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Ubuntu Won't Moan To EU About Microsoft

timothy posted about 4 years ago | from the kudos-to-them dept.

Government 248

Barence writes "The company behind the Ubuntu Linux distro says it has no plans to follow Opera's lead and file a complaint against Microsoft to the EU. Ubuntu 10.10 is the most 'consumer-friendly' version of the Linux distro to date, but it faces an uphill battle against Microsoft's marketing machine. Even high-profile supporter Dell has dropped Ubuntu machines from its website in recent months, while continuing to remind visitors that 'Dell recommends Windows 7' at the top of every PC page. 'I don't think we've ever considered [an EU complaint],' said Steve George, vice president of business development at Canonical. 'The improvements we're making to Ubunutu ... are a better route for us to reach out to users and get a bigger user base.'"

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Aha! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829346)

I knew it! It's trap!

10.4 (1)

PsyciatricHelp (951182) | about 4 years ago | (#33829358)

I mean 10.10

Word of Mouth (1)

BuckaBooBob (635108) | about 4 years ago | (#33829362)

It might be slow but it works.

Re:Word of Mouth (2, Funny)

mwvdlee (775178) | about 4 years ago | (#33829444)

As soon as the revolution comes, we all know what to do with the MicroSoft marketing department.

What to do with the MicroSoft marketing department (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829492)

As soon as the revolution comes, we all know what to do with the MicroSoft marketing department.

Sell them, I presume?

Cheers,

Re:Word of Mouth (3, Funny)

DIplomatic (1759914) | about 4 years ago | (#33829790)

A$ $oon a$ the revolution come$, we all know what to do with the Micro$oft marketing department.

You must be new here, so I fixed that for you.

Re:Word of Mouth (2, Funny)

commodore64_love (1445365) | about 4 years ago | (#33829800)

Bribe them to promote Ubuntu (and linux in general)? No sense throwing away skilled laborers.

They bribe PC makers. No skill required. (4, Informative)

xzvf (924443) | about 4 years ago | (#33829912)

Dell, HP and Lenovo don't put up " recommends Windows 7" on each page because they actually do recommend Windows 7. They do it because Microsoft pays them money to do it.

Re:They bribe PC makers. No skill required. (0, Troll)

nashv (1479253) | about 4 years ago | (#33829992)

It's not bribing. It's called the free market.

Re:They bribe PC makers. No skill required. (4, Funny)

mark72005 (1233572) | about 4 years ago | (#33830058)

Well, the joke's on them, because 2010 is the year of Linux on the laptop.

Re:They bribe PC makers. No skill required. (1)

tsa (15680) | about 4 years ago | (#33830128)

Yeah man, the last 15 years have been a blast! Every year it was 'Linux on the desktop' year. Oh! The excitement!

Re:Word of Mouth (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829512)

Until you realize you are destroying one monopoly (Microsoft) while supporting another (Google). Operating systems are irrelevant if every app runs in the browser (Google Apps).

Re:Word of Mouth (1)

DrSkwid (118965) | about 4 years ago | (#33829672)

Operating systems are pretty much irrelevent anyway, browser or no.

Unless you think the height of the art is one of the bloated copies of a decades old OS design.

http://doc.cat-v.org/bell_labs/utah2000/ [cat-v.org]

Open Source Growth Strategies Think Tank (2, Interesting)

h00manist (800926) | about 4 years ago | (#33829972)

Is there such a thing as a group that coordinates actions to push for open-source growth strategies? Several groups might want such a thing, like governments. There was a time when I thought Microsoft was to blame for everything. These days I believe plain ole hard work, funding, partners, coordination, objectives, strategies, etc play a quite big part too.

Re:Word of Mouth (2, Insightful)

Technician (215283) | about 4 years ago | (#33830414)

Slow like in the original Napster, Bittorrent, Pirate Bay? Unless made illegal, the converts don't go back.

If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (4, Insightful)

Jailbrekr (73837) | about 4 years ago | (#33829384)

Dell may have dropped Ubuntu, but we dropped Dell. Good god are their business offerings ever horrible. We went out of our way to retire any and all Dell hardware with *extreme* prejudice.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (3, Insightful)

MBGMorden (803437) | about 4 years ago | (#33829464)

The only Dell hardware I've had that gave me serious trouble was a robotic tape library. Aside from that, it's mostly been ok.

Still, I don't see this as a huge problem. Even when Ubuntu systems were available from them, you still had to track them down. Anyone who wants it can still install it for free. With Windows it's a great boon to get it installed from the manufacturer because Dell gets Windows for a very small fraction of the cost as an end user (IIRC, it's around $25 per copy for a manufacturer that size). As such, if you want Windows on your new machine, you're saving a ton of money by getting it that way. Ubuntu on the other hand, being free, loses that advantage. I can install it after the fact for the same price.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (2, Informative)

DrSkwid (118965) | about 4 years ago | (#33830132)

I don't know about now but non-standardly shaped Dell parts forcing you to buy a new PSU from them sucks big style.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (2, Informative)

_Sprocket_ (42527) | about 4 years ago | (#33830146)

It's easier to just take the Windows install. Our IT folks still have to touch every new Dell box that comes through the door to load the standard image. The company still has to buy CALs for all workstations whether they're pre-installed with Windows or not. The two Dell systems (desktop, laptop, array of monitors) on my desk all get wiped and set up with Ubuntu with vbox handling the IT WinXP image. But ordering those systems without Windows would have been an additional level of effort with not enough financial gain to justify it.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (1)

rplst8 (828331) | about 4 years ago | (#33829504)

We went out of our way to retire any and all Dell hardware with *extreme* prejudice.

kill -9 dell

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (3, Funny)

blair1q (305137) | about 4 years ago | (#33829964)

'kill' is not recognized as an internal or external command,
operable program or batch file.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33830502)

bash: kill: dell: arguments must be process or job IDs

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (1)

MonsterTrimble (1205334) | about 4 years ago | (#33829536)

I was going to mod you up, but I want to ask you about your post. What caused you to "retire any and all Dell hardware with *extreme* prejudice"? If a machine is working fine and not outdated, why would you pull it for another model, even if it is labelled 'Dell'? My wife has a Dell which I grant is a POS but it is also 8 years old and in it's first life was abused in a call center.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (1, Insightful)

Confusador (1783468) | about 4 years ago | (#33829656)

I can't speak for Jailbrekr, but we've been replacing their stuff as fast as we can not because it doesn't work, but because we know that when it fails it's going to be like pulling teeth to get it fixed. I don't know what sort of contractual/legal obligations made us wait this long, but now that we can we're going full bore.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (2, Informative)

dave562 (969951) | about 4 years ago | (#33829796)

What kind of support contracts do you have? I've worked with HP hardware my entire career, with the exception of my current job where I inherited a bunch of Dell hardware. Their hardware isn't all that great, and their drivers are crap compared to HP. However their support seems as good, if not better. We have 24x7x4 "mission critical" support and I haven't had any problems getting parts and technicians dispatched.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (2, Interesting)

MonsterTrimble (1205334) | about 4 years ago | (#33829852)

That I get, although I still question the ROI about pulling still servicable working systems out and replacing them. If they are busted or obsolete then have at 'er.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (5, Informative)

CannonballHead (842625) | about 4 years ago | (#33829578)

Dell didn't drop Ubuntu. You can still buy Dell computers preloaded with Ubuntu.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (2, Funny)

AHuxley (892839) | about 4 years ago | (#33830110)

Re: You can still buy Dell computers preloaded with Ubuntu.
I eventually had to go down to the sitemap. D: That's the display department.
A: I had to do a search. D: The database must have been out. A: So were the links.
D: But you did find the Ubuntu Dells. A: Yes, I found them. In a hidden directory in a disused sever behind a popup that said "Beware of the Malware".
D: That's our Dell department.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (1)

interval1066 (668936) | about 4 years ago | (#33830260)

"Dell didn't drop Ubuntu. You can still buy Dell computers preloaded with Ubuntu."

But would you want to? After several recent stories in the media about defective components and sub-standard (even for the industry) support, looking to fill reqs with Dell hardware would be a foolish endeavor.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (1)

Jazzbunny (1251002) | about 4 years ago | (#33830378)

Dell might be selling preloaded Ubuntu machines but at least Dell UK makes it rather difficult to actually buy them [h-online.com] . Basically you need to call sales rep, send them few emails, blog about how your emails just weren't answered and if you are lucky you get twitter name that might be able to help you in your quest. Not exactly the easiest shopping experience.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (1)

nine-times (778537) | about 4 years ago | (#33830040)

Care to explain? What were your problems, who did you switch to and why?

I know it's off-topic, but you brought it up and I'm curious.

Re:If it makes Ubuntu feel any better.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33830222)

Dell loaded tons of crapware on the last laptop I bought. The options seemed to be: 1) deal with msconfig and hope you get rid of it all or 2) install the os from scratch. I did the latter.. but then you have to spend hours downloading and installing all their drivers.

Dell should just pack it in... (2, Insightful)

strangeattraction (1058568) | about 4 years ago | (#33829390)

It is time for Dell to admit it can't compete against the Chinese. MS tells them to stop shipping Ubuntu and they do. They have no will of their own.

How the HELL is this informative? (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829712)

Dell has NOT dropped Ubuntu [dell.com]

The story is BS. PC Pro has zero credibility.

Give the money back to the shareholders ... (2, Interesting)

perpenso (1613749) | about 4 years ago | (#33829754)

I think Michael Dell already knows what to do, he's commented on situations like this in the past:

"In 1997, shortly after Mr. Jobs returned to Apple, the company he helped start in 1976, Dell's founder and chairman, Michael S. Dell, was asked at a technology conference what might be done to fix Apple, then deeply troubled financially. "What would I do?" Mr. Dell said to an audience of several thousand information technology managers. "I'd shut it down and give the money back to the shareholders."" http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/16/technology/16apple.html [nytimes.com]

Re:Give the money back to the shareholders ... (1)

Archangel Michael (180766) | about 4 years ago | (#33830524)

Who would you rather listen to? Steve Jobs or Michael Dell?

That prediction was silly at the time, and now ... it just looks idiotic. Apple is #2 and might reach #1 here shortly (Market Cap).

I wonder how crazy THAT prediction would have been at the time.

Kudos (4, Insightful)

MBGMorden (803437) | about 4 years ago | (#33829396)

I think they're probably going about it the right way. It's an uphill battle, and we've still got a ways to go, but Linux in general and Ubuntu specifically has been making great strides here.

I particularly like Ubuntu's focus on polish. They don't just crank out apps. They work on themes, fonts, artwork, etc. Things that really make the desktop shine to user who's just taking a test drive. There was a time when a Linux desktop without a TON of work poured into it (and sometimes even after it) was just ugly. Sure it didn't crash, and it was secure, but it looked like it was drawn by programmers - because it WAS back then. Getting UI and artwork people on board helps a lot, and Ubuntu is doing the right thing in that regard.

Re:Kudos (1)

BJ_Covert_Action (1499847) | about 4 years ago | (#33829456)

The polish is nice. I still wish it was easier to connect my network card to a WPA protected wireless network without having to manually configure WPA_Supplicant. I haven't piddled around with the network managers after 9.04 so maybe they are better now, but for awhile there, it was a pain in the ass to configure your computer to connect to a static IP address on a WPA2 protected network without hacking the configuration files manually.

Re:Kudos (1)

MonsterTrimble (1205334) | about 4 years ago | (#33829568)

I run Kubuntu 10.04 on my laptop and I haven't had any of those problems. The wireless GUI worked like a charm.

Re:Kudos (1)

MightyMartian (840721) | about 4 years ago | (#33829658)

I agree. There's something fundamentally busted about the Gnome network app. I've had nothing but grief. But a move to Kubuntu seems to fix those particular issues (even if I'm not a big fan of KDE).

Re:Kudos (1)

MonsterTrimble (1205334) | about 4 years ago | (#33829880)

I am, although my poor lappy isn't - it's just too old to handle the CPU load properly. Once I jump to Maverick I'm going to install Lubuntu-core and see if that helps. LXDE with KDE apps - should be fun!

Re:Kudos (1)

mirix (1649853) | about 4 years ago | (#33830430)

Gnome network manager works fine with WPA2 in debian, so it sounds more like there is something busted with ubuntu.

I don't recall having any problems on lenny or squeeze... it just worked.

Re:Kudos (1)

commodore64_love (1445365) | about 4 years ago | (#33829834)

I have Lubuntu (lightweight ubuntu)(runs on 128k) and have not had problems either, except I still can't AOL Web Accelerator to work. So I use Opera's web accelerator instead.

Re:Kudos (1)

MonsterTrimble (1205334) | about 4 years ago | (#33829920)

I used to run a home brew Ubuntu Minimal + LXDE + Opera on my laptop and the only reason I redid it in Kubuntu was the lack of WiFi support on my laptop. If that starts showing up on Lubuntu, Kubuntu goes buh-bye again. Loved the speed and low resources.

Re:Kudos (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829996)

I ran Ubuntu on your mom. Last night. And again in the morning.

Re:Kudos (1)

Dishevel (1105119) | about 4 years ago | (#33830462)

I think that the crossing of your name with the mention of AOL has begun a process in my brain that can only end in a very painful death.

Re:Kudos (1)

jellomizer (103300) | about 4 years ago | (#33830370)

Ubuntu has a lot of these cases where things are quite sketchy in terms of support.
There are so many apologist out there that it is quite infuriating to get your answer. Oddly Enough with Windows things work, if it doesn't there is usually a short path to fix it. With Ubuntu some things work better then windows but other things work just as well with simple fix, then they are the trouble makers where there are enough to be problems. The issue of getting Wi-Fi to work is often not an easy one. I have seen it myself where WPA Personal works but WPA Enterprise doesn't or it does only when there is a particular configuration.

Don't fool your self Ubuntu has a lot of bugs and a lot of areas to improve on it. I wish a lot of it supporters would take a step back and look at it what it is, and see where the gaps and problems are. Ubuntu has done a lot to improve UI... But so has Windows also windows has done a lot to improve it Stability too. I havn't seen XP, 7 or even Vista crash from a non-hardware issue. Just like Linux. The Linux advantage is protection against worms and viruses. Due to more of a secure base when they made it. But still Windows actually Sucks a lot less then Ubuntu fans are willing to admit.

Ubuntu is a great OS. One of the better Desktop Linux UI or one of the better Desktop UI around. There are a lot of nice things about it that Windows or OS X doesn't have. But there are gaps, and has problems, that needs to be address and fixed and not apologized for

Re:Kudos (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829608)

Of course it will only get better, they don't have investors to please, deadlines to meet, millions in salaries to pay to executives and other useless people.

Re:Kudos (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829692)

And while they piddle around with changing the theme every 2 days, there is STILL no supported way to play blu-rays on Linux. There is still no way to view netflix streaming movies. Look, I can live with a 5 year old theme, I just don't want to be left in the slums of the internet because the focus is on changing the theme colors yet again rather than keeping up with other OSs.

Re:Kudos (2, Insightful)

_Sprocket_ (42527) | about 4 years ago | (#33830334)

Yeah, I'm sure the reason for lack of blu-ray and Netflix support is too much time toying with The GIMP. There's nothing about either blu-ray or Netflix that's restricted. The only thing stopping Ubuntu from supporting these is all the time spent trying to decide on a brown or blue color pallet for the next release desktop default.

Re:Kudos (1)

Mordok-DestroyerOfWo (1000167) | about 4 years ago | (#33830428)

Shit! My sarcasm detector just melted!

Re:Kudos (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33830176)

Polish and yet this issue has existed for months: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1478787&page=114&highlight=freeze

Positive Rather than Negative (4, Insightful)

BJ_Covert_Action (1499847) | about 4 years ago | (#33829400)

'The improvements we're making to Ubunutu ... are a better route for us to reach out to users and get a bigger user base.'

High five for being one organization in this world that recognizes the benefits of positive advertisement rather than negative attack campaigns. It's always better to stay positive. People will like you more.

Re:Positive Rather than Negative (2, Insightful)

catbutt (469582) | about 4 years ago | (#33829938)

Negative attack campaigns are one thing....but filing an antitrust complaint is another. We need healthy competition, and I don't think we have it. I think Opera did the right thing, and partially as a result of that, we have a lot healthier competition in browsers these days.

Re:Positive Rather than Negative (1)

91degrees (207121) | about 4 years ago | (#33830194)

I think that would have happened anyway. MS did nothing with IE for years. Mozilla was evolving pretty rapidly and was soon clearly the better browser. But even without Mozilla, Google would have released a browser eventually since they have a vested interest in making sure that Microsoft don't control the web.

Re:Positive Rather than Negative (1)

catbutt (469582) | about 4 years ago | (#33830286)

It's hard to say, but I think the fact that windows users now get a place to choose their browsers can make a real difference over time. Imagine if new pc users got a choice of OS (say, windows as well as a selection of 3 or 4 flavors of linux) when they started their computer for the first time.

Re:Positive Rather than Negative (1)

Mordok-DestroyerOfWo (1000167) | about 4 years ago | (#33830444)

There was never a limitation on whether or not an end user could install a 3rd party browser. Opera may have the best browser out there, but I refuse to help give any marketshare to a company that litigates to increase its install base. You can pry my Firefox and Chrome from my cold, dead, Cheetos encrusted hands.

Re:Positive Rather than Negative (1)

Dishevel (1105119) | about 4 years ago | (#33830472)

Wrong.

Negative attack campaigns and antitrust suits are the same thing.

Positive way of looking at market share. (1)

xzvf (924443) | about 4 years ago | (#33830036)

If you only count the United States and the desktop, the commonly touted market share numbers of Linux is 1-2%. Say there are 200 million desktops actively used in the USA. That means there are between two and four million Linux desktop users in just the United States.

Re:Positive Rather than Negative (1)

h00manist (800926) | about 4 years ago | (#33830206)

I agree. I also liked what Shutteworth said once, Linux needs to gain on it's own terms. Open source needs to have it's own strategic advantages, work on it's own tech and obstacles, rather than trying to constantly figure out whatever Microsoft proprietary stuff does.

TFS is incorrect about Dell (5, Informative)

StayFrosty (1521445) | about 4 years ago | (#33829412)

Dell is still shipping PCs with Ubuntu preloaded. You can find them here [dell.com] .

Re:TFS is incorrect about Dell (0, Troll)

MichaelKristopeit 39 (1917448) | about 4 years ago | (#33829484)

slashdot = stagnated.

story submissions are nothing but lies.

Re:TFS is incorrect about Dell (1)

Dunbal (464142) | about 4 years ago | (#33829876)

or copies of the CNN front page...

Re:TFS is incorrect about Dell (1)

taylormc (926607) | about 4 years ago | (#33829522)

But why are they shipping with 9.04???

Re:TFS is incorrect about Dell (1)

CannonballHead (842625) | about 4 years ago | (#33829566)

They aren't. There's one running 9.10 and one running 10.04.

Re:TFS is incorrect about Dell (1)

CannonballHead (842625) | about 4 years ago | (#33829644)

Oops, nevermind, I see the laptops with 9.04 now. Doh.

Re:TFS is incorrect about Dell (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829562)

No if you click through by the time you're on an order page Windows is the only option. Chances are they forgot about that page you linked...

Re:TFS is incorrect about Dell (3, Informative)

CannonballHead (842625) | about 4 years ago | (#33829606)

Not true. I just configured an AMD-based XPS 7100 with 10.04.

Re:TFS is incorrect about Dell (1)

StayFrosty (1521445) | about 4 years ago | (#33829610)

I clicked through the Mini 10 option and it didn't change it to Windows only.

Re:TFS is incorrect about Dell (2, Informative)

medlefsen (995255) | about 4 years ago | (#33829618)

http://dell.com/ubuntu [dell.com]
They even have a page extolling the virtues of Ubuntu with a snazzy short url.

Wrong Country (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829742)

Not on http://www.dell.co.uk/ [dell.co.uk] - this is the EU we are talking about not America - different sites you know.

Ubunutu? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829420)

"Ubunutu"? It's not that hard to get right... *looks at address bar* ohh.

Good For Ubuntu and Canonical (2, Insightful)

TheNinjaroach (878876) | about 4 years ago | (#33829434)

I don't have much respect for those who unnecessarily bring government and lawyers into every situation.

Re:Good For Ubuntu and Canonical (2, Interesting)

jd (1658) | about 4 years ago | (#33829840)

Be, Inc. thought the same as you, whereas Novell did not. Novell still exists, Be does not.

That tells me it is indeed necessary.

Another good point (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829534)

The amount spent on a single lawyer would probably pay for 2-3 programmers for the same period of time. Assuming you'd have 5 lawyers, 5 paralegals (1-2 programmers each), their support personnel (secretaries, whatever), and their expenses, you could probably hire 15-20 programmers and their support personnel over the same period of time that the lawyers would spend researching the complaint and drafting corrective proposals (probably a few months, maybe a year depending on any followup). The positive effect of 15-20 well paid and supported programmers on Ubuntu would probably have the same effect on adoption rates through word of mouth as bringing the complaint and giving people the option of choosing the Ubuntu that didn't have their improvements.

Of course, I could be overstating what 15-20 programmers could do. I can promise you, though, I'm not overstating how much attorneys cost...

Re:Another good point (1)

Just Brew It! (636086) | about 4 years ago | (#33829898)

If anything, you're probably underestimating the cost of an attorney.

Re:Another good point (1)

koiransuklaa (1502579) | about 4 years ago | (#33830090)

On the other hand, most people underestimate the cost of (and especially the difficulty of finding) _competent_ developers...

Re:Another good point (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33830284)

True. Very true. Especially the competent part. 1st year out of school lawyers at a top firm have salaries of 120k-160k, plus bonuses. I feel like you can hire one or two competent developers, maybe 3 if you're getting them young (60-80k for ones with a few years experience, 40-60k for direct from school). Of course, if we're talking attorneys with a few years experience, then we're talking people being paid 200k a year, and if you can't find 2 competent programmers for 100k a piece, then I feel like you may be doing something wrong...

As far as finding...yeah, I'm just assuming there's a few waiting at the gates, so to speak.

Re:Another good point (1)

Just Brew It! (636086) | about 4 years ago | (#33830308)

Good point. A statistic I've seen is that productivity among software developers varies by roughly an order of magnitude. Based on my own experiences in the industry, I would have to agree; in fact, some developers even have negative productivity!

On the other hand, how much does it cost to get a competent attorney (as opposed to just an average one)? Is the ratio of competent to incompetent attorneys any better than that of software developers?

Good (0, Troll)

Jorl17 (1716772) | about 4 years ago | (#33829592)

Good, if nobody talks about the company of the shitty OS (aka Microsoft), then maybe the competition can have a chance at EXISTING. Once that's done, we can cleat the minds of the poor users who have been living trapped in the claw of suckness.

No competetion for programmers workstation (5, Interesting)

grepya (67436) | about 4 years ago | (#33829652)

I use an Ubuntu (Lucid) desktop for work... customized for our organization by our IT department and fully supported. Even though I develop (server-side stuff) for the linux platform, I'd given up on using linux as my main work machine a few years ago. This was done in frustration over the amount of work I had to do to get basic features going wireless (for laptops), web videos, sound, random usb device support etc. I had gone completely over to OSX as the platform of choice. But this current iteration has completely changed my mind. No more virtual-machines-for-coding-and-real -machine-for-everything else lifestyle for me.

      Everything "just works" out of the box. Critical updates get auto-pushed (arranged by our IT... thorough our internal apt repo).... desktop/GUI behaviors etc. have been flawless... and I was able to connect my iPhone and upload all my music/photos etc. to the desktop (for more convenient headphone experience while coding). This last one is something that I positively *can not* do on my apple laptop. So in this instance, the Ubuntu desktop added value to an Apple product that another Apple product refused to do. And I was shocked to realize how plug-n-play this whole experience was (after the fact). No hacks, no "install ExperimentWare version 0.31" etc. I plugged in the phone via USB, some windows popped up to ask me what I wanted to do with the photos/music and just did what I asked. Impressive.

 

Re:No competetion for programmers workstation (2, Funny)

equex (747231) | about 4 years ago | (#33830508)

My wife set up Ubuntu 8.04 alone and got everything to work. flash, samba, A/V codecs, media players. In fact, we were going to make a whining video about how difficult everything was with Linux but had to cancel it due to everything turning out better than expected.

IMHO... (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829726)

> 'The improvements we're making to Ubunutu ... are a better route for us to reach out to users and get a bigger user base.'
In my personal opinion,

- Sun did this.
- Digital did this.
- Netscape did this.
- Amiga did this.
- BeOS did this.

Well, that's the basic idea and the results are now well-known.

Re:IMHO... (1)

blair1q (305137) | about 4 years ago | (#33829986)

Well, Dell did this, Intel did this, Microsoft did this, Oracle did this...

And it worked for them.

Re:IMHO... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829994)

Fire-fox did this too .. but they will have to be good

Word of mouth = exposure. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829784)

I think Canonical have it right, sit back and wait for people to realise that Microsoft is not the only reason they can do what they want to do.

The rapid take up of Android and iOS means that (dumb?) users are finally noticing that it doesn't matter which label is on a PC, as long as they can Tweet\Facebook\etc. they will use it and pretty much ignore the actual brand that allows them to do so.

OS agnosticism is approaching, as long as it can support the web apps that they want to use.

Nothing changes (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829792)

until PC's has to be sold without an OS. That way people are forced to know what to do and what can be put on the computer. In the mean time Microsoft and Apple will keep forcing everyone to install Windows or Mac OS.

Would also forcing Grandma from going to Best Buy, buy a PC, go home, surf the net, and get the PC infested. The much needed "Driver License" for PC's need to include OS knowledge.

Re:Nothing changes (1)

Dunbal (464142) | about 4 years ago | (#33830074)

While I think you don't deserve the "Troll" mod, I would argue the following with respect to the "Driver License for PC's":

You are required to have a driver's license for motor vehicles, and presumably the amount of testing is much more detailed than a "PC license". Yet the road is still full of idiots. I don't see how a "PC license" would achieve anything, other than an additional revenue stream for a testing agency and more make believe jobs.

Ubunutu? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33829870)

Uhh... how did no one catch this?

Well I think _someone_ needs to (1)

Duncan J Murray (1678632) | about 4 years ago | (#33829874)

If not Canonical, then I think someone needs to press the EU into pushing open standards for software.

In the UK it seems a lot of pressure has been put on the mobile phone and broadband companies to allow users to easily switch between service providers without suffering a huge penalty. The same goes for gas and electric supplies. I'm sure most people would agree this has been hugely beneficial, both for the service provided, and for allowing other businesses into the market.

The main reason for lack of linux uptake amongst my peers, is simply because it isn't compatible with the industry standard - the closed-source .doc .xls and .ppt files. And no, openoffice.org, while good, does not have seemless compatibility, and is useless for such things as collaborating on files due to the slight differences in formatting.

The fact that one also has to pay Microsoft to buy any mainstream laptop is also, surely, anti-competitive. What it means is that no matter what operating system I choose, Microsoft will receive my money, which will no doubt fund a business practice I don't approve of, and an operating system I don't rate.

Thank goodness for open standards such as html, www, email; twitter, facebook, gmail, googlechat protocols etc etc, or else Linux, for the home user, would be almost useless!

Duncan

Re:Well I think _someone_ needs to (1)

nashv (1479253) | about 4 years ago | (#33830056)

That analogy fails. You aren't locked down to a OS, technically, as you are with mobile networks and electric supplies. At least, not with Microsoft - the iPhone might fit the bill for that one. You are free to do with the machine what you want, it's sold to you in a particular state. You can always buy an OS-less computer, and in all cases, you can actually return the Windows license and get your refund.

Re:Well I think _someone_ needs to (1)

Noughmad (1044096) | about 4 years ago | (#33830108)

Thank goodness for open standards such as html, www, email; twitter, facebook, gmail, googlechat protocols etc etc, or else Linux, for the home user, would be almost useless!

One of these things is not like the others.

Kudos to Canonical for taking the high road (3, Interesting)

Just Brew It! (636086) | about 4 years ago | (#33829878)

I wish them success in their attempt to topple (or at least put a serious dent in) Microsoft based purely on technical merit. Unfortunately the landscape is littered with other companies who have tried to do so; it's an uphill battle which typically runs off a cliff at some point. I do think that Canonical is in the best position to do so since IBM with OS/2 back in the day; in fact, IMO Canonical is significantly better positioned than IBM was back then. I've been using Ubuntu as my primary OS (both at home and work!) for a while now, and in spite of the occasional glitches, it has been like a breath of fresh air. The mere thought of going back to Windows gives me nightmares.

Re:Kudos to Canonical for taking the high road (1)

Ukab the Great (87152) | about 4 years ago | (#33830184)

Considering that most of Linux's previous attempts to topple Microsoft on the desktop were based on sheer force of zealotry alone, I guess that's progress.

Re:Kudos to Canonical for taking the high road (1)

Just Brew It! (636086) | about 4 years ago | (#33830420)

Yeah, zealotry will only get you so far. At some point you've got to deliver solutions that real-world users can use without spending days surfing web forums to figure out how to configure things, or learning how to compile a custom kernel. In fact, I've said that Linux evangelists are often Linux's own worst enemy. Canonical's approach seems to be a sensible one, in that they're really trying to address the issues which have prevented non-computer-geek types from adopting Linux on a wider basis.

Still available in the US. Still and MS Tax (2, Informative)

RebootKid (712142) | about 4 years ago | (#33829948)

I think it must just be Dell in the EU. Here in the US, you can still configure systems preloaded with Ubuntu.

In fact, I just ran the numbers. Buying a Latitude 13 configured exactly the way I like it, running 9.10 (32bit): $1753.98
Running Windows7 (32bit): $1862.98

I didn't see a way of doing 64bit installs for either option. This also doesn't take into account any of the specials that may be running, or employee discounts, etc.

In this circumstance, the Microsoft tax is $109

Laptop (1)

tsa (15680) | about 4 years ago | (#33830002)

I dunno. I can buy a desktop computer with no OS without problems, but try to get a laptop without an OS. Impossible! I think Ubuntu is allowed to complain about that.

Prime example of word of mouth (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 years ago | (#33830234)

I've been a high school math and physics teacher for a few years now. When I came into the school, no one had heard of ubuntu, let alone linux (our IT manager had heard of linux, but never used it!). I've introduced most of my students to open source software, such as openoffice, GPeriodic, CaRMetal, and some other scholastic software provided right in the ubuntu software center and they love it! I love it because it's free, and to boot, it really does assist me in the classroom. The other math teachers love all the stuff that can be done with it too. In fact, I don't see any reason why most schools don't set up a massive LTSP server and recycle the hardware they have when it comes for a refresh.

It's a slow process, but, I firmly believe any audience will follow functionality when the functionality is better at a price range. Of course, I know there is the hidden cost of the learning curve and stuff, but, when introduced at a young age people can be trained to use any software effectively.

Not quite there yet (1)

airfoobar (1853132) | about 4 years ago | (#33830248)

It will take nothing less than some serious anti-trust lawsuits to bring the Microsoft OS monopoly into check, because they are so deep-rooted and have so damn much control of the market in so many different ways.. Only to think they are paying large OEMs to quietly "disappear" the option of no OS (i.e., forcing the consumer to choose between their product and the highway) is a frightening demonstration of their power.

Perhaps Canonical is not the right company to initiate the anti-trust investigations, but Google will very likely be. I certainly look forward to the day when I won't need to pay the Microsoft tax every time I buy a laptop.

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