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Did the Windows Phone 7 Bomb In the US?

CmdrTaco posted more than 3 years ago | from the now-wait-a-minute dept.

Microsoft 609

Thorfinn.au writes "Microsoft's new smartphone platform is off to what could be considered a slower start than expected in North America. That's according to The Street, which has released a report saying that the company sold some 40,000 units on its first day on the market. Early sales numbers from other phone platform launches include Apple's estimated 500,000 iPhones being snatched up during its launch weekend in 2007, and a million and a half G1 Android phones being bought up by T-Mobile subscribers in the phone's first six months." Do you know anyone with one of these phones? Me either.

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609 comments

If You're Late to the Party (5, Interesting)

eldavojohn (898314) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195480)

You better bring something that no one else has. I'm still looking and waiting for something that WP7 devices are offering that isn't covered by Android and/or iOS. I understand that a hybrid is valuable when Android and iOS offer either extreme but ... can someone tell me what WP7 does that makes it unique? What are its selling points? Because from what I've read, there are no unique aspects to it.

It's XBox all over again. They'll lose several billion on WP7 and write it off. WP8 will come out and after three years of shoving the platform down people's throats, they'll be a hard won 25% of the market. Don't get me wrong, I own an XBox 360 but how many years of mistakes did it take for them and how much did they lose on the original to come to that piece of market share?

Why flush money down a losing venture until it starts to see a return? Because they can. And one of the many faults of capitalism is that those with a ton of money can do the stupidest shit and still come out okay.

Re:If You're Late to the Party (4, Insightful)

KiloByte (825081) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195528)

You are assuming that WP8 will magically be a success, with, as you say, "25% of the market". What are the reasons to think that? It's not like WP7 is the first or second of Microsoft's forays into phones -- just look at the aptly named WinCE or the recent Microsoft Kin flop.

Re:If You're Late to the Party (1)

Barryke (772876) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195532)

capitalism is that those with a ton of money can do the stupidest shit and still come out okay.

Man i would like to be a capitalist. Because then i can.

Re:If You're Late to the Party (4, Insightful)

MemoryDragon (544441) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195538)

Yes really hardly surprising, and I was hoping for it, not because I wish Microsoft evil, but after years of dreadful ies on the desktop at least in the emerging mobile sektor webkit and its html5 implementation has become more or less the current defacto standard, so people finally can settle for a decent webapp programming experience. And then wham 3 years late Microsoft comes with its newest version of the os and tries to shove IE7 down the web developers throats. I have yet to meet a single web developer who was excited about the browser in WinMobile 7.
If Microsoft had gotten its way then we would have had ie6 all over again in the mobile sector, where a significant portion had a browser which had the latest standards in and stubborn Microsoft users wanted to see the latest whizbang features on their rotten browser without even thinking about installing an alternative. We have been there the last 10 years, and I really do not want history to repeat itself!

Re:If You're Late to the Party (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195604)

Agreed, I am following them for a while now and I was always wondering how they weren't committed to playing towards key differentiators. Native exchange server integration comes to mind.

Re:If You're Late to the Party (4, Insightful)

ducomputergeek (595742) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195668)

It depends, what is the long game? US companies have the unhealthy opinion of "What do you do for me next quarter?", but if the strategy is "Where do I want to be in 15 years?" (Europe) or "Where do I want to be in 50 years?" (Asia), then those losses are short term. And if you think the future is going to be some kind of media appliance over the next 10 - 15 years, yeah, you've lost a bunch of money on the first two generations, but the experience they've gained for the next 5 generations is invaluable.

I recently bought a 360. I used to play at my friends house, but as we've gotten older and they've gotten married/had kids or moved elsewhere...

Why did I buy a 360 over a Wii or PS3? Because that's what my friends had. Most of the people I know who bought Wii's seemed to have lost interest in the machines. Most use it more to stream Netflix than play games these days. And very few of my friends had a PS3 and most who did also had a 360.

Now I know those numbers don't hold up on a global scale. Xbox has not been that popular outside of the US.

Re:If You're Late to the Party (1)

somersault (912633) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195678)

I didn't even know it was out yet. I guess I've mostly ignored the Win7 articles for a while now though, and wasn't psyched for it. I moved from years of Windows Mobile phones to Android a couple of months ago.

Re:If You're Late to the Party (5, Interesting)

Jugalator (259273) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195698)

You better bring something that no one else has.

Yup... and especially not LESS.

WP7 doesn't do multitasking with third party apps (only Microsoft's own apps has this advantage, go figure...), and doesn't even support encrypted Exchange connections. Yes, yes, Microsoft wrote Exchange, and even Windows Mobile 6.5 supported this! This will effectively shut out many enterprise users from using this phone if their servers reject unencrypted connections (and rightly so, in my opinion).

It's funny when iPhone has support for encrypted Exchange connections in built-in software on both OS X (Mail) and iOS, and MS in neither Windows 7, nor Windows Phone 7. No, not even Windows Live Mail supports true Exchange connections -- it has to be set up to serve as an IMAP server. And Exchange is a behemoth in the enterprise market.

Go go Ballmer with your strategic decisions.

Or maybe it's their shareholders that need to go "strategic" on Ballmer...

The only thing I want to know is... (3, Funny)

xtracto (837672) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195892)

The only thing I want to know is: Does Windows 7 Mobile allows me to squirt my pals?

Re:If You're Late to the Party (1)

The MAZZTer (911996) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195702)

Well I've heard complaints about Android and iOS and their stores and the ways each locks down apps etc, different OS versions (for Android). But I haven't heard anything bad about WP7! But then again at the time it hadn't been released yet... so that was probably why... >_>

Re:If You're Late to the Party (1)

jayhawk88 (160512) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195778)

It's XBox all over again. They'll lose several billion on WP7 and write it off. WP8 will come out and after three years of shoving the platform down people's throats, they'll be a hard won 25% of the market. Don't get me wrong, I own an XBox 360 but how many years of mistakes did it take for them and how much did they lose on the original to come to that piece of market share?

This is exactly spot on. There will be enough integration and management benefits that businesses will (eventually) begin to migrate to it for corporate needs, more and more consumers will be talked into it by Verizon reps, and eventually they'll gain a foothold. Microsoft really doesn't have any other choice but to stick with it, and to take a beating with it early if necessary. Plan B is to just be a complete non-factor - or worse, non-participant - in the mobile world.

Re:If You're Late to the Party (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195820)

can someone tell me what WP7 does that makes it unique? What are its selling points? Because from what I've read, there are no unique aspects to it.

Crashing every few days????

Just my experience from the previous couple versions.

Xbox 360 Failing Just As Badly As First Xbox (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195844)

The Xbox 360 is selling just as badly as the first Xbox marketplace failure.

The first Xbox was dead in Japan.
The Xbox 360 is dead in Japan.

The first Xbox was dead all across mainland Europe, but alive in the UK.
The Xbox 360 is dead all across mainland Europe, but alive in the UK.

The first Xbox survived almost entirely by US sales.
The Xbox 360 is once again surviving almost entirely by US sales.

Rushing out defective hardware a year early and then selling millions and millions of duplicate consoles to the same people isn't gaining marketshare.

The Xbox 360 is in last place in worldwide installed base. And that is including the millions of duplicate consoles.

Microsoft has gotten absolutely nothing in return for the billions they thrown down the Xbox rat hole. That is why they have now given up the Xbox 360 as a competitor to the PS3 and are now totally focused on trying to turn the 360 into a Wii type device.

Xbox,WP7,Zune...All The Same MS Division (1)

Minsky_9 (1938696) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195936)

Xbox
Zune
Windows Phone 7,Windows Mobile

All those high profile failures are part of Microsoft's disastrous E&D division.

E&D and the online services/search products are reason everyone wants Ballmer gone. Blowing billions on garbage products like the Xbox and Bing are something the people who actually make profits, OS, office software, and server&tools are sick a tired of after a decade.

There is only so long that people are willing to wake up and go to work everyday just to have other people like the idiots running E&D blow billions in profits on junk products.

Re:If You're Late to the Party (1)

Lumpy (12016) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195908)

Xbox live integration is highly popular with all the Executives!

Re:If You're Late to the Party (1)

Andy Dodd (701) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195952)

Everything I've read about WP7 indicates that it's a step backwards in terms of flexibility and features from WM6.5.

Yes, the UI is cleaner and shinier, but iPhone and Android also have very nice UIs, in addition to having more applications available and more capabilities than WP7.

Re:If You're Late to the Party (1)

Fibe-Piper (1879824) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195972)

I have the previously marketed WinPhone; i.e. Windows Mobile 6.5. It was won in a contest by a friend. A bunch of contract fanagalling with the service provider and a $50 fee to unlock it and I was able to use it with my current provider. I was excited about a Microsoft product for the first time in years!

Then I learn that this thing is a dead end. I can't upgrade to WinPhone7. All mention of Windows Mobile 6.5 being touted as "WinPhone" disappears. I mean it was free (minus the $250 worth of contract fanagalling mentioned above) so who cares right?

But you know what - its been my favorite phone ever. I really like it. It does everything I need. If the Windows Phone 7 takes off and Microsoft manges to support it and not dump it like my phone's OS, then I may go to that next.

I would need to hear some really positive things to stop me from buying an Android out of spite though.

Yet another MS flop (-1, Offtopic)

debus (751449) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195484)

I love to see these guys fail.

Is it still true that Office and Windows are their only profitable products?

Re:Yet another MS flop (2, Insightful)

colmore (56499) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195526)

There's the XBOX, they make money of their servers and related products, and they do a lot of business with various products and services related to Exchange.

And they make a damn fine mouse.

But in the consumer world, there's Windows, Office, and XBox. Everything else they've tried to do has failed.

Re:Yet another MS flop (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195552)

Is it still true that Office and Windows are their only profitable products?

No, they make a pretty good basic mouse.

Re:Yet another MS flop (1, Informative)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195598)

There's the XBOX, they make money of their servers and related products, and they do a lot of business with various products and services related to Exchange.

The Xbox is not remotely profitable. The entertainment division has been a hole down which money was flushed until extremely recently. It may not be a bleeding hemorrhage any more, however.

Xbox Profitable??? No... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195672)

The Xbox fiasco has racked up some 7+ billion in visible losses. If you take away all the profitable products that the Xbox is mixed in with over the past 8 years the losses are significantly higher. I've seen Microsoft people estimate the actual Xbox losses up in the 15 billion range.

Just last quarter the Xbox was still such a drag on Microsoft's E&D division that they still 200 million in the red for the quarter.

That means that even with the profitable products in E&D, the hundreds of millions in online fees being charged that the Xbox is still a massive money sink.

Xbox revenues, yes. Profits, no.

That is why Microsoft is fed up with the clusterfuck of a product and is now trying to turn it into a Wii type device instead of handing the idiots running the Xbox disaster more billions to blow on new Xbox hardware.

Re:Yet another MS flop (1)

MemoryDragon (544441) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195550)

No their server products make money, the database, their dev tools, heck even the xbox by now makes money. But I do not see Winmobile end of the line, it simply is a restart. Microsoft usually is very stubborn about pressing products into the market. If they followed the US business rules they would have given up Windows by version 2.0 and probably their dev tools by 1988.

Me neither (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195504)

The last sentence of the summary should say: me neither.
--
Brought to you by your local Grammar Gestapo office.

OMG! OMG! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195506)

Not that I am a big fan of Microsoft (far from it actually), but come on Taco, don't turn /. into another engadget or gizmodo.

While I agree it's not as good as... (5, Insightful)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195512)

While I agree it's not as good as Microsoft probably hoped for, I'd like to point out that comparing it's sales to the iPhone (who was, for all intents and purposes, the first of its kind to go critical) and Android (the first solid competitor to the first smartphone to really go critical) isn't exactly fair.

If anything, I'd say that 40,000 for the first day in an already crowded market isn't bad. Not great, but not bad.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (5, Insightful)

wvmarle (1070040) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195572)

No matter how you look at it 40,000 is still 40,000. That's a significant number of phones. The iPhone and Google's phones were hyped badly before launch; highly anticipated; no wonder they sold well.

More fair would be to compare it to say a new Nokia or Sony Ericsson top-line model. I bet those companies would be quite happy to sell that number in the first day of sales. A not hyped, "yet another" kind of phone, that's what this is and that's what it should be compared to.

But of course Apple's iPhone is the de-facto reference smartphone these days. No matter what you do, release a smartphone and it'll be compared to the iPhone first.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (5, Insightful)

dc29A (636871) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195716)

The iPhone and Google's phones were hyped badly before launch; highly anticipated; no wonder they sold well.

Exactly. There was no hype at all around Windows Phone 7. None. Nada. Zilch. That explains all those TV commercials, launch parties, paid shills like Paul Thurrott and Co. touting Windows 7 Phone as the second coming of Zeus.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195862)

Yes, and what TV ads they were. Trying to sell a new smartphone OS while insulting every other smartphone OS user.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (2, Interesting)

falldeaf (968657) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195896)

Those tv commercials are so awful, they make no sense. I think they're saying people are too fascinated and in love with their phone, and win7 phones are going to fix that for you.... wait, what? And launch parties?... Like that travesty for windows vista? I thought Microsoft was supposed to be a juggernaut of advertising, maybe their strength is advertising to corporate types.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (1)

miffo.swe (547642) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195804)

WP7 has gotten its fair share of paid for hype no doubt. Grassroots like with Android and iPhone, not so much. There just aren't anything in WP7 to get excited about. Its just boring and featureless without anything even remotely unique that would make it stand out.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195822)

Has there even been a case where 40000 is still NOT 40000 but instead is 1 or -1?

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (1)

Joce640k (829181) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195838)

Only the "die hards" buy it on the first day, the real dyed-in-the-wool fanbois who'll buy anything with "Windows 7" written on it.

The real test is how many 'normal' people buy it in the next year.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (1)

AltGrendel (175092) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195574)

I'm sorry, but that has got to be one of the sillier things I've read here on /. There's nothing special about this other than the fact that it's a Microsoft product. In the current smart phone market, more is expected of a product than that.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (1)

Legion303 (97901) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195646)

Not only that, but the article compares launch day numbers to launch weekend numbers to 6-month sales numbers. that doesn't really tell me anything.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (0)

mehrotra.akash (1539473) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195664)

ooooookkkk..
what about symbian(s60),Black Berry,Windows Mobile 6 which were there before iPhone
All iPhone did was dumb down the smartphone so that non "smart" users could use a smart phone
It gave a limited set of smartphone features to the featurephone crowd, and everyone loved it. Now, others are eliminating the features which were already present in the OS to appeal to the masses..

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (1)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195748)

I didn't say the iPhone was the first...I said it was the first to go critical.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (5, Interesting)

jittles (1613415) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195726)

I think it's not fair to make the comparison just because AT&T didn't bother to supply their stores with anything. I have a friend who took the day off work to wait in line and buy one. He had called the store and asked them if he needed to get in early and they told them they had plenty of phones in stock and that he could come in any time and buy one. He got there an hour before the store opened and found out that the AT&T corporate store had 2 phones in stock. That's right. 2. Now maybe that's all the demand they thought they'd get but that store was sold out the second the store opened.

I don't think AT&T has any interest in offering serious competition to the iPhone. That's why all their android phones are pretty crappy compared to T-Mobile, Sprint or Verizon.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (1)

Pojut (1027544) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195766)

I don't think AT&T has any interest in offering serious competition to the iPhone. That's why all their android phones are pretty crappy compared to T-Mobile, Sprint or Verizon.

pretty much. A good friend of mine is on AT&T, and just a couple of weeks ago he was asking me about which Android phone he should get. I told him "if you insist on staying with AT&T, just get an iPhone 4. If you really want an Android phone, go with a different carrier."

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (2, Insightful)

dkleinsc (563838) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195818)

I'm no fan of Microsoft, but I'm also not one to judge a technology on its first day or first week of sales. For one very specific reason - nobody's used it for any significant length of time yet.

It takes a while to determine if some technology is really really nice, or a complete piece of crap. If you base your judgment on a slick demo plus 5 minutes of use, you're in fact no better than the infamous PHB who decides to use some horrible technology due to a really good sales pitch. Admins generally need a good 6 months to figure out whether something is really easy to manage, and consumers generally take a while to discover the nooks and crannies of a phone or software or anything else.

And this goes both for the good and the bad. For instance, users might be pleasantly surprised to find out that the developers actually knew about some rare but possible situation and had done the right thing (the Nethack dev team is notorious for doing just that). They might also find out that something that they actually do a lot was more annoying than they thought.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (2, Interesting)

je ne sais quoi (987177) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195828)

I disagree, I don't believe 40,000 is a "okay" day. I don't know anything about the number of these phones that are out there, but I what I could find briefly is for distributors so far are AT&T [microsoft.com], the same company that is providing service for the iphone, amazon [amazon.com], the world's largest on-line distributor, AND Best Buy [dailytech.com] a huge brick-and-mortar chain of stores. Between them, they sold 40,000 units whereas the iphone sold 270,000 [socialmediaseo.net] for the same period, almost SEVEN times as many and just from Apple and AT&T stores/on-line.

You can argue that sales will pick up after Verizon starts carrying it next year and once natural turnover will force people to buy new phones, but I'd put it as 50-50 that this is the highest rate of sales that they'll ever see with this OS and that from here on out it's downhill. While I don't think this will be another Kin that will get pulled from the shelves in a few months, they haven't made nearly the impression they need to in order to get any sort of widespread awareness of the public that this is a useful thing to buy.

For the record, I don't own an iphone, nor do I text, nor to I patronize the apple store with any regular frequency.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (2, Interesting)

je ne sais quoi (987177) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195904)

One thing that I forgot: As far as I can tell, these numbers neglect pre-orders. For the iphone, if you include pre-orders I think it will only increase the gap because they're surely above the one million mark.

I think if you want to make a penetration into a crowded market, you've got not just do as well as the competition, you've got to do a lot better than the competition. Remember: cell phones and mp3 players were supposedly a "crowded market" too when Apple released theirs.

Re:While I agree it's not as good as... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195914)

not bad, if you consider 50,000 of those went Microsoft employees.

Far too early to say (5, Insightful)

MrHanky (141717) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195514)

At this moment, declaring Windows Phone 7 a flop is just FUD.

Re:Far too early to say (1)

zombieChan51 (1862028) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195948)

Ah, I see you got modded down -2 for Disagreement.

I do agree, we should wait at least until spring 2011 before decarling if it's a flop.

Wait, we're comparing one *day* to six months? (5, Insightful)

JSBiff (87824) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195530)

Another fabulous slashdot article summary - comparing the sales on the first day of the WP7 phone with 6 months of sales for the G1? Seriously? I'm no Microsoft fanboy (I've got a G1 sitting on my desk 8 inches from me right now), but c'mon. It would be much more interesting to know how many G1's were sold the first day, the first week, and the first month, and compare that to WP7.

Re:Wait, we're comparing one *day* to six months? (3, Informative)

UnknowingFool (672806) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195770)

Well a few things to put into perspective. 40,000 is the reported number by a third party. That number may not be correct. The actual number may be higher or lower.

The second thing is that the G1 was one model from one manufacturer. By reports, there were 9 WP7 phones from several different manufacturers. Initially there were reports that some places were "sold out". If the number is correct then there was not a large initial supply. With 9 different models, it's hard to believe the manufacturers released less than 6,000 units per model.

The discrepancy might be that MS has reserved one for every one of its employees. So that 90,000 additional and may have created an artificial scarcity not driven by consumer demand.

Re:Wait, we're comparing one *day* to six months? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195888)

Yes, how can they compare the launch of the WP7 platform with 10 different handsets [engadget.com] to the sales of a single Android device? Seriously?

Actually yes... (1)

sapphire wyvern (1153271) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195548)

I *do* know someone with a Windows Phone 7 phone.

It was bought for them by their work.

Do I know anyone who has bought one by personal choice? Not yet...

Re:Actually yes... (1)

miffo.swe (547642) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195762)

Thats the same for people i knew that had Windows Mobiles, all of them got it from work. Every single one of them hated Windows Mobile with a passion, even the really die hard MS fanboys.

Those people are not going to be happy getting the same crap all over again in their lap.

Really? (0, Troll)

ProppaT (557551) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195556)

TMobile sold out of the HTC HD2 within hours of launch. What more do you want?

WP7 looks promising, but it's not going to make people cancel contracts to jump over to AT&T or TMo to switch to the platform. I'm guessing you'll see slow adoption over the course of the next year as contracts are expiring. I think most people are taking a "wait and see" approach to WP7.

I will say this, next year when I'm in the market for a phone, it will probably be down to a WP7 phone or whatever Palm/HP has cooking up. I love WebOS, but I also love my Zune and the idea of a phone that expands on what the Zune HD has been doing is really appealing to me.

Well... (4, Insightful)

nametaken (610866) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195558)

Say what you will about Microsoft but I don't think they actually had expectations of the things flying off the shelf in the first few days. They know they're re-entering a brutal market with a lot of very good products and very strong competitors.

Re:Well... (1)

UnknowingFool (672806) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195836)

Maybe privately but publicly, by some reports, MS is spending $400 million on the WP7. With that kind of money, you'd think they could get more than 40,000 on opening day if the number is correct. One analyst has said the problem might be they launched on Monday instead of Friday or Saturday which is against the prevailing wisdom. This weekend's sales might be more indicative.

The score here... (1)

FlyByPC (841016) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195564)

Half a dozen people with iPhones, at least nine friends and family with Androids (including me), and nobody with Windows Mobile since we went from the HTC Moguls (WM6.1) to Epic 4Gs on launch day (8/31). The Mogul was a good phone, but the Epic (and Android) blows it away. From what I've seen of Microsoft's latest mobile OS in their commercials (large, white-on-blue buttons for a few categories, to start), I'm not interested. It looks like one of those large-button old-school phones. I'm a techie and a fan of open source, so it's not surprising that I enjoy using the Android OS. What was pleasantly surprising is how easily my parents (competent Windows users, but not true geeks) have picked it up and are enjoying it.

Re:The score here... (1)

js3 (319268) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195616)

They are hard to get. On tuesday nobody could find one, most stores don't even know when they will get them in stock, even if you ordered they won't arrive until next week. Too early to conclude anything. I attended an MS conference on tuesday and they only had like 4 in total.. and there where hundereds of people there including MS employess.. can't find em, can't buy em.

I don't understand it (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195566)

I don't understand it either. What happened to Microsoft? They were very innovative in the 90s, and then after XP it appeared that all they wanted to do was sit on their ass and do nothing. It culminated in Vista. The development cycle for what would ultimately be Windows 7 was gigantic if you compare it to the rest of the industry. And just now they are releasing a new smart phone OS? How can a company of that size grind to a total innovative halt like that?

Re:I don't understand it (2, Insightful)

dc29A (636871) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195750)

They were very innovative in the 90s

Can you name a few innovative products from MS?

Not enough units (5, Informative)

TheBiGW (982686) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195582)

Apparently most stores only got 10 or so units and they sold out immediately. Pretty hard to sell more units of something if you don't have the stock.

Re:Not enough units (1)

miffo.swe (547642) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195704)

Well, it was next to impossible to buy an Android phone when they launched, anywhere. In stores they didnt come until more than a year had passed after the release here in sweden. The difference was that there was a big demand for Android phones where people wanted one since they was announced, without any campaigns at all being done.

I suspect the reason Microsoft shipped so few was that they wanted to build a perception that there was big demand and it backfired at them because there was next to nil demand in reality.

On the contrary, it's a great success (1)

Huntr (951770) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195590)

The commercials say WP7 phones don't make you want to use them extensively. It's true, I skipped buying one!

was expected (1)

mehrotra.akash (1539473) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195594)

In WP7, to a large extent they have copied all the shortcomings of the original iphone OS.
From what I've heard, it doesnt have true multitasking, proper copy paste, app installations from non trusted sources,etc -- similar shortcomings like the original iPhone
Its almost as if they tried to copy iPhone , but copied the original one rather than iPhone 4.
Also, why is this in the Apple category??
And /. is giving me "unknown error" for submission. Any ideas why?(missed getting 1st comment :( )

Failed launch (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195600)

Maybe its due to the fact that theres handset shortages everywhere and partner staff were not trained correctly, their canadian launch was abysmal, i have not seen any adds on tv for it at all here in canada, theres no advertising in their launch partner stores like telus, bell and rogers, on launch day the only store that had anything in ontario was telus flagship store in toronto and they only had the htc surround which almost no one likes, i called several telus stores in london ontario where i am, and most dident know when they were getting them, they received shipment on the second day of launch but

so far were on the 4th day and the lg optimus 7 is nowhere to be found, acording to posts on the net the situation is the same at bell and rogers with staff either not knowing what windows phone 7 is or not very interested in selling it, so it sounds like ms at least in canada is not pushing its launch partners to get any displays out or doing a very good job in getting interest going, but hey just last night alone i saw 5 kinect adds in one hour, that speaks where their priorities lie.

I reluctantly admit it looks pretty fine.. (3, Informative)

delire (809063) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195602)

I have an N900, run GNU/Linux at both home and work and will probably by an HTC Android phone sooner than later. Nonetheless the UI on the Windows Phone 7 looks pretty lovely to me. I think MS has done a fine job.

The question these days of course is not what the phone can do OOTB, but what you can install on it later. AFAIK there isn't much of an 'app ecosystem' for the platform. They're also charging device manufacturers a license fee to ship with the OS, which isn't smart in a world rapidly flowing with Android phones. I wouldn't ring the death bell just yet though - it seems the market's changing pretty fast with the iPhone losing it's fashionable appeal here in the EU now that road-workers, plumbers and unemployed single fathers have the things.

Market differentiation allows for consumer individuation - something Apple's aesthetic homogeneity, doesn't offer. Think Similar (TM).

Re:I reluctantly admit it looks pretty fine.. (1)

gmuslera (3436) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195916)

If you got used to the N900, trying a windows phone the "but i can't do this things at once?" question will hit your head like a brick the first day...and it will bleed. You have the wrong culture to enjoy those phones now, would be like putting a few nice toys inside a baby cage

Science, I say Science again! (4, Insightful)

dwightk (415372) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195618)

I love the comparison of First day :: Launch Weekend :: First 6 Months

Give it away (1)

digitaldc (879047) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195632)

The smartphone market is flooded and the Win7 phones are too late and too expensive.
Microsoft would be smart to subsidize the cost of the phones (which are only on AT&T and T-Mobile) and give it away for free. Then, it might make an impact.

Re:Give it away (1)

rwrife (712064) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195800)

They're the exact same price as every other smartphone. But I agree, they should try to undercut the competition.

Simple explanation (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195642)

MS doesnt have "fanboys" to the degree google and apple do these days, they wont line up or rush into a 1.0 release. The market is too fluid and competitive for any one now to dominate in the longer term. I think their approach will be similar to that of their Xbox consoles, nobody gave them a chance, too late to the game to compete with Sony and Nintendo are they out of their minds? etc. But they stuck with it slowly giving consumers what they wanted, features and services they couldnt get anywhere else that consumers had been crying out for and also spent zillions marketing it which probably played a larger role, yes the Xbox doesnt dominate the market, but it does very good business and thats all any company wants.. will it bomb? I think not.. I have one, but that said i also have a few iPhones and a Nexus one. WP7 is 1.0 in features and function to be sure, but it wont be forever and i like many aspects of it and am using it day to day atm over my other phones.

Better than G1 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195648)

So they've outsold the G1 if you extrapolate 40,000 per day for six months which is 7 million, greater than the 1.5 millions G1s.

Steve Ballmer's last chance (2, Funny)

Yuioup (452151) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195658)

He's on it like Donkey Kong.

Re:Steve Ballmer's last chance (2, Funny)

ginbot462 (626023) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195890)

He's moved onto barrels now?

Oh, and does that mean he has a hairy back? Eh... excuse me while I vomit into my coffee.

Not innovative, and no WOW!! factor.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195662)

I played with it. It was not innovative. I was waiting for the "WOW" factor. The only thing they changed was the interface. I don't feel it was enough to WOW me. I feel like its the same 'ol windows phone, which I use on a daily basis....

Why would anyone expect anything different? (1)

Attila Dimedici (1036002) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195674)

Why would anyone expect anything different? My expectation for Windows Phone 7 is that it will have slow uptake, but, if it is a good phone OS (and not junk like WinCE, which actually did pretty well for awhile), it will gradually increase market share with very few people realizing that that is what they are running. There will be four groups of people: "I've got an Iphone", "My phone runs Android", "I've got a BLackberry", and "I don't know what OS my phone runs". The last group will be composed primarily of those running WP7.
People aren't going to go out and buy a new smartphone just to get Windows Phone 7 on it, but they may replace their existing phone with a WP7 phone when it is time to upgrade.

It's too early (1)

madskyllz (699304) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195692)

Come on people, give it a week or two. Not all movies are #1 after the 1st box office weekend. Sometimes it takes a while for them to catch on.

Our DBA picked up the WP7 on launch day, and after I played with it for a few minutes, It's very cool. Without going into the pros/cons, I'll just say I was very impressed with the screen's crispness, and the fluidity of the phone's interface. The WP7 is late to the game in a crowded market, but other products (Chrome browser, for example) have made headway...just give it some time before calling it DOA.

Disclaimer: I'm not a MS fanboy, but I am a .NET dev, so of course I lean toward MS products. I've never owned an Apple product other than the IIe, and I'm a proud Android owner.

To Answer CmdrTaco's Question... (1)

Jizzbug (101250) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195724)

Yes, I do know someone who got the phone, he loves it and has been raving on facebook about it...

Also, it's "me neither"...

Time will tell (1)

ovette_pta (1930698) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195730)

These days Android is so promising that so many apps are available for you, you cant risk buying the new release WP7. I think they still need to prove there competitiveness now that Apple and Android Phone has well-established their names on this category.

http://www.pathtoasia.com/jobs/ [pathtoasia.com]

_

I still want it in PDA form. (3, Insightful)

DdJ (10790) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195738)

If I could get one of these in a PDA-like form instead of phone-like, for under $300, I'd get one, if for no other reason than compatibility testing, development, and the XBox Live integration.

But I am not going to replace my phone at this time.

And that's a real key point to remember, there. Unlike many consumer electronic devices, there are huge barriers to getting a new phone as soon as it comes on the market. Contracts to not all expire at the same time. Check for sales numbers on the 2-year anniversary of the release of previous popular phones (like the iPhone 3Gs for example), and check for sales numbers after a full year of peoples' contracts expiring, and then we'll talk.

Myself, I have no idea if WP7 will succeed, but I think it's got a shot, especially if they take certain actions that they haven't taken yet (eg. extend the "indy marketplace" concept from the XBox to WP7, and STOP PUSHING ZUNE BRANDING SO HARD).

Who bought half a phone? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195752)

a million and a half G1 Android phones being bought up by T-Mobile subscribers

Who's the unlucky sap who bought half a phone?

That's because people remember the past versions (2, Interesting)

plastick (1607981) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195754)

People are not excited because past versions of their OS have had such serious issues, that why would people want to put themselves through that again?

I knew so many people that switched to Android, the Palm Pre, and the iPhone from a Windows Phone because they got tired of rebooting their phone on a daily basis.

Why is this here (1)

atari2600a (1892574) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195776)

I'd hardly call it news. I can guarantee anyone here expected it to flop like a fish w/ it's head cut off & tossed into a desert within the first week on the market, like that other retarded phone Microsoft launched. Seriously, who would buy a phone with no SDK (= no apps)? Furthermore, simply purchasing this pseudo-smartphone would be an (unwise) investment of at least a $15 data plan for at least 2 years, or $300! Why not get a fully POSIX-complient phone while you're at it, then!? Hell, most embedded electronics are these days!

Me either? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195784)

Yes, because that makes perfect sense.

Try "Me neither."

[/englishpedantry]

Several People... (1)

rwrife (712064) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195788)

I know several people and all of the surrounding stores were sold out in a few minutes after going on sale.

Every one can be reflashed with Android (1)

phonewebcam (446772) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195798)

Shows the faith the manufacturers have in them, although its pretty obvious if you've just invested the eye-watering costs of setting up the manufacturing facilities you'd make sure it was so anyway. Look at the ranges from the initial players, HTC, Samsung, LG etc - turned off, there's nothing between their WinPhone 7 and Android models.

My buying experience (5, Informative)

plasmana (984377) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195806)

I arrived at AT&T 10 minutes after they opened and they were sold out the 4 phones they had. I was the first person to get on the waiting list. There were 5 people behind me waiting to get on the list. They did receive one more phone that day and I got it. I suspect the demand was higher that day than the available inventory. As for the phone, I love it. Showed it to my wife and kids (14 & 16). The kids raved about it, and my wife (not a technology nerd) was surprised she like it so much versus her iPhone (3G). The UI is very slick, usable and responsive. This is not your typical Microsoft version 1 product. It feels a lot more like it came from a first class consumer electronics company than a business software company.

Maybe they need a catchy slogan.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195846)

Like:
BSOD: Don't leave home without it!

or

Abort, Retry, Fail - WP7 gives you options!

Little Early to Speculate...? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34195884)

My god it's only been 3 days!

Blotchy blocks... (1)

defaria (741527) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195930)

Bunch of blotchy blocks - I don't get it. The commercials are cool though but if you're not really looking at or using the phone then would you judge it as successful? I guess sales are all that matters.

Why Microsoft is in trouble... (1)

QuietLagoon (813062) | more than 3 years ago | (#34195942)

With visionaries like this [longbets.org] working in Microsoft research, it is no wonder why Microsoft keeps missing the next big technology wave.
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