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Apple: "We must Have Comprehensive Location Data"

samzenpus posted more than 2 years ago | from the I-always-feel-like-somebody's-watching-me dept.

Privacy 556

An anonymous reader writes "Apple's iPhone 3G, iPhone 3GS, the iPhone 4, and iPad models are keeping track of consumers whereabouts. Mac computers running Snow Leopard and even Windows computers running Safari 5 are being watched. But the question is why? 'To provide the high quality products and services that its customers demand, Apple must have access to the comprehensive location-based information,' Apple says."

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556 comments

So, who's the "customer"? (4, Insightful)

GodfatherofSoul (174979) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921308)

Your users or world governments?

Re:So, who's the "customer"? (5, Insightful)

perbert (241785) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921420)

Your users or world governments?

Advertisers.

Re:So, who's the "customer"? (4, Interesting)

wireloose (759042) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921488)

Exactly. Google's facing lawsuits from around the world for collecting "private" data. Does Apple face the same issue?

Re:So, who's the "customer"? (0, Troll)

x*yy*x (2058140) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921578)

At least Apple buries the fact somewhere in some deep EULA (I guess). Google didn't ask anyone when it collected WIFI data, nor does it ask for permission when people use google's search engine (or 90% of the other sites on internet that have google analytics)

Re:So, who's the "customer"? (4, Informative)

icebike (68054) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921886)

At least Apple buries the fact somewhere in some deep EULA (I guess). Google didn't ask anyone when it collected WIFI data, nor does it ask for permission when people use google's search engine (or 90% of the other sites on internet that have google analytics)

Well Hello there, Mr Double Standards Guy, Nice for you to drop by.....

Apple buries the fact >> Google Didn't ask permission? How are those even CLOSE to the same thing?

Let me fix it for you:
Apple Didn't Ask Permission. Google tells you right up Front.

Go to Google.com. Right there, mid screen is a Privacy link [google.com] .
Click it and read. I'm astounded you've never seen this page before. Flabbergasted actually.

And were you TOTALLY UNAWARE that Google gives you all the tools you need to [google.com] CONTROL [google.com] what info they keep about you? I'm astounded.

And why is it suddenly about Google? Apple is the one leaving years worth of tracking data on the phones
and transmitting it secretly to headquarters with no way for you to opt out.
 

Re:So, who's the "customer"? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921600)

Exactly. Google's facing lawsuits from around the world for collecting "private" data. Does Apple face the same issue?

No apple is liberal collecting data.

Re:So, who's the "customer"? (1)

JaredOfEuropa (526365) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921466)

Asking questions that are better left unasked. Just hope no one will come mod you down... in person.

Re:So, who's the "customer"? (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921564)

Riiiiight, because governments are rushing to validate the statements of irrelevant slashbots (myself very much included) by disappearing them?

Re:So, who's the "customer"? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921888)

Whoever said the GP was talking about governments? All Apple has to do is use that location data to find the nearest Machead sleeper cells nearby to "activate", and...

That smells like (1)

Darkenole (149792) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921316)

Bullshit!

Re:That smells like (2)

peragrin (659227) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921440)

that was my thought. I was withholding judgement until Apple actually opened their mouths.

apparently they decided to stick their feet into their mouths.

then again there is no indication that apple actually gets any of the location data. unlike google which only keeps a few days locally but transmits it to google regularly(who knows how many days they store at google) .

Re:That smells like because it is (2)

clang_jangle (975789) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921596)

that was my thought. I was withholding judgement until Apple actually opened their mouths.
apparently they decided to stick their feet into their mouths.

It's called "quote mining". The explanation* [house.gov] for the location data is really quite straightforward. Apple isn't doing anything here that isn't also being done by Google, only the method varies.

*pdf warning

Re:That smells like because it is (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921728)

So your argument is that since one group does something bad, then another group can do that too? That makes you a fanboi.

Re:That smells like because it is (2)

tripleevenfall (1990004) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921904)

His argument is that if someone else does it, it's NOT bad.

Further, I'm sure he would posit that Apple is trustworthy, as is Google, so it's no big deal to wear a tracking device for them.

Re:That smells like (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921648)

TFA says they haven't said whether the data is sent up to Apple, but that Apple says if the want to it's "within their right to do so".

Yeah, no thanks.

Re:That smells like (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921512)

Bullshit!

No it's not. That information is needed for the "Find-A-Homo" app. Th Republican's are really big on that app - don't know why. And the "Find-A- Public-Restroom" app.

I don't have time to find the sites. Today is worship the Chocolate Rabbit and Egg day.

Praise be the Easter Bunny - who the Jews killed and ate.

Goverment! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921320)

OK Government, for god sake protect us from this.

Re:Goverment! (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921454)

OK Government, for god sake protect us from this.

I have protected myself from this: I don't have or use any Apple product or service. Why would I need government for that?

You'd have a point if Apple held a monopoly. They don't.

OR, don't buy? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921814)

How about a simpler solution: DON'T BUY if you don't like it!

Still no answer. (4, Insightful)

El_Muerte_TDS (592157) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921324)

Still no answer to why they need that information.

Re:Still no answer. (4, Insightful)

Stan92057 (737634) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921450)

For them and there partners to sell us stuff they think we want or need for our own good. I don't own an apple anything so this doesn't affect me directly but it will when every corporation starts to keep a track of us. Until the day comes when congress puts a leash on theses spying tactics,its only going to get worse. And as history teaches us it will take an act of congress to stop it. I don't want to be followed for advertising purposes. thats a service for THEM not us. anything like this must be opt in as we see it takes security experts to even find out there following us.

Re:Still no answer. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921506)

'To provide the high quality products and services that its customers demand.'
Mac users are more liberal, [slashdot.org] so it only makes sense that Communist era Big Brother would be used to make sure that the people are buying the quality products and services that Apple demands.

Re:Still no answer. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921910)

Uh, liberalism is capitalistic, comrade. You know, that whole free market thing.

Re:Still no answer. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921704)

I call BS on Apples part. None of the products or services that I use with Apple have anything to do with my location. Plain and simple they are spying on me for no valid reason. They should offer an Opt out, or better yet an Opt in.

Re:Still no answer. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921742)

And you are, what, surprised by this? It's an obvious policy to never, ever give a direct answer to any question you ask them, only to the questions noone asked.

No thanks dude. (0)

rolfwind (528248) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921336)

Next computer and phone will not be a mac then. /previous Apple customer.

Re:No thanks dude. (1)

Weezul (52464) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921540)

You were silly for ever sing their phone. I'd imagine that /etc/hosts can cure these issues for their laptops.

Re:No thanks dude. (3, Funny)

Frosty Piss (770223) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921826)

Next computer and phone will not be a mac then. /previous Apple customer.

I'm sorry, but your response pretty much proves that you are full of shit. A *TRUE* Apple customer would not respond the way you did, so I call "bullshit" on your post. I do not believe you own *any* Apple products.

Hmmm (2)

RenHoek (101570) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921338)

I don't think I'm the only one that has a problem with Apple only saying: "Hey guy, you know, just trust us!"

Re:Hmmm (4, Informative)

Frosty Piss (770223) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921864)

"By using any location-based services on your iPhone, you agree and consent to Apple's and its partners' and licensees' transmission, collection, maintenance, processing and use of your location data to provide such products and services," Sewall's letter reads, citing Apple's End User Agreement. News? Not really. Unless you totally ignore the EULA. None the less, it is there.

rtfa (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921350)

Old quote bolted onto new news.

"In June 2010, Congressmen Edward J. Markey, D-Mass., and Joe Barton, R-Texas wrote a letter to Apple... ...In response the company's general counsel Bruce Sewall wrote a letter... ..."To provide the high quality products and services that its customers demand, Apple must have access to the comprehensive location-based information," Sewall told Congress in the letter."

Re:rtfa (1)

Concerned Onlooker (473481) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921550)

Also from the article:

"Apple also stores the location information in a database only accessibly to Apple, the letter says."

Sewall was lying or badly misinformed.

I'm not sure I would mind so much if all this data sharing with advertisers meant that I got my phone for free. I am irked that they expect me to provide advertisers with a wealth of data AND pay for the privilege. I might be switching to Android. I just wish the Android phones didn't feel so cheaply built. Or perhaps someone does make one with a glass screen?

Well you know the saying... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921356)

The best Korea is Apple Korea.

Old news. (5, Informative)

romanval (556418) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921358)

This article is referencing a reply Apple wrote on June 2010.

Re:Old news. (2)

jesseck (942036) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921476)

This article is referencing a reply Apple wrote on June 2010.

Old news or not, it sounds like Apple's stance hasn't changed.

Only two uses for that data (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921366)

Two uses for that data:
1. Advertisements
2. Police

and of course the 3rd one that Apple do not want to think about:
3. Thieves can use it, to know when your house is empty.

Re:Only two uses for that data (1)

ArAgost (853804) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921746)

3. Thieves can use it, to know when your house is empty.

I'm quite sure that thieves don't rely on stealing your phone and do forensic analysis on it to determine you're not home.

Re:Only two uses for that data (1)

Dracos (107777) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921782)

You have summed up Minority Report. Now the question is, how does Apple relate to pre-crime?

Re:Only two uses for that data (3, Funny)

The End Of Days (1243248) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921784)

Well it also makes paranoid types bug out over unlikely scenarios, which entertains me, which I guess is yet another use.

Not one they intended, I'm sure.

Why? Because we know what's best for you... (2)

elFisico (877213) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921370)

It is OK to keep a log of the devices whereabouts... on the device. It is not OK to transfer that data to another entity without explicit permission of the devices owner... and better ask one time too often for that permission...

Re:Why? Because we know what's best for you... (1)

mr_lizard13 (882373) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921652)

Which is why I'm not quite so up in arms about this, because the data doesn't get transferred to another entity. It's on the device, and on the computer that device gets sync'd with, and nowhere else.

Many apps require location services by design, duh (1, Troll)

stewbacca (1033764) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921384)

Jesus (appropriate on Easter Sunday) let it rest already.

Obviously many apps for the iPhone REQUIRE location information because that's the whole point of the app. Of course users want location services to be turned on when they are doing things like checking a map, browsing for restaurants, using real estate apps, etc. I also like my images to be geo-tagged. It's a feature I want. If you feel differently, then click the "don't allow" button when prompted.

Next non-story, please.

Re:Many apps require location services by design, (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921414)

If you feel differently, then click the "don't allow" button when prompted.

Next non-story, please.

There's a difference between needing your current location to browse for a nearby restaurant than from storing all your location and movements over time without permission.

Re:Many apps require location services by design, (1)

gislifb (1979154) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921428)

But why on earth is that information kept? They could easily just dump old information, I'm thinking maybe 24hours. And phone owners should be able to turn this feature on or off as they please!

Re:Many apps require location services by design, (2)

gnasher719 (869701) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921546)

But why on earth is that information kept? They could easily just dump old information, I'm thinking maybe 24hours. And phone owners should be able to turn this feature on or off as they please!

You post on Slashdot and can't think of a reason why? iPhones with GPS help updating Apple's database by reporting precise information about nearby routers to Apple's database. Now you don't want your phone to report the same information over and over and over again. Like my phone sending exactly where my neighbours' routers are every five minutes. And all the routers on my way to work twice every day. So how do you avoid this? You keep a list of known locations that you have sent, and don't send that information again.

Now maybe the developer who wrote the code should have thought of the paranoia, sheer stupidity, and sometimes hatred of the public, and kept the information somehow different, for example with some hashcode. But apparantly he wasn't paranoid enough himself and just wrote code to get the job done.

Re:Many apps require location services by design, (1)

Rijnzael (1294596) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921432)

And those apps require that all location data be recorded and saved to a file all the time?

Re:Many apps require location services by design, (1)

JaredOfEuropa (526365) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921510)

I am fine with such apps making use of my current location. After asking me nicely, that is. And all apps on the iPhone do that: the first time (or 2 times) you use them you'll get a popup asking permission to use the current location. That is not quite the same thing as the phone tracking my location without my knowledge, and tracking that location over time to boot.

Re:Many apps require location services by design, (4, Insightful)

pla (258480) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921654)

Obviously many apps for the iPhone REQUIRE location information because that's the whole point of the app.

They need to know my current location. Period. My every step for the past six months, not so much.

Not to say I can't think of uses that do need to record your movements (apps like jogging logs come to mind), but those don't apply to the vast majority of people and, once installed, can do their own - user initiated - tracking.


If you feel differently, then click the "don't allow" button when prompted.

Does the iPhone actually have such a button (in general, not just relating to tagging pictures)? If so, I would agree with you that this amounts to nothing but clueless end-users. I do not suspect that as the case, however.

Re:Many apps require location services by design, (1)

cloudmaster (10662) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921678)

Where's the preference which says "please don't store my information forever, and don't send it to Apple so that they can store it forever + give it to any other business partner (including the police for a profiling database) who they decide would like to know where I've been."? Besides, there's no way to disable all location information, as a cell phone will be connected to a tower pretty much all the time, which identifies your location down to within a couple of miles. And this database, if you've read the articles, is a list of cell phone towers and relative signal strengths - which the new app demonstrates can be used for mapping where you've been.

Yes, the cell company has this information. I agreed to that when I bought my phone (which isn't an iPhone, BTW, but let's pretend it is for this). I even agreed to let apps access real-time location information. I did not, however, agree to have my phone store historical location data in a way that any other app can access, nor did I agree to send that information to the phone's manufacturer who has *no* legitimate use for that data.

fsck you apple, and google (1)

bl8n8r (649187) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921396)

aside from using gps or other applications which logically require the use of location data, i'm not seeing the need for constant logging.

Re:fsck you apple, and google (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921656)

Never, ever, allow a GPS device to be coupled to a transmitter that you don't have absolute control of. Nothing good can ever come of that.

Similar with 'national security' excuse. (0)

unity100 (970058) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921398)

"Why do we have to have these freedoms-infringing procedures ?"

"Why, to protect our national security"

Apple MUST have information on you which not only infringes on your freedoms, but also perils your personal information, because, they will 'provide better products' with it. And, without your knowledge or your approval !!!

When asked to define what 'national security' or 'better products' are, they fell flat on their face. Because they are just empty excuse words.

ITunes? (1)

EvilGiraffe (2014568) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921412)

If they're monitoring Windows systems via Safari, what about people with iTunes installed? Surely, by far, that's the most prevalent piece of Apple software on non-Apple platforms. Consequently, it would be the best means by which to gather data on customers. To be honest, I'd always thought I was being a little bit paranoid to so studiously avoid installing Apple products. I guess I was wrong.

Re:ITunes? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921858)

LoL.

I assume your post is a not-so-veiled attempt at getting people NOT to install Apple iTunes by your attempt at pure speculation.

Think of the users (4, Interesting)

nolife (233813) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921422)

Apple is doing it for the users regardless if they want it or not. Why not give them the ability to purge the data let them delete or purge the data regardless if they want it or not. It could be simple option somewhere that does not take away from the pristine user experience.

I call bullshit on the whole thing anyway. A database of where I was last week/month/year has very little benefit to advertisers. Any benefit it does have is far overshadowed by the users personal privacy of having that data available to Apple and whoever else can access that info. What if my bank account balance was available to them, sure, it would help advertisers but what is the downside to my privacy to give that info up?

The users do not want this.

To unclear (3, Insightful)

gnasher719 (869701) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921438)

Apple should have said what this really is about: Your iDevice can't determine its position by using the MAC addresses of nearby WiFi points unless Apple knows the locations of those WiFi points. And Apple's servers can't tell your iDevice where it is right now, unless the iDevice gives them the information that Apple's servers need to determine the location of your iDevice.

I wonder if all those people who helped OpenStreetMap are aware that OpenStreetMap knows the exact location where they were when they collected the data.

On the other hand, there is a website know where you can enter the MAC address of a router, and it will give you the location of that router, based on data on Google's servers. I hope Apple doesn't allow the same thing. I would hope even more that Google would put a stop to this. According to what Apple says, this is a black box: Only when the location software in the iPhone OS asks for the information about routers that are physically nearby will it receive location information. And in that case, anyone with a working GPS could have the same information anyway, so this is no privacy breach.

Re:To unclear (1)

QuasiSteve (2042606) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921628)

Apple should have said what this really is about: Your iDevice can't determine its position by using the MAC addresses of nearby WiFi points unless Apple knows the locations of those WiFi points. And Apple's servers can't tell your iDevice where it is right now, unless the iDevice gives them the information that Apple's servers need to determine the location of your iDevice.

Wait. the iDevice needs to tell the Apple Servers where it was days, weeks, even months ago... in order for the Apple Servers to tell the iDevice where it is?

That makes absolutely no sense.

Re:To unclear (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921664)

RTFA! Apple do not need location information for my Mac Pro, yet they collect it. We're not just talking about phones here.

Re:To unclear (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921718)

I wonder if all those people who helped OpenStreetMap are aware that OpenStreetMap knows the exact location where they were when they collected the data.

It sounds like a tautology. Am I wrong or that's the only way collecting location data can work?
Maybe you're asking if OpenStreetMap anonymizes the data it receives?

Spycoders (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921474)

Spycoding.

Yawn (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921500)

People use apps that need location data in order to work, are surprised that the phone stores the information for future reference. I'm sorry, did you think it operated on magic?

Shut the fuck up morons, don't use the apps if you're going to get your panties in a twist.

apple is pushing nazi computing talking like that (0)

Joe The Dragon (967727) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921508)

apple is pushing nazi computing talking like that. Now will the us army stop useing mac over this? what stopping apple from selling this data to any willing to pay even places like Iran?

Re:apple is pushing nazi computing talking like th (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921616)

Iran, really. Because like.... their.... well.... nazis? May be you should get your coat.

Re:apple is pushing nazi computing talking like th (1)

mr_lizard13 (882373) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921684)

You'd have to give Apple the data for them to do that.

Unlike your cell carrier, Apple isn't keeping tabs on where you've been. The data is being stored on the device, and on the computer it's sync'd with. Nowhere else.

who to say that data is not being upload to apple? (1)

Joe The Dragon (967727) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921764)

who to say that data is not being uploaded to apple?

Re:who to say that data is not being upload to app (1)

mr_lizard13 (882373) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921832)

Who is to say it is? That's a pretty wild assumption.

The creators of the 'iPhoneTracker' app (Alasdair Allan and Pete Warden) which analyses the data stored and represents it visually on a map have done some extensive research into this and have found no evidence that the data is transferred across the network to Apple, or anyone else.

That's not to say that I feel comfortable about the data being stored for so long in the first place, but suggesting that it's being collected and stored on Apple's servers needs at least a shred of evidence before I'd take that suggestion seriously.

Why? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921520)

Haven't all Apple drones been outfitted with anal probes anyway?

No excuse for lack of encryption. (4, Interesting)

metrometro (1092237) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921538)

I will concede the debate that permanently logged location information is required to run the features consumers want. I think it's false, and I think it's about iAds, but I'll concede it.

However, the lack of encryption or even simple hashing on this database is inexcusable. Unencrypted copies stored on every computer an iOS device syncs to! Inexcusable, irresponsible, sloppy software. A product which flings around my private data that way is a broken product, regardless of which features it offers. This is a stalkers dream. This will appear in every divorce court (That database is jointly owned property!). This will be used to bully and out gay college roommates (Physical access to your desktop? Yup). This will be used to keep tabs on employees work habits (Have iTunes on a work computer? Burned).

Apple made terrible software, and they are now informing us that they will continue to do so.

Re:No excuse for lack of encryption. (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921614)

Why on earth would you have iTunes on a work computer? You've got an iPhone, listen to music on that. Then you could have a phone charger at work, which won't leak any personal information except that you have an iPhone.

With that said, there is no excuse for leaving this data lying around on the user's computer. iTunes won't do anything for the user with it. Send it to Apple if Apple must have it, then remove temp files. I can see why you'd want to keep a log on the phone, but not why it needs to appear on your computer.

Re:No excuse for lack of encryption. (1)

metrometro (1092237) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921692)

For a lot of people who travel extensively (consultants), a workplace-assigned computer is their only laptop when on the road. This leads to lots of work-home blurring.

Re:No excuse for lack of encryption. (4, Insightful)

schnell (163007) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921762)

Why on earth would you have iTunes on a work computer?

You may need to have it if your employer uses iOS products. iTunes is required to activate an iPhone (or iPad), as well as for backing up the on-device storage and doing certain other things. I have a work-issued iPhone and I'm actually required to have iTunes on my work PC for syncing the iPhone and loading on corporate-signed apps from outside the public app store.

Re:No excuse for lack of encryption. (0)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921878)

Yeah, when I wrote it I forgot that employers have been jumping on the iBandwagon and buying iPhones for employees. Seems to me like Android would be more suitable to business but that assumes a lot.

Re:No excuse for lack of encryption. (1)

arikol (728226) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921624)

will someone mod this fella up, pls?

I have no problems with seeing possible technical reasons why this information may be useful to keep on the phone, but Apple, ENCRYPT IT!

Re:No excuse for lack of encryption. (1)

countertrolling (1585477) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921716)

Apple made terrible software, and they are now informing us that they will continue to do so.

Really? And what's the standard procedure for dealing with 'terrible software'? Apple stock is now over 300 dollars an ounce.. er.. share.. because of their 'terrible software'.

Re:No excuse for lack of encryption. (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921794)

Encrypt it?? why the fuck??

This is *user data*. If Apple were to encrypt it from the user, it would be even more evil than it already is! If users want to protect their private data from "stalkers" (maybe in your world everyone is a stalker to you), then maybe the users could *encrypt* their drives themselves instead of by some Apple's secret key??

But I guess you are right. Apple should have encrypted this information. After all, users should not know that Apple is tracking their every move for their own monetary gain.

Why? As Sting would say (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921558)

Every breath you take
Every move you make
Every bond you break
Every step you take
I'll be watching you

Every single day
Every word you say
Every game you play
Every night you stay
I'll be watching you

Oh can't you see
You belong to me
How my poor heart aches
With every step you take

Every move you make
Every vow you break
Every smile you fake
Every claim you stake
I'll be watching you

Privacies (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921560)

You aint's got em anymore.

"STOP BUYING Their Shit!" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921566)

"Oh, I didn't think of that."?? WTF

What? Me Worry? (-1, Flamebait)

Wingsy (761354) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921604)

I couldn't care less if Apple, a private investigator, or the US government knew my precise location 24/7. I'm not cheating on my wife, I'm not wanted by the FBI, and I'm not hiding from the IRS. So why would I give a shit?

I suspect that the location gathering they're doing will in some way enhance my portable experience. Like, if I *have* to see an ad for used cars, that I see one for areas I frequent rather than for some lot on the other side of the country. And when Apple releases Find My Friends, that it too will be more appropriate for my roaming areas. So relax and enjoy it... unless of course your wife is on to you.

Re:What? Me Worry? (4, Insightful)

NFN_NLN (633283) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921772)

I couldn't care less if Apple, a private investigator, or the US government knew my precise location 24/7. I'm not cheating on my wife, I'm not wanted by the FBI, and I'm not hiding from the IRS. So why would I give a shit?
 

You're obviously a moron so no amount of logic is going to change your mind. After all the information is already out there and you've chosen to ignore it so far.

Once everyone is logged and cataloged then police don't have to do their jobs anymore. Defense will change from "innocent until proven guilty" to "guilty until proven innocent based on a preponderance of the evidence". It has already happened, the most famous being finger prints. Finger prints are unique but matches are usually based on a few key markers. There have been plenty of cases where paper pushing monkeys blindly accept these key markers in cases to convict people. They had to hire professionals at their own expense to fight the system.

I just hope your iPhone whereabouts a linked to a high profile murder with no other suspects. The police will be pressured to get a conviction and with no other leads they will ride you like a $12 hooker trying to get you to confess... guilty or not. Sure you will most likely be found innocent, but that's after thousands of dollars in legal bills and having your like turned upside down.

The police government employees AND they're lazy. I wouldn't want them having this information. It's probably the first database they'll mine for leads rather than getting off their asses.

Re:What? Me Worry? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921892)

That is exactly my worry too, government workers don't think a criminal would be smart enough to turn off/leave at home/not have a smart phone. Those that do have a smart phone and simply drive/walk by a crime scene will be screwed. Not to mention if someone wanted to frame you cloning of your sim card or borrowing of your phone would be a great way to manufacture evidence that you were near the scene.

Re:What? Me Worry? (1, Troll)

The End Of Days (1243248) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921838)

You're not allowed to be okay with it. The only acceptable opinion is the hivemind opinion that this is pure inexcusable evil.

Re:What? Me Worry? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921870)

If you don't care about your location data being made public, then why don't you just post your name and address on this forum? Privacy is important and necessary.

Sounds good (1)

NetNed (955141) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921660)

Bernie Madoff only needed peoples money to ensure they got the most potential for their investments.

HP webOS (1)

Kupfernigk (1190345) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921690)

Does anybody know if webOS does this? What is the least evil phone operating system out there now Symbian has been buried at the crossroads?

Re:HP webOS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921912)

Here, this one: http://www.mobilecashmate.co.uk/assets/images/87/370/nokia%206310i%20front.png

Opportunity for MS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921790)

May be MS can use this as an opportunity to differentiate their mobile product and gain some market share. All they need to do is commit to not tracking any user on their mobile devices. The android business model is totally based on tracking users. It seems like iOS wants a big piece of this pie as well. Since MS will mainly be making their money off of software licenses they could create a campaign to target this.

Well... Ok then (1)

TheCarp (96830) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921806)

I guess if you need it you need it. There we go. Good thing I don't need an iPhone.

Why the timestamps ? (4, Insightful)

redelm (54142) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921828)

So Apple is beginning to reply over this blackeye. Excellent. Other posters have asked "who is the customer?" and that is a perfectly legitimate question. There ought at least have been some sort of consumer opt-out ala "DO_NOT_TRACK".

But beyond that, even granting _arguendo_ legitimacy to targetted advertising, what possible useful purpose do the detailed timestamps serve? A file with locations (when different from previous) would be equally as useful. Timestamps are for tracking & snooping, not local service advertising. If that were even ethical.

This argument is relatively important to Apple -- they might well be accused of "unauthorized access to computing systems" (aka cracking) unless they can show the tracking is somehow essential to the access they have been authorized (OS & app services). Just because they're a mfr/OS vendor does not grant them automatic permission to do what they want. The law is not written that way, and penalizes those whose use exceeds the owner's authorization.

At least for those running OS-X (3, Informative)

zuki (845560) | more than 2 years ago | (#35921862)

Using apps like Little Snitch, it's trivial to block the server requests (which happen about once a day) that the OS is making when it tries to 'phone home'.

They actually come in groups of three, including iphone-wu.apple.com, location.apple.com or something of that ilk.

This is obviously much more of an issue on any iOS device, where the user has little to no control of what's taking place behind the fancy window dressing, and for which no such firewall is made available for purchase through Apple's app store that I know of.

Anyway, for a computer that's staying in one place, a case could be made for the lack of need to know it is staying there all the time. Butt off my activities unless you give me the opt-in choice to be the one that decides whether to provide your company with this information or not. In fact, it could be argued that for home computers the only use for this sort of stuff is targeted advertising somewhere down the road, once users have accepted the idea that being tracked is normal.

good (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#35921926)

good! hahaa ~

http://www.queshao.com

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