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Verizon iPhone Could Double US Mobile Games Biz

Soulskill posted more than 3 years ago | from the inexorable-shift dept.

Iphone 115

donniebaseball23 writes "Earlier today, Verizon and Apple finally confirmed what everyone knew was coming: iPhone will soon launch on the Verizon network. The hugely popular iPhone has been a hit with gamers and game developers on the App Store, and by bringing the phone to the largest carrier in the US, the installed base suddenly could get much larger. The folks at social gaming network OpenFeint believe the Verizon iPhone impact could be immediately felt this year. 'The iPhone coming to Verizon is a highly anticipated event by the mobile gaming community,' said Peter Relan, chairman of OpenFeint. 'Adding 13 million more potential gamers on the iPhone is going to be a watershed moment for mobile gaming. I wouldn't be surprised if the US mobile gaming industry doubles in revenue this year because of this deal.'"

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Life without Apple (3, Informative)

mykos (1627575) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845352)

While I'm sure it will sell like gangbusters on Verizon, the AT&T exclusivity of the iPhone allowed the Android platform to flourish on the nation's largest wireless network.

Apple is now releasing a seven month old single-core phone against a deluge of versatile dual-core Tegra 2 devices.

Re:Life without Apple (5, Insightful)

ZackSchil (560462) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845434)

No one knows or cares what processor is in their phone as long as the interface is smooth. And iOS 4 is smooth as silk on that seven month old single core processor.

For games, all that really matters is how well developers are targeting your platform. I'd say they're doing a pretty good job of targeting the iPhone 4.

Re:Life without Apple (3, Insightful)

MightyMartian (840721) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845450)

That's what the Amiga fanbois kept saying as Macs and EGA-capable PCs were steamrolling over top of them.

Re:Life without Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34845966)

That's what the Amiga fanbois kept saying as Macs and EGA-capable PCs were steamrolling over top of them.

When it comes to games, Andriod's "just work around the garbage collector" is the OS that's in denial. People have been trying to make games in Java for 15 years and other than some random stuff like minecraft it's just not going to happen.

Re:Life without Apple (3, Insightful)

Sockatume (732728) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846346)

It's also what console gamers have been saying since the first 3D cards appeared and PCs became the more technically capable platform. Yet the home games market still doesn't seem to be in any danger of a massive swing towards the desktop, nearly two decades later. Suffice to say that specifications are not a reliable predictor for or against a game platform's dominance in isolation. What'll matter is how developer support is courted and maintained, and by all accounts that's what Apple and Google are betting the farm on.

Re:Life without Apple (0)

node 3 (115640) | more than 3 years ago | (#34852152)

Um, no. They kept saying that the Amiga had a superior processor to PCs (Motorola 68k series) and had coppers (co-processors) for sound and video which were superior to anything either PCs or Macs came with. If anything, Android fanboys are like the Amiga fans in that they are generally a geekier crowd who are completely flummoxed as to why their preferred system isn't as highly coveted by less-geeky consumers as it is with them.

Slashdot is such an isolated echo-chamber, you actually get absurd posts getting +5 for saying things like iPhone is going the way of the Amiga, or that people aren't going to buy a half-year old phone because it doesn't have some specific CPU/GPU.

Anyone who thinks a Verizon iPhone is not going to be a huge success is a fool. People who buy an iPhone buy it because they specifically want an iPhone far more than those that they buy an Android phone do so because they specifically want an Android phone. Or put differently, you never see lines for an Android phone like you do for an iPhone.

Put yet another way, iOS on only two distinct models of one distinct phone line on one (often derided) carrier has held its own against a whole armada of manufacturers and lines on multiple carriers. There is huge pent up demand for the iPhone on America's largest carrier. Sticking your fingers in your ears and crying, "lalalala fanboyfanboyfanboy" is not going to change anything.

Life With Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34854232)

I think you need to take into account the fact that the group "Anonymous" has decided to attack Apple and spread hate towards it - including in slashdot, because of their general anti-geek/nerd and anti-little-guy/pro-take-the-easy-road-not-the-right-road stance. You wont find logic or reason when people are talking about Apple. Regardless of the fact that Apple is the reason all the Smartphones and Laptops now look the way they do, and the reason Windows 95, Windows 98, Windows XP, Windows Vista and Windows System 7 look the way they do, and the reason future innovation and change will generally come from Apple.

Re:Life With Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34855760)

Yeah why don't those people get it apple might not be the most powerful and you might not be able to set it up however you want; but they invented everything first like when they made the first computer, and the first portable music player, and when they made the first smartphone, and when they made the first tablet. Everybody is just copying the all great apple who is %100 percent original.

Re:Life without Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34845506)

I have to agree, I used the Iphone since the first gen all the way up to the 3gs, all of them jailbroken. It always worked, and was intuitive and simple to use, but I hated AT&T with a passion. Compared to my previous Verizon phone service At&t was terrible everywhere, with 1 single bar on Verizon I could make a crystal clear phone call, with 3 bars on the Iphone it would still cut in and out. But even on my old iphone 2g all of the games were perfectly smooth and everything loaded pretty quick.

As soon as the Evo came out I pre-ordered the first 2 the store got, it's got some bugs and some quirks, and a lot of things are not nearly as intuitive or fluid in motion, for instance when viewing pictures in the gallery it takes 3 or 4 seconds to fully load each picture, or when typing in login boxes, the password field is often covered by the keyboard with no ability to scroll down, only knowing to hit the back button to hide the keyboard allows you to then select the password field. It's little things like this that make the Iphone much simpler and user friendly to use, it was clearly more thought out before it was even put together. But with true multi-tasking and a huge 4.3 inch screen, I wouldn't give up my glitchy Android phone to go back to the Iphone any day.

Re:Life without Apple (1, Interesting)

tuppe666 (904118) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845580)

No one knows or cares what processor is in their phone as long as the interface is smooth. And iOS 4 is smooth as silk on that seven month old single core processor.

For games, all that really matters is how well developers are targeting your platform. I'd say they're doing a pretty good job of targeting the iPhone 4.

Lots of people care. Thats why they publish specifications, and put them on little labels next to phones. When the iPhone was a smartphone competing against feature phones it didn't matter - or phone with pinch and zoom...or the amount of applications that it had. It matters more because people are on contracts at Version and the iPhone is getting less attractive by the day. You have to remember that some of us have has the iPhone on Multiple carriers for a long time and still seen explosive growth of android.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

jellomizer (103300) | more than 3 years ago | (#34848340)

They publish specs next to the phone so they can try to market their phone as so much more better then the other ones.

While technically smart phones are the same as a normal computer. There doesn't have a much of a white box do it yourself Smart Phone community like they do with PCs. You cannot buy customization to your phone to make it better for gaming or better.

In the US market there is probably about 6 carriers you can choose from and they will offer 10 different smart phones each. It is easy for software makers to list out all the phones it will work well on.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

stewbacca (1033764) | more than 3 years ago | (#34851460)

They also publish specs to "check the box" for the lazy shoppers who don't want to feel like they are missing out.

Seriously, compare a Nikon and Canon equivalent DSLR. They all have features A, B, C...some have D, while others have E and F but not G. I'm thinking specifically of my dad who bought some lousy Sony camera because "it has more pixels than your Canon 1D".....riiiiiiight.

Why is it, though, that few people actually care about HOW GOOD Nikon's A is compared to Canon's A? They only care that Nikon has A, B, D, E, F.

Consumers are dumb so we get dumb marketing. If it didn't work, they would keep doing it.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

Hognoxious (631665) | more than 3 years ago | (#34853706)

Consumers are dumb so we get dumb marketing. If it didn't work, they would keep doing it.

Not as dumb as you, apparently.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

stewbacca (1033764) | more than 3 years ago | (#34853982)

Yes, because intellect and proof-reading while posting on slashdot at work are so tightly correlated.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

Tharsman (1364603) | more than 3 years ago | (#34850318)

When some one has not even heard the name of a phone, specs are the only way they are going to sell. When people have been already convinced/sold/brainwashed/decided what they want, though, specs don't matter.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

stewbacca (1033764) | more than 3 years ago | (#34851522)

When some one has not even heard the name of a phone, specs are the only way they are going to sell.

No, this is simply not true.

Watch an iPhone commercial and tell me what specs they advertise. They don't. They show a guy using (some of) the features on the phone in a way that people can understand, regardless of tech specs.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

Tharsman (1364603) | more than 3 years ago | (#34851728)

Read my whole post, it was not that long.

Repeat here: When people have been already convinced/sold/brainwashed/decided what they want, though, specs don't matter.

If you are watching an ad you are only looking at one product and being brainwashed/convinced/persuaded to like it. When you go to the store and you see 10 different phones you never heard off, though, specs are the easiest way to decide.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

stewbacca (1033764) | more than 3 years ago | (#34853752)

No I read that part. I dismissed it as blatantly biased and regurgitating it again does nothing for your argument.

The "easiest way to decide" is to pick one up and use it. Since you can't touch stuff on your tv, a good simulation of this is to have your ads have people using the product as you would be so inclined to do in real life.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

stewbacca (1033764) | more than 3 years ago | (#34851344)

"Lots of people care" is a very narrow, somewhat ego-centric distortion of a greater reality, however.

Yes, lots of people care about specs but most don't. If most people did, you could argue most people would have mostly the same stuff, because it is clearly evident that most stuff for sale can be quantifiably identified as being better or worse than the other thing.

If there's one thing I've learned in 41 years about US consumerism, it's that companies make stuff for the indiscriminate masses, not the hard-core hobbyists. There's more money to make that way.

Re:Life without Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34848506)

Smooth as silk? If silk is laggy maybe. Apple stopped caring about performance and just loaded iOS down with garbage. iOS 1.x felt smooth and nice, now trying running version 3 or 4 of the firmware -- it's a lagfest.

Re:Life without Apple (0, Troll)

codepunk (167897) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845452)

Still a wash it takes one and a half of those cores to run the dalvik vm. Native iphone application code execution speed still lays waste to even the most powerful android devices.

Re:Life without Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34845496)

Still a wash it takes one and a half of those cores to run the dalvik vm. Native iphone application code execution speed still lays waste to even the most powerful android devices

As much as it pains me to say it you have a point minus some obvious hyperbole.

Re:Life without Apple (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34845520)

As someone who has actually, and is still doing academic research in this area, I call this statement FUD, there hasn't been any proof of this statement, and DALVIK has some very nice VM "tricks" it pulls that makes it very efficient, and let alone the huge speed boost JIT compiling added to the platform, and with the native development kit (r5 if i remember correctly) of Android, you can write code for android in 100% c++ now(and output as mostly arm assembly). Just because something has the term "VM" around it, and is(can be) written in Java (then compiled into DEX bytecode, not Java bytecode) doesn't mean it is inefficient(once you take into account the added security/functionality/etc the system adds).

Perhaps you should actually look into the technology and THEN make statements randomly on the topic.

Re:Life without Apple (2)

shutdown -p now (807394) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845608)

Dalvik has been doing JIT compilation of bytecode since 2.2, so it's also native code in the end. A bigger problem there is that Java has no low-level primitive operations that can be faster with correct use (e.g. array access with no bound-checking, or function pointers, or stack-allocated user-defined types).

Re:Life without Apple (1)

mlts (1038732) | more than 3 years ago | (#34848936)

[Citation Needed]

Of course, Java will take some overhead, but the days of Java being obnoxiously slow are far behind us, especially with Android 2.3 and the JIT compiler ability.

Want to know what the Dalvik VM brings to the table over the compiled Objective-C binaries? Security. It takes a lot more hacking to bust out of a well secured sandbox, then to try to find a hole in the userland environment than it is to just run a binary. Of course, there are examples of both, but a sandbox can be tightened up.

The VM also brings architecture independence. Say IBM made a version of the POWER7 that could execute code better, using less electricity than the ARM architecture. A Linux port later, and an Android device can use that.

Re:Life without Apple (0)

node 3 (115640) | more than 3 years ago | (#34852428)

Your claims are that:

  • Java is slower than native, but not obnoxiously so. - Maybe. except during GC, and things like lack of GPU acceleration of the UI.
  • Android is more secure than iOS - Really, you're going to go with this?
  • Architecture independence - Right, because POWER 7 is destined for handsets any day now, it's totally worth the downsides...

All of your claims are about theoretical benefits, as opposed to reality in which every single thing listed is either completely irrelevant or outright worse for Android than for iOS.

Re:Life without Apple (5, Insightful)

Man On Pink Corner (1089867) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845498)

Translation: "I've never used an iPhone 4 in my life, but that's not going to stop me from telling you all about how slow and clunky its CPU is. Instead, I recommend that you buy a phone designed by an ad agency."

Re:Life without Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34846240)

Translation: "I've never used a decent Android phone in my life, but that's not going to stop me from telling you all about how slow and insecure it is. Instead, I recommend that you buy a phone designed by the Church of Scientology's marketing counterpart."

Re:Life without Apple (2)

L4t3r4lu5 (1216702) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846740)

Translation: "BZZZZZZZZZZZ People have differing opinions BZZZZZZZZZZ No one tool is the best at everything BZZZZZZZZZZZ."

Re:Life without Apple (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34847936)

Translation: "I want to be modded insightful for offering a moderate viewpoint to contrast two extremes."

Re:Life without Apple (1)

stewbacca (1033764) | more than 3 years ago | (#34851608)

BZZZZZ...he never said anything the performance of Android phones. Defending the merit of an iPhone is not the same thing as criticising an Android phone.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

node 3 (115640) | more than 3 years ago | (#34852610)

Defending the merit of an iPhone is not the same thing as criticising an Android phone.

This is Slashdot. Anything not in praise of Android is an indictment against it and all those who use it. Saying something nice about the iPhone is doubly so.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

Man On Pink Corner (1089867) | more than 3 years ago | (#34856538)

Saying something nice about the iPhone is doubly so.

And I didn't even do that! The only troll in that cave was the one that Android Guy brought in with him.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

Kildjean (871084) | more than 3 years ago | (#34850086)

the ad agency that trumped microsoft on their own playground right?

Re:Life without Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34856476)

Aaaaaannnd, there's the Flamebait/Troll/Insightful trifecta.

Re:Life without Apple (3, Insightful)

BasilBrush (643681) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845588)

Apple is now releasing a seven month old single-core phone against a deluge of versatile dual-core Tegra 2 devices.

Yeah right. Because the average smartphone user buys based on the number of cores in the CPU. Time to get out of the basement.

I guess Android must need that extra core though, because the most common thing I read in reviews of Android devices is that the device in question isn't as responsive to touches as an iPhone.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

Archangel Michael (180766) | more than 3 years ago | (#34849708)

I think part of the reason why Androids aren't as responsive is that they are truly multitasking, while Apples only offer limited multitasking. And when you overtax the multitasking capabilities of a processor, it affects responsiveness.

I have a Droid X, and I keep it lean and clean. IT is responsive as it needs to be. I use it as a PHONE that is smart, not as a smart phone. I don't have a bunch of crap running because "it can". I don't play games, don't have a billion ringtones, don't run fancy live wall paper I'll never look at. And I run task killer to keep the transient applications silent and off the processor.

The iPhone does have more "polish" than Froyo has, but its also been around longer to get more polish. I'm glad I have the Droid. Best damn phone I've ever had.

Re:Life without Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34850610)

Stop using a task killer. They're stupid. Android's multitasking engine isn't fucking retarded, nearly everything running in the background consumes no CPU and memory doesn't matter.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

Archangel Michael (180766) | more than 3 years ago | (#34850760)

I kill tasks because battery life is WAY better after using it. "Nearly" isn't "Totally" and not "nearly enough" for me. I like using without having to plug it in half way through the day.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

Dexter Herbivore (1322345) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845590)

So John Vechey, Brian Fiete and Jason Kapalka from Popcap games are about to buy themselves another mansion I guess.

Re:Life without Apple (4, Insightful)

obarthelemy (160321) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845818)

some people do get that hardware is only part of the equation. OS, Apps, Content, Ecosystem are probably more important to the user experience. Even on the very narrow subject of performance, it may be news to you, but it's not all about hardware: the OS and the way apps are written is as important, if not more, as the hardware.

Re:Life without Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34847776)

And I'll bet, despite your brilliant analysis of Android's strengths, that Android sales growth on Verizon will stop and eventually the iPhone will become the dominant smart phone on Verizon. Go figure? It will once again show that Android users, despite their desire to sneer and look down on others, are not quite as smart as they think they are and they don't understand the iPhone's appeal.

Re:Life without Apple (2)

deathguppie (768263) | more than 3 years ago | (#34848016)

I've been hearing more from people who own Iphone 3g's and 3gs's that want to switch to Verizon from AT&T then I have heard from android users who want to switch to Iphone. A lot of Android users like me have picked out the phone they wanted within the android ecosphere and are very happy with their decision.

That said, this years Iphone will most definitely have a dual core cpu and some kind of advanced graphics processor, leaving all the other Iphones in the dust, and creating the same hardware incompatible environment (old vs new) that IOS fan boys complain about when talking about android phones.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

stewbacca (1033764) | more than 3 years ago | (#34851818)

I'm not aware of any incompatibility issues with new versions of the iPhone. This is one selling point (for me at least).

Applying the shortcomings of the open Android environment to the iPhone, when the iPhone's environment is designed specifically to avoid those problems is not valid.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

deathguppie (768263) | more than 3 years ago | (#34852376)

any software written to take advantage of the new IPhone hardware will not run on the older models. This is the same issue that android faces with it's different models. No different.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

node 3 (115640) | more than 3 years ago | (#34852756)

I've been hearing more from people who own Iphone 3g's and 3gs's that want to switch to Verizon from AT&T then I have heard from android users who want to switch to Iphone.

That's exactly why the iPhone will do so well on Verizon. People aren't dissatisfied with the iPhone, just with AT&T.

A lot of Android users like me have picked out the phone they wanted within the android ecosphere and are very happy with their decision.

Not relatively speaking. Most Android users did not specifically want an Android phone nor did they weigh all the different models. Why do I say this? Because most consumers don't do this, and Android is the best, most prolific and most interesting system on all carriers in the US that aren't AT&T. If you're on Verizon, until now/next month, the choice was between a bunch of uninteresting non-Android phones and a bunch of more interesting Android phones. Now, it's a choice of a bunch of uninteresting phones and the iPhone, at least as far as the normal consumer is concerned. Geeks (such as yourself, presumably) see it differently, and find Android quite interesting. Fair enough, just not representative of the market as a whole.

That said, this years Iphone will most definitely have a dual core cpu and some kind of advanced graphics processor, leaving all the other Iphones in the dust, and creating the same hardware incompatible environment (old vs new) that IOS fan boys complain about when talking about android phones.

Not even close. Why is it, do you suppose, that you call people with a valid point of view that is verified by how reality has actually played out as "fan boys"? Given that "fanboy" is supposed to carry with it connotations of irrationality and ignoring reality, it seems Android proponents are more fanboys than iOS users are.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

deathguppie (768263) | more than 3 years ago | (#34853484)

OK if it helps we can refer to fanboys as protagonists. The point is still very valid however that there will be plenty of software written for the iPhone 4 that will not run on the older phones because of hardware incompatibility. Older phones don't have forward facing cameras or the ability to record movies or fast enough processors to handle software written for newer iPhones. That is reality.

And yes I admit I do not have any more statistical data than you do however I still don't believe that anyone who is about to plop down $100 on a new. phone and a two year contract won't shop around for their phone. Also given the fact that the initial iPhones will be 3g only is not going to go over as well as you think when 4g will be available on android phones thus year.

Having said that I think the iPhone is a well designed peice of hardware its just not the universe that apple followers seem to think it is.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

node 3 (115640) | more than 3 years ago | (#34854360)

The point is still very valid however that there will be plenty of software written for the iPhone 4 that will not run on the older phones because of hardware incompatibility. Older phones don't have forward facing cameras or the ability to record movies or fast enough processors to handle software written for newer iPhones.

"Plenty of" is overstating it much, but...

That is reality.

It's reality, but nowhere near the fragmentation like it is with Android. Specifically, I was replying to this part of your post "creating the same hardware incompatible environment (old vs new) that IOS fan boys complain about when talking about android phones." It's not the same, and in two very important ways.

First off, iPhones simply upgrade each year. There aren't multiple current iPhones in terms of supported features, just one (although Apple does tend to keep the previous model for sale at a lower price, so you can count it as two if you want, but only one current-gen model). And with the iPhone, each year they simply add more features in a progression. With Android, you have at least half a dozen of reasonably advanced "current gen" models, all staggered in their releases, all with similar but different feature sets.

The second is that if you expand it to include either all devices that can run the current OS (a very simple matrix on the iOS side, and very complex on the Android side), or just all devices ever, Android is far, far more fragmented. I don't think it's fair to expect Android or iOS to support devices from two or three generations back, but whichever way you want to look at it, the situation is far better on iOS than on Android.

And yes I admit I do not have any more statistical data than you do however I still don't believe that anyone who is about to plop down $100 on a new. phone and a two year contract won't shop around for their phone.

For the most part, they won't. If they want an iPhone, there's no shopping around, you just buy the iPhone. For non-iPhones, "shopping around" means looking at what phones your carrier currently has on their website or in their store. I highly doubt the average Android user could name three different current Android models, even five minutes after leaving the Verizon store and having looked at the different phones there. In fact, most people don't even know the difference between "Droid" and "Android".

On the other hand, the stereotypical Slashdot Android user will know not only the different models, and which manufacturer makes which model, but also the relative strengths and weaknesses between many of them, as well as which can run which version of Android, and which can't be easily rooted, etc.

This is what has so severely warped Slashdot's view of the mobile landscape.

Also given the fact that the initial iPhones will be 3g only is not going to go over as well as you think when 4g will be available on android phones thus year.

4G is of very limited usefulness right now. It's definitely something people will make hay over, but it's not something which is going to have much of an effect on iPhone sales.

Having said that I think the iPhone is a well designed peice of hardware its just not the universe that apple followers seem to think it is.

Fair enough. That's definitely not the prevailing view of the vocal minority here, which is the context in which my posts are born. I think Android is an interesting system, hackable and probably quite fun, but it's definitely not eating Apple's lunch, like so many Android followers seem to think it is.

Re:Life without Apple (1)

Dr Max (1696200) | more than 3 years ago | (#34856036)

That said, this years Iphone will most definitely have a dual core cpu and some kind of advanced graphics processor, leaving all the other Iphones in the dust, and creating the same hardware incompatible environment (old vs new) that IOS fan boys complain about when talking about android phones.

I was originally thinking the same thing about apple's next phone being a dual core but I’m not so sure any more. They may just settle for an a9 core (smaller architecture would mean significant performance increase and lower power consumption) running maybe a little faster than the current a8 with a sgx540 gpu from the galaxy s. It would mean it’s easier to adapt current ios (keeping a more compatible enviorment), a cheaper price, higher supply of hardware, and smaller size.

Re:Life without Apple (2)

stewbacca (1033764) | more than 3 years ago | (#34851272)

Apple is now releasing a seven month old single-core phone against a deluge of versatile dual-core Tegra 2 devices.

And most people (not on slashdot) don't even know what that means, nor do they care. I know what that means I don't really care.

Re:Life without Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34852792)

So all the single-core Android phones out now or being released soon must be garbage too then?

Here's a tip: If jacking off to the hardware specs is your main concern when buying a phone, you probably don't know much about technology.

Microsoft may already have lost (1)

greenreaper (205818) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845396)

I find it amusing that this blurb uses the term "App Store" in a manner befitting its trademarked status, given the immediately previous story [slashdot.org] .

Re:Microsoft may already have lost (1)

Sockatume (732728) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846564)

I would've thought that referring to Apple's "App Store" as a proper noun implies that the uncapitalised "app stores" refers to something else entirely, i.e. that "app store" is a generic term. Think of the difference between writing "I bought a thermos" and "I bought a Thermos".

Re:Microsoft may already have lost (1)

greenreaper (205818) | more than 3 years ago | (#34851162)

No . . . if they had referred to it as "Apple's app store" it would have indicated that "app store" was a generic term. Capitalizing it indicates that it is a proper noun and refers to one thing (i.e. is not generic).

Wild speculation could double slashdot userbase... (2)

syousef (465911) | more than 3 years ago | (#34845522)

...or then again it could just flop. News at 6.

Re:Wild speculation could double slashdot userbase (1)

node 3 (115640) | more than 3 years ago | (#34852814)

Yeah, iPhone is totally going to flop on Verizon...

Re:Wild speculation could double slashdot userbase (1)

syousef (465911) | more than 3 years ago | (#34856070)

Yeah, iPhone is totally going to flop on Verizon...

Who said anything about the iPhone flopping? Are you dense? Need help grasping analogies? There's no guarantee it's going to double games sales either though.

If I heard "biz" one more time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34845552)

Heads will roll.

Re:If I heard "biz" one more time (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34846174)

So, you're in the decapitation biz, are you?

Gamers? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34845948)

The hugely popular iPhone has been a hit with gamers and game developers on the App Store

I, for one, object to labeling people who play a lot of Angry Birds on the toilet as gamers. I'm not saying that Angry Birds wouldn't be a game but "gamer" has certain meaning and that's like saying "The Garfield comics have been a great hit with literature geeks". At least ever since Counter Strike 1.6, gamers have been a significant subculture that has been recognized as such by the mainstream. There has been made a distinction (even if the line is blurred) between "casual gamers" and "gamers" but people who buy a lot of game apps for their iPhone hardly even fits the "casual" category (yes, I know many of them spend dozens of hours to those games. But it's still a different group of people / different concept).

Re:Gamers? (1)

Celarent Darii (1561999) | more than 3 years ago | (#34855336)

lol

Do you really think (2)

Dr. Hellno (1159307) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846000)

That anybody was waiting for Verizon? Almost nobody holds back on something they want for 3 years because of something as insubstantial as a moderate and geographically varied difference in network quality. Maybe the install base will increase, but double? Hah!

Re:Do you really think (2)

mad flyer (589291) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846142)

Actually... Yes, having a phone on a network that actually... WORK... is quite a dealmaker for me... Here only softbank have the IPhone... And their network coverage in the sticks is notoriously bad... on some place you're better off communicating with smoke signals... Therefore I'm stuck waiting with my crap-phone on a pretty reliable network wherever I go... But it's driving me totally mad.

Re:Do you really think (1)

zach_the_lizard (1317619) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846336)

I'm one of the people where AT&T, though crappy, at least gets service to my house. If I were to use Verizon, I'd have to go somewhere else to make or receive a phone call, and that's just not acceptable. Some of my friends have the same issue; Verizon doesn't get service to their houses, but AT&T does. I bet it's different nationwide, but in this little slice of the planet, AT&T gets better service. Shitty service, but still better than nothing.

Re:Do you really think (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34849826)

Still no excuse when there are good Android phones available on said network. Does it really have to be an iPhone for you to be 100% happy? Or are you already totally mad? :)

Re:Do you really think (1)

spxero (782496) | more than 3 years ago | (#34848364)

Yes. I don't quite think it will double, but there are quite a few that have been waiting. My wife won't give up her Verizon service for anything and as a result she is very excited to get the iPhone there. When she gets one, her mother will get one so they can do facetime. Not a huge jump for gaming, but definitely one for apps in general.

Re:Do you really think (1)

stewbacca (1033764) | more than 3 years ago | (#34851928)

I'm consistently amazed that people have any feelings (let alone strong ones) for service providers. It's the phone, not the network. Well, for some people it can't be the phone because the phone only works on a network they can't access. I'm guessing this is why adding Verizon is good for both Apple and Verizon.

Re:Do you really think (1)

goombah99 (560566) | more than 3 years ago | (#34848656)

That anybody was waiting for Verizon? Almost nobody holds back on something they want for 3 years because of something as insubstantial as a moderate and geographically varied difference in network quality. Maybe the install base will increase, but double? Hah!

You must live in a city. Outside the city the difference in carriers is huge!!! AT+T won't support iphones in my area. (they actually cancel your contract if you use your iphone more than 50% of the usage in my zipcode) So yeah I've been struggling along with a jailbroken iphone on t-mobile, but that's cause I'm nerdy enough to jail break it. most people here can't do that and have been panting for a verizon iphone.

Vodafone and others on iPhone in Europe (4, Interesting)

cerberusss (660701) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846196)

Here in The Netherlands, we had T-Mobile as the sole distributor of the iPhone. Since one or two months, the other carriers offer the iPhone as well. Problem is, they don't always specify what works and what doesn't. For example Vodafone doesn't offer Visual Voicemail. I think this is a very nice feature and if it's missing, this should be well-noted. Other carriers offer them with a very tight data limit, which makes watching Youtube and the evening news, or using Spotify, uninteresting.

So I applaud the fact that this freaking phone is available but I'd suggest other slashdotters that they are careful and look at the whole package. And there's something else as well: there's a new iPhone expected around June. Wait a little bit for a discount, or get the latest model.

Re:Vodafone and others on iPhone in Europe (3, Informative)

Sockatume (732728) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846352)

Carrier support for Visual Voicemail, tethering etc. is summarised on this Apple support document. [apple.com]

Re:Vodafone and others on iPhone in Europe (1)

De Lemming (227104) | more than 3 years ago | (#34847940)

In Belgium, the official iPhone carrier is Mobistar. They still don't have Visual Voicemail, although I had a sales person assuring me they would "offer it soon." That was in 2008...

Their 30€ ($39) /month plan has a 200MB data cap (it also includes 3 hours of call time OR 300 sms messages)... 45€ gives you a 500MB cap, and 60€ 2GB.

Notice you still pay the full price (640€-750€) for an iPhone, as the phone isn't locked to the operator.

what is the math here? (2)

LodCrappo (705968) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846286)

So I see the headline proclaiming that the mobile games business could "double".

I see a quote about adding 13 million potential new gamers.

Even if we ignore the fact that some if not a majority of VZ iPhone users will simply be former AT&T iPhone users, thus causing no change at all in the size of the gaming market.. Apple moved 10 million phones in Q4 2010 alone. The installed base is pushing 100 million devices. I guess we are also supposed to forget about the even larger number of Android devices out there, and the even larger number of new Android devices being sold each quarter when we think about the mobile gaming market.. but still how exactly does 13 million new users double anything?

Re:what is the math here? (1)

zach_the_lizard (1317619) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846342)

Maybe it doubles the US iPhone install base? Still wouldn't double the mobile gaming business, considering all the Android devices out there.

Re:what is the math here? (1)

LodCrappo (705968) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846374)

i'm fairly sure there are waaaay more than 13 million iPhones in the US.

Re:what is the math here? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34846832)

The story doesn't say the number of mobile gamers could double, it says SALES might. Fewer Android users game, and a larger percentage of those that do are running free, pirated, or ad-supported games.

The piece clearly isn't about specific numbers, just substantial sales. Let's not be pedantic.

Re:what is the math here? (1)

texas neuron (710330) | more than 3 years ago | (#34848686)

Comscore Nov 2010 says there are 15,375,000 users but with Christmas sales - maybe 16-17 million now. Not sure how you define "waaaay"

Re:what is the math here? (1)

tlhIngan (30335) | more than 3 years ago | (#34849426)

I don't get it - the VZ iPhone may double the number of iPhone users, but it will not double the number of mobile gamers

The reason is simple - the iPhone sells a lot. Guess what sells A LOT MORE? iPod Touches. The iPod Touch outsells iPhone in the US for obvious reasons (no contract, for starters).

iPad is doing quite well too, but nowhere near iPhone or iPod Touch sales. Maybe a quarter of iPhone sales.

Which makes the whole "iPhone marketshare" thing kinda silly. Yes, Android phones are outselling iPhones for various reasons, but platform wise, the situation's more murkier - iOS vs Android. Even when we assume that Android outsides iOS 2-to-1, things still aren't clear because of things like how many people just buy free apps vs. paid, etc.

Either way, having both ecosystems is a good thing. I do love the ability to find pirated eBooks on the market, for example (something Apple had the gall to crack down on - dammit!). Nothing's better than finding all the Harry Potter books for free on the marketplace.

Re:what is the math here? (1)

Karlt1 (231423) | more than 3 years ago | (#34850792)

Even if we ignore the fact that some if not a majority of VZ iPhone users will simply be former AT&T iPhone users

http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9176349/Verizon_customers_lust_for_iPhone_says_survey [computerworld.com]

"Of those polled who are currently Verizon subscribers, 19% said they were "very likely" to buy an iPhone if it became available to the carrier, with another 34% answering that they were "somewhat likely" to buy. Both numbers were higher than those for either Sprint or T-Mobile subscribers."

Apple moved 10 million phones in Q4 2010 alone.

Calendar 4th quarter numbers haven't been announced. They sold 14 million during their fiscal 4th quarter (ending in September).

guess we are also supposed to forget about the even larger number of Android devices out there, and the even larger number of new Android devices being sold each quarter when we think about the mobile gaming market.. but still how exactly does 13 million new users double anything?

Study after study shows that Android users buy a lot fewer apps than iOS users. For example, from Rovio -- the maker of the most popular mobile game last year -- Angry Birds.

http://pulse2.com/2010/12/29/rovio-mobile-mighty-eagle-peter-vesterbacka-nobody-has-been-successful-selling-content-on-android/ [pulse2.com]

"Paid content doesn't work on Android".

Re:what is the math here? (1)

LodCrappo (705968) | more than 3 years ago | (#34852716)

all that and you ignored the basic premise that adding 13 to 100 doesn't double your total?

Re:what is the math here? (1)

Karlt1 (231423) | more than 3 years ago | (#34852892)

all that and you ignored the basic premise that adding 13 to 100 doesn't double your total?

I didn't comment on the basic premise -- I commented on the fact that everything that was said in the original post was demonstrably shown as incorrect.

It doesn't matter how many Android users there are to third party developers, but how many are actually willing to buy stuff. As much as Slashdotter's hate to believe that Android's "fragmentation" is not a problem and makes it a less attractive platform. The truth is different.

Again take Angry Birds -- the best selling mobile app in the world. It is compatible with every iOS device that has ever existed. On the other hand.....

There are at least 18 different phones that are not supported by Rovio, including some that were still selling.

http://www.rovio.com/index.php?mact=Blogs,cntnt01,showentry,0&cntnt01entryid=47&cntnt01returnid=58 [rovio.com]

Re:what is the math here? (1)

LodCrappo (705968) | more than 3 years ago | (#34853088)

oh.. you're just going on some unrelated rant. ok then.

Re:what is the math here? (1)

Karlt1 (231423) | more than 3 years ago | (#34853202)

Oh well, I've got Karma to burn....

"oh.. you're just going on some unrelated rant. ok then."

So exactly which part of your ass did you pull out all of your (mis)information from?

Re:what is the math here? (1)

LodCrappo (705968) | more than 3 years ago | (#34853286)

mostly this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:IPhone_sales_per_quarter.svg [wikipedia.org]

and i mistyped 10 when i wanted to mean 14 million sold in Q4. would have been a stronger point, that apple sold more phones in Q4 10 than this 13 million additional gamers the article was talking about. oh well.

Re:what is the math here? (1)

node 3 (115640) | more than 3 years ago | (#34852958)

The installed base is pushing 100 million devices.

Four months ago.

I guess we are also supposed to forget about the even larger number of Android devices out there, and the even larger number of new Android devices being sold each quarter when we think about the mobile gaming market..

There are more iOS devices than Android devices. Android has been growing faster over the past year, but iOS market share has been growing too, and with more carrier choices, iOS is going to grow even faster than before.

On to the specific topic at hand, the iOS apps business dwarfs the Android apps business. An increase in iOS devices will drive the "mobile games biz" far more than an equivalent Android device increase would.

Re:what is the math here? (1)

LodCrappo (705968) | more than 3 years ago | (#34853120)

Ok.. so there is even more than 100 million.
Stil no answer to the question: how does adding 13 to (more than 100 million) = double your market??

Out here in the rest of the world... (1)

samael (12612) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846288)

The iPhone has been available across numerous phone service providers for years now. Android is still doing very, very well...

Wild speculation... beyond wild (1)

erroneus (253617) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846356)

Recall when the iPhone was first released. A lot of people switched over to AT&T for that phone. But the iPhone isn't new any longer and many people found a more than adequate replacement in Android.

Frankly, this new iPhone vendor is just too late to the game for it to make a huge difference.

Will there be some increase? I'm sure of it. But nothing that would approach "double." Double would be wild speculation even if there were only two carriers!

old device new network. (-1, Flamebait)

luther349 (645380) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846442)

iphone has reached the end of its fad. why you think apple is letting another career have it to sell more old phones. android devices that are more powerful more open and in most cases cheaper. are taking over the market. my next smart-phone will be andoride. not just in the phone market it has revived the tablet market as well. heck they probably coulda took over the netbook world to if they hadn't wasted there time on chrome os. 2011 the year of the tablets is apon us look at all of them announced at ces. these are not the weak underpowerd windows mobile/palm devices of the old days there sporting dule cores and tigra gpus.

Re:old device new network. (1)

jo_ham (604554) | more than 3 years ago | (#34846550)

No, what's happening is that the US cellular market is catching up with the rest of the world, where we've had the iPhone on multiple carriers for a long time.

It was only the backwards, stone-age US cellular market that was "special" with the exclusivity of AT&T. Sure the other markets also launched with exclusive deals (O2 in the UK, for example) but these ended quickly and opened up the market, offering the choice of an iPhone if you wanted on, on your carrier of choice - just like Android handsets.

Re:old device new network. (2)

intheshelter (906917) | more than 3 years ago | (#34848292)

Jeez, is every android lover just plain stupid or do they have their head stuck in the sand. I know you'll never admit this, but get ready for a wake up call. Android sales will slow a LOT on Verizon and Apple will probably catch up or overtake them. Look at AT&T for an example. iPhone buries their Android phone subscribers by a factor of 10 or more. You're going through life with blinders on if you think the iPhone is on the decline. The rest of your post is just utter stupidity. Apple led the current smartphone market explosion, Google copied and followed. Apple led the current tablet explosion, Google is busy copying and following in Apple's footsteps. Sorry, but Google has blatantly ripped off Apple's ideas for the past several years. Which is good for Google, otherwise their offerings would not exist in those markets, or they would be half back perpetual betas like most of their products.

Re:old device new network. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34851038)

I love you Apple people. You're so easy. Of course iPhone outnumbers Android on AT&T! If you want an iPhone, you HAVE to choose AT&T. If you want an Android, you have choice. And who would choose AT&T?

As mentioned before, in most other markets iPhones aren't exclusive to any one carrier, though maybe not as prolific as Androids. But guess what? Android still outsells your precious shiny gewgaw. Turns out that more people can recognise it for what it is than might be expected.

Re:old device new network. (1)

DragonWriter (970822) | more than 3 years ago | (#34851318)

Look at AT&T for an example. iPhone buries their Android phone subscribers by a factor of 10 or more.

Sure, but that's because of exclusivity: if you want an iPhone, you have to be an AT&T subscriber. If you aren't committed to an iPhone, then while the specific names may be different for different networks, you can go with whatever cellular network you prefer -- and AT&T hasn't promoted their non-iOS smartphones the way other carriers (particularly Verizon) have. So, yeah, iPhone is dominant on AT&T, but there are pretty clear reasons for that that don't apply to other carriers once AT&T isn't the exclusive carrier. Sure, you'll expect that some people who would prefer the iPhone but also have a stronger concern for Verizon's network over AT&T's, and thus who currently use a different phone on Verizon's network, would switch to the iPhone. And you'd expect people that would prefer Verizon's network but have stayed with AT&T because they have a stronger iPhone preference than their network preference to switch to Verizon from AT&T. But I think it would go farther than is rationally justified to expect that with exclusivity gone from AT&T, the iPhone will be as dominant as it currently is on AT&T on Verizon's network or, even, after a couple of years to even be as dominant on AT&T's network now that people who want an iPhone have a choice of networks.

Re:old device new network. (2)

texas neuron (710330) | more than 3 years ago | (#34848660)

Apple is expanding to more networks because it apparently is out from under the AT&T exclusivity period. In other countries where Apple has gone multi-carrier - their market share has expanded. It will expand here as well. Most of the switchers on verizon will come from windows mobile, palm and blackberry since android users are still locked into their 2 year contracts. I do expect a lot of users with wait for the next model in the June/July time frame.

I don't understand why anyone would buy the VZ (1)

Scyber (539694) | more than 3 years ago | (#34847102)

iphone 4 on release next month. VZ is rolling out LTE this year, and the iphone 4 is not compatiable. VZ just eliminated its early upgrade program, so anyone who signs up now will have to wait at least 20 months before getting a new phone. Considering the iphone's are normally refreshed in June/July, why not wait a few months to at least see what the next version of the iphone will bring. Its possible only the GSM iphone will be refreshed this summer and the CDMA one will be refreshed later, but isn't it worth waiting a few months to find out?

Re:I don't understand why anyone would buy the VZ (3)

dogmatixpsych (786818) | more than 3 years ago | (#34847286)

You would think that is logical but a lot of people don't care; they just want an iPhone now on Verizon/Sprint/T-mobile. I've been reading that online for the past 3 years. Most people do not think about or not aware of upgrade cycles and the rest. Most don't care about LTE either.

unlocked iPhones (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34849806)

You would think that is logical but a lot of people don't care; they just want an iPhone now on Verizon/Sprint/T-mobile. I've been reading that online for the past 3 years. Most people do not think about or not aware of upgrade cycles and the rest. Most don't care about LTE either.

If you're near the northern border, purchase an unlocked GSM phone from a Canadian Apple store and bring it back. Just make sure your carrier sells stand-alone microSIMs.

Re:unlocked iPhones (1)

mlts (1038732) | more than 3 years ago | (#34852298)

It isn't hard to crunch out a standard MicroSIM from a normal size one.

Only caveat with this method is, if the phone has issues, to take it to a store in Canada. The US store will hand you a replacement phone... locked to AT&T.

Re:I don't understand why anyone would buy the VZ (1)

intheshelter (906917) | more than 3 years ago | (#34848328)

I think the key words that answer your question are "VZ is rolling out LTE this year". Since LTE is still pretty much scarce in the US, why would Apple spend extra money reegineering the phone for a (mostly) non existent phone network?

Re:I don't understand why anyone would buy the VZ (1)

Scyber (539694) | more than 3 years ago | (#34849190)

My question was why would anyone buy it, not why would Apple make it.

In all likelyhood, Apple is taking the same approach they took with 3G, let the network built out first. And wait for the 2nd/3rd generation radios that use less power and cost less to buy.

Double? Already on Android... (1)

Acron (1253166) | more than 3 years ago | (#34850802)

This may have already been noted before but I couldn't find it - Verizon users that may have wanted an iPhone may already have an Android phone, so it will be some time before they have the option to switch to an iPhone. I would be surprised if there were 13 million Verizon subscribers eager to have a smart phone who have waited several years without getting an Android phone instead.
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