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Nokia Has a Billion Reasons To Love WP7

Soulskill posted more than 3 years ago | from the attempting-to-buy-mindshare dept.

Microsoft 318

theodp writes "A report from Bloomberg notes it ain't easy, or cheap, to outbid Google. Microsoft has reportedly agreed to pay Nokia more than $1 billion to 'promote and develop' Windows Phone devices under the agreement between the companies. Bloomberg says the agreement for the payment was 'part of a campaign by Microsoft to keep Nokia from choosing Google's Android operating system.'"

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Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (-1, Flamebait)

devxo (1963088) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417766)

Personally I'm waiting to see what Nokia gets out. While the older Windows Mobile's haven't really been up to current generation, Windows Phone 7 is completely different thing. It's actually a great platform, and developers have the best possible tools available for making apps and games (Visual Studio, C/C++, C#, Silverlight..). It's also fast, sleek looking and up to current standards.

Now combine that with the great devices that Nokia makes and it could be a true hit. Actually, it's the only way how Nokia and Microsoft both can fight against iPhone and Android. Nokia has always had amazing hardware, but their software side has been lacking, especially in recent years.

My next phone will be either Nokia with Windows Phone 7 or iPhone. I have great hopes for Nokia.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417780)

Thanks for a good laugh this morning.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418216)

He is correct on many things. There really isn't any other IDE that can compare to Visual Studio. I also hate using Java, C# is a lot better language.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (5, Funny)

Alex Belits (437) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417784)

Hi, Microsoft marketing department, we almost missed you guys here.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (2, Informative)

digitalchinky (650880) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417818)

Right you are good sir. Having used Maemo for the last year I only recently took a look at Android - naturally my opinion is subjective, but it struck me as being a much more tedious experience, inferior in many ways. This is not to say it's bad, maemo just felt more intuitive and easier to use.

I haven't seen WP7 though I gather from the responses to the parent that it's not so great.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (2)

somersault (912633) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417956)

It's not about whether it's good or not - it's that this guy obviously is shilling because of the way he talks, and the speed with which he responded to the story.

I've never used WP7, and only used iOS briefly. WP7 did look like it had a nice smooth flashy interface from the videos I've seen, but I don't base my choice of OS purely on how flashy it looks. Having said that, it's kind of funny how shit even Windows 7 (the desktop version) looks whenever I have to use it. I'm guessing Ubuntu does a lot more anti-aliasing on its interface than Win7.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417988)

He does have a point - I'd go with W7 just so I didn't have to use Java

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (2)

agge (1244568) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418018)

I have also been using Maemo the last year and it is a vary good linux/mobile system it is lacking in overall mobile phone performable it is still using the n900 like laptop wasting performance and battery. that could have been used better.

My next telephone is going to be a Android whit full qwerty keyboard if Nokia don’t make a new Maemo or a good Meego phone within 6 months.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (5, Insightful)

somersault (912633) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417842)

No shit, 1 minute after the story is posted no less. Saw something similar happen around the end of last year too, but it probably happens more often than that and I just have missed it.

If it wasn't for the "best possible tools" crack then it wouldn't have been quite so obvious, but the rest of it is just another "part of a campaign by Microsoft to keep Nokia from choosing Google's Android operating system" as the summary says. Interesting that they'd rather see people buy iPhones than Android. And that they think that they can change our opinions just from some noob saying how great MS is. Slashdot does have a lot of groupthink, but it doesn't quite work like that.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (2, Insightful)

gbjbaanb (229885) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417930)

He's not a n00b, he's a highly trained and experienced marketing person, selling the same old 'viral memes' that they think is a good way to get "mindshare" for a dud product.

They do give themselves away by banging on about the developer experience, when its a product aimed at consumers who don't give a fig about development. you could program the things using goats blood sacrifices for all consumers care, and someone trying to explain how good the product is should really be describing how intuitive it is to use, how its a new design of interface to help you organise your stuff. (too bad it appears to be so Facebook centric)

and definitely do not talk about silverlight! (besides, most phone devs want C/C++ development, not to rewrite everything they do for other platforms in .NET). If MS really was interested in "developers, developers, developers" they'd realise that devs want a common platform upon which to code so we can reuse code and don't have to write the same damn thing several times. And definitely not in Silverlight - you were right to ignore it at the PDC, go open standard HTML5 (or even Qt, go on MS, do a Qt port to WP7 like the projects for Android and iPhone). Ignore the vocal minority who demanded to keep their Silverlight skills, let that platform stagnate and slowly die.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418042)

I heard that tiger blood sacrifices were much better...

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (1)

S.O.B. (136083) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418278)

I prefer Smurf blood sacrifices.

Let the streets run blue with Smurf blood!!!

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (1)

TapeCutter (624760) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418068)

most phone devs want C/C++ development, not to rewrite everything they do for other platforms in .NE. If MS really was interested in "developers, developers, developers" they'd realise that devs want a common platform upon which to code so we can reuse code and don't have to write the same damn thing several times.

It's not hard to use MSVS with portable C/C++.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (1)

91degrees (207121) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418110)

They do give themselves away by banging on about the developer experience, when its a product aimed at consumers who don't give a fig about development.

If it was marketing people, surely they'd know abut this. But developers do care. Given an even choice, I'll pick the platforms that's easiest to develop for. Moire developers = more apps.

and definitely do not talk about silverlight! (besides, most phone devs want C/C++ development, not to rewrite everything they do for other platforms in .NET).

Speak for yourself. I want a language with memory management. Sure, some compatibility with C might be nice so I can add lua or something but I like that modern languages deal with memory for me.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (0, Troll)

hairyfeet (841228) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418246)

Question: What EXACTLY is wrong with Silverlight, other than you don't like the parent company? Because while I'm not a coder I'd have to say the SilveOS [silveos.com] full OS in a browser is a pretty damned impressive demo. I'd say if you can cook up something THAT cool in Silverlight and actually have it run smooth in bog standard Firefox with no funkiness needed you ought to be able to cook up anything in it.

Me personally I never understood this whole "hate a language" thing (except maybe Brainfuck, but that was evil from birth) since all languages are tools and it is up to the coder to use it correctly instead of acting like a monkey with a wrench beating on a bomb. I've seen damned nice apps written in everything from C to VB and the coders I've known usually didn't have any trouble picking up a language.

So what exactly is wrong with the language known as Silverlight? I haven't seen it used a lot, but that doesn't mean it isn't a perfectly usable tool, just unpopular.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418384)

Because no one wants a web controlled by MS technology. You laugh now because competition exists with Flash, etc. But what happens when MS starts throwing around billions of dollars for exclusivity on major sites? MLB comes to mind.

It's not about technology. It's about a company that thinks in terms of total control, not competition.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (-1, Offtopic)

devxo (1963088) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417938)

What better development environment there is than Visual Studio? Nothing comes even close to it.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418032)

Eclipse OWNS Visual Studio.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418126)

Notepad++. Heck, I'd even go with notepad.exe before I start using that overbloated POS you call a developer environment. More like "developer" sandbox, amirite?

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (2, Insightful)

91degrees (207121) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417954)

Well, based on experience of both, I'd say Visual studio is a much better development tool than Eclipse. I also prefer C# to Java or Objective C.

Some of us actually quite like Microsoft's dev tools. We're familiar with them and they do the job they do fairly well.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418084)

Some of us actually quite like Microsoft's dev tools. We're familiar with them and they do the job they do fairly well.

Stockholm syndrome.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (1)

commodore6502 (1981532) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417964)

The Nokia manager doesn't care.
He's just enjoying his signing bonus & polishing his resume so he can bail ship.

He's right! Visual Studio rocks! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417978)

Visual Studio is the best IDE I've ever used for any development.

Eclipse? Please!

xCode? -Pfft!

NetBeans? Close, but no cigar - it is getting there. We'll see if Oracle fucks that up.

Oh! And Emacs? Nuh uh. Or at least you'd have to spend so much time configuring the fucker to be as good as VS that you'd never get the code you originally wanted to develop done.

Re:He's right! Visual Studio rocks! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418088)

And as usual the windows fanboys think everybody should use windows and spout their opinions as devine fact.

Re:He's right! Visual Studio rocks! (-1, Troll)

miffo.swe (547642) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418160)

Visual Studio is like taking a suppository in the form of an ananas without lube. Anything is better, even notepad or pricking holes in paper strips. Anyone declaring VS good has obviously never ever used anything else. Managers choose VS, not developers.

Re:He's right! Visual Studio rocks! (1)

91degrees (207121) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418276)

Interesting. Which IDE do you consider to be better?

Re:He's right! Visual Studio rocks! (-1, Troll)

miffo.swe (547642) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418422)

Almost any IDE is better but Eclipse takes VS2010 to the cleaners totally. Not much of a battle there.

Re:He's right! Visual Studio rocks! (0)

somersault (912633) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418340)

Actually, even though I've just been using a pretty basic text editor (I use syntax highlighting and line numbers but that's about it) for all my web development stuff, I did quite like Visual Studio for C++ stuff around 1999. I haven't used that many IDEs, but it is much more responsive than Eclipse at least, and better with the BASIC IDEs and Delphi that I'd worked with previously. The lack of built in GUI design options was the only thing I didn't like, but they must have that by now?

I think Visual C++ 6 and Exchange are the only 2 MS products that I actually have had much respect for over the years.

Re:He's right! Visual Studio rocks! (1)

somersault (912633) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418368)

I'm not saying that I think it's the best possible tool though as even if it was the best available tool, it wouldn't be the best possible. I haven't tried enough of the alternatives to be able to say how high it should rank, but I certainly wouldn't put it below even just using a text editor. I like being able to just hit one key to compile and run rather than bringing down my console, so in those terms any IDE would be better than a text editor.. also having a project tree is nice.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (2)

0olong (876791) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417846)

Yeah... he really gave it away by jamming "best possible tools" and "Silverlight" into the same sentence, didn't he?

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (3, Insightful)

outsider007 (115534) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417860)

Ha! Anyone who has anything positive to say about MS is a shill! Everything is black and white! Ha!

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417890)

i'm completely colour blind and only see in super-high-contrast, you insensitive clod!

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (3, Insightful)

somersault (912633) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417994)

It's not that at all, it's just obvious. 1 minute after the story was posted. At least this time they didn't make it quite so obvious. Last time I saw it they had several large paragraphs of pro-MS sentiment in the first post - again posted 1 minute after the story was up. The "best possible tools" line is a complete give-away though, seriously who outside of a marketing department would even say that? I certainly don't think that any programming tools available today are the best possible.

Re:1 minute (1)

TaoPhoenix (980487) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418048)

The truly scary question is which is better for the entire discussion thread, a MS AstroPost, or the improved Russian Goatse guy?

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417942)

Someone mod this insightful. The MS astroturfing has been getting out of hand lately.

Alex Belits (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418092)

Its a real shame that a supposed tech website like Slashdot has it's comments section consistently shitted up by people like Alex Belits who can't read anything pro-MS without having to play the 'shill' card. Its even more of a shame that the readers of this site, who so often like to use words like 'groupthink' and 'sheep' to describe other people, are so embrassingly and transparently guilty of exactly the same thing when they mod shit like OP's post up.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (5, Interesting)

gbjbaanb (229885) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417840)

If its so great, how come they sold sweet f*** all of the things?

sure, the adverts were pitiful, but the reviews were generally positive. As such, I'd expect a lot more to be sold than the reported 2 million over 3 months. (eg Apple sells 40 million in the same time, Android sells 30+ million).

So, the only answer I can think of is either they'er not as good as some people make out, or people really don't want Microsoft products (ie they only buy Windows and Office because they have to).

Combine that with the great devices Nokia makes and you have ... a Windows 7 phone that still no-one wants. Nobody bough Nokias because of the hardware, it was a combination of HW and SW that did what people wanted. Sure, they fell way back int he smartphone stakes, but the old voice+sms phones were very popular and the software was comparitively very good for the time.

I think that people bought a Nokia because their previous phone was a Nokia and it ran almost the same SW, and all the menus and options were the same. Now, they have to really make a choice, and as a result, they have no loyalty - and that means more sales for Google and Apple.

There's one more nail in the coffin - if someone is going to buy a Windows 7 phone (to be different from their peers perhaps :) ), then why would they buy a Nokia one when there are phones from LG and HTC that are just as good.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (1)

js3 (319268) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417908)

Your numbers are totally off. Apple sold 40million last year. Windows Phone 7 came out mid october 2010!

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (1)

gbjbaanb (229885) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418002)

yes, quite right - 14 million [appleinsider.com] for that quarter, not 40. sorry guys.

Best possible tools? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417876)

Personally I'm waiting to see what Nokia gets out. While the older Windows Mobile's haven't really been up to current generation, Windows Phone 7 is completely different thing. It's actually a great platform, and developers have the best possible tools available for making apps and games (Visual Studio, C/C++, C#, Silverlight..). It's also fast, sleek looking and up to current standards.

Now combine that with the great devices that Nokia makes and it could be a true hit. Actually, it's the only way how Nokia and Microsoft both can fight against iPhone and Android. Nokia has always had amazing hardware, but their software side has been lacking, especially in recent years.

My next phone will be either Nokia with Windows Phone 7 or iPhone. I have great hopes for Nokia.

LOL. I guess so: [urbandictionary.com] :

1. tool

One who lacks the mental capacity to know he is being used. A fool. A cretin. Characterized by low intelligence and/or self-steem.

2. Tool

A person, typically male, who says or does things that cause you to give them a 'what-are-you-even-doing-here' look. The 'what-are-you-even-doing-here' look is classified by a glare in the tool's direction and is usually accompanied by muttering of how big of a tool they are. The tool is usually someone who is unwelcome but no one has the balls to tell them to get lost. The tool is alwasys making comments that are out-of-place, out-of-line or just plain stupid. The tool is always trying too hard to fit in, and because of this, never will. However, the tool is useful because you can use them for things; money, rides, ect. ...

Because you sure as shit can't be talking about Silverlight...

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417948)

Fanboi much?

Everything I've heard about WP7 says it's a big-clunky OS that hasn't caught up to its competitors, and that Nokia is falling behind and losing market share.

I wouldn't own a phone powered by Microsoft any more than I would own a car powered by Yugo.

Re:Nokia has amazing hardware, but not software (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418132)

I'm not sure about Nokia, since I haven't owned one of their phones in year, but after getting to play with WP7, I will agree that it is a nice mobile OS. I think most people who would speak ill of it haven't even tried it yet. Personally I like the way that the UI is laid out much more than either Android or iOS, but different strokes for different folks and all that.

My biggest reason for holding off on getting a WP7 phone right now is the outrageous prices. The cheapest I've seen was a little over $400 USD and I'm not willing to spend more than about $200 on a smartphone. Until then, I'm just going to stick with my Linux (rooted Motomagx) phone.

Might not be a horrible mistake (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417802)

We'll have to wait for the NEXT version of Windows for Handhelds (whatever it will look like and be called by then) to know how big a mistake this was for Nokia.

If it's going to run on ARM anyway they can always just defect back to Android if they ever come to their senses.

Re:Might not be a horrible mistake (4, Insightful)

jbplou (732414) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417868)

The next version? It took them years to develop this and it didn't even have copy/paste at launch. They will have minor updates periodically but the next major version is long off. They are so far behind on mobile they don't know what to do.

Re:Might not be a horrible mistake (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418116)

I can count on zero fingers the number of times that I've missed copy/paste, though supposedly that feature will be released in an update this week (yawn). But every time I look at an Android phone, my eyes start to bleed from the (lack of) graphic design. Android feels like a sad iPhone imposter, whereas Windows Phone has a subtle cool factor that has yet to be imitated.

And for that, I'll be a happy customer until something even sassier comes along.

Re:Might not be a horrible mistake (1)

Xacid (560407) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418402)

"I can count on zero fingers the number of times that I've missed copy/paste"

Are you serious or are you just trolling?

Re:Might not be a horrible mistake (1)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418202)

The iPhone didn't have copy and paste upon launch either. It's kind of odd that MS didn't have copy/paste either after the flack that Apple received for that move. Windows mobile 6 kind of had copy paste, but it really depended on what application you are using as to whether it was available, leading me to believe it wasn't actually built into the core system. There seems to be quite a history of mobile devices not having copy and paste, for whatever reason. Anyway, I wouldn't hold that against them too much. MS probably wasn't planning to have a major release of windows after Vista, but with the failure of it, they had to do another release. I could very much see the same happening with windows phone.

Re:Might not be a horrible mistake (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417882)

Next version? Ive been waiting since about 1.5... It was garbage then, doesnt seem much better now. Microsoft really did not understand its audience of developers. Apple got it by mistake. Google who knows at this point.

No shit (1)

larry bagina (561269) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417808)

This was known on day two by anyone paying attention.

Re:No shit (1)

wisty (1335733) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418186)

And the really observant will notice that despite having "a burning platform", Nokia are about a billion dollars less desperate for a mobile strategy than Microsoft. RIM would be somewhere in between.

I might even run Windoze for a billion $$$$ (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417812)

But I'd have to think about it.

don't flame me (1, Insightful)

crashumbc (1221174) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417858)

While, I know it popular to Flame MS. If Nokia isn't just taking MS's money, and is planning really throw everything they have into it. This "may" just save MS(mobile) and Nokia. Nokia has a history finding and growing niches and finding what customers want. As long as they don't just play follow the leader to what Android and Iphone do, AND (this is a big if) MS listens to them when the need want changes to WP7. I think may at least be able to compete. I don't see them taking over but they may put up a decent showing.

Re:don't flame me (2)

jbplou (732414) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417880)

The only Areafor MS is business if they convince their corporate customer to switch off Blackberry. Goto any store and watch what interests people its the iPhone and the big screen Android phones. I suspect Ms is regretting doing the "tile" thing

Re:don't flame me (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418118)

The tiles are fine, IMO, and I can't see that as a deterrence for interest. However, the name is a huge problem: No-one is interested in a "Microsoft" phone, and a "Windows" phone is just a bad, bad idea. Smart phones are personal (and pricy) device: people need to be able to really like them, otherwise they won't be interested -- and very few people really like Windows, it's just a tool.

Microsoft obviously understood this with X-Box: Go to xbox.com and you won't see Microsoft or Windows as the main branding. I have no idea how they dropped the ball with the phone OS.

Re:don't flame me (1)

somersault (912633) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418038)

There have been very few times where MS has done anything but play follow the leader. I'd say perhaps no times, but I'm sure someone will point out an exception. Any time they've done something cool it's usually a result of buying another company up, rather than having the idea in-house.

When I see "WP" I still think "WordPerfect" (4, Funny)

thomasdz (178114) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417872)

When I saw the headline, I thought: "Nokia is rolling out WordPerfect v7???"

Re:When I see "WP" I still think "WordPerfect" (1)

crashumbc (1221174) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417976)

OH how I miss Wordperfect...

Re:When I see "WP" I still think "WordPerfect" (1)

m.ducharme (1082683) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418312)

Wordperfect Lives. [corel.com]

Sadly, only available for Windows.

Re:When I see "WP" I still think "WordPerfect" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418376)

i'm not surprised that Wordperfect lives, its that zombie Corel that just won't die!

Re:When I see "WP" I still think "WordPerfect" (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418014)

When I saw the headline, I thought: "Nokia is rolling out WordPerfect v7???"

That might be a more effective strategy.

Re:When I see "WP" I still think "WordPerfect" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418020)

Of course the name "Windows Phone" makes little sense, as there are no "windows", and presumably it will be targeted to tablets some day...

OS-M ?

Re:When I see "WP" I still think "WordPerfect" (3, Funny)

wisty (1335733) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418158)

How about "Windows Highly Integrated Nimble Ecosystem", or WHINE. It's tag-line? "Better than WinCE".

Re:When I see "WP" I still think "WordPerfect" (1)

davidbrit2 (775091) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418064)

Yeah, and with all this 2.4 talk from Google, I keep thinking, dude, I've had that version of Lotus 1-2-3 on my HP 200LX for decades now!

The problem with WP7 is... (5, Insightful)

ilsaloving (1534307) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417888)

that it could be the single best operating system on the planet that is superior to every other system in every possible way, but...

It's still A Trap(tm).

Microsoft has a very long history of blatantly destructive behaviour. They have a lot to make up for before they should be considered trustworthy enough to rely on.

Anyone who willingly buys microsoft products should be pitied, because clearly they're trapped in an abusive relationship. "Oh! He's not like that anymore! He's changed! Oh no, I got that black eye from falling down the stairs!"

Re:The problem with WP7 is... (2)

Vectormatic (1759674) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418066)

thank you good sir, for that mental image of Admiral Ackbar shouting "It's a trap!" in the face of milions of WP7 phones swarming out of a star destroyer, with Ballmer at the helm, complete in Grand Moff uniform

Re:The problem with WP7 is... (5, Funny)

bmo (77928) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418082)

It's like the old joke...

Scene: a bar in Helsinki. Microsoft has flown in from Redmond....

Microsoft: Would you let me stick my operating system in your phone for a billion bucks?
Nokia: *sips a glass of wine* Yes...
Microsoft: How about two shares of stock?
Nokia: What, do you think I'm some kind of whore?
Microsoft: We've already established the relationship. We're just negotiating price now.

--
BMO

In a meeting between Nokia and Microsoft.... (5, Funny)

bernywork (57298) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417892)

Nokia: We've had a good think about it and we're going to start developing for Android
Microsoft: What would it take for you to start using and developing for Windows Mobile?
Nokia: *Has a think* *Pinky moves towards mouth* ONE BILLION DOLLARS!
Microsoft reps: *look at each other, shrug shoulders* Yeah, OK, I can't see any reason why we can't do that..
Nokia: Err, OK, I guess we're using Windows Mobile then....

mutants ability to do further harm challenged (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417900)

that's the spirit? we know you can feel it. it's getting late?

Sendo: The cat's out of the bag now (2)

phonewebcam (446772) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417906)

So serious sweetners are the only way to pull it off again [stashbox.org] .

30 pieces of silver... (2)

bmo (77928) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417922)

1 billion dollars US.

No difference, really.

It's still selling out. The scale is just different.

--
BMO

Re:30 pieces of silver... (1)

Vectormatic (1759674) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418144)

The scale is just different.

i wonder what 1978 years of inflation amounts too :P

Re:30 pieces of silver... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418348)

At current savings rates of 0.25%, it's 139-fold.
At 1% it's 352 million-fold.
At 2% it's 102 quadrillion-fold.

Where's my time machine?
I wanna deposit a penny.

Re:30 pieces of silver... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418154)

If Google had outbid Microsoft it would've been a good investment in the company that sells the most handsets.
But because its Microsoft that outbid Google, Nokia have "sold out".

Whats with the clear bias against Microsoft just because they put a little more "pieces of silver" on the table than Google did?

Re:30 pieces of silver... (1)

Frosty Piss (770223) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418370)

It may be "selling out", but it is also the first serious step in Nokia's death spiral. Honestly there is no longer any reason to pay attention to Nokia. If you own stock, think about selling it.

MS 1, Nokia 0 (2, Insightful)

schmidt349 (690948) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417926)

Yes yes, I know we all hate Microsoft, but on the face of it this was a very shrewd business decision. Nokia was getting killed by the fact that people now want their phones to do such exotic things as email and Web browsing. They had no real internal direction in terms of software development, as evidenced by the schizophrenia of Symbian and Maemo, and the fact that they were trying to do it all in-house wasn't helping things any.

Meanwhile, Microsoft comes along with a ready-made solution to Nokia's woes in the form of a pretty complete mobile platform and a $1 billion payout to help with the transition. To Nokia's idiot board of directors this probably looked like a no-brainer. Meanwhile Microsoft gets amazing value in the form of a very, very large company now pushing out its software products worldwide. This isn't going to put WP7 ahead of Android or iOS, not by a long shot, but it will do wonders in terms of shoring up their position.

On the flip side of things, consider Motorola. At one point they were kind of in the same boat as Nokia, having missed the first wave of the smartphone epidemic, and went from being the company that had it all with the once-super cool RAZR to an also-ran. They got behind Android in a very complete and enthusiastic way and the results have really paid off for them. I'd venture to say that they make some of the best Android phones out there, and they're taking a great stab at the tablet market. And no one had to pay them $1 billion to do it!

In short, this is great news for MS, bad news for Nokia fans. I always thought the path to Palm's demise was paved by Windows Mobile ending up on Treo smartphones. They just couldn't be bothered to invest in an innovate mobile OS of their own until webOS, and that was obviously a day late and a dollar short...

Re:MS 1, Nokia 0 (3, Insightful)

Pieroxy (222434) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418208)

If you think the iPhone revolutionized the space by offering email and web browsing, it just means you have missed the entire picture. What Apple brought to the table is *much* more than a featureset. It brought an experience. It's the glue between the features that got them ahead of the competition - even if the features were way ahead of the competition as well.

How many phones do they have to sell? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417932)

How many phones must Nokia sell for MS to make their money back?

If i were Nokia, I would take the money then declare a big dividend and close up shop.

bah! (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417962)

enjoy your silver Nokia.

We are paying you more than $1 bn to (2)

unity100 (970058) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417966)

'promote and develop' windows phones and slide to obscurity in the process ....

great case of forfeiting long term future for short term gain on behalf of nokia ..

nokia .... DONT !

Good. That is 1 billion less available for ... (0, Offtopic)

140Mandak262Jamuna (970587) | more than 3 years ago | (#35417970)

That is 1 billion less available to Microsoft to distort the open documents marketplace to keep its fraying monopoly intact. 1 billion less for shills like Gartner to produce TCO studies. 1 billion less available to cats paw companies like SCO to create distracting law suits.

But still we are not seeing competition with level playing fields. Corporate desk tops and office applications are still dominated by Microsoft. Media entertainment market is still dominated by Apple, another closed proprietary system. For smartphones and tablets there is some small battle going on between Android and iOS. Search engine is still dominated by Google.

Instead of open battle between the companies fighting in the open duking it out in close range combat, each giant has built a fortress and are fighting each other with long range artillery. For the consumers to benefit we need level playing fields and major players in each arena.

Last century was not a battle between Capitalism and Communism. It was between Competitionism (to coin a term) and Controlled economies. By misattributing the fall of Berlin wall to Capitalism instead of Competitionism, we are working to preserve existing winners in each sector of economy. Consolidating the power in the hands of Microsofts, Goldman-Sachs, BofA, Wallmarts, HomeDepots etc instead of creating multiple players who can actually fight each other for the privilege of serving us. There is no special interest lobbying group for the winners of tomorrow, for those who could create millions jobs in the coming decade. Our political system rewards people who benefit by the status quo.

OK, here is the obligatory, Get off my lawn.

MICROSOFT! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35417986)

Such a shitty friend they have to PAY people to hang out with them.

Nokia announces MeeGo 1.2 for Developers w/ N900 (3, Informative)

operator_error (1363139) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418024)

Jukka Eklund at Nokia writes to the Meego Dev list [meego.com] : "I am thrilled to announce a little thing we started at Nokia. Basically we want to have MeeGo running in N900 device, so that it's really usable as your daily development device. Basic Handset UX should work, phone calls, SMS, web browsing. So we are concentrating on a few selected features and polish those to be "perfect". It might mean that we leave out some things in MeeGo 1.2 trunk for this edition, but that is not the default intention.

We are doing this fully on the open, and I hope this is an interesting project where we all in the community work towards the same goal: have a great MeeGo edition in the N900. This work is naturally based on the great work done already by N900 adaptation team lead by Harri and Carsten.

The wiki is up here: http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/DeveloperEdition [meego.com] . It will populated with more information as we go, thanks for the patience.

Br,
Jukka
Developer Edition product manager" ...Also folks, be sure to stay tuned for the new Nokia N950 meant only as a (likely) unsubsidized Developer's hardware refresh of the N900. Only rumor has it that it will not arrive with a slide-out keyboard. How important is having a N900-style keyboard to you, along with the new Meego Love Nokia software continues to offer?"

[note this was posted as an article Saturday [slashdot.org] and wasn't accepted as newsworthy by Slashdot. I cannot imagine why not.]

Re:Nokia announces MeeGo 1.2 for Developers w/ N90 (1)

Svartalf (2997) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418322)

It's nifty that they did this, but wouldn't you say this was a day late, dollar short overall? I seriously doubt that Nokia would market anything like an N950 because they've sold Qt off to someone else and they've said they're pretty much ditching MeeGo and Symbian for Windows Phone- unless they don't have clauses in there to sneak it in under radar and the current upper management is going to quietly develop a backup plan for this if it doesn't work, the N950's not terribly likely to happen.

Microsoft has to buy its friends (0)

inkscapee (1994086) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418054)

Microsoft has to keep buying business-- I'm wondering what kind of fancy accounting they're doing to prop up their revenue figures.

Re:Microsoft has to buy its friends (1)

miffo.swe (547642) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418262)

Well for one they seem to borrow money like there is no tomorrow. That in itself is pretty strange considering the extreme profits they supposedly make.

babys/LSI/W+dog/RSF; evile offers no concessions (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418060)

what a surprise? it knows that it has only one primary function. so,,,,, it's getting late?

Clearly Microsoft can do no right (0)

ugen (93902) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418076)

I mean, this is /. - so whatever Microsoft does is bad :)

I am a developer, and I am currently evaluating a mobile platform to move my application to. The application requires both fairly extensive user interface and significant graphic processing.
1. Android: The good - our code would port into native Android quite well and work with all appropriate optimizations. But the NDK does not really have a UI component, and writing our own UI is both non-cost effective and probably won't look the way users would like it to look. Java is not suitable both due to limits on performance (see elsewhere on /. about its responsivness or lack thereof when handling sound, for example), as well as because our current code base while quite portable, is C/C++. These issues would make development technically difficult for us - not impossible, but simply not economically feasible. No go at this point.

(Why, oh why did they decide to put Java into the mix there? If only there was a native GUI, Android would have been perfect for us. But I digress)

2. iOS/iPad/iPhone - technically these would work, but we are not terribly eager to get into a single-platform solution. Sure, they are big and have many devices out there, but these devices are all the same and come from a single hw vendor. Aside from that there are API and optimization issues, due to some quick and shoddy decisions that Apple made when putting iOS together. The resulting product would not be as efficient as we'd like and Apple hardware does not entirely hit the target market. On top of that, some of the requirements of Apple store are incompatible with what we do, so we'd have to remove functionality or otherwise work around legal hurdles. So - a weak "may be" only because there is little choice for now.

3. Here comes the Windows part. Our code would build/run on those devices natively wiuth all appropriate optimizations. There is a native accessible (C/C++) GUI, without a need of Java shims or custom UIs. It is not locked to a single hardware vendor, so in theory we could expect a number of tablets and other devices to satisfy various user needs. A small snag - not too many devices available quite yet :)

So, personally I am rooting for Nokia + Windows. If this works out, it will provide is the shortest most direct path to give mobile application to our users.

Admittedly, I would just as well welcome a complete Android NDK (with full GUI integration, to remove any need to glue Java and native code together). Perhaps it's there already? :) It's hard to know seeing as very little of NDK is properly documented.

And now we return to our usual Microsoft bashing programming :)

Re:Clearly Microsoft can do no right (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418280)

I agree with your complaint about MS bashing. However, WP7 doesn't allow you to use C or C++. You have to use a variation of Silverlight.

Re:Clearly Microsoft can do no right (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418320)

Dear Microsoft: if you're going to shill your dev products on /., maybe you want to not be so obvious about it.

I'm a C freak, my first word was "ifndef" and my first book was Kernighan & Ritchie, and about the last thing I would ever say about any Microsoft dialect of the language is that it plays well with others. From incompatible bullshit like CreateFileMapping to linguistic trash like explicitly allowing casted lvalues to the endless parade of pointless clutter macros, MS was probably singlehandledly responsible for creating the perception that C and C++ are somehow hard to use or esoteric. Maybe that's changed and maybe it hasn't, but for Microsoft to claim that standard C runs better on Windows than on NeXT/Mac OS is insane.

Apple uses pretty well bog-standard C in both ANSI and C99 dialects. Their compiler is good old GCC, which they tirelessly support. I don't know what these quick and shoddy decisions you're referring to are. Granted they do change the Objective-C language standard more often than most geeks change their underwear, but at least it's well-documented and submitted to standards bodies for approval. I don't like that they abandoned both Cocoa Bindings and the garbage collector on iOS; the latter was for performance reasons and I don't for the life of me know why they did the former. But at least all this is well-documented, and none of it's going to affect your C/C++ code one bit.

Maybe I'm not the "standard" C guy. I'll take Automake and Eclipse over Visual Studio any day of the week. But I've survived Microsoft crapware from Win32 to MFC to GDI and I have to tell you I am not eager to repeat the experience.

[PS. I'm going to take it as prophetic that the Captcha for posting this comment was "blunders."]

Re:Clearly Microsoft can do no right (2)

miffo.swe (547642) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418336)

I think you seriously underestimate Android. Would be interesting to know what limitations you would hit that a complex 3D game dont.

Re:Clearly Microsoft can do no right (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418346)

Qt runs on Android AFAIK.

Re:Clearly Microsoft can do no right (1)

Svartalf (2997) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418396)

It couldn't be because many of us have watched these things play out, either up close, from a distance, or both (waves hand...). In short, I don't see much upside from this little relationship and state it from facts in evidence.

Stack
Novell
SEGA (Where do you think they got the idea for the X-Box from... No, I don't think MS had the same involvement as they did with Stack, etc. but they DID give it a bit of a shove all the same...)

Three right off the top of my head that didn't fare well. There's a history, replete with disasters resulting from partnering with that company. It's why I don't see what you see in things. The ultimate end is that the deal fails and either they barely survive like SEGA did or you end up on the auction block or shuttered like Stack or Novell ended up- and the deal they cut was one of the primary causes for that demise.

As for the Android NDK...as of r5, you pretty much have it available to you.

Re:Clearly Microsoft can do no right (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418404)

You havent done your research. Windows Phone 7 doesnt allow native apps yet - they all run on Silverlight and I don't think any C++ at all

As far as I know this deal has to do with WP7, not Windows itself

Interesting... (1)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418128)

The question that this raises, for me, is as follows: "If Microsoft paid Nokia $1 billion(plus the special-BFF ability to customize WP7 to a degree that others cannot), this suggests that either A) Nokia was largely willing, possibly with the customization proviso; but one or both parties were worried about Nokia's ability to keep on course long enough to iterate out a good WP7 product(not necessarily because of bankrupcy, from which they are a good ways off; but because of shareholders demanding a new plan with expected better returns, or similar pressure) or B)Our Google Overlords had an offer that needed to be outbid... If A, what hold-ups were MS and or Nokia worried about? If B, was Google also offering sweet, sweet, cash money? Or was the perceived superiority of the Android world worth less than; but not too much less than, $1billion?

You don't get as rich as Microsoft by paying for things that you can get for free. So, that strongly suggests that there was an offer(in cash or in code) worth not too much less than $1 billion on the table, presumably from Google(or possibly Intel). Who was it from? Was there also substantial cash in it? Or is the perceived delta between WP7 and the alternatives actually ~$1billion in the eyes of Nokia and MS?

Amazing what 35 years will do (1)

kmdrtako (1971832) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418166)

35 years ago Bill and Paul stuck it to MITS for putting their software on the Altair.

Now Nokia has figured out how to get Microsoft to swing the other way and pay them.

Too funny.

Sounds like (1)

Stumbles (602007) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418192)

Sounds like Nokia will be another Novel, its just a matter of time now for them to go tits up just like Novel.

This is a new, third way to deal with m$ (1)

phonewebcam (446772) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418266)

It used to be the only reasons people dealt with m$ is that they were assholes or they were forced to do so by assholes.

Bargain (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418294)

$1B to ensure the death of an open source competitor? Bargain!

word perfect 7 is awesome (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35418334)

I agree. Nokia will be very pleased with the features.

how many platforms? (1)

djfake (977121) | more than 3 years ago | (#35418408)

iOs, Android, WebOS... was there really room for another platform? Wasn't Nokia taking a huge risk in a crowded market? Is Nokia really taking a risk with Windows 7? Just sounds like a business deci$ion to me.
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