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Sony Planning Serial Keys For PS3 Games?

Soulskill posted more than 3 years ago | from the keep-digging-that-hole dept.

Piracy 283

Stoobalou writes "Rumor has it that Sony is looking to the PC games market to help solve its growing piracy problem on the PlayStation 3 — with the introduction of serial keys to its games. According to 'a very reliable source' quoted by PS3-Sense, Sony is attempting to address the recent revelation that it failed to properly secure the private signing key for its flagship console — leading to clever tinkerers producing third-party firmware that allows unofficial software and illegitimately downloaded games to run on unmodified hardware — by looking to the PC retail market for solutions. Unlike the PS3, the PC doesn't have a hardware DRM system built in to it — despite attempts by groups like the Trusted Computing Group, formerly the Trusted Computer Platform Alliance, to introduce such a thing — relying instead on software-based DRM and a surprisingly old-fashioned guarantee of a game's uniqueness: a serial key."

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Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (4, Insightful)

eldavojohn (898314) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955466)

From the article:

Printed on the product's packaging, the key is a unique identifier that promises that the game is the real deal - and usually verifies itself with an online server

So in order to play disc games you're going to require an internet connection?

And, just as speculation, wouldn't it be possible for someone to figure out what the server is sending the gaming console as an acknowledgment code and then setup a local area network that directs the PS3's requests to that IP address to connect to your own computer and send the same key acknowledgment notification? Sure, it's more work but history has shown that just means a little more time.

This just seems implausible and ineffective on so many levels ...

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (4, Insightful)

MoonBuggy (611105) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955506)

This just seems implausible and ineffective on so many levels ...

Unfortunately that is often not sufficient to prevent a given DRM scheme from being implemented.

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955730)

This network intercept idea is very similar to how many programs have their verification cracked. usually by making hosts file edits to block access to the company's server. I feel it would be out of many people's league to do this on a local network level instead of a single-system level. It would work, but it will be harder for the average user.

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (1)

HarrySquatter (1698416) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955934)

So in order to play disc games you're going to require an internet connection?

Yeah, and? How is this new? There routinely have been required updates that one has had to get to play new PS3 games or watch Blu-Ray movies.

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (1)

mark72005 (1233572) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956028)

So you are saying that if I had an unpatched PS3 with no internet connection, I couldn't buy a game off the rack and play it today?

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (0)

Sable Drakon (831800) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956220)

That's exactly what he's saying as Sony strictly enforces the OS being up to date. Say you buy a Gen1 PS3 running v1.0 and you get any game made in the last 6 months, you'll be forced to update to (I would think) v3.2 or v3.3 before you can play the game.

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956284)

To be clear though, this only means you'd have to install the firmware update before playing. However, the game disc would have the firmware so he could still play it even without an internet connection. It DOES NOT mean that the game is not playable if you don't have an internet connection.

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (4, Informative)

zegota (1105649) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956602)

This is false. Games that require a certain firmware include the firmware on the disk.

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956100)

So in order to play disc games you're going to require an internet connection?

Yeah, and? How is this new? There routinely have been required updates that one has had to get to play new PS3 games or watch Blu-Ray movies.

Never bought a Blu-Ray but if it's a firmware update its always on the game disc, individual game updates are not required to play offline (and if you've got no internet connection you'll never know about them anyway).

So yea, requiring an internet connection to play games would be new for the PS3...

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (4, Interesting)

andymadigan (792996) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956050)

That workaround is the simplest one for DRM to avoid. Burn a public key into the game, have the game generate a random number and send it to the server, the server must respond with that random number, signed using the private key that matches the public key in the game.

Of course, Sony doesn't seem to be competent when it comes to RSA... and there's still the fact that you should be able to modify the software to remove the DRM.

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (1)

Sable Drakon (831800) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956160)

Keep in mind that they may make this whole system a part of PSN's authentication system. Meaning this workaround would force anyone using it to be unable to play their games online while it's in use.

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (4, Interesting)

ObsessiveMathsFreak (773371) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956340)

This just seems implausible and ineffective on so many levels ...

This is going to be a total disaster. Console gamers have enjoyed instant on convenience, game sharing/lending/selling, and in general a concrete certainty that the disc they hold in their hands is guaranteed to work on any console without a hitch. You cannot turn around and change all that overnight without seriously ruffling feathers. Console gamers will expect these features implicitly--it's tradition!

A recent game, Assassin's Creed:Brotherhood, came with a one time serial code which could be used to obtain downloadable content. Lots of console players simply didn't bother. The concept of typing in this alpha-numeric hieroglyph, originally designed for commercial office software, was simply alien to them. It goes beyond intelligence or capability, and enters the realm of culture and society. Console gamers simply don't work this way. This move is taking Sony into three shells [youtube.com] territory.

This isn't going to fly. This is going to crash and burn. I foresee droves of console gamers being driven to console hacking by this move. The smart option is simply to place more focus on downloadable titles, content and network features in title, incentiveising people to stay on PSN, and not bother with all that complicated geek stuff. But when it comes to consumer relations, Sony never misses an opportunity to miss and opportunity.

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956396)

Believe it or not, the PS3 already does phone home when you install new games. Though if your network connection isn't enabled it wont break anything.

This became apparent with the introduction and beta test of their 'Playstation Rewards' program, where you get reward points for installing new games. Mind you, when they say new, they mean not games that have been installed or played on other PS3s. Since they can tell when a game has been installed before, they must be already tracking game unique IDs.

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956544)

From the article:

Printed on the product's packaging, the key is a unique identifier that promises that the game is the real deal - and usually verifies itself with an online server

So in order to play disc games you're going to require an internet connection?

And, just as speculation, wouldn't it be possible for someone to figure out what the server is sending the gaming console as an acknowledgment code and then setup a local area network that directs the PS3's requests to that IP address to connect to your own computer and send the same key acknowledgment notification? Sure, it's more work but history has shown that just means a little more time.

This just seems implausible and ineffective on so many levels ...

I think it's a pretty obvious choice, no serial at all to play the game, but have a one time activation of said serial if you wish to play online. All problems solved, absolutely no issues if you plan to use the game without an internet connection.

As for figuring out what is sent, no, only one serial can be used at one time online, this is processed server side.

I thought this is all common sense?

Re:Doesn't This Require an Internet Connection? (1)

SirMasterboy (872152) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956682)

I don't think it's that easy. I have never seen someone successfully crack most PC games' multiplayer. The server simply disconnects you if you don't send them a serial that exists in their database of sold serials.

Though this system would be more similar to Steam or WoW. You have a gamer account that you add your keys to and then the system allows that account to play.

With how popular WoW and Steam are, nobody yet has managed to crack them to be able to connect and play on the real severs with other legitimate WoW and Steam players without a real serial key attached to their account.

If the mass of PC hackers can't do it on one of the most popular PC games and platforms then I don't see this happening on a game console.

Rentals? (5, Insightful)

ryanw (131814) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955500)

Lame.. what about game rentals or taking it over to a friends house to play for a few hours? NO way..

Re:Rentals? (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955596)

Get a PC in a console form factor.

Sincerely,
The Last Remaining PC Gamer

Re:Rentals? (-1, Troll)

madhatter256 (443326) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955688)

implying people take games to friends houses anymore
implying people don't play over the internet
implying you have friends

Re:Rentals? (1)

Cwix (1671282) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956828)

I do take games to others houses.
Sometimes I don't play online, in fact a lot of games I much prefer the single player to listening to 13 year olds yammer on about something retarded.
I do have friends.

Troll much?

Re:Rentals? (-1, Troll)

Duradin (1261418) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955714)

Be sure to thank Geohotz for this.

If you cheered his 'liberation' of the PS3 you can't really be unhypocratically mad about Sony's response.

Re:Rentals? (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955804)

You, sir, are nincompoop.

Re:Rentals? (5, Insightful)

chispito (1870390) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955888)

Be sure to thank Geohotz for this.

If you cheered his 'liberation' of the PS3 you can't really be unhypocratically mad about Sony's response.

Um, yes I can, because there are plenty of content producers and distributors who don't punish their customers in ANY WAY for buying their products, pirates-be-damned.

Re:Rentals? (2)

paulsomm (92946) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955932)

Be sure to thank Geohotz for this.

If you cheered his 'liberation' of the PS3 you can't really be unhypocratically mad about Sony's response.

geohot didn't enable/endorse/provide piracy. he merely exposed a flaw, and took steps to specifically release and detail it that wouldn't allow you to use it for piracy. he's a hardware hacker in the old-school sense of wanting to learn, pick apart, see how things work and make them do what he wants, just to do it.

the fact others have used his work to further piracy isn't his fault and shouldn't be blamed on him.

Re:Rentals? (5, Insightful)

countSudoku() (1047544) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955992)

Bullocks! He is a hacker hero. Period. Sony is not out to make things easier for consumers, and good people like George undo the shitheadednessness of assholes like Sony. The more you accept draconian DRM, as well as pure root kit nonsense, that Sony forces you to swallow, the more they take your freedom to do with your hardware whatever you want. I no longer buy Sony or Apple products because of bullshit like this. Also, do NOT subscribe me to your newsletter as you are consumer unfriendly, a possible DRM sympathizer, and as AC put it a "noncompoop."

Re:Rentals? (2, Funny)

synthesizerpatel (1210598) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956380)

I concur, Sandra Bullocks!!

Re:Rentals? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956090)

By that logic, we should thank the terrorists when they demonstrated the massive gapping holes in airport security.

Re:Rentals? (1)

Dishevel (1105119) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956240)

Right. No difference there that I can see.

Re:Rentals? (0)

h4rr4r (612664) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956280)

No Sony chose to do this. He is not responsible for what they do. STOP BLAMING THE VICTIM.

Re:Rentals? (0, Troll)

Duradin (1261418) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956416)

Why did Sony chose to do this? Could their system being cracked wide open and the method to do so widely broadcast have anything to do with it?

Do you wonder why a dog bit you after you poked it with a sharp stick too? Or is that blaming the victim too?

Re:Rentals? (4, Insightful)

pcolaman (1208838) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956520)

I have a feeling it's partially about piracy, and partially about the used game market. They want a bigger piece of the pie, so they want to make it much harder or impossible for gamers to trade in games and buy used games.

Re:Rentals? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956736)

Nah, I think it's because they removed functionality that was advertised when the system was released. I'd probably mod my car if the dealer decided to remove the speedometer after I'd had it for a few years.

Understand that as an average consumer, I don't bother with things like piracy unless they're worth my time. $60/game is steep, but if it's going to take me a few hours to mod my system, then I will simply keep buying the games. A move like this moves dangerously close to making it a hassle to use legitimate games. If a network connection is required every time I want to play or I have to enter a 48 character key code, then I'll mod and copy just to remove these inconveniences.

Re:Rentals? (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955728)

Don't worry, this isn't going to prevent that. It will, however, prevent you from playing the game on any console without an internet connection.

Re:Rentals? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955758)

I own 2 PS3s and hundreds of games and since the other os removal I will not purchase any more Sony products. It probably won't change anything. Changing a products features after it is purchased does not sit well with me.

Re:Rentals? (1)

TavisJohn (961472) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956008)

Or the used game market? Not going to be able to sell that game you finished and never want to play again.

Re:Rentals? (4, Insightful)

Nadaka (224565) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956512)

That is just an added bonus. Why allow someone to own a physical object when you can license its use to them instead. Every resale of a physical object is the loss of a first hand sale at full price. Personal ownership is a threat to corporate profit. Imagine the chaos if people had the same rights as corporations?

Re:Rentals? (2)

Svartalf (2997) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956616)

They don't like game rentals to begin with. Cuts into sales for them and their affiliated studios and publishers.

It should be observed, though, that if they're going to that...what difference is there other than maybe some cost savings on the unit, between a PS3 and an HTPC?

They honestly don't really want to go where they're going with all of this. It's not a pretty place for someone in the console business.

Re:Rentals? (1)

Chowderbags (847952) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956746)

They probably think that if they kill the rental market, people will have to buy games. And with no used games market, they don't even have to lower the prices of old games that much. Seems like the perfect strategy to milk the market, so long as you don't stop to think about how much this would piss off potential customers, who would go elsewhere with their dollars. (but wait, call everyone pirates and win anyway?)

OMG Now we will! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955520)

Get keygens for Playstation games... How exciting. Does anyone else think its rundant to even have consoles anymore? Really they should just make the controllers 100% functional with normal everyday PCs and just move on.

Re:OMG Now we will! (1)

wilgibson (933961) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956082)

The wired XBox 360 controller already is 100% compatible with Windows (imagine that!) and is probably the best gaming pad on the market for the PC.

Real Old School (4, Insightful)

RazzleFrog (537054) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955528)

"Enter the 5th word from page 35 of the instruction manual." Or maybe like SimCity which had the list of codes that couldn't be photocopied.

Re:Real Old School (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955658)

Couldn't be photocopied, but could be scanned in very easily at the time since hand scanners generally used a red light.

Hmmm, how would I know that?!

Re:Real Old School (2)

RazzleFrog (537054) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955970)

Who even owned scanners at the time, though? I think the only printer I even owned back then was a daisy wheel.

Re:Real Old School (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955684)

I liked the combination wheels. Monkey Island had 3 different sized circles on top of each other, rotate each one to replicate the picture on the screen.

Test Drive 3 had something similar as well....

Re:Real Old School (1)

khellendros1984 (792761) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956454)

That was Monkey Island 2.

Re:Real Old School (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955870)

Or maybe like SimCity which had the list of codes that couldn't be photocopied.

I remember that. Didn't stop my dad, though; he copied the entire thing by hand, symbols and all, the entire list. Was one hell of a lot easier to read, at that.

Re:Real Old School (2)

rograndom (112079) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956000)

I had one friend that messed with the brightness/contrast controls on a photocopier for an entire afternoon and managed to get a readable copy out of the Simcity code list. The copy also copied very well I remember.

Re:Real Old School (1)

hitmark (640295) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956744)

Odd, i do not recall seeing a simcity version that required a code.

Keygen (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955556)

So now pirates will just strip out drm , release cracks or keygens. Meanwhile, the paying consumer will suffer all these inconveniences.

Re:Keygen (1)

HarrySquatter (1698416) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955964)

How does one "suffer" by having to enter in a keycode? It takes all of 5 seconds.

Re:Keygen (1)

GrumblyStuff (870046) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956040)

If the game I bought uses a key that someone else created (via keygen) and I can't play it, I've suffered to the tune of about $60. Good luck returning disc, too.

Re:Keygen (1)

Kell Bengal (711123) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956432)

This happened to me with an EA game I bought cheap in a discount bin. Fortunately, EA was actually cool about it and after a few emails explaining the problem they gave me a replacement CD key. This surprised me a great deal because I have a low opinion of EA in general. Sometimes they will surprise you.

Re:Keygen (1)

Nemesisghost (1720424) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956120)

Unless you like dragging your PS3 around with you, then you have to buy a new copy every time you want to play it on a PS3 that is not your own. And before people say that nobody does that, I got my brother a PS3 for his house knowing that I could bring my PS3 games and play them at his house.

Re:Keygen (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956138)

How does one "suffer" by having to enter in a keycode? It takes all of 5 seconds.

That isn't even true on a PC where you have a real keyboard, much less a console where you have to navigate a virtual keyboard with the gamepad.

Re:Keygen (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956144)

How does one "suffer" by having to enter in a keycode? It takes all of 5 seconds.

Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha... I don't remember which it was, but one game took me the best part of two days to install because the stupid sods used both B and 8 in the key (and similar easily-confused characters) and in the font they used they were almost identical. I must have entered a hundred different variations on the key until I found a post on the Internet explaining exactly how to work out which characters were which.

So yes, one has "suffered" from having to enter a stupid CD key to play a game that I've paid for.

Re:Keygen (1)

Ephemeriis (315124) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956224)

How does one "suffer" by having to enter in a keycode? It takes all of 5 seconds.

Right now console games are fairly portable. You can bring the disc over to a friend's house and play on their console. Or you can sell the game to somebody else. Or rent it somewhere. This is all possible because the DRM makes sure it's a legitimate disc - but not necessarily that it is unique.

If we're going to start doing keycodes on discs, they're going to become a hell of a lot less portable.

Once you've authenticated that keycode against your console, or your online account, or whatever you won't be able to haul the disc over to a friend's house, or sell it, or rent it.

Re:Keygen (1)

smbarbour (893880) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956570)

Pray you never want to buy a Myst game for your PS3... They'd probably do something really asinine like having to enter the keycode using the D'ni alphabet and numbers.

Hah. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955558)

Sony has two problems if they go down this path:

Cracks
Keygens

And don't think they wouldn't happen.

This only works for multiplayer (1)

cforciea (1926392) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955560)

I would assume this has the exact same problem as serial key DRMing schemes on the PC: it only works for multiplayer. For single player games, you'll just get a cracked version of the game that doesn't require serial key validation, like we've been doing on the PC for more than a decade.

Keygens for Playstation? (1)

bchickens (255621) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955572)

So now were going to be using keygens on Playstation games, wonderful! It seems that consoles have become redundant, to be honest they should just push all the controllers to a home PC system and quit charging people for meager upgrades everytime they come out with a new console.

Re:Keygens for Playstation? (1)

currently_awake (1248758) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955654)

Or you could burn the key into the game disk, though that would cost more. Or you can have a console serial number and have the game register online during the install procedure (though that would require internet, bad for single player). Or you can have an online apps store, with games locked to the console. Regardless of method it's likely to be bad for selling games or going to a friends house to play.

Why is this even here?? (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955576)

When did rumors perpetuated by 4chan become news?? Someone posted this on 4chan a couple of days ago. Then it showed up on PS3-Sense and now it's on slashdot.

Lots of trolling going on....

Oh this is going to be popular... (2)

Samuraid (824799) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955594)

I don't know anyone who regularly plugs a USB keyboard into their console for any reason. Likewise, "typing" out a long number of string of characters using a controller seems exceptionally cumbersome. Also, having a serial code remains yet another way Sony can tie a specific game license to a specific console. Really, I don't see any way this could be convenient nor benefit gamers.

Re:Oh this is going to be popular... (2)

vikisonline (1917814) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955718)

Umm what makes you think any of this is to benefit the gamer? If they don't tie it down to a specific console and make it so its like old half life/ counterstrike was (only one instance of a cd key can play online at a time) or which is the same thing steam is doing now it could be fine. Then if you pass it to someone you trust with the key they can play it too. But if you give it out on the internet then it will be unplayable because you will never know when someone is on. Now the only question is whether sony can be trusted to create such an old school implementation.

Re:Oh this is going to be popular... (3, Interesting)

mike260 (224212) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956016)

PS3 games are already spectacularly inconvenient, often requiring 30 minutes or more of downloading, patching, installing and firmware-updating before letting me actually play the game I just bought. Having to type in a serial via gamepad would be the least of it.

And ...... (0)

Lumpy (12016) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955634)

The ps3 platforms dies completely in 3.......2........1

This move will utterly kill the platform.

That is a very typical move of sony... Kill things they design with really stupid decisions from management.

Re:And ...... (0)

zifn4b (1040588) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955866)

So what? Why don't we, the consumers of console gaming platforms, take matters into our own hands? Those of us that are capable of producing games independently can produce games for the PS3 platform and not be required to have their products officially signed. We, as legitimate and loyal consumers can pay them a fair price for their creations and play their great games so they can make more. We don't really need Sony or any of the big time game publishers that are using price-fixing and other anti-competitive tactics to boost their stock prices for their major shareholders, many of whom have probably never played a video game in their entire life. While we, the consumers pay artificially high prices for products to big publishers and the actual creative minds behind the games get peanuts, long hours and more stress than you can possibly imagine from ridiculous ship dates.

Re:And ...... (2)

countSudoku() (1047544) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956132)

Damn good points. Also, think of this; Sony is spending millions of dollars on securing their system, rather than improving the gaming experience on it. They are trying to build a wall around a garden that is old, uninteresting, and now outgrowing the gardener's tiny constraints. Fuck 'em. Freedom of hardware is for the consumer and Sony would only like to piss on that very freedom. You buy the hardware, but Sony/Apple tells you what you can and can't do with it? That's not consumer friendly, that's being a Software Nazi. I call shenanigans!!1!

Re:And ...... (1)

MichaelKristopeit401 (1976824) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956640)

you have yet to offer me any hardware or software for purchase. you are a nazi.

cower behind your chosen pseudonym some more, feeb.

you're completely pathetic.

Re:And ...... (1)

khr (708262) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955890)

This move will utterly kill the platform.

Well, that's one way to cut down on piracy.

That admits a lot (1)

sethstorm (512897) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955644)

Sounds like they're treating it sort of like how PC's are treated with respect to games.

So much for their hypervisor and kill-off of OtherOS.

Re:That admits a lot (1)

MichaelKristopeit401 (1976824) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956172)

read those english as a second language books again...

I really wish people would tell Sony to fuck off. (4, Insightful)

seeker_1us (1203072) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955652)

I stopped buying their stuff after the rootkit thing. By buying their stuff, people are only supporting the abuse that Sony seems to feel entitled to heap on its loyal customers.

On A Side Note if P==NP (1)

medv4380 (1604309) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955674)

If the crazy guy yesterday is correct (Probably not but IF) then will any kind of DRM really work?

Re:On A Side Note if P==NP (1)

icebraining (1313345) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955780)

DRM is a logical impossibility regardless of such possibilities. The only thing it can already do is throw a couple roadblocks to delay the crackers - it can't actually protect the content.

Re:On A Side Note if P==NP (1)

MickyTheIdiot (1032226) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955980)

Great logic. Problem is that the Peter Principle has promotes every simpleton who can't use login into a place of power.

Do I sound frustrated? It's because I am. The world, especially the corporate world, gets more and more illogical every day.

it's like sony wants the x-box to win (4, Insightful)

alen (225700) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955722)

first kinect outsells the Move by 2 to 1 or more. now they have this plan to drive even more people to Microsoft. i have both and only game on my x-box. i was actually going to buy a PS3 game yesterday, but decided against it at the last minute. crazy systems like this will mean i'll just stick to my x-box

why would anyone put up with this?

Re:it's like sony wants the x-box to win (1)

StikyPad (445176) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956718)

Ah yes, because the 360 is *so* much more open than the PS3. Oh wait, it's not. There is no jailbreak for the 360, only a DVD firmware mod to play "backups" (for which they've banned thousands of consoles, if not more). There was never an OtherOS for the 360. There's no official support for 3rd party hard drive installation. It only plays MS-approved media formats. And if all that weren't enough, they also charge a FEE for online play, Netflix access, and other "value added" services that don't cost them a penny. Their multiplayer is P2P by the way, which means they're charging you to use your own bandwidth.

I'm not blowing Sony's trumpet by any means, but the idea that the 360 is somehow more consumer friendly is absurd.

console developers are idiots (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955746)

First the console games requires peripheral disc drives (Famicom Disk System/Mega Drive), then memory upgrade (Saturn/N64), then third party controllers that only work for some titles (Steel Battalion, Tony Hawk, various music games), then web cams (Eye Toy/Kinect), then hard drive installation (eg: PS3/XBOX 360), and now SERIAL KEY? The very reason to play on consoles is to avoid needing all these 'accessories' just to play games! At this rate it will be cheaper just to get a 2-year-old refurb PCs, which would be less annoying than consoles to begin with, and with more (potential) performance as well. The same idiocy are also apply for those who develop games for consoles.

Re:console developers are idiots (3, Interesting)

alen (225700) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955814)

so how do you exactly play Dance Central without Kinect? press the buttons on the controller to move? the fun is moving your body and trying to learn the moves.

same with the music games. few weeks ago i found a $15 drum set on sale and bought rock band, guitar hero and some track packs. total cost around $50. how would i play the music games without the instrument add ons? the whole fun factor is to replicate the air guitar/drums that people play when listening to music

Hear that? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955754)

That's the sound of Nintendo and Microsoft's stocks going up. I like console games more than PC games specifically because they don't put you through this crap. It won't stop people alrwady doing stuff, just harass those of us who don't.

Keep trying, Sony (1)

Stiletto (12066) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955822)

This will have the exact same effect on copying as... well... as every scheme the industry has concocted to try to stop copying.

don't buy consoles (1)

Dan667 (564390) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955832)

you should not have to put up with something like this.

Re:don't buy consoles (1)

alen (225700) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955930)

x-box is simple

buy game, play it. it just works. and tons of older and on sale games you can buy for cheap. and you can stream netflix on it and play DVD's. much better than buying a $300 to $400 graphics card that sounds like a jet engine and sucks up electricity. and doing it all over again in 2 years and having to buy a new computer as well because the slots are now different or something else changed.

Re:don't buy consoles (1)

WeatherServo9 (1393327) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955996)

much better than buying a $300 to $400 graphics card that sounds like a jet engine and sucks up electricity.

I like my Xbox 360, but to be fair it also sounds like a jet engine and sucks up electricity.

Re:don't buy consoles (1)

alen (225700) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956130)

i have the new slim from the kinect bundle along with the PS3 slim

didn't buy the consoles new due to global warming already making it nice and warm in my home

Re:don't buy consoles (3, Informative)

Shados (741919) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956126)

My video card is quiet, cost me 110$ 3 years ago and play most games on high settings, including garbage console ports. I do have most consoles of this generation (both portable and not), and i like them better than PC for gaming, but for other reasons. This isn't 2002 anymore. You don't need a powerful PC to game, and upgrades are often unnecessary. (Heck, it looks like my Nintendo DS will have to be upgraded more frequently than my computer to get all the bells and whistles, between the DSi for the store and now the 3DS for newer games)

Re:don't buy consoles (1)

Sinistar2k (225578) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956562)

Don't buy PCs either.

What does it say.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34955868)

.. when the answer to this 'problem' is targeted exclusively in the direction of anti-piracy.

It's not like signed executables were ever for enduser 'security' anyway. Money-money-money!

And here are the keys... (3, Informative)

Maltheus (248271) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955942)

Agu4shoh dae2oCha VieGhoh2 Gairoh5a
iak6Ou7i Wu0ATeit IrohT5ee Fu2neif8
Woh5OoWo Zoh7zah0 Jong1tav OB1oliuy
Aev2az4f il9phieZ AeM0uXah ESheika3

You're welcome!

join me as I say (0)

MickyTheIdiot (1032226) | more than 3 years ago | (#34955946)

DIE IN A FIRE!

Jerks. The corporates are all jerks that hate their customers.

Come on guys! More reasons to avoid consoles? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956060)

I REALLY dislike cd-keys. I've owned many and lost the use of exactly one. I don't know exactly how I lost it (and the company did give me another) but I do not believe it was a direct error on my part.

One possible explanation is that someone generated the key. It shocking how many modern games are still vulnerable to this old trick. The basic method goes something like this:
1. determine key generation algorithm
2. generate many technically valid keys (but only a tiny tiny percentage are real keys)
3. use script to check which keys are actually activated (this is where companies need to block attempts)
4. profit! (literally unfortunately)

Supposedly there are some older games where someone has checked every valid key and put a list online of all the thousands of working keys for that game. Never actually checked it out, but I don't doubt it's been done.

Wouldn't this be more effective? (1)

Schadrach (1042952) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956084)

Have the PSN multiplayer code check for LV2 peek/poke syscall support, if it's found, they are using a JB dongle (or CFW modded for easier piracy) and backup manager to play (and are almost certainly pirates), so blacklist the PS3 from playing games multiplayer. This removes the people using a JB dongle.

Have the PSN multiplayer code check some hash value of the EBOOT and the FW, and compare to known values. If the FW hash doesn't match, the user is running a CFW such as geohot's that isn't specifically made to make piracy easy (backup managers won't run on these because LV2 syscalls aren't modified). I don't know if he genuinely needs to be punished outright (he might be one of those who is actually only interested in "legitimate" homebrew if the EBOOT checks out). If the EBOOT hash doesn't match up, however, then he's using a cracked and resigned game. Prevent access to multiplayer by the game (possibly ban that PS3 from multiplayer entirely, since he may be a pirate but it's slightly less likely since this is the "hard" way to do it compared to using a BM).

Either way, do not ban access to the PSN Store, since that's the most likely way you might still make money from a compromised console (DLC and the like).

Re:Wouldn't this be more effective? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956232)

Cue a homebrew that intercepts those function calls and feeds them the numbers they're expecting.

Re:Wouldn't this be more effective? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956554)

So I write a root-kit that intercepts peek/poke and returns whatever value maybe your code happy. I write one that intercepts the hash function call and returns a known good value. Or, since I can play modified binaries, I just JMP over the if(){ blacklist() } code.

Since you know... (1)

JustAnotherIdiot (1980292) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956182)

...serial keys work OH SO WELL on the PC, no one ever finds a way to crack them...OH WAIT.

TBRMInsanity (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#34956218)

All Serial Keys do is punish legitimate customers. This is why I abandoned PC Gaming for console gaming back when the PS2 first came out. If Sony make me put in Serial Keys for PS3 games, I'm done gaming all together. Don't punish your customers, go after the people that are actually doing the piracy and make an example of them. Just leave me and my legitimate games alone!

Useless... (1)

Trintech (1137007) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956524)

PS3 hackers have already decrypted game executables and modified them with custom values. Its not gonna be much harder for them to find these "internet key check" calls and jump over them. Given Sony' previous record though, they will probably do something stupid like implement this internet serial key checking function as a syscall which the hackers will just patch over to always return "the key is valid" leaving legitimate game owners the only ones who will have to deal with this crap.

This would be an utterly desperate move (1)

mattbee (17533) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956680)

I don't believe they'd ever do it. They can keep pushing firmware updates, blocking PSN accounts, detecting new modifications - just settle into the pattern like Microsoft have done! But to have to enter a long code for every PS3 game I buy? Is that before the long installation, followed by mandatory download and patch? Or after? And is that a one-time code meaning the same game can't be installed on a second PS3; would that be stomping on the used market at the same time? The PS3 is already the most expensive & lease pleasant to use console, they *really* can't afford to make the experience any worse.

Dear Sony... (5, Interesting)

Rinnon (1474161) | more than 3 years ago | (#34956732)

In any market, it is always advisable to be aware of what your competition is doing so that you can make sure you are offering a superior, or at least non-inferior, experience. Allowing your competition to stay leaps and bounds ahead of you in any market is a sure fire way to flush your business down the toilet! So who is your competition? Microsoft, and PIRACY. Yes, that's right, Piracy is a competitor, and don't you ever think otherwise. It's a competing distribution method that is cheaper and in some ways more convenient. Hope you have some great plans up your sleeve to prove that buying games is the most hassle free way to go; That buying games gets you a BETTER product!

Let's take a look at what the you and your competition are up to shall we... oh, it looks like none of you require a constant Internet connection to play games, so you're all on the same page there. Wait, what? You WANT to introduce that? Won't that put you in a WORSE position than your competitors on the level of convenience offered by your product? What if people have flaky Internet, or god forbid, NO Internet! Fuck them you say? Oh, well, okay. I'm going to have to deduct you a few points for that one.

Let's see... no one has CD key's either, so that's nice... wait, WHAT again!? You actually WANT to introduce these!? What if people lose their keys, or want to rent video games before buying? Fuck them you say? Welllll okay, it's YOUR business Sony. Of course, I'm going to have to deduct more points yet again...

You know Sony, you're not really selling me on why I want to buy from you here. What? Fuck me you say? You know, I'll remember that.

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