in the event of fault (including negligence)."

I always thought that these notices are very odd. I mean, can I put up a sign that says "In no event shall Esben be responsible for any crime he might do" and expect it to have any effect?

Re:Windows XP Professional license agreement (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30253696)

Only if every other person on earth signs it in agreement. Then you have free reign to blow up whatever you want.

Re:Windows XP Professional license agreement (3, Insightful)

DriedClexler (814907) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254556)

Well, the asshole truckers that carry small rocks without covering up the load think they're accomplishing something by having a notice:

"Stay back 200 ft -- Not responsible for damaged windshields"

Yet they know damn well that they'll be at fault for such damage. Go fig.

I'm guessing it's just an attempt to deceive people into thinking they don't have rights that they really do ... which should probably be illegal.

Re:Windows XP Professional license agreement (2, Informative)

Dysproxia (584031) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254680)

I always thought that these notices are very odd. I mean, can I put up a sign that says "In no event shall Esben be responsible for any crime he might do" and expect it to have any effect?

Of course not, since that claim would be false. Software maker responsibilities are a different matter. Would you hold the Apache Foundation liable for damages if someone hacks your web server due to security holes in their code? No, as they don't claim or promise responsibility any more than Microsoft or anyone else with half a mind do.

Re:Windows XP Professional license agreement (1)

EsbenMoseHansen (731150) | more than 4 years ago | (#30255020)

I always thought that these notices are very odd. I mean, can I put up a sign that says "In no event shall Esben be responsible for any crime he might do" and expect it to have any effect?

Of course not, since that claim would be false. Software maker responsibilities are a different matter. Would you hold the Apache Foundation liable for damages if someone hacks your web server due to security holes in their code? No, as they don't claim or promise responsibility any more than Microsoft or anyone else with half a mind do.

But the notice doesn't change anything, does it? Of course, in this country, the maximum damage award I could get would the price of the software :P (there are a few exceptions, but none that matters for software)

In other news... (3, Informative)

itsdapead (734413) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253604)

About half of 369 websites selling electronic goods checked in an EU crackdown [eubusiness.com] were found to have exactly these sorts of problems.

Of course, 99% of those websites weren't run by Apple, so they don't get singled out in the press. Fair do's I guess - 99% of companies don't get every product launch reported by the BBC, either.

The EU "distance selling" regulations (which include the UK) are fairly tight and comparatively recent.

Re:In other news... (0, Offtopic)

Hurricane78 (562437) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253842)

Did’t you know that since the 14th, the head of all Slashdot editors will explode, if they don’t release at least one Apple article on average?

Seriously! Check for yourself:
http://slashdot.org/index2.pl?fhfilter=apple [slashdot.org]
http://slashdot.org/index2.pl?fhfilter=iphone [slashdot.org]

My guess is that it’s some “better bad news than no news” viral advertisement deal.

Re:In other news... (1)

kramerd (1227006) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254698)

Yes, /. is required to make sure that other websites have articles about apple that can be linked to and summarised on /. at least once for a viral advertisement deal. I assume because apple can't afford television or radio or internet or mall kiosk or email commercials and really just wants to the word out about how locked down, worthless, anti-consumer they are.

Tinfoil hat much?

Re:In other news... (1)

Adlopa (686151) | more than 4 years ago | (#30253918)

Replying to remove erroneously applied mode point (not a 'funny' comment at all). My bad.

after an agreement is made? (0, Troll)

nurb432 (527695) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254142)

So why is apple going to be held to a higher standard then any other company out there?

Changing products after the sale, and changing terms, is standard practice. Don't like the new terms, dissolve the contract and choose a more customer friendly vendor. If you want the new features that came out afterwards, upgrade. ( or conversely, if you don't like what was removed or added, don't upgrade. )

Wrong (2, Informative)

Sockatume (732728) | more than 4 years ago | (#30254940)

That's not "standard practice" in the UK for the sale of goods. We have an entire "sale of goods act" outlining a customer's rights, for example that a contract is final and binding once money has changed hands, that a seller has specific undisclaimable responsibilities with regards to the quality of goods (a kind of super-warranty) and so on. Apple is being held to the same standard as everyone else.

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