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Chicago Mayor Calls For "Brainiac High"

Soulskill posted more than 4 years ago | from the edumication-in-the-windy-city dept.

Education 419

theodp writes "In a private lunch with Chicago Mayor Richard M. Daley, BusinessWeek's Michael Arndt was taken aback by the mayor's candid monologues against the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and the failure of public schools — Chicago's included — to adequately train kids today in technology, math, and science. Among the education fixes Daley said he's contemplating are a fifth year of high school and elite math and science academies for Chicago's brainiest students. Endless wars that divert hundreds of billions a year from schools and job training are also undermining America's competitiveness, Daley added, wondering where the public outrage is."

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Schools vs. Killing brown people (3, Insightful)

koreaman (835838) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800390)

Thank god at least one elected official has some sense of priorities...

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (1, Troll)

Rockoon (1252108) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800422)

Except that his message is to throw more money at schools as if that will fix the problem.

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800474)


Except that his message is to throw more money at schools as if that will fix the problem.

Actually, his message hints at an end to the "social promotion" and "everyone is equal" memes that has plagued the system. If he thinks he can do that with more money, then by all means please. We just had an article about Jaime Escalante who was a pioneer of that braniac concept, who was forced out by the union for promoting "inequality" (especially among teachers). He tried again at other public schools but was unable to hire the quality of teacher he needed for his program to work.... apparently "those who can" got paid big money for "doing".

Of course, Daley being Daley, I'm sure the money will quickly disappear into people's pockets never to be seen again.

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (3, Insightful)

introspekt.i (1233118) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800506)

But, but, some people are more equal than others!

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800610)

Actually, his message hints at an end to the "social promotion" and "everyone is equal" memes that has plagued the system.

Good luck with that. After all Chicago is pretty darn full o' niggers.

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800660)

Well they shipped one off to Washington, D.C. - that's a start!

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (1, Informative)

spune (715782) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800848)

I went to the Illinois state-run brainiac school (IMSA) upon which Daley is dreaming -- let me tell you, this is not the model that will help Chicago's education program. These elite schools spend exorbitantly on a small crop of students, giving them (myself included) a fucking awesome education while students who didn't make the cut are stuck in the ineffectual morass of public high schools.

To really solve Chicago's education problem, you have to prioritize the schools that cater to the very worst students; it makes no sense to spend more money on students who are already succeeding.

It will work at least as well (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800496)

As throwing more money at the military-industrial complex

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (5, Informative)

PopeRatzo (965947) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800630)

Except that his message is to throw more money at schools as if that will fix the problem.

Like it or not, there's no such thing as a school that couldn't do a better job educating kids with more money. It does take money to teach kids. The more the better.

People point to public schools and say "See, they spend more money and don't get better results" than private schools.

What those people don't take into account is that private schools self-select their students based on social and economic measures, and start off with better students. Further, unlike the public schools, private schools are not required to take the most difficult cases: students with learning disabilities, physical disabilities, behavioral problems. Public schools MUST take those students, and that's where a huge amount of the funding in public schools goes.

Anybody who parrots the right-wing talking point that the problem is teachers unions has never taught in both public and private schools. I taught in both systems, back when I was working my way through grad-school in the 80s, and was on the school board for both my daughter's k-8 and high schools. She went to public schools here in Chicago and got a first-rate education (she's in grad school now). Chicago is supposedly "ground zero" for a school system that is dysfunctional because of the teachers' union, and I can tell you from direct experience that's not the problem.

The problems are many, but at the top are funding, shitty parenting, a growing socially and economically-impoverished underclass (thank you Ronald Reagan) and a society that is increasingly anti-education (thank you, Fox News).

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (4, Insightful)

russotto (537200) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800726)

Like it or not, there's no such thing as a school that couldn't do a better job educating kids with more money.

There are, however, such things as schools that will not do a better job educating kids if given more money.

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800766)

Bout time someone mentions parenting! Parents who choose to send kids to private school, despite higher costs, have a clue that having a decent education is important. (and the private schools benefit from having students whose parents tend to be intellectually smarter, generally leading to smarter kids.

As to thanking Ronald Reagan, it's the "trickle down" theory of economics at its best...rich people will tinkle down on poor people...err, trickle down. Whatever happened to that HBO documentary on Ronald Reagan that HBO was prevented from airing, even thought they paid for the production? Without the education of the people about the decisions that have had long lasting effects, how can people make more intelligent choices?

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (1)

0xdeadbeef (28836) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800744)

Except that his message is to throw more money at schools as if that will fix the problem.

Yeah. You'd think they'd have learned their lesson from the failure of capitalism. When will people learn, incentives don't work!

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800524)

This is Daley, he'll say anything to get more votes the idiots who live in Chicago.

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (4, Funny)

$RANDOMLUSER (804576) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800644)

This is Daley, he'll say anything to get more votes the idiots who live in Chicago.

Perhaps if he had his way, you and your ilk would be able to troll in complete, comprehensible sentences.

Your racism is really offensive (0, Insightful)

dirkdodgers (1642627) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800640)

Please stop using the words "brown people" like that. I don't care if you think you're being snide or ironic.

As one of those "brown people" I can tell you that to our ears it's your own racism you're projecting, not the alleged racism of anyone else. In fact, I've never heard a US politician in favor of the US wars in Iraq and Afghanistan use those words. It's always those who oppose them.

Speaking of education, while war is horrible and I would not wish it on anyone, at least now as a side effect the girls and young women in Afghanistan are returning to schools, still with great risks, but have been empowered to take some small measure of their future into their own hands. That, in the scale of human progress, is in my opinion at least no less an achievement than 5% more scientists coming out of the US.

Re:Your racism is really offensive (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800672)

Is that any worse than saying white people or black people?

Re:Your racism is really offensive (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800692)

I believe you may be missing something. Can you guess what it is?

Re:Your racism is really offensive (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800704)

Would you prefer camel jockey or sand nigger?

Re:Your racism is really offensive (3, Insightful)

koreaman (835838) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800778)

I'm against the war in Iraq. I think the war in Afghanistan was justified (but very stupidly prosecuted).

Racism is discrimination against people based on (perceived or real) racial characteristics. It's not using certain words. For the record, I harbor no ill will for members of any race and have many friends who could reasonably be called "brown".

Obviously no politician who cares less about non-Americans is going to publicly announce that by calling them "brown people". When I and other people against the war use that term, it is to signify that that is the mindset of most of those in favor of the war continuing, NOT to say that I condone people being lumped together under that label.

Re:Your racism is really offensive (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800802)

OMFG, who modded this whiny humorless vagina "insightful"? Does he really think that Bush & Cheney were really going to publicly admit that "Operation Enduring Freedom" was really (in their minds) "Operation Get The Rest of the Brown Ones"?

Re:Schools vs. Killing brown people (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800818)

If common sense (like Daley's) does not take over soon we shall have weapons generally smarter than people (the weapons industry has been for quite some time now, feeding on the bloodshed), continuous war in the streets instead of solutions to the world's problems. Pres. Eisenhower after WWII warned against the "military industrial complex". He is not with us anymore. Nazis and commies are gone, so what now ? Find WMDs ? Or go after the real daily killers like disease, traffic, drugs, poverty, ignorance, illiteracy ?

Chicago Mayor Calls For 'Brainiac High' (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800394)

If the Mayor wants to get a "brainiac high" he can try one of those Ecstasy dens down on the south side.

But (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800406)

>Endless wars that divert hundreds of billions a year from schools and job training are also undermining America

Have you seen how brown those people are?

Re:But Yes! (1)

mcneely.mike (927221) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800694)

They are so brown, their brown goes all the way to eleven!
Don't touch them... don't even look at them.

5th year? (5, Insightful)

sanosuke001 (640243) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800408)

How about let the smart kids finish the required classes and go to college a year early? Or at least work on college classes their fourth year (like a community college set of classes for free given to them by the high school). Making them wait another year seems cruel when they can do the same coursework in college and actually further their education instead of taking classes that will probably be required in college anyway, effectively making them take those classes twice.

Re:5th year? (3, Insightful)

salesgeek (263995) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800420)

Nah... they should go to school for and extra year to get the smart ground out of them.

Re:5th year? (3, Insightful)

russotto (537200) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800746)

How about let the smart kids finish the required classes and go to college a year early?

Where's the money in that for Daley?

Re:5th year? (2, Informative)

pooh666 (624584) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800780)

The practical effect of this *should* be just that the kids get a free year of collage on the state under the guise of another year of high school. Sounds like a great deal to me. So not so cruel. Many kids manage to cut close to a year off as it is with advanced classes. If this opens up those chances to a few more, then great as well.

Re:5th year? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800870)

I was going to make the same comment. His fifth year sounds like a remedial education for students who find they weren't properly prepared for secondary education. Treating the symptom and not addressing problem.

Missed the mark (1, Insightful)

Brain-Fu (1274756) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800418)

There are not enough jobs that require math, science, and technology skills.

The jobs that exist don't pay squat.

Furthermore, brainy kids are treated terribly by their peers.

Therefore, neither kids nor adults have real incentives to develop themselves intellectually.

Pouring more money into schools will not change any of that.

Re:Missed the mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800464)

Well said!

Re:Missed the mark (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800558)

Is this post serious? Because if we're speaking seriously, every single sentence is absolutely wrong. Except maybe the "brainy kids are treated terribly by their peers", which is only true until college.

Re:Missed the mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800732)

Which is when they get taken advantage of by their peers.

Re:Missed the mark (1)

Alphanos (596595) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800892)

Oh, so kids are only discouraged from being brainy for the first 14 years of their education then? Got it, no problem.

Re:Missed the mark (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800566)

Why don't you train the kids that can apply those skills to creating things, and let them worry about making money? It used to work so well for us in the early 20th century. We had people who were smart and created things that they knew would be useful. They then attempted to sell those things.

Enough with the attitude that corporatism is neccessary for the progression of society and that we won't ever be able to move forward from our current position.

Re:Missed the mark (4, Insightful)

segmond (34052) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800602)

You can't be serious.

Once upon a time, there was not any job that really required science, math and technology skills? Go back to 1850.

So I suppose we should not have taught them. Do you think the job comes before the skills or the skills come before the job?

Frankly. There are more than enough jobs that require math, science, and technology skills. It's 2010. We are no longer in the industrial age, we are in the tech age. Even if people don't work in the tech fields, they will be able to apply their skills using technology. We are at the point where physicists, chemists, biologists are needing to know how to program to dig in into their work. Do you think it doesn't apply to other's in different fields? Please!

Jobs will be created when we know we have people with the needed skills.
It's when there aren't enough people with the skills that you need that we hesitate to create jobs because training is expensive!

Re:Missed the mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800736)

Actually we're going backwards in the number of tech jobs. Big time. Here in Portland, there are currently fewer tech jobs than there were 17 years ago. And this is a place where Intel has 4 factories including their only process development fab and employs about 10,000 people. But since 2006, Intel has closed one factory here and cut about 25% of its workforce.

Re:Missed the mark (3, Insightful)

mc moss (1163007) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800788)

I take it you have no clue at all about the science job market.

You work your ass off in college, then grad school, and are often required to do a post-doc these days. For what? You have a snowballs chance in hell getting tenure these days, and there is little stability in industry (especially biotech/pharma which I'm familiar with). And even if you have the PhD that is required for the job, if you don't have the right specialization, you can forget about getting the job. Add in the fact that companies are off-shoring or brining in H1B workers, why in anyone in their right mind do a science PhD?

There's a reason why if you go to the grad department of any university, it's filled with people from China and India with few if any Americans. There are no decent paying jobs for all the training and schooling required.

I know plenty of science PhD's. A lot of them still have the interest and love for science, but regret going down that path. It's hard work, little pay (compared for the training), heavily dependent on funding, and little prestige (compared to a doctor/lawyer/ibanker).

Re:Missed the mark (1)

93 Escort Wagon (326346) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800866)

I know plenty of science PhD's. A lot of them still have the interest and love for science, but regret going down that path. It's hard work, little pay (compared for the training), heavily dependent on funding, and little prestige (compared to a doctor/lawyer/ibanker).

Come on. I work in an engineering department at a state university. Starting faculty salaries are between eight and nine thousand dollars a month. Our full professors are making twenty thousand dollars a month. That's "little pay"? This is all public information and easily verified.

You also mentioned tenure. I didn't used to have a strong opinion about it, but now... it really is welfare for the well off. We have a couple dozen tenured faculty, and very few of them are doing any significant amount of research. There are a couple that still work hard, still invest loads of time into their students... but those are the exception.

Nice work if you can get it - you get paid very well for working hard 10-15 years, then you get paid fantastically for the next 20 years, even if you do next to nothing. I don't begrudge these guys their nice salaries, but - the tenure system has to go.

Re:Missed the mark (4, Insightful)

T Murphy (1054674) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800628)

At my highschool there wasn't a real problem between smart students and the rest of the school. I mean geeks still tended to hang out with each other, but if anything smart students got a little more respect than your average student. It's all about the culture of the school. Finding the right way to emphasize academic success could eliminate the geek-hating problem, and that could produce a positive feedback loop as people look up to straight-A students and try to become as successful as them.

That said, I realize not all students can pull off an A in calculus, so there has to be some balance so as to avoid sidelining the "dumb" students instead.

Re:Missed the mark (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800662)

I agree. The problem should be attacked from the demand side (industry, jobs) rather than the supply side (schools, # of math/science students). Kids get the picture. They're not studying science and math because they realize they'll actually get a job if they study business. They'll study the easier subjects any day, but when there's career incentives for it, we're in trouble.

The problem is that an Indian or a Chinese braniac is a lot cheaper than an American braniac. Our gov't must cut down in the number of H1B visas that are issued. That'll raise demand for American brains for companies that actually still manufacture here (Intel, for example) and software companies that still choose to develop products in the US.

Surely that won't begin to solve the problem, but there needs to be a carrot on a stick to get kids to go into science and math.

Brian
too lazy to create an account

Re:Missed the mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800734)

Therefore, neither kids nor adults have real incentives to develop themselves intellectually.

Maybe the graduates of the mayor's academy can be offered discounts on season tickets to Wrigley Field?

Steve Bartman (the guy who inadvertently prevented the Cubs' outfielder from catching a late inning fly ball in the playoffs) looks like a math/science type.

CPS (3, Insightful)

crumbz (41803) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800432)

The Chicago Public Schools are laying off teachers and closing schools due to budget constraints. Howver, despite da mayor's feelings on the issue, I am not sure that dumping more cash into the the arguably bloated CPS bureaucracy would result in students receiving a better education. At some point, parental responsibility ensuring that students actually attend the schools and complete the days assignments might have a greater impact.

Re:CPS (3, Insightful)

thbb (200684) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800906)

How is this "Insightful"? The USA are really doomed if its educated population actually believes this shit.

And how exactly, do you want to increase "parental responsibility"?

You want to set up a mandatory adult "schooling" education program? With what funds and who do you put in charge of creating this program, which would, admitedly, be a world premiere?

Or perhaps, you have the idea of sanctioning the parents when their children don't do their homework or don't attend school? This has been tried: it merely results in even more children dropping out of schools and even poorer education. Notwithstanding the creation of ghettoized populations cut back from any chances of ever raising out of poverty and poor education.

Even though it's costly, pouring more money at schools, providing teachers with the means to do their job well is the only method that has a track record of actually raising the education levels.

Yes, maybe the CPS' bureaucracy is choking the attempts of the few remaining dedicated teachers to do their job properly. In any case, I doubt it is much worse than the US Army bureaucracy, which is completely sold to the military industry.

Throwing more money in the school system provides the ability to hire more talents (at the management and operational levels), motivate the education personnel and, ultimately, raise the education levels globally. As for the details, let the teachers and their administration, who are in daily contact with the population they have to deal with, decide how it's better done.

Public outrage? (1)

the_arrow (171557) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800438)

wondering where the public outrage is

What happened the last 40 years or so? Then there were riots in the streets and major protests against the then ongoing war. Is a SUV on the driveway and a reality show on tv all that is needed to pacify everyone?

Yes (1)

ArchieBunker (132337) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800490)

Yes it is.

Re:Public outrage? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800528)

There were plenty of riots and massive demonstrations here in the UK. The issue in Britain is not lack of a public outcry but lack of anyone in Westminster who payed, or is paying, even the slightest attention with the two major parties having backed the war despite obvious massive popular opposition, and despite the extremely transparent nature of the nonsense regarding WMD, `hand of history on my shoulder' etc etc from Tony Blair.

Re:Public outrage? (2, Interesting)

Joce640k (829181) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800834)

Same thing here in Spain ... we had massive anti-war protests here and for weeks on end everybody would go out on the street at 8pm and bang frying pans with spoons to make a huge noise all over the city.

Did anybody listen? Nope. It took a change of government to get us out of Iraq.

(But hey, at least the 'democracy' part worked in the long term...)

Re:Public outrage? (4, Insightful)

Swanktastic (109747) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800844)

There is no draft.

Why add a 5th year? (2, Insightful)

commodore64_love (1445365) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800442)

It would just be wasted as a "babysitting service" like the first 4 years of high school typically are. The amount of time my teachers spend goofing-off in class, not teaching anything, was ridiculous. When I got to college the professors taught the same material in about one-quarter the time. - Take the existing 4 years and concentrate them. Instead of Algebra 1 and 2, make it a combined course. Then take the resulting extra year and teach some "tech oriented" like Programming.

Final thought - I wonder where Mayor Daley thinks he'll get the money? You can't get more juice out of an already-squeezed orange. A wiser course is to hold costs at present levels, and make sure the 12 years in school are maximized to full potential rather than wasted.

(But of course "I'll give your kids an extra 13th year" will probably sell better to voters.)

Re:Why add a 5th year? (2, Informative)

Nerdfest (867930) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800708)

We had 4 and 5 year paths through high school in Ontario up until fairly recently and I think it worked quite well. The 5th year in the advanced path had lots of science and math courses (physics, chemistry, calculus, functions and relations, algebra) as well as the usual English, history, etc. I'm still not sure why it was cancelled, the class sizes were always big enough (20-30).

Re:Why add a 5th year? (2, Informative)

RobinH (124750) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800828)

I was in the 5 year program, and I think the problem is that when you got to University, you're in first year with a bunch of other students who may not be from Ontario, so they may not have taken the 5th year of high school. The idea of the 5 year program was to help subsidize post-secondary education by teaching introductory level university courses to university-bound students without them having to pay tuition or live away from home, etc. I agree that it originally worked that way in principle, but once students started going to university out-of-province, the universities in Ontario had to assume you didn't have those courses, and universities outside of Ontario assumed nobody had them either, so you just ended up with a lot of repetition in first year.

Specifically I remember thinking that calculus was really easy in first year, but I was in class with people who hadn't done integration in high school. Things got harder again when everyone was up to speed.

I agreed with removing the 5th year. Not because it was a bad idea in principle, but because it was flawed in practice.

Re:Why add a 5th year? (1)

dAzED1 (33635) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800774)

"insightful..."

you wouldn't have learned it that fast in college, had you not already learned it in high school. Education is a cumulative process.

Re:Why add a 5th year? (1)

pooh666 (624584) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800800)

Why the bloody hell is Algebra even taught in high school? Like the last two years of grade school couldn't cover it as well for all but he ultra helmet wearers?

Why would the smart kids want to stay in hs? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800450)

The current highschool system is such a steep step down from college that staying an extra year seems like punishment.

Re:Why would the smart kids want to stay in hs? (1)

pooh666 (624584) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800822)

This depends on which classes you are in. In my high school AP Chem was a vastly different env than the time that shop classes with people smoking joints in the back. My school had both extremes and it was pretty much up to the kids which class they took. The only real difference I found in better high schools is they didn't have the joint smoking shop class part.

More money? (1)

jamesl (106902) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800454)

" ... Endless wars that divert hundreds of billions a year from schools and job training are also undermining America's competitiveness, Daley added, wondering where the public outrage is."

And exactly how would the good mayor spend the hundreds of billions a year to improve schools? Specifically. No platitudes. Nothing like, "more computers" or "magnet schools" or "more arts programs." To use a sports metaphor, what's needed is "more blocking and tackling." Or, back to education, the three Rs -- Reading, wRiting and aRithmetic. Test the kids and fail the failures. Test the teachers and fire the failures. Success is dependent on hard decisions and hard work, not billions of dollars.

Re:More money? (4, Insightful)

sjames (1099) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800504)

To be perfectly honest, we would be better off digging a big hole, tossing the money in and then covering it over than spending it on war. Unlike the never ending wars including the war on [demon of the day], throwing the money down a big hole will create jobs and can be stopped at any time when we think of something more worthwhile to spend it on. It would have the side benefit of not making the rest of the world hate us as much as war and not alienating as many of our own citizens as the war on drugs does.

Given that, throwing the money at schools and seeing what sticks can hardly do worse.

Re:More money? (2, Insightful)

pluther (647209) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800560)

Good questions.
And where would answers possibly be found. Oh, gods, if only there were an article linked from that summary!
Or... and I know this is crazy talk here... but, what if the summary itself mentioned something other than billions of dollars!

Re:More money? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800620)

No, we need to privatize education. When schools are forced to seek profit and keep themselves afloat people will really value education because they will see exactly how much it costs them. Schools will finally be forced to innovate in order to differentiate themselves from mainstream education and bad teachers will finally be fireable.

All your approach has done is hamstring teachers and students with ridiculous academic requirements that most students should not need to survive life outside of school. I have never seen anyone use algebra in a work environment, yet it is still a high school requirement. Why? Why do requirements have to be so specific? Are we preparing ALL students to study in a rigorous academic environment? All I've seen come from that movement is a dumbing down of undergraduate courses so that all students can take them and not flunk. I graded coursework for 180 undergraduate students at my school and if I had been teaching the class I would have flunked 160 of them. They didnt try, they didn't even care that they were in college. The attitude from high school of doing the absolute minimum had perpetuated itself because most of them were getting a free ride paid for by you and yours.

I'm a little bitter because I'm still paying off my loans and I actually learned something from my education. So fuck your return to the fundamentals. Teach the kids that don't belong in college skills that they can sell in the real world, and track the students who do belong in college into college.

College is not for everyone. It shouldn't be for everyone. It should be for people who have the potential to advance the world by their study of something. If that sounds like elitism to anyone they are correct. But look at what is happening to our country every time you push for equality of the mind! You are killing our country by destroying the elite. They are the ones who drive us forward, and they need our moral support to continue. Things are not equal which are not equal. Elite used to have such wonderful connotations. Now it is a word spat into the faces of the bright, the wealthy, and the gifted.

Re:More money? (1)

0xdeadbeef (28836) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800682)

Elitism is private schools giving morons the same degree you earned because their parents can pay full tuition.

Re:More money? (1)

0xdeadbeef (28836) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800658)

Success is dependent on hard decisions and hard work, not billions of dollars.

No it isn't. It is dependent on accomplishing goals, and doing better than your competitors.

If you think not failing stupidly easy multiple choice tests, or not getting fired because your students are not failing stupidly easy multiple choice tests is success, well, yeah, you're part of the problem.

Too Dumb To Protest (2, Interesting)

b4upoo (166390) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800466)

Infested with the lies of corporatism and capitalism our general public is far too dumb to make intelligent demands for education. It
has reached the sad point where one supposed leader has remarked that education should be run like a business. That translates rather
  easily into giving students as little as possible while taking as much from the public as they can get.
              Limit summer holidays to three weeks in total. Stop honoring lesser holidays. Get rid of teacher work days. Make school a 8 am to
5 pm activity with half days on Saturday. Get rid of equivalency diplomas and be quick to permanently expel students who either show
little interest in academic life or have behavior problems. Let the parents pay for private schooling for the expelled.
              In essence every student should know that endless help is at hand for excellence but endless rejection and failure are also very real and immediate consequences. Make courses just hard enough so that some good students can not pass them.
              Be certain that Texas has no influence over text books. And isolate schools from parental influence or complaints. Pay teachers as if they were professionals in the same sense that doctors or lawyers or CPAs get paid.
              That will do the trick. Do less and we will serve foreign masters.

Re: Too Dumb To Protest (1)

vcgodinich (1172985) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800592)

And isolate schools from parental influence or complaints.

because parents should have no say in their child's education

Re: Too Dumb To Protest (3, Insightful)

Ironchew (1069966) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800600)

Lots of good points, but some seem unnecessarily and impractically harsh.

Stop honoring lesser holidays.

Which ones are the important holidays, and how can you justify those in an impartial manner?

...be quick to permanently expel students who either show little interest in academic life or have behavior problems.

Sounds like one-strike-you're-out to me. Suspensions and counseling should make things clear the first or second time, and you can consider expulsions afterward. Having little interest in academic life is relatively normal, otherwise everybody would be scholars. Not bothering to make a minimal effort suggests a problem.

In essence every student should know that endless help is at hand for excellence but endless rejection and failure are also very real and immediate consequences. Make courses just hard enough so that some good students can not pass them.

This is utterly impractical and it sounds a little vindictive. Set the bar so that some good students are eternally unable to pass any of their courses? Intellectual improvement is the point of going to school, and there should be help for students who have the determination to pass a course.

Be certain that Texas has no influence over text books.

Care to be a little more specific? I'm sure there are many intelligent professors in Texas that publish adequate material for the subject(s) at hand.
Though I agree with most of the other stuff. Education should be a higher priority in the United States than our military prowess.

No, it's backlash against the 60s and... (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800478)

The reason the country doesn’t have enough money for better schools or job retaining, he went on, is that it is spending hundreds of billions a year on war. This isn’t what the U.S. should stand for, he added. He also wondered where the public outrage is. Back when his father was Chicago’s mayor, he recalled, thousands of people would routinely take to the streets to protest the Vietnam War. Nowadays, he said, there are no demonstrations—people shrug off war and say if enlistees want to go off and risk their lives, well, that’s their choice.

First, a lot of it, I think, is some sort of backlash against the 60s and calling kids that had no choice to go to war "baby killers" and horseshit like that. Many of our boys coming back from Viet Nam were treated like shit for no good reason.

Secondly, it's the new patriotic sentiment. We got caught with our pants down on 9/11 and folks are pretty steamed about it still - especially the older folks who grew up with a secure and invincible America. There are also the folks who just like the fact that the US is "asserting" its power. Personally, I think power should be used sparingly and only when absolutely needed because others will:
not be afraid or respectful
and consider us to be bullies instead of beacons of freedom.

Third, there's a lot of apathy. Just what will protests do? What can you expect? There have been protests since the beginning and nothing has come of it an many protesters were harassed by folks - see #2.

Forth, there isn't the news coverage like we had in Nam. No stories with the soldier's coffins coming home. Hardly any battlefield coverage. And the economy is showing everything. So, of course there's no outrage. Folks are worried about paying their bills.

If they're smart kids... (5, Insightful)

icebrain (944107) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800484)

...then they don't need another year of high school. Off to college with them.

Simply dumping more money into education does not make it better.

Buying all this "technology" stuff is a waste of money if it's not implemented right. You don't need a computer to learn basic subjects.

Paying bad teachers more doesn't make them teach better. There are good teachers out there who deserve more for what they put into their jobs, and plenty more people who would make great teachers but won't take that big a pay cut from their current jobs in science, engineering, etc.

Similarly, elementary schools don't need two "counselors" each making $70k+. High schools don't need "career counselors" making $90k. And the school board doesn't need six figures (hell, no elected official does). Stop wasting money on administration and get some better teachers.

Hire some former drill instructors to fix discipline problems. Yes, your little deviant brat who "would never do anything bad" might get his feelings hurt a little bit, but maybe he'll finally get his shit straight and go on to be a decent member of society.

Spend some money and get some real scientists and engineers to teach. Teach hard science and math to the kids. Let's try to stop the reverence for idiocy while we can.

Re:If they're smart kids... (2, Insightful)

sco08y (615665) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800688)

Paying bad teachers more doesn't make them teach better. There are good teachers out there who deserve more for what they put into their jobs, and plenty more people who would make great teachers but won't take that big a pay cut from their current jobs in science, engineering, etc.

Similarly, elementary schools don't need two "counselors" each making $70k+. High schools don't need "career counselors" making $90k. And the school board doesn't need six figures (hell, no elected official does). Stop wasting money on administration and get some better teachers.

I'll be up front and admit that I have no idea how much teachers and administrators should be paid. However, I know that if someone wrote the same thing about IT people, we'd be pointing out that if you don't offer a decent salary, you're guaranteed to get crap people.

Hire some former drill instructors to fix discipline problems. Yes, your little deviant brat who "would never do anything bad" might get his feelings hurt a little bit, but maybe he'll finally get his shit straight and go on to be a decent member of society.

Understanding how the recruiting process works might dispel the notion that some guy screaming at people can turn "deviants" into good citizens.

First off, the Army gets to be pretty picky about who it lets in. They can screen out a lot of physical and mental disorders that few employers are allowed to screen. And felonies are right out, whereas schools pretty much have to teach kids even if they've been expelled from other schools.

Now, my experience was combat arms, so this may not be as universal in the Army as it should be. But even if only at an abstract level, we understood that the stuff we were doing could get us or our buddies killed, which becomes pretty concrete when you're dealing with heavy weapons. Further, there was a real sense of camaraderie, and the feeling that we were doing something truly worthwhile. I was older than others, but I thought that even for teenagers they were pretty damned good about paying attention, even when no one was looking over their shoulders.

Finally, our drill sergeants (drill instructor is the Marine term) had gone through everything we were going through. Just in case they hadn't, in drill sergeant school they got to be treated like brand new privates. So the younger guys especially looked up to them and tried to emulate them.

None of those three factors are in play in a school. The bottom line is that parents aren't going to listen to any erudite arguments as to why some guy is yelling at their precious baby, they're just going hire a lawyer and sue the school into submission.

Re:If they're smart kids... (3, Insightful)

russotto (537200) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800790)

I'll be up front and admit that I have no idea how much teachers and administrators should be paid. However, I know that if someone wrote the same thing about IT people, we'd be pointing out that if you don't offer a decent salary, you're guaranteed to get crap people.

That's because IT doesn't have unions assuring that performance and pay are orthogonal. Also I think GP is implying that the "counselor" positions he mentioned are entirely superfluous, not merely overpaid.

As long as the system works the way it does, throwing money at the schools won't work. As soon as more money might be available, the unions will smell it and go on strike until they get it. And everyone else with a pet project within the system will grab for a cut too. Net result: more money being spent for the same people resulting in the same results. And maybe a new library (but don't count on actual books) with some politically powerful person's name on it.

Re:If they're smart kids... (1)

sauge (930823) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800710)

Being smart and being educated are quite different. In order to be educated, one needs some smartness, but being smart does not mean one is educated.

Re:If they're smart kids... (1)

wbackner (1417725) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800824)

It must be different in different parts of the country. Areas where I have lived and worked, almost all of the additional school staff (counselors, school psychologists, and speech/language pathologists) get paid on the teachers salary schedule, which definitely isn't $70-90k+. According to NEA average teacher salary in the best paying states is around $60k.

good thing 'economy' etc.. roaring back to LIEf (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800502)

so much so, that 33 states have exhausted their ability to pay unemployment to the few of us who have yet to experience the stellar (?faiytail?)'recovery'.

like 1984 (the book). almost forgot, we're also 'winning' wars all over the globe. we hope it doesn't get much better right away, lest we forget the troubles we had a couple days ago.

never a better time to consult with/trust in your creators. just in case something goes wrong again ever.

additional 'benefits' noted (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800568)

schools closing (40 in detroit alone), who needs 'em anyway.

old people eating pet food. even though it's more expensive now, it's still good they've learned to do that.

with record profits for felonious stock brokers/'bankers', one can only imagine how well the honest folks/& the rest of us are doing.

can anyone even remember what the supposed 'hard times' were like?

Outstanding chutzpa! (4, Informative)

Bearhouse (1034238) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800522)

Not THE Richard M. Daley, from the outstanding bunch of politicos who have shaped Chicago's history for the last 50 years?
see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daley_family [wikipedia.org]
Reap what you sow, then bitch about it...what amazing hypocrisy.

No Oprah moment (2, Insightful)

SmallFurryCreature (593017) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800638)

The problem is that there isn't a problem. There are a whole lot of them, all interconnected and unrelated all at the same time. And that means there isn't a solution. Not a simple one anyway.

The problems are:

  • The elites (several, not all the same group), who live in their own world and have carefully surrounded them by like minded indivduals (unpaid yes-men) so they never hear anything that disagrees with them.
  • Voters who want to be involved but not be involved. Who don't trust everything that is told to them but don't bother to find out the truth either.
  • NIMBY.
  • Politicians getting elected on promises, not on what they deliver.
  • People keep voting for taxcuts despite taxes never ever having being cut, ever anywhere.
  • Taxes being considered the only measurement, people not asking what you get for them. Fine that someone promises to cut spending, but if this means that you now have to pay more yourself, then you lost. Oh and remember, spending cuts never result in less taxes.
  • Long term plans don't appeal to politicians facing re-election in two years. Take Obama, has to fix 8 years of bad goverment in less then a year before being judged. HOW? If a politician initiats a policy that takes years to prove successful, he will have lost and the opposition takes the credit. Why bother? Instead shout "TAXCUTS" and get elected now.
  • Media with clear agenda's ruled by an elite who never has to take responsibility.
  • Secret ballots. I know how to solve the deadlock around global climate change. The republicans get their way, but if in 10-20 years they are proven wrong, all republicans and their offspring are killed off. Now we get voters voting for whatever but without any accountability. So they vote for their own short term self intrests, then bitch when the long term bites them in the ass. AKA all the people who voted for this major for 20 years that lead to Chigaco needing a bullet detection system.
    • And the list goes on. Frankly, I think democracy is to blaim. Democracy only works if the voters take an intrest and the elected people are accountable. Neither of these two is happening in western democracies. Fix that and you will start fixing the system. good luck.

illiteracy will make us more competitive !! (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800526)

Let's eliminate schools now. We are the dumbest nation in the world. A 4 year college education in the US is the same as a HS education in most other countries. Most people just watch sports and reality shows and lucky if they have the brains the eat, shit and fuck. Wasn't for the McDonalds commercials they wouldn;t know how to eat.

Since we are becoming a 3rd world country let's act like one ! Most jobs have left the country. Why learn how to read? We will be able to compete with 3rd world countries on their level !!! Illiteracy will give us an economic advantage.

We already have this for brainiac kids... (2, Insightful)

ducomputergeek (595742) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800544)

It's called college.

money from wars? (4, Insightful)

phantomfive (622387) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800570)

Endless wars that divert hundreds of billions a year from schools and job training are also undermining America's competitiveness, Daley added

Right. I'll tell you, I've heard so many times people say, "we could easily pay for X if we weren't spending money on wars" that if all those things people have in mind got funded, the money would be spent twice over. I don't know where the money would go if we stopped fighting wars, probably to cover medical/social security expenses, but Mayor Daley is very low on the priority list for recipients of the money.

wondering where the public outrage is

Where it is? It's everywhere. Outrage is the American national pasttime. Aren't there tea parties in Chicago? I mean, doesn't he watch TV? Every news program you watch has some segment trying to make people outraged. What we need is less outrage, not more, and more rational thought. I will happy when Americans realize outrage really doesn't help (or maybe they already are, maybe mayor Daley is noticing that). Of course politicians like outrage, it makes people easier to manipulate.

Re:money from wars? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800664)

This isn't a problem that just popped up yesterday or in the last 10 years, it's very old. So yeah, less outrage, less thought and more doing,

law of unintended consequences anyone? (1)

waddgodd (34934) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800584)

Does anyone else notice here that the "elite school" is going to be a HUGE PITA? first, you'll have helicopter parents doing MORE stuff (like making their kids teachers life hell when they MARK SOMETHING WRONG on their precious snowflake's paper) to make sure their kids get to the 5th year HS, then idiots that have no business caring about the 5th year HS are going to make it a requirement, can you imagine being told by the local McD's "sorry, you only have a 4 year HS degree, the guy we hired has a 5-year".

There's Only One Problem I See (1)

LifesABeach (234436) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800586)

This Educator is correct. At Orange County California, one does have an option to take an ROP [tec.ca.us] class, but with some troubling limitations.

5th F#@!% year? (2, Insightful)

Bai jie (653604) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800594)

Why would we want to send them to school for another year when the four they already are forced into are a waste of time? Most college educated people I know will admit that they learned more their first semester of college than they did in four years of High School. How will another year of crappy education help? It'll only delay their real education. I say shorten High School to 2 years and make it into a preparatory school for either getting a trade or going to college. Take the extra money saved by not running a four year high school and funnel it into making higher education cheaper to get access to. This will have kids done with school by 16, when most of them really should start thinking about how to take care of themselves.

How about the 4 day a week plan to save costs?? (0)

Joe The Dragon (967727) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800596)

How about the 4 day a week plan to save costs??

that sounds better then cutting class and laying people off.

What does anyone expect? (1)

Vinegar Joe (998110) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800606)

Chicago is a 3rd world city with a 3rd world government and a 3rd world education system.

Re:What does anyone expect? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800722)

Fuck you, troll.

Re:What does anyone expect? (1)

night_flyer (453866) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800770)

Is that you Mayor Daley?

Re:What does anyone expect? (0)

spire3661 (1038968) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800854)

He does have somewhat of a point. Chicago is a cesspool, in fact the entire region is shit. Chicago, Detroit, Cleveland are all rotting holes.

University of Michigan - private (1)

GPLDAN (732269) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800616)

The school system in Michigan, with it's devastated tax base, has become so horrific that the University of Michigan is working towards becoming totally private, using Penn as the school to model itself against. Once it does so, in-state admissions will drop to probably below 2-3% of all students admitted. The Chinese will increase the number of students they send to Ann Arbor from 15% of all undergrads to over a quarter.

Daley looks across the lake and sees what's happening to Michigan and Ohio. Like his father before him, who saved Chicago from becoming Cleveland (where it was headed) by making it a financial and banking hub, Daley knows he's got to do something to save Chicago. DePaul and Northwestern and others see the quality of students getting worse and worse every year, and they haven't developed a pipeline of foreign students like Umich has.

The whole city suffers from a workforce that is under-educated, especially in tech. He looks up to Minnesota, where high state taxes have helped keep Minnesota public schools top notch and he starts thinking like a Democrat, or more accurately: like a sane person. Public schools either continue to wilt under a dwindling tax base, or he finds the revenue to pump up the school system. CPS are some of the worst in the nation, worse than even LA or NYC, so that's pretty abysmal. He knows he has to change course, and avoid living in a state where U of I has to consider going private by 2030. Umich will be private by 2020.

Re:University of Michigan - private (1)

Vinegar Joe (998110) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800668)

he starts thinking like a Democrat

The Democrats have run Chicago since Anton Chermak beat Chicago's last Republican mayor, Big Bill Thompson on April 7, 1931.

British television could help with this. (2, Interesting)

Shag (3737) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800642)

On British TV, there have been some Brainiac shows about science [wikipedia.org] and history [wikipedia.org] that I dare say are more engaging than any typical American curriculum.

Chicago Political Machine (3, Informative)

fwarren (579763) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800654)

I think the big thing to take away from this is that Mayor Daily IS the Chicago Political Machine. To do business as a politician you have to be in his good graces and of the same mind.

Obama is cut from the same cloth. Much of his staff grew up as part of Chicago Politics. As a rule, what is popular in Chicago does NOT play well in the rest of the country. So Obama can't say these things himself. But watch how he governs. His mindset and agenda are the same.

If you agree with that agenda then you should be very happy with his presidency. If you don't agree with his agenda, at the very least you should not be surprised by it.

Seriously? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800718)

Yes because more money would stop stuff like this [chicagoreader.com] .

Daley is a crook. Be thankful his only aspiration is Emperor of Chicago.

How about... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800742)

Teaching kids how to stay out of debt!

Two ideas that don't address the problems (3, Insightful)

kenh (9056) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800756)

The mayor 'floated' two possible 'fixes' for what ails chicago's ailing school system (wasn't our 44th president a community activist trying to improve public education in Chicago? What happened? Why is it not better?) - a fifth year of high school and a brainiac academy. Neither addresses the problems and would likely impact the average Chicago Public School student.

A fifth year of high school would have little impact, as these children managed to avoid getting a proper education in the first 13 years of public school, plus some amount of 'Head Start' programs, how in the world can anyone think adding a 14th year make a difference? It would increase the number of teachers by 1/14th and would require 25% more high school classrooms. Why not simply enforce a 'no social promotion policy' and start to cull the ranks of the teachers weeding out those that aren't effective?

A brainiac academy ony supports/aids those already succeding, draining the teaching pool of all the good teachers, and leaving those most in need of help to fend for themselves without even the benefit of a smart kid to help them with their homework/copy off of during tests.

In these tough economic times, several states are looking at eliminating the requirement for a 12th grade/senior year of public school, since kids are able to complete their required studies in before their senior year. Iowa is considering granting a bit of money as a scholarship (of sorts) of $2,500 toward their freshman year of college.

Mayor, get your teachers to do their job in the first 13 years (K-12), don't punish the kids for one more year, and pulling the brainiacs out of the general student population only helps those that have overcome the challenges your schools pose to their students, it does nothing for those left behind.

Re:Two ideas that don't address the problems (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800782)

Fuck those that are left behind.

Or the opposite. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800812)

Having come from Chicago's schools, it was my experience that the opposite seemed to work better. For high school I attended the Illinois Mathematics and Science Academy, which gave you the option of doing high school in three years--and many of the most successful kids did just that. While it was not related to CPS and had a slew of other factors (it was a boarding high school, and drew selected students), the fact that you could take someone from algebra 1 to multivariable calculus in the span of three years says that if you need 5 years to do less, you're doing something wrong.

What we need is... (2, Insightful)

elnyka (803306) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800820)

This is what we need:
  1. Better parenting and accepting responsibility for one's children teaching: my sisters when to public school and got an awesome education. But then again, we expected that from them, taking every hard elective they could get, even on summer, never taking a summer break.
  2. A public education system that resembles the German model of education, a system geared towards training kids from an early age so that they become useful and self-reliant. We have this notion of middle and high school that are just baby sitting for teens, and that the only way to *make it* is to get a university degree. Bullshit on both.
  3. Abandon the "everyone is equal". No, we are not. We have been confusing "we have a right to the same opportunities" with "we are equal". This is strongly related to the previous point: not everyone is made for university and not everyone that goes to university is guaranteed to make it.
  4. Get rid of the stigma of technical trades. We have this shitty thinking of "plumber bad, mba good". Incredibly stupid way of thinking. College professions and technical traders are to be nurtured and respected.

Instead of throwing money for a 5th year for brainiacs, fix the entire system. It makes no sense to have HS graduates who can't do fractions. Many kids in other parts of the world (even in developing countries) end their HS with a solid foundation in algebra, trig/geometry, vectors, biology, chemistry, classical physics and world history.

If we are to throw money, do it for the purpose of changing our way of thinking.

Why would anyone want a career in technology????? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#31800826)

I'm a software developer for 40 years now. As a senior developer, my only course for advancement is to become a project bookkeeper creating endless spreadsheets, powerpoint slides for preliminary & critical design reviews, requirements reviews, risk management - it's called "process". Then there's the endless screwing around trying to get MicroQuack Project to reflect what's really going on. Accounting can't get me useful information regarding hours entered into a stupid time card program so that has to be manually managed. Fully 67% of my last project's hours went, not to programming, but to managing programming. Since I avoid doing all this crap, I'm constantly told I can't be advanced plus I get constantly harrassed because I'm "overpaid".

American business is trying to turn nearly everyone into an accountant, so why the hell should anyone study technology when all the action, fame, & glory is in admin & accounting? Smart people see this & get into day trading or creative finance in the first place.

Yeah, I'm cynical...used to be companies at least claimed there was a "technology track" where one could advance without becoming a conventional "pointy haired boss". Nowadays, doesn't seem to be the case...

Problem with different high school requirements (1)

wbackner (1417725) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800840)

Here in Utah one of the state congressmen proposed having only three years of high school to save money because he felt the fourth year was wasted. This brought up the problem that most colleges have a standard set of classes that they expect high school graduates to have. Adding a year may not cause the same problems. However, before anything is done that changes what colleges expect they are getting, the people implementing changes need to make sure that they aren't screwing over their best students for college admissions.

I'd rather offer grades 13 and 14 to everyone (1)

davidwr (791652) | more than 4 years ago | (#31800862)

These days schools with more than a few dozen brainy kids offer enough advanced-placement classes so kids have 1 or 2 semesters of college behind them before they start.

What we need is taxpayer-paid K-14 for anyone who wants it, especially those of limited income. Grades 10 and above don't even need to be academic, they can be vocational or pre-military training. Every tax dollar spent on educating young adults will pay itself back several times over in the long run, even after taking inflation into account.

Most cities already have community colleges in place, and many of these offer high-school-level classes to adult students. Piggyback on this. You don't really want a 14-year-old high school freshmen on the same campus as a 20-year-old college student or trade-school-student, but at the same time an 17-year-old taking college-sophomore-level classes should be allowed to choose if he wants to be in the high school social group or the college social group. Now, a brainiac 14-year-old taking college freshmen classes? He probably belongs at a Tier-1 university, not a community college. Let him take a couple of non-academic or college-level classes at a local high school if he wants to get a swirley, er, I mean socialize with other teens his age.

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