Beta

Slashdot: News for Nerds

×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

NetBeans 7.0 Is Now Available

samzenpus posted more than 3 years ago | from the everyone-likes-new-stuff dept.

Programming 137

An anonymous reader writes "Oracle releases NetBeans IDE 7.0, which introduces language support for development to the proposed Java SE 7 specification with the JDK 7 developer preview. The release also provides enhanced integration with the Oracle WebLogic server, as well as support for Oracle Database and GlassFish 3.1. Additional highlights include Maven 3 and HTML5 editing support; a new GridBagLayout designer for improved Swing GUI development; enhancements to the Java editor, and more."

cancel ×

137 comments

What a load of bollocks (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885572)

GlassFish bla Maven bla GridBagLayout bla Swing GUI.
Is any of this junk useful?

Re:What a load of bollocks (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885854)

Not unless you are a real developer, which you're obviously not... (see, I can troll too!)

Cool! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885592)

But how far from Visual Studio 2010 is it, in terms of features?

I'm still waiting for something I can put on my Ubuntu laptop and show my coworkers to put them to shame.

There's no point in being a developer advocating Linux if I have to conceive every time that although most things are better here, we still don't have a good-enough IDE.

Disclaimer:
I mean an IDE mostly for OO-ed statically typed languages. C#/Java-like. For dynamic languages vim will do.

Re:Cool! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885598)

Need a feature comparison grid.

Re:Cool! (1)

JonySuede (1908576) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885608)

with NetBeans 7 with maven3, nexus and Hudson, you could put them to shame any day.

disclaimer
I used to be a sun campus evangelist

Re:Cool! (1)

nschubach (922175) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885690)

It's pretty bad when you have to evangelize a campus ;)

Sorry, but on a related note, I've generally been impressed with NetBeans prior versions but they never picked up as much support as Eclipse did for plugins so I've been sticking with Eclipse. I think the last time I checked out NetBeans was when I wanted to fiddle with the Ruby plugin. Hopefully 7 will impress me before I end up removing it later. ;)

Re:Cool! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885802)

It's pretty bad when I have to evangelize yo mama but she sucks cock like a pro.

Re:Cool! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885732)

What's Hudson? I've never heard of it. I've heard of Jenkins, though. ;)

Re:Cool! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886648)

NetBeans is honestly shit compared to VS.

Disclaimer: I use NetBeans and VS every day.

Re:Cool! (1)

kaffiene (38781) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886768)

So do I and I think the exact opposite.

Re:Cool! (1)

blackpaw (240313) | more than 3 years ago | (#35887292)

I use both, find them both excellent. I'd put them on a par feature and usability wise.

Re:Cool! (1)

iced_773 (857608) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885610)

It can do Java out of the box. :-P

But in all seriousness, add the right plugins and wait for it to load and Eclipse will blow everyone out of the water.

Re:Cool! (1)

JonySuede (1908576) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885628)

we are talking about NetBeans, if you are mavenized NetBeans is leaps and bounds ahead of eclipse.

Re:Cool! (3, Informative)

ink (4325) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885612)

Visual Studio can work with Java projects? If you want to use the Microsoft vertical stack, then stick with Visual Studio. Netbeans supports several application stacks -- many use it just for it's comprehensive PHP support.

Re:Cool! (2)

cbhacking (979169) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886746)

Yes, it can work with Java. VS is extremely pluggable. You can create a project type that calls the Java builds tools, understands the Java language, and so forth. Even the debugger is pluggable, although the only non-VS debugger I've used with it is also written by MS.

Here's the thing. (5, Funny)

MrEricSir (398214) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885648)

Both Visual Studio 2010 and NetBeans 7 allow enterprise developers to create and deploy enterprise frameworks for the enterprise, then develop enterprise software solutions with re-usable enterprise components while reading enterprise documentation.

Enterprise.

Re:Here's the thing. (1)

JonySuede (1908576) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885656)

Had I not posted, I would have modded you up !

Re:Here's the thing. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885674)

Both Visual Studio 2010 and NetBeans 7 allow enterprise developers to create and deploy enterprise frameworks for the enterprise, then develop enterprise software solutions with re-usable enterprise components while reading enterprise documentation.

Enterprise.

Darn! I need something for distributed computing.

Re:Here's the thing. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885680)

> Enterprise.

Khaaan!

Re:Here's the thing. (3, Funny)

hairyfeet (841228) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886456)

Dammit man, didn't you get the memo? You have to add synergy and integration if you want it to be an enterprise post! Here let me show you...

Both Visual Studio 2010 and NetBeans 7 allow enterprise developers to create and deploy enterprise frameworks for synergy within the enterprise, then develop enterprise software solutions with synergistic re-usable enterprise components while reading enterprise documentation, thus creating vertical integration and a full stack approach to workflow.

See? If you are gonna work in the enterprise kid you gotta speak the lingo. Don't make me go six sigma on yo ass!

If there were such a thing... (1)

warrax_666 (144623) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886594)

... as Enterprise Kissing ('twould be RESTful, I'm sure), you'd be receiving one of those from me right now.) In lieu of that... Kudos!

Re:Cool! (1)

somersault (912633) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885660)

The word you want is concede, not conceive.

Re:Cool! (1)

nschubach (922175) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885724)

Damn, I finally thought I was going to "get some" by evangelizing.

Re:Cool! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885804)

It works for the Mormons.

Re:Cool! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885730)

Thanks.

Re:Cool! (2)

marcel (6435) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885692)

I wouldn't know how Visual Studio is these days, but some developers I know say that Eclipse beats VS2010 in most respects. I do now Eclipse and Netbeans fairly well and I'd say that Eclipse out-of-the-box is nothing compared to netbeans. With plugins they are comparable, but the GUI builder of Netbeans beats all the ones I've used so far. Also the Maven integration is much better in Netbeans than Maven. So it depends on what features you want to show tour coworkers and I'd say give it a try.

Re:Cool! (1)

oakgrove (845019) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886574)

I've been doing a lot of web development lately with aptana [aptana.org] which basically is eclipse just with a whole bunch of web-by add-ons and plugins. I must say that it is the best experience I've ever had with an ide for this kind of work. Supports code completion for jquery, dojo, plain javascript, css, html and a whole lot more out of the box. Add in some vi keybindings [sourceforge.net] and I'm in dev heaven. Not sure if it will impress anyone's co-workers but it sure makes writing web pages fun.

Re:Cool! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885712)

You do realize your co-workers would be able to run this under Windows as well right?

Re:Cool! (1)

kaffiene (38781) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886762)

I prefer NB to VS, but it's hardly apples to oranges. NB does do C/C++, but it's not its strong point - Java is its strong point. I used to think that Visual Studio was the best IDE ever at about release 5, but since then I think all the main Java IDEs: Netbeans, Eclipse and IdeaJ have, well, eclipsed VS.

Re:Cool! (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35887238)

emacs

Re:Cool! (1)

shutdown -p now (807394) | more than 3 years ago | (#35887278)

I wouldn't be able to give a comprehensible feature comparison, but in terms of overall feel, NetBeans seems to be the Java IDE that is closest to VS. It has the same sort of "everything and kitchen sink" out of the box approach, with many rich project templates to get started, and a very nice Swing GUI designer that reminds me of WinForms one in VS (only NetBeans one generates flexible layouts, almost automagically!). Same for web development - you get a complete development stack set up right out of the box and integrated with IDE. If you come from VS, this is a nice thing compared to Eclipse where there are myriads of plugins for this and that, and then usually you still have to set up servers (for web) and emulators (for J2ME or Android) separately.

Re:Cool! (1)

HJED (1304957) | more than 3 years ago | (#35888884)

It is very good for java, but a bit hard to set up for C/C++ and I don't think it supports C#.
I personally use it for all of my coding as it's formatting and code completion features are very good (even for C and HTML) and I find it easier to use then other IDE's (although Visual Studio comes close).

Best IDE Out There (1)

teknopurge (199509) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885662)

I like vi. I like NB. Been using it since it was Forte - so much less-bloated than Eclipse. Kudos NB Team and please keep it up.

Re:Best IDE Out There (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885720)

NetBeans is a great IDE. Eclipse is a great IDE.

Why do YOU have to be an asshole?

Bloated does not mean it is bad (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885762)

Eclipse is demanding of CPU and memory. That does not make it a bad editor.

Re:Bloated does not mean it is bad (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886894)

Funny, we used to say that about Netbeans.

Re:Best IDE Out There (1)

getNewNickName (980625) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885754)

Does NB have a good vi plugin? The one for Eclipse is satisfactory, but I long to get back my ctrl commands.

Re:Best IDE Out There (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885788)

Yes, search for jVim. It is far superior to the eclipse emulation.

Re:Best IDE Out There (3, Informative)

teknopurge (199509) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885846)

http://jvi.sourceforge.net/ [sourceforge.net] parent was close. The best part of NB is how light-weight the modules are: NB was built to be a platform from day-1; has epic other language support.(php, ruby, python, C, etc...)

Re:Best IDE Out There (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35888284)

I've found the python support to be pretty poor, but I think that particular module is a community made, unsupported one.

Re:Best IDE Out There (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886766)

Please keep it up? What, breaking features with every update? For example, from 6.8 or 6.9 a refactor would go and bugger up any XML files that use imports. Matisse is pitiful (Yes Netbeans by moving that Text field I wanted my panel to be 40,000 pixels wide).

At least with Eclipse I don't have to have every project open, it doesn't search/compile closed projects and it doesn't go off into its "Scanning projects" lala land. Plus with eclipse you can copy your workspace from one machine to another and not have to fix all your missing references.

Please NB Team - get your act together. Buy a real IDE (VS) and see how good that experience can be. Like, for example, using 100 Meg, even after you've been developing all day (instead of 600+).

Re:Best IDE Out There (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35887362)

You know, there was a time when you would have gotten me. All of you AC Visual Studio trolls running your dick beaters over your keyboards. Well, I decided to give VS a shot. It's okay. Eclipse is better. Anybody reading this, please don't be fooled by the VS hype these astroturfers lay down. None of it is true.

Re:Best IDE Out There (2)

thePowerOfGrayskull (905905) | more than 3 years ago | (#35887608)

On the other hand, the eclipse team seems to have said "Hell with anything you may be familiar with - like shortcuts that practically every IDE shares in a windowed environment - we're going to do our own thing and everyone else can figure it out or suck it. While we're at it, let's make all of our features as non-discoverable as possible by hiding them in illogical places."

Re:Best IDE Out There (1)

digsbo (1292334) | more than 3 years ago | (#35888914)

100 Meg? What are you writing, a tiny console app? I freely praise the MS development tools, and VS is fantastic, but 100 meg after a day of developing is not even close to my experience (working on a medium-size web app with a few hundred source files across maybe ten projects). 600 meg is pretty close, though.

Netbeans is a Superb PHP IDE (3, Informative)

QJimbo (779370) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885676)

I use this on a daily basis for PHP projects. Haven't found anything that comes close to saving me time and guessing what I'm trying to do correctly as I'm typing. It's very smart when you mix HTML, CSS, PHP and Javascript as well.

Re:Netbeans is a Superb PHP IDE (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886438)

I'm working on WordPress development and I find the exact opposite to be true. The parsing is way off - it points out missing tags when code blocks are mixed with HTML constantly. There's no way to turn it off, or at least block errors in the core code that aren't my concern. Its navigation to function declaration is the only reason I'm trying to use it. Otherwise I'd be using any number of other lighter-weight IDEs.

Perhaps it's better in v7. *crosses fiingers*

Re:Netbeans is a Superb PHP IDE (1)

HJED (1304957) | more than 3 years ago | (#35888964)

I haven't used the php part for a while but in the HTML editor you can turn off error checking for an individual line by clicking on the code with the error and then clicking on the lightbulb and selecting "turn off HTML error checking for this line". I assume it's the same for PHP.

Re:Netbeans is a Superb PHP IDE (1)

RobbieThe1st (1977364) | more than 3 years ago | (#35889248)

Geany. It's not perfect, but it's free, and it has navigation-to-function also.

Re:Netbeans is a Superb PHP IDE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35889818)

Since WordPress still FAILs at doing even basic XHTML, and falls back to Transitional (essentially HTML 4), Iâ(TM)m not surprised if NetBeans canâ(TM)t parse the crap you guys call code.

Try 100% XHTML 1.1 Strict. With JavaScript not using < or >. If it still fails, you got a point. Otherwise, (and looking at WordPress code, thatâ(TM)s pretty much a sure thing), itâ(TM)s actually correct in pointing out your errors.

Re:Netbeans is a Superb PHP IDE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886540)

You should try Komodo IDE (commercial) or Edit (free). Its on of the best...

Re:Netbeans is a Superb PHP IDE (1)

YoshiDan (1834392) | more than 3 years ago | (#35889000)

I've been using Komodo Edit for over a year and I love it. But seeing all these comments about netbeans I decided to give it a spin and I have to say I like it. I like it a lot. Feels a little slower than Komodo Edit but I can definitely put up with that for all the extra features it has. I know Komodo IDE has most of these features but that costs money. My employer doesn't like spending money, especially since they spent a whole load of $$$ upgrading my Adobe shit to cs5 last year...

Re:Netbeans is a Superb PHP IDE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886882)

I concur, it is a great IDE for PHP development, its error highlighting can be flaky at times but its nothing a re-parse doesn't fix. The best thing I like about NB is it looks/feels the same in all three major OS, ubuntu, windows, and mac os (yes I use all three among others daily).

It still is just another java IDE patched for PHP but the support has been steadily getting better for years now, been using NetBeans since v3 for various languages.

Re:Netbeans is a Superb PHP IDE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35887810)

... and guessing what I'm trying to do correctly as I'm typing...

I've been using Netbeans for the last 2 months, and am just starting to get used to it. Personally - the 'guessing what I am trying to do' thing really annoyed me at first, and has now become only a minor annoyance. I'm sure there is a way to turn it off, but I thought I'd stick with it for a little longer to see if it would actually help. So far, no luck...

Come to think of it... I've given it way longer than I should have, and just turned it off. Thanks :)

Re:Netbeans is a Superb PHP IDE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35889242)

PhpStorm [jetbrains.com] does this better but at a cost. Also, they falsely claim it's "lightweight". It is everything but. On my first attempt with a 2-core, 2GiB RAM Ubuntu box, it took an hour to grind the HDD (continuously paging in and out) and crash. Geany [geany.org] OTOH gets it right but is fairly minimal (flies fine with me, YMMV).

All 64-bit? IDE/executables/runtime script, etc.? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885706)

I mean the entire thing: Or in other words, does NetBean 7 have a PURE 64-bit fully ready dev. suite here in various versions, & for all languages capable of targetting that memory addressing range, that NetBeans supports??

I only briefly messed around with NetBean & JAVA a couple years back, to "see how the other 1/2 lives" & learn too, why not. It's been a while though, & I really didn't "dig into it" either when I did use it... so if you would, please bear with me. I need to ask. Yes, it happens, this is living proof.

May not make sense to some of you, but I am trying to go completely 64-bit here (may sound strange, but string processing seems faster on it, even notepad.exe itself, by far, vs. 32-bit in native 32-bit OS environs no less - very noticeable!)

So, I am curious - thank you for the answer (I toyed w/ NetBeans 6 & JAVA before in 32-bit environs).

APK

P.S.=> Oh, & I've got NO PROBLEM with an "equitable substitute" either, such as:

"NetBeans 7 does both 32-bit &/or 64-bit executable targetting in ALL languages capable of it that it supports"

That'd definitely work too.

Again, thanks for the answers, always willing to explore (or, re-explore) alternatives here, & sometimes asking 1st, helps... apk

Re:All 64-bit? IDE/executables/runtime script, etc (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35885760)

Was anyone able to follow the OPs stream of thought? I feel like I lost some cells just reading it.

Re:All 64-bit? IDE/executables/runtime script, etc (2)

tibit (1762298) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885820)

I think you missed the key issue: Netbeans is a java application. As long as you have a 64 bit java runtime installed, netbeans should happily run in that. There may be a native 32 bit executable that starts things up, but it'd be separate from the java runtime and won't prevent a 64 bit runtime from running. That's what I make of it, at least.

Do other langs. NetBeans 7 supports do 64-bit too? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886682)

That's pretty much the rest of it (I get what you mean by JAVA runtime portions, I used the 32-bit one last round & on 32-bit Windows Server 2003). My question now is, what about other languages it supports (C++ iirc, & possibly others as well: If the base compilers can target 64-bit, is NetBeans 7 able to do so also?)

May seem silly, but I know little about NetBeans (even though I messed with it a bit in JAVA 32-bit).

Thanks for the assist here.

APK

Re:Do other langs. NetBeans 7 supports do 64-bit t (1)

tibit (1762298) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886846)

NetBeans is an IDE. It mostly doesn't give crap about what the compilers do, apart from producing an "understandable" debug information file with the executable, and the debugger being able to control the executable and extract/modify memory and registers. Even if, somehow, NetBeans didn't come with necessary debugger functionality needed to debug 64 bit executables, or if it didn't have the project setup dialogs expose the 64 bit target option, it should be an easy fix (perhaps less than 1000 lines worth of changed/added code).

When I last tried (a couple years ago) it was fairly easy to coax NetBeans to use a Zilog C compiler for the ez8 target. I only had to add a JNI blurb to expose Zilog's debugger dll, and some glue between that and rest of the IDE.

Re:Do other langs. NetBeans 7 supports do 64-bit t (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886920)

Right I know - it's just a "Front" to compiler switches basically with some help files & code completions (other features in GUI) for compilers/languages it "Fronts" for.

However - on those notes, what about SYNTAX code completion differences between 64 bit targets in say, vars declared or rather, passed into, in function/method/procedure/subroutines calls or compiler switchwork (not the greatest examples, but I think you catch my drift)?

Aha: NOW WE'RE ON THE SAME "PAGE/WAVELENGTH", here:

"Even if, somehow, NetBeans didn't come with necessary debugger functionality needed to debug 64 bit executables, or if it didn't have the project setup dialogs expose the 64 bit target option, it should be an easy fix (perhaps less than 1000 lines worth of changed/added code)" - by tibit (1762298) on Wednesday April 20, @08:21PM (#35886846)

That's pretty much WHAT I have been asking... how is the support for going 32-bit to 64-bit in all the languages the NetBeans IDE handles as a "front" to compilers/languages it suppports>

APK

P.S.=> Without ME having to make changes to the IDE itself for say, as I said above, code-completion (or even optimization targets for diff. langs/compilers etc.) as you state you did for a Z-80 target CPU/platform? apk

Re:All 64-bit? IDE/executables/runtime script, etc (4, Informative)

Jahava (946858) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886164)

May not make sense to some of you, but I am trying to go completely 64-bit here (may sound strange, but string processing seems faster on it, even notepad.exe itself, by far, vs. 32-bit in native 32-bit OS environs no less - very noticeable!)

I'm going to go off-topic for a second to address your post. Firstly, preliminary research (I mean that) suggests that NetBeans is pure Java, so it will run in whatever JVM you have. Both 32- and 64-bit JVMs are offered, so it sounds like NetBeans will run in 64-bit mode. However, there is also information [netbeans.org] that suggests the NetBeans installer only supports the 32-bit JVM, so you'll likely have to install it with a 32-bit application, but can run it as a 64-bit application.

Regardless, I feel that you're a bit misguided about the nature of 64-bit architectures. Let me list for you the big advantages that 64-bit has over 32-bit:

  • (1): You can directly access a 64-bit virtual memory space. This means that individual applications aren't limited to 3 GB of virtual address space like they are in a 32-bit world.
  • (2): You have access to some more modern architecture features over 32-bit systems.
  • (3): A single register can hold 8 bytes instead of 4 bytes.

So let's break this down. (1) means that applications that use huge amounts of memory (over 3 GB) at the same time will likely run faster. Most applications come nowhere near this, and NetBeans is no exception. Unless you're running enterprise applications or database servers, you shouldn't notice any change from this strength, and even then, only those applications need to be 64-bit to gain the advantage. You can use 32-bit NetBeans to build a 64-bit GlassFish application.

(2) means that your system's paging layouts and execution environment can take advantage of some of the offerings of the modern architecture for both security and efficiency. This is almost entirely handled by the kernel, meaning that if you're running a 64-bit kernel, you're fine. Actually, modern 32-bit kernels can also take advantage of 64-bit architecture security features, so either way you're good. A 64-bit kernel can easily run 32-bit applications, so (2) alone isn't a reason to favor 64-bit applications.

Finally, (3) means that certain operations dealing with gigantic numbers will be more efficient. It also means that compilers can do some slight optimization tricks on non-huge values. Unless you're running a math-intensive application (MatLab, Mathematica, etc.) , you shouldn't notice any difference from this.

I suppose, in summary, that your claim that even Notepad runs faster in 64-bit seems unlikely. Most applications gain no noticeable advantage being 32-bit over 64-bit. If you care about efficiency, use a 64-bit kernel, and run whatever applications are most convenient. If you want to read up on 64-bit architectures, check out Wikipedia [wikipedia.org] .

Yes, I know - I didn't express myself well perhaps (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886770)

Initially - The majority portions of your reply (very detailed) I knew already. Thanks though, pretty accurate rundown.

However, yes, & I don't blame you - You may not believe it, but some operations I've done in notepad.exe in 32-bit OS environs (replace, from edit menu) is FASTER in the 64-bit model on Windows 7 64-bit.

Seems nuts, & I would have said the same as you pretty much (i.e. -> You're not crossing over 4gb size limit of data in Win32 using a file that's only 40mb in size, & not streamed, but "block read" etc./ et al )

The part about the 2gb/2gb default memory split (though you used 3gb/1gb split iirc) I knew about in Windows or 64 bit in general but in Windows you have to do a switch in boot.ini to enable in for 32-bit OS'... etc./et al.

That MAY be part of it!

Or, perhaps, notepad.exe (for whatever reasons) has parts written better in 64 bit, but...

I am not kidding you, replace works faster on the same data in 64bit using notepad.exe on Windows 7 than it did in 32-bit notepad.exe in Windows Server 2003, with the same size data both times, & many times each over years now.

APK

P.S.=> I do 16/32/64 bit programming for years now professionally & otherwise... it's why I asked about NetBeans having 64-bit target capabilities for ALL languages the IDE supports... can NetBeans 7, do that (in a nutshell)... apk

Re:Yes, I know - I didn't express myself well perh (1)

Jahava (946858) | more than 3 years ago | (#35888422)

Initially - The majority portions of your reply (very detailed) I knew already. Thanks though, pretty accurate rundown.

However, yes, & I don't blame you - You may not believe it, but some operations I've done in notepad.exe in 32-bit OS environs (replace, from edit menu) is FASTER in the 64-bit model on Windows 7 64-bit.

Thanks, appreciate that. It's not whether or not I believe you so much as whether or not I can justify what you're asserting with (what I know of) the underlying technology. In this case, for example, I would expect the difference in performance to be much more tightly bound to the OS than to the application. For example, 32-bit Windows Server 2003 versus 64-bit Windows 7, you're testing different versions of Notepad on different operating systems. They have different scheduler optimizations, different background loads, and, to a significant extent, different internals. Not a good test!

32-bit Notepad on 64-bit Windows 7 versus 64-bit Notepad on 64-bit Windows 7 would be a test to run, and you would definitely have to do an accurate benchmark. I can't think, off the top of my head, why one would perform noticeably different then the other. One other poster mentioned cache coherency, but I tend to disagree in the common case, since regular (i.e., non-memory-intensive) applications share the same small virtual address space as their 32-bit equivalents.

otherwise... it's why I asked about NetBeans having 64-bit target capabilities for ALL languages the IDE supports... can NetBeans 7, do that (in a nutshell)... apk

So as far as I can tell, NetBeans modules (which add language support) are pure Java, and therefore will run in the JVM of your choice, be it 32-bit or 64-bit.

Cheers!

Re:All 64-bit? IDE/executables/runtime script, etc (3, Interesting)

cbhacking (979169) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886774)

There's actually a downside to 64-bit as well: cache coherency is poorer, so unless you're actually taking advantage of 64-bit capabilities your Notepad or other simple app might actually be a little bit slower because cache misses will occur more often.

How complete's say, 64-bit C++ support etc./ et al (0, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886996)

String processing work I've done in notepad.exe works faster in 64-bit Windows 7 than it does for me in Windows Server 2003, 32-bit...

Specifically, the edit menu REPLACE function & with the same size data and same file, everything.

Any largish text file exhibits it for me in fact doing that operation.

There IS a noticeable diff. in speed of it.

Unless notepad.exe is rewritten better in Win7 64 than it is in WinSrv 2003, I am not sure what could be the cause here.

On cache coherency, that's really only about SMP/HT isn't it? Multi-CPU setups SHARING data in the cache areas...

What this boils down to is this (I must not be expressing myself well today):

HOW COMPLETE IS THE SUPPORT IN NETBEANS, for 64-bit, FOR LANGUAGES OTHER THAN JAVA? ( in a nutshell, in bold - I asked this of another replier here, & thanks for your time... )

APK

P.S.=> Anyhow - Weird part is, the file itself it only around 40-50mb tops, not streamable afaik in text file data alone via notepad.exe, & well beneath 32-bit 4gb size limits (2gb memory to OS, & 2gb memory (both virtual) to notepad.exe by default)... apk

Re:All 64-bit? IDE/executables/runtime script, etc (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886686)

May not make sense to some of you, but I am trying to go completely 64-bit here (may sound strange, but string processing seems faster on it, even notepad.exe itself, by far, vs. 32-bit in native 32-bit OS environs no less - very noticeable!)

Lemme guess. It particular shines on host file processing:)

Just large text files in general on REPLACE ops (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886854)

String processing work I've done in notepad.exe works faster in 64-bit Windows 7 than it does for me in Windows Server 2003, 32-bit... specifically, the edit menu REPLACE function & with the same size data and same file, everything. Any largish text file exhibits it for me in fact doing that operation. There IS a noticeable diff. in speed of it. Unless notepad.exe is rewritten better in Win7 64 than it is in WinSrv 2003, I am not sure what could be the cause here.

APK

P.S.=> Weird part is, the file itself it only around 40-50mb tops, not streamable afaik in text file data alone via notepad.exe, & well beneath 32-bit 4gb size limits (2gb memory to OS, & 2gb memory (both virtual) to notepad.exe by default)... apk

Re:All 64-bit? IDE/executables/runtime script, etc (2)

jensend (71114) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886716)

Right now the 64-bit JRE is not an overall win unless you really need lots of memory per app. Java is really pointer-intensive, and doubling the size of pointers hurts. The 64-bit JRE does some on-the-fly compression to try to minimize the pain by using pointer compression (for instance, at most 40 or so bits of your pointers are used on current architectures, so it'll try to use that fact), but it's still gonna hurt.

Why would the word length and ABI of the apps you build in native-compiled languages using NetBeans depend on NetBeans? I'm sure you can just set it up to pass the relevant options to the compilers &c.

I realize 4 JAVA it's runtimes but what about (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886964)

other languages that NetBeans 7 supports: Yes, the compilers "beneath" the mask of the NetBeans IDE may support 64-bit, but does NetBeans in former OR this version, in your guys' experience @ least, do as well as it does for JAVA, but instead say for C++ or the other possible languages NetBeans handles? For things like compiler switch optimizations, code completion (little things mostly, some bigger)...

This is hard to express to you - it really comes down to:

HOW COMPLETE IS THE SUPPORT IN NETBEANS, for 64-bit, FOR LANGUAGES OTHER THAN JAVA? ( in a nutshell, in bold)

APK

P.S.=> Thanks for your info. on this, & others replying also if I did not tell they the same... apk

Re:I realize 4 JAVA it's runtimes but what about (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35887098)

go forth and die !

FORTH (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35888384)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) [wikipedia.org]

Are you trying to tell me NetBeans 7 supports that too?

APK

P.S.=> This is only a joke... or does it? apk

Re:All 64-bit? IDE/executables/runtime script, etc (1)

HJED (1304957) | more than 3 years ago | (#35889062)

Netbeans runs the same as you Java install. (if you have 64-bit java netbeans is 64-bit if you 32-bit java netbeans is a 32-bit app).
On windows you may need to download the platform independent version to run in 64-bit mode (can't remember).
Netbeans follows the standards for the language you are using for syntax checking and code completion, you specify the compiler/SDK you want to use for each project, usually netbeans auto-detects SDK install if you specify there installation directory.
Netbeans works with 32 and 64-bit compilers.

Thank you, that's as close an answer as I needed (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35890334)

See subject-line, & this was the line from your reply that helped:

"Netbeans follows the standards for the language you are using for syntax checking and code completion, you specify the compiler/SDK you want to use for each project, usually netbeans auto-detects SDK install if you specify there installation directory. Netbeans works with 32 and 64-bit compilers" - by HJED (1304957) on Thursday April 21, @12:17AM (#35889062) Homepage

Again, thanks. I was aware of the 32/64 bit part with JAVA, but I was mostly curious on OTHER languages' support (how accurate is it, how good is code completion. help files etc./et al) really... & I think your reply answers it best. C++ support was the one I was TRULY the most curious about actually...

APK

P.S.=> Now, I don't know why the heck an honest question from me was down moderated here, but there you are. It's slashdot... lol! apk

Swing (0)

Kufat (563166) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885812)

I'm surprised that Swing is still being developed. It seems like they should just add SWT to the official spec...it looks better, performs better, and seems to be much more popular among developers of nontrivial Java GUI programs. Granted they'd need to add a fallback for unusual platforms with no native widgets to use, but that should be relatively small compared to the overall work needed.

Re:Swing (2)

kaffiene (38781) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886860)

I prefer Swing by a long shot. SWT was prettier and slightly faster than Swing when it was initially released. Neither of those are true any more.

Re:Swing (1)

shutdown -p now (807394) | more than 3 years ago | (#35887264)

Swing still has those fugly non-native (pretending to be native, but very poorly done) file open/save dialogs. That's one major annoyance.

IntelliJ (1)

Maltheus (248271) | more than 3 years ago | (#35885872)

For me the gold standard will always be Intellij. I liked Netbeans the last time I tried it a couple of years ago, but it was too buggy for regular use (like creating thousands of temp directories for no reason). I use Eclipse for specialized development since many vendors will provide plugins that make it worth it (barely). But I always come back to IntelliJ for its more intuitive handling. It's simply the best IDE I've used in any language.

Re:IntelliJ (1)

kaffiene (38781) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886872)

Buggy? I use NB all day every day and I can't remember the last time I saw a bug in NB

Re:IntelliJ (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35887186)

I used it for three months in a Java class, and will never use that piece of shit ever again. It would randomly corrupt files of the UML plugin, meaning you'd lose the entire diagrams (literally days of work sometimes), and basically required that you backed up every 10 minutes. I wish my Java class was about patching netbeans. It would've been a more efficient use of my time than actually using the software.

Re:IntelliJ (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35887708)

I was editing some piece of shit php file from os commerce and it would lock up 6.9.1 hard.

Re:IntelliJ (1)

timeOday (582209) | more than 3 years ago | (#35888066)

NetBeans 6.8 crashes a couple times per day for me.

Re:IntelliJ (2)

happyhamster (134378) | more than 3 years ago | (#35887368)

Not sure what you are talking about. I have personally seen NetBeans used by a large company (who is also a defense contractor, albeit not for this project) as their main Java IDE. The project was mission-critical transportation control system. Incidentally, it was about 2 years ago, around your point of reference. So, I'd say that assuming the IDE is buggy just because it appears to you that it creates "thousands of temp dirs" which you have no idea why is very far fetched. NetBeans is a nice, stable IDE which thousand of people and companies use on a daily basis.

Re:IntelliJ (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35890332)

Couple of years, you say? We using NetBeans on a daily basis and we have zero issues. We even don't need to pay money, as we would be obligated in case of IntelliJ. Name me what is so cool in IntelliJ that we would start looking at it? Profiling? Monitoring? Editing? Integration with appservers? Extendability? What is so cool there?..

and with native Android development support? (1)

Locutus (9039) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886022)

I didn't think so. A plugin it must be.

LoB

Re:and with native Android development support? (1)

snookiex (1814614) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886174)

Almost everything in Netbeans is a plugin. The problem is that it was born as a Java-only IDE (many years ago) while Eclipse has been always marketed as a meta IDE. Things have changed and thanks to the Netbeans Platform [netbeans.org] it can be easily extended. By the way, I'm a fanboy :)

No Python plugin (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886214)

Sadly, the Python plugin that worked in the 6.X series seems to be no longer available for Netbeans 7 ...

Re:No Python plugin (2)

thetoastman (747937) | more than 3 years ago | (#35887672)

I haven't tried this yet, since I rarely program in Python. I won't start a language war, but I really seriously do not like Python (and I've tried several times). I'll try again when I have some free time.

At any rate, the Python plugin has moved to community status (along with Ruby, and UML). The UML plugin has been struggling for quite a while, but hopefully the same fate won't happen with the Ruby and Python plugins.

From the forum, here's how to get the Python plugin into NetBeans 7.

Python on NetBeans 7 [netbeans.org]

The last post in that topic shows what to do.

On another note, I've used NetBeans 7 RC 2, and liked it OK. 6.9.1 seemed to be a bit faster, even with the huge amount of plugins I throw at it. I'll probably post a little more about my thoughts once I've installed it and run a few projects through it and Tomcat 7.

As far as Eclipse is concerned, I can never manage to create a stable and upgradeable Eclipse installation. Some plugin compatibility war always ends up making my environment unstable, and I just have to trash the installation and start over again. I like a lot of things about Eclipse, but keeping an Eclipse menagerie stable is not one of them.

Scala (1)

akeeneye (1788292) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886632)

To hell with this, where's my built-in Scala 2.8.x and SBT support? Instead I get PHP and "Guided installation to JDBC driver". Nice. Thanks.

Re:Scala (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886776)

Get back us when your language grows up and requires semi-colons.

Re:Scala (1)

akeeneye (1788292) | more than 3 years ago | (#35886808)

Get back to us when you're no longer an AC.

Re:Scala (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35887242)

Get back to us when someone will care enough about Scala and SBT to actually bother logging in to respond to one of the five users of your language.

Re:Scala (1)

akeeneye (1788292) | more than 3 years ago | (#35887384)

Get back to us when you aren't an AC *and* you've heard of, oh, companies like LinkedIn, EDFT, Twitter, Novell, the Guardian, Xebia, Xerox, FourSquare, Sony, Siemens, Thatcham, OPower, GridGain, AppJet, Reaktor [cut&paste from scala-lang.org] and my dev group. There are some good articles on the net about some of these companies and their Scala experiences, and if you can't read, some videos too. But don't get back to us before you can count beyond five.

Re:Scala (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35888198)

Wow Twitter, fuck me then. You're ready for prime-time Scala.

where's the perl? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35886788)

I love Netbeans and wish I didn't have to open up another window to get a full featured perl IDE.
I have been hoping for perl support for the past several releases and aside from rumors on forums
there hasn't been much to this.
Also, why hasn't someone picked up maintenance of the latex module!
Aaaarggghhhhh!

Re:where's the perl? (1)

thetoastman (747937) | more than 3 years ago | (#35887730)

Yeah, I would like a Perl plugin as well. OK, don't laugh! I still write Perl code on occasion.

There have been rumors floating around like you mentioned, and I think that there is even an alpha plugin that does syntax highlighting. Unfortunately, there isn't much else.

I end up using Perl Padre [perlide.org] for my Perl programming, but like you I'm not wild about running multiple IDEs.

http://www.fullmalls.com (-1, Offtopic)

xiaojiekytt (2053178) | more than 3 years ago | (#35887512)

Click on our website: ( http://www.fullmalls.com/ [fullmalls.com] ) Website wholesale various fashion shoes, such as Nike, Jordan, prada, also includes the jeans, shirt, bags, hats and decoration. Personality manufacturing execution systems (Mes) clothing, Grab an eye bag coat + tide bag Air jordan(1-24)shoes $30 Handbags(Coach l v f e n d i d&g) $35 Tshirts (Polo ,ed hardy,lacoste) $15Jean(True Religion,ed hardy,coogi) $30Sunglasses(Oakey,coach,gucci,A r m a i n i) $15 New era cap $12 Bikini (Ed hardy,polo) $20accept paypal and free shipping ( http://www.fullmalls.com/ [fullmalls.com] )

GWT (1)

BassKnight (525986) | more than 3 years ago | (#35887602)

I really like NB (fast, unbloated, compact), but for GWT applications development Eclipse is superior.

Still butt ugly on Ubuntu (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | more than 3 years ago | (#35889394)

I can't stand it under Ubuntu. Netbeans does not use Ubuntu's Xorg fonts and it looks ugly and way out of place. Not only are the same fonts not used but they are not LCD friendly sub pixeled rendered in the same way. My guess is a hinting bug is in there as well. I reported this bug 2 years ago and they still have not fixed it claiming it was Sun's problem with their JDK.

It looks fantastic on Fedora.

Netbeans has got a bad rap because of this bug from Ubuntu users as it looked very Swingish style.

No, I'm still not talking to Oracle (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#35889412)

Tell Oracle I'm still not talking to them after what they did to OpenSolaris. He can take back his "Net Beans" -- that's HARDLY an apology.

HTML5 support (1)

sdiz (224607) | more than 3 years ago | (#35889454)

My vim have HTML5 editing support 10 years ago!

Load More Comments
Slashdot Account

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?

Don't worry, we never post anything without your permission.

Submission Text Formatting Tips

We support a small subset of HTML, namely these tags:

  • b
  • i
  • p
  • br
  • a
  • ol
  • ul
  • li
  • dl
  • dt
  • dd
  • em
  • strong
  • tt
  • blockquote
  • div
  • quote
  • ecode

"ecode" can be used for code snippets, for example:

<ecode>    while(1) { do_something(); } </ecode>
Create a Slashdot Account

Loading...