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9 Features We May See In Ubuntu 11.10

timothy posted more than 3 years ago | from the working-teleporter dept.

Operating Systems 281

splitenz writes "Canonical's Ubuntu 11.04 'Natty Narwhal' may still be occupying much of the Linux world's attention, but at last week's Ubuntu Developer Summit in Budapest, the next version of the free and open source Linux distribution began to take form. A number of decisions were reportedly made about Ubuntu 11.10, or 'Oneiric Ocelot,' at the conference, while numerous other questions are still being debated. ... Here's a roundup of what's been reported so far."

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281 comments

Let's hope for another radical GUI change! (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161160)

Because end users hate it when they upgrade their OS only to find it doesn't look completely different

Re:Let's hope for another radical GUI change! (-1)

SilverHatHacker (1381259) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161312)

I'm sure the developers hate it when the users update their OS and actually bother to read the release notes, too.

Re:Let's hope for another radical GUI change! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161338)

Because end users hate it when they upgrade their OS only to find it doesn't look completely different

Your comment seems relevant to some other article?

Re:Let's hope for another radical GUI change! (3, Interesting)

rubycodez (864176) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161388)

we sure hate it when 11.04's ssh client and sshd have all kinds of connection-breaking issues. That pisses me off way more than the half-baked Unity I can choose to not use.

Re:Let's hope for another radical GUI change! (1)

Stormwatch (703920) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161414)

Another radical GUI change couldn't make things any worse, could it?

I gave up on them... (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161800)

...when they went with the wimpy sounding Maverick Meerkat instead of Masturbating Monkey. That's when I knew I could not take them seriously anymore.

Re:I gave up on them... (1)

lorenlal (164133) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162018)

I'm hoping that in two releases they can come up with something better than an ocelot... Of course going with your theme, I'm sure they can find some name that may be kitteh related....

Only thing I can come up with is... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36162172)

...Orgasming Octupussy.

Re:Let's hope for another radical GUI change! (4, Interesting)

Trifthen (40989) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161904)

I know one of the features is "me not using it anymore." 10.10 is probably the last version I'll ever use, and I've been looking at Mint or just going straight Debian.

I love apt, otherwise I'd consider an RPM based distro.

Re:Let's hope for another radical GUI change! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36162316)

Try PCLinux

Re:Let's hope for another radical GUI change! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36162332)

I love apt, otherwise I'd consider an RPM based distro.

DId you choose what computer to buy on the basis of the box it came in?

Basing your choice of distro entirely on the package system it uses seems a bit short sighted to me. synaptic is definitely better than yumex, but not that much better.

Re:Let's hope for another radical GUI change! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36162222)

There's a typo in the headline. It should say "9 features we won't see anymore in Ubuntu 11.10". ;)

Because they decided that you don't need them anyway. And if you do, you better dumb down to the 2011 standard level quickly!

Ubawndo! It's what users crave! It's got Unity! [youtube.com]

When is... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161170)

.. Porny Playboy or Horny Hustler going to come out?

Re:When is... (3, Informative)

rubycodez (864176) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161510)

Ubuntu is animal-centric in release naming. For release naming with sexual connotations, I suggest migrating to Gaybuntu, Archhole, Hoin'SuSIE, Ephebian or maybe OpenBSD&M

Re:When is... (1)

ArcherB (796902) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161880)

Ubuntu is animal-centric in release naming. For release naming with sexual connotations, I suggest migrating to Gaybuntu, Archhole, Hoin'SuSIE, Ephebian or maybe OpenBSD&M

You forgot GayToo, FlapWare, DamnSmall and Yelper.

There are more, I'm sure

Re:When is... (1)

Dracos (107777) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162396)

Aye... but if they keep pushing their existing users away, no one will be left to enjoy the ravages of randy rabbit.

Re:When is... (0)

WorBlux (1751716) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162130)

Nothing stopping you from making a remix.

Killer App? (5, Insightful)

TheStonepedo (885845) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161208)

Ubuntu has gone soft. Its recent changes pushed me back to Debian. Why does it have to be targeted at social media, online music sales, etc.? Unless it has something to give that isn't better-known on another platform, there's no incentive for users to switch.
TFA is slashdotted or I'd cross my fingers hoping for just that feature.

Re:Killer App? (1)

0100010001010011 (652467) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161292)

Same here. I was locked to 10.04 because that was the last XBMC Live that worked well. Except because of Ubuntu's non-rolling update nature I was stuck at everything that came with 10.04 unless I started adding special repositories.

With Debian. I choose to run Sid, Testing, Stable. Stuff gets pushed forward all the time. Personally I run Sid (not experimental) and I've almost never had a problem.

My girlfriend may get introduced to XFCE because she's not having a fun time with Unity.
Day 1) Oh, it looks so Mac Like
Day 2) It Doesn't work like your Mac, how do I make it go away.

Re:Killer App? (3, Insightful)

Ethanol-fueled (1125189) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161498)

Still Using 9.10 here, and considering moving to Debian given the direction of Ubuntu. Some of the handful of recent converts I know stick with 9.10 because it Just Works(TM). The others who installed the 10.xx versions are suffering from stability bugs and inconsistent behaviors related to managing multiple user management (among other things) as well as those awful default Mac-style window controls which were totally unnecessary. (the ones I know who have almost always used Linux use RPM distros because it's what they work with, and/or window managers like Enlightenment because that's what they're coding).

Hey, Shuttleworth - how about a little less Steve Jobs in the next distro, huh?

Re:Killer App? (2)

DadLeopard (1290796) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161534)

Well, at least it worked for her! I'd have been willing to give it a try, BUT, they broke the Nvidia Driver I need to use it at all! Tried the Classic and it was full of bugs and glitches like disappearing and reappearing window decorations, and many other things! Luckily I have a separate /home partition, with that and a 10.10 CD, I got back up and running again! Have been trying Xubuntu 11.04 out and it works pretty well, but I miss some of the things that are in Ubuntu 10.10 by default, plus the ability to customize things there!

Re:Killer App? (1)

Compaqt (1758360) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161586)

Isn't the latest Debian Squeeze (6.0)? Why would you run Sid? (An Ubuntu user looking to get into Debian).

Also, on debian.org, it says (somewhere) that stuff is pushed into testing automatically (according to some given criteria), therefore they don't recommend it as a distribution. Comments?

Re:Killer App? (5, Informative)

cwebster (100824) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161768)

The release version is frozen in time, essentially. The only thing that a named release will get is security and some other important updates. As for stable, testing, and sid:

stable always points to the current named release (today squeeze, later something else). When the new release is released, if you are running stable, an apt-get dist-upgrade will pull down the new release.

New package versions are pushed into sid. Sid can be frustrating because you might update to a package with broken dependancies or other issues that will not install. Give it a few days and it'll probably be fixed.

After some period of time in Sid, those packages move to testing. Testing is where I run, as it is continually updated and I have not observed many instances of breakage. When its time for a release, testing goes through a freeze and then becomes stable. Or something like that.

If you want stability, run stable.
If you want cutting edge, run sid.
If you want a reasonable mix of both, run testing.

Re:Killer App? (4, Informative)

kvvbassboy (2010962) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161938)

Actually, Debian recommends running Sid over Testing [debian.org] , simply because bug fixes could potentially take longer to get into testing.

From personal experience, for a normal user I would recommend Sid too, because you get the latest software, and breakages happen very rarely.

Re:Killer App? (3, Informative)

oakgrove (845019) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161784)

Sid, i.e., unstable is the bleeding edge rolling release. For historical reasons, it actually tends to break less than testing which is called Wheezy right now. While Squeeze is indeed the latest stable release, it is frozen and will only get security updates until Wheezy becomes the new stable thus repeating the cycle. Debian usually runs on an eighteen to twenty four month cycle but it's really an Id-esque "it's done when it's done" kind of release pattern. The bottom line is, if you want traditional rock solid Debian stability, you go with stable which right now is called Squeeze. If you want a still relatively stable system that is constantly updated, go for Sid bearing in mind that you can't just download a Sid CD. You have to get stable or testing and upgrade it. I hope I haven't been unclear.

Re:Killer App? (1)

0100010001010011 (652467) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161786)

Sid is always "Unstable". (Like in the Movie).
"Unstable" (IMHO) has always been 'more' stable and newer than any Ubuntu release. As time rolls on each Ubuntu release gets farther and farther out of date while Sid continually gets updates from experimental.

By time stuff makes it into Stable, it's that STABLE. People that run high end websites would stick to stable. For my desktop, Unstable or Testing is just fine. And if something doesn't work, you can easily roll back a single package to testing or so with the '-t' flag.

the debian stable (1)

formfeed (703859) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162194)

"Unstable" (IMHO) has always been 'more' stable and newer than any Ubuntu release. ... By time stuff makes it into Stable, it's that STABLE

So if I switch from Ubuntu to Debian I could run Unstable to get something more stable? Or run Squeeze and wait for it to become stable, or Sid which would be stable, but will be frozen and could become quite unstable once I break it with newer packages. Testing would be unstable, but more stable than a new ubuntu release, which becomes stable over time, and as long as you stay with an LTS will be updated quite some time. Except when software you use goes to new versions, ubuntu LTS tends to have dependency problems and then it would be more stable to mix debian stable with unstable or even go with unstable and add the cutting edge you need from testing. Adding software from testing would make the traditionally stable debian-unstable quite unstable. But maybe less unstable than staying with ubuntu LTS and adding an untested ppa. Which could make your whole system unstable, and makes you wish you went with unstable to begin with so at least you would have a stable system.

Right?

Re:the debian stable (1)

icebraining (1313345) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162380)

Squeeze is actually the Stable release now. Testing is Wheezy.

The best option for stability with occasional upgrades of certain packages is Stable + Backports. Never mix Stable with Testing or Unstable.

Re:Killer App? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161956)

sid is *always* the unstable debian release (though probably not as unstable as ubuntu)

testing is basically (all but) stable, so its usually safe to include it in your apt sources

only repo to avoid is experimental

i think from memory it goes something like this:

new app/version -> experimental -> unstable (sid) -> testing -> stable

Re:Killer App? (1)

O('_')O_Bush (1162487) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161678)

Well, it's stupidly easy to switch out of Unity and forget about it. When you log in (once) change from Unity to classic in one of the log-in options. Tada, better Ubuntu.

Truly though, the only problem that I've had with 11.04 that wasn't present in 10.10 is that Google Desktop doesn't search as efficiently, do to what I suppose is some indexing issue. Nothing that would cause me to revert back a release.

Re:Killer App? (2)

Risen888 (306092) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162126)

Well, it's stupidly easy to switch out of Unity and forget about it.

Indeed it is. [debian.org]

other ways to avoid suck (2)

iggymanz (596061) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162310)

Yup, that's Ubuntu before the suckage added.

  Or Unbuntu with the suck massaged out: http://www.linuxmint.com/ [linuxmint.com]

    Too light to contain suck: http://www.archlinux.org/ [archlinux.org]

    Too tiny to hold suck: http://puppylinux.com/ [puppylinux.com]

    Got their suck fixed a few releases ago, it's all good now: http://www.fedoraproject.org/ [fedoraproject.org]

    fixed their suck a while ago too, lookin' good: http://www.freebsd.org/ [freebsd.org]
 
    supports all kinds of desktops that don't suck: http://www.mandriva.com/ [mandriva.com]

    roll your own without the suck: http://www.gentoo.org/ [gentoo.org]

   

Re:Killer App? (2)

iggymanz (596061) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162200)

yeah, but the next release there won't be a non-sucky alternative. best take the next 5.5 months to pick your next distro.

Plus, other major things are broken with 11.04, if you have certain routers or NAT devices, the ssh/sshd/ssl combination they put out will bite you in the ass. Spend a couple hours compiling a proper replacement from source and putting in the upstart and /etc/init.d - rc.d files and you might get cranky.

Re:Killer App? (2)

wrook (134116) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162340)

Well, it's stupidly easy to switch out of Unity and forget about it. When you log in (once) change from Unity to classic in one of the log-in options. Tada, better Ubuntu.

For those that like to feel like they are in control, run the Compiz Settting Manager (ccsm) and unclick the Unity plugin. Unity is then gone. You can run gnome-panel, or whatever the heck you want. What would be nicer is to have "Unity" as an option in the Appearances settings application, but they seem to have made it difficult to find that application...

The more I think about it, though, the more I find that Ubuntu really isn't for me. Originally I switched because I wanted a non-rolling distribution with fairly frequent releases. I felt that it didn't matter how it was set up because I would just set it up for myself anyway. But Ubuntu is increasingly making it difficult to choose a different setup than they like. I think this is fair. They are focused on creating a brand and want a single identifiable look and feel for people who want an "Ubuntu computer". But I'm not the customer they want and I think it might be time to move somewhere else (maybe back to Debian -- starting to miss the rolling updates).

Re:Killer App? (2)

MrEricSir (398214) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161464)

Unless it has something to give that isn't better-known on another platform, there's no incentive for users to switch.

But that's just the thing; if it's on Ubuntu it's free/open software, and therefore will be on other distros if not other platforms, if not now then eventually. The very idea of a "killer app" for Ubuntu is in many ways contrary to the idea of free/open software because such software can always be modified, forked, and/or ported.

Re:Killer App? (5, Insightful)

Shark (78448) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161512)

Well, I wouldn't fault Ubuntu for trying to appeal to the masses. I think their aim is linux on the desktop. I don't use Ubuntu, I also don't use Facebook or social media beyond the occasional Slashdot post (and that's hardly social). The reality is that the masses do.

I'm fine with Ubuntu turning into 'Linux for people who don't care that it's Linux'. There's plenty of choices for people who know what they're doing otherwise and it grows the market, which means that hardware vendors pay a tad (not much) more attention to the fact that linux exists and sales can be made by supporting it, etc.

Re:Killer App? (1)

Nerdfest (867930) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161604)

As long as I can still install and configure what I want, I can deal with it. I don't like Unity much, partly because there's very little that can be changed and the OS X style global menus annoy me to no end, but mostly because it's extremely buggy. Compiz crashes or behaves poorly frequently, some panel widgets stopped working, and my wireless card is slow and flakey. I've developed a certain amount of trust for Canonical ... my previous upgrades have all been relatively trouble free, but 11.04 really wasn't ready for release. Even the fonts in the unity title bar are fuzzy and poorly rendered. Perhaps it's time to stop the 6 month release cycle when the product is really not ready.

Re:Killer App? (3, Insightful)

Compaqt (1758360) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161804)

Inconsistency and hypocrisy are what kill me.

Mark Shuttleworth pushed through the left-side window control buttons change by using the excuse of "less mouse movement" (which is ridiculous since the scrollbar is on the right side, so you're often on the right side).

Then he goes and puts the menu all the way on the top of the screen. How much mouse movement does that take? And what does it do for keyboard control?

Re:Killer App? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36162000)

Inconsistency? maybe, but hypocrisy? Changing directions and criteria on software projects is a normal thing... how does a moral tag like hipocrisy relate to this?

Re:Killer App? (1)

Nerdfest (867930) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162178)

Instead of the top global menu, I've been thinking about a 'better' way. Have the menu where it normally is on each window, but only show it on a 'hover' (or click for touchscreens) over the title bar. Saves space, but puts it more easily in reach. I think I could deal with that a lot more readily. It could be left configurable to always show as well.

Re:Killer App? (1)

Osgeld (1900440) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162208)

who uses the scroll bar since the wheel mouse became standard over a decade ago?

our UPS rep came in today to fiddle with my departments station, it has no wheel mouse and I had to actually point out the scroll bar to him

Re:Killer App? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161734)

Well put.

And some of us are reasonably capable (and care that they're using linux) and use Ubuntu for our own reasons. Any of the new stuff that bothered me about Ubuntu was gone with one click. Really... before you log in, and never touched it again. I got to keep everything else I like, and no changes, rebuild, etc.

lightdm is in natty but doesn't work (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161240)

boo I say, boo

at least it didn't work here, yes I installed a theme

chromium (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161264)

I don't understand the idea to replace Firefox with Chromium. How anyone can surf the web without NoScript?

Re:chromium (1)

websitebroke (996163) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161788)

Using NotScript? NoScript is nicer, but NotScript does mostly the same thing.

Re:chromium (1)

pspahn (1175617) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162014)

How anyone can surf the web without NoScript

I tried using script blocking tools before. I found it more of a hassle to constantly white-list web sites where I want javascript running.

Re:chromium (1)

RobbieThe1st (1977364) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162182)

So set it to block from third-party sites and run with everything else? That'll speed up your browing a bit, increase your safety too, and you won't have to mess with it.

Alternately, I've gone with going between run scripts globally and block - Sometimes I just want to use it, sometimes I /don't/ want ths JS functionality.

This is news? (4, Insightful)

msobkow (48369) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161284)

Man, I can't believe I waited longer for the ads to load than to read the so-called article.

Ad sponsored fluff piece. This was worth mentioning on Slashdot?

I have an idea! (1)

atomicbutterfly (1979388) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161310)

Fix Unity. If you're not going to have GNOME 2 as a selectable option in future distros, at least work to make Unity a bug-free and far more configurable experience. Provide an easy to find and select option (i.e. not a shell command) to disable the global menu for those of us who prefer a traditional menuing system.

Oh who am I kidding. Mark has gone on record stating how he doesn't like having too options because it increases the number of permutations in which something could go wrong, plus he wants Unity to look the same on all desktops (a consistent look). But hell, Windows 7 has the ability to dock the superbar on any side of the desktop, and Unity doesn't. How did they miss that feature?

Re:I have an idea! (2)

Missing.Matter (1845576) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161402)

But hell, Windows 7 has the ability to dock the superbar on any side of the desktop, and Unity doesn't. How did they miss that feature?

They didn't miss that feature; according to Shuttleworth a configurable launcher does not fit in with their "broader design goals" and they have no plans to make it configurable in the future.

Source: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/668415/comments/2 [launchpad.net]

Re:I have an idea! (3, Insightful)

atomicbutterfly (1979388) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161662)

Well that just reaffirms my concerns then. Ubuntu's UI is in some areas far less configurable than Windows 7.

I suppose there's a reason the Ubuntu web site barely mentions the word "Linux". The traditional benefit of everything being configurable in Linux does not translate to Ubuntu's philosophy, even if there's very little reason why it should not. Maybe Canonical just doesn't have the manpower/skill?

Re:I have an idea! (1)

thegarbz (1787294) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161970)

Well that just reaffirms my concerns then. Ubuntu's UI is in some areas far less configurable than Windows 7.

Isn't that exactly why people like OSX?

A configurable user experience makes for a very difficult to learn system when everyone's looks different and everyone shows you a different way of doing something.

Re:I have an idea! (2)

Risen888 (306092) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162150)

Isn't that exactly why people like OSX?

It's exactly why I hate OSX.

Re:I have an idea! (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36162408)

Isn't that exactly why people like OSX?

It's exactly why I hate OSX.

You're not thinking outside the box hard enough! Once you're outside the box, you'll see how great it is when everything is the same.

Re:I have an idea! (4, Insightful)

getto man d (619850) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161688)

Mark has gone on record stating how he doesn't like having too options...

Too many options is why I was drawn to Linux in the first place.

sigh

Re:I have an idea! (1)

wrook (134116) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162278)

I just switched to Natty yesterday and gave Unity a whirl. Like you say, I really don't think it's ready yet. But I was very pleased to discover that it's a Compiz plugin, so it was really easy to disable. On thinking about it, I think two fairly simple things could make Unity a friendly player in the desktop environment world:

1) Split it up into two plugins: one for the menu thingy at the top and one for the launcher at the side.

2) Don't make dependencies with other plugins that I might not want to use (like the viewport switcher: I like my cube desktop!!! :-) )

I actually like the menu thingy and would use it in preference to gnome-panel if I could, but I don't like the launcher (Docky is better). Also the app search/menu is horrible and I would *really* like to get access to the normal Debian menu list somehow. But there are some good ideas hiding in there. IMHO, making Unity a compiz plugin is exactly the right thing to do, but execution is lacking. I'm more than half tempted to start writing some patches. I wonder how accepting they are about outside help... Or possibly just write my own menu/panel.

Re:I have an idea! (1)

The Dawn Of Time (2115350) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162286)

But there are sooooo many other Linux distributions you can choose. This particular distribution isn't aiming to be everything to everyone, it's aiming to be a lot of things for a lot of people. Allowing total configurability tends to not be helpful in achieving that goal.

no interest (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161336)

Unless... they decide to stop forcing Unity down everyone's throats.

The feature I'd like to see? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161346)

Quit fucking up flash every other upgrade. Youtube no longer works after this last upgrade. Youtube! It's only one of the biggest users of flash on the web. Maybe you might have heard of it. And this isn't the first time. 2 upgrades ago it was broken, then they fixed it 1 upgrade ago. Now it's broken again. How about dropping some of the cutting edge shit and going back to the days when Ubuntu Just Worked.

The beginning of the end. (0)

ewoods (108845) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161468)

What a bunch of disorganized crap Ubuntu is becoming. On one hand, they're moving away from Evolution toward Mozilla Thunderbird (which I support), but on the other hand, they're moving away from Mozilla Firefox toward Google Chrome. They still haven't figured out what it's going to look like and, from the people I talk to, Unity has driven many away. Uncomplicate things and use the standard GNOME shell, dummies. Stop worrying about NIH. Swapping GDM for LightDM and justifying it by saying it has a smaller memory footprint? Has anyone verified this? I mean, loading up a full html engine is lighter than using a toolkit that will need to be loaded anyway? Seems like more NIH and arrogance. Everyone I know uses LibreOffice, whether on Windows or Linux, but Cononical wants to dump it? Morons, I say. Ubuntu seems to have no vision anymore. They throw everything at the wall to see what sticks. The determining factors in sticking are convoluted and nonsensical. As fast as they gained in market share, they can lose. And with these sorts of craptastic, random changes, they aren't going to get much business support. Yay.

Re:The beginning of the end. (1)

hedwards (940851) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162352)

I'm actively looking for a new distro. I wasn't particularly attached to Ubuntu to begin with, mainly because I do my tinkering in FreeBSD and just need Linux for a few applications which don't yet work in FreeBSD, such as Crashplan. But this unity crap and major change slipped into a stable release pretty much eliminates any point of using Linux. Thankfully, there are other distros, but still, it's a serious PITA.

I kind of like SUSE, apart from the headaches with getting some software packages which aren't available in the repository. Most likely, I'll try Slackware and then a couple other ones to see if I find something that's going to be stable, with a good repository and somewhat resource efficient.

Re:The beginning of the end. (1)

Dracos (107777) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162458)

My advice: back down to Debian, or move forward to Mint.

And up next... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161478)

...9 super models I may sleep with this year.

Switch to a DVD (1, Insightful)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161488)

It's 2011. There's no reason they shouldn't switch to a DVD release. TFA said they might have to drop LibreOffice, or go with 2 CDs, or a DVD. I say stick with a single DVD image. That doesn't mean they have to fill up the full 4 GB, but it gives them quite a bit more room to play with. 2 CDs would be inconvenient. Also, who doesn't have a DVD burner these days.

Re:Switch to a DVD (1)

zonky (1153039) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161584)

My current ubuntu device doesn't even have an optical drive....

Re:Switch to a DVD (1)

WeatherGod (1726770) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161716)

Ditto to this. Ubuntu really got my attention originally by making it dead easy to set up a USB stick with a live image. This was perfect for my netbook.

Also, for the GP, I think they are heading towards DVD. I have noticed a couple of DVD images for natty on their cdimages website.

Re:Switch to a DVD (2, Insightful)

Just Some Guy (3352) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162086)

Ditto to this. Ubuntu really got my attention originally by making it dead easy to set up a USB stick with a live image.

Only if you already have Ubuntu up and running. Otherwise it's a complete bitch that makes me want to throw things. Fun situation: you have an Ubuntu netbook with no optical drive, an old PPC Mac desktop, and a FreeBSD server. The netbook hard drive dies and you replace it. Pop quiz; think quick! How do you use OS X or FreeBSD to copy the downloadable USB image to a flash drive to boot the netbook? Ha-ha! Trick question! There is no downloadable USB image! You have to create one yourself using the Linux or Windows usb-creator GUI, which happens to operate directly on a flash drive (meaning that you can't SSH into your Ubuntu desktop at work and run the X program there to create an image file you can scp back to the house).

And that's how I ended up driving to work to make a bootable USB stick and cussing myself hoarse.

Seriously, Ubuntu: forget the damned cutesy usb-creator tool and just put a downloadable image up on your website. Almost no one ever wants a custom boot image with a writable partition, or at least to the point that you have to make it configurable at image creation time. Pick an easy-to-manage small size (say, 2GB), use usb-creator to make a bootable drive that size, use dd to copy the image back off the USB stick, and put the damn thing up on your website. I guarantee that everyone who owns a computer without an optical drive and who wants to install Ubuntu will thank you for it.

Re:Switch to a DVD (0)

Osgeld (1900440) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162238)

seconded, its a fucking pain in the ass to download a ISO, burn it, boot the stinking thing which takes for ever, wait for it to load a fully functional work terminal just so you can click a couple buttons and

fuck it doesnt like the format my usb stick is in, so dick with that click a couple more buttons wait for friggen ever as it redumps from damned cd to damned slow usb stick and take it with you to wait even fucking LONGER to boot off of the usb stick

it could be much simpler

Re:Switch to a DVD (1)

cwebster (100824) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161802)

Then you can probably just load it onto an 8 gig USB memory stick which is even more storage than a DVD!

Ignore it (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161514)

All you need do is select the Ubuntu Classic desktop when you log in. Worked like a charm, No more Unity.

Re:Ignore it (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161728)

you do know that's going away too, right?

Re:Ignore it (1)

MichaelSmith (789609) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161876)

Also note that gnome 3 breaks anything which uses GTK including gnome 2 and XFCE.

Sorry to be the guy with the "who cares?" comment (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161518)

..but, considering that Linux distros offer the quickest, easiest ways to install software, we sure spend a lot of time talking about what's included out-of-the-box.

I can tell you right now that, no matter what they include, my first installation of any OS is always going to be followed by choosing the software that I personally want. Who are these people who use Ubuntu & don't know how to use the package manager?

Re:Sorry to be the guy with the "who cares?" comme (1)

Osgeld (1900440) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162304)

that is what I ended up doing

small annoyances in U8 started to grate at me in U9 and 10 was just too much fiddle dicking to get back the way I liked it, but whatever time to "move on"!

the problem is I do not know where I could ever find a debian/ubuntu/ remix (cough mint)

Re:Sorry to be the guy with the "who cares?" comme (1)

icebraining (1313345) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162464)

Some people don't have Internet access, you insensitive clod, or might only have very limited 3G without the possibility to download LibreOffice, which is quite heavy. For them, asking for a mailed CD might be their only option.

Also known as... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161552)

9 Features and/or functions that were working in the previous version but aren't working now. I kid, I kid! But really, raise your hand if you remember the pain of Pulse Audio.

Just to avoid being consumed by flames, I have to say that use Linux every day at work and for play. I think it's the best OS for me.

unity (1)

darjen (879890) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161574)

I'm sure I am in the minority here, but I don't mind unity all that much. It even works well with my magic trackpad.

Re:unity (1)

WeatherGod (1726770) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161760)

You arent alone. I rather like unity on my eeepc, but that might be largely because unity came from netbook remix. I haven't tried unity on a larger desktop, but I have a hard time imagining it's current incarnation to work well. But I certainly do see the direction it is heading, and I think it will work well.

Re:unity (1)

darjen (879890) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161870)

I use it on my 8 year old Asus laptop, which was fairly high end for the time. Looks and feels fine on my 1080p monitor. Wife uses it via netbook remix on her eee PC as well.

Re:unity (1)

Sepodati (746220) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162236)

You aren't alone. Squeaky wheels and all that. I'm just as functional using Unity as I was with a dropdown menu.

The only issue I had wasn't Unity related. My PCIe wireless card in my desktop would drop out after several minutes to an hour and not reconnect. So I stuck with 10.10 on that machine, but 11.04 is running great on my netbook (2d unity) and my other two laptops. Kids picked it up quick, too, so it was barely a change for them (they never even asked me about it).

Unity passed my parents' test... (2, Informative)

mathfeel (937008) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161580)

All my machines are Arch or Gentoo, except two I leave home for my parents to use, which run Ubuntu. I recently upgraded to Nauty remotely for them, forgetting to tell them that the default desktop is now Unity. So far, besides slightly slower start up after login (the machines could use more RAM anyway), they like the new Desktop. Their commonly used apps' are automatically set up as big and visible icon on the left-edge dock. (I used to put AWN, a bottom-screen dock, up for them, but they always find it obstructing even with auto-hide). They also like that menu item for all apps consistently appears when the cursor hovers over the top edge. I am ambivalent myself toward Unity, but if it pass their test. I would say it can't be all that bad.

Re:Unity passed my parents' test... (3, Informative)

nnull (1148259) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161718)

I actually had to uninstall ubuntu from my mothers computer because she hated it (Upgraded from 10 to 11, I know big mistake). It kept crashing with skype (it never did before), the interface is messed up, there's no option to turn off desktop effects other than manually setting up metacity --replace, and a host of other stuff. And yes, this is after using the "classic desktop" option. I ended up installing Mint and she's not calling me anymore about problems. So my parents don't like it, so it didn't pass their test.

Re:Unity passed my parents' test... (1)

kvvbassboy (2010962) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161832)

On the contrary, the real test of a UI is how people who use various obscure aspects of it, feel with the new UI. Your parents (and my parents, I am sure) would use an openbox WM without any problem, as long as you put big Pidgin, Firefox, FileManager and Skype icons on the desktop. It definitely doesn't mean openbox is better, does it? (Okay, well it is pretty damn good for someone who can customize it :))

ath5k (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161634)

Let's hope that WiFi using the ath5k driver is no longer broken (at least half-broken using the options nohwcrypt=1 trick in modprobe.d/ath5k-workaround.conf )

year of the linux desktop (0)

aahpandasrun (948239) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161676)

Year of the Linux Desktop will be 2011. Count on it!

Re:year of the linux desktop (0)

aahpandasrun (948239) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161684)

damn, it removed my sarcasm tag...

Re:year of the linux desktop (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36162058)

YLD has until 21 May...

Count on it :)

Jeez, Ubuntu? Again? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36161698)

Where would they be without the subjunctive...

My take (1)

Compaqt (1758360) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161740)

1. A Refined Unity
>"icons in the launcher will be able to display count badges or progress meters to reflect the state of the underlying application"

2. GNOME 3

Will people now stop posting "you can just choose class Gnome before login!"? Prediction: Neither Unity nor Gnome3 will have the functionality that Just Worked fine before, and was letting people get their work done.

3. Evolution -- or Thunderbird?

Even though I use Thunderbird (I prefer to have the same client across computers, plus it has great dynamic folders), I don't agree with switching applications on a whim every few releases.

Pitivi to be dropped
F-Spot => Shotwell
Evolution => Thunderbird
Firefox => Chromium

4. No LibreOffice?

First they drop GIMP, now the OpenOffice clone, too? So what exactly will you be able to do with a live CD? I guess they had to make space for Unity chrome.

5. Chromium Instead of Firefox?

See #3. Also, it's not as if there's actual functionality missing from Firefox (unlike, say with the move from Pidgin to Empathy). Gratuitous changes. The Ubuntu trademark. "Ubuntu is safe, intuitive and stable [ubuntu.com] " haha.

6. No Computer Janitor or PiTiVi

They just added it (Pitivi) a few releases ago!

7. LightDM Instead of GDM

Good if it works. But Ubuntu has a history of messing these things up.

8. Deja Dup by Default

It's a backup utility. Could be good, depends on integration. Does it work with Ubuntu One?

9. Ubuntu Software Center

>"the Ubuntu Software Center is also slated to get a number of enhancements, including improved integration with Unity and a simplified user interface."

How much simpler could it get?

>"I don't know about you, but I'm already champing at the bit to test it out."

Dreading it already.

Will 10.04 work with Sandy Bridge kit? (1)

Nimey (114278) | more than 3 years ago | (#36161900)

I'm sufficiently unimpressed with 11.04 (and especially Unity) that I'm tempted to reinstall with LTS and keep at least until next year.

Re:Will 10.04 work with Sandy Bridge kit? (1)

Gazsi (2171044) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162330)

Many people are forced to upgrade because old Linux won't with new hardware easily. This is because APIs change too often.

A good discussion thread on this topic started with a comment from bmastenbroo here:

Unity in Ubuntu 11.04 User Comments#Sandy Bridge [arstechnica.com]

Unrelated to your question, but related to Unity, which is the main topic on the site, let me quote [arstechnica.com] JEDIDIAH from the same user comment area. He summarized Unity in one single sentence:

It isn't quite like Windows 7 and it isn't quite like Snow Leopard but it steals just enough bad ideas from both to look like an incompetently executed clone with no identity (or value) of it's own.

Re:Will 10.04 work with Sandy Bridge kit? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36162366)

May as well go all the way back to 9.latest_LTS. 10.04 screwed up the nvidia drivers. I'm switching to either Arch or 9.whatever next time I have time to reinstall.

Ubuntu is a perfect Linux-newbie distro (1)

Errtu76 (776778) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162138)

I don't run Ubuntu. I don't quite like it. I do however recommend it to my friends/family who want to experience Linux and have only used Windows so far. It's by far the easiest and most complete distro available to newbies. And if you want more (or less, depends how you look at it) you use Fedora or Debian.

Re:Ubuntu is a perfect Linux-newbie distro (0)

mandelbr0t (1015855) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162166)

Compared to me, you're a newbie. I use Ubuntu. Draw your own conclusions. (/. ID notwithstanding; I first logged into Linux Kernel 1.1)

Re:Ubuntu is a perfect Linux-newbie distro (1)

grcumb (781340) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162364)

I don't run Ubuntu. I don't quite like it. I do however recommend it to my friends/family who want to experience Linux and have only used Windows so far. It's by far the easiest and most complete distro available to newbies.

If you do recommend it to others, recommend nothing later than 10.04, the last LTS release.

10.10 saw a number of minor but irritating bugs creep in that show a significant shortage of testing and forethought. There were countless small things like context menus no longer working after returning from a suspended state or new window positioning that's completely counter-intuitive. Some of them, like changing sides for window buttons or listing indecipherable package descriptions above package names in Update Manager, were deliberate (and conceivably, in some universe, necessary), but most of the changes were clearly mistakes. When these are combined with long-standing bugs (like Network Manager arbitrarily deciding to disable the Save button) and inconsistencies, they begin to weigh against Ubuntu's many virtues.

Unity, combined with an increase in the number of stupid bugs (that spiffy state-of-the-machine motd message is FUBAR'ed now on console login) clearly indicates that Ubuntu is more interested in new and shiny than they are in quality. A quick scan of Launchpad (itself a new product designed to simplify bug maintenance and supplant the competition, but which has done neither) shows that there are, on average, 100 open bugs per project.

Ubuntu is slipping out of control. They've stopped listening and - more importantly - working with the community. The number of defects are growing, but Canonical's response is to make it harder for mere mortals to submit bugs. They seem to think that strong guidance is needed for their product to grow in new and interesting ways. Fair enough, but they're confusing leadership with control. They're simply imposing their views because they don't value the discussion. They're treating criticisms as opposition and shutting themselves off from valid feedback.

Worse, they simply don't have the number of skilled developers they need to achieve their goals. When I look at the bug queues on some packages, I shudder in sympathy with the poor souls who are expected to wrangle them. Ubuntu is clearly embarked on an impossible task, but nobody's either got the guts or the vision to spell this out to Shuttleworth and co.

Getting buy-in and active participation from the community is a pain in the arse at the best of times, but the alternative is far worse. Heaven knows that the GNOME dev camp are... special, to be nice. But it's clear that, given the choice between getting a partial but workable success through compromise or taking their ball and going home, Canonical has consistently chosen the latter.

This cannot end well. It will, however, end sooner than later.

Fix high I/O load in server distro when run on USB (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 3 years ago | (#36162196)

for quite a few releases now, ubuntu server has had an issue where if the OS was running on a USB drive, any activity on any drive (even SATA attached ones) would drive load averages over 5 or 6. it's crazy and doesn't exist in any debian release.

Re:Fix high I/O load in server distro when run on (1)

clarkn0va (807617) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162432)

Odd. Have you tried changing the I/O scheduler?

I'll always be greatful to Ubuntu (3, Insightful)

Beelzebud (1361137) | more than 3 years ago | (#36162422)

Ubuntu has a special status for me, because it's what I learned the basics of Linux on. These days I use a mix of Arch (for bleeding edge) and Slackware (for stability), and I doubt I would have ever delved in to learning Linux as deeply as I have if it weren't for Ubuntu. Although these days I really don't like the direction they're heading in. Too much re-inventing the wheel, not enough refining.

The last time I played around with Ubuntu I actually found it had more quirks, bugs, and stability problems than my Arch Linux install, which is a rolling release. I think these days, if I was going to set up a Linux box for someone, that only wanted to use it and not tinker with it under the hood, I'd just put Slackware on it and configure it for them.
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