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114 comments

Or... (1, Flamebait)

soupbowl (1849394) | more than 2 years ago | (#37721906)

Or they could just make the desktop version not suck and do something about its terrible interface.

Re:Or... (3, Informative)

ozmanjusri (601766) | more than 2 years ago | (#37721962)

Have you tried it recently? It's really very good.

Re:Or... (1)

hairyfeet (841228) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723900)

I have and its stil sloooooooooow as hell. While I give it out on new builds simply because its "free as in beer" after trying to use it for a month it pissed me off enough I went ahead and loaded the MS Office 2K7 I had sitting in a drawer, although honestly I have yet to see any version beat my beloved Office 2K. That to me was the best version ever,light and nimble. I have that one loaded onto my netbook as its light weight saves battery life.

I'm sorry but while LO has many things going for it lightweight and nimble ain't among them. I don't blame the LO guys though, they've only had a year and we are talking some seriously NASTY code. Has anyone here looked at the OO.o code? I have, wow talk about a big bloated mess! The LO guys probably need to chunk a good portion of it and go modular to fix the bloat, and that will take time. I say give them another year to two years and see where they are then. By that time we should know whether they are gonna be able to pull it off.

Re:Or... (1)

ozmanjusri (601766) | more than 2 years ago | (#37727642)

Writer opens in less than a second on my very ordinary Dell laptop.

Maybe you should look at fixing your computer.

Re:Or... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37724198)

Open Office and Libre Office are slow - very slow - and not dependable. Occasional format headaches (with Microsoft Office) is a given. These are great for the correct market - people who dont use Office suites often. But for the mainstream - these are as useful as Linux desktops are. In the US - find me a LO or Open office user - and I will show you someone who is irrational.

Re:Or... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722088)

This is true. I begrudgingly use LibreOffice. Challenging interface. Not a big fan of the random bugs. With the last two versions I used, clicking "Print preview" guarantees a crash. It's very unfortunate. I try to live with hope.

Re:Or... (2)

westyvw (653833) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722102)

I havent had any problem with it. I use it at home exclusively, but I also use it at work when MS Office can't do the job. Just the other day I started writing a VB script for Excel (office version 10) got halfway through and remembered that the functionality I wanted was in Calc by default. But crashes? I just dont have them, could be I only use Linux versions.

Re:Or... (1)

sourcerror (1718066) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722642)

I haven't seen any bugs in the Windows version, on the other hand it loads a bit slow, and the scripting API is just horribly convoluted, and underdocumented.

Re:Or... (1)

MrHanky (141717) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722802)

I've had OpenOffice crash on me with two (I think) different documents, both written in Word for Mac. Both documents also crashed Word 2003 for Windows. Perfect compatibility with a rubbish document format aside, it's been very stable.

Re:Or... (1)

BrokenHalo (565198) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722292)

Challenging interface.

Right. The Open/LibreOffice developers have gone to some trouble to make their suite pretty much idiot-proof. But I guess the trouble, as they say, with that is that idiots are becoming so ingenious... :-|

Re:Or... (2)

Ihmhi (1206036) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722334)

This is true. I begrudgingly use $PROGRAM. Challenging interface. Not a big fan of the random bugs. With the last two versions I used, $USING_FEATURE_X guarantees a crash. It's very unfortunate. I try to live with hope.

Look everyone, it's standard boilerplate to talk about any piece of FOSS you want!

Re:Or... (1)

MrNthDegree (2429298) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722370)

This is true. I begrudgingly use Windows. Challenging interface. Not a big fan of the random bugs. With the last two versions I used, using any of my old hardware guarantees a crash. It's very unfortunate. I try to live with hope.

Re:Or... (2)

Teun (17872) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722622)

Hmm, crashing on print preview?

Out of curiosity I just tried on the last two versions but sorry to spoil your rant, no crashes.

It's not me it's you. (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722124)

sorry to others but OO did suck, and unusable for instance when setting up the margins your told to use that styles thingy which has never laid out the header correctly and never will. I have visited this open office on and off for years and they never fixed such a simple thing that has kept an untold number of students from working with it. if the school says the lay out the paper a certain way that is what you do otherwise you no grade

Re:It's not me it's you. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722294)

Sorry to say but Libreoffice with Zotero plugin handles all my chem paper requirements (post grad ) so its probably more attributable to pebkac.

Re:Or... (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722268)

Yeah, it really needs a ribbon thing so that one can hide all the menu items behind huge icons and 'mouse over' moves. It is important to have huge icons, since people who use a word processor obviously cannot read and therefore cannot use menus...

Re:Or... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722520)

I wouldn't say it needs huge icons, but the icons in LibreOffice seem to be a step backwards from those used in the OpenOffice which it forked from. As a person with a background in graphics, I'll just say that they're more ambiguous in appearance and don't "read" well. Small icons are fine if it's pretty easy to tell them apart and make sense of them at first glimpse without waiting for a tooltip to tell you what they are.

Not that it's anything that couldn't be fixed by something like user themes and re-skinning. But I really haven't dug in to see if the program supports such features. (I have seen such features implemented in other FOSS projects and stuff like browsers, so it's not too far-fetched to consider in terms of features relating to improved usability from a UI perspective.)

Re:Or... (1)

Bert64 (520050) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722758)

Yes, i second the call for a skinnable interface...
Some people prefer the current interface, some prefer the ms2k7 style ribbon etc. You can't suit everyone with the defaults, so make the interface flexible, let users choose the skin and provide a handful of sensible defaults to choose from.

Re:Or... (2)

lastx33 (2097770) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722960)

You can change the icons quite easily and there are a number of sets available online. To change the icon set go to Tools>Options>View and you will see an option for Icon Size and Style. Select a style from the drop down menu. BTW I find the LibreOffice interface infinitely preferable to the mess that MS Office now uses. I used to be a fan of MS Office and thought it was their best product but switched OpenOffice long ago after having suffered more and more bugs and the interface becoming more convoluted and less productive. Having switched again to LibreOffice I have found the improvements over OOo very well executed and had no bug problems. The project seems to be moving along nicely and MS Office file support is excellent.

Are you serious?? (4, Interesting)

jampola (1994582) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722386)

I have recently moved 50 computers from Windows to Linux here in Thailand and the most comments I get related to the move is how much better Libreoffice is than MSO 2k7. This might have something to do with a far more simplistic interface than what 2k7 has and also the brilliant Thai translation for LO. Apart from the odd formatting issues when sharing documents between Libreoffice and MS office (usually font mismatches), it has been a successful move. I would welcome an open source mobile version of Libreoffice to use on my Galaxy Tab and Android phone.

What's the competition? (2)

itsdapead (734413) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722784)

I've used both MS Office and Open/Neo Office - and my impression is that OO was about as annoying as Microsoft Office (pre-ribbon).

I think the introduction of the abomination that is the Office Ribbon has left it ahead of the game (OK, some people like the ribbon, but then I know one person who liked Windows Vista, and another who liked the Apple hockey-puck mouse...)

One possible criticism of OO/LO is that the style system, though flexible, can be a bit hard to get your head around. OTOH, there again MS have been happily screwing up the style system in Word to the point where it is now pretty unusable.

So, what's the easy-to-use but flexible opposition that LibreOffice should be competing with?

I'll concede the point that LaTeX/LyX is probably still king for technical writing, and that there are other products aimed at people writing "pure text" - but what is a good role-model in the realm of general purpose WP/DTP-crossover?

Re:What's the competition? (1)

hackertourist (2202674) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723054)

So, what's the easy-to-use but flexible opposition that LibreOffice should be competing with?

I'll concede the point that LaTeX/LyX is probably still king for technical writing, and that there are other products aimed at people writing "pure text" - but what is a good role-model in the realm of general purpose WP/DTP-crossover?

LaTeX/LyX is a nice project, but 'king for technical writing'? Technical writing generally means user guides and other product manuals, and LaTeX is a niche player at best in that market. FrameMaker is popular, and content management systems like AuthorIT are gaining traction. This market is all about reuse of content, and LaTeX doesn't offer that, as far as I know. LaTeX is aimed more at academic publishing.

For a good role model WP/DTP package, look no further than FrameMaker:

  • Proper support for styles, but still accepts style overrides if need be.
  • A good combination of DTP (flexible page layout) and automation options for formatting.
  • Stability (no crashing when the document gets large).
  • A properly documented readable-text file format (MIF) that is the exact equivalent of its default binary file format.
  • Formatting that changes only when YOU want it to (Word bullets and numbering, I'm looking at you).
  • Templates that actually work (allowing you to copy styles from one document to another).
  • Exports to everything.

Re:What's the competition? (2)

ksd1337 (1029386) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723176)

LaTeX/LyX is a nice project, but 'king for technical writing'? Technical writing generally means user guides and other product manuals, and LaTeX is a niche player at best in that market.

Several publishers produce technical and user manuals with LaTeX.

Re:What's the competition? (1)

hackertourist (2202674) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723882)

Interesting. In about 13 years in the industry I've never come across a client who used it. Then again, most of our clients do very small print runs (all the way down to custom manuals for every individual machine) for large numbers of related machines. That's when you need reuse facilities.

Re:What's the competition? (1)

Dynetrekk (1607735) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723974)

LaTeX/LyX is a nice project, but 'king for technical writing'? Technical writing generally means user guides and other product manuals, and LaTeX is a niche player at best in that market. FrameMaker is popular, and content management systems like AuthorIT are gaining traction. This market is all about reuse of content, and LaTeX doesn't offer that, as far as I know. LaTeX is aimed more at academic publishing.

It may be true that LaTeX is more used in academic publishing, but how is LaTeX not about reuse of content? Define your own commands to write similar equations, easily and portably generate documents from a simple script or program, \include{subdocument}, and a thousand other ways of reuse content makes LaTeX the working environment which allows the MOST reuse, as far as I can tell. Auto-generation of all sorts of references, an index, and so forth also reduces manual labor to an extent I have never seen Word (or whatever) even approach. Please, do correct me if I am wrong, because if something exists that is even better than LaTeX, I'll want to know!

Re:What's the competition? (1)

hackertourist (2202674) | more than 2 years ago | (#37724142)

Is \include{subdocument} workable when that subdocument is one paragraph long and you have 1000 subdocuments in your book?

In FrameMaker, you have 'conditional text' which allows you to tag text with a condition. During publishing, you select the conditions you want shown or hidden. This allows you to have one master document to describe a series of related machines (or what have you). All WYSIWYG. Autogeneration of all sorts of lists, and a scripting language are available.

AuthorIT and other document management systems use a database. Each of your text fragments (a section or part of a section, down to a single sentence if you want) is a record in a database, and the system allows you to string these together arbitrarily.
AuthorIT can output XML which allows for extensive postprocessing.

The problem I see with \include{subdocument} is that you're relying on the file system to manage your subdocuments. You can open the subdocs as separate files, but the system doesn't organize them for you on-screen, which makes it more difficult to see them in context.

Re:What's the competition? (1)

Dynetrekk (1607735) | more than 2 years ago | (#37724290)

Is \include{subdocument} workable when that subdocument is one paragraph long and you have 1000 subdocuments in your book?

I've never tried, but why shouldn't it? LaTeX is a compiler; surely a project of 1000 files could be compiled. Also, there are other ways, such as defining 1000 macros in a single file.

In FrameMaker, you have 'conditional text' which allows you to tag text with a condition. During publishing, you select the conditions you want shown or hidden. This allows you to have one master document to describe a series of related machines (or what have you). All WYSIWYG. Autogeneration of all sorts of lists, and a scripting language are available.

WYSIWYG is a downside IMHO. The UNIX philosophy says "use text, it is a general interface". Also, you can have conditionals in LaTeX code. Oh well, people and their preferences differ, so secretaries probably disagree with me. Of course you could chuck text strings in a database if you wanted to avoid files in a filesystem, too. Heck, you can probably even awk | grep | sed | latex, if you want to - as I said, text is universal, there's a million ways of working with it.

Re:What's the competition? (1)

hackertourist (2202674) | more than 2 years ago | (#37724436)

WYSIWYG is a downside IMHO. The UNIX philosophy says "use text, it is a general interface".

It's a general interface, but it's also one that doesn't use a large chunk of the available bandwidth of your information channel (a bitmapped display). Text that use visual cues to convey formatting information is more readable than text that uses [emphasis]textual[/emphasis] cues to convey the same information.
WYSIWYG has a bad name because of the likes of Word, where formatting is just that: formatting. In FrameMaker and AuthorIT, each paragraph is assigned a functional tag. That tag is visualized using text formatting but it is independent of that formatting: with a single command you can assign new formatting. This isn't much different to what LyX does.

The main difference between LaTeX and FM/AIT is context: As far as I understand, LaTeX uses a programming approach where you call subdocuments in the same way you can call a subroutine. That works well for subroutines where you only need to know about the input, function and output of the subroutine to use it.
For text I prefer having the subroutine expand in place so I can see it in context (vital for a manual that has to have a consistent text flow). Unlike a subroutine, the exact wording of a subdocument is important and I'd rather not have to find and open the subdocument manually.

Re:Or bubbling byteboyz bauble (1)

noshellswill (598066) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723396)

Not likely to see rational behavior from free-office ego fanatics. They had a perfectly good OPEN OFFICE product that needed polishing ... what do they do? Fork fingers up *zzwhole and carry on babbling a new bauble. Casual Linux lusrs supporting current projects & years of OO text get screwed. Nice feckin-A work byteboyz ... change yo DEV-diapers cause it stinks!

Re:Or... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37724578)

What's wrong with the interface? It's a lot better than recent versions of ms-office, IMO.

I'm fine with the LibreOffice interface, I just wish LibreOffice were faster.

LibreOffice Online... (3, Insightful)

Zibodiz (2160038) | more than 2 years ago | (#37721914)

Would that be hosted with cloud storage? If not, I'm not sure what the benefit would be. If it will be, then who will be carrying the tab?

Re:LibreOffice Online... (1)

gman003 (1693318) | more than 2 years ago | (#37721928)

If it's GPL, you can always just host it on your own server. Or maybe just run it on localhost - being run in a browser solves most of your platform-compatibility issues (assuming you don't give a shit about IE).

Re:LibreOffice Online... (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722144)

Not true. With the GPL, you don't have any rights or access to the source code unless they distribute something to you. With a website, you may use the software, but there is no distribution. They need to release it under a truly FREE license (such as the AGPL) so that everyone will have access to the source code without distribution.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722306)

Riiiight... because all the people working on LibreOffice would start development on a web version with no intention of distribution, donating their time and effort to a closed, hosted-only product.

I'm gunna go out on a limb and guess you're being a little too paranoid. Even for slashdot.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (1)

g4b (956118) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723032)

I think you all are missing the point here.

You fear they do it to serve a closed version as a service. I don't see that scenario. Why? it is too expensive.

What you see there is LO binary running on a server transmitting its looks through an engine which uses GTK internal redraws to transmit the changes to a client with websockets, which in turn has a canvas capturing input and an engine which knows how to draw the deltas into place. Funny nobody yet thought of doing that with VNC.

Imagine a service where everybody can start any amount of instances of this software (for free) on your servers as a successful business solution.

There is none. Because with all respect, You will need to have to run the whole thing on your server still.
So, while using the software to power some lucrative services for the company, releasing the source is even better on the long run.

This is a very nice hack, however, and would be a nice add-on, but it is no mass solution for the "office online public $$$" service. and i think suse/novell knows that very well. Also, the techniques they are using are afaik open, too.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37723068)

How's the GTK drawing going to work with non-Linux operating systems like Windows?

Re:LibreOffice Online... (0)

hairyfeet (841228) | more than 2 years ago | (#37724058)

Bimbo Newton Crosby, because if they are using GTK its already fucked as it won't work on Windows without installing the GTK crap which means NO libraries, NO schools, NO offices, NO places where users aren't allowed to run as admin and install whatever they want.

If they are using GTK (haven't looked at the roadmap so I don't know for sure) then I label this epic fail and a waste of time. the whole point of web based is that it will work with any modern browser and THAT'S IT. If I have to install a bunch of crap to make it work? Its not web based, its just bullshit.

Make it to where it works in a browser that has standard features like Firefox/Opera/Chrome (not counting IE as those guys tend to be pretty far behind the curve and when they do implement its the "IE version" that rarely works 100% correctly) and THEN you'll have something worth noting. But nobody is gonna let users just dump GTK on everything just so LO web edition will work. Sorry but that is just a bad idea and a hack way to do it.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37727064)

Did you reed the article? (I suppose this is slashdot so the answer is obvious...)
GTK has an output method that allows it to write to a HTML canvas over the web, rather than to the normal windowing system, so yes they are using GTK on the server but that still does not mean you need it installed on your client machine. personally I prefer the portable apps version when I do have to use windows, but this works on anything with a new web browser.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37723162)

It's a prototype but it only really shows off what GTK Broadway can do. Any users that actually wanted this functionality would more likely use something VNC.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37723872)

Funny nobody yet thought of doing that with VNC.

butbutbut !: http://kanaka.github.com/noVNC/screenshots.html

Re:LibreOffice Online... (1)

TechLA (2482532) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722218)

That's bullshit. There's many open source software, especially security and crypto stuff, that only has open source client but they've never given away the server software. And it's fully within GPL license.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (1)

itsdapead (734413) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722838)

That's bullshit. There's many open source software, especially security and crypto stuff, that only has open source client but they've never given away the server software. And it's fully within GPL license.

All true, but one would hope that the people behind LibreOffice would release the server-side code under some form of OS license.

A good open-source online/collaborative office suite that let people run their own servers could be really, really useful - and addresses one of the main worries (Google Can Haz Ur Data) about cloud computing.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37721966)

Would that be hosted with cloud storage? If not, I'm not sure what the benefit would be. If it will be, then who will be carrying the tab?

they could always sync it with google docs, you can do that now with a plug-in

Re:LibreOffice Online... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722038)

It could be tied to Dropbox or any other cloud provider.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (1)

ciantic (626550) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722918)

I wouldn't worry about cloud service providers at this stage when the product doesn't even exist. Taken the fact how sucky the existing commercial office suites are it might be a while until it works... They should first develop it so that everyone can run it like in own servers etc?

When it works (in words real meaning) there will be no shortage of cloud service providers, I'm sure.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (1)

LWATCDR (28044) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723152)

Simple, to make money. That isn't a dirty word folks. They can make money hosting services for companies that don't want run their own infrastructure. No different than all the ISPs around the planet that sell web hosting and entire websites that run on Apache, Linux, PHP, Perl and so on.
That can support paying programers to make the software better. If they make the software available to under GPL as well so people can host it locally then no one has any room to complain about the concept.

Re:LibreOffice Online... (1)

arielCo (995647) | more than 2 years ago | (#37724084)

(Libre|Open)Office is well known to be a bit heavy for most office PCs. I'd be quite happy to move that load to a medium-sized server of my own, with the benefits that derive from shared libraries loaded once for all instances/threads, and that CPU load in a office app is impulsive so a few cores can serve a large number of seats.

OTOH, I expect to lose some functionality in areas such as graphs, at least in not-quite-HTML5-compliant browsers. * looks at IE9 >_> *

Improved visibility (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37721946)

If Libreoffice is ported to Android, then it will become more visible. This will help Libreoffice step out of Openoffices shadow.

Re:Improved visibility (1)

hedwards (940851) | more than 2 years ago | (#37721992)

I'd be surprised if it happens anytime soon. Libreoffice is still a fairly hefty download, and space on hand helds is still somewhat limited.

Re:Improved visibility (1)

BrokenHalo (565198) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722324)

It is indeed pretty hefty (as is any office suite), but I imagine it would most likely be pared down for handheld use. I find it hard to even imagine anyone trying to use the more complex features in any meaningful way on a phone, or possibly even on a tablet device. But a decent document viewer is definitely much needed.

Re:Improved visibility (1)

deniable (76198) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722930)

If they pare it down for mobiles, I'd love to see it built back up from that for a desktop version. Same base build with extra modules. Done right, it should address a lot of the speed / size concerns.

Re:Improved visibility (1)

blackest_k (761565) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723028)

not really my tablet has 8gb of flash with around 6.3 GB free to use as you wish + another 8gb mini sd
my netbook has an 8gb sdd and i run libre office on that everyday. The bigger question would be how much ram is needed/ available to run libre office.

This (2)

TennCasey (1667347) | more than 2 years ago | (#37721960)

This is exactly what they need. Otherwise, Google Docs and Office 365 might end up making LibreOffice irrelevent.

Make it functionally complete! (1)

unixisc (2429386) | more than 2 years ago | (#37721972)

It's port needs to be on par, if not directly file compatible w/ Excel and other Office programs. In other words, one should be able to do on their spreadsheet exactly what one can do in Excel - formulas, pivot tables, autofills and so on. Similarly, in their presentation programs, one should be able to make good use of special effects. An Access like database in the package would also be good.

It's not always just the license it's under, or merely the ports that exist

Re:Make it functionally complete! (2)

MrNthDegree (2429298) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722378)

Which LibreOffice has had since day one. Even Base has an Access-like database.

I can't see why that wouldn't be in the port.

Re:Make it functionally complete! (2)

bogaboga (793279) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722412)

'Functionally complete' as a goal is a good end in itself...but equally important is the fact that it must be a pleasure to use by first being a pleasure to look at.

I haven't looked at the latest version but my memory of earlier ones planted a bias in look and feel that will be hard to erase. On Windows XP, the 'beast' took forever to load and once it did, you wouldn't admire its interface.

An Access-like module actually exists but is very clunky to the extent of being unsealable. These folks should borrow a leaf from Microsoft, where the entire office suite, even with its bugs works 'flawlessly' 99% of the time for 99% of users.

Re:Make it functionally complete! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722470)

List of missing features:
* Pivot tables in Cals
* Polynomial regression in Calc
* Importing formulas reliably from Word
* Exporting formulas reliably to word

Re:Make it functionally complete! (1)

Rastor (8752) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722594)

Have you even used it?

LibreOffice has had pivot tables since day one, they call the feature DataPilot. And you can do a polynomial regression with the LINEST function. And the import/export gets better with every release.

About time (1)

gaelfx (1111115) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722158)

It's about time we get a real document app for mobiles. I'm surprised it took them this long to announce it, but I guess they've been busy with all the other drama. I hope the web version allows collaborative document creation/editing as well, otherwise, I don't really see the point of pursuing BOTH of these projects.

Re:About time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722252)

The MS Office in Windows Phones is an impressive Office Suite for Mobile.

Re:About time (1)

oakgrove (845019) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723100)

No it's not.

Re:About time (-1, Flamebait)

hairyfeet (841228) | more than 2 years ago | (#37724144)

Nice answer fucknuts, no proof, not even any experience with the product, just "nu uh!". And this is from an idiot that doesn't even know how to quote correctly so what should anyone expect?

Now let us see what he is AFRAID TO SHOW YOU because it is the TRUTH. The CORRECT quote is "As far as the user is concerned there is NO CLI in windows" and I DARE anyone to prove me wrong. walk up to 100 people in the street and ask them "How do you call up command line in Windows" and you know what you are gonna get? "Whats a command line" Because windows DON'T NEED A SHITTY TERMINAL just to do the tasks 99.995% of the population does. Linux? Puts the terminal on the desktop, why? Because YOU HAVE NO CHOICE. Its a SERVER OS that has been BADLY hacked to pretend to be a desktop OS, but in the end? Its ALL CLI. Here fucknuts, enjoy your fail...

Isn't it sad, how like a frightened child afraid to look under the bed, you cower at the truth? if your driver model isn't shit then why does Dell have to run their own repos [theinquirer.net] even though we are talking a teeny tiny subset of hardware? Oh right because Linux shits itself and dies if you use the default repos! Man that is some excellent product you got there! you think I can get better QA than the third largest OEM on the planet? What, you expect me to tell paying customers "Go to the forum, kiss some loser ass, and maybe, just maybe, in a few days someone will have mercy and give you a big pile of bullshit that may or may not make your sound work again"?

Bleeding yet douchey? want some more? nice thing about having the truth on your side, you can keep throwing punches all day! How about how a decade old Windows beat the shit out of Linux on netbooks [computerworld.com] or how ASUS has given up on your bullshit [computerworld.com.au] or how about Walmart running away from linux as fast as it can [pcworld.com]? You got the crazy koolaid drunk enough to say they ALL are paid shills because they won't do your forum dance or CLI horseshit? Meanwhile your "hero" Torvalds the great says Plans? We don't need no steenkin plans! [kerneltrap.org]. Why don't you tell them that at work next week, see how quick you get a pink slip? More? How about you actually have the balls to celebrate getting a whole 1% market share [slashdot.org] while you are actually lower than JavaME [netmarketshare.com] and there is a whole website dedicated To your bullshit and excuses [tmrepository.com] .

You see you whiny little delusional mama's boy, I'm your worst fucking nightmare...a retailer that still believes. I believe that the community doesn't have to take Torvalds shit sandwiches, I believe that things can be made better, I believe Linux can be something for more than douchebags like you that will happily take a cock slapping from linus as long as you can say you are sticking to "teh man". I believe that there can be Linux boxes on actual shelves and penguins on boxes. But here enjoy some of the wisdom of the great RMS [youtube.com] and maybe you'll feel better

Re:About time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37724246)

Shut up, bitch. Nobody gives a fuck what a part switcher like you thinks. Go back to fucking little old ladies out of their social security checks with your "system optimizer" services bullshit.

Re:About time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37724392)

My mental image of you is a fat greasy 5' 5" tall troll-esque greasy piece of shit sitting in his "man cave" in his droopy shit-stained drawers wacking it to hentai porn with a 10 year old 21 inch monitor with cigarette ashes everwhere. When you're done, you probably beat your wife/girlfriend/boyfriend and steal 20 dollars out of his/her purse to go sit at the corner store in your piece of shit Hyundai waiting for your crack dealer to come sell you a rock. When you get back home after smoking the rock in your car, you plop your fat ass back down in front of the computer to troll some more and yell at your wife/whatever telling her to bring your dinner of microwave hotwings. When she brings it, you grope her banana titties and she shies away (who wouldn't), you get offended and slap her. Then she runs off and cries while you eat your nasty ass chicken and lick your little pointy fingers not giving a shit how she feels. Then you probably play some Everquest since you have multiple level 80 characters and "6 box". This fulfills you as you have no real friends but you "Da Man" in a raid with 6 characters, amiright? Fucking piece of shit motherfucker. How far off am I?

Re:About time (1)

oakgrove (845019) | more than 2 years ago | (#37725062)

Nice answer fucknuts, no proof, not even any experience with the product, just "nu uh!".

Sigh...

I own an HD7. Office on it is just another cut down mobile Office-a-like that has a small fraction of the features of its desktop counterpart. Editing documents on it is torture on a tiny screen, you can't even switch fonts. Nobody cared about Office on Windows Mobile judging by its dismal performance in the marketplace and it's not a compelling selling point on wp7 because if it was, the damned things would be selling. In short, nobody cares about Office anywhere except on their desktops. Next.

Now let us see what he is AFRAID TO SHOW YOU because it is the TRUTH. The CORRECT quote is "As far as the user is concerned there is NO CLI in windows"

As far as the user is concerned, there's not a lot of things in a lot of things. Newsflash: advanced functionality is for advanced users. Duh. All you are illustrating is the typical Windows user is clueless about the features embedded in their OS of choice. They probably don't know much about "Administrative Tools" either. But for advanced uses, like, oh, I don't know, Goup Policy editing, it is a must. So, to follow your logic, there is no such thing as "Group Policy Editor" in Windows. You are a myopic trollish fool.

Linux? Puts the terminal on the desktop

You are a fucking liar. Ubuntu which is the distro in use by half of Linux desktop users does not put anything on the desktop. To access the terminal, you have make multiple clicks through the menu. It is well hidden. So not only are you a troll but you are an ignorant liar.

walk up to 100 people in the street and ask them "How do you call up command line in Windows" and you know what you are gonna get? "Whats a command line"

Why don't you do that? Because you are talking completely out of your ass? Thought so. Think about it, if you can. Out of the total population of Windows users, a certain percentage is going to know what the command prompt is. What percentage that is, I don't know but I guarantee you it is above zero. And you know it. So not only are you ignorant and a liar but you are also intellectually dishonest.

I don't want to blow your teeny tiny little pea brain but let's put the situation another way since you are so fond of "statistics". By definition, more technically literate people are going to be using Ubuntu because it takes a willful choice to install it on your hardware in the first place. So, we are already talking about people with above average aptitude with computers. What percentage of the pop uses Linux? About 1-2 percent depending on who you ask. What percentage of people can probably tell you what the command prompt is on windows? Probably the same 1-2 percent. Think about it, simpleton.

if your driver model isn't shit then why does Dell have to run their own repos

The same reason they have their own support area where you can download their drivers for hardware running Windows. And that driver model that you call "shit" --as if a pathetic piece of shit like you could even begin to recognize driver code if it slapped you in the face-- is the reason the Linux kernel runs on everything from embedded gumstick sized arm boards all the way up to supercomputers and everything in between. It's called portability, stupid. It's the reason Google chose to keep Dalvik for Android. So that I can install Android on my netbook and actually use the apps. One of the main reasons the Linux kernel is so portable and fills so many niches is because many of the drivers are in the kernel and can be compiled right along with it. So my USB 3G dongle that works on my x86 laptop also works on my Asus Transformer. Thank you, Linus Torvalds. Fuck you bassbeast.

How about how a decade old Windows beat the shit out of Linux on netbooks or how ASUS has given up on your bullshit or how about Walmart running away from linux as fast as it can?

Simple Simon always looking for the simple answer. Obviously for an operating system to succeed, it needs a complete package. And for an OS to succeed against Windows that is completely entrenched in the consciousness of billions of people and the entire computing landscape will require a monumental effort. There are two main reasons consumers reject Linux on the desktop: lack of familiarity and lack of a win32-sized application ecosystem. It didn't help that the Linux systems sold in Wal-Mart had shit for a distro and the Eee-PC wasn't much better. Linux on the desktop for the mass market is probably a lost cause as Windows only developers are just too ubiquitous. No matter how good Linux is if the applications aren't there, it won't matter. Now, let's consider another sphere. Mobile. Linux stomps Microsoft in the ground on the smartphone. It's not even sad. The main difference on the phone is people didn't come in with a lot of expectations as long as it was kind of like an iPhone and available on their carrier, you were golden. Windows Mobile was a piece of shit. Blackberry was a piece of shit and Symbian was MIA. Fast forward a couple of years and now you have the app ecosystem, a much more polished interface and a shit-ton of momentum. So shove you Linux hate up your ass because it is walking all over your beloved Microsoft. We'll see what happens with ICS and tablets but, remember, Honeycomb just came out in February and has had some growing pains. ICS promises to remedy many of HC's issues and might just show the iPad a thing or two.

I'm your worst fucking nightmare...

You are my favorite chew toy actually.

I believe that the community doesn't have to take Torvalds shit sandwiches, I believe that things can be made better, I believe Linux can be something for more than douchebags like you that will happily take a cock slapping from linus as long as you can say you are sticking to "teh man". I believe that there can be Linux boxes on actual shelves and penguins on boxes. But here enjoy some of the wisdom of the great RMS and maybe you'll feel better

You are an arrogant, deluded asshole who thinks his opinion is superior despite any evidence to the contrary. You have a world view all nice and tidied up in your own little mind. Everything to you has a simple answer. It's all about you against the Linux people and fuck what reality is. If an explanation requires 3 sentences and more than 20 words to articulate, you go scuttling back to your hate-filled comfort zone. You are sad and pathetic and I feel bad for you.

More like a recompile [was Re:About time] (1)

gnugnugnu (178215) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723184)

A developer got it to compile successfully, on different hardware. There are no intereface changes and the article makes it clear they are more targeting tablets anyway than mobile devices with really small specialised interefaces. It is techincally a "port" but that is misleading and suggests a lot more than has really happened.

LibreOffice Online - now with free seats (3, Funny)

the_other_chewey (1119125) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722174)

"LibreOffice Online"... seriously? LOO?

I assume it will be accessed via a series of pipes?

Re:LibreOffice Online - now with free seats (0)

ukemike (956477) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722546)

Why make fun of the acronym? The name itself sucks even more. Is it Lee-bray Office or Lee-burr Office? One is the sound a donkey makes, the other is what gets stuck in your socks when you walk through a bunch of weeds . At least when I told people to try Open Office I didn't have to apologize for the name.

Re:LibreOffice Online - now with free seats (1)

Teun (17872) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722654)

When that's your opinion on the name LibreOffice then you suffer a serious lack of culture and language skills.

English inherited even more than other European languages words and expressions from Latin and Libre is a widely understood example of such.

Re:LibreOffice Online - now with free seats (1)

itsdapead (734413) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722814)

When that's your opinion on the name LibreOffice then you suffer a serious lack of culture and language skills.

Sadly, when choosing a name for a product, if you want success you have to win the hearts and minds of people with small hearts and even smaller minds. Intellectually, Software Libre is a much better term than "Free Software" but out in the real world, "FreeOffice" would probably shift more copies than "LibreOffice".

...and its important to remember that, whether software is Free-as-in-speech or Free-as-in-beer, if you want impact you still have to market it as if it cost money.

Re:LibreOffice Online - now with free seats (1)

ukemike (956477) | more than 2 years ago | (#37724444)

Well perhaps your high and mighty superiority complex needs a nice lecture on the history of the english language. How it has a few remnants of p-celt but is mostly a flavor of German that was brought to the island by the Angles and the Saxons during the 6th century. Much later, after the Norman invasion when most of the nobility was French speaking lots of new words were introduced into the language. This explains why we have two words for most sorts of meat (sheep/mutton cows/beef etc) and it also explains why so many words don't follow easy to learn spelling rules of thumb. We have elements of Germanic and Romance languages which are fairly different branches of the indo-european language family tree. English has certainly NOT inherited a disproportionate amount of Latin. French, Italian, Spanish, and Portuguese are almost all Latin in origin. English gets almost all of it's Latin through the French. Though to be fair we do have more Latin bits than German, Dutch, and the Scandinavian languages. But so much for the highly simplified history of the language. The fact that Libre means free and comes from Latin (ooh it's Latin it's sooo sophisticated) is fine and is well understood by all but the most uneducated, but it doesn't change my opinion that the name is clunky and utterly fails to have a nice ring to it. It's exactly the sort of name that a committee of programers would come up with. So perhaps if you pulled your head out of your highly cultured ass you might realize that I was expressing my opinion that has nothing to do with etymology and everything to do with my opinion that the name sounds like crap.

Re:LibreOffice (1)

petit_robert (1220082) | more than 2 years ago | (#37725504)

I, for one, really enjoy that name. It really conveys the right feeling, as seems to be confirmed by the onslaught of the schills against it.

Disclaimer : I'm a French programmer

Re:LibreOffice Online - now with free seats (1)

Teun (17872) | more than 2 years ago | (#37725734)

I respect your opinion that Libre has a negative ring to you.

But your writing doesn't match etymological facts. Of the languages based on Germanic grammar the English has with in excess of 50% by a good margin incorporated the most vocabulary of Latin origin.

Re:LibreOffice Online - now with free seats (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722656)

How about a LibreOffice Lite version for embedded use? LOL

Re:LibreOffice Online - now with free seats (1)

ilsaloving (1534307) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723196)

"Where did you put that TPS report?"

"It's in the LOO!"

Reminds me of the time when we were naming our servers after planets, and I made the mistake of naming a file server Uranus. The jokes were going on for months.

Re:LibreOffice Online - now with free seats (1)

Megane (129182) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723430)

I'm waiting for LuchaLibreOffice Online. Or would that be LuchaOfficeLibre?

Re:LibreOffice Online - now with free seats (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37726594)

The Internet is, after all, a series of tubes.

Good. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37722366)

NOW I am convinced that I should be using libreoffice, not openoffice.

I love LibreOffice (0)

ihasdiggs (2485446) | more than 2 years ago | (#37722566)

I am a big fan of open source software

Re:I love LibreOffice (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37723178)

Looks like you love sucking geek cock too, all the way up to +2 mod points by default

And what a charmingly banal sentiment you offer up with your bonus mod points.

Re:I love LibreOffice (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37723322)

What do you have against people who suck geek cock? Are you just jealous that it isn't yours beings sucked?

LibreOffice Online (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37723082)

LibreOffice Online is a bit misleading, the article is just talking about a prototype that uses the GTK Broadway with HTML5 backend to make a remote connection to LibreOffice. An impressive demo but sure but hardly the most practical.

iOS Version? I thought that didn't work (2)

omnichad (1198475) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723268)

If you use proprietary Apple API's, I don't believe they allow you to release your source code. It wouldn't be open source. They would have to release that version closed source, which they can't do if they don't own the code.

Re:iOS Version? I thought that didn't work (5, Interesting)

bWareiWare.co.uk (660144) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723304)

It is LGPL, so they can use their existing code as a library and write a closed source iOS UI.

Mobile Viewer (3, Interesting)

tverbeek (457094) | more than 2 years ago | (#37723300)

While I would welcome an iOS version of LibreOffice some day, what I really want in the near future is a viewer for its native file formats.

Mobile LibreOffice: it's far from a reality (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37724184)

I was at the announcement, and I remain sceptical. This was more or less only an announcement of an intention, not an announcement of something that actually exists. Nothing was shown, and if you have followed the LibreOffice mailing lists, you have seen that so far it is only a build of the standard UI on Android. Before we will see a touch based interface, the developers will first have to separate the UI from the engine which is an enormous task.

If you want to have a free office suite on Android, I recommend starting with the Calligra suite instead. They already have two touch based interfaces (Calligra Mobile for smartphones with MeeGo and Calligra Active for tablets using Plasma Active).

What About Android in the Browser? (1)

Doc Ruby (173196) | more than 2 years ago | (#37725802)

I know I'm talking about kinda the reverse of this story.

But is there a way to run all of Android in a browser? With apps embedded in it. So all of the apps I have installed on my Android phone I can also install on my (or someone else's) server. I'd just hit my webpage with Android and its apps embedded in the page, and use the same apps. I'd use apps that all save their state to a DB on my server (or through my server to a cloud). I could flip between phone and other machines at will.

I could use "my phone" anywhere, even when there's only wired networking (eg. inside big buildings) or where I had better/cheaper bandwidth, or a better keyboard/screen, or my battery was low. I couldn't use the phone to talk over the PSTN, but even that limit will eventually go away (Google voice, etc).

Android is a largish Java program in bytecode running on a Dalvik JVM, that was originally written in Java source and compiled to target Dalvik. Browsers have a JVM (Sun or other) that Android might be recompiled to target running on. The hard part is getting Android's hardware abstraction to map to the browser's hardware abstraction. But is it doable? Is it already done?

I live Libre (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37725886)

I love LibreOffice. I hope this is competitive with Google Docs.

Officelibre supporter (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#37726982)

I've been using OfficeLibre since their release and I support their projects. Everything coming from their 3rd party progs have helped build the freeware movements.

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