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377 comments

Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (1)

sethstorm (512897) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492892)

For the country that usually is known for its robots, that sure seems to be an embarrassment.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (1, Insightful)

InterestingFella (2537066) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492906)

Disappointment? Things work both ways. But since the whalers are in international waters, they should just shoot down those drones. It's not like the anti-whalers have tons of cash to spend on them.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (1)

luther349 (645380) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492926)

you would think so. but i think the Japanese have more fun harassing them back tomorrow on whale wars the Japanese use there own uav to spy on sea shepherd lol. and it will be made out to be some super evil tactic.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (2)

mrchaotica (681592) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492966)

Tactically, a UAV wouldn't do the whalers much (if any) good as long as Sea Shepherd has one too. Sea Shepherd's entire goal is to find and then tailgate the factory ship; once they've done that then it doesn't matter if the whalers know where they are.

Now, if the whalers shot down Sea Shepherd's UAV (before it found the factory ship) then they could use their own to track Sea Shepherd and keep the factory ship away from their position, without "wasting" a harpoon ship like they've been doing.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (2)

luther349 (645380) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492990)

yea i was just making fun of there whole cat and mouse game. maybe the Japanese need to sink another one of there boats.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (1)

zill (1690130) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493010)

This "shoot the drone" down idea has been mentioned twice in this thread already, but how feasible is it really? Can anyone familiar with maritime law comment on it?

Pragmatically speaking you'll need automatic weapons to take down a drone on the high seas, and those NFA firearms aren't cheap. Not to mention you'll need to sail out of US, intercept the drones, and then sail back to the US again.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (2)

Issarlk (1429361) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493038)

And if the drone is high in the sky then just guns won't make it, you'd need some missile. Would whale fishing cover the costs of firing perhaps several guided missiles on each trip ?

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (4, Insightful)

Discopete (316823) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493108)

I'd be willing to bet that the minute the Japanese whaling fleet took a missile shot at the drone, the Australian navy would be all over them. The Japanese don't need that kind of bad PR at this point in time.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (4, Insightful)

Runaway1956 (1322357) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493280)

Won't swear to it, but I'm pretty sure that our guns could reach higher than a drone could fly. Of course, those were navy main deck guns, and whalers don't have anything as big, or as powerful available to them.

What whalers MIGHT get hold of, are some missiles. Shoulder launched SAM missiles, if they can acquire a lock on the drone. Drones are rather stealthy, lacking a lot of the heat, radio, and/or magnetism associated with older and/or ancient aircraft. So - you rely on sight? Fly-by-wire?

But, when you get down to it, I think the Iranians have the best idea. Just use some radio equipment to jam communications, the GPS spoof it into landing on the water, recover the blasted thing yourself, and the Greenies are out one drone.

All that said - I do wish the Japanese would quit hunting whales. It's not like they are going to starve without them. Back in the day when there were tens of thousands of any given species, and mankind only captured a few dozen whales per year, things were cool. Today, the population is just to damned low, and we've become to damned efficient. Extinction threatens, and that just sucks.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (5, Informative)

sg_oneill (159032) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492982)

Actually much of the whaling has been happening illegally in australian waters, and believe me, firearms would absolutely be the last straw in our governments very thin patience with these poachers.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493060)

Actually much of the whaling has been happening illegally in australian waters, and believe me, firearms would absolutely be the last straw in our governments very thin patience with these poachers.

Mod Parent up.
Public Opinion has in the region is around 90-10 against the Whalers, especially after the Sea Shepherd Stunt.
The Australian Navy has been requested to intervene on both sides in the last few years. Refused to take sides at this point.

General feeling is the Activists could prob take it a few steps further iwthout getting into trouble whereas the Japanese have pushed to the limits already.

Sonic weapons on both sides will be the next escalation step. However as this article is about communication and intelligence is vital.
If they know where the mother ship is they know how far out the whaling ships can reach and therefore act to drive the whales out of the way.

The danger comes where they know the Whaling ship has spotted a whale and is actively hunting it.

They will attempt to get in the line of sight of the harpoon, acid/gumsplash the harpoon mechanism, anything to stop the shot.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (1)

speaker4thedead (193887) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493070)

Well... In that case, lets all hope they decide to resort to firearms.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (5, Informative)

Richard_at_work (517087) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493190)

The waters they are fishing in are waters claimed by Australia but not recognised by Japan - Australia claim control over most of the southern ocean, well outside of the normal economic zone limits, and thus Japan has a valid reason to not recognise Australian control. Japan also doesn't recognise the economic area Australia claim off the coast of Antarctica, so once again the claim is in dispute.

It's hardly as black and white as you put it - and I support the abolition of whaling.

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (1)

TFAFalcon (1839122) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493078)

Don't the anti-whalers have the right to fly drones around in international waters?

If the whalers start shooting them, what is to stop the anti-whalers from sinking the whaling ships?

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (1)

Runaway1956 (1322357) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493294)

Sinking a ship would put all mariners up in arms, no matter their nationality, politics, religion, or anything at all. There are some things you just don't do, unless you're ready to declare open war. Do the whaler-chasers have a nation ready to back them up with a real navy? I don't think so . . .

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (2)

skegg (666571) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493296)

Oh come now, no ships would ever be sunk because of a feud between a nation state and environmentalists.

Err, scrap that [wikipedia.org] .

Re:Looks like drones aren't just for governments. (2)

jimbolauski (882977) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493344)

Most ships would not be allowed in claimed waters if they had weapons. Its part of the strange rules that govern sailing vessels and make them prime targets for pirates.

So people really have this much time and money? (3, Insightful)

antifoidulus (807088) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492902)

I don't get the opposition to hunting non-endangered whales. The whales being hunted(mostly minke whales), are nowhere near endangered, so why is there just so much opposition to the whaling? Do these people really have nothing better to do with their time and money than harassing fishing boats? Maybe they should just get into Magic the Gathering instead, eats time and money like nothing else....

Also have these people actually tried whale meat? It's delicious.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1, Troll)

InterestingFella (2537066) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492920)

Anti-whalers, PETA and for example those who oppose nuclear power aren't usually known to be all that wise. For example with the latter group they don't get that nuclear power is actually good for them because it's the least polluting energy source there is. But they cannot comprehend that and probably want us to have no energy at all. Same goes for anti-whalers and PETA. They just think killing animals is somehow bad, and don't look into matters past that.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (0)

luther349 (645380) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492940)

the least polluting energy we have is solar wind and hydro. nuclear power has changed sense the 60s that's true and shit rarely happens but when it does its always big, i for one would not what to live near a nuclear plaint. but call me when they get fusion going.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (2, Insightful)

bky1701 (979071) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492984)

"the least polluting energy we have is solar wind and hydro"

If you ignore how the actual plants are produced. Hint: solar isn't very clean to build on the scale it has to be to work. Hydro is likely the most dangerous and destroys environments. Wind is extremely expensive and makes large tracts of land unusable. And finally, none of them are actually answers. Solar and wind are not reliable enough and never will be with out level of technology, and that is unlikely to change soon. Hydro can only be built in some places and usually is not for the aforementioned reasons. Nuclear is the safest, cleanest, and cheapest option we have. We need to stop listening to fearmongers and figure out how to make it work right. Coal and oil are power until that happens. Solar and wind are pipedreams.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493046)

I wholeheartedly agree that you first have to "figure out how to make nuclear work right". Until now the nuclear industry has given us nothing but an nuclear disaster every 10 years, nuclear weapons and lots of waste no-one has a reliable storage for until it is completely save again. Worst is that there are nuclear technologies which are safe and produce much less and faster-decaying waste, but because they did not produce so much weapon-grade Plutonium, they were neglected.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (4, Interesting)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493214)

There are plenty of nuclear waste disposal options that are cheap, reliable and safe. They are just politically problematic.

The easiest would be to just put it in boxes and throw it down the Mariana Trench. There is no possibility of anyone getting it back, and if it ever comes back up naturally it'll be long after safe decay. The problem is political: Throwing nuclear waste in the ocean violates international law, and for some reason no politician wants to start the process of changing that.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493228)

So far it's been only one disaster every 25 years, not every 10.
And the nuclear industry did give us something: lots of electricity. LOTS. If it weren't for nuclear energy, we would not be able to have computers in every home. And every office would have only 1 (10 for big corproations), not the 100s they currently have in many places. We would also have to give up on a lot of hospital equipment. And the industry would have to give up on a lot of machines that produce the goods we buy (cars, iPods, TVs, kitchen hardware, etc) and we would go back to technology from the 50s.

Nuclear disasters suck but overall nuclear still saves much more lives, not to mention improve the comfort of our lives. Also, the technology is really safe (except for that Chernobyl incident - the reactor had flaws, but we improved so much since then). The problem behind disasters like Fukushima is people. People in charge don't go for maximum security in order to save money. The public also votes to cut funds to nuclear energy, thinking this will stop nuclear power, but in reality it just forces already existing nuclear plants to give up on security measures. It all comes down to people, and this is a problem we can solve if we really want to. On the other hand, if we gave up on nuclear power, we would not be able to run all the technology we have and need, no matter how much we want it to run without electricity.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1, Interesting)

luther349 (645380) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493058)

we have the biggest hydro dam in the word able to run most of the usa on its own. its just they never expanded it on that scale but it does run a large chunk of it. and that's just 1. i got 2 250 watt panels and a couple dc battery's plus a 600 watt turbine mounted on a fucking camper and it pulls plenty of power. enough to run pretty much everything. the problem is not with alt energy being pratcal because it is very much so its removing the power hungry devices from your life. that 3 video card computer drawing 1500 watts just isn't needed. even the most powerful laptops draw under 150 watts. and netbooks 35. with 450 amp hrs on my 2 batters i can run even the gaming laptop all night long and still have power. and if theirs wind not even drain the battery's. and most cases if theirs no sun there is wind. its just a matter of using low power devices. led lighting etc.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (2)

AlanS2002 (580378) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493126)

Nuclear is the safest, cleanest, and cheapest option we have. We need to stop listening to fearmongers and figure out how to make it work right.

60+ years hasn't been long enough to "figure out how to make it work right"?

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1)

FrozenFood (2515360) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493140)

I think he means 60+ years to build another 10,000 nuclear plants

Fear (2)

gd2shoe (747932) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493208)

60+ years hasn't been long enough to "figure out how to make it work right"?

No. Not in our current climate of fear. It's a political third rail. Investors don't give nuclear a second thought. Scientists and engineers have limited funding. Many of our best minds avoid the field altogether as a dead end career. Who wants to be working in nuclear? The future is elsewhere.

(personal position: nuclear power could certainly be safe, but I've yet to find an organization I'd trust to not cut corners on something so expensive and dangerous. I've also yet to find a regulatory agency with better attention to detail than your average grade schooler.)

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493154)

Since that guy was talking about our current technology, you may be right. But technology is always advancing, so solar, hydro, and wind power may become viable in the future.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1)

Paradise Pete (33184) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493216)

But technology is always advancing, so solar, hydro, and wind power may become viable in the future.

What other things are possible?

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493184)

Solar panels contain sand (silicon), aluminum, and glass with a few copper wires. There isn't anything toxic about them unless you get your 'facts' from Fox News.

And yes, solar and wind could work for 50-60% of our power needs if we got behind the technology and wanted to use it.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493258)

Solar panels absorb sun rays that would normally heat the ground. If we used solar panels on a large scale, we would drastically change the environment.
Same with wind power: the power of the wind is absorbed by the blades of the wind towers, thus the wind gets weaker after it goes through a large field of wind towers. Wind is important to the environment as it helps plants reproduce and spread their seeds further away. It's also important to birds, who use it a lot to make flying easier, especially when traveling long distances.

At least nuclear waste is 95% recycled (and we find new ways to recycle the remaining 5% every year) and nuclear plants are very safe when properly funded.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493312)

Solar panels contain sand (silicon), aluminum, and glass with a few copper wires. There isn't anything toxic about them unless you get your 'facts' from Fox News.

Riiight. In fact my recycle bin of glass bottles and aluminum cans starts spontaneously arcing in the sunlight, it's so magically easy.

Solar panels use toxic materials as part of the panel and in the fabrication process. Oh, and they require significant amounts of power to fabricate.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (4, Insightful)

tenco (773732) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493268)

Here in southern Germany you still have to test mushrooms and wild boar for radioactivity because of the Chernobyl accident 1986. It's mostly due to Cs137 which has a half life of ~ 30 years. I remember having to stay indoors for days as a child (i was 5 at that time) because of that accident. The linear distance to Chernobyl is about 1400 km.

I would call that very much polluting.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1)

fredan (54788) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493284)

solar isn't very clean to build on the scale it has to be to work.

Coal and oil are power until that happens.

so this is less dirtier than making solarpanels.

you sir, are a troll.

What do you spend your time doing? (3, Interesting)

thegoldenear (323630) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492946)

There's a lot of people on the planet, and so a lot of time being spent by them, why does the small amount of time these people spend grate on you that much? What do you spend your time doing?

Re:What do you spend your time doing? (1)

antifoidulus (807088) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493006)

If they weren't doing illegal shit and bothering other people then I wouldn't care. I can turn around and ask you the exact same question, why does the small amount of time Japan spends whaling bother them so much?

Re:What do you spend your time doing? (2)

thegoldenear (323630) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493152)

It's not the _time_ being wasted that they're bothered about, it's the whales being wasted that bothers them.
Your point, that I was addressing, was "Do these people really have nothing better to do with their time".

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (5, Informative)

mrchaotica (681592) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492948)

This group was founded by a guy who got kicked out of Greenpeace for being too extreme. Logic has nothing to do with their decisions.

That said, possible justifications might include the argument that the whales are too intelligent to ethically kill, or the argument that the law only allows killing whales for scientific research but the Japanese are instead killing them for food/profit (despite the word "research" written on the sides of their ships).

Also have these people actually tried whale meat? It's delicious.

I'd be very surprised if they aren't all vegans.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (5, Informative)

axx (1000412) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492998)

I believe Watson left Greenpeace because they were softening up. Different interpretations?

The Japanese have massive factory ships dedicated to cutting up and conditioning whales, and according to Wikipedia: “The efficiency of these ships and the predation they carried out on whales contributed greatly to the animal's precipitous decline.”
These are, supposedly, research vessels. You have to appreciate the hypocrisy.

Also, Sea Shepherd vessels *are* vegan, to the best of my knowledge.

And SSCS also have a PGP key to send them encrypted email, c'mon, /. should approve of them.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (5, Interesting)

Discopete (316823) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493144)

Paul Watson was asked to leave Greenpeace because when GP was attempting to get charitable status with the US IRS, the IRS told them "No property damage". Later that week, Watson disarmed a harp seal hunter who was clubbing a seal to death and tossed the club into the ocean. That is considered property damage and the board asked him to resign.

A few years later, one of the other founders of GP decided that they had become too soft, left and joined Sea Shepherd.

I believe everyone on board SS's ships are vegetarian, if not Vegan.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (3, Insightful)

axx (1000412) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492970)

I'm trying to figure out if you're trolling, or just have never considered the ethics of hunting and killing other sentient species for pleasure.

You may not realise this, but whaling is actually against international regulations. Sea Shepherd simply enforce the ban in International waters, given no one else does. They also protect and defend many other marine species.

It's called conservation.

Overfishing and fucked up fishing practices are incredibly common place, it's good we have some people trying to prevent it.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493102)

This is why responsible cannibals stick to people with low IQs.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493206)

I'm trying to figure out if you're trolling, or just have never considered the ethics of hunting and killing other sentient species for pleasure.

I don't think they're doing it for fun.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (0)

muon-catalyzed (2483394) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492988)

actually tried whale meat? It's delicious.

Woohoo, we have a whale eater in the discussion, and since whales are delicious, it is OK to kill them, right? (just following your logic)

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1, Troll)

TFAFalcon (1839122) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493112)

Don't the Japanese have problems getting rid of all the meat they harvest? From what I've read there isn't much of a market for it, so they have to give it away to schools which can force their pupils to eat it.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38492996)

I don't get the opposition to hunting non-endangered whales. The whales being hunted(mostly minke whales), are nowhere near endangered, so why is there just so much opposition to the whaling? Do these people really have nothing better to do with their time and money than harassing fishing boats? Maybe they should just get into Magic the Gathering instead, eats time and money like nothing else....

Also have these people actually tried whale meat? It's delicious.

Because the Japanese have proven time and time again they don't just go after the 'non-endangered' species.
How many times do people have to be shown the truth?

Most of last years catch of whale meat ROTTED at the Institue behind this sham.

At this point they are killing whales out of tradition and the small minority that eat the meat still.

And do you really think harpooning and electrocuting the largest mammals on earth whose brain power and emotional states are generally compared to say YOU , don't you think thats a little...off?

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1)

cheekyjohnson (1873388) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493062)

And do you really think harpooning and electrocuting the largest mammals on earth whose brain power and emotional states are generally compared to say YOU , don't you think thats a little...off?

I don't see why their brain power is all that important. Less intelligent animals don't matter, then?

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (2)

reve_etrange (2377702) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493134)

Less intelligent animals don't matter, then?

Not as much, anyway.

For example, the bar is lower for medical research performed on rats and mice than dogs, chimpanzees and gorillas. Most people feel more sympathy towards animals that can be taught to communicate via sign language (such as gorillas) or other means than rodents that barely remember mazes./p?

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493248)

>> And do you really think harpooning and electrocuting the largest mammals on earth whose brain power and emotional states are generally compared to say YOU , don't you think thats a little...off?

> I don't see why their brain power is all that important. Less intelligent animals don't matter, then?

Stop trolling, I'm in doubt you're doing the "false dilemma" or the "straw man" logical fallacies...

This is not to establish what matters or not; to a vegan all animal life matters, while in some cultures traditions determinate what is fit to eat and what's not..

The point is we constantly evolve a better comprehension of Nature; the same way we expect someone to free the slaves once he understands they're human beings just like the rest of us, the same way we expect a cannibal to stop eating humans once he stops to think that they are the same like him, we hope someone starts ceasing to eat intelligent animals one he perceives them as such.

Because intelligent animals would be like us -- that's what we are.

If we can manage to go further and just eat synthesized lab meat, I'm all for it, but killing (not just eating) intelligent life is a huge no-no in my Ethics book. I just imagine others are like me, if not already then after thinking a little... I also expect not to be eaten, if I encounter an intelligent alien...

Actually, I'm quite surprised that people question why not killing intelligent animals; I'd like to know what criteria they use to spare a life... maybe the animal must be cute enough to be unfit for being devoured?

Of course, it's a different question if a species, intelligent or not, is endangered -- and specifically, if it's endangered by us!.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493324)

I totally agree, i am carnivore, and i do not think there is anything wrong with killing animals like pigs/chicken/fish for food, but killing INTELLIGENT animals for any reason except to save HUMAN LIFE is a big no-no

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1)

cheekyjohnson (1873388) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493366)

Stop trolling, I'm in doubt you're doing the "false dilemma" or the "straw man" logical fallacies...

I wasn't trolling, and I wasn't stating anything. I don't know how that was a false dilemma.

I was asking if less intelligent animals mattered. That's why it was in the form of a question. I wanted to know if the one I replied to believed that less intelligent animals are objectively less important.

I also expect not to be eaten, if I encounter an intelligent alien...

Perhaps they will find us so unintelligent and inefficient that they will kill us without hesitation.

I'd like to know what criteria they use to spare a life

Their own beliefs.

In any case, I was just saying that I see no magical reason that "intelligent" animals are more important than unintelligent animals outside of person beliefs.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493318)

well, the reasoning is that they (the animals) can understand the plight they're in in they got more brain power.
basically that's the same reason why it's not ok to make dogs starve but it is ok to make flies that eat rotten dog meat starve.

that said, the "research" performed by japanese whalers is ridiculous - like researching the best way to do whaling. eh. as a food source whales aren't sustainable.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (2)

InterestingFella (2537066) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493120)

And do you really think harpooning and electrocuting the largest mammals on earth whose brain power and emotional states are generally compared to say YOU , don't you think thats a little...off?

Are you saying killing is ok as long as the target is dumber than you? Does this also expand to other humans?

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493354)

Notably, one of the big issues I have with animal protection activists is that they tend to blur the line between humans and animals.

Humans are our own species. Animals are OTHER species. There is no fine line. We may all be animals, but we are different species then any other animal. And I would personally butcher a hundred whales if it meant I could save one human life. I would harm as many just to avoid harm coming to another human.

And that's the difference between people like myself and people like those from Sea Shepard. We value human lives much higher then they do, and at the same time we value lives of other species much lower then they do.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1)

cheekyjohnson (1873388) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493000)

so why is there just so much opposition to the whaling?

I don't know. Difference of opinions?

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (4, Insightful)

unity100 (970058) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493048)

whaling is illegal in majority of countries which actually could engage in whaling. case in point below.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7188674.stm [bbc.co.uk]

that means, the majority of the countries which have a stake in this, are against whaling. but, japan, engages in whaling on its own accord.

then lets reflect on this - where does the 'individual freedom' stop ? see, majority of the countries in the world find something unethical and ban something, like slavery. and then is it ok if i broke accord and go against majority, and engage in slaving within my own country or international waters/zones - based on my own 'freedom' ?

it is a simple case of individual freedom's limits. there is no unlimited individual freedom, and there cant be unlimited individual freedom. you cant just go shit in your neighbor's backyard, or your neighbor cant just shit on the streets in common space. there are all encompassing rules that everyone needs to obey for society to EXIST (note how i didnt say 'work', but, even to exist), and these rules are determined by the overall level of ethics and morals understanding of the entire society. (planet in this case).

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (3, Insightful)

Ardeaem (625311) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493080)

"I don't get the opposition to hunting non-endangered humans. The people I'd like to hunt (mostly developmentally-disabled people), are nowhere near endangered, so why is there just so much opposition to the people hunting? Do these anti-human hunting people really have nothing better to do with their time and money than harassing human-hunting parties? Maybe they should just get into Magic the Gathering instead, eats time and money like nothing else...."

Seriously, if you think the amount of a particular species is the only thing relevant to the ethics of killing it, you aren't thinking about ethics very hard. The fact that your post was modded up is baffling. We can disagree on whether whales are intelligent enough to make killing them unethical (I think the evidence shows they probably are, and it is better to err on the side of not killing intelligent animals unnecessarily).

And then you belittle Sea Shepherd for acting in a principled manner and putting their lives and money on the line to fight something that a strong argument can be made (whether you agree with it or not) is like murder. While you might like playing Magic, at least they're out there fighting for something that has the potential to make the world a better place not just for future people, but other intelligent species as well.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493130)

Having had it as steak, burger and shish kebab, I respectfully disagree - it retains a side-taste sort of like cod liver oil that I wasn't very fond of. It's supposedly possible to reduce or hide it, but I remain sceptical.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (3, Informative)

Discopete (316823) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493136)

The Japanese are not "Whaling", they are conducting "Research" which apparently involves stockpiling whale meat for consumption. The Japanese whaling fleet has repeatedly violated international treaties and at least one off-limits whale sanctuary. The largest power in the area is Australia and they refuse to enforce the international treaties that apply to the sanctuary, hence Sea Shepard has to step in and enforce the law.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (1)

AlanS2002 (580378) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493138)

I don't get the opposition to hunting non-endangered whales. The whales being hunted(mostly minke whales), are nowhere near endangered, so why is there just so much opposition to the whaling?

So, lets just hunt them until they are endangered and then move on to the next species?

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (2)

Cyberax (705495) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493266)

"I don't get the opposition to hunting non-endangered whales. The whales being hunted(mostly minke whales), are nowhere near endangered"

Yet.

And not only mink whales are being hunted.

Re:So people really have this much time and money? (4, Interesting)

Runaway1956 (1322357) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493304)

There's a narrow line between "endangered" and "not endangered". The seas have grown barren, compared to 300 years ago. With five years of sea duty behind me, I can state that whale sightings are rare, dolphins are only somewhat less rare.

It's a bit tough to find tales of life at sea 300 or more years ago, that don't include a lot of superstitious nonsense, but it seems to have been common for ships to be constantly trailed by dolphins, and whales were common sights. With each passing decade, there are fewer and fewer.

The only two explanations for that, that make any sense, are over hunting, and pollution.

We really need to allow the ocean, and the populations found in the ocean to recover. Why wait until any given species is actually "endangered" before trying to conserve resources?

Summary got whale count wrong (1)

million_monkeys (2480792) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492916)

They didn't save 200 whales, that's how many were actually caught, which was only about a fifth of the whaler's quota.

From TFA (emphasis added):

"This is a very effective tactic that we did last year, it was so effective that the whalers went home over a month early and called it quits and we saved 858 whales out of a possible 1,035.

These guys are like pirates (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38492924)

The crew of the Sea Shepherd have steered themselves into collision courses with other vessels, attempted to board other boats and thrown acid onto the decks of other ships.

Those guys are pirates that endanger the lives of fishermen who are just doing their jobs.

I'm concerned about what they will end up using the drones for.

Re:These guys are like pirates (2, Insightful)

Issarlk (1429361) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492942)

By fishermen you mean scientists, right ?

Re:These guys are like pirates (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493042)

Sure he does. Just like the ones in Enola Gay.

Re:These guys are like pirates (1, Troll)

andydread (758754) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493350)

Scientist my ass. They are fishermen. There is no research going on. The Japanese believe that eating whale meat will give you a big dick. This is enshrined into Japanese folklore. Apparently the Japanese have always had a problem with penis size. Killing these animals over stupid superstition then lying that you are killing them for research is pathetically slimy.

Re:These guys are like pirates (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38492960)

You mean that collision in this video?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7p6fXA0flmA&feature=relmfu

where are 4 seconds in the ship is coming straight at the camera before making a hard turn to startboard TOWARDS the sea shepart ship.

Look I agree that they are mainly crackpots but in that case it is pretty bloody obvious that the Japanese ship went for them.

Re:These guys are like pirates (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38492964)

"who are just doing their jobs", hahahahaaaaaaaa.
sure, everybody's just doing their jooooob, lol.

the fact is that everything human race touches crumbles to dust, we're just very successful in fucking everything up.
some may laugh about PETA, even me, but still better than nothing - well, although I don't think they will make any difference in the end.
if we don't get those whales by fishing then we'll do by throwing radioactivity to the sea, or millions of plastic bags. I swear we'll find something :P

Re:These guys are like pirates (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493026)

I am hunting and slaughter ACs for scientific reasons.
Sorry, but it's just my job. So don't be against it and rest your head on this fine cosy block of wood while I'll get my axe.

"It's just my job" is the absolutely worst of possible excuses there is. It downgrades you to an animal blindly following daily routine. You have a neocortex to think independently. Try to use it.

I love Japan. But whale hunting is just plain stupid. Even the japanese people do not eat whale meat. The average consumption was 15g (gramm) in an entire year!
It's just stubbornness. Nothing else.

Re:These guys are like pirates (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493028)

The crew of the Sea Shepherd have steered themselves into collision courses with other vessels, attempted to board other boats and thrown acid onto the decks of other ships.

Those guys are pirates that endanger the lives of fishermen who are just doing their jobs.

I'm concerned about what they will end up using the drones for.

Please go Youtube the Sea Shepherd Collision. No flaming just curious if you think they engineered that collision after watching it?
They aren't the most rational of guys for sure.
But deliberately colliding something with something that much bigger than you in the open ocean would be suicidal.

Re:These guys are like pirates (1)

axx (1000412) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493072)

Said this way, this is mostly FUD.

SSCS have never been convicted in court, to the best of my knowledge.
Even though they have sunk a good number of ships, including some of the Norwegian fleet a while back.

They have thrown rancid butter acid on illegal shipping vessels' decks as stink bombs. We're not talking fluoridicric acid here.
Look out for the “they threw acid at us” spin, the Japanese whaling industry is in an public image war with Sea Shepherd.

“Just doing their jobs” is probably the best bit though.

Re:These guys are like pirates (1)

AlanS2002 (580378) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493156)

Those guys ... endanger the lives of fishermen who are just doing their jobs.

If I recall correctly, the "just doing my job" bit didn't fly too well at Nuremberg.

Re:These guys are like pirates (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493194)

Just doing their jobs? That's what Adolf Eichmann said at Nuremberg too.

Re:These guys are like pirates (0)

Yoda222 (943886) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493348)

Why do the police imprison hitman who are just doing their job ?

In other news salmon and tuna are running out (1, Interesting)

tp1024 (2409684) | more than 2 years ago | (#38492944)

As well as lots of other species. No fuss about those.

Why is it that those guys still act like it's 1968? We have different problems these days!

Re:In other news salmon and tuna are running out (3, Interesting)

puppybeard (1971088) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493016)

There is fuss about both of those, perhaps you aren't aware of it.
http://www.nasco.int/ [nasco.int] for Salmon

http://www.tunaresearch.org/ [tunaresearch.org] for Tuna

And you forgot cod: http://www.greenpeace.org.uk/media/press-releases/greenpeace-ship-sails-to-save-north-sea-cod [greenpeace.org.uk]

And to be fair to them, while I don't see myself joining their fight, at least they have the balls to stand up for something, sure there are problems in the world, but most people don't bother addressing those problems either. Apathy, not whale conservationists, is our biggest enemy.

Re:In other news salmon and tuna are running out (4, Interesting)

axx (1000412) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493020)

In other news, Sea Shepherd are a conservation group, they defend all marine species, including Tuna (for which they have been doing a major Mediterranean campaign). You should check the width of their action before pointing out “boo, there are other fish species endangered, so you get no points for protecting one and not all of them!”.

Interesting that while TFA is about clever use of technology in a space where it's not obvious, most slashdotters seem more interested in bashing the group of people using this technology for not following their (very traditional and anthropocentric) view of life. Nice.

Re:In other news salmon and tuna are running out (1)

AlanS2002 (580378) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493164)

As well as lots of other species. No fuss about those.

So if I'm not taking action about every single issue on the planet, I'm automatically discredited?

Re:In other news salmon and tuna are running out (1)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493220)

People only care about cute species. Even Sea Kittens are not that cute.

Terrorist with drones now? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493030)

These terrorists should not be allowed to use drones. Not terrorists you say? They ruin the lives of fishermen by sinking their ships! [riseup.net]

Re:Terrorist with drones now? (1)

Issarlk (1429361) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493090)

Fishermen you say? So why are they hunting whales?
Whales are not fish.

Re:Terrorist with drones now? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493202)

Yeah, they are the chicken of the sea.

Re:Terrorist with drones now? (0)

JustOK (667959) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493218)

they're fish-ish

Re:Terrorist with drones now? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493096)

Yes, it's better to ruin the lives of endangered species by terrorists.^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H...fishermen. These terrorists.^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H...fishermen should not be allowed to use ships.

Re:Terrorist with drones now? (0)

andydread (758754) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493356)

I don't normally reply to Anonymous Cowards however you are a fucking moron.

Swarm drones (1)

arcite (661011) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493128)

In the near future they could use a swarm of drones to both deflect the whalers boats and to scare away the whales themselves. With a large enough supply of drones, the hunting could be made virtually impossible (or at least increasingly economically unviable). This is very good news for the whales.

Anti-Drone Systems: Japanese-Iranian Joint Venture (1)

PolygamousRanchKid (1290638) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493148)

Company name: Jairan. Project code name: Rodan!

This will definitely be a growth area in military industry in the next few years, as all smaller countries scramble to rid themselves of those meddling spy drones. Look for them at the next air warfare exhibition.

But what could they be . . . ? Anti-GPS radio beams . . . ? Laser pointers to blind the pilots back at the command base . . . ?

C'mom, ./er's . . . put on your imagination caps, and tell us your ideas! This anti-whaling skirmish is just the start of bigger battles to come.

Re:Anti-Drone Systems: Japanese-Iranian Joint Vent (1)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493236)

Micro-missiles would be politically difficult - can't just let civilians play around with those without a lot of regulation. Some sort of ECM system would be doable. Find the downlink frequency, directional antenna and tracking system locked on to the uplink. Disrupt the control connection. Drones aren't so dumb they'll crash, but the autopilot will kick in, turning the drone around and sending it back from whence it came.

Re:Anti-Drone Systems: Japanese-Iranian Joint Vent (1)

qxcv (2422318) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493332)

You needn't go so high-tech to take down tiny unmanned aircraft, have a look at the CIWS [wikipedia.org] ("Close-in Weapon Systems") used by navies to protect from missiles and aircraft. Scattering a bunch of those around the countryside (or in this case, on board a whaling ship) would probably take care of those meddling spy drones. Here's a video of one in a training exercise [youtube.com] .

Not their first use of awesome tech (1)

thegarbz (1787294) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493162)

Sea Shepard are not new to fancy high tech gear. Sure last year they may have been firing bow and arrows at the Japanese whaling fleet, but they were doing it from one hell of an awesome boat [wikipedia.org] .

At least it was one hell of an awesome boat until the idiots managed to get it sunk / sink it (depending on who you ask) in a collision with a whaling boat.

The whalers are going to be running scared. (4, Funny)

Khith (608295) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493192)

Here's a picture of the drone! [hometheaterforum.com]

Re:The whalers are going to be running scared. (1)

AbRASiON (589899) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493326)

Damn that thing really is a bird of prey isn't it?!

I used to be ... (1, Funny)

AlanS2002 (580378) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493234)

I used to be an anti-whaling activist, but then I took an arrow in the knee.

Re:I used to be ... (2)

qxcv (2422318) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493306)

I used to be a whale, but then I took a harpoon to the face.

Future title: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38493256)

Anti-Droning Group Using Whalers To Find Drones

Only to find them? (1)

ecotax (303198) | more than 2 years ago | (#38493274)

Can't these things even carry a small torpedo, then?

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