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Microsoft Unveils Smaller Xbox 360 Model, Kinect Details

Soulskill posted more than 4 years ago | from the might-as-well-call-it-a-slim dept.

XBox (Games) 277

E3 kicked off today, and Microsoft took advantage of its early keynote presentation to show off a ton of new games and features for the Xbox 360. The biggest news for the very near future is that they're releasing a smaller, revamped version of the console, with immediate availability. It's black, it comes with a 250GB HDD and built-in 802.11n Wi-Fi support, and it's priced at $299. Microsoft also put a release date on Kinect, the motion control scheme formerly known as Project Natal: November 4 in the US. It will launch with 15 games, mostly casual-oriented, several of which were demonstrated on-stage. Many new Kinect features were shown as well, such as the dashboard interface, video chat (with support for playing movies both parties can watch), and a partnership with ESPN to provide live and on-demand sports, all controllable with hand gestures and voice commands. (It presently includes college football and basketball, soccer, the NBA, and MLB.) Also notable is a partnership with LucasArts for a Kinect Star Wars game, a fitness game from Ubisoft, and a Forza racing game that uses Kinect and allows players to inspect the cars with an impressive level of detail. Engadget's liveblog of the event has a bunch of pictures from the demonstrations, or you can read a more detailed play-by-play at Ars.

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Ok but... (1)

i_ate_god (899684) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570074)

Where is Valve's big surprise?

Re:Ok but... (1)

Coder4Life (1396697) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570104)

Where is Valve's big surprise?

THE CAKE IS NOT A LIE!!! Maybe they'll unveil portal 2

Re:Ok but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570406)

Where is Valve's big surprise?

Didn't Valve say that they were going to unveil it at their own press event? So why are you surprised that they didn't unveil it at Microsoft's press event?

Re:Ok but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570444)

Where is Valve's big surprise?

Didn't Valve say that they were going to unveil it at their own press event? So why are you surprised that they didn't unveil it at Microsoft's press event?

Perhaps you missed the point. The OP was clearly dismissing this news as irrelevant and trivial.

ESPN (5, Insightful)

tweek (18111) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570100)

Kinect is exciting and I'll get it but the biggest announcement had to be the ESPN agreement. That's a cable killer right there depending on how blackout/regional rules apply.

Re:ESPN (2, Informative)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570158)

the biggest announcement had to be the ESPN agreement.

It doesn't include NHL support (at least, they didn't mention it during the keynote.) It's useless -_-;;

Re:ESPN (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570600)

What is this NHL you speak of?

Is it better use of ice than curling?

Re:ESPN (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570780)

What? You're no Canadian! A true Canadian could BOTH put a stone in the house AND cross-check anyone who gets in its way!

Re:ESPN (1, Informative)

jittles (1613415) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570802)

That's because those jackass*s at ESPN don't cover hockey. It's a sad world. :(

Kinect Is Exciting? LOL, You Have To Be Joking. (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570236)

This fiasco of an overpriced add-on is getting laughed at across the gaming world right now.

Re:Kinect Is Exciting? LOL, You Have To Be Joking. (1)

tweek (18111) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570536)

Actually I think it will be awesome for my 2 year old.

So yeah, it's pretty exciting.

Re:ESPN (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570394)

It only works if your provider has ESPN3 anyway. No killer there.

Re:ESPN (1)

tweek (18111) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570514)

Okay that blows because I don't HAVE a cable provider. I'm not even sure who services my neighborhood.

Re:ESPN (2, Informative)

Killer Orca (1373645) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570412)

Kinect is exciting and I'll get it but the biggest announcement had to be the ESPN agreement. That's a cable killer right there depending on how blackout/regional rules apply.

I got bad news for you, it appears that the service is still dependent on ESPN having an agreement with your current ISP in place too. Not an ESPN friendly ISP account holder and no others available? Too bad for you.

Re:ESPN (1)

cgenman (325138) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570576)

Can you post a link to where it says that in detail? Having data dependent upon the ISP for a feature on a console seems like a very convoluted chain, likely to enrage a lot of people (and ISP's).

Re:ESPN (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570652)

Nah, it makes the ISPs (at least Comcast) happy. ESPN provides CDN boxes and keeps all the traffic internal, ISP gets to promote their TV/internet service as coming with exclusive ESPN content.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESPN3

It's actually pretty cool if you happen to get it, Comcast's gating isn't very strict and you get it even with only cable internet/FTA-over-cable TV services, so if the only thing you'd watch on cable is sports you can drop cable TV completely and just use computer TV out.

Re:ESPN (1)

NeutronCowboy (896098) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570772)

I haven't seen a link that supports that, but it jibes with the way that ESPN has been offering events on the internet: only through approved ISPs. For example, to watch the World Cup live on ESPN.com, you need to enter the account information for an ISP with which ESPN has a deal. If you have the big ones (ATT, Comcast, etc), you're golden. If not, say goodbye to watching the World Cup on ESPN.com. The same deal was in place for the Vancouver Winter Olympics.

Honestly, I hope that this practice dies a sudden death. I don't care about the Internet turning into a glorified TV, complete with channels and viewing schedules.

nice...mostly (1)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570106)

It's awesome that they will have Wireless N built in, and I like the fact that the cooling has been changed around...but apparently the current external hard drives won't be compatible with it, and neither will memory cards.

How are we to transfer saved games and content? USB key and redownload arcade titles?

Re:nice...mostly (1)

negRo_slim (636783) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570522)

Re:nice...mostly (1)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570570)

That's all fine and well, except the new revision won't be compatible with external hard drives. Sooo...yeah.

Re:nice...mostly (3, Informative)

kjart (941720) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570710)

That's all fine and well, except the new revision won't be compatible with external hard drives. Sooo...yeah.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure you can just transfer your profile, saved games, arcade games to a regular old USB flash drive and then transfer all that stuff to a new console.

Re:nice...mostly (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570722)

That plugs your old external HDD into a USB port. It would make sense that it would work.

Re:nice...mostly (1)

ProppaT (557551) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570748)

I believe the way the transfer kit works is that you take the old hard drive and connect it to the dongle, plug the new hard drive into the console, then connect the usb cable coming from the dongle to the Xbox. There shouldn't be any concerns about this.

And the new Xbox will support external hard drives/usb drives exactly like the current one does. If you meant it won't support the old style xbox "external" hard drive, you're correct...but that's not an issue due to the transfer cable and/or external memory stick/hdd options.

Re:nice...mostly (0, Troll)

mrops (927562) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570586)

This is MS shooting itself in the foot. I see a new connector on the images, I bet that's for Kinect.

In essence they are saying buy this new console if you want to use Kinect.

I got hooked on to Halo when I was unmarried and had no kids, now I play it exclusively, never got hooked on to COD. Not because I don't like it but instead I can't spare the time to learn a new title, particularly to compete with teenagers who can play all night long. Halo entertains, Halo I learned, Halo I play.

I would have bought kinetic for its geek value, and then a few games for it, unlikely I will buy if I need to get a new console. I mean, I have about two dozen games that I bought and regret buying because most suck. I never play them, those were $50 bucks a pop. I can't see spending 300 bucks for this gimmick. And gimmick it does look like.

Maybe I am not MS's target audience, maybe I'm too old to keep up with all night gamers.

Re:nice...mostly (3, Informative)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570656)

You've got it all wrong. Kinect will be compatible with every version of the 360. The difference is, if you don't have a slim version, you need to hook it up via USB for the data and then a seperate power connector to plug into the wall. The "Kinect Socket" on the new revision would provide data and power, negating the need to plug the hardware into the wall.

That being said, I personally don't see myself spending the money on it.

Re:nice...mostly (1)

Tridus (79566) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570920)

In the last 360 software update, they added USB thumb drive support. You can copy games/saves/profiles over to that, and copy them to the new console. (You can also copy it between 360s right now doing that, I did it a few days ago when visiting a friend.)

Let's not turn the Xbox360... (1)

Voulnet (1630793) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570144)

Let's not turn the Xbox360 into the next Wii.... Hopefully developers don't feel a pressure of hype that forces them to try and squeeze motion control into games just to have that 'compatible with Kintec' label.

Re:Let's not turn the Xbox360... (1)

IshmaelDS (981095) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570272)

I don't think that will happen as the 360 is a more mature gaming system and alot existing franchise's will not change just to have that label. At least I hope so. I could see some cool things with it though, a revival of boardgames on the 360 would be great. I would love to play something like axis and allies (the boardgame not the computer games) on the screen with a buddy, I think that would be very cool.

Microsoft Is Giving Up On The Core Console Market (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570438)

"Let's not turn the Xbox360 into the next Wii"

Are you serious? That is all Microsoft has been doing for the past two years. Over the past couple of years Microsoft has been:

1. Shutting down their first party studios

2. Making it clear to everyone that there is no new next gen Xbox coming out

3. Refocused their tiny 3 studio first party developers on casual Wii like titles

Microsoft is no longer willing to waste billions on the console market. They have gotten destroyed by Sony and Nintendo in Japan and Europe just like last gen. Their only 'bright spot' this gen is selling millions of duplicate replacement consoles to mostly US Xbox owners to help inflate their installed base a little compared to last gen. Graphically the Xbox 360 has been humiliated by the PS3 this gen due to its wimpy and gimped graphics hardware and smaller than DVD storage format. And there is nothing Microsoft can do to compete with Sony's massive 20+ first party development studios.

It is cheaper for Microsoft to lose to Nintendo than it is to Sony.

At the very least this laughably bad Microsoft jump onto the motion control bandwagon will ensure the hardcore Xbox owners keep wasting 50 bucks a year for the 'privilege' of playing games online.

Re:Microsoft Is Giving Up On The Core Console Mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570592)

They have gotten destroyed by Sony and Nintendo in Japan and Europe just like last gen.

Except that in pretty much every European country the stats show the 360 always selling more than the PS3 and having higher attach rates.

Graphically the Xbox 360 has been humiliated by the PS3 this gen due to its wimpy and gimped graphics hardware and smaller than DVD storage format.

So then how do you explain all the examples one can find in a 2 second search that show this to be wrong in many cases?

Re:Microsoft Is Giving Up On The Core Console Mark (1)

Gizzmonic (412910) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570790)

I agree with everything you said except for the part about the PS3 having better graphics. The PS3 *should* have better graphics but most titles available for both consoles look better on 360.

No Wonder The Top Xbox Guys Just Got Fired (0, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570194)

This is just embarrassing to watch. The Kinetic stuff looks is not only looks as un-fun as any gaming thing possibly could be, it is also getting torn apart by people closely watching the demos and seeing the horrendous lag and inaccuracy.

And five years after the Red Ring of Death plagued Xbox 360 launched they are releasing a 300 dollar smaller unit.

Let me guess Microsoft, you claim this one has finally fixed the worst console hardware design in history and in a smaller form factor. Yeah, right...

Re:No Wonder The Top Xbox Guys Just Got Fired (1, Informative)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570314)

The Falcon's ran quite stable, and the Jasper units are nearly 100% stable. My own Jasper runs perfectly fine, despite the fact that it is kept in an enclosed space (inside my tv stand with glass doors, next to my PS3 Slim...sometimes with both on at the same time.) The red ring problems were a very huge issue for a long time, but with the Falcon revision they were vastly reduced, and with the Jasper release they are pretty much entirely fixed. This smaller unit is only going to increase the stability even more.

I smell a shill.

Shocking news! Xbot claims 'teh RRoD is fixed' (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570556)

What a bunch of fucking losers! How long have you dipshits been sitting around in forums making that same stupid fucking claim?

Let's just recap what you idiots have claimed over the years:

* Those RRoD 360s are pre-production models dying in stores! The real ones won't have hardware problems!

* Those RRoD 360s dying in stores are just because of stupid employees not hooking them up properly!

* Those RRoD 360s are just the first batch! The 'real' 360s won't have that problem!

* Those RRoD 360s are first gen units! The new motherboard fixes that problem!

No wonder the gaming worlds hates you retards.

Re:Shocking news! Xbot claims 'teh RRoD is fixed' (1)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570624)

What a bunch of fucking losers! How long have you dipshits been sitting around in forums making that same stupid fucking claim?

Well, I can't speak for anyone else, but I've been making that "same stupid fucking claim" since the falcons came out, and then the jaspers. No denying previous revisions had serious problems, though.

Let's just recap what you idiots have claimed over the years:

Slow your roll, shill. You don't know me, and I don't think you've been paid to insult people you don't know. Stick to your talking points.

No wonder the gaming worlds hates you retards.

Which worlds might those be?

Xbot Spammer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570750)

Microsoft spammer trying to call out others! Precious!

You're like the idiot who farts in a car and then tries to cover it up by yelling "Who farted!?"

At least the spammers Microsoft hired to troll boards like neogaf were more subtle before they were exposed. Thank your faggot ass you're far away in some shithole town or you'd get the shit beaten out of you.

Re:No Wonder The Top Xbox Guys Just Got Fired (1)

Jeng (926980) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570666)

I smell a shill.

Not all of us are up on the production cycles regarding the different versions of the Xbox 360 as such it is not an unusual question to ask about it's reliability.

I would suspect you of being a shill vs the parent considering your extremely informed post.

Re:No Wonder The Top Xbox Guys Just Got Fired (1)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570744)

I would suspect you of being a shill vs the parent considering your extremely informed post.

That's right, I'm a paid shill posting under my real account, which I use nearly every day on here. ::eyeroll::

Re:No Wonder The Top Xbox Guys Just Got Fired (0, Troll)

Jeng (926980) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570922)

That's right, I'm a paid shill posting under my real account, which I use nearly every day on here. That's right, I'm a paid shill posting under my real account, which I use nearly every day on here.

Why not? It would make you a better shill. And yet you accuse some AC's with pitiful arguments of being shills.

A shill is a person who is paid to help another person or organization to sell goods or services. The shill pretends to have no association with the seller/group and gives onlookers the impression that he or she is an enthusiastic customer. The person or group that hires the shill is using crowd psychology, to encourage other onlookers or audience members (who are unaware of the set-up) to purchase said goods or services. Shills are often employed by confidence artists. The term plant is also used. The term is also used to describe a person who is paid to help a political party or other advocacy organization to gain adherents; as with the situation of selling goods or services, the shill gives the impression of being unrelated to the group in question, and gives the impression that he or she finds merit in the ideological claims of the political party.

Microsoft Astroturfer??? Shocking! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570878)

"I would suspect you of being a shill"

During the outbreak of the RRoD fiasco Microsoft was paying marketing companies to have guys like Pojut sit around in gaming forums making constant claims about how the RRoD wasn't that bad and the new models fixed the problems and on and on. One of the guys Microsoft was paying to do this finally admitted to it after he stopped working for the marketing/PR company responsible for the damage control spammers.

Standard operating procedures for Microsoft.

This is the same company that resorted to sending out 900 dollar 'gift bag'/bribes to 'game reviewers' to ensure they got their silly little guy in shiny dayglow green armor decent reviews.

 

Re:No Wonder The Top Xbox Guys Just Got Fired (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570584)

The Kinetic stuff looks is not only looks as un-fun as any gaming thing possibly could be, it is also getting torn apart by people closely watching the demos and seeing the horrendous lag and inaccuracy.

What does this mean? Translator please.

"Custom kinect port" (2, Interesting)

Bert64 (520050) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570248)

Custom kinect port = it uses some proprietary connector so you won't be able to use it with anything else, will it even be possible to connect it to an original 360?

Re:"Custom kinect port" (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570364)

Damn, wikipedia is fast

Kinect [wikipedia.org]

Connectivity USB 2.0 (type-A)

I'm sure it will attach via usb

Re:"Custom kinect port" (0, Troll)

kidgenius (704962) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570424)

I was wondering the same thing. Details are noticeably absent. Though, most peoples 360s will RROD, requiring them to buy a new one anyways, so the new one they will inevitably have to pick up will have the port on it. Also, people talk about how awesome it will be to play racing games without a wheel. Sure, I guess. Just do this. Go ahead and stick your arms out in front of you and hold them there like you are holding a wheel. Now how long do you honestly think you can go before your arms get tired? At least a wheel gives your arms something to rest on...

Re:"Custom kinect port" (1)

nateand (1487549) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570440)

They've said kinect will be 100% compatible with every Xbox 360 on the market.

Re:"Custom kinect port" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570472)

It has been reported that the new connector supplies the required power for Kinect, as USB does not provide enough. It has also been reported that you can connect it on original 360s via USB but then you will need to plug a second cable to the wall for power.

Re:"Custom kinect port" (0, Flamebait)

gravos (912628) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570488)

Yep, pretty much. But sony is still king of the "custom connector," "custom memory stick," custom every damn thing.

And can anyone guess why the slim 360 is more expensive when they're releasing an expensive add-on like Kinect?

Re:"Custom kinect port" (5, Informative)

kidgenius (704962) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570544)

Yep, pretty much. But sony is still king of the "custom connector,"

Really?? PS3 uses standard USB cables for its controllers. It uses a standard harddrive inside you can easily upgrade. It uses standard bluetooth to connect any headset you want? Custom connector? More MS than Sony from a console standpoint

Re:"Custom kinect port" (1, Interesting)

MBCook (132727) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570672)

PS3 uses standard USB cables for its controllers

Yes, but due to a touch of brilliance, the controllers won't charge if the console isn't on.

Re:"Custom kinect port" (2, Insightful)

ilguido (1704434) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570724)

??? you can charge your MP3 player when your computer is off?

Re:"Custom kinect port" (1)

MBCook (132727) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570818)

Right, that's why they come with wall chargers. Sony thinks you should buy those separately, or leave your console one when you're not using it but your controllers need to charge.

Considering the thing uses soft-power like everything else, they could have easily identified the controllers and allowed them to charge when the thing was off, but they didn't.

It's just a stupid little decision they made. One of those things that seems to serve no benefit, but is a little paper-cut on the experience.

yes (1)

iPhr0stByt3 (1278060) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570892)

I charge my smartphone all the time when my PC is OFF (completely, not just stand-by or sleep). It's a BIOS feature maybe? If you use a powered USB hub, it would proably also work?

Re:"Custom kinect port" (1)

VGPowerlord (621254) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570686)

It uses a standard harddrive inside you can easily upgrade.

Standard 2.5" (or Notebook) HDD that is.

Just thought I'd clarify that.

But yeah, even the PS3 "charging cable" is just a USB 2.0 A to mini-B connector as I recall.

Re:"Custom kinect port" (1)

Lunix Nutcase (1092239) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570626)

Except he's pretty much wrong. It's going to use a USB 2.0 type A connector.

Fanboy Owns Himself (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570650)

How the fuck can someone like you be that stupid?

PS3
Standard USB keyboards and mice
Standard Bluetooth devices
Standard off the shelf laptop drive upgrades and replacements

From now on shut the fuck up.

 

Re:"Custom kinect port" (1)

Monkeedude1212 (1560403) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570510)

They said it will be. Which means its probably USB (There is one on the back of the 360) but it has a component to detect if its an X-box or not.

It will be hacked to work with a PC within a week, don't worry.

Re:"Custom kinect port" (1)

Lunix Nutcase (1092239) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570678)

It will be hacked to work with a PC within a week, don't worry.

What would be the point if no PC games are made to use it?

Re:"Custom kinect port" (3, Informative)

zaffir (546764) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570520)

Yes. It'll connect to any 360. However, the custom port on the new XBox will also provide power to the Kinect, so that you don't have to have a separate power adapter for it.

Re:"Custom kinect port" (3, Insightful)

Tordre (1447083) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570540)

The game trailer post show had that grey shirt guy on and stated the extra port is just for power, you can use it with an old xbox but you will need to plug it in to the wall separately.

Re:"Custom kinect port" (1)

Psykechan (255694) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570866)

I'm guessing that it's a combination data and enhanced power connector that will be used for a single connection on the new units.

The Kinect camera bar will probably need two cables for operating on older 360 units; a USB connection to the console and an external power adapter. I'm guessing that the external power adapter will be shipping with kits but bundled systems will not include it.

I am happy to see more USB ports on the console especially since they are now being used for external memory.

Wireless + XBL = More Lag? (1)

decipher_saint (72686) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570256)

I'm not a big XBL player but one thing I notice is how laggy a lot of gamers already are given a wired connection.

Will Wireless N make this better, worse or the same? Is this a big selling point for people?

Re:Wireless + XBL = More Lag? (1)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570372)

If you are lagging out when using a wired connection, that's a problem with your internet connection/router. I'm currently running my 360 through a modified WRT54G that has the DD-WRT firmware on it running as a bridge, and I still get hardly any lag on Live.

Wireless N will make a huge difference for those of us on wireless connections. Folks using wired connections wouldn't notice much difference. If you are still getting lag and are wired using Ethernet, make sure your router is set up properly (ports, etc.)

Re:Wireless + XBL = More Lag? (1)

decipher_saint (72686) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570512)

My connection is fine, about every fourth challenger I match with in Super Street Fighter IV appears to be connecting to XBL via tin can and string.

Sure, I can filter connection quality on most XBL titles but will Wireless N create even more high-ping laggers? If so, what's the attraction? One less cable in the jungle behind the TV?

Re:Wireless + XBL = More Lag? (1)

negRo_slim (636783) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570548)

It's also dependent on the games method of networking, P2P style is all the rage as it cuts down on the amount of dedicated servers required but performance penalties tend to apply.

Re:Wireless + XBL = More Lag? (1)

cgenman (325138) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570658)

Lag can also come from other people's networks. People connecting over Microsoft's wireless G dongle are notorious for lagging out everyone's online experiences.

Even N, though, adds a minimum extra 10ms of lag. It has great throughput and cleaner signals, but too much wireless noise and running toasters / etc can still kill your transfer. For serious gaming, unless your airspace is relatively clean, wired is still the way to go. With the way wireless networks for home are currently setup, they will always bee a speed penalty on top of wired networks.

Re:Wireless + XBL = More Lag? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570864)

"Wireless N will make a huge difference for those of us on wireless connections."

Maybe a difference on signal strength (weak signal can affect speed). But on a good connection, you won't see a speed increase over the internet unless your ISP is giving you one big, fat up/down pipe.

Re:Wireless + XBL = More Lag? (1)

Monkeedude1212 (1560403) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570564)

It'll be the same.

Wireless runs at about 54 Megs, if I recall correctly. N might be more (I think 300?).

Either way, your ISP is not giving you those speeds, unless you are paying for a commercial business line.

Essentially you are only as fast as the slowest part in the chain, which is in 99% of cases, your Internet service provider.

Re:Wireless + XBL = More Lag? (1)

Lunix Nutcase (1092239) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570648)

I'm not a big XBL player but one thing I notice is how laggy a lot of gamers already are given a wired connection.

Really? Outside of the first few days after a new game was released (like with Red Dead Revolver), I can't even count on 1 hand the times I've lagged or had others lag out of a game.

Re:Wireless + XBL = More Lag? (1)

kevinNCSU (1531307) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570874)

I used my xbox both wired, and wireless with the router 2 stories above the Xbox (in the basement of course! =P ). The only difference I noticed between the two has been dropped connections. Sometimes Wireless just likes to drop machines which is aggravating. But as far as lag while playing CoD 4 and MW2 I didn't notice a whole lot of difference. There might have been a slight decrease in me getting shot when I thought I was already around a corner, but that might have just been me slowly getting better too. No dramatic differences for sure.

The router was dual band both G and N, but I'm not sure the wireless adapter I had for the xbox handled N, my guess would be it did not.

Microsoft + Cameras + Internet (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570302)

Re:Microsoft + Cameras + Internet (1)

Eponymous Coward (6097) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570408)

Wanna see something you can't unsee? Play Uno on your XBox online.

Re:Microsoft + Cameras + Internet (1)

Pulse_Instance (698417) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570632)

Microsoft already has control over a large majority of the cameras on the internet. They could probably get the laptop webcam to turn on without the light beside it turning on and we have yet to hear about them trying anything there.

They should've doubled the RAM, too (1)

BcNexus (826974) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570368)

Who couldn't use more RAM?

Re:They should've doubled the RAM, too (2, Funny)

Midnight's Shadow (1517137) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570442)

Who couldn't use more RAM?

And switch out the dvd for a blueray player.

Re:They should've doubled the RAM, too (1)

Hatta (162192) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570706)

512M should be enough for anybody.

Re:They should've doubled the RAM, too (1)

cgenman (325138) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570730)

Consoles are fixed platforms. You can't upgrade the internals of a console that way, because games expect that fixed platform. Doubling RAM would simply mean that game developers would have to decide between playing on all consoles (with less RAM), or just playing on the new ones (with more RAM). It's not like a computer internally, that is abstracted enough to deal with upgraded components dynamically.

This is why consoles upgrade with more reliable, quieter, and cheaper hardware. But they almost never get upgraded from performance or specification standpoints.

None of which really matters on the Xbox anyway, as the disks can only take 8 GB max, 4 GB practical. You're maxing out that poor spinning DVD before you max out RAM.

Re:They should've doubled the RAM, too (1)

VGPowerlord (621254) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570740)

Yup, because developers don't develop on consoles because the specs are fixed.

Oh wait, yes they do!

CPU and GPU integrated... (1)

gabereiser (1662967) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570414)

I'm very curious as to what CPU/GPU config this thing has. The original xbox360, while being quite dated now by chip standards, still has amazing graphics due to it's gpu capabilities. I wanna know what's under the hood. More cores? Radeon HD? Gimme specs!!!

Re:CPU and GPU integrated... (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570700)

I'm very curious as to what CPU/GPU config this thing has. The original xbox360, while being quite dated now by chip standards, still has amazing graphics due to it's gpu capabilities. I wanna know what's under the hood. More cores? Radeon HD? Gimme specs!!!

I can tell that you don't understand hardware very well (which just makes the fact that you're asking for hardware specs that much funnier). With any console revamp like this, the specs are the exact same, just done with a reduced die for lower power consumption and less heat dissipation. There might be other tweaks to the board design (possibly slightly different controller chips, etc), but as far as speed and polygon count, etc, they're essentially the same. That's the entire point of having "locked in" hardware designs for things like consoles.

Reliable? (1)

Hatta (162192) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570418)

What assurances can we have that this new slim 360 isn't going to be subject to the same quality problems the original 360 had? If I buy now, can I reasonably expect my 360 to be functioning in 5 years? 10?

Re:Reliable? (3, Informative)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570486)

The primary cause of the old RRoD problem was excessive heat. The Falcon revision released a few years ago made great strides in reducing red rings, and the Jasper revision that came out about a year ago all but eliminated the red ring issue.

Considering this new version has better cooling and is based on 45 nm production, it will generate even less heat than the Jaspers. The chances of it having the same problems are practically nonexistent.

Re:Reliable? (1)

Hatta (162192) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570612)

the Jasper revision that came out about a year ago all but eliminated the red ring issue.

I'm not sure I believe that. I've certainly heard a few of complaints about RROD on Jasper consoles. Of course, the people with problems are going to be the loudest, so it's hard to say. If they're still using lead free solder, I'm still skeptical that these things are going to be useful more than a couple years out.

Re:Reliable? (2, Informative)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570708)

Speaking from personal experience, my Jasper revision 360 sits in an enclosed space next to my PS3 Slim (inside my entertainment center, behind a glass door that stays closed unless we're changing discs.) I haven't had a single problem with it, and it gets at least 2-4 hours of use a day, either through gaming or Netflix. I've had my Jasper for a little under 9 months at this point, sitting in that enclosed space. ::shrug::

Re:Reliable? (3, Insightful)

BitZtream (692029) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570736)

Do you consider sounding like a small jet turbine to be a problem?

I do.

I'm wondering if that problem has gone away yet.

Re:Reliable? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570792)

Did you even read the post you replied to?

Less heat = less fan noise

Does it include Blu-Ray yet (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570464)

or actually offer ANYTHING aside from Wifi?

let's face the facts, 5 years on, they never managed to fix the Xbox overheating problems, a smaller case is not going to help matters.... It's not even a slot load.

FAIL (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570478)

STILL NO BLUE RAY!?!?! maybe we can plug the oil well with this piece of junk.... I get it BP oil and water can coexist

/facepalm (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570528)

"250GB of storage on a removable hard drive, although it's not a standard drive or same drive as the old console250GB of storage on a removable hard drive, although it's not a standard drive or same drive as the old console"

I'll keep waiting, thanks.

No blu-ray (1, Interesting)

kimvette (919543) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570610)

No blu-ray, no new features, smaller, and positioned as a must-buy?

Gee, where have I seen this before? [wikipedia.org] I know I have seen similar restylings [old-computers.com] that offered no real improvement.

Where is Blu-ray? I know, Ballmer, offering blu-ray would be admitting you were wrong, but getting Windows 7 out so quickly after the monstrosity known as "Vista" is a pretty loud admission that you do fuck up now and then. You're only compounding it by not embracing blu-ray while the rest of the world already has.

I'll admit, I do want an XBox 360, and while it's nice the power supply, wifi, and HDD are all now internal, what I am waiting on is blu-ray. I want it more as a media extender/STB more than anything else, primarily for Hulu and Netflix, and possibly for Rockband 3 once the "real" keyboard comes out.

Re:No blu-ray (2, Informative)

kevinNCSU (1531307) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570734)

Call me crazy but I'd say built in wireless N, smaller form, and quieter (claimed) cooling/running are new features especially when it's being sold at the same price even though you don't have to buy some wireless adapter for ~$60 (for MS's version?).

I also don't think it's positioned as a must buy for current owners so much as, if you're going to buy a new 360 to get into console gaming or replace and old one you'll want to get this one.

Re:No blu-ray (1)

e2d2 (115622) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570760)

I think that comes down to price point. I'm of the belief that they cannot out a BR drive in and still make any money, which is slim as it is. Sony can use their own manufacturing line and produce Blu-Ray drives themselves. That's my theory anyway.

Honestly if the 360 had a Blu-Ray drive I doubt I'd have considered the PS3. I ended up with both machines but I could slim down to one easily given not many titles are platform-exclusive anymore.

Re:No blu-ray (1)

VGPowerlord (621254) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570812)

You want a console with a Blu-Ray drive, built-in WiFi, and 250GB drive from a large company that has shady business products?

Here you go [amazon.com] !

Re:No blu-ray (1)

VGPowerlord (621254) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570828)

Oh blah, stupid AJAX in-line updating crap. I meant to link to this one [amazon.com] .

Re:No blu-ray (1)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570840)

Stand alone blu-ray players can be had for 100 bucks, no need to use an Xbox for that anymore.. Not to mention i hope blu-ray is shortlived and download/streaming media continues to improve a-la netflix so on and so forth. XBL with zune mp 1080p with 5.1 is amazingly good and can only get better.

Re:No blu-ray (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570894)

That's like complaining the new Nintendo DSi lacks UMD support.

The only thing keeping Blu-Ray alive is extended life-support from Sony.

Re:No blu-ray (2, Insightful)

MBCook (132727) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570906)

Does Blu-Ray matter at this point?

I don't like using my consoles for other things. I used my PS2 as a DVD player for years, but it wasn't as nice as a real DVD player, interface wise. I've used my PS3 once or twice as a Blu-Ray player, but the interface isn't as nice as a stand alone device.

The big reason the PS3 having Blu-Ray was so great was because the console cost $500 or $600, and a Blu-Ray player cost $400 to $700. It was like buying the Blu-Ray player and getting a console for free. The PS3 also supposed updated profiles that older hardware wouldn't.

But at this point, there will be $100 players this Thanksgiving. It's not a bad feature, but I'm not sure it would really move any additional XBox 360s.

It would increases the fees to make the thing thanks to licensing though. And like additional RAM, games couldn't take advantage of it without writing off all of the millions of units already sold, so the storage wouldn't be useful for games.

A separate little box (like they did with the HD-DVD player) would work much better, in my opinion.

Two weeks after Kinect release... (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 4 years ago | (#32570756)

Rob Jones, AP Wire. A new health crisis is sweeping the nation as gamers struggle with pulled groins due to the new Microsoft Kinect video camera game controller. "You know, it's really hard to teabag people over and over in real life," said Gary Wachinstein, 22. "I used to do it to all my victims in games, but now my doctor says not to do it more than once a week, or I may never be able to humiliate anyone physically again.". Microsoft has, so far, refused to comment, but sales of Thighmasters are reported to have increased over 7500%.

Other uses, games are just games... (1)

yoma666 (1083023) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570824)

Does anyone know if you'll be able to *somehow* connect this to a PC / get access as a normal hobby developer to the SDK's? I can think of a ton of great uses for this controller beyond games... Domotics stuff, adapted programs control, blabla... I would personally love to be able to clap my hands, say the name of song/artist/album and get it to play. And when i want the next song just wave to the camera :-)

Anyone else watch the stream? (0, Troll)

Spatial (1235392) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570842)

The Kinect demonstration was the worst presentation I've seen in years. A bunch of insincere, over-rehearsed routines performed with the most poorly feigned enthusiasm a human being can muster. Direct line to the cringe button in my brain.

Unfortunately they didn't demonstrate the tech very well either - just a bunch of minigames and emulations of things we've all seen before. Some of them were really awful. It has potential but I don't think we say it implemented today.

The actual tech was interesting. They've certainly got the full-body tracking down well. That said, it appears to have substantial latency; I'd estimate >750ms from the video. Maybe it varies depending on the level of tracking being done? They were playing racing games on it, and that just wouldn't cut it for those.

I didn't hear mention of the price. I seem to remember that all the processing was supposed to be done on the 360's CPU, so it shouldn't be that much. Anybody know?

Halo + Kinect = Hilarity (1)

SenorPez (840621) | more than 4 years ago | (#32570934)

I can't wait until a team member "lags out" of Halo. And by "lags out," I mean, "Is having a heart attack because his 350 lb. Cheetoh-laden body couldn't bunny hop across his living room anymore."
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