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Microsoft Looking Into Windows Phone 7's 'Excessive' Data Use

Soulskill posted more than 3 years ago | from the time-to-rethink-the-refresh-internet-button dept.

Microsoft 401

phands writes "A few users are complaining that Windows Phone 7 is eating data plans alive. One user estimates idle data usage at 3-5 Mb per hour. Not good for a phone which seems to be struggling against Android and iPhone."

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what about excessive first posts? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830596)

suck it, faggot!

Can't believe they released this shit (5, Insightful)

whong09 (1307849) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830620)

Seriously, does no one do field testing anymore?

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830652)

Sadly, Microsoft has always let their users do this. :(

But, you're right ... How could you NOT know this? That's bloody ridiculous ... I bet a lot of users are getting utterly hosed by this.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (2)

nurb432 (527695) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830662)

Sure they tested, but they had unlimited corporate test accounts so they didn't really care..

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (4, Informative)

digitig (1056110) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830968)

That probably is right [stepto.com] .

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831406)

So a guy is a web site reality distortion field is commenting about the redmond reality distortion field.

Do /. a favor. Never link to this site again. There are enough intelligent people who choose not to attack others through web sit design that we do not need to patronize those who do.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (5, Interesting)

Threni (635302) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830674)

They released the Kin. Apparently they don't do market research either.

It's probably just the phone sending periodic screenshots back to base so they can keep an eye on what you're downloading or something...

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830676)

Seriously, does no one do field testing anymore?

Testing is hard. It's really easy to miss something. Apple found that out about antennas; since their real-world testing had the phone in a locked plastic box to conceal its identity, they didn't see the effect of holding the phone on reception.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

whong09 (1307849) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830712)

OK but how hard is it to take the phone through normal use case scenarios while monitoring things like data usage, battery drainage, memory leakage?

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (5, Informative)

John Hasler (414242) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830754)

> ...how hard is it to take the phone through normal use case scenarios...

Easy, when you let the customers do it for you.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

TrancePhreak (576593) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830762)

It can be very difficult. The signal to the tower can cause battery drainage as the communications chip in the phone ramps up power to compensate. Not to mention a number of things can interfere with the signal and cause this condition.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (2)

John Hasler (414242) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831122)

if you actually know what you are doing (and care) you don't do this sort of testing by wandering around the campus saying "Can you hear me now?". You make actual measurements. There are instruments designed for this purpose. Of course, actual engineers are needed to design the tests and interpret the results, which may be the problem.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (4, Informative)

Kitkoan (1719118) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830814)

About how hard it was for Apple to the their iPhone 4 through normal use case scenarios for things like antenna reception. Sometimes random things are missed, mixed with what was the testing area like? Might have caused unforeseen fixes (a la iPhone 4 was tested near a cell tower if I remember right, why they missed the antenna reception issue.). Also, it seems most of the complaints are from US users, not global users so it could be something up with how the US carriers are handling the phones, which wouldn't come up in a normal use scenario. Maybe US carriers are trying to ping the phones and the pings are accidentally sending more information then they should?

On a completely side note, is it just me or does Ballmer look really haggered and worn in that photo? Maybe all is not going well for him at Microsoft and its really starting to wear on him?

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (0)

Saint Stephen (19450) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830916)

mod parent up

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (2, Insightful)

hobo sapiens (893427) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831064)

as a software developer, I could see how Apple might have missed that. Mind you, it was a boneheaded move and even more boneheaded was to deny it once it became obvious. I guess the Reality Distortion Field really exists at Apple.

But this, these guys at MSFT aren't even trying. It's sad that companies like MSFT are rewarded with success when it's clear then are just completely phoning it in (pun intended). Though, I do think the Windows 7 Series Millenium Extra Plus CallsForSure Super 7 Series Phone (or whatever they are calling it now) is doomed to fail. For the record, I'll state it here. It will be about as successful as the Zune. Remember those? The Windows phone will have a few rabid followers, and the rest of us who snicker when we hear reports of it being pwned by Ukrainian botnets.

If a Reality Distortion Field exists in Cupertino, then an alternate reality machine exists at Redmond, one where mediocrity is excellence and complete failure is good enough.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (3, Insightful)

Kitkoan (1719118) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831184)

If a Reality Distortion Field exists in Cupertino, then an alternate reality machine exists at Redmond, one where mediocrity is excellence and complete failure is good enough.

That's pretty much true in any business though. It's part of moral boosting, to make people think and act like they are building a great product during the fact. When it happens, they will still pat themselves on the back, helps their workers keep trying because if you don't you'll either be left with mopey, useless workers or people who quit. Neither one is good for the business and it's a big part of a managers job to prevent it from happening. Businesses that don't do this tend to fail and close up pretty fast.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (3, Interesting)

darkpixel2k (623900) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831270)

When it happens, they will still pat themselves on the back, helps their workers keep trying because if you don't you'll either be left with mopey, useless workers or people who quit.

...wait. You want workers who design crappy products to quit? That's a novel idea. Next you'll be suggesting that they replace those crappy workers with employees that are actually competent enough to design a good product...

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (3, Interesting)

sjames (1099) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831304)

If you reward failure you'll get more failure. If you want to maintain morale, tell the team you're sure the next project will go better and that failure is an essential element of later success. You do NOT tell them that was perfect and keep it up.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (2)

erroneus (253617) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830766)

Apple couldn't test it! They were too busy trying to get their test model back after it fell into the wrong hands! Yeah... that was pretty bone-headed too... even worse to claim "you're holding it wrong." I think someone's turtleneck is just a LITTLE too tight.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830860)

Apple couldn't test it! They were too busy trying to get their test model back after it fell into the wrong hands! Yeah... that was pretty bone-headed too... even worse to claim "you're holding it wrong." I think someone's turtleneck is just a LITTLE too tight.

He wears a turtleneck? I thought that was part of his skin.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

ocdscouter (1922930) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831518)

He wears a turtleneck? I thought that was part of his skin.

See, I was thinking it was some kind of black sandtrout.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (0)

Kitkoan (1719118) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830954)

Apple couldn't really test the iPhone 4 antenna because they would have done most of the testing on site, which as it happens, Apple's HQ has a cell tower on site. [techmagnews.com] They wouldn't have noticed a signal loss being that close. An unexpected side effect that would be hard to have considered during normal QA.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (3, Informative)

Tiger4 (840741) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831188)

Apple couldn't really test the iPhone 4 antenna because they would have done most of the testing on site,

Then maybe they could have crossed the street. Maybe got in a van and driven across town. Called a cell phone company (like ATT for example) and tried to find out the median distance between towers, or the mean connect distance to a cell site, then tested at range. You know, FIELD testing, with some minimal technical muscle behind it.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (3, Insightful)

h4rr4r (612664) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831488)

This is total bullshit. You put the fucking thing in a Faraday cage that has a tiny little antenna in it that you can control the power too.

You don't test devices like this by just walking around with them.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (4, Informative)

afidel (530433) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831546)

Yeah and the test mules that were released into the real world were in a 3GS plastic case keeping the testers hands off the antennae. It was a classic case of Apple's need for secrecy keeping them from getting good testing data.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

erroneus (253617) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830740)

"Looking Into"? Are they saying that they don't know what their own products do??

Microsoft: Let's compete by putting a desktop OS onto a phone!
Everyone else: Will it work??
Microsoft: I don't know! You tell us!

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830812)

Maybe you should actually do some research before posting asinine comments. The only thing WP7 has in common with the desktop OS is the name.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

MickyTheIdiot (1032226) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831056)

I thought they named it that way in order to disassociate it from their PREVIOUS mobile OS disasters. I have a pocket PC and I will never trust MS with a mobile device again. WinCE and all its flavors were disasters. Why should Mobile 7 be any different?

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

exomondo (1725132) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831388)

Why should Mobile 7 be any different?

Why should? You mean why is. But in answer to your question, it's the same reason the iphone/ipad aren't unusable POS like the Newton.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (0)

erroneus (253617) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831118)

Hehe... you mean Microsoft didn't make WP7? (By that do you mean Word Perfect 7?) Windows Phone 7 has lots in common with mainline Windows. They are born of the same company that thinks it can keep its customers "wanting more" by releasing crap and begging for fixes. Those days are over with the general public rejecting both Vista and 7. (Rejecting 7 is harder since OEMs aren't allowed to sell XP any longer)

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

dwywit (1109409) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831264)

My wholesaler is still advertising XP Pro (costs more than 7Pro, though).

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

exomondo (1725132) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831400)

Those days are over with the general public rejecting both Vista and 7. (Rejecting 7 is harder since OEMs aren't allowed to sell XP any longer)

So how did the public 'reject 7'? It would seem many have embraced 7.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (5, Informative)

ludomancer (921940) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830752)

Is it that bad? Again?

I have a windows mobile phone from the generation before. I tell everyone I'm able: it really is the worst product that I've ever seen actually released. I have NO idea how it was put on the market, because it is so fundamentally nonfunctional in so many primary features... I mean that statement says it alone.

I will never touch another MS mobile product again. It enrages me that they get away with multiple shit-products. DO NOT BUY!

Are there any MS people up here? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831078)

I mean really, do they read Slashdot, hang there heads down in shame, and go and pop open a bottle of single malt and drink?

Or has MS off-shored so much that their technical people are in old textile third World sweat-shops that even the apparel people won't even use and the MSofties over there are just ecstatic getting their $5 a day coding for MS? And they don't even bother with Slashdot or any consumer site that says their product is crap?

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (-1, Redundant)

jeffgeno (737363) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831174)

This is informative? Really? Yes, Windows Mobile was slow and buggy, but Microsoft realized that and trashed it completely for WP7. It's a brand new OS that's as fast and responsive as anything out there. Your experiences and DO NOT BUY recommendation for the old OS are irrelevant.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (3, Insightful)

tyme (6621) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831342)

jeffgeno wrote:

Your experiences and DO NOT BUY recommendation for the old OS are irrelevant.

Really? Really?!? In what corrupt and twisted world do you live in where previous products and services from a company are irrelevant to evaluating whether or not to buy current products or services from that company?

What are they teaching the kids these days?

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (0)

jeffgeno (737363) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831404)

In a world where the current products are different than the previous ones and should be judged on their own merit. Or should nobody ever buy Sam Adams's Noble Pils this spring because the old Spring White was kind of shitty?

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

Gadget_Guy (627405) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831560)

In what corrupt and twisted world do you live in where previous products and services from a company are irrelevant to evaluating whether or not to buy current products or services from that company?

Surely the far more important factor is what the current product is like. A lot of the complaints about Microsoft products turn out to be from people who saw an earlier version 10 years ago and who still assume that the current version has exactly the same problems. As jeffgeno said, Windows Mobile 7 has been totally rewritten, and it should be judged on its own merits.

Unfortunately, looking at the merits of the current OS, it does come up lacking. Microsoft released this product way too early. There are far too many missing features. For instance, what kind of idiotic company produces a product that can't do copy and paste? Apple were stupid for doing this with the iPhone, and Microsoft were doubly stupid for not learning from Apple's mistakes.

I haven't played with a Windows phone to really be able to judge it for myself because from the specs it seems that this is at version 0.5 and is not ready to be used. When Microsoft release the update this year, I will test it out. I haven't been convinced by the static screenshots that I have seen, but I get the feeling that it may be more intuitive once you start actually using the product.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (5, Informative)

Rogerborg (306625) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831262)

Hah, I used to develop for WinCE and Windows Mobile. From time to time we would look at each other, exchange an "Are we really doing this? For real?" glance, then sigh and get back to our Sisyphean task.

It was always blindingly obvious that the chaps who developed the WinCE line did so on simulators on their desktops, not on actual phone hardware. The WinCE line has never, ever been designed for actual mobile use.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831454)

I did the same for many years. I know *WHY* they did it on sims. The hardware was not up to the task of actually running that POS os. Never mind activesync is the biggest POS software.

I also met over the years many of the guys working on the low level stuff. I would goto the classes thinking 'I must be missing something'. The same people would be in those classes asking fundamental C/make problems. I would ask 'what do you do?' 'oh I write the device driver for xyz'. When I would get back home I would instruct my test teams to crawl thru driver XYZ and fix it or file as many bugs as you find. It was a seriously broken system ground up. The software to debug sucked. The drivers sucked. The build system sucked. It sucked all around. The API was not quite Win32. The hardware was 'okayish' but not up to the task of CE. There is a reason linux/iOS/FreeBSD is eating MS's lunch in that market. The tools are better to use, and the APIs are actually 99% the same. There is a reason MS is in a dominate position on the desktop. The visual studio tools are way better than what everyone else has. In the mobile market the tools blow ass.

Balmer may scream 'developers' but they make some dreadful mobile dev tools. Its like they actually want to punish us to use their software. It may be better now. But a couple of years ago it was pretty pitiful.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

slaingod (1076625) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831268)

Worked fine for my for years and years, starting pre-phone with the Compaq Aero, thru my last phone the XV6700. It was either that or Palm, which was a comparable product. Neither was exceptional but they def worked.

I do have a Droid now tho, since the day it came out on Verizon. Not saying MS didn't squander an opportunity with it, but it did work.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (0)

miknix (1047580) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831290)

have a windows mobile phone from the generation before. I tell everyone I'm able: it really is the worst product that I've ever seen actually released.

I share the same thought. My experience with Windows Mobile was so bad that I bought a Alcatel OT-106 and have absolutely no intentions of buying anything superior.
I just didn't sell the Windows Mobile phone yet (HTC Wizard) because I could join a development team that is porting Linux into it. http://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/linwizard/wiki [sourceforge.net] Seriously, the phone even has a qwerty keyboard! How is it possible that Microsoft messed up so bad?

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (2)

jellomizer (103300) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830864)

It is part of their key feature that they advertise over android and iPhone. The ability to look at your phone and see realtime updates without loading an app.

Unfortunately in order to get realtime updates. That needs data to be sent to the phone even when you don't need it.

That is why iPhone pushed it's push notification. As well as it's psuto multitasking. To keep it's customers safe from killing their plans.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (4, Informative)

jeffgeno (737363) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831102)

That's simply not true. Windows Phone 7 does the same kind of push notifications iOS and Facebook updates only come over automatically for the couple people you have pinned on your screen. I've had one since launch and used 500MB the first month and 450 the second. I have no doubt a few users are having problem (likely leaving the Feedback option checked and their email) but it's not a widespread problem by any means.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831138)

They're just holding it wrong...oh wait...

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

Gerzel (240421) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831180)

They did. The phone successfully phoned home and did all the updates they thought were necessary.

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (2)

sjames (1099) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831226)

OMG! It compiled! Quick, ship it!

Re:Can't believe they released this shit (1)

exomondo (1725132) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831368)

Seriously, does no one do field testing anymore?

Seems quite far from a platform-wide issue.

This is M$ pre SP1 is the field test (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831428)

This is M$ per SP1 is the field test

The Way of Windows (5, Funny)

lymond01 (314120) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830628)

It's the normal tracking mechanisms of any cell phone: maps, GPS, app updates.

Windows 7 Phone just sends it in powerpoint format.

Re:The Way of Windows (5, Funny)

rsborg (111459) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830658)

Windows 7 Phone just sends it in powerpoint format.

Using PPTP (PowerPoint Tunneling Protocol)

Re:The Way of Windows (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831154)

sure dude. Android is great for tracking. especially because I disabled GPS, didn't allow maps' services to run (Latitude; etc), and don't allow automatic updates. oh, and that other little minor thing: using iptables to block network access for all programs.

I bet the installed apps even magically bypass their manifest-specified permissions which limit apps like Market from reading random data about you. hidden APIs right? maybe you could tell me what those are; I've actually read much of the Android source code when looking for ways to non-root hijack a Motorola system service. Android's Dalvik sandboxing model is pretty fucking tight.

gosh i'm terrified now. you couldn't just be making a totally groundless statement to spread FUD, right? that wouldn't be like Slashdot at all.

Maybe it's the (2)

armer (533337) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830650)

damn viruses...

Re:Maybe it's the (1)

rvr777 (1082819) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830690)

imagine all those zombie cellphones... now the will actually be able to move.

It takes a lot of data... (1)

dakkon1024 (691790) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830678)

to monitor someone's soul.

Thought there was no "idle" mode... (5, Interesting)

Kenja (541830) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830706)

Wasn't the whole point of these new phones all the little windows constantly being updated with the latest Twitter, etc data?

Windows phone 7 viruses (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830714)

It's the windows phone 7 viruses and trojens phoning home... You'll need to wait for next month's announcment of Norton anti-virus to help deal with the disaster phone.

This is by design (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830718)

At the recent Microsoft TechEd, pretty much all of the Windows 7 talks and tutorials were about how cloudy Phone 7 was and how it just used Facebook and all that other stuff directly and so on and so forth.

I asked a couple of different people whether this would mean it would chew a bunch of bandwidth, and the impression I got was that (to paraphrase) "Pretty much everyone is going to have decent data plans these days anyway, so we don't think it's a problem".

The Windows 7 phone is chatty by design, I think they just expect data plans to catch up with it's usage until it's not a problem any more.

Re:This is by design (1)

Frosty Piss (770223) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830972)

The Windows 7 phone is chatty by design

In other words, it's just the Kin rebranded... Yup.

Re:This is by design (1)

GoochOwnsYou (1343661) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831074)

In Australia we havent even got decent dataplans, its all between 20Mb to 500Mb. The 1Gb & 2GB plans are hideously expensive.

Re:This is by design (1)

h4rr4r (612664) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831140)

*sunglasses*
That sounds Criminal!
yeeeeaaaaaaaaah!

Re:This is by design (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831224)

That is absolutely incorrect, at least for metropolitan areas. My plan recently went from 400MB to 2GB a month with a reduction in my monthly fee.

You can get a free Android handset (Samsung Galaxy S) on a AU$69.95 plan with 2GB of data and over $700 worth of credit every month.

Re:This is by design (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831236)

telstra have a 49$ cap with 1GB data included, not really hideously expensive. Plus their coverage is probably some of the best in the world.

Re:This is by design (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831344)

We do seem to be improving in that regard.

Telstra (of all people) recently upgraded my $49/month plan (HTC Desire default plan) from 200Mb to 1g with no additional cost.

Re:This is by design (1)

exomondo (1725132) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831432)

In Australia we havent even got decent dataplans, its all between 20Mb to 500Mb. The 1Gb & 2GB plans are hideously expensive.

Really? You actually consider $49 per month to be 'hideously expensive'? That's not even just data, that's voice and sms too. For $59 you can go with Optus and get 2GB of Data, something in the order $500-$700 of calls and unlimited SMS...im not sure how you can consider this so far out of the range of affordable.

Re:This is by design (5, Interesting)

PhrostyMcByte (589271) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831196)

You're right. Windows Phone 7 is very cloud-focused -- so much that they didn't bother to expose the APIs for local databases. The data usage is definitely going to be higher than other less-connected devices. My best guess is that these people might have unrealistic expectations as to the amount of data these services use and are getting excessive push notifications, either from having too many live tiles or just ones that update too frequently. Next to that, a live tile might be crashing and perhaps the phone is sending debug information back home. The reports of using 3G even when wifi is available are interesting though, and suggest there might be another problem.

That said, in my experience it still doesn't use a significant amount of data. I have a Windows Phone 7 device, and am using a lot of those cloud services. Instant email sync for two accounts (one fairly high-traffic), twitter, a few other live tiles, and the tracking service that occasionally wakes up GPS to ping MS with your location in case you lose your phone. When I'm at home it all goes over wifi like it's supposed to. I'm about 2/3rd of the way through my billing cycle and I'm still very very far under my bandwidth limit.

Re:This is by design (1)

Platinum Dragon (34829) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831202)

It's going to suck mightily for them if unlimited data plans go the way that unlimited home broadband plans are, and if the end of network neutrality makes it possible to charge extra for packets exchanged with a site owned by a company that hasn't signed some kind of deal with your ISP. That cloud stuff's not going to seem so neat when a user has to pay extra fees just to use basic features of their devices.

Re:This is by design (1)

sincewhen (640526) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831500)

about how cloudy Phone 7 was

Cloudy, with an 80% chance of fail.

Re:This is by design (1)

Man On Pink Corner (1089867) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831532)

With engineers like that, who needs competitors?

Why does MS even try anymore? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830732)

Yes, this may sound like a troll, but I'm serious. Their devices are half-assed garbage that never should have left testing. Fuck, their game console STILL has intermittent RROD issues and STILL scratches optical media despite technologies that have existed forever beforehand to prevent that. Not to mention their OS which even though it's improved is still a massive virus-ridden, buggy clusterfuck.

MS, give it up. You're out of your league. It was fine when no one was connected and computers ran MS-DOS, but you have demonstrated time and again that you are completely incompetent when it comes to anything modern.

Hurt them with your wallets, people. Give up your 360s, don't buy these flawed damn phones, and don't even worry with MS Windows.

Re:Why does MS even try anymore? (0, Troll)

scdeimos (632778) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830936)

I hate to sound like I'm feeding the troll, but...

Microsoft doesn't even make the xbox 360: that's Felextronics. Microsoft doesn't even make the DVD drives in the xbox 360: that's LG, Toshiba, BenQ and LiteOn. If you want to blame somebody for scratched discs then blame the correct manufacturers - or yourself for moving the console while it's spinning the disc!

Microsoft is a crappy software company. When it comes to hardware they're just Badge Engineers - even the Kinect is PrimeSense technology!

Re:Why does MS even try anymore? (4, Insightful)

Fulcrum of Evil (560260) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831112)

I don't have control over which DVD drive goes in my xbox, so I'll keep blaming the company I bought it from TYVM.

Re:Why does MS even try anymore? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831464)

People bought a Microsoft Xbox. The internals and where MS sourced the individual parts are not nor should be relevant to the end user. It is a Microsoft product. It's cool to know what the internals are but the blame still falls 100% on Microsoft for puting crappy stuff insode an all in one device. If I plug in my own external drive or a non MS controller to it and they fail, that is not MS's fault.

A few users? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830736)

Everyone who bought one?

Re:A few users? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831498)

A few users.

just use a packet sniffer for 3G and see the data (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830790)

oh wait you cant

You see thats what i hate about these "smart" phones, you have no idea exactly what data is being sent over 3G and no control over it, wifi i can fire up a packet sniffer and see and block at the edge routers, but 3G i cant (without some serious hardware tools)

no wonder 1 in 2 phones (iOS/Android) are full of spyware [wsj.com] its a free for all for data mining/theft.
i'll stick with my "dumb" nokia until i can have a firewall to protect me

Re:just use a packet sniffer for 3G and see the da (1)

leehwtsohg (618675) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830900)

Droidwall

Now you can go get an Android and suffer like the rest of us.

Re:just use a packet sniffer for 3G and see the da (1)

h4rr4r (612664) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831090)

1. they are not full of spyware
2. tcpdump works fine on my android phone, I bet iptables does as well.

Re:just use a packet sniffer for 3G and see the da (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831296)

well you need a netfilter kernel. some vendor kernels might not have it enabled. most do though. community-compiled kernels always have it.

also, pure lol at gp's post. if you have spyware on android then you knew of the danger when installing the app. don't be stupid next time. or do what every enthusiast/pirate does and use a fw.

WGA (2)

Bork (115412) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830800)

Its just MS's Genuine Advantage Validation Tool making sure you do not use any illegal apps.

Re:WGA (1)

GoochOwnsYou (1343661) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831116)

Like Firefox?

Duh... (5, Funny)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830830)

That Windows Genuine Advantage isn't going to validate itself....

I've got the solution (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830872)

Put them on Verizon.

from desktopland (2)

Tablizer (95088) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830880)

If it's anything like a Windows desktop, then it's probably a boatload of security fixes.

There's an easy answer. (1, Funny)

Minwee (522556) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830898)

It looks like everyone should just get an unlimited data plan from Verizon [slashdot.org] .

I can't see anything wrong with that idea.

Easy method to HELP vs. this bandwidth issue...apk (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831038)

Try applying a variation of purpose for an idea I have already implemented on ANDROID:

http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1930156&cid=34713952 [slashdot.org]

Except this time, on this MS product, instead.

(That is, provided their IP stack is BSD derived, which it most likely is, & that dev. tools like ANDROID's ADB exist for the MS unit)...

APK

P.S.=> I mean, hey - First of all: It's YOUR MONEY & online speed + security, after all! Secondly/For example, & a single one only (because there's a lot more you can use this for)?

Using HOSTS to block out adbanners & such alone would cut a huge hunk out of the bandwidth usage!

(Let alone security ideas like the one I noted above that HOSTS files are also good for. THUS? Well - You can "Cut the Chatter" to ANYTHING YOU LIKE, using that technique!)... apk

SMALL ADDENDUM/DISCLAIMER (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831182)

Microsoft Bypasses HOSTS File:

http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/04/16/1351217 [slashdot.org]

EXCEPT, of course, if this "chatter" is back to MS' own servers? This may NOT work - As it ALL really depends specifically on what/where/how this data goes to & what that article above's about from the past (& MS has been known to "bypass" the HOSTS file for various operations, especially regarding "talk back" or updates iirc, to their OWN servers...)

APK

P.S.=> This isn't meant to "rib on MS" either, because what I first wrote here:

http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1944892&cid=34831038 [slashdot.org]

?

Yes - It largely depends on that bypass of HOSTS, or not, & where this chatters' going to etc. (especially if back to MS' own servers)... apk

Why it's called Windows Phone 7 (5, Funny)

midtoad (18044) | more than 3 years ago | (#34830914)

It's called Windows Phone 7 because it uses 7GB of data per month in standby mode.

Theory... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34830964)

Microsoft: All your data are belongs to us!

Dumb question (0)

n_djinn (1883738) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831120)

So most smart phones have a 1ghz chip (just a guess) and windows XP ran well on a1ghz chip, why invent a new crappy W OS like 7?

Re:Dumb question (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831164)

Because phones are ARM and desktops are x86.
The operating systems are not compatible, not to mention that even two x86 chips can have vastly different computing abilities at the same frequency (think Pentium 3 @ 1GHz vs. Core 2 @ 1 GHz), much less an x86 and an ARM.

So yes, that was a dumb question.

Re:Dumb question (1)

jbacon (1327727) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831374)

Because XP in no way satisfies any of the requirements for a mobile consumer OS.

Re:Dumb question (4, Insightful)

exomondo (1725132) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831508)

So most smart phones have a 1ghz chip (just a guess) and windows XP ran well on a1ghz chip, why invent a new crappy W OS like 7?

Captain Obvious says: Because no-one wants to run Windows XP on their phone.

wireshark? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34831278)

Has anyone with one of these phones analysed the traffic with wireshark or similar yet?

I gotta get a WinPhone7 STAT!!1! (-1, Flamebait)

countSudoku() (1047544) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831288)

So, I can gift it to my worst enemy! Thank yous, Microshaft! Another stunning, qual-tee product for us to goof on until Ballmeister packs up and rides off into the pixelated sunset on a three-legged jackass.

Wow, just frickin' wow. I'm kinda feeling sorry for them, and the idiots who fall for the hype and buy into the Windows Everywhere World. Then again, I feel sorry for people who shoot themselves in the foot. Go figure.

MS behind everyone else again? (4, Interesting)

Platinum Dragon (34829) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831334)

I noticed the line at the end of the BBC article and couldn't believe what I was reading - does WP7 actually lack copy-n-paste capabilities? Apple took some justified shit for waiting years to include that capability in iPhoneOS. If that's for real, then WP7 deserves its unpopularity.

I had a chance to play with a WP7 device at a big box tech retailer on NYE (oddly, mere moments before getting an iPhone after a spontaneous discussion with my partner about my former piece-o-junk phone[0]). The interface was snappy, but it was pretty obvious why - solid colours, simple text. I have to wonder how well a WP7 device would operate under load with some third-party software installed.

[0] An LG Neon TE365F. Go ahead and laugh, I deserve it for purchasing such a turd.

Pride (2)

Zippy Cart (1974196) | more than 3 years ago | (#34831382)

It doesn't surprise me that a problem like this has surfaced. As several posters have already pointed out, it's almost impossible to tell what kind of problems a prototype is going to have in the field under live conditions. None of us know what the exact Microsoft (or Apple, or Google, or whoever) testing conditions are before they release a product. To be sure, a wide, varied testing protocol would ensure the best outcomes, however, these are giant corporations with lots of money, but who also have to ensure a significant return on investment. It's likely that the testing methods are at some balance point (possibly arbitrary) between cost and sample size. The flip side of this is that Microsoft's huge market share in terms of home PC users (I still call them IBM-compatibles, but that has started drawing weird looks in public) may tend to make them a bit blind in terms of quality assurance. Maybe they'll learn their lesson over time, but I wouldn't hold my breath. They are a giant steel behemoth doing whatever they are going to do. Vote with your wallets and take whatever evil you think is least.

Pop shopping (0)

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