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CES Vendors Kicked Out of Hotels For Showcasing Wares in Room

ScuttleMonkey posted more than 4 years ago | from the sorry-we-changed-our-mind dept.

Businesses 285

An anonymous reader writes to mention that a number of companies attempting to stretch their dollars by showing their new gear in hotel suites around Vegas during CES were kicked out of the rooms they paid for by CES organizers and hotel staff. According to sources as many as 30 small electronics companies may have been kicked out of The Venetian and The Palazzo on Thursday. One anonymous vendor claims they were coerced into paying $10,000 to the CEA lest they be kicked out of their (paid for) suite and barred from exhibiting or meeting with clients. 'States our source, "I asked the hotel staff if there were any limitations for using the suite. They said the only limitations were how many people were at our parties. They didn't say there were any limitations on displaying product. We set up our product on the first day. Then on Wednesday a cleaning person came in and reported what they saw to management. From there we got kicked out on Thursday."'

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285 comments

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And this is news why? (2, Insightful)

suso (153703) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726000)

I mean I'm not a show vendor and I even know that doing such things is not ok with hotel management.

Re:And this is news why? (5, Insightful)

eldavojohn (898314) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726078)

I mean I'm not a show vendor and I even know that doing such things is not ok with hotel management.

A lot of the vendors claim they had informal conversations with management who said it was okay:

More importantly, the vendor's chief representative reports that they had contacted the hotel management before the show and asked if there were any limitations on showing product in the suites. The hotel management at The Venetian reportedly said there were not.

But then someone at the hotel said:

A security guard at The Venetian confirmed these reports further, saying he had been involved with "solving" a "lot of problems" at CES. When we inquired what these "problems" were, he stated, "The problems aren't with CES itself, but with people who didn't go through the proper channels to display the products and hold their business meetings."

So there's your news, it's a he said/he said sort of thing at this point unless you can find the rules to CES that explicitly address this. You know, it could be spun one way saying that the hotel management knew it wasn't going to fly but wanted the moneys and so they lied and kicked them out only after they had the money in their pocket. Should have got it in writing if that was the case. The other way to spin it is that these guys did more than they asked was okay and that bothered management.

I particularly enjoyed this statement:

If the vendors can't pay, they can't pay. One smaller company was already kicked out we witnessed today, likely more have been or will be as well. Is this really good for CES, an industry flagbearer? And is it really good for the Las Vegas economy, so dependent on the show?

It's pretty obvious to me that if you're paying a premium for showing your product at that show, you don't want 2 bit operations setting up in the hotel rooms above you trying to swindle your viewers up to their private quarters. You're there for those people to see your flashy setup. That's why you pay, isn't it? Management and CES could very well have been protecting the interests and quality of the show. Also, I don't think if CES moved it would hurt Vegas all that much. They have some other industries around there that do pretty well despite recessions or any sort of economic downturn.

And even if it is, why wasn't the CEA and hotel management more clear about restrictions on exhibits and meetings in Las Vegas hotels this week?

Agreed, brace yourself for a forty page contract written in legal speak to be signed next year before your exhibit and hotel room is inspected and okayed for entrance into the hotel and showroom floor.

Re:And this is news why? (5, Insightful)

XPeter (1429763) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726210)

It's pretty obvious to me that if you're paying a premium for showing your product at that show, you don't want 2 bit operations setting up in the hotel rooms above you trying to swindle your viewers up to their private quarters. You're there for those people to see your flashy setup. That's why you pay, isn't it? Management and CES could very well have been protecting the interests and quality of the show. Also, I don't think if CES moved it would hurt Vegas all that much. They have some other industries around there that do pretty well despite recessions or any sort of economic downturn.

You sir, are an idiot.

The small companies (such as Zalman) that were evicted from the hotels, paid for the room in full without signing any unique agreements. Unless the parties violated the following conditions set forth by many hotels, then they had no right to be kicked out.

Standards:

* Disorderly conduct
* Nonpayment
* Using the premises for an unlawful purpose or act
* Bringing property onto the premises that may be dangerous to others
* Failing to register as a guest
* Using FALSE PRETENSES to obtain accommodations
* Being a minor unaccompanied by an adult registered guest
* Violating federal, state, or local hotel laws or regulations
* Violating a conspicuously posted hotel or motel rule
* Failing to vacate a room at the agreed checkout time

Vegas is STARVING, akin to what Dubai just endured...They need everything they can get. CEA handed the town a nice lump sum, and with that they became the new sheriff in town (obviously abusing their powers).

Re:And this is news why? (2, Interesting)

Unequivocal (155957) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726444)

I agree, but remember this is Vegas. Normally to get kicked out of a hotel room, there is a "guests bill of right" which you list pretty effectively.

But Vegas runs by Vegas' rules. I think the concept that a Vegas hotel will ask a business or person to leave the premises b/c a more important patron doesn't want them there is time honored. Regardless of whether the first party is a customer or not. In that sense I don't think this story is new information on the underlying problem, but it's still aggravating.

Re:And this is news why? (1)

morgan_greywolf (835522) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726612)

You, sir, are incredibly naive... (okay, read you're signature, you're only 15, so I guess that's allowed)

First of all, when CEA comes into town handing the hotels a nice sum, they fully expect that the hotels are going to enforce the policy CEA has handed down for CES. That the hotels did exactly that should come as a surprise to no one.

Secondly, a hotel can refuse service to anyone, at anytime, for any reason. Hotels are privately-owned businesses. If you don't like the hotels exercising their private property rights, you're free to not patronize The Palazzo or The Venetian. Furthermore, the hotel reserves the right to determine what constitutes "disorderly conduct" or using "false pretenses" to obtain accommodations. Renting out a suite is an obvious attempt to deprive CEA of the money they're asking for a booth.

Thirdly, if you think The Palazzo or The Venetian are starving, think again. Maybe you don't have the money to stay there, but there are plenty of rich people with money to burn. I recently read an article in the Miami Herald about how, for example, super-luxury 180-360 day cruises around the world (starting at $100,000 and rising to $500,000 and up) aren't hurting one bit, despite the economy.

Re:And this is news why? (1)

XPeter (1429763) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726942)

1. So your justifying that since CES came rolling into town, they are now the new overwhelming authority?

Handing someone a large sum of money in exchange for them to become your puppet is being anti-competitive, is it not?

2. These companies were PAYING customers, and under the guidelines most hotels follow (See my OP), they had no jurisdiction to kick them out, it was only when the CEA came in and complained that they were sent packing.

3. Yes, I'm sure that Vegas is hurting...look at Dubai "The Playground for the Rich". Over the years I've stayed at spruced up places such as The Biltmore (Miami), and eaten at restaurants like Mortons, and maybe it's not declining as rapidly as the middle-class market, but the consumer flow isn't as abundant as it was years ago.

Re:And this is news why? (1)

BobMcD (601576) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726996)

These sorts of things are bound by the law. Unfortunately, the only recourse would be to sue, but purporting that they have any legal right to behave this way is dubious.

At the end of the day the questions become:

1) Whom would a judge side with?

2) Is it worth the legal fees and the hassle?

Re:And this is news why? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726712)

I'm pretty sure that part of the agreement is that you use a suite for either living or small parties - not for such business purposes as "displaying and demoing products" (for which the hotels typically have business space such as meeting rooms and ballrooms). Using the living space for purposes like this increases the foot / elevator traffic above what it is designed for and should indeed be prohibited.

Re:And this is news why? (4, Informative)

Albanach (527650) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727138)

Crikey, hotel suites exist for two purposes. 1, Folk with money who want space, and 2, business people who need space to meet clients without inviting them into their bedroom.

Journalists book suites to conduct interviews, senior business people use them to conduct large transactions. I'd guess in most hotels, suites are used more for business than they are for ordinary guests.

You've hit the nail on the head (2, Insightful)

stomv (80392) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726720)

Using the premises for an unlawful purpose or act

My bet is that Las Vegas zoning code specifically restricts commercial activity from hotel rooms themselves. I've never looked at the Las Vegas zoning code, but I have looked at the codes in my area of the country -- and hotels are only allowed to have certain activities in certain areas of the hotel.

Commercial activity in the rooms themselves is verboten in every code I've seen (about a dozen), although again, I've never looked at the Las Vegas zoning code (or any other Las Vegas laws that might or might not apply, including laws on lodging houses of various kinds, health codes, etc).

Re:You've hit the nail on the head (5, Insightful)

mmeister (862972) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726940)

As I understand it, these were Suites. Suites as in designed to have guests, business guests.

I know lots and LOTS of business folks that rent suites to conduct business in all the time. I know other trade shows do this all the time as well, it is part of the trade show mechanism. This is typical short term thinking. If the meetings in suites prove successful, those same companies will hopefully grow big enough to need a booth next year.

Sorry, this looks like nothing more than a CES shakedown. I would definitely question the legality of CES being able to kick you out of a hotel suite for having business meetings. I could maybe understand it if you had a standard room, but if you got a suite, then IMHO, the hotel is completely in the wrong and caved to CES threatening them.

Both parties should be taken to court.

Re:You've hit the nail on the head (2, Interesting)

BobMcD (601576) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727036)

Except they asked and the hotel answered. This would make the hotel a party to the crime, and puts them on dubious ground in making an 'unlawfulness' claim.

Also, if no money changes hands, there could be a grey area of what 'commercial activity' actually means. If all conduct of business is forbidden, then many of those rooms would be empty and they likely wouldn't have desks in them.

Re:And this is news why? (1)

alen (225700) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726874)

almost every hotel room i've been in has a limit of people who can stay before they charge you extra. reason is they budgeted a portion of the money you pay for utilities like water and electricity. if you bring potential customers than they are losing money

Re:And this is news why? (1)

eldavojohn (898314) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727074)

You sir, are an idiot.

Thank you, I value your constructive input. It's statements like this that really make my day.

Vegas is STARVING

Right. Yeah, I've heard this sort of thing before too [lasvegassun.com] . Just look at those data points from March:

Commercial building permits — down 57 percent.

Commercial building permit values — down 72 percent.

Passengers at McCarran International Airport — down 14 percent.

Gross gaming revenue — down 18 percent.

Visitor volume — down 10.9 percent.

Convention attendance — down 4.9 percent.

Gallons of gasoline used — down 5.3 percent. That is an indicator of out-of-state visitors and transportation of goods.

Never mind that with those adjustments their revenues are still well above average. See, when growth slows, people scream like Vegas is dying.

Yet I was there in November and was a single one of the casinos closed? Nope. Oh well, they have to put off plans to demo the older ones ... why are they doing that? To build tons of newer ones, of course. The casinos and restaurants were still bustling but by news reports, you'd think the economy was tanking. So what happened? Who went under? What closed? Oh, decadent plans to demolish and rebuild were put off? I feel horrible for poor Vegas.

Vegas is STARVING, akin to what Dubai just endured

Well, I'm no economist but I know enough that comparing Vegas -- something that has been a cash cow for decades -- to the relatively recent startup of Dubai is not a prudent analogy to attempt by anyone.

Re:And this is news why? (0, Redundant)

changa (197280) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727170)

What is weird about this is the High end audio rooms have been at the Venetian for at least 2 years now and much business and product is shown off there.

I can only think some companies did something weird and stupid.

Re:And this is news why? (4, Informative)

Dahamma (304068) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726676)

It's pretty obvious to me that if you're paying a premium for showing your product at that show, you don't want 2 bit operations setting up in the hotel rooms above you trying to swindle your viewers up to their private quarters. You're there for those people to see your flashy setup. That's why you pay, isn't it? Management and CES could very well have been protecting the interests and quality of the show. Also, I don't think if CES moved it would hurt Vegas all that much.

That's a pretty crazy exaggeration/analogy. You are practically comparing the 100's of small startup tech companies who rent suites at CES to hookers or swindlers. Nice.

Further, your description is not very accurate. The Las Vegas Convention Center is not a hotel, so there is no "swindling viewers up to their private quarters" - in fact, the hotels that rent the largest number of suites to companies (Venetian, Bellagio, Wynn, etc) are no where near the convention center. Many of these companies have no presence at the convention, so how are they "swindling away" anyone? Many of the meetings/demos are private, have no interest/intention of showing their products in public yet, and have been set up between various parties well in advance, so it's not even taking away revenue from the CEA.

In fact, much of the reason the companies schedule these meetings at CES not to "steal" from the CEA, but simply because that's when all of the executives, press, etc who they want to meet with are in one place at the same time. They save a lot of money and time not having to inefficiently fly everyone around the world for weeks holding one painful meeting at a time. I suppose that is now stealing from the airlines, though...

Re:And this is news why? (1, Insightful)

ktappe (747125) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726132)

I mean I'm not a show vendor and I even know that doing such things is not ok with hotel management.

What part of the summary "I asked the hotel staff if there were any limitations for using the suite. They said the only limitations were how many people were at our parties. They didn't say there were any limitations on displaying product" was unclear? It was OK with hotel management.

There is no way anyone should have modded you up and I'm publicly asking people to mod you down.

Re:And this is news why? (4, Insightful)

DragonWriter (970822) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726254)

What part of the summary "I asked the hotel staff if there were any limitations for using the suite. They said the only limitations were how many people were at our parties. They didn't say there were any limitations on displaying product" was unclear?

Its not unclear.

What it is not is confirmed by any source who doesn't have a vested interested in presenting things in a particular light.

There is a difference between a claim and a fact.

Re:And this is news why? (1)

Sheik Yerbouti (96423) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726590)

Wait what? He should be modded down because you disagree with him? There is no -1 disagree moderation moderation is not for burying people who's opinions don't line up perfectly or nearly so with yours. Although to be fair that is how most people seem to use it.

Re:And this is news why? (1)

Lserevi (1270986) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726618)

Why would you believe an anonymous someone who, by their own admission, went out of their way to avoid paying customary fees to the organizer of the event?

Re:And this is news why? (4, Insightful)

iamhassi (659463) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726152)

"I mean I'm not a show vendor and I even know that doing such things is not ok with hotel management."

you didn't RTFA: "the vendor's chief representative reports that they had contacted the hotel management before the show and asked if there were any limitations on showing product in the suites. The hotel management at The Venetian reportedly said there were not.... "I asked the hotel staff if there were any limitations for using the suite. They said the only limitations were how many people were at our parties. ""

I think the real lesson here is not to stay at The Venetian. If I want to get a hotel, then invite a few people over to view a new laptop, what business is that of CES? I know CES doesn't want to lose money, but really these small businesses are just moving out of the way for the big guys to get more booths. Intel isn't going to bring people back to a hotel room, and the more companies you have in Las Vegas that week the bigger CES will be, whether they're in their room or on the floor.

Re:And this is news why? (3, Insightful)

iamhassi (659463) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726256)

"Intel isn't going to bring people back to a hotel room, and the more companies you have in Las Vegas that week the bigger CES will be, whether they're in their room or on the floor."

Also once these small time players become larger companies thanks to hotel rooms at CES, do you think they're going to want to associate themselves with the small time players peddling wares out of a hotel room? This is like selling TVs off the back of a truck, if you become successful eventually you'll want to get your own store, and eventually these companies will move out of their rooms and down to CES floor.

If you don't do this, these smaller companies might band together and get one hotel for themselves that week and do their own thing. Sure 10 grand ain't much to a Vegas hotel, but you get several dozen 10 grands together and some of the smaller hotels might take notice.

Re:And this is news why? (1)

Unequivocal (155957) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726490)

Exactly. Mod parent up! This is similar to something Vegas should understand well: the pre-games for the World Series of Poker - people who don't have $10k to stake on the main event, play a satellite tournament in advance with a $1k stake, and if they win, they get their $10k stake for the big time..

Re:And this is news why? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726868)

Small time players? The whole world cannot be Intel, but surely everyone on /. has heard of Zallman, one of those removed from the hotel.

Re:And this is news why? (5, Insightful)

aaandre (526056) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726466)

What we see here is the overreaching arrogance of an organization blinded by the belief that they "own" something that can't be owned: others' right to share their products with an audience. Ironically, the show exists precisely because of all these big and little companies make an effort to show up, pay up, and display their products to an audience.

Now, the middlemen suddenly believe that they own the process of doing so, and not just the real estate of the showfloor.

It is crucial how the bullied companies react to this insanity. Ideally, big headlines revealing the evilness and stupidity of CES management, and appropriate lawsuits will provide CES with enough incentive to refrain from bullying their own (potential) clients in the future.

I can see how scared CES may be of the possibility of a parallel tech expo which they can not monetize on. Wouldn't that be a great idea? Lower participation threshold, more indie companies, diversity, and the possibility of fun with fewer constipated uptight suits in the room.

Re:And this is news why? (1)

TubeSteak (669689) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726596)

I think the real lesson here is not to stay at The Venetian.

The real lesson is to get it in writing.
If you can't have it in writing then, at a bare minimum,
document who you talked to, when, and what was said.

Re:And this is news why? (1)

mmeister (862972) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727056)

Most normal people will look give you a stupid look if you ask to have in writing that you can have a business meeting in the suite you rented for the week. While I could *maybe* understand it if you had a standard room (although even then), but you rented a suite. That would be a place that has separated the bedroom from a meeting place. That seems like standard operating procedure for businessmen on the road.

No, the Venetian should get a big fat black eye for acting like thugs in what clearly looks to be a CES shakedown that probably is illegal, even in Las Vegas.

Re:And this is news why? (1)

ShadowBlasko (597519) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727146)

Well, it seems to depend on the market.

I've done fetish shows and high end precious and semi-precious gemstone shows where I would estimate that at least 50% of the selling goes on before or after hours.

Basically, any kind of product where;
1) The retailer may not be comfortable with the products for fear of blackmail [Just because you are a high end jewelry and clothing boutique, doesn't mean you don't sell latex corsets and vac beds on weekends]
2) Prices are based more on what the seller knows than what the product is worth. [gem shows are huge for that kind of thing.
3) Where price depends on venue. [That $200 piece of white turquoise might be worth $100 in Tuscon, but $500 in Chicaqo] So prices are best discussed in a private setting.

wrong tag line (0, Offtopic)

alen (225700) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726002)

this should be a YRO article

Re:wrong tag line (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726294)

Your rights ______ ?

Re:wrong tag line (2, Funny)

biryokumaru (822262) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726824)

Your rights ______ ?

Offline.

So... (5, Interesting)

XPeter (1429763) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726004)

To sum up TFA:

1. CEA buys out Vegas for a week, attracting technology enthusiasts and large companions from across the globe.
2. Said organization is holding the balls of local buisness so tight, that they must bend over to anything the CEA demands.
(In this instance it was having The Venetian, The Palazzo kick out small/medium tech buisnesses who couldn't afford a CES floor spot onto the streets unless they paid the hefty fee of $10,000)
3. ???
4. Profit!

Another evil coorperation fucking over the little guy, nothing to see here folks.

Re:So... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726334)

Okay, let's look at it from the other way...

1: Organization spends millions advertising and setting up one of the most well known trade shows.
2: Said organization finds out one of the hotels it is paying truckloads of money to is renting out rooms to vendors who want to be associated with their show, but not pay the fees which make it happen.
3: Hotel, realizing which side of the bread the butter is, kicks out small vendor.
4: Small vendor whines that they can't get free publicity from demoing their stuff at CES, that they have to actually pay for it.
5: Whining gets small vendor free publicity.
6: ???
7: Profit!

Another attempt at getting free publicity. Nothing to see here, move along.

Re:So... (5, Insightful)

XPeter (1429763) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726502)

Your saying that it's acceptable for a cooperation to endorse monopolistic business practices?

Lets say I'm going to open a brand new WalMart here in my town, and I just spent a large wad of cash advertising for it. Does the mom n pop grocery shop across the way not have the right to operate? I think not.

When signing up for the hotel, companies such as Zalman ASKED the hotels if there were any pretenses to having a gallery in their rooms, and the hotels answered no. The problem here is that the CEA became flustered and used their $$$ to kick out mom n' pop.

It's called being anti-competitive.

Re:So... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726658)

Your saying that it's acceptable for a cooperation to endorse monopolistic business practices?

What monopoly? Huh? Wha?

Lets say I'm going to open a brand new WalMart here in my town, and I just spent a large wad of cash advertising for it. Does the mom n pop grocery shop across the way not have the right to operate? I think not.

Sure they have the right to operate. But do they have the right to open up a store in the same strip mall called "WallMort", with the same blue colors and tacky look, that sells the same crap? Nope.

When signing up for the hotel, companies such as Zalman ASKED the hotels if there were any pretenses to having a gallery in their rooms, and the hotels answered no. The problem here is that the CEA became flustered and used their $$$ to kick out mom n' pop. It's called being anti-competitive.

Again, you keep using terms I don't think you understand. It's not anti-competitive... they're keeping somebody from piggybacking on their investment.

The problem here is the hotel said one thing, and did another. The fault here lies with THE VENETIAN. Not CES. And it's certainly not 'a monopoly' or 'anti-competitive'...

Re:So... (1)

XPeter (1429763) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727220)

Since you question my competetence, here's the definition for anti-competetive

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-competitive [wikipedia.org]

The CEA is prohibiting other business' from preforming perfectly legal actions.

Just because a company is bigger than yours, doesn't give it the authority to prohibit you from selling your merchandise.

Lastly, it's not creating a WallMort. It's creating a NEW market for those interested in what these smaller-businesses have to offer, you can't suggest that CES is going to cry bankruptcy because of some competition.

If I go and fly to Vegas to grab a hooker, that doesn't tie me to that girl unless there is some binding contract (Which in this case, is non-existent), so I'm free to go and check out another lady if I please.

Re:So... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726356)

CES? Isn't that where they're showing all of that "3D" TV crap that nobody really gives a fuck about? And the next generation of locked-down mobile devices that run only the shittiest, vendor-approved apps?

Re:So... (5, Informative)

spatley (191233) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727030)

It is worth noting that the Venetian is also an official CES venue in their convention space so CEA is not just a big pull on the industry, but a big pull on the Venetian for some pretty hefty revenue. This does not take conspiracy theory, this is a corporate entity throwing a small client under the bus to make a gigantic client happy. Standard procedure in big business.

That is positively asinine. (5, Insightful)

jcr (53032) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726008)

Vendors have been showing their products in hotel hospitality suites for decades. I've never been to any trade show yet where this wasn't the case. I don't know what the hell CES management is thinking if they consider this any kind of a problem.

-jcr

Re:That is positively asinine. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726044)

Absolutely! do they think the suites are only for ho's and coke?

Re:That is positively asinine. (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726092)

"I've never been to any trade show yet where this wasn't the case."

Even companies that have floor space MOST have some sort of suite where the big guys can come in and play with the gear without having to deal with the riffraff.

I'm headed out to a show in a few days in LA that I've been invited to a few...last time I was out there, I thought I was meeting up with the pres of an overseas company to see his products, and it ended up being a suite full of scantily dressed hookers and coke. Only speaking broken Japanese, I apologized to the gentleman as I figured I had the wrong room.

I quickly got the hell out of there...my buddy, however, decided to stick around for a while...turns out it WAS the guy were were supposed to meet!

They had one of the biggest sq ft on the floor, bit there was OBVIOUSLY a reason he needed to have his suite private...kinda wish I had stuck around!

Re:That is positively asinine. (2, Insightful)

negRo_slim (636783) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726788)

I call BS on the whole post. Sounds like a Penthouse Forum letter more than anything.

Re:That is positively asinine. (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30727122)

It happens. I've seen it. I know, this is another anecdotal post, but I'm not the same AC from above.

Re:That is positively asinine. (4, Funny)

houstonbofh (602064) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727212)

I call BS on the whole post. Sounds like a Penthouse Forum letter more than anything.

That or the broadcom suite...

Re:That is positively asinine. (1)

ncohafmuta (577957) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726796)

I'm headed out to a show in a few days in LA that I've been invited to a few...last time I was out there, I thought I was meeting up with the pres of an overseas company to see his products, and it ended up being a suite full of scantily dressed hookers and coke. Only speaking broken Japanese, I apologized to the gentleman as I figured I had the wrong room.

wrong room??? what's the right room!? ;-)

Re:That is positively asinine. (-1, Flamebait)

Maniacal (12626) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726144)

I've seen this as well but I've only seen it as "hospitality suites" in which the vendor has a booth at the show and ALSO setups in their rooms. These people were trying to piggyback off of CES popularity and get a free ride.

Re:That is positively asinine. (4, Insightful)

Blakey Rat (99501) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726220)

They paid for the rooms, same as everybody else. The hotel had no objections to what they were doing...

Sure, the timing means that they were taking advantage of the marketing for CES, but that's not against the law. (Hell, it's an old long-standing tradition, if anything.)

Don't make excuses for this asshole move.

Re:That is positively asinine. (1)

Aeros (668253) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726482)

The article said some of those people did have spots on the CES floor...but some didn't.

Re:That is positively asinine. (5, Insightful)

wramsdel (463149) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726370)

You're damn straight, and there's nothing wrong with it. When 40-50 of your customers are in one place at the same time, you'd be an absolute fool not to go there and meet with them. It's the most bang for the buck you'll get all year. How far, exactly, do you need to be from the show floor before you're not trying to "get a free ride"? If I'm at CES and a buddy of mine's at CES, and we get together and talk business somewhere on the strip, are we trying to "get a free ride" because we're not buying the CEA's beer? Where's that line drawn?

Re:That is positively asinine. (1)

Unequivocal (155957) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726536)

That's like arguing that tech companies are getting a "free ride" by basing themselves in Silicon Valley. Or that retail stores are getting a free ride by opening shops on Main St alongside all the other stores.

The problem in the story is that CES didn't establish and publicize a policy that "satellite events" were not permitted in hotels they were booking. Why didn't they publicize this? Because it's terrible publicity of course. But they seem happy to enforce it - and other than slashdot this will probably get very little play, so it is probably a smart strategy.

Re:That is positively asinine. (3, Insightful)

mmeister (862972) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727120)

Um, not a free ride. If you rented a suite during CES, especially close to any of the venues, I can guarantee you paid out the ass for it.
Free ride? No way.

Now, CES a-holes didn't get their pound of flesh, but it isn't theirs to take.

Re:That is positively asinine. (5, Informative)

Kemanorel (127835) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726234)

Having stayed at the Venetian the week before CES two years ago, I can say without a doubt that it is usually standard practice to hold meetings in hotel rooms. I had been upgraded to a suite there and the night before I was to check out, hotel staff were removing beds (mattresses and frames) from every room in the same wing and floor I was staying on. I can only imagine that they were going to take the bed from the room I was in as soon as I checked out.

When I used to attend CES in the late 90's through 2002, I was well aware of business meetings as well as parties being held in hotel rooms at most of the nearby hotels. I never received an invite, but the Kentia hall vendors would often have a sign saying, "Come see our presentation in room blah of the [Hilton, Venetian, Sands, etc...]."

I'm thinking this is just CES management shaking down unregistered vendors that are trying to piggyback on the show without paying a share. I could be wrong though.

Re:That is positively asinine. (5, Informative)

jcr (53032) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726456)

Having stayed at the Venetian the week before CES two years ago, I can say without a doubt that it is usually standard practice to hold meetings in hotel rooms.

It's the same for NAB. Last time I attended, I had at least four meetings with vendors in hotel rooms where they had demo systems set up for products they weren't ready to announce and were only showing under NDA terms.

-jcr

Re:That is positively asinine. (2, Interesting)

Unequivocal (155957) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726564)

These vendors are probably registered at CES as customers rather than getting a booth. They probably have staff wandering around on the floor picking up clients and taking them back to their hotel room. Kind of like high-tech hookers, I guess.

CES doesn't like customers stealing other customers - they want those customers on the floor looking at the booths that bigger vendors paid big dollars for.

Re:That is positively asinine. (4, Informative)

wramsdel (463149) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726280)

Seconded. I've been to CES a number of times with a wireless startup, and we've always been in suites in the hotels. There's no way they don't know exactly what's going on when they see us roll up in a loaded minivan with boxes that say "Dell" all over them. We chose suites for two reasons: the obvious expense aspect, and there is no way we'd try to demo on the show floor...the RF environment is just too congested. It's also a much nicer way to engage a customer, and gives them a break from the insanity of the floor. I can't imagine that the use of suites will ever go away...CEA will just find a way to drive the cost up.

Re:That is positively asinine. (4, Insightful)

mrisaacs (59875) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726662)

Ok let's get it straight.

CES allows or at least turns a blind eye to vendors who have rented space on the floor and also show products in their suites, or there might be restrictions on when the suites are used, etc.

The hotel staff who told the vendors who did not have floor space, that here were no restrictions probably did not know the hotels had a contractual agreement with CES, specifically not to allow suites to be used by vendors who did not have floor space.

There's a simple reason for this. CES spends a lot of money to rent facilities, guarantee occupancy and advertise the event. Some portion of the fee$ paid by the vendors who rent floor space goes to this.

The vendors who don't rent floor space are capitalizing on the attendees, who are their because of the efforts of CES and those vendors who rented floor space. Before anyone makes the analogy - this is NOT akin to filesharing or the alledged piracy of music or video. This is more akin to pirating someones' signal and replacing their content with your own.

The suite only vendors are not only not paying CES for their services, they are reducing the amount of face time for the vendors who are paying for those services. If they make a sale - it really is potentially at the cost of someone else who paid to show at the conference.

The agreements with the hotels are CES' insurance that attendees only view the wares of those who have paid to be at the conference, for the duration of the conference. It costs them money (or occupancy guarantees/penalties) to get those agreements..

They were no kicked out for showcasing wares (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726026)

They were kicked out for placing improperly licensed chocolates on hotel pillows.

Re:They were no kicked out for showcasing wares (1)

Aeros (668253) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726508)

damn..those are the 'worst' kind of chocolates!!

Bob's Country Bunker (1)

BlueBoxSW.com (745855) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726032)

I would love to make a "Bob's Country Bunker" reference, but it would only make sense if you go to the Philly Folk Fest.

Re:Bob's Country Bunker (1)

mcgrew (92797) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726410)

Or have seen a Blues Brothers movie.

It's like (2, Interesting)

MikeyinVA (1450809) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726034)

Wi-fi and tables are available at the bookstore but they don't expect you to run your business, host clients, create displays on the tables (seen this done before!). CES and Vegas in general benefit from having a formal process and presenteres paying a fee and going through a process. Of course the hotel (and Vegas and CES) wouldn't want this.

does AVN have the same rules? (3, Funny)

alen (225700) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726038)

AVN holds the porn convention at the same time in vegas. do they have the same rules about not working in your rooms? maybe the demo was a rogue AVN guest and not CES?

Re:does AVN have the same rules? (3, Funny)

geekmux (1040042) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726104)

AVN holds the porn convention at the same time in vegas. do they have the same rules about not working in your rooms? maybe the demo was a rogue AVN guest and not CES?

Perhaps, but I guarantee you the product lines would not be confused. Different hardware and firmware altogether.

Re:does AVN have the same rules? (3, Funny)

Whalou (721698) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726228)

Viagra can convert firmware into hardware.

Re:does AVN have the same rules? (3, Funny)

Dunbal (464142) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726414)

Viagra can convert firmware into hardware.

      But is there any hope for micro soft?

Re:does AVN have the same rules? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726428)

and more importantly software into firmware...

Re:does AVN have the same rules? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726898)

You mean software into hardware.

At first glance I read "Showcasing Warez in Room" (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726046)

Probably scared the crap out of the DRM mafia.

Tightening up... (5, Insightful)

meerling (1487879) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726052)

I guess they really want to tighten up their grasp at other companies money.

I've always heard about these types of 'parties' from all the shows, especially CES and EEE.
Even Microsoft and Sony (among many others) do these for some stuff.
The smaller vendors have utterly relied on being able to do this.
Having a small booth in a 'busy' place like that can make it really hard to do a presentation of your product, not to mention restricting access when you want to keep it limited.
Seems a bit odd (or greedy) for them to start cracking down on it now.

Re:Tightening up... (2, Insightful)

silent_artichoke (973182) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726184)

I guess they really want to tighten up their grasp at other companies money.

The more they do that, the more star systems will slip through their fingers.

Re:Tightening up... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30727080)

What the hell is happening to peoples' ability to write paragraphs? Everwhere more and more people are writing lots of sentences as individual paragraphs, seemingly unable to group the related ones. It's maddening to read and witness!

Pretty disgusting (5, Insightful)

HEbGb (6544) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726058)

The CEA can institute whatever rules it wants on its own show property, but it has no business or right to interfere with anything (ahem) going on in local Las Vegas hotel rooms.

Similarly, unless the hotel informed them of some restriction, and as long as they abided by all of their usual rules, they have no basis for throwing them out, at all. I hope these companies fight this. At the very least, there's remedy in small-claims action. And obviously they should dispute any credit card charges from the hotel.

They're probably desperate from the declining numbers, and revenue, and are in financial trouble.

Re:Pretty disgusting (2, Informative)

Derekloffin (741455) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726150)

And, as usual, CEA doesn't realize this will not help them in the long run. All they do with this guy of BS is irritate the very companies they want to court, making them that much more prone to saying 'F it' and either skipping the event entirely, or using completely separate events to hock their wares.

Re:Pretty disgusting (1)

hackus (159037) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726398)

"They're probably desperate from the declining numbers, and revenue, and are in financial trouble."

Them and half of the United States small businesses and local, state and Federal government.

It tisn't going to get better any time soon either.

-Hack

PS: Unless of course your a bank or Wall Street which is currently in the middle of another Ponzi scheme with the market going up, and everything else going down the crapper.

Lawsuit, anyone (3, Interesting)

mtrachtenberg (67780) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726130)

Monopolistic practices. Interference with trade. Lost and unrecoverable revenue opportunities. General fuckedupness.

Re:Lawsuit, anyone (-1, Offtopic)

mtrachtenberg (67780) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726168)

Interesting. Within one minute of my posting the parent, it had been down-moderated. It was then up-moderated, but someone wanted it to disappear.

Re:Lawsuit, anyone (0, Troll)

feepness (543479) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726742)

Or perhaps your post just contained a lot of general fuckedupedness.

Sounds pretty idiotic to me (3, Insightful)

khallow (566160) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726140)

CEA probably could have saved a lot of grief by warning these vendors ahead of time that it was going to do this sort of thing. Sure a number of the vendors would have worked around the rules, but that'll happen next year despite the crackdown. The vendors will just be a bit more clever.

Further, this just reeks of bad communication and incompetent handling by CEA and the respective hotels. If I were involved with the decision, I'd be worried about breech of contract suits from the affected vendor firms. Just from my extremely crude reading of the article, this doesn't sound like CEA or some of the hotels did due diligence in upholding their side of the exhibition contracts.

Finally, these sorts of antics show up when an organization is tight on money and starts ignoring long term costs and harm. One wonders if the CEA will go bankrupt in a few years.

Re:Sounds pretty idiotic to me (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726296)

One wonders if the CEA will go bankrupt in a few years.

IMNSHO, they now deserve to.

So, the question now is, how do we - the consumers - facilitate this?

Re:Sounds pretty idiotic to me (2, Funny)

GooberToo (74388) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726300)

The vendors will just be a bit more clever.

Like refusing maid service. Its not that hard to place a "Do not disturb" sign on the door.

Vegas mafia strikes again! (1, Troll)

sageres (561626) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726142)

"In Vegas, everybody's gotta watch everybody else. Since the players are looking to beat the casino, the dealers are watching the players. The box men are watching the dealers. The floor men are watching the box men. The pit bosses are watching the floor men. The shift bosses are watching the pit bosses. The casino manager is watching the shift bosses. I'm watching the casino manager. And the eye-in-the-sky is watching us all." Casino (1995), Robert De Niro as Sam "Ace" Rothstein:

In FreeMarket America... (4, Insightful)

fantomas (94850) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726204)

... no competition is allowed ;-)

Re:In FreeMarket America... (2, Insightful)

aicrules (819392) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726606)

On private property, he who owns the private property has sole discretion over what can and cannot be done on that property within the realms of legal activities. Obviously illegal activities are not allowed with or without the owner's discretion.

Re:In FreeMarket America... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726828)

Yet another retard who doesn't understand the concept of the free market but feels no shame in his ignorance and will continue to make all kinds of assumptions.

These are the people we normally laugh at for being fools but I guess when you have all kinds of bias instead of a working model that's what you'll get.

Whats the Warez connection? (2, Funny)

vlm (69642) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726252)

I had to read this at least three times to figure out they meant "wares" not "warez".

I was thinking, video game modchips and rom images, or torrented movies playing in the hospitality suite?

I visted vendor room at VMWorld (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726336)

I visted at least four different vendors in their suits at the Venetian and The Palazzo for food, drink, and discussion while at VMWorld in 2008 (one was a large VMWare competitor). Some of party setups were very elaborate with a rotating guest count of over 50 people. One of the vendors even brought his own alcohol, although he had to sneak it in his luggage in multiple trips.

On a side note, I stayed at the Venetian, it is an awesome hotel with very large rooms. It would have been a decent stay with the exception of the "subtle" flower fragrance they inject in to the ventilation system, it triggered my allergies and brought on repeated use of my inhaler. I can kind of understand the psychological influence it might have on people gambling on the floor but why did they have to use it in the guest rooms as well? When I asked about it at the front desk, they acted as if I was the first person ever to complain about that.

 

Almost certainly the hotel really had restrictions (4, Insightful)

PatMcGee (710105) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726366)

I've seen this happen with Siggraph. The contract that Siggraph had with the hotels said that no vendor suites would be allowed for display of products or meetings with actual or prospective customers without explicit written permission from Siggraph management. All vendor suites had to be booked through Siggraph.

In, I think 1994, several vendors had such suites and publicized them at the exhibition. Siggraph management charged the hotel the standard suite fee for each of those vendor suites. Collected it too. I don't know if the hotels managed to get it back from the vendors or not.

And it will continue.... (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30726402)

with smaller companies will find anyway to save revenue if possible..

For example, the cost of the mandated "union" to plug in the 300 watts of trade show display booth lights into an electrical outlet is $150. An an "always on" Internet at the shows are typically $500+ when if you can get the same connectivity in your room for $10.

We run our demo at the show(s) over the internet by tethering our mobile phone internet connection- instead of paying the overinflated price for broadband at conventions. By attending as little as two tradeshows a year more than justifies the annual costs of the data plans from any major mobile phone network.

Announcing competitive event for 2011 (4, Funny)

ls671 (1122017) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726432)

We are proud to announce that we will be holding a similar event in Lost Springs, WY and that there will be absolutely no restriction on what participants may do. Also, the fees we are going to charge will be ridiculously low compared to what it costs in Vegas.

Stay tuned for updates.

You can look here for directions :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_Springs,_Wyoming [wikipedia.org]

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Lost+Springs&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=32.252269,72.158203&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Lost+Springs,+Converse,+Wyoming&ll=42.863886,-105.314941&spn=0.93208,2.254944&z=9 [google.com]

There are definately 2 sides to this (1)

Stregano (1285764) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726460)

One side is basically CEA not getting their dues. Setting up shop in a suite is essentially similar to setting up a small booth for the price of a suite and food.

How fair is it to the other companies that had to pay the dues that there are companies displaying products without paying the 10,000 fee?

Me, personally, I am an indie game developer. I am sure you have all heard of me. What? You have not heard of me? That is probably because I do not have the money to pay to get myself publicity through channels such as E3 or other means like that. I can see where the publicity is good for the people that do not have the money.

One thing I did not see mentioned: Did these smaller companies make previous arrangements with CEA before booking the suites to show their products? If they DID make previous arrangements with CEA to display their items at CES and then just did not pay the fees, and instead just held their own display in a suite, than that is wrong.

They also do not state what kind of suites these guys were staying in. It could have been the cheap 150 a night rooms, or it could have been a penthouse. That piece of information also makes a difference. Let me explain: a penthouse is super expensive. I am sure if you shopped around, you could finda penthouse for 1000 a night. Let's see, one week is 7 days, which is 7000 if you do good shopping. If you can afford that, then save a little more and you will be good to display.

Like I said, it truly depends on a couple factors: were they displaying this stuff in nice suites that could help prove that they could have afforded the 10,000 if they had gotten cheaper rooms? Did they make previous arrangements with CEA and then display items in their rooms?

There is just too much information left out of this and it is clearly one sided with the lack of information.

One of the sources asked if there were any restrictions to being in the room, but if I were to call one of those places right now and ask what restrictions I had for a show, the hotel clerk may not be able to realize that I am actually a business.

Do not get me wrong, I am not one sided here. I come from the side of the person that would be paying for the $150 room and not being able to afford the 10,000 fee. With how many small companies they said had to leave (I think it was around 30), that means that there is an incredibly small chance that all of those companies were staying in Presidential Suites or something like that.

Also, somebody else in the comments pointed out that hotel room showings were pretty standard and normal for these shows. That is where it does flip the script a little bit.

I am saying that this sucks for both sides. The smaller companies have to pack up their stuff when they have been accustomed to being able to do the hotel room showings and not told ahead of time that they can't do them.
On the same note: I am sure it is not cheap to be able to take over a portion of Vegas to throw together a massive show like CES. Where does that money come from? I bet alot of that money comes from vendor fees. If 30 vendors did not pay the fee, that is $300,000 that CEA could use to continue the show.

Re:There are definately 2 sides to this (1)

kylemonger (686302) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726646)

How fair is it to the other companies that had to pay the dues that there are companies displaying products without paying the 10,000 fee?

Well, you would assume that if you're on the CES floor as opposed to a hotel suite, you'd get a lot more people walking by your display, neh? That's part of what the floor display fee buys you. How is it fair to pay the fee and not get that foot traffic, which is what these people were apparently being asked to do?

Always tip the cleaning staff! (2, Insightful)

castironpigeon (1056188) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726486)

I'm guessing they got more for turning the guests in than they would have for cleaning the rooms for a couple of days.

I'm not surprised at all. (1)

MarchTheMonth (1232442) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726512)

I am not surprised at all that the hotels kicked em to the curb. Makes sense, you have a bunch of techies that do not gamble like other conventioneers do, CES makes money (and continues to beable to have the CES because of the income), and no offense to the small players, but if you can't pay/are unwilling to pay to get on the floor, then perhaps you don't belong at CES.

From the Hotel's perspective, the removal makes complete sense. CES is bringing in money to them, paying them to have X amount of floor space, which X floor space would be larger if these small players paid to be on the floor, and are instead paying for just a room.

Which sounds more likely in Vegas: CES is really upset not to have the money and asks the small player(s) to be removed, or the Hotel is upset enough to ask them to leave because they're not making the extra money. I'm going with the latter. Vegas hotels will say one thing and then change their mind, or the front of the hotel person was incorrect on the "restrictions" (possibly even using tricky wording to think they have the freedom to have their displays in their room). My money is totally on hotel management getting wind of it and taking it upon themselves to "solve" the situation.

I first misread title... (1)

Nomaxxx (1136289) | more than 4 years ago | (#30726582)

as "Vendors Kicked Out of Hotels For Showcasing Whores in Room".

Renting from the CES Block of Rooms? (1)

mistapotta (941143) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727046)

Not mentioned in the article was did they pay for one of the (usually discounted) block of rooms CES had set aside. Usually large conventions set aside a block of rooms at a discount for people participating in the convention. Their guarantee subsidizes the cost of these rooms, and give them a bit more control over what goes on there. Doesn't make their actions less ass-hat, but does let me understand why the CES would have that much sway over the occupants of the rooms, as they might have paid for (up to half) part of the rooms' cost.

A warning / refund seems logical (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30727062)

Shouldn't they simply have warned them and required them to stop or at least refunded there money? Is it really fair for someone to take your money decide what your doing doesn't suite them and kick you out without so much as a dime in return? Was there any information up front about product showcasing being against there policies? *sigh* only in the united states.

The idea that... (2, Informative)

DavidTC (10147) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727076)

...CES 'kicked people out of hotel suites' is patently delusional. The hotels kicked them out. Random people cannot kick people out of hotel rooms.

Whether or not the hotels can do that is a separate point. You cannot just randomly kick people out of their rooms for no reason.

While a lot of you are talking about 'changing agreements' after the fact, I'm not entirely certain hotels could actually dictate the purposes for which you could use a hotel room even with a contract in advance.

Everyone assuming this is a simple matter of contract law needs to look up 'innkeeper statutes'...people who operate hotels cannot just randomly make whatever rules and regulations they want about residents, even in advance.

If I walk up to a hotdog vender, and want to buy a hotdog and have the money, and he doesn't like my hat, he doesn't have to sell me a hotdog. Normal businesses can refuse service to anyone except for specific reasons.

If I want up to a hotel, however, and have the money, they do have to give me a room if they have one, unless they think I'm going to use it for some unlawful purposes. Hotels are not like other businesses, they're not even like apartments...they are considered public accommodations, and the reasons you can refuse service are only the reasons specifically outlined in law.(1)

There are a lot of other regulations about what 'innkeepers' can, and cannot, do. For example, in most places, they can't actually disallow non-renters from visiting a renter who authorizes them. Your parties have to obey fire code, and cannot be disruptive, but that's it.

I know a lot of people assume 'Companies can do anything as long as they say it advance', but 'innkeeping' is actually heavily regulated.

Casinos in Vegas have, for exactly this reason, a clearly defined area that is 'the hotel' (Where innkeeping laws hold sway), vs. 'the casino' (Where gambling laws hold), vs. the rentable floor areas (Which are just like renting a warehouse or something) vs. the rest of the building (Which falls more under the 'mall' part of the law, being open to the public.)

Oh, and some people may be unaware...The Venetian and The Palazzo are the same building. They are two hotels next to each other, with one casino in the middle of them, and one (huge multi-story) exhibit area behind the casino, along with a bunch of other stuff back there like the Blue Man Group theater. (I stayed at the Venetian once.)

1) Someone's about to say 'Hey, didn't hotels used bar unmarried couples from staying, and to have 'house detectives who attempted to make sure that people weren't using hotels for affairs?'. Yes, and having sex outside of marriage used to be illegal, making that being 'using a hotel room for unlawful purposes', until the Supreme Court struck those laws down, and hotels had to stop.

New Show: CNC (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30727162)

CNC , which stands for CNC's Not CES is a fantastic new high-tech consumer gadgetry trade exhibition that'll be going on next year in Las Vegas, coinciding with the closed CES show. Bring your stuff!

CES owns Vegas? (1)

santiagodraco (1254708) | more than 4 years ago | (#30727198)

Congratulations on CES purchasing controlling rights to the Venetian and Palazzo hotels such that they can control what you can or cannot do in your rented suite! What's next, you won't be able to fly into Vegas unless you have a CES badge?

showcasing wares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#30727226)

"showcasing wares" - is that what the kids are calling it these days?

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